The Atheist Experience 751 with Matt Dillahunty and Jen Peeples
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- čas přidán 5. 03. 2012
- The Atheist Experience 751 for March 4, 2012 with Matt Dillahunty and Jen Peeples.
SHOW TIME-STAMPS
00:44- Intro & Announcements - Matt Dillahunty
05:30- Matt Dillahunty on emails about contraception
13:44- Clint: religious authorities attacking human rights and trying to make laws, putting your faith in anything, matter is energy, identifying tension in relationships is possibly a sign of the supernatural
31:11- Jonathan (theist from episode 728 and 745): believes in an “unfalsifiable” god because it makes him happy and won't hurt anyone, belief is a choice, what would he gain from atheism
56:46- Kevin: references Eric from the previous episode, something coming from something
You can read more about this episode on the Atheist Experience blog:
► freethoughtblogs.com/axp/2012/...
This episode of The Atheist Experience (topic: "Viewer Calls") is archived on Ustream.tv:
► www.ustream.tv/recorded/20889991
WHAT IS THE ATHEIST EXPERIENCE?
The Atheist Experience is a weekly cable access television show in Austin, Texas geared at a non-atheist audience. The Atheist Experience is produced by the Atheist Community of Austin.
The Atheist Community of Austin is organized as a nonprofit educational corporation to develop and support the atheist community, to provide opportunities for socializing and friendship, to promote secular viewpoints, to encourage positive atheist culture, to defend the first amendment principle of state-church separation, to oppose discrimination against atheists and to work with other organizations in pursuit of common goals.
We define atheism as the lack of belief in gods. This definition also encompasses what most people call agnosticism.
VISIT THE ACA'S OFFICIAL WEB SITES
► www.atheist-community.org (The Atheist Community of Austin)
► www.atheist-experience.com (The Atheist Experience TV Show)
More shows and video clips can be found in the archive:
► www.atheist-experience.com/arc...
DVDs of the Atheist Experience can be purchased via:
► www.atheist-community.org/prod...
MUSIC CREDITS
Theme song: "Listen to Reason," written and performed by Bryan Steeksma.
► / bryansteeksma
► www.myspace.com/bryansteeksma
NOTES
TheAtheistExperience is a fan appreciation channel on CZcams.
"The Atheist Experience" is a registered trademark of the ACA.
Creative Commons license: BY, NC, SA
► creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
"There is no bigger fool than the fool who discovers a lie, yet still believes it." - Doug Parmenter
I sincerely hope that this is the last time the AE will accept a call from Jonathan. That thread is exhausted.
"If you say unfalsifiable one more time I'm hanging up. Stop wasting my time." - Dillahunty
"I am no longer willing to believe something because it simply feels right, or feels good because I understand that I can be fooled, and I can be wrong.
I need to take the steps to find out what the actual answer is, and if I am unable to find the answer I am in a position of "I don't know".
I am NOT justified in my claiming my lack of understanding, or my inability to find a better answer justifies any kind of supernatural explanation, or one that just seems to "fit"." Matt Dillahunty
Christopher Harper Ah. Plussed you. Thought it was your statement. Then got to the point in the vid where Matt said it. But you may keep the plus for your transcription. Well, 80% of it. I'm docking you two tenths for not using quotation marks and leaving the attribution at just "MD". But, rounding up: still 1.0 thumbs.
Christopher Harper Hi Chris. Thanks for taking that well. I too love language and playing with it. Words...those that exist and others I make up.
Not sure what you meant by the cross reference. Or "lifting" language.
Bruce Baker Ok, I edited it for clarity.
Thanks.
Christopher Harper Hi again Chris.
Don't sweat this. Just mentioning it cuz I'm getting odd input.
I don't note any substantive change in the OP. And, though I see your second reply (and all my comments), your first comment has vanished.
As I said, don't sweat it. Just go forth and be awesome. Ciao
Yeah, that is because I thought you were still commenting on my other comment about "Fire".
lol
I had just woke up and it took me a bit to sort that this was a completely different comment.
@imation879 "Josephus Flavius, the Jewish historian, lived as the earliest non-Christian who mentions a Jesus. Although many scholars think that Josephus' short accounts of Jesus (in Antiquities) came from interpolations perpetrated by a later Church father (most likely, Eusebius), Josephus' birth in 37 C.E., puts him out of range of an eyewitness account. Moreover, he wrote Antiquities in 93 C.E., after the first gospels got written! Therefore his information could only serve as hearsay."
and could easily be based on the gospels rather than hearsay
Fantasy is good in small doses, being lost in fantasy seems dangerous.
Thanks a lot for putting the time Stamps in the description. Much appreciated.
You did finally answer his question about "what difference does my belief actually make". The biggest problem with believing in a religion is the loss of self. The next biggest problem is the justification for evil deeds that can be done without good reason.
I appreciate that you guys spent the time to discuss with the one caller who is questioning his own beliefs.
I feel like a lot of people start to see pain points in where they were raised and begin to have their own questions and reactions and it's often good to just try to understand where they are coming from. I hope the gentleman caller continues to search for answers wherever they might be.
Also, thanks for putting in the times when the calls start and such, it's very helpful!
Everyone should be held to a 10 minute time limit.
Especially when the argument continues in circles.
I honestly can't believe the patience Matt and Jen demonstrated with the second guy... I mean he wasn't being disrespectful in any way, but surely they didn't need to waste half the show on him when it was painfully obvious that he clearly wasn't able to see the pointlessness in trying to justify a belief in something unfalsifiable...
But good on them for being really good sports and incredibly respectful.
thank you!:D wish we had a show like this in sweden^^
It's like a deja-vu experience. I hear arguments and discussions we had here in Europe 50 years ago.
Matt always makes these episodes great.
Hopefully Matt and Jen's sacrifice by withstanding the "waste of time" harm of Jonathan will help other people realize that rational thought is imperative for a peaceful sane world.
My son was ten he said to me, ''How did Adam and Eve learn to walk and eat and stuff like that?''. ''It's sad they was never children and never played too'', so you learn that stuff when we are little that's weird''. I don't think my Son ever truly believed in the fairytale God.
Jen and Matt. This is my fav combo of Atheist Experience.
Don and Matt are great as well
To be a Christian who also believed he had a vision that was true, Clint is very open minded, I think. Because someone in his position would very often be a hardcore believer, but he didn't let what appeared to be true outweigh tons of physical evidence. So bravo to Clint for being a logical thinker.
The guy was kind of right. He chose what he wanted to believe, and didn't care if it was wrong.
First caller. Good point. "Blessing" food (saying grace) made no sense to him.
"People...maybe Christian, maybe atheist or Hindu...developed the seeds.
"People...maybe Jewish, maybe Sikh...grew those seeds into plants.
"People...maybe Mormon, maybe Scientologist...raised the cattle, etc.
"...packaged and butchered...
"...transported...stored...sold...cooked...
"...and I traded some of the money I earned through my own effort & expertise to buy it...
"so thank you God, for "providing" this food for our use"
I see a lot of people in that process. And I see God nowhere in it.
"God helps those who help themselves". So...eliminate the middleman.
+Bruce Baker it's about humility before nature and realizing how fragile is civilization. your words are those of a fat westerner who has never lived through war, siege or famine. what's worse he has no intrinsic connection to his ancestors' experience, who have.
also, Jewish farmers, yeah right.
Matt: "Congratulations, you've defined a tautology and wasted an hour." Great stuff.
topic times at the description, is an excellent idea :D
There is SO much ground that needs to be covered in each call, each theistic caller demanding their own 'reasoning' to understand an atheist mindset. I'm enthralled by what gets discussed on this show and only wish that it were longer / more regular.
Good job guys +1 for reason and oranges alike.
haha religion go home your drunk!
y'know you know you know you know like you know its like yeah you know
Thank you guys for the responses, I respect science & am very fascinated by all new discoveries, progressions made, & how anatomy works as well. To ME, with all due respect, Atheism is another type of belief system. From observations, I can see that any belief system consists of truth finding & ultimately boils down to the conditioning of what that person interjects & retains in their metal aspect & in turn will disavows any outside conjectures. "we are never wrong" in our own mind set.
I was recently asked by a believer whether I prefer to either be happy or to be right. I actually wanted to face palm. What an asinine question!
One of the biggest indicators as to how empathetic we are as a species, IMO, is our eyes. If you compare our eyes to the eyes of almost every other animal, what stands out? The whites of our eyes. Those things really draw your attention. In most animals, having dark eyes allows them to hide better. The fact that humans have white eyes is a huge indicator that social selection has overcome any predatory selection. It is vastly important to our genetic reproduction that we are able to spot other humans instantly, see where they are looking, read their emotions, and so on. This carries beyond eyes to facial expressions and body language as well, but is less obvious than the eye. We are very attuned to each other. We read each other for intent and emotions so much that we don't even think about it. This knowledge just forms in our brains with hardly any effort. Since it all happens without (much) conscious effort, people attribute this ability to supernatural sources, but it really is just human nature.
Timothy Edgar
Good read
you can't prove bigfoot doesn't exist. therefore, can I assert its existence.
cool, bro... have at it.
Jeff Connors Bigfoot his for your sins. Praise Wendigo! In Yeti’s name!
oh dear... I've gone through most of my life believing Im not particularly intellegent but frankly I don't think I've given myself enough credit... thanks for the show
My sentiments entirely.
I fucking love you guys and this show.
Jonathan... that is gullibility in a nutshell
I've been watching the last couple of AEs to see if they were going to touch on some of the religious/political craziness (esp the contraception issue) ongoing in the current election season. I'd like to hear an open atheist discuss these issues on the MSM but they seem to be in short supply. Glad to see Matt and Jen decided to cover it.
I am god because you can't disprove it. Please form a queue and bring a $100 "seed" offering.
Yours Sincerely, God
What is the evidence that you are god?
@@agimasoschandir You don't need evidence, you have faith.
@@insanetester1015 OK. So,, its OK to believe in fairies? I ask, because I know at least one person who does, or did, have not seen them in awhile. You see, you can believe anything without evidence. As for faith, what do you mean?
Belief without evidence is what faith is
The first time a company tries to discriminate against their employees due to their religious beliefs, the law will be overturned. One thing about America is that your medical records are NO ONE'S BUSINESS but yours, your doctor's, and your insurance company. In fact, the only way I believe you can gain access to someone's medical records is through a subpoena, and I doubt any judge would actually sign a subpoena so a company can see if their employee is using birth control.
Jonathan: “It’s given me hope and happiness.”
Then he should stop lying about caring about the truth.🤡
best reference ever
Jen at the end asking "What's hopeful about that?" - this is just hypnotic but so true. I hate when the caller lost and never replied to that question.
That's great, made me smile. :D
A lovely fart occurs at 42:52
Yes, there was a fart
-- But it's unfalsifiable! *sound of shotgun blast in a face*
I was having hard time to grasp the concept that Matt has been saying: "Do you care whether the things you believe are true?" So when the answer is "Yes" I think that the second question should be something like "How do you know that your beliefs are true?" - at least this way it will lead to a meaningful conversation.
I used to not like the theme song but more and more it's growing on me.
Matt:"I swear to your god..."
Now one of my favorite quotes.
I love Jen, she is so smart! Seriously, Matt should give more space to co-hosts!
Idea for a commercial. A kid goes to high school for the first time. He's walking down the hall and he's passing by a group of other kids huddled in the corner. One of the kids from the group says "Hey, hey you" and motions for him to come over. The kid, wanting to make friends joins the group. The kid who called him over says "Hey dude, you want one?" and the camera pans in, and they've all got a bible in their hands. The original kid just smiles, says no and walks away. "Religion. Just say no"
@TheAtheistExperience
The moment Clint said he was studying chiropracty, I expected the woo that followed - and I wasn't disappointed: Matter isn't matter but is really energy, vibes, etc. Woo, woo,WOO.
I'm surprised Matt didn't catch on to that but let him go on preaching for so long.
jonathan has created a "god" he can keep safe in a vault, forever protected against investigation by pesky skeptics, all because he also wants to believe in life after death, which he keeps in the same vault. all because jonathan cannot tolerate doubt.
Joy, there are people like me! Love this show!
Beliefs are choices to conscious individuals.
They really should have a boom mike as a backup to the Lavalier microphones.
Correctrix mic
i like matts way of thinking
I would add the comedy bits by Patton Oswald about religion. Funny but also very insightful too.
And Eddie Izzard and Ricky Gervais. Also try Tim Minchin, such as Thank You God song
Don't imprison yourself with labels. Remember, just because something is true does not make it more valued or better, those are subjective labels. It is as it is, absolutes have nothing to do with positive or negative, unless perceived through social, cultural, scientific, religious, humanistic or any other anthropomorphic scope. Condescension is a turbulent tightrope.
The caller reminded me of a documentary called Jesus Camp
It seems like Jonathan's definition for what he called "active belief" is closer to the definition of "self delusion".
my fave two hosts :)
Is The Atheist Experience a great show, or the GREATEST SHOW??!!!
Love yo faces!
The simplest and most logical solution to the objections some businesses have toward paying health care insurance is to replace health insurance with a national health service. The U.S. is the only industrial nation that has no national health service.
@robinvan1983 Yes, I've purchased individual health insurance. Look up the definition. "Insurance" is meant to protect the insured against the UNexpected. Unless there is an unexpected medical need for contraception, such a provision can not be construed as insurance. Socialized medical care is merely another program to forcibly distribute wealth. Insurance is rational. Socialized medical care is irrational.
It's harmful to believe that something is true just because it makes you feel good, because that belief could make potentially harmful actions more likely to occur.
If someone believes that on their next birthday, they are going to find a treasure chest with a million dollars inside, then it may cause them to not save their money throughout the year, and cause them to experience a crushing feeling of disappointment when their birthday arrives.
Everything you believe has an effect on your life, and a belief that is not based on a foundation of evidence, will make actions based on foundation without evidence more likely.
Jonathan's belief could result in him not trying to have the best life he can on Earth, because he believes that a better one is waiting for him.
@wannabefilms you just made my day
@Konicava when do you need 1080p to listen to a conversation?
I think even without knowing the details of Jonathan's life, it wouldn't be unfair to suggest that his belief in an afterlife will likely cause him to value this life less. Of course he'd probably say "you don't know my life" if this were pointed out to him, but I think we know enough about human nature to make that assertion without having to know the details of his life specifically.
@thenakedatheist hey. You mentioned about believing in afterlife might make one value this life less - I am severely disabled and have brain damage. I am newly atheist, but when I was Christian I was told I would have a fully working body in heaven, and I neglected the body I have now, even in its disabled state. I had been told I was stupid and didn't have much to look forward to. Now I am studying at open university, and every moment is precious despite the pain. Christianity diminished me, a
The government DOES direct how I do my job. There are specifications I need to follow, there are legal standards for the materials I work with, and there are a bunch of OSEH guidelines I need to legally obey for safety reasons.
Contraception is a prescription medication that treats medical conditions on top of preventing pregnancy. What if an employee had lupus and the employer decided for some arbitrary reason not to cover that particular treatment?
Theories hold an exalted place within science. In science, for an idea to reach the status of theory (not just hypothesis), it must go through a prohibitively rigorous examination by a whole community of scientists whose job it is to DISPROVE the idea. If an idea has gone through this lengthy process and still holds up, it reaches the exalted status of "scientific theory." Scientific theories make predictions that can be shown to be true through observation and evidence.
Johnathan is unfalsifiably Harry Connick Jr..
Matt's opinion of compelling employers to cover medical products and services is proof that merely being an atheist is no assurance that that person is rational in all aspects of their life.
I don't think Matt actually listened to Limbaugh's comments on the Georgetown student, or he might have gotten the obvious humor intended.
whats wrong with the resolution? its broadcasted in 480P and its not poorly encoded plus its about what they say really
The point is where did the wind come from. The 'world' for that matter
When it comes to the contraception issue... he is right. It is not a matter of religious liberty. But it is a matter of the government over stepping their bounds.
May we all have good reasons to keep smiling
@AtheismTV This is awesome.
@TheAtheistExperience
He probably meant that it has to be in 1080p HD or it doesn't count :P :P :P
He should believe in God because he likes oranges. Did he really just say that?
😂
The contraception issue is a big thing. A lot of people who aren't specifically religious actually support this measure as they think it's a freedom of religion thing. It isn't however because, as Matt stated, these are secular businesses. This would be EXACTLY as insane as if a Jehovah's Witness owned hospital refused to perform blood transfusions or transplants. The rationale and REASONS are exactly the same.
Logic is a method for evaluating the POSITIVE existential claims (the assertion that something DOES exist). The burden of proof is upon those who MAKE claims to offer sufficient evidence as to WHY those claims are reasonable, and thus WHY others should accept them as true.
Absolutely, forgive me.
The caller Johnathan I feel sorry for him. He seems to really believe in God based on his emotions, but based on reason, he is coming to the realization that he can't justify that believe and desperately wants to find a solution quickly but can't.
in laymen's terms, they guess and presume a possible solution by conducting test with the end results being left in assumption till more information is discovered. Even though my statement may not be 100% on point, it still hold's relevant to Atheist belief systems, I can respect their beliefs.
45:35 - OWNED!
Right on, thanks. I suppose I should have known that as I'm in pharmacology :s
@TheTexanCanadian
" This critically highlights the mental disconnect that keeps people who would otherwise be quite intelligent from fulfilling their full potential, which is ironically exactly what Matt has done"
What do you mean?
@willzyx1980
That issue is an issue of fairness. If a business offers a healthcare plan that covers Viagra, then by rights they also have to offer contraception. Otherwise it is discrimination in favor of men and against women. But more importantly, it's the topic on which the decision is made. A religious organization cannot discriminate against potential employees because they don't believe in their religion. By that same token, they cannot force their belief on others.
if a pharmacist from a local privately owned pharmacy sells condoms/contraceptives but one of the employers finds it insults their religious sensibilities, can they simply say they are not going to sell it?
I love how this dude is using "unfalsifiable" as if it were just any other characteristic of his god.
Sorry for the exceptionally long delay in response, don't really check mail as often..lol
you know, your response is very interesting and entertaining (sincerely speaking) . It almost sounds like a religious view. I can respect that as well, I don't hate.
That difference between subjective value beliefs and a NONOBJECTIVE belief in God, is that the subjective value beliefs attach to OBJECTIVE things. Therefore, the logical basis of that subjective value preference can be evaluated in terms of the consequences of its objective attachment, unlike a purely subjective preference to believe in, say, God.
Usually Matt is a lot quicker to the disconnect button. I can't believe he didn't hang up on the guy after just a few minutes. That guy was all over the place, and took a long time to say a whole bunch of nothing.
Why didn’t Jonathon just eat a make-believe orange?
It should have given him equal pleasure.
In regards to Jonathan, why is Matt using logic and reason to what is obviously an emotional appeal? Logic and reason do not work because emotions are inherently illogical.
@abamguy I don't understand the skeptic's thing against chiropractors. I go to one regularly, and it always makes me feel better. It re-aligns your spine and stuff.
thats true. some dont know that the truth wont change if you believe otherwise.
I'm so tired of callers like Jonathan who want to justify their beliefs in wonky, sideways talk.
Matt must have been in a good mood to keep him on the line for so long. I mean, he claims that he'd hang up if he said "unfalsifiable" one more time, only for Jon to say it not five seconds later and is allowed to prattle on some more.
Early man could only imagine a superbeing being able to create something. They had nothing to guide them, and plumped for the easiest solution. Especially following a disaster/famine/disease. They probably tied those kinds of things to being some kind of punishment, and then the fear grew along with superstition.
Never heard the saying "on the first day, man created god"?
I understand that, matter is not energy (because of massless particles), you misread what I wrote, BUT MASS and ENERGY are a different manifestation of the same thing.
You said :"This does not mean that there is more matter when the mass increases due to velocity, just more mass". I totally AGREE with that, I know that, it's easy to understand.
So far we agree on the same things you just misunderstood me. My question is: do you know why massless particles are not consider matter.
I have no time for people who don't care about the truth. And neither does society.