That Vegan Couple needs to stop (Re: Baby Dies from Vegan Diet! Parents Jailed)
Vložit
- čas přidán 2. 07. 2017
- A response to That Vegan Couple's recent video "Baby Dies from Vegan Diet! Parents Jailed", which is not only full of inaccuracies, but comes across quite dismissive and more than a bit paranoid.
That Vegan Couple's video
• Baby Dies from Vegan D...
Support a rational vegan community
philosophicalvegan.com/
Twitter: / unnaturalvegan
Instagram: / unnaturalvegan
Patreon: / unnaturalvegan
I find it disturbing that they're more concerned with defending their diet than they are the fact that a child died.
Typical vegan behavior. Brainwashed by corporations.
The story has been distorted dont believe everything you hear
Aislin Watson Exactly!
AmyOverby sources???
also quite funny that they call themselves concerned about animl well-being but the death of a small child is just nothing in their books because "other children die too". I cannot take these kind of people seriously with their "beliefs". noble diet my arse. Attention seekers.
I hate the way they smile and seem so smug and proud of themselves, when they're talking about a baby dying. It comes across as sociopathic
Ewwe. I agree.
I’d say psychopathic
Vegans are generally misanthropic.
@@geetee2392 And there's a whole lot to love about you, isn't there.
You understand that they're "laughing" at the insane way these extremely few orthorexic/anorexic parents starving their children are used by the media and animal ag industry as wrecking balls against the cause for veganism, don't you? Well, obviously you don't; either that or you agree with them. It's the media and their slaughter industry cronies offending these kids' memories by exploiting them for an ugly, evil reason. There's that sociopathy you're talking about. You think there aren't malnourished/dying meat raised kids out there every day? Smh...
Plant milks often say “not a substitute for infant formula” on them these people are just not being responsible
I notice that too.
They do??? Omg, I can't believe that these parents would do this!!
If they follow vegan
Cant she follow nature and breastfeed
sai sai no, veganism excludes as far as possible all food derived from animals. Humans are a part of the animal kingdom and are therefore, animals. Drinking breast milk is not vegan, under this strict definition. However, other definitions talk about and emphasize giving permission, so if a mother consents to breastfeeding, breast milk from that mother to that child then becomes vegan.
Latifah Dhia as I said, it was under strict definitions and standards that people agreed to this. Others went more with the second option of my comment
Um...the baby was 10lbs at 9 months...how was this not a concern for the vegan couple...
Their ignorance is just disgusting.
Honestly! Some babies are BORN at that weight
Lara Brown I was legit born at that weight. My sister was born at 12 pounds!!!
DID THE BABY HAVE A GP OR PEDIATRICIAN? iF THE BABY WAS UNDER A DOCTORS CARE HOW DID THIS HAPPEN? MY SON WAS 8LBS AT BIRTH. AFTER A BABY IS BORN THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO HAVE MANY CHECKUPS WITH A DOCTOR. IT WOULD SEEM TO ME IF THE BABY WAS INDEED SEEING A DOCTOR THAT THIS COULD OF BEEN PREVENTED. 10 Lbs at 9 months. HOW THE HELL DID THIS HAPPEN? HOW IS A BABY 10 LBS. AT 9 MONTHS. SCARY.......Scary how this was even possible......I CAN"T GET THAT OUT OF MY HEAD....10 LBS @ 9 months. I'm SORRY, BUT WTF WERE THEY THINKING! MY HEART IS WITH THAT POOR LITTLE BABY...RIP ANGEL....KEEP YOURSELF EDUCATED. NOT WITH JUST YOUR WAY OF DOING THINGS BUT WITH EVERYTHING YOU POSSIBLY CAN < ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO A BABY. THEY CAN"T TELL YOU WHAT"S WRONG>
I was born 12 pounds. 10 pounds at 9 months when the baby was born 8 pounds is horrifying.
I agree
Mammals produce milk for their babys because they need it, period.
William Veatch
Yeah, also the milk has the needed proteins for infants
don't forget all the hormones
I don't know how some vegans (that can produce milk) refuse to breastfeed their babys because that somehow interferes with being vegan (-because milk is not vegan-) like what the actual fuck?!
Ella B
Breastfeeding is completely natural. And it's not harming any animal in any way
Da Dragon Durp I literally said the exact same thing as you
However, *some* vegans think that it's not ok to breastfeed and I dont get why.
Their attitude in the video is sociopathic to me. They're laughing and smiling while talking about a baby who died.
Sara Blair was just about to point that out
It's disgusting
Could be a sign of nervousness, many people smile while they know their lying as well. :)
Yes - Their opinions are more important than a tragic baby-death. Shame on them & good for you!
Brainwashed. vegan. robot. couple. VS. Kristina who has a brain and a personal opinion.
Random, but the couples energy really creeps me out
They are very creepy. Pushy, delusional and paranoid. They both look emaciated. I totally get what you mean with their energy, they make you feel very uneasy.
@@laurainthesky8372 - how long before they are the old couple from Book of Eli?
Agree
They need a belting 😂 the shit they fucking spread is beyond me
And her jaw is deviating and looking a bit strokey by my eye. Oral deformation is a sign of dentition issues
Heartbreaking. This child trusted his parents. He must have been crying and sad for months, from hunger, and they ignored him :(
ana mihajlovic Im getting so upset just thinking about it
It reminds me of my son, who has a milk allergy. It took us a while to figure out. But while we didn’t know, he would scream in pain multiple times a day and refused feeds and we just didn’t know why. I cried all the time. We obsessively journaled his formula intake. I was desperate for him to eat. His weight stalled and he dropped in percentiles. When we finally figured out his allergy and put him on a special formula he was a completely different baby. Thriving and 18 pounds at 10 months. I just don’t see how these people watched their baby starve to death. That baby was probably lethargic, not developing correctly, not meeting milestones- and they just didn’t see anything wrong with that 😞😞😞
@@AllenSeizmik how does One "figure out" that One's Baby is allergic to some type of food? doesn't One just GO TO SEE A DOCTOR, rather than doing the "figuring out"?
@@wolfrahmphosphoros5808 we DID go to see doctors, three times. They either said colic or GERD. We were the ones that had to guess it was a milk allergy and switched his formula. When it worked, we asked to see an allergist who then confirmed the allergy via testing.
@@AllenSeizmik I'm surprised your Doctor wouldn't suggest that straight away. regards.
“Just because something is unnatural doesn’t mean it’s unhealthy” THANK YOU
i want to know the % of foods in the entire world that are actually considered "Natural". I assure you pretty much none of it is lol. Even the plant foods in general are gmos and grown around lots of sprays and chemicals. That's why these "Natty Vegans" and Paleo types crack me up.
That's literally what I always tell people buying skincare. "natural" skincare isn't better and "chemical" skincare isn't worse. Actually I would say skincare made in laboratory is safer than natural one because when it's refined in laboratory it is less likely to react with someone's skin type or some skin conditions. So yeah it's nothing bad in natural skincare but I think "unnatural" one is safer for use by more people.
Not really about nutrition but still
@@rumyanaromelova643 check out Beautycounter that is basically their philosophy
Lots of food containing GMO's is actually fine. Most of the time something that has been genetically modified can simy meannthat it has been crossbred with a plant that can thrive with an extreme climate which can save tons of lives in areas where people die of starvation. Also lots of drugs that save lives ars synthetic and that is okay.
Am I the only one who is creeped out by how much they're smiling in a video about a baby dying?
In their case, it actually looks predatory.
sof ka What the actual fuck.
Now I’ve read the literature equivalent of a train wreck.
sof ka Nah, man, I’m just wondering why you left all this here.
Maybe not the right video to be talking about sex, yeah? The rest of it I get. I’m a pagan in a Christian town. Just the sex was... rather unexpected.
That is why I left that here.
I find it funny.
If you don't get it, you don't get it, that's ok
It's like the comment under a science astronomi video where the guy start totaly seriously then talk about his exema then his mother who died and stuff.
Maybe he's crazy, maybe he's being absurd...etc.
Anyway. The least funny stuff is when you explaine your joke. So as I've said. If you don't get it, you just dont, it's ok.
That's nice to live in a christian town I guess. I live in europe which is doomed. Doomed coz of the muslim demography. And don't start with label such as racist or stuff. I'm arab and my family is muslim. I can separete the human afect from the civilisation pov. We are lost. It's over
USA will be the last rampart of western civilisation which is THE civilisation.
If you want to marry me so I can get the USA green card, I'm all hear. Lolilolilolilol. Good night sweet prince (^_^)
Ashley Lesiak they dgaf about the baby
This baby weighed 10lbs at 9 months old... I was 10lbs when I was BORN.
Ugh I need that kid to be okay and he isn't and I wanna die
Same! But for my little sister though.
I was a bit different. Mom couldn't eat properly with me. She kept throwing up even in the third trimester.
I was born premature, weighing 4 lbs and then I was lactose intolerant.
It worked out in the end though.
My youngest weighed a little bit more then 11lbs when she was born 😳
I also weighed 10 pounds at birth. I actually dislocated my shoulder at birth because I was pretty big. My two siblings were also hefty newborns. Crazy that a 1 year old would weigh less than than.
Me too.
If a baby died, even if I didn't believe it was bc of something the parents did, I would never ever be this cold being sarcastic, laughing and talking about this subject like this. They come across really cold and scary.
RIP little baby 💓
"youre not a baby cow, why are you drinking cow milk?' is a common thing vegans say. THIS IS A HUMAN BABY THAT NEED HUMAN MILK
CottonCandyLamb the mom couldn’t lactate. I’m lucky enough to be a breastfeeding mama but some of my friends genuinely did not produce enough milk for their babies and had to give up and go to formula. A good friend of mine was pretty depressed about her inability to produce enough milk. Don’t assume it’s the moms fault when the baby isn’t breast fed but formula is also just frickin fine for babies! It is MADE for them!
Nicole Smith, well said. I do wonder how much of this lady’s lactation problems were due to her own diet.
She probably didn't even try...
Nicole Smith thats not my point, but I'm sorry it seemed like I assumed this. I meant human milk or a good substitute. I'm not saying all women need to breastfeed, more that babies need it or something with the same nutrition.
Well... Apart from that it's still more of a baby cow than a baby qinoa. I mean, another species modified milk is still hell of a lot closer to actual human breastmilk than some odd mixture of different plants.
Dutch speaker here. I read the original articles written in Dutch. None of the articles state that the parents were vegan; all it says is that they run a health food store and that they constituted that the child was gluten and lactose intolerant. There are references to the couple being Catholic (there was a paternoster aka The Lord's Prayer hung around his neck and a remembrance leaflet (bidprentje) in his diaper). They also sought help from 'Leken', religious people that are not affiliated with specific congregations. Yes there are vegans feeding their children improper diets but I think this is more a case of rejection of science than anything else.
quiztheghosts Thank you!! This should be top comment 👍🏾
quiztheghosts This! I read the Dutch articles too. They never mention any vegans or vegan diets.
The parents of the child that died last year in Portugal were vegans.
The Belgian articles written in French also don't say the parents were vegan. I only found one French article stating the parents were vegetarian. And yes the rejection of science also seems to be part of the story. "The prosecutor assesses that the parents "aversion for conventional medicine" is partly responsible for their baby's death, they preferred a homeopathic doctor who's practise was an hour away even tough their child's state was very worrisome"
( www.lepoint.fr/faits-divers/uniquement-nourri-au-lait-vegetal-un-bebe-meurt-en-belgique-19-05-2017-2128627_2627.php )
thank you for your insight
can I please have the link to the original articles that are in French or Dutch? thank you so much!
m.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20170516_02884670
m.nieuwsblad.be/cnt/dmf20170515_02883946
://www.rtlnieuws.nl/buitenland/baby-kreeg-alleen-natuurvoeding-en-overleed-ouders-mogelijk-cel-in
Some people should not have children.
Sarah Kelly wtf? No one‘s saying all vegans are bad people, it‘s about those who are completely delusional to the point that they disregard their own health and the well-being of their kids because of their “lifestyle”. Nobody is attacking you personally or hating you. I’m very sorry that your life didn’t work out as you wanted it to and if you really think about suicide you should talk to someone like a friend, a relative or a therapist because there’s always another way than ending your life. Even without kids your life can be fulfilling, maybe you just didn’t find a thing that gives your life purpose yet. I think it’s pretty fucked up though, to blame people who wrote a comment, not even centered towards you, but to people who starved their child to death with a weird diet, for your thoughts about taking your life. I really hope you get the help you deserve by seeing a therapist, and if you’re not ready for that, there are plenty of other options like hotlines or websites where you can get help. Please just be aware that there are people who love you and care about you
Vegans
I am aghast that they sit there laughing and joking when the story they’re conveying is that a baby DIED! He died! The FACT that he was starved is irrefutable! He weighed 10lbs at 9 months! Babies should fall somewhere between double and triple their birth weight at a 1year. The double birth weight is considered on the border of failure to thrive. They’re being sarcastic and taking jabs at omnivorous diets, which are PERFECTLY healthy when they, or vegetarian, or vegan diets are ALL sustainable diets. How healthy or unhealthy your choice of diet/lifestyle is up to YOU and your due diligence to find reputable sources and guidelines and TONS of research from credible, reliable sources. Thank you for once again being the voice of reason and being exceedingly patient in explaining how to manage a sensible nutritious vegan diet and lifestyle! That Vegan Couple is often at the minimum misleading and at maximum paranoid and dead wrong in their lack of anything resembling an actual probable fact. They’re too busy slamming everyone else to even show the modicum of concern that a baby was starved! It doesn’t point a shaking finger at the parents bc they’re vegan! It’s bc they starved their baby to death when it was totally an avoidable disaster!
Lorilynn Morrow I know! They looked like they found in humorous! It’s disgusting!
That poor baby died and you find that amusing? Those people need to have a good, long hard think about what they should be discussing in this situation. The poor, innocent child who died due to negligence and ignorance on behalf of the parents. Instead they choose to focus mainly on defending veganism? I’m vegan myself and I find that utterly horrible. That’s really what you got out of the article? Not that a child..a BABY died??
Lorilynn Morrow very well said!
An average healthy weight for a baby boy at that age is over 21 pounds. That poor baby boy was starved
Not to mention, plant based milks and other animal milks don't contain the proper proteins that fortified plant based lactose free formulas have that help them mimic breast milk. If you assume your kid is lactose intolerant, or you don't want to risk it, find a proper formula!
See, people like this lady who instead of just attacking meat eater she calmly explain her concern backed up by evidence. These type of people I am more inclined to listen
SouthernGlitter for once in my existence on CZcams, I agree with somebody. Thank you for being a decent human! Keep it up!
SouthernGlitter exactly... probably the first rational vegan i encountered on net, of course after that filthy frank video
Somehow, people don't understand that being so aggressively against something in fact does the opposite to change people's minds. Who would've thought? Lol.
SouthernGlitter I agree :)
+Amb Amb your a prime example of "those" people.
Why weren't they giving her breastmilk? Breastmilk *is* vegan!
Lucky Kitty The mother couldn't give milk. So needed an alternative.
There are mothers that donate breast milk to help babies who are struggling to eat or because of milk allergies or if the new mother hasn't been able to breastfeed. These parents just neglected this baby for their prideful belief at the cost of their own child life, they should have been more educated on their infants diet before considering an alternative diet especially because it's very different from an average adult. They require much more nutrients so they can grow and develop into their little bodies.
It's Belgium just think about it.
@@kylelindgren5290 Belgium is a developed country with quite a good healthcare system from what I know of. I don't understand your point
Ana Hernandez but they don’t keep track of whether it’s vegan breast milk. So their child would be absorbing animal proteins (or something). Also breast milk is supposed to have the taste of the foods the mother eats as well so the baby could get a taste for meat I guess
That vegan couple kind of remind me of cult members.
it's the laughing and the smiles, and their dead eyes
@@maxebanana6143 Hit the nail right on the head there.
Wouldn't be surprised if that's the reality behind the scenes.
New age solopsistic cultists.
OMG! I was thinking the same thing.
"Just because something is unnatural, doesn't mean it's unhealthy." ROLLS CREDITS
Omg a vegan that isn't preachy, is intelligent, looks well nourished, has heathy skin and hair , and knows the importance of a healthy diet and supplements! You madam are the unicorn
yug0w0lf I agree. Most preachy vegans I've seen look tired and leathery with hair that looks like they're balding. That vegan couple and Freelee both fall under this category, along with others.
HAH! Love you comment! V. funny!
it's not rare, most vegans are rational. it's the vocal minority that make us look bad
Omg quite literally why I don’t tell vegans I am because I’d rather save myself the earache. If anything I despise how most of them behave and have this god like complex for their diet or beliefs. :/
most vegans I know are pretty normal human beings xD. It's really not that uncommon.
That couple makes me sick. They are just smug and sitting there with a smile on their face. They are talking about a dead infant. They don't care. All they care about is that their life style is being called out for literally being the death of a child
No... you comment to this thread is cringe worthy K...
Yes, i do cry when I learn of children dying... I do cry when someone dies... Its a part of having empathy
The Vegan Couple doesn't care that a baby. Look how they handled that story...
keyahnna lindsey Not everybody has the equipment or software to even make a video like that numbnuts.....
Also you don't have to make a whole fucking video to show you care or to somehow prove the validity of your opinion... How the fuck does one even get that idea in the first place????
keyahnna lindsey Are you done making wild assumptions now? I never claimed to do any of the things you mentioned and honestly have no clue where you got those ideas about me from.
And again, a video is not the basis or bare minimum for showing you care. One is not required to sit down and make a whole spiel on tape to prove a point. Hitting record on an argument does not magically make it any more powerful. Going by your logic I'd have to assume that you don't give a shit about anything given the fact that you only have a single video dated three years ago on your channel.
Plenty of compelling arguments and heartfelt condolences are made purely through text alone. Having some audio and a moving picture to accompany the script does not in any way alter the heart behind a message.
keyahnna lindsey There you go again putting words in my mouth! I did _not_ say "text message" you freaking walnut. I said "text" meaning any written form of communication! Email, written letter, etc. We did not always have phones or video recording devices. So are you saying all forms of communication before then were "disrespectful"??? Sure, sending a single sentence text in response to some tragic event can be disrespectful. But a well written thoughtful message can have the same impact as a video or call. And must I remind you that not everybody is even capable of calling or making a video due to speech impediments/impairments, or impairments to hearing and/or motor skills making vocal communication(and in some cases communication through sign) incredibly difficult if not impossible? Those sufferring from anxiety disorders can also find phone calls or videos extremely difficult and often are able to convey what they mean better through text. Are you saying those people are incapable of meaningful communication simply because they might have to rely on written/typed forms of communication??
How can you discredit the written word when things like textbooks or historical literature are so integral to learning about the world?
THANK YOU! agree 100%
Hee, Dutch person here. I would translate it as: Lucas died of starvation (well done Google!), but his parents kept believing in emergency solutions. Lapmiddel is hard to translate is kinds means a temporarily fix or solution, kinda in an emergency. Not to be relied on..
I am horrified by these people..
I think something similar in English would be to say you’ve patched up the problem (lap = patch of cloth)
Would a suitable English equivalent be something like "bodged" or "makeshift"?
Also, as a very very beginner to Dutch, I always chuckle when I read Dutch because of how literal it can be, like how to be hungry or thirsty is literally to have hunger or thirst, or how pet translates to house animal.
It looks like a compound word that might be translated as “stop-gap” in English.
@@FumerieHilaire stop-gap is a great suggestion!! I think that is possibly the closest you'll get
Nice goeie vertaling!
...can u imagine the pain that whole babys existence was...being born and in pain for 9months then dieing....like how can any parent be such a monster
Obviously, their life-style choices were more important to them -- and more "worthy" of defending -- than their own baby! What a couple of delusional saps!
*dying
can you imagine billions of baby cows getting killed every year just after they were born...every non vegan here calls these parents disturbing but what about them?....they themselves contribute towards the murder of babies and are now acting as if they care about one
@@AM-tb4fn did you just call a human baby no different then a cow.....
@@Char1ynn I did...why discriminate btw them...aren't they both babies...why do u think humans lives matter more than the lives of these babies?
Do vegans realize putting veganism up against scrutiny actually helps veganism? Stop treating it like a delicate religion and let it stand up to science. Great job, UV.
How true - good comment!
Wrong lol. Idiots. You are doing it wrong.
Atheists Gone Wild Ummm but science DOESN'T support veganism so....
+MiAmoreNoir+
Why do you think that science doesn't support veganism ?
If science didn't support veganism I would stop it.
If it's not safe and healthy, we shouldn't be vegan.
Akilab Sheep Because it doesn't. I was vegan for a while but it didn't feel right for me and all the "science" and "facts" didn't add up when I really looked into it.
Studies with rats/mice are b.s. Observational studies are b.s. The BIGGEST thing for me was that Veganism almost always piggybacks off of or is categorized with vegetarianism and plant-based diets, which are NOT the same. Science is flawed and/or incomplete and a lot of vegans take the info and blow it out of proportion. When and if you actually read the study (which I find most don't) it is not as conclusive as presented. A lot of conclusions about meat are based on excessive consumption of grain-fed CAFO meat, which is terrible. They also fail to take into account the vast amounts of starch and sugar most unhealthy ppl eat. For instance, when talking about how bad fast food is most ALWAYS zero in on the meat when 80+% of fast food is comprised of starch and sugar. Buns, fries, soda/juice, cookies, ice cream, etc. Even the meat usually has some sort of grain-based filler or coating.
There is a lot of misinformation about nutrients. Vit A is not the same as beta carotene, though it is often labeled as the same. Heme iron is MUCH better absorbed and utilized than non-heme. B-12 in plant foods is of questionable bioavailability. The lie that we can't digest meat when it is fiber that we can't digest (hence the reason it makes your stools bigger). The only undigested matter I've seen on the back-end are vegetation - corn, lettuce, etc. I have known quite a few vegans who suddenly hit a wall and didn't recover until they went (at least) vegetarian but again it is rarely, if ever talked about. I saw so many nutritional deficiencies and other health issues with my own eyes but when you talk to most vegans they turn a blind eye and act like these unhealthy vegans don't exist.
We are people who come from varied backgrounds and diets. I think some ppl do well on a vegan diet and others do terribly. We can find science or a study to support almost any dietary conclusion. I, personally, haven't found a long-lived 100% vegan culture. Even the oft-touted Okinawans ate the dreaded pork, even if it was in very small amounts. If anything, a vegetarian or plant-based diet is what I have found to be the most scientifically-supported diet but as I stated earlier that does not equal a vegan diet nor does that mean it is best for everyone. I also find starch and sugar to be HUGE culprits and that most people's health really improves when they reduce them, whether they eat meat or not.
Not telling you not to be vegan but I think it is disingenuous when people put any diet in a pedestal and act like it will stand up completely against science - it won't. There will always be a flaw or exception. There will always be another study with different results. There will always be a culture that has done well doing the exact opposite. If being vegan works best for you than do it! But it won't work for everyone nor is it best for everyone and THAT is the important part! People shouldn't be led to or scared into believing there is one diet for all and that science proves it.
Why do they sound so calm when talking about a dead child?
Because the _important_ thing wasn't the _terrible tragedy_ brought on by parents who didn't know what they were doing and were too arrogant and self-assured of the intrinsic and faultless healthiness of their lifestyle to _admit that_ and seek advice from an _actual dietician_ who would know how to round out an infant's vegan diet; no, the _important_ thing was that they now had a perfect opportunity to cry "Propaganda!" like a couple of paranoid sphynx cats while they act smug and condescending to meat eaters.
Da Dragon Durp if they weren't calm people would be like I hate those angry vegans. The lady in this video is calm as well
Jalapeno Pizza .....no people wouldn't be saying that because there is a reason for them not to be calm. A dead child.
Because they could care less about the child. They're taking this tragedy and trying to use it as a platform to launch their "omnivores are against us" rally. It's disgusting that they won't even admit that the kid's parents did wrong because they're determined to promote the vegan diet as flawless, and any criticism or mistake someone makes is not linked to the food they ate but a personal vendetta against veganism. Probably on the pork industry's payroll. *eyeroll*
Da Dragon Durp because they’re anti kids like typical vegans are and they’re glad a “potential meat eater” died
I can't trust a thing 'That Vegan Couple' says. They think guide dogs are abused, when the guide dogs I've seen have been the happiest looking dogs ever!
Carefree Critters Dogs like to feel important. That’s what i observed.
Yes, exactly! My dog loves learning tricks and going over obedience training. They wouldn't do it if they didn't like it!
guide dogs are literally just trained dogs, and they're not trained like elephants are bc,,,,,, they enjoy the training lmao. "do thing, get treat" sounds pretty great to me! I had a dog that was a failed service animal, but the only reason he failed was because he loved kids so much he couldn't resist saying hi to them whenever he saw them and would act like a puppy, even at 15 lol. people, esp cultist vegans, don't seem to understand that it's possible for animals to like work and companionship, which why there are entire classifications of breeds that are known as working dogs. the same way some people need to constantly be doing something, some dogs need to constantly have something to do, and the love they receive is more than enough of a reward
London M Exactly! I am vegan but was looking into getting a service dog, or training my own dog to be my medical alert/psychiatric SD. She loves learning tricks, and even without treats, she just loves getting my praise, and it gives her something to do!
@@reina8942 did they really say that? I'd like to have a link to that video. I wanna call them out on it
The fact that they are laughing and smiling while talking is truly disgusting.
They want to save the animals, but don’t care to save their child. Where’s the logic?
Bush Wookie I don't really see how this has to do with anything
lemonlimedisaster what does anything have to do with anything on this stupid rock hurling through space?
lemonlimedisaster its a bit dude. Or a roast whatever you call talking shit but only half serious. Other half is too lazy to ever REALLY care
🤔
Bush Wookie Alfa/Beta is not a real term in human society. A man who is big and muscular might be "alfa" when it comes to brute strenght but could hypotetically be a dumb as a stick and earn pennies flipping burgers, while a skinny man who is at the top of a big corporation might not be able to throw a decent punch but could earn millions and would be alfa in that world. So which "alfa" exactly should women be fucking then?
They should've breastfed. That's the original source of nutrition for babies.
Brenda Akers Is that vegan thou? I asked myself that the whole video.
Marie #LaFamilia if somebody is so vegan they can't breastfeed for the reason of veganism, the person is nuts!!!
Brenda Akers So i did research and most people think its okay to breastfeed as a vegan because just like goatmilk is the best for goats and cowmilk is the best for cows they think breastfeeding is the right way to nourish their child. But if you live an unbalanced vegan diet it may happen that women dont produce enough milk/enough well nourished milk to feed their child properly
Marie #LaFamilia yes. I was kinda joking. But you never know- some ppl think breastfeeding is yucky. I breastfed wherever I was, and never had a problem. Some of my friends have had different experiences.
Marie #LaFamilia yes of course its vegan.
I'm vegan, but I don't impose my diet on my children, except for cutting out over processed foods.
The baby in your picture is so cute but I totally agree
But why? Why would you want to be vegan but not your children I don’t get it?
My mum was the same with me (she's also vegan.) But recently, I decided to go vegan for ethical reasons, and my sister went vegetarian 2 weeks ago. It's good to have your children make their own decisions, but I don't think it's a bad thing raising your kid vegan. If they don't want to be vegan later in life, well, they don't have to be! Same way goes with eating meat.
You can raise your kid vegan, but it is absolutely necessary that they get all the stuff they need. Except for dairy formula, most babies are raised vegan when they get breast milk. Ofcourse it's your own decision, but it is necessary that vegans that are feeding their kids the right way don't get al this hate from people who want to see vegans burn because of some stupid crazy people that don't know how to raise a kid.
i find it helpful for growing children to eat meat simply because of the complete amounts of protein and iron. i know that older children are 100% able to eat most of their food but with my experience with little kids, they dont like to eat a ton like adults will for multiple sources of protein or iron in veggies.
Honestly, that sandwich looked good to me. I was surprised they got so irritated at the image.
I agree. I’m not vegan and would looooove to eat that sandwich.
Omg a vegan who evidences their info from reputable sources and isn't angry af. I would actually listen to you compared to the screaming masses trying to guilt trip us in the city centre :/
Fuck off, a lot more meat eaters scream at me than vegans
August NKK,
Proving the OPs point, 10/10 would rate again. Is English your primary language?
August NKK what did the vid say about the number of vegans in the world again?
@JustMe 101 What about carnivores and omnivores? o.o
Speaking of doing actual research, you watched this video right? This person is a vegan and admits having deficiencies of certain nutrients that you get primarily from meat sources without it being synthesized. You CAN survive without meat, but you wont be at your healthiest. You CAN survive for a few days without water too, doesn't mean you shouldn't drink it daily.
So I read the original dutch article (I'm from the Netherlands), and it had NOTHING to do with veganism. It actually said that "the seven month old Lucas was barely 4,3 kilograms (not quite 10 pounds), severely dehydrated and didn't have anything left in his stomach or intestines when his parents drove halfway accross the country with him (It's Belgium. It's a small country. It took them barely an hour to do that.) to seek help from a homeopathic doctor, who sent them to a hospital straight away. But Lucas died on the way there. Lucas had severe feeding problems and his parents were being prosecuted for not seeking medical help sooner. The parents were giving him all kinds of different types of vegan milk substitutes from their own store all the time. They determined for themselves without seeking help from a doctor that he was gluten- and lactoseintolerant. Their ideas about healthcare cost their son his life. They were, apparently, excessively religious to the point of being cultlike. Lucas was the third of four children" (Which, I guess, means he had a twin sister?) "and the other three, all girls, were reportedly fine. According to the couple's lawyer, Lucas' health was changable, good some days, and worse on others, but never truly concerning. On the day of his death, the parents decided to drive for an hour to get to a homeopathic doctor instead of taking him immediately to the nearest hospital. If they had, Lucas may have lived. The parents had never taken him to a doctor before, even though he, since the parents put him on the milk diet they devised and according to the people around them (the neighbours and stuff), lost a lot of weight and often looked grayish pale and like he was gasping for breath. Apparently the parents 'never saw anything strange and don't have an explaination for their son's death.' They only ever sought help from either priests/ bisschops or people who don't know much about medicin (the word 'Leken' can mean either) and your 'lapmiddelen' (basically temporary self-devised solutions that don't really address the problem). A review from an expert, however, suggested that Lucas had been pathologically undernourished."
The word 'Vegan', however, is actually not mentioned once in the article. I will say, however, that to deny your child their right to proper medical treatment is considered a crime in the BeNeLux (Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg), is illegal. Because you, as a parent, are supposed to watch over your child's wellbeing above all else. And unproven ideas (Slang for 'alternative medicin') don't count. Religion is NOT considered an excuse to deny your child medical aid here. And I like it that way.
Esmée Bruinsma “Religion is not an excuse to deny your child healthcare” Omg I would give my life savings for it to be like this in the US. I hate that parents can just decide not to take their kids to doctors because of some grand conspiracy they believe in and it leads to kids literally dying.
Thank you for your summary on the original article it was very helpful and greatly appreciated.
@@AT-sx2jp I wish it was the same here too! Maybe then the US would have less problems with anti vaxxers and people just generally neglecting their children's health.
Esmée Bruinsma the couple fabricated food allergies and intolerances (such as lactose intolerance, gluten allergy etc.) to force their veganism life style into their child. That’s what I heard/read anyway.
Thank you!!
That Vegan Couple is so condecendingly smarmy in all their videos. Such a turnoff.
You might take a few minutes to watch their video in it's entirety (she included the link above.) The clips alone do allude to the attitude you mention but the entire video indicates they are more conscientious and even genuinely concerned & sorry for the poor baby, than the clips would suggest and they do make valid points regarding vegan vs omni diets & perceptions about both.
I thought you meant that they make you... un-horny(that’s probably not how you would word that but I’m dumb)
"when do they say this to parents feeding kids an omnivorous diet??" i literally screamed "ALL THE TIME" the moment she said " umm all the time''
Someone give this woman a "Vegan of the Year" award. She's the best vegan I've ever seen.
The Boofar I hope you are sarcastic.
She constantly bashed other vegans for views and drama. All her viewers are vegan and don’t watch her vegan videos because they are already knowledgeable on that subject so she starts drama with other vegans to gain attention.
Ken Don't you think that someone needs to reign in those spreading misinformation? Who better to do that than a vegan who practices a healthy lifestyle. I am not vegan but would listen to this woman far sooner than those making wild claims.
Moose Ken I watch her and I'm not vegan
Book Worm I’m the best normal person I’ve ever seen. Can I get an award? 😐
I wish all vegans were like you.
i wish vegans were not vegan but then again ill take the extra quality food
Thankfully a lot are. Unfortunately there are also a lot of arrogant, crazed ones too, that are also very loud, and well, as you can guess, the latter get more attention, and give us all a bad name.
Yeah. One side you have highly respectable and empathetic ones. While on the other you have loud, crazy, and.... maybe mentally insane ones who only wish for genocide against their own kind.
we are there are just anomalies, like meat eaters with the whole carnivore blood drinker, raw meat muncher
Including peta
what an adult does with their body is their business
but when they start to starve their baby/children or pets someone should step in.
Their reaction is very odd to me. It amazes me how they cherry-pick their research.
That Vegan Couple are, to me, one of the most alarming and misinformed vegan channels on CZcams... They really do nothing for the movement other than drive people further away from it.
Erin Honor agreed. Why do people like them so much they're scary and condescending
Those under nourished vegans are in no physical condition to be lecturing any other person on their preferred diet type.
Pretty sure it's the lack of bacon that drives people away.
Erin Honor ikr that vegan couple are condescending af as well
This has to be the most important comment here.
Raising a baby vegan is not a problem. I was raised vegan and have been very healthy my whole life (my mother is a nutritionist, she knew what she was doing). Like you said the problem is parents who dont know what they are doing. It is so sad.
From infancy?
You missed the whole point of the initial video where they couldn't figure out why the word vegan needed to be mentioned in the title if the infant was given cow milk formula. Basically UV viewers need to get over themselves. So much ego on the page is attractive to materialists. Pretty low grade viewing.
You were raised on a supplement diet you wanted to say
Liv K the thing is, these parents weren’t even vegan. They were religious extremists who refused to see doctors, and started giving their baby quinoa milk instead of breastmilk because a priest told them the baby was lactose intolerant. They have 3 daughters who were given regular omnivorous diets and were given breast milk as babies rather than this crazy diet.
Liv K And there’s nothing wrong with a vegan diet, as long as the baby is getting breast milk or formula (there are both vegan and non vegan varieties of formula) but this couple just starved their baby. It’s no different to the couple in the US who gave their baby regular cows milk and water and the baby died.
14:13 "The majority of women who can't breastfeed their child for whatever reason [...] put them on cow milk formula."
"Wrong species! Wrong species!"
"How is giving cow milk powder to a human baby healthy?"
Gotta love how they're bashing cow milk formula, because it's the "wrong species", while they'd probably recommend a plant based formula to a mother who can't breastfeed. Hey, geniuses. Soy isn't just the wrong species, it's the wrong KINGDOM, which is several taxonomic ranks farther away from humans than cows. At least we're both mammals. What even is the argument here?
WHY IS THIS COMMENT SO FUNNY TO ME JFUEUFJS YOURE SO RIGHT OH MY GOD 😂😂😂
Trying to follow Frelee and fully raw Kristina’s diet nearly killed me due to my malnutrition. I didn’t starve by any means but when I gave birth my body was lacking so much it literally just gave up and they had to rush me to the OR to save my life. I’m so glad your educating people how to be healthy.
see, you I can respect, I am a meat eater but I can absolutely respect you and am open to listening to you. you're calm and rational and polite, you're not angry and shouting and paranoid, it's wonderful. I wish more vegans were like you, I think people would accept the vegan community a lot more if more were like you.
Hannah Olech there are a ton though. It's just that we only see the bad ones because people like watching them and making fun
It seems the crazy ones are more inclined to pick up a camera
I'm not trying to be patronizing, but do you think it's because she doesn't call out meat eaters as much as other vegans? I do wish some of the more vocal vegans were more pragmatic and willing to accept non-vegan data. This couple isn't realistic and is being disrespectful to the babies in these stories.
Saxon Anglo Yeah that's the reason I can't stand vegans. If they choose not to consume animal products, cool you do you, I don't really care what you do. *But* it's when they try to force non-vegans into becoming vegans and acting like your the devil because you happen to like meat.
I understand. I don't think most vegans are like this. Tbh, when food comes up and I *have* to state that I'm vegan, people start criticizing my diet like I'm attacking theirs by just being vegan. I think for youtubers, it's more effective to just present the facts because then there is no refuting veganism, only educating non-vegans. Plus, like unnatural vegan has mentioned in other videos, consuming animal products can still be fine for your health and be more practical for some people.
That's why all those plant milk labels say, in GIANT BOLD LETTERS "NOT TO BE USED AS IMFANT FORMULA!!!"
mahoraner niall Yeah, but that's in america where warning labels are slapped on everything because US-americans are both uneducated and love to sue.
In europe, warning like that aren't on plant milk.
Like, it's still obviously a Bad idea to use plant milk as formula but america is not the whole world.
Nathalie Mykløy Not because we're dumb. Because we're litigation-prone.
Don't be a jerk.
oKiryn They have to claim ignorance so what was said is not being a jerk, it is true. How many law suits have been won when the person suing said they knew the outcome but did it anyways.
Saying "the majority of americans are retarded" is a tad rude, to put it lightly. I'll happily accept your criticisms of our bogus legal system, though.
Nathalie Mykløy you can't say the majority of Americans are retarded if your using lightbulbs a laptop and a swivel chair or have a Roomba because you have a likelyhood of owning the first things and a average possibility of not being able to make fun of swivel chairs otherwise know as how to get sick in 4+ directions
As a Vegan myself, please don’t give your newborn plant milk. Give them breast milk or formula please.
There is a soy formula alternative for babies that are lactose intolerant. I had to get it for my child.
I'm lactose intolerant and have celiac disease, so my mum had to order food and formula from over seas until I was old enough to eat some fish and meat :/ (born in the 90s, so everything was so expensive as well D:)
Yeah, I was raised on soy formula, too. The state even helped pay for it with wix. I wonder if that's not available in Belgium as readily.
My dad bought me that to supplement the breastmilk because my mom worked
@@LostApotheosis it surely is, and even if it isn't parents in need are go an search for it and import it. I think, the parents of this poor baby are just absolutely crazy and haven't cared at all for their child
@@LostApotheosis It is in the Netherlands, so it should be available in Belgium as well. Even if it's not available, they could have gone to the Netherlands and just bulk up.
You're the only vegan I've met on youtube who's actually educated and knows what she's talking about. It's so alarming how many vegans don't have a clue about proper nutrition. Keep educating those vegans! You're so needed in this community.
I'm Dutch and I read the original article. It doesn't mention once the parents were vegans. I'm not even sure they were vegans but they did own a health food store. Clearly this story has been sensationalized by international media and That Vegan Couple jumped on the bandwagon without doing research. I'm glad there's people like you who know better!
Um, they were vegan...
@@adammonks591 really? Do you know them?
@@adammonks591 how do you know? If the original article doesn't mention it, clearly someone made false assumptions.
Zou je me kunnen vertellen hoe je de originele artikel hebt gevonden? Zou het fijn vinden om deze zelf ook te kunnen lezen
@@therobin980 No, I just did my research.
i can not physically look at them. it pisses me off
Very proud of this channel for using an actual analytical approach with sound logic.
Ugh why is she laughing when he reads that headline... their huge smiles are worse than them scoffing the whole time...
because she knows its hilariously stupid which it is
Nasa P I know right. They give me the creeps!
Nasa P I was about to comment on that until I read your comment. I'm like wtf is wrong with her? Does she think the death of a baby is funny?
Pepe Frog Ayyy pepe get outta here man, the normie levels are too damn high
happy Gabby!!! I don't see her laughing . In fact she is the most serious hot nerdy girl I've ever seen. What else do you want from her, wear a black veil ?
The two of them are so annoying and cringe worthy. I can't believe people follow them. People that bend truth to fit their narrative need to stop.
I thought so too, but they have some cool videos lately. I do hope they start to positively influence people.
I actually find both of them annoying, but also unnatural vegan, I can never watch a whole video of her :/. I like vegans like Ed or Joey Carbstrong much more than those 3.
+Becca * People that bend truth to fit their narrative need to stop.*
Tell THAT to every politician, every salesperson, and every marketer trying to sell you something. The world is FULL of people who bend the truth in order to push their agenda or to sell something. If you want to be safe from it, learn critical thinking skills, how to understand rhetoric, and how to properly research claims you see made. Because frankly, people will never stop framing things how they want you to view them in order to get you to do what they want.
Ivona Flakus A positive influence??! They are defending fucking murderers!! They deserve hell, not views. Nothing they do will ever be cool to me
+She's The One I do not believe the parents of the child that died are murderers. Negligent, yes, but not outright murderers. Murder implies intent to harm, or even intent to kill. These parents were ill informed, and negligent, but I seriously doubt their intent was to harm or kill their child.
The thing about vegan woman dying in Mount Everest was such a big headline because she wanted to prove that “vegans can do anything”. So yeah... Granted, many non-vegan people had died in that mountain too, but sadly cruel irony is what brings most views for these news companies.
I absolutely love your videos, intelligent, factual and well informed.
II have 2 daughters and I had the most wonderful paediatrician when they were born.
I breastfed both my girl, I was lucky. But he said to me that both regular and soy based formula were adequate for babies. Usually, it's true, they will only recommend it if your baby is allergic to regular milk. But he would never have said anything against it if that would have been my choice, even if my girls weren't allergic.
He supported any complete diet and was very anti medication (he wouldn't prescribe drugs just to get rid of a problem) He was a wonderful man, very interested in new approaches and alternative medicine.
Sadly he passed away from complications due to a lung transplant. He continued working until he was hospitalized, taking care of his patients was his life mission.
Great man, RIP.
Even if you are vegan you should breast feed your child because it's natural and if you have to give them a non vegan formula just do it. I'm all for saving the animals but everyone should put their child first
Totally agreed but I wonder if the mother was malnourished somehow and she didn't have breast milk. I agree on the formula as well if necessary. I'm just a gal who doesn't eat meat. I still eat milk and egg...so I expect someone to insult me like "you're not even a vegetarian" yadayadayada
i was so sad when i coudnt breast feed but i did resereach and found what was best for my baby if i couldnt feed her. you are 100% right the child comes first
nehagatari but you are a vegetarian. You just don't eat meat. You still eat animal products. That is what a vegetarian ja.
Are vegans against breastfeeding? I honestly don't know. I guess it's not "vegan" but I thought the point of a vegan diet was to spare the animals from the abuse... It's not abuse to feed your own child. Do they think baby cows drinking mom's milk as bad?
Eloise Maeve it being natural isn’t a reasoning to do or not do something.
I'm vegan and so is my daughter. I still fed her formula though because the risk of not giving her formula was too high for me personally. I wish I could have breastfed but, we adopted and induced lactation didn't happen. I think vegans should try to educate others on how to properly feed vegan children vs. just dismissing it completely and deflecting the real issue.
Jessika England Totally agree with your decision to use formula. Eventually there will be vegan alternatives because of our demand for them, for now we just have to avoid animal abuse and products as much as 'possible and practicable'.
That's really cool I'm interested in vegan adoption I wish she would make a vid on it!
Jessika England I know this is probing and you totally don't have to answer, just ignore me if it's rude to ask, bit do you have thyroid issues? I had my own biological child and my milk never came in. I was devastated that I couldn't breastfeed but found out 5 months later that I was dangerously hypothyroid. I've started wondering if that was the cause.
A Designer At Home -Corinna I have Hashimoto's (autoimmune hypo thyroid) and yes, being hypo or hyper can really mess with your milk supply. I had the opposite reaction and my breasts thought I was feeding twins. Getting on tsh replacement can really help.
Vegan formula may not be a great alternative. Obviously breast is best, but the closest thing to breast milk is probably another animal's milk when it's modified to be as close to breast milk as possible. I don't actually know if there's any research on this, but it would make sense to me that a non-vegan supplement for a baby at breastfeeding age would be ideal
I'm sure that baby wasnt on a bacon diet and having multiple vitiman deficiencies because of that.
I was veagan for most of my life.. When I became anemic and pregnant I started eating meat. No supliments worked
Mao mao the girls a lot of people need meat and its totally okay!! i hope youre healthy now :))
that's okay! a vegan diet is NOT healthy or sustainable for everyone! your health matters, and eating and using animal products does not make you less of a person
Thank you I am healthy now
Yup supplements are rubbish
The same thing happened to me when I tried to go veggie. I knew I was anaemic, and I was taking my pills, then passed out at work and ended up at the hospital. Now I try to just eat as little meat as possible and only ethicality sourced from a co-op I trust. We all have eat the way that makes us healthiest and happiest.
People like you, who educate rather than scream and shout, really helps me understand aspects of veganism and how I can at least change my diet step by step to have less of a negative impact on the environment. I also appreciate that you don't band wagon along with other vegans and have the ability to logically scrutinize the insanity that others spout. Thank you for what you do!
Lien Vo I feel exactly the same way
So... breast milk for babies isn’t vegan? From my understanding, I thought that the reason for a lot of vegans drinking plant milk was because giant factories harm cows and the milk is intended for the calves... so isn’t breast milk intended for babies?
I believe the mother was having problems lactating, so she could not breastfeed the child
Danielle i dare say they should have done to a doctor for that. Find a correct formula or find the right materials to keep them alive. She may have had problems lactating but they were so foolish and are just smiling
Jon Oxlade usually, it’s for medical reasons. Maybe you aren’t producing enough milk (this happens often with preemies, where you have to feed the baby every hour or so), or maybe the baby is having a negative reaction to the milk (I broke out into huge burning hives every time I nursed, because I was allergic to my mother’s milk). There can be many medical complications that arise because of breastfeeding, and it’s a sad truth that not all people can breastfeed because of those reasons.
Danielle, is there any proof that this is the case for this instance or were the parents really just delusional vegans?
andreeuh all human fluids considered vegan as far as I know, including breast milk. So basically baby fed breast milk is still a "vegan-baby". But if/when a mother can't produce feeding baby a soy/almond/etc milk is an utter BS and delusion. In an attempt of being ethical to an animal you're being unethical to your child, in an attempt of being healthy your child is being injured and/or dead.
"Lapmiddel" is a Dutch saying, meaning some sort of thing you do or use that don't actually help, I'm Belgian and I must say it's rarely used in a daily context
Cows and goats, literal herbivores: drink and feed milk for child
Those vegan couples: THAT’S NOT VEGAN.
Doesn't it literally say on the packaging of plant milks that it is not meant to be used as a baby formula??
It does, people are just to stupid
It definitely does
They literally made the "formulas" themselves
Yasss! I am vegan and tired of hearing other vegan promote veganismo as the only diet that’s healthy!! People in china are much healthier and eat eggs and meat!! It’s about good ingredients and keeping calories in check!
Omg a down to earth vegan! Can I take a pic of you? :D
Sarah Boldin They eat a lot of seafood too.
Sarah Boldin have u ever been to japan ? Cz I laugh so hard just by reading your comment 😂
Sarah Boldin you are so wrong, you have no clue. Haven't you ever heard of Kobe beef? 😅😂🤣
korean diets are one of the most healthiest in the world. i think you mean that? they like meat a lot as well, but it’s kept very well balanced. don’t always eat rice and noodles in every meal but sometimes just veg and lettuce
They seem to forget that there is a soy based formula. I was allergic to milk as a baby, and was raised on a soy formula
Two of my children were too. Also first 6 months of life its recommended no solid food. When mine were weaned, they started on rice, fruit and veg and were naturally vegan for first year of their life. Neither starved.
@Good Cook When did you get medical/dietetic degree? We all know 'breast is best', but we also know that for many many reasons, some mums can't. Stop shaming them!
These two...their personality(!) is being Holier-Than-Thou Vegan. He's even wearing a SHIRT that says "VEGAN" making a response video in the wake of a baby dying. (He wears one in both videos --how many of those do you have in your closet?) A little cavalier, honestly.
Their tank tops give me anxiety
Judging people’s body’s like that is disgusting.
@@KeithsUniverse calm down.
@@KeithsUniverse chill, they commented about their ugly af tanktops, it's okay shhh, calm down.
But it can't hide the ugly that is spout out of their mouths.
@@KeithsUniverse 1) the comment is abou their clothes, not bodies - you making it about their bodies makes you the disgusting one 2) it's completely fine and normal to point out to a person that they're looking unhealthy - it means you care about that person and tell them something they might be missing and hence help them to uncover an underlying issue which you can then help them to overcome, that's like friendship 101. But maybe you don't have any friends since you ddn't know that...
I've seen another one of their videos. They are the "holier than thou" types. From what I saw, they care more about defending veganism than the child.
InTheMorningSnow I can't imagine actually sitting through one of their videos.
This is how extremists and facists think.
What is the channel? I'm going to bring the audience out of their vegan trance.
Edit: Nvm I found it.
Nothing Cheeseburger why should I sit through arrogant propaganda by some pseudo-nutritionists? I doubt you could even define your vapid insults.
Bruce Weiner yeah i do. Why do i even wrote it.
The Dutch/Flemish word Lapmiddelen (translated as cloths) is meant to be translated as band-aid, patched-up or quick fix solution✌🏻. Greetings from 🇳🇱The Netherlands👋🏻
I'm from Belgium and 'lapmiddelen' in this context means that they continued to use alternative supplements to hide the inconsistency of certain foods. We are a vegan family living in Belgium and it's EXTREMELY hard to maintain a healthy vegan diet here. Average MD here does not know a single thing about a vegan diet, even the hospitals here are very little informed about this. We don't have a lot of produce to keep up with a healthy vegan diet, so much so, that during the winter season, we sometimes have to bound off our diet a little to make sure we don't become defficient in important nutrients. HOWEVER there is a lot of American advertising about veganism here, which results in a lot of parents wanting to raise their child vegan without making the transition themselves and there's very minimal info about how to maintain a healthy vegan diet. That sadly results in a lot of parents wanting to do the right thing for their child, but with zero help of medical doctors and if you don't know what you're doing here, you really shouldn't.. we gave our baby non-vegan formula after breastfeeding. You have to be smart, not naive.
I'm reading this four years later, and am a bit surprised because at least in Brussels, where I live, it's extremely easy to be vegan because, apart from the many supermarkets carrying all kinds of fruits, vegetables, legumes, tofu, vegan processed foods etc there are so many huge health stores, weekly markets etc.
It might be different in Flanders though, or in smaller towns.
Yes! Where we lived at the time was a very rural area and we didn’t even have a supermarket. We had a local butcher, bakery and farmer and that was it! Since moving more towards the city it has definitely become more easy 😊
If they had talked about how these plant based milks are meant to be consumed by adults as a substitute for milk. It IS NOT meant to be baby formula. But no, they played the victim and talked about a dead baby like it was nothing.
It even says on the carton that is should not be used as infant formula of every alternative milk, just like it says on cows milk carton. The idea that is not relevant to them is baffling.
Ikr breast milk is literally there for the baby. It's not harming any animals. In fact it only has benefits as long as the mother is healthy
If you watch their original video that’s not their baby and they aren’t the couple in the video
Girl you are the coolest vegan I know.
sarabeht same
Yes! I love fullyrawKristina's positivity, too - but man; some things that come out of the mouth's of vegans are just horrifying!
I find it bemusing that they disabled the comments on their video...
Probably cause they don't wanna be refuted with facts and stuff. How.... "Open minded" of them.
I'm a vegan, my hubby a meat eater and if we had children I would not expect the child to be vegan, although I would try to ensure they were vegetarian x
Maybe your husband would try to “ensure” that they were meat eaters. Why is your way and what you want any better. Feed them a variety of meat, veggies, and fruit and let them decide as they get older.
@@kristypickett4227 I don't want kids but if I pushed it out I would decide what it was being fed
Why ‘at least vegetarian’? Why are you hit vegetarian yourself?
I'm a vegan but how could anyone be so stupid to substitute anything with breast milk. They better not think breast feeding is non vegan or else they're beyond stupid.
Right! I'm all for breastfeeding, but if it's not possible to do that there are soy formulas that have all the nutrients that baby's need, why you would feed your child quinoa milk I don't know
Wow. As a non-vegan, I'm so interested in your vids. Ty for keeping it real.
ty for making people dead lol
Amaterasu Gōka Mekkyaku and you don't care abt killing the plants u eat.
There are plenty of “regular” vegans, it’s just that the loudest attention seekers are usually the crazies. True for a lot of things really, lol.
Cause she makes you feel good about being non-vegan? :p
@@lilevex7861 pragmatism is far more effective at conversion than hostility. :)
I was breast fed as a baby and then given soy formula until I could eat solid food (I was lactose intolerant) and I turned out completely healthy bc it was soy FORMULA that was FORTIFIED! Thank you for speaking the truth always girl❤ if my parents had just given me soy milk I would have died but they took me to the doctor when I was having horrible reactions, getting sick and breaking out in a rash every time my mom gave me cows formula and the DOCTOR like actual medical professional diagnosed me as lactose intolerant and put me on soy formula. If done right your baby can be vegan but it has to be planned and done under the supervision of a doctor or dietitian who specializes in a vegan diet. It’s just a lot more common for vegan parents vs omnivore parents to feed their kid an extreme diet so that’s why it needs to be talked about. It’s crazy how much you are educating us and people still wanna completely miss the point of what you are saying like all the posts saying “yeah vegans hate babies” like that’s not what she’s saying she’s saying we need to talk about these extremist vegan parents not properly planning their babies diet. Even though my parents didn’t intentionally feed me vegan, bc of my intolerance I basically was plant based as a baby and was fine bc it was done correctly.
Edit: I was born in 99 so there are far more formula options now and it’s easier to access so there was no excuse back then and there’s none now to malnourish your baby vegan or not
Y'know what headline I have seen before? "Child dies due to negligent parents" just like this.
They care so much about proper treatment for animals but they go ahead and starve and pain their OWN CHILD. What hypocrisy? If they had properly known what the child needed and wanted to see to those demands then the child would be thriving. They hurt their own child from the moment their born simply because of the reason of a diet and didn't think about the own well being of the baby at that moment.
you should look into being a lawyer in the field of animal rights and advocacy. Your rhetoric is amazing already.
KnightofAntiquity ???
Jillian Jacques ou
KnightofAntiquity
Who are you talking about?
WaSsUp Gamz. also mutual confusion lol
Lololol
Hi Unnatural Vegan: please note that there are other options other than cow's milk: there are also goat milk formula's and in addition there are donor breast milk services or wet/cross nurses for babies. Some babies are allergic to cow's milk - it's not a one size fits all formula!
They keep saying its how they "help"
people giving them "advice", when they're actually just defending and justifying their diets, they're all just masking their ignorance and idiocy with _"concern"._
I honestly found their video really insensitive... they came off so smug and superior, laughing and smirking, all while discussing and debating the death of a baby as if it was no big deal. for all their semantics, "oh poor baby, how unfortunate" they acted very disrespectfully and demonstrated a real lack of sensitivity considering they are talking about a death that could have easily been prevented. like when you're making a video about a baby dying, maybe show some tangible sympathy and grace rather than using it to prove a point??
I agree completely. It's their insensitivity to the death and absolute sensitivity to the "vegan-'shaming'" that's so offputting...
Video Gamer how could you describe their behavior as being sympathetic? Foh
cate f very well said.
I don't understand why babys are just fed vegan, although they cannot decide what they want to eat. My sister is vegan, but her daughters eat meat because they want to. I think it's important to accept kids own will and decision!!
nic jones Uh...that's the age you give hormone blockers? They do no harm and give the kid time to determine whether or not they really want to transition.
Rian Lewis eh actually there are cases of children having a rough time because they were put on hormone blockers at a young age and they didn't want to transition a few years later.
but that doesn't really have anything to do with the video
ok that's cool Yeah but most of the time that isn't the case and at least they had time to make a decision rather than either 1. make irreversible changes and regret it later or 2. Not make any changes and have horrible dysphoria until they do transition.
I know lmao idk why the other person made that comment. They're two completely different situations.
Rian Lewis yea true idk I still don't think you start transitioning a young kid like that, wait until they're older
I've talked to my bf about it, who is trans and he said that a lot of kids today do it because they see it all of the place and they don't really understand the mental struggles that come with it and transitioning a 12 yr old kid because they said they're trans could be a bad decision but it's not my decision to make
ok that's cool I'm trans and I agree with your point on kids transitioning too young. However, like I said hormone blockers just temporarily stop physical development and aren't the same thing as permanently transitioning. They give preteens an opportunity to "experiment" and discover whether or not they are actually trans. If they aren't, then so be it, they can just quit the blockers, but if they are it could be extremely helpful for body dysphoria later on in life.
If my situation were completely different and I had known I was trans as a younger kid and had an accepting family hormone blockers could have helped with my mental health right now. If I had went on them and later discovered it wasn't what I wanted, then I would have just had a delayed puberty. In my opinion, the pros of hormone blockers outweigh the cons.
Wow, I just clicked to this video and I remember watching it when it came out. I was wondering why I had given a thumbs down to this video, but when I realized this was a response to That Vegan Couple I immediately understood. I used to be the number one fan of them, and I still like them, but my point of view has changed soooo much lately. Now I agree a lot more with you. It is so funny to notice how much I have changed. I used to be very strict with everything when it comes to veganism (like I guess almost everyone is when they start being vegan). Now I have been vegan for 6 years and before that I was a vegetarian for many years. But, I now understand that veganism is not as easy for everyone as it is for me. I also understand how bad vegan diets many people eat (including me), and only recently I have understood how many things are wrong in my diet. Just a reminder for everyone, try to look outside the box and don´t take nutritional advice ONLY from people on youtube who have not had any nutritional education. This doesn´t really have to do with this video but it just made me reflect my journey as a vegan. Veganism is not the answer for every single problem in the world! It is a good start and I recommend everyone to at least try it but there are other factors to be taken into account.
The way they talk about that sandwich 😂
"It looks so obscure, who would want to eat that"
I understand what vegans arguments are against cow milk but human breast milk is specifically for human babies and they shouldnt be feed anything else untill they arent in need of other food.
lilkhalim what you are saying is true and I agree but I think you are really underestimating just how many mothers have trouble breastfeeding. I don't know any stats but it is a very substantial amount of women. And its for All sorts of reasons so it's not an easy fix, so this is where formula comes in. And is actually life saving, not just a corporate gimmick (even though there are quite a few horrendous stories about formula such as Nestle giving free formula to new mothers in poverty stricken countries just long enough for their milk to dry up so they become dependent on formula). But in regards to this case, it's important to also remember the mother was vegan (and didn't do it healthily) so she wouldn't have been eating essential nutrients and vitamins and so there was no way her breast milk would have been enough.
Cassi actually it wasn’t stated that the mother in that story was vegan - did you even watch the video
@cassi Actually, the amount of women that arent able to produce enough milk for their babies is around 15%. Very small. There are other external factors(lack of information, PPD, etc) but those are all solvable.
lilkhalim ik right,
@@cassi1502 if the mothers were eating a high protein diet with lots of animal fat this wouldnt be a problem all
Maybe she wasn't lactating because she was not healthy either.
A Darice That's a very real possibility.
I’m not 100% sure, but wouldn’t you think there’s a vegan formula for babies? You aren’t even supposed to give a baby any type of milk (other than breast or formula) before they are a year old. And by that time the baby would have been eating solids as well as milk.
Emma Carlson there is soy formula, whether or not it's 100% vegan I don't know.
Most vegans have to take B12 just to produce the proteins to lactate
lol B12 has nothing to do with protein
I remember watching them when I was younger and just thinking about how negative and extreme they were. This is crazy to come upon now, years later.. unfortunate that a child died...
It breaks my heart to see these parents be okay when their child just died. I just- I’m speechless. It’s like you had the kid to get attention.
i appreciate this vegan youtuber. she's not in denial. which is why so many vegans dislike her videos.
the fact is, SO MANY vegans DO NOT want a real conversation. they mostly want to confirm each others' biases, and dismiss anything that makes them feel uncomfortable about vegan diet.
Yeah! Shame they're the minority.
THIS! This this this this this! You're so right!
Somehow this popped up in my trending. I’m a meat eater but I loved listening to you. You were very informative. Very glad I found you.
JDMOokami im not into the Vegan diet but i do agree with you i do eat some veggies though my prayers for the baby
Omnivorous is a better term than meat eater, just to help.
I sometimes watch "that Vegan Couple", but I am, like you, disappointed at their insensitivity and lack of commonsense here.
Even their original 'anti-vegan conspiracy theory' comment is incorrect: it has certainly been the case in the UK that parents have hit the headlines for inappropriate junk food diets, for inappropriate high salt diets and for other forms of over feeding, under feeding and inappropriate feeling of their babies/children. The really sad issue here, is that a baby died, due to parental ignorance and neglect,
I really respect your cool-headed logical and sensitive approach. Thank you for your wonderful work and for your channel: you are a great 'advertisement' for the vegan lifestyle! Blessings on you and your family 🙏🏾✨🤗😊
When does a parent look at their child and say, yeah my kid looks fine when the baby is dying🙈
I'm vegan and pretty proud of it. Went vegan for healthier lifestyle. Then environmental impact kicked in. Last came ethical for the animals. We have 2 kids and both vegan. When it comes to vaxs we vaccinate them. We are both againts formula (for us) and breastfeed both our kids.
My eldest had slow weight gain and we seen every doctor or professional we could. We hospitalised and 2 days later we added a top up of fortified formula to our regular breastfeeding. Now first child we were omnivorous. Second child full vegan. Both children are having similar weight gains SLOW. The issue is low milk supply grrrrr. Sadly some of the milk ducts aren't producing high volume of milk. We finally know. So this time we have hit our fortified formula hard and fast.
Your kids come first.
The Dutch world translated as cloths (it doesnt mean cloths) basically means "palliative" So it reads 'Lucas died of starvation but his parents continued to believe in palliatives.'
lasercat also not correct, the direct translation for Lapmiddel is Palliative.
Oh, I always thought it had that meaning. When I search for it it says ' something that doesn't really work' Isn't it a bit similar then?
Not quite, a lapmiddel is something that doesn't really work, but is used temporarily.
Oh ok then I'll change it. Thanks!
That couple would drive me mad, and I'm vegan and Australian. I managed to watch half of one of their videos once before having to close the window. Way, way too intense for me, and a reason why some don't like us vegans.
distant_sounds that's who I think of when I think of vegans.
distant_sounds
I usually do really HATE vegans (why was this in my recommended btw ?) because most vegans are stupid narrow minded extremists. But I'm totally OK with veganism and vegans who respect other people's diets. :)
Every group has their extremists, and it seems a good deal of vegan ones are online, sadly and/or have a public profile (appearing on TV etc). But most vegans aren't that way.
shizukagozen777 it’s not most vegans, it’s the vocal minority, it’s the same way you don’t hear about Christians until the westbourough Baptist church does something stupid, most people who are vegan don’t mention it or preach about it in their day to day life, but the few people that do get preachy and sanctimonious are far more vocal
They actually attacked me on one of their posts once. I think I commented on someone’s comment on their videos and they completely came after me for no reason, it was ridiculous and I’ll never be able to take them seriously
Vegans like them can really mess up the image other people have of vegans. Your comments on their video is absolutely right and it's really good to see that there are vegans who can think rationally. I really like this video, first one I watched of you, and it was very informative and interesting. Thanks!
I'm vegan and wanting kids soon, so I've decided to keep eating vegan, but make them 'normal' food. When they're older, they can choose if they want to eat like me, but the most important thing as a mother is to make sure your kid is healthy.
Please, before you have kids, think about whether or not you'd be okay with feeding your child animal products if they have a health condition that makes it impossible. I am someone who has severe medical issues that prevent me from being vegan, and a seriously medically neglectful parent. If my mom was vegan, I would have died. So please, really think about whether or not you would be willing to feed your child meat before you have kids.