Never knew how bedding was accomplished until I looked at this video. I'll be bedding my Marlin 572 pump next... it's just a .22lr but I'm planning to get my A17 Savage sometime this summer. It too will be bedded. Thanks for sharing the technique.
Absolutely love how you set THEE standard with this rifle with practical and easy advice for anyone level shooter to follow, and my next rimfire purchase will be the A17 👍
Cavedweller. Thank you for this video. I just finished my A-17, and it turned out fantastic. This was my first time bedding anything and couldn't be happier. Thank you
Thanks for putting this video out. Have been interested in the a17. Glad to know what needs to be done to shoot consistent groups. That checkering reminds me of what sako does on some of their rifles
Wow, a tack drivin' rimfire at 100 yards!! That's awesome! I always have known a solid bed job was good, but this is an excellent example of what it can really do. Tack driver and an auto-loader at that. Thank you!
The critter will shoot but you really need to pay attention through the entire trigger pull. It's like a 3 stage trigger, you first pull through the garbage stage, then the pure trash stage until you hit the wall, then it's ready to go. This is almost a 5 year old rifle and I have seen pictures of 2, if not 3 different spring set ups for the A17, I have no idea what the new ones are doing.
The Ruger 22 Hornet video was GREAT !!!! You explained what to do and showed how to do it. My Miles Gilbert kit came today & the Hornady One Shot is do Monday. So, my first glass bedding will happen next week. I would not have tried this until I watched your videos. "Thank you", Jim
Cavedweller1959, following your instruction on your videos, it was easier than I thought. Living in a city, I can only go to a police range for the 100 yard shooting and it's about 25-30 miles away. The range is opened to the public on Sat. But I'll let you know how it does. I can go to 25 yard indoor range to try it out."Thanks again", Jim
Thanks for the great video @cavedweller1959... I watched a couple of times before tackling the job. I'm going to sight it in today or tomorrow, I can't wait!!! One major difference I employed in my process: I bought two 1/4" NF (National Fine, or 28 threads per inch) stainless steel cap screws and cut the heads off and rounded the end over smooth. After applying liberal coats of release agent, (love your One Shot idea), I screwed one into the brass threaded adapter in the stock, where the rear takedown screw goes, and the other one into the threaded hole that accepts the front takedown screw. What this did, while not totally necessary, was: 1.) It gave me guide posts that made it impossible for me to misalign the screw hole/stock interface, (I need all the help I can get!), and: 2.) Almost as important in my decision was that it completely did away with what I thought would be a tedious job of having to dig out all the modeling clay from the screw holes. All I had to do was back the guide posts out of the holes and the threads were totally clean. Bingo... One note: Because I didn't want any chance I would bung up the action or stock, the hardest part of the process was finding out what threads I was dealing with to make my guide posts. I called Savage tech line, easy-peasy, right? Not only was it hard to find a real person on the other end of the line, once I could try to get their help, the woman was very short with me and just blew me off by telling me "Those are proprietary threads.", forcing me to jump down the rabbit hole of the interweb on a quest. Finally, in one forum or another, I found out that many Savage actions simply machined to standard 1/4" fine thread. (1/4" NF). I really enjoyed your presentation, I learned a lot from you (I used to use neutral shoe polish as my release agent), I also like the no-nonsense approach you take, so, Thanks again, have a great New Year, I'll be looking for more from you. Keep your eyes on a swivel, your ear to the ground and keep your powder dry Brother... Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum, JG
Nice video, thanks for posting. I have glass bedded several centerfire rifles but not a rimfire yet. I have the plain plastic stock A17 and the Wood laminate stock version and both shoot well under 1" 10 shot groups at 100 meters right out of the box. I am Using CCI A17 ammo and Bushnell 4-14 4500 series scopes on Leupold rings. The only fliers I have I can call because it is generally my fault. Great rifles.
I have a 9317 btvs with 20in bbl combined with a 3/9/50 tasco on weaver 6 bolt rings that will absolutely shoot 3/4 moa with hornady 17grain vmax. beautiful rifle heavy but just more to love. for price & accuracy $$$ in the bank. your a17 is what I've been waiting for so absolutely great job & I'm stoked that someone actually did what you did
+Timothy Rose The factory version wasn't all that great , OK for most folks, but not good enough for you & me. But bed that action into a solid, ridged stock, Holy Smokes, It can be fun!!
Thanks for the videos. Really informative. I may look into getting a similar Boyds stock for my Savage 93R17 BTVS at some point. The thumbhole stock is nice but kind of heavy.
Your Savage A17 glass bedding video was well done, I learned a lot. The targets really told the story, you need to glass bed to have a good shooting rifle. Keep up the good work.
Great video as per usual. I'm glad you glass bed all of your rifles and emphasize its importance. I need to get some CCI TNT and try in mine. My A17 shoots as well as, or better, than my 10-22 with 20" kidd barrel. Also to the left handed shooters out there, cavedweller was asked how it is for a left handed shooter. I can tell you personally that you will always get debris coming back toward your face when you shoot a right handed semi auto of this sort. It works on a gas blow back system, so you get some of that gas and debris coming back. More so than a 10-22 IMHO. Especially with that dirty A17 ammo. My rifle will consistently shoot sub 1/2" 10 shot groups at 50 yards, but it has also been glass bedded in its factory Boyds pepper laminated stock. It shoots well enough that I don't see why I own a precision type 10-22. Keep up the good work on your videos Cavedweller. I don't always agree, but for the most part, you put out some very informative stuff...
Thanks for your response. I have always used rem oil on all guns but I think the A17 needs a better oil that will bond more to the metal. My problems occurred with CCI TNT 17gr. Thanks again. Also for anybody that has an A17, you need to invest in a Boyd's stock. It completely changes this gun.
I've been following along with your videos on the A17 and can't wait for this stock to come out. I bought this rifle when they came out and it's been in the safe ever since, because I knew this stock would be in the works. I'm glad they made it nice to look at as well. The first thing I thought was "shut up and take my money" :-)
Dan Roy I talked with the R&D guy from Boyds a few days back, Said they are done with their work but it can take quite some time for the sales people to get something new into the system. The good news is that it is on the way.Thanks for Watching.
I think it will be worth the wait. I was about to post the little bugger up for sale the other day but I suppose I can wait for the light at the end of the tunnel. Maybe by Christmas I can buy him a proper stock.
Purchased a Savage A17 in 17 HMR cal. and the trigger is absolutely the worst trigger I have ever used! So after I came back from the range immediately ordered a JARD trigger with 1 lbs. trigger weight for the rifle. While I have it apart I am going to glass bed the rifle and see if it can give my Ruger 10/22 bull barrel a little competition! Great vid!
I bought an A17hm2, it's going to be here tomorrow. I already know I'm putting a boyds on it. I plan on bedding it per your instructions. I'm going to try to give a review of it as I make it grow.
I like your video very illuminating I don't have one of these Savage rifles yet plan to go out and buy one my brother has one and it's a dandy I do plan to buy one thanks for the input I will be watching your videos
I have the A17 heavier barrel sporter, that came with a Boyd's stock. I think you are the first review I have seen that complained about the acutriger . I agree, I have a savage 93r17 and the A17 and prefer the trigger on my savage mark II. The mark II had a ridiculous pull when I bought it but it cost virtually nothing and very simple to reduce the trigger pull. Wish my A17 was as accurate as yours. It'll shoot sub moa but barely and not always. Good enough for what I use it for but everyone would prefer a rifle that will put 5 shots in the same hole. Also should mention that I had issues with my A17 out of the box but fortunately savage has outstanding customer support.
Well, I completed the glass bedding on my Ruger 10/22 at 3:pm est. It's wrapped with tubing and I hope I did it right. "Thanks for your input cavedweller1959", Jim
+Zombi3mountain It is that simple, just think every thing through & do it right the first time. Best part is, if it doesn't come out perfect, just take your dremel roto tool and remove 1/8" or so and fine tune your job. Just don't be shy with the release agent.
I own Savages, and the accutrigger is a fine trigger at a great price, crisp and adjustable, lending itself to fine accuracy, however it is not as pleasing to the touch as a good conventional trigger, but then again it wasn't designed as an expensive trigger, but part of Savage's design to make a great shooting rifle that was affordable, and that it is:)
Agreed, Most all other Savages have pretty good triggers for the money spent, BUT this video is not about most other Savages, It's about the A-17. And the A-17 trigger it nothing like any other I've ever come across. I have a video on this trigger assembly, watch it and I think you will agree.
I see, that is surprising, esp. if it is an inferior trigger, if that's the case, their trigger was one of their selling points, I'll take a look at this 'new' trigger, thanx
Hey, That is some dam good improvement you made! One final thing that I would try if that were my rifle though..... I would make a few paper shims and place them to apply a few pounds, somewhere between 2-6 pounds usually, of upward pressure on the barrel at the forend. I have solved many flyer problems and brought groups sizes in even tighter using that method when everything else was done right and a rifle just "felt" like it wanted to shoot a little better! That little bit of upward pressure at the fore-end tip of the stock can be as little as a pound and a half and settles harmonics down just enough to work miracles! I hope you give it a try, it might surprise you! Also, with a stable stock, you would be surprised what full length glass bedding will do for group size to! Just my 2 cents.....
That has always been a concern of mine too,... harmonics. I understand the idea of bedding but the 'floating barrel' seems like a bit of a tuning fork. I'm going to have to experiment with your idea maybe utilizing some dampening material near the tip that is not going to melt or burn with repeated firing - still have to do some research on that.
What an excellent video, so informative, thank you for taking the time. One thing I was wondering though, I recently bought an A 17 , could I apply the bedding to the factory stock and still have it perform the way yours did ?
I polished all the parts of the trigger mechanism and ground down the sear/releases and reduced the size of the spring on the knob that is adjustable. it is really clean and predictable now. it's really easy with this model. A LITTLE GOES A LONG WAY so go little amounts when changing anything.
Great video on glass bedding and the results of the work. After watching this video i am curious as to what options are there to improve the trigger (which you mentioned wasn't all that great)? Also after time did the groups with 17gr ammo ever tighten up anymore? Or how well have the groups stayed over time? I didn't realize this video was 7years old being I had originally watched the video on CZcams on the television. Thank you for your thoughts and time making your videos.
Thanks for sharing this. I actually have the standard A17 on layaway right now after thankfully getting $200 off. I don't have a scope for it yet and not sure exactly what I will do there, but I know that eventually I will get a new stock from Boyd's for it. You actually have the color Coyote Brown that I want to go with. Either that or Forest Green. I do plan on trying to take out some pesky coyotes with it along with some squirrels, groundhogs, etc... I definitely will reference this video again when I get to that point. Oh and I am a left eye dominate shooter as well, even though I am right handed.
I just finished titanium epoxy beding my rifle in a Boyd's pro varment and pillar beaded the front Bolt. shot it today with good results but I'm still on the first box of ammo and I am using the A 17 cci it seems to like a dirty barrel my last two groups where under 1 inch at 100 yards I wish I could show you see what you think and thank you for your videos. I'll try to do a respond video when I'm on my PC. again thank you great videos
Nice video. Any 17HMR worth a light should be able to goup consistently sub 1" at 100 yards; if it doesn't then there is a problem with it. I have a laminate stock Savage 17HMR bolt action and its incredibly accurate stright from the box. Any miss is down either to 'me' or a 'duff' round. I suppose glass bedding is a must for custom stocks or possibly for some older kit, but most new rifles can out shoot their owners straight off the shelf. Cheers for the info.
I have the original 17 hmr savage no accu trigger and original 3 9 40 and it shoots under 3/4 inch groups at 100 yards from a bipod with 17 hmr cci jacketed hollow points. I'm glad I didnt have to do all this to make it more accurate. Pretty cool tho
Hey Cave, not really a gun question - but am curious, how did you get the tip of your left trigger finger removed? And how did you handle the scarring. I only ask because my right thumb had to have its tip amputated (bout 2mm) after getting bottomed out on a 200k metal shear. and the scarring is pretty freaking annoying lol
nice video my stock savage 17 HMR also likes the 17gr Vmax but its a stock bolt action. i have shot .331 5 shot at 100yd. totaly going to bed it now seeing this. the reason your video popper up was cause i was wondering if savage ever found a way to put an accutrigger on a semi auto. was kind of hoping to see one on the MSR line as i love how the trigger works
I’m surprised you didn’t like the accutrigger, my markII has one and I’ve loved it so far, granted I haven’t fired very many rifles but the trigger has been excellent for me.
Very impressive I got my coming I will do the same bedding. Savage 17hmr shoots light out man. I have 2 bolts guns and because I saw you video I decided to buy the semiautomatic one . Will see I'm thinking about kill Russian boar with it I mean 2 shots in the same ear area has to drop it down. I think
Love the video CaveDweller! All of your A17 videos are really helping me! I plan on bedding my A17 asap. What scope would you recommend for this setup? Looks like a vortex in one video then some other scope when shooting the TNT ammo.
Scopes get moved from rifle to rifle, depending on the season. most of the time it wears a Vortex Viper 4-16. If yours comes out as accurate as mine, I wouldn't go less than 14x.
@@cavedweller1959 Bedding mine now. There is a retaining clip on the magazine catch which I guess needs removal before bedding. Did you remove that? Will bedding make it impossible to reattach that clip to the mag catch? Thank you for your help !
+wycwby1 Eastern S.D. Was kind of close to WY. the last 2 1/2 days, Humpin round the Black Hills trying to shoot some rock chucks, seen a few, but to slow setting up the camera for the shot & ended up skunked, But it beat the hell out of working.
Very helpful video. I am preparing to glass bed my Boyds stock and have some questions: 1) can the bedding job be done with the trigger housing assembly removed from the receiver, i.e., just the receiver, barrel nut, and barrel? it does not appear to be needed; and 2) did you add the micro balloons to the hardener and resin to get the viscosity of the mixed liquid glass you applied to the stock in the video?
+jspurr.cnta Remove the trigger housing if it looks to be easier, ether way is OK Myself, I have no use for the balloons, I did not use them. Thanks For Watching and Good Luck, Let use all know how much better your rifle groups when you are finished..
All brands of .17 HMR ammunition are made by CCI. For me the polymer tips aren't as consistent -- accurate, but inconsistent. I've had the best luck with 20gr XTP bullets, but I haven't tried the .17gr TNT and I'm not sure how different they are. I haven't seen that the polymer tips are any more destructive to the target anyway, but I suppose it depends on application or something.
My magazine will not go into my gun and clip in, i thought it was the stock so I purchased a different stock and have the same problem! I have yet to fire my gun
Thank you very much! Ive been wanting to know how to glass bed one, and FINALLY found the video. I know your gonna get hate comments, but not from me, again THANK YOU 👊
Great videos, Cave'. But..here's the main deal I've found with all rimfires--you have to sort by rim thickness, rim shape (not deformed) and overall cartridge weight. Doing this alone will shrink groups considerably and eliminate flyers. Bedding or stock replacement is valid too as you demonstrate. But did you try sorting ammo? I could also get into chamber dimensions but I'm not familiar with the .17 rimfires enough although we all know how a "match" chamber in .22 lr makes all the difference in the world. Keep up the good work and videos!
Hi there Cavedweller, which bench rest make and model is working best for you? I like your new elk movies, nice country there for sure. Was out yesterday evening with the A17 and was watching an all black rabbit - first time I've seen once of those on the station (ranch) - left it alone. Cheers, Andrew
Hey, I just use the same one I've used forever, it's an Outers, by Omark Ind. I bought it back in the 80s, It worked really good shooting p-dog over the hood of the pickup--back when they were square. A rare black rabbit, get your stuff ready, shoot,skin and tan it, Hang it on the wall. With any luck I'me going to do a home tanning video soon.
Good video as usual. I was wondering if you could use a syringe to place the soft epoxy with less fuss than the small wooden ticks you were using? Just a thought.
Just out of curiosity, yes I enjoyed your video, but wanted to ask if you noticed when the flyer happened was it random or like always the last shot maybe 3rd shot or whatever? Please just curious, I’m older than you not as experienced but recently spending some retirement change on .22s and.17s, Pennsylvania finally is allowing us to use auto rimfire for small game and varmints and want to spend my money and time wisely. I do own a few Savages yes a 17hmr as well that shoots great but it’s bolt action, love the look of your stock I’ve done business with Boyd and love their style! Yours looks great. Any .22 or .17hmr Auto’s that you favor most? Thanks for your assistance and keep shooting.
This rifle before bedding didn't really shoot groups with an occasional flyer. It was more like a pattern, shotgun style. Glassing it into a ridged stock worked wonders on it. Read through the comments on my A17 videos and notice how many claim theirs will shoot all rounds into the same hole. You can find videos of everything and anything on Y-TUBE, except someone shooting bug hole groups with a factory plastic stocked A17, weird huh. And it's still the worst trigger of any firearm I have ever shot. To my knowledge it is the only 17 rim fire semi auto out there under &1,000. That said a Ruger 10/22 is hard to beat for a semi auto.
Have you been able to get the trigger to behave properly yet? If so, and if the accuracy has been straightened out by bedding, do you think cutting the barrel back to 16.5" and adding a suppressor would still allow proper function? I know you don't have a crystal ball, but I figured you would have some understanding of how robust the gun cycles in its factory configuration.
ILicence I don't believe there is any hope for this trigger, outside the hope it's only a very small % of the rifles that suffer as bad as mine. As for putting a can on this rifle----Not a Clue--sorry, Thanks for Watching..
I JUST HAD MY 1517D OUT, SHOT TEN GROUPS THIS WEAK. A FLYER FOR ME ,IF THE BULLET IS THREE EIGHTS OF AND INCH FROM MY GROUP,THAT A FLYER, IT SHOOTS A DIME GROUP P.S. I AGREE THE ACCUTRIGGER IS HEAVY AND CHEAP.FOR THE TIGHTER GROUPS IT HAS TO BE IN ONUCES.
Some years ago I purchased a CZ American .17 and did nothing to it. I shot 1/2 inch to 1/4 inch groups at 100 yards. The 12 power scope I have on it does not allow me to see 1/8 inch diamond bulls at 100 yards, I have to guess where it is at.
Interesting the bedding part... considering it to my Savage .308 with a Boyd stock. Can I use JB Weld for bedding?please confirm best product for it, if any... Thank you
I did a video using JB just to show it can be done, No more, No less. Would I recommend it, Not after using it. If you are going to start a new hobby, start off on the right foot. Google Brownells Acra glass gel. Can you use JB?? Yes. Thanks for Watching.
I JUST GOT A A17, PLANNING ON PUTTING A STOCK LIKE THAT ON MY. WHITCH STOCK IS THAT. I KNOW YOU SAID BOYDS BUT THERE IS ABOUT 16 TO CHOSES FROM. THANKS.
www.midwayusa.com/product/1023724374?pid=474097 or www.midwayusa.com/product/1006499518 Either brand will work fine. Brownells is probably the best to work with. www.brownells.com/tools-cleaning/gun-tools/stock-tools/acraglas-gel-resin--hardener/
For your next video, could you do Ruger 10/22 with a Boyd stock? There are many 10/22's and I for one would like to watch you do one. But, only with a Boyd stock. "Thank you", Jim
What lube/oil are you using? I just purchased one and upgraded to the Boyd's stock and bedded the action/ barrel. Gun functions flawless up to 40-50 rounds then fail to feed or fail to eject. I know it's a lubrication issue. Help would be appreciated. Gun has only had about 100 rounds through it so far. Thanks for your videos.
+hookbrian I use Pro Gold gun grease on the delay lug on top of the bolt, Any good grease will do fine here. On the rest I use Slick 50, It was once sold in small containers, It is by far the best oil for my guns that I have ever found. I think it is now only sold in 1 quart cans in the auto parts dept. Your rifle works great for 40-50 rounds then starts to fail??? Not being there to see it, That sounds like it is getting to dirty to function, If you are using CCI A17 ammo try not to, It has proven to be very dirty stuff in my rifle.
James Payne I have never glassed a 10/22 but every one I have seen done had the barrel full length bedded and the action was floated. They claim it works very well. Good Luck.
Hi there Cave Dweller, have you run CCI 20 grain FMJ through your A17? I did OK at 50 metres but it didn't want to group well at 100 metres. And even at 50 metres not to be compared with CCI TNT Hollow Point but did do OK. I'm curious to know if others have had difficulty with CCI 20 grain FMJ in their A17 in terms of groups. I hunt European Hares and European Rabbits here in New Zealand. The hares are a good challenge and are big! The rabbits are really a byproduct of my hunting hares. It is also my business. Your videos are really important to me. My A17 is right now at the local gunsmith getting bedded - but with Savage synthetic stock as I have to lug it up and down some mean hills here and also I'm happy with the synthetic stock. I am not using a bipod out in the hills either as that for me is just more "stuff" to lug around on my back or in my hands. After watching your videos I didn't go and buy CCI A17 ammo either which can only get here in 200 round bricks. I would like to do better with the FMJ as not always I can get a headshot. I have Leupold VX2 4-9 x 40 mm AO scope on my A17. It is good. The accutrigger is great for me. I really like it. Thanks for putting in your time and effort into your CZcams videos - very helpful for me. Keep up the good work. - Andrew
I've never seen FMJ rounds for the HMR. Let us know how bedding the factory stock improve you accuracy, I bedded my factory B-MAG stock and that helped a lot but it can;t hold a candle to the laminate aftermarket stock. You are right about the weight If i remember right it's 1 lb more than the factory plastic one.
Hi there Cave Deweller, can you move your barrel at all in your stock? I have my gun back from gunsmith and there is some flex at front end of stock. Shot six hares Saturday here dusk time here in NZ bit not happy with some of the placements (all went down though) and still not hitting like yours on paper.
I believe the bedding of the synthetic stock has made a difference. I am now doing all head shots. But also more rounds have gone down the barrel too, etc., etc. More than likely I will still get the laminated stock as having some difficulty over 100 metres but having said that, I need to work on uphill/downhill shot placement. All has to be head shots. I haven't run the FMJ again. I think the barrel twist on the A17 will be too tight for CCI FMJ 20 grain. I am running CCI TNT Hollow Point 17 grain and cleaned the rifle today and it really wasn't dirty. And to date, no misfires. I felt the CCI TNT Hollow Point is VERY accurate. And there can always be the possibility of my own error and not the rifle or ammo as every shot at these hares is different (now up to 28 hares taken and over varying distances/terrain including uphill/downhill shots, short flat shots, long flat shots, etc., etc. Yeap, I was holding high on a couple of uphill shots instead of holding low...just because of automatic reasoning so I will need to consciously hold low. And they are crafty buggers these hares. This is the European Hare (Lepus europaeus) wild in New Zealand as feral animal. Will be doing feral goats soon but not until have laminated stock.
Never knew how bedding was accomplished until I looked at this video. I'll be bedding my Marlin 572 pump next... it's just a .22lr but I'm planning to get my A17 Savage sometime this summer. It too will be bedded. Thanks for sharing the technique.
This was spot on .......8 yrs ago. I bought an A17 in 2016 and it is accurate out of the box with a laminate stock. Great video!
Absolutely love how you set THEE standard with this rifle with practical and easy advice for anyone level shooter to follow, and my next rimfire purchase will be the A17 👍
Cavedweller. Thank you for this video. I just finished my A-17, and it turned out fantastic. This was my first time bedding anything and couldn't be happier. Thank you
Love to hear it, what kind of stock did you use??
Thanks for putting this video out. Have been interested in the a17. Glad to know what needs to be done to shoot consistent groups. That checkering reminds me of what sako does on some of their rifles
Wow, a tack drivin' rimfire at 100 yards!! That's awesome! I always have known a solid bed job was good, but this is an excellent example of what it can really do. Tack driver and an auto-loader at that. Thank you!
The critter will shoot but you really need to pay attention through the entire trigger pull. It's like a 3 stage trigger, you first pull through the garbage stage, then the pure trash stage until you hit the wall, then it's ready to go. This is almost a 5 year old rifle and I have seen pictures of 2, if not 3 different spring set ups for the A17, I have no idea what the new ones are doing.
Thanks Cavedweller. I will definitely be doing that to mine when i get my new stock. Great video.
The Ruger 22 Hornet video was GREAT !!!! You explained what to do and showed how to do it. My Miles Gilbert kit came today & the Hornady One Shot is do Monday. So, my first glass bedding will happen next week. I would not have tried this until I watched your videos. "Thank you", Jim
James Payne Don't know if I missed it in a past post, but what rifle are you going to bed.
Hoping to pick on of these up next year, very interesting end results. All the more excited to get the A17 now knowing I can do this too.
Cavedweller1959, following your instruction on your videos, it was easier than I thought. Living in a city, I can only go to a police range for the 100 yard shooting and it's about 25-30 miles away. The range is opened to the public on Sat. But I'll let you know how it does. I can go to 25 yard indoor range to try it out."Thanks again", Jim
Thanks for the great video @cavedweller1959... I watched a couple of times before tackling the job. I'm going to sight it in today or tomorrow, I can't wait!!!
One major difference I employed in my process:
I bought two 1/4" NF (National Fine, or 28 threads per inch) stainless steel cap screws and cut the heads off and rounded the end over smooth.
After applying liberal coats of release agent, (love your One Shot idea), I screwed one into the brass threaded adapter in the stock, where the rear takedown screw goes, and the other one into the threaded hole that accepts the front takedown screw.
What this did, while not totally necessary, was:
1.) It gave me guide posts that made it impossible for me to misalign the screw hole/stock interface, (I need all the help I can get!), and:
2.) Almost as important in my decision was that it completely did away with what I thought would be a tedious job of having to dig out all the modeling clay from the screw holes. All I had to do was back the guide posts out of the holes and the threads were totally clean. Bingo...
One note: Because I didn't want any chance I would bung up the action or stock, the hardest part of the process was finding out what threads I was dealing with to make my guide posts. I called Savage tech line, easy-peasy, right? Not only was it hard to find a real person on the other end of the line, once I could try to get their help, the woman was very short with me and just blew me off by telling me "Those are proprietary threads.", forcing me to jump down the rabbit hole of the interweb on a quest. Finally, in one forum or another, I found out that many Savage actions simply machined to standard 1/4" fine thread. (1/4" NF).
I really enjoyed your presentation, I learned a lot from you (I used to use neutral shoe polish as my release agent), I also like the no-nonsense approach you take, so, Thanks again, have a great New Year, I'll be looking for more from you. Keep your eyes on a swivel, your ear to the ground and keep your powder dry Brother...
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum, JG
Shooting good. Sure improved with the bedding, and also shows the value of trying different ammo. Love my A17.
Nice video, thanks for posting. I have glass bedded several centerfire rifles but not a rimfire yet. I have the plain plastic stock A17 and the Wood laminate stock version and both shoot well under 1" 10 shot groups at 100 meters right out of the box. I am Using CCI A17 ammo and Bushnell 4-14 4500 series scopes on Leupold rings. The only fliers I have I can call because it is generally my fault. Great rifles.
I have a 9317 btvs with 20in bbl combined with a 3/9/50 tasco on weaver 6 bolt rings that will absolutely shoot 3/4 moa with hornady 17grain vmax. beautiful rifle heavy but just more to love. for price & accuracy $$$ in the bank. your a17 is what I've been waiting for so absolutely great job & I'm stoked that someone actually did what you did
+Timothy Rose The factory version wasn't all that great , OK for most folks, but not good enough for you & me. But bed that action into a solid, ridged stock, Holy Smokes, It can be fun!!
Using Hornady one shot has changed my life buddy, ok, maybe not that extreme but it sure makes bedding a lot easier.
Thanks for the videos. Really informative. I may look into getting a similar Boyds stock for my Savage 93R17 BTVS at some point. The thumbhole stock is nice but kind of heavy.
Your Savage A17 glass bedding video was well done, I learned a lot. The targets really told the story, you need to glass bed to have a good shooting rifle. Keep up the good work.
James Payne Thanks, I did skip through a lot to keep it short as possible, The glass bedding video on the Ruger .22 Hornet covers more detail.
Great video as per usual. I'm glad you glass bed all of your rifles and emphasize its importance. I need to get some CCI TNT and try in mine. My A17 shoots as well as, or better, than my 10-22 with 20" kidd barrel. Also to the left handed shooters out there, cavedweller was asked how it is for a left handed shooter. I can tell you personally that you will always get debris coming back toward your face when you shoot a right handed semi auto of this sort. It works on a gas blow back system, so you get some of that gas and debris coming back. More so than a 10-22 IMHO. Especially with that dirty A17 ammo. My rifle will consistently shoot sub 1/2" 10 shot groups at 50 yards, but it has also been glass bedded in its factory Boyds pepper laminated stock. It shoots well enough that I don't see why I own a precision type 10-22. Keep up the good work on your videos Cavedweller. I don't always agree, but for the most part, you put out some very informative stuff...
Thanks for your response. I have always used rem oil on all guns but I think the A17 needs a better oil that will bond more to the metal. My problems occurred with CCI TNT 17gr. Thanks again. Also for anybody that has an A17, you need to invest in a Boyd's stock. It completely changes this gun.
I've been following along with your videos on the A17 and can't wait for this stock to come out. I bought this rifle when they came out and it's been in the safe ever since, because I knew this stock would be in the works. I'm glad they made it nice to look at as well. The first thing I thought was "shut up and take my money" :-)
Dan Roy I talked with the R&D guy from Boyds a few days back, Said they are done with their work but it can take quite some time for the sales people to get something new into the system. The good news is that it is on the way.Thanks for Watching.
I think it will be worth the wait. I was about to post the little bugger up for sale the other day but I suppose I can wait for the light at the end of the tunnel. Maybe by Christmas I can buy him a proper stock.
Thanks for the fast reply. You are right, truck hoods today are not like they were.
Purchased a Savage A17 in 17 HMR cal. and the trigger is absolutely the worst trigger I have ever used! So after I came back from the range immediately ordered a JARD trigger with 1 lbs. trigger weight for the rifle. While I have it apart I am going to glass bed the rifle and see if it can give my Ruger 10/22 bull barrel a little competition! Great vid!
I bought an A17hm2, it's going to be here tomorrow. I already know I'm putting a boyds on it. I plan on bedding it per your instructions. I'm going to try to give a review of it as I make it grow.
I just won one of these in a raffle still have to go pick it up! Looks like a good little gun
I have watched it three times and learned something each time.
I like your video very illuminating I don't have one of these Savage rifles yet plan to go out and buy one my brother has one and it's a dandy I do plan to buy one thanks for the input I will be watching your videos
I just got my Boyds Prairie Hunter stock in Nutmeg for my A17. I actually ordered my bedding kit first because of this video. Thanks for the info.
How much a weight difference is there between the Boyd's and the original stock?
@@shigweezy a good bit. I didn’t weigh it but it’s laminated hardwood vs hollow plastic. It’s bedded now and rock solid. It’s a tack driver!
I have the A17 heavier barrel sporter, that came with a Boyd's stock. I think you are the first review I have seen that complained about the acutriger . I agree, I have a savage 93r17 and the A17 and prefer the trigger on my savage mark II. The mark II had a ridiculous pull when I bought it but it cost virtually nothing and very simple to reduce the trigger pull.
Wish my A17 was as accurate as yours. It'll shoot sub moa but barely and not always. Good enough for what I use it for but everyone would prefer a rifle that will put 5 shots in the same hole.
Also should mention that I had issues with my A17 out of the box but fortunately savage has outstanding customer support.
Thanks Cavedweller1959, appreciate your input, keep those video coming, I’m now subscribe thanks to your help, grateful Charlie
Thanks for dis top Report .regards from germany
Well, I completed the glass bedding on my Ruger 10/22 at 3:pm est. It's wrapped with tubing and I hope I did it right. "Thanks for your input cavedweller1959", Jim
Late to the party but you gave me hope for my 17 I could get it to shoot anything well ever...
150 bucks worth of upgrades ill have to giver a shot
Wow, that is actually impressive, considering the rifle is pretty affordable. Good informative video
My first try at glass bedding will be a heavy barrel with a Boyd stock, Ruger. After watching your videos, I think I'll do a good. "Thank you", Jim
James Payne A Ruger what?
Thank you for this video, you make all kinds of sense, will be doing that with mine
Great Video! Thank You!! This was a big help!!
You make glass bedding look pretty simple. I hope it's really that simple, and damn fine shooting.
+Zombi3mountain It is that simple, just think every thing through & do it right the first time. Best part is, if it doesn't come out perfect, just take your dremel roto tool and remove 1/8" or so and fine tune your job. Just don't be shy with the release agent.
Wow! Thanks for the valuable info.
Good stuff... thanks for sharing.
What an awesome informative video.
I own Savages, and the accutrigger is a fine trigger at a great price,
crisp and adjustable, lending itself to fine accuracy,
however it is not as pleasing to the touch as a good conventional trigger,
but then again it wasn't designed as an expensive trigger, but part of Savage's design to make a great shooting rifle that was affordable, and that it is:)
Agreed, Most all other Savages have pretty good triggers for the money spent, BUT this video is not about most other Savages, It's about the A-17. And the A-17 trigger it nothing like any other I've ever come across. I have a video on this trigger assembly, watch it and I think you will agree.
I see, that is surprising, esp. if it is an inferior trigger, if that's the case,
their trigger was one of their selling points,
I'll take a look at this 'new' trigger,
thanx
Hey, That is some dam good improvement you made! One final thing that I would try if that were my rifle though..... I would make a few paper shims and place them to apply a few pounds, somewhere between 2-6 pounds usually, of upward pressure on the barrel at the forend. I have solved many flyer problems and brought groups sizes in even tighter using that method when everything else was done right and a rifle just "felt" like it wanted to shoot a little better! That little bit of upward pressure at the fore-end tip of the stock can be as little as a pound and a half and settles harmonics down just enough to work miracles! I hope you give it a try, it might surprise you! Also, with a stable stock, you would be surprised what full length glass bedding will do for group size to! Just my 2 cents.....
That has always been a concern of mine too,... harmonics. I understand the idea of bedding but the 'floating barrel' seems like a bit of a tuning fork. I'm going to have to experiment with your idea maybe utilizing some dampening material near the tip that is not going to melt or burn with repeated firing - still have to do some research on that.
Ordered my Boyd's!
Gonna try n glass bed it....
Thanks for educating
Let us know the before and after accuracy story when it's done.
CCI TNT ,17HMR Hollow Point is a wicked little bullet. I don't use anything else in my Savage bolt action.
Like many before ....exalant video man
What an excellent video, so informative, thank you for taking the time.
One thing I was wondering though, I recently bought an A 17 , could I apply the bedding to the factory stock and still have it perform the way yours did ?
cavedweller1959, the "One Shot" worked out well, nothing stuck to the gun itself and the barrel movement is totally gone. "Thanks again", Jim
James Payne It wasn't half as hard as you though it would be, and your already thinking of your next project. Let us know if it shrinks your groups.
I polished all the parts of the trigger mechanism and ground down the sear/releases and reduced the size of the spring on the knob that is adjustable. it is really clean and predictable now. it's really easy with this model. A LITTLE GOES A LONG WAY so go little amounts when changing anything.
Great video on glass bedding and the results of the work. After watching this video i am curious as to what options are there to improve the trigger (which you mentioned wasn't all that great)? Also after time did the groups with 17gr ammo ever tighten up anymore? Or how well have the groups stayed over time? I didn't realize this video was 7years old being I had originally watched the video on CZcams on the television. Thank you for your thoughts and time making your videos.
Thanks for sharing this. I actually have the standard A17 on layaway right now after thankfully getting $200 off. I don't have a scope for it yet and not sure exactly what I will do there, but I know that eventually I will get a new stock from Boyd's for it. You actually have the color Coyote Brown that I want to go with. Either that or Forest Green. I do plan on trying to take out some pesky coyotes with it along with some squirrels, groundhogs, etc... I definitely will reference this video again when I get to that point. Oh and I am a left eye dominate shooter as well, even though I am right handed.
No se podría poner las leyendas en español? Estamos en Argentina... Gracias
Excellent video on how to setup a rifle.
Cavedweller1959, thanks for the advice. That is what I'll do. "Thanks again for your videos and the advice", Jim
I just finished titanium epoxy beding my rifle in a Boyd's pro varment and pillar beaded the front Bolt. shot it today with good results but I'm still on the first box of ammo and I am using the A 17 cci it seems to like a dirty barrel my last two groups where under 1 inch at 100 yards I wish I could show you see what you think and thank you for your videos. I'll try to do a respond video when I'm on my PC.
again thank you great videos
Review This chances are I carved your Boyd's gunstock I use to work there
Nice video.
Any 17HMR worth a light should be able to goup consistently sub 1" at 100 yards; if it doesn't then there is a problem with it.
I have a laminate stock Savage 17HMR bolt action and its incredibly accurate stright from the box. Any miss is down either to 'me' or a 'duff' round.
I suppose glass bedding is a must for custom stocks or possibly for some older kit, but most new rifles can out shoot their owners straight off the shelf.
Cheers for the info.
Mine also same gun
I have the original 17 hmr savage no accu trigger and original 3 9 40 and it shoots under 3/4 inch groups at 100 yards from a bipod with 17 hmr cci jacketed hollow points. I'm glad I didnt have to do all this to make it more accurate. Pretty cool tho
I'll be doing my A17 boyds stock this weekend , I can't wait to use your video to help me make it rock solid
Let us know how it shoots when done.
Great video !
Hey Cave, not really a gun question - but am curious, how did you get the tip of your left trigger finger removed? And how did you handle the scarring. I only ask because my right thumb had to have its tip amputated (bout 2mm) after getting bottomed out on a 200k metal shear. and the scarring is pretty freaking annoying lol
nice video my stock savage 17 HMR also likes the 17gr Vmax but its a stock bolt action. i have shot .331 5 shot at 100yd. totaly going to bed it now seeing this. the reason your video popper up was cause i was wondering if savage ever found a way to put an accutrigger on a semi auto. was kind of hoping to see one on the MSR line as i love how the trigger works
I’m surprised you didn’t like the accutrigger, my markII has one and I’ve loved it so far, granted I haven’t fired very many rifles but the trigger has been excellent for me.
The only thing your Mark II and the A17 triggers share is the name. Mechanically, they are worlds apart.
Good vid...you are sooooo goood.....
Very impressive I got my coming I will do the same bedding.
Savage 17hmr shoots light out man.
I have 2 bolts guns and because I saw you video I decided to buy the semiautomatic one .
Will see I'm thinking about kill Russian boar with it I mean 2 shots in the same ear area has to drop it down.
I think
The barrel on my 10/22 is a Tactical Solutions .920dia. With a Boyd Barracuda stock. Jim
Have you tried the 20 grain bullets in the fully bedded rifle? Wondering how they did. Thanks
Thank You
My Ruger 10/22. It shoots good at 100 yards and I hope to do better after glass bedding. Jim
hey cavedweller I was wondering what varaitation of the stock you have
Love the video CaveDweller! All of your A17 videos are really helping me! I plan on bedding my A17 asap. What scope would you recommend for this setup? Looks like a vortex in one video then some other scope when shooting the TNT ammo.
Scopes get moved from rifle to rifle, depending on the season. most of the time it wears a Vortex Viper 4-16. If yours comes out as accurate as mine, I wouldn't go less than 14x.
@@cavedweller1959 Bedding mine now. There is a retaining clip on the magazine catch which I guess needs removal before bedding. Did you remove that? Will bedding make it impossible to reattach that clip to the mag catch? Thank you for your help !
Cavedweller1959 are you a WY native. I enjoy your videos, very informative. Keep up the good work.
+wycwby1 Eastern S.D. Was kind of close to WY. the last 2 1/2 days, Humpin round the Black Hills trying to shoot some rock chucks, seen a few, but to slow setting up the camera for the shot & ended up skunked, But it beat the hell out of working.
Sounds like fun.
Excellent!
Very helpful video. I am preparing to glass bed my Boyds stock and have some questions: 1) can the bedding job be done with the trigger housing assembly removed from the receiver, i.e., just the receiver, barrel nut, and barrel? it does not appear to be needed; and 2) did you add the micro balloons to the hardener and resin to get the viscosity of the mixed liquid glass you applied to the stock in the video?
+jspurr.cnta Remove the trigger housing if it looks to be easier, ether way is OK Myself, I have no use for the balloons, I did not use them. Thanks For Watching and Good Luck, Let use all know how much better your rifle groups when you are finished..
wow!!! nice!!! i have my next project!!
After seeing this, I'm even happier with buying the BTVSS
What's a Btvss??
@@michaelhull63 the fancy one with stainless heavy barrel
@@mamjack6134 got it thx
All brands of .17 HMR ammunition are made by CCI. For me the polymer tips aren't as consistent -- accurate, but inconsistent. I've had the best luck with 20gr XTP bullets, but I haven't tried the .17gr TNT and I'm not sure how different they are. I haven't seen that the polymer tips are any more destructive to the target anyway, but I suppose it depends on application or something.
great video thanks
My magazine will not go into my gun and clip in, i thought it was the stock so I purchased a different stock and have the same problem! I have yet to fire my gun
Thank you very much! Ive been wanting to know how to glass bed one, and FINALLY found the video. I know your gonna get hate comments, but not from me, again THANK YOU 👊
Great videos, Cave'. But..here's the main deal I've found with all rimfires--you have to sort by rim thickness, rim shape (not deformed) and overall cartridge weight. Doing this alone will shrink groups considerably and eliminate flyers. Bedding or stock replacement is valid too as you demonstrate. But did you try sorting ammo? I could also get into chamber dimensions but I'm not familiar with the .17 rimfires enough although we all know how a
"match" chamber in .22 lr makes all the difference in the world. Keep up the good work and videos!
.
Hey Cave Dweller. Which vortex model scope did you decide to go with on your gun. I have several Vortex diamondbacks on centerfire guns.
I have a couple of 4-16 x 44 Vipers, one has both target turrets the other has only the elevation target turret.
Hi there Cavedweller, which bench rest make and model is working best for you? I like your new elk movies, nice country there for sure. Was out yesterday evening with the A17 and was watching an all black rabbit - first time I've seen once of those on the station (ranch) - left it alone. Cheers, Andrew
Hey, I just use the same one I've used forever, it's an Outers, by Omark Ind. I bought it back in the 80s, It worked really good shooting p-dog over the hood of the pickup--back when they were square. A rare black rabbit, get your stuff ready, shoot,skin and tan it, Hang it on the wall. With any luck I'me going to do a home tanning video soon.
Superb video,got my 17 sub moa at 100 but bedding it certainly won't hurt.
Sam Sawyer What 17 rifle do you have?
I've got a sako quad and I've put it in a grs stock,not sure they are a popular rifle or stock in the states
Wow that is absolutely amazing sir I am very impressed. Going to glass bed my rifles
Good video as usual. I was wondering if you could use a syringe to place the soft epoxy with less fuss than the small wooden ticks you were using? Just a thought.
Rod Mac Less is better on this one. Thanks for watching
Just out of curiosity, yes I enjoyed your video, but wanted to ask if you noticed when the flyer happened was it random or like always the last shot maybe 3rd shot or whatever? Please just curious, I’m older than you not as experienced but recently spending some retirement change on .22s and.17s, Pennsylvania finally is allowing us to use auto rimfire for small game and varmints and want to spend my money and time wisely. I do own a few Savages yes a 17hmr as well that shoots great but it’s bolt action, love the look of your stock I’ve done business with Boyd and love their style! Yours looks great. Any .22 or .17hmr Auto’s that you favor most? Thanks for your assistance and keep shooting.
This rifle before bedding didn't really shoot groups with an occasional flyer. It was more like a pattern, shotgun style. Glassing it into a ridged stock worked wonders on it. Read through the comments on my A17 videos and notice how many claim theirs will shoot all rounds into the same hole. You can find videos of everything and anything on Y-TUBE, except someone shooting bug hole groups with a factory plastic stocked A17, weird huh. And it's still the worst trigger of any firearm I have ever shot. To my knowledge it is the only 17 rim fire semi auto out there under &1,000. That said a Ruger 10/22 is hard to beat for a semi auto.
Have you been able to get the trigger to behave properly yet? If so, and if the accuracy has been straightened out by bedding, do you think cutting the barrel back to 16.5" and adding a suppressor would still allow proper function?
I know you don't have a crystal ball, but I figured you would have some understanding of how robust the gun cycles in its factory configuration.
ILicence I don't believe there is any hope for this trigger, outside the hope it's only a very small % of the rifles that suffer as bad as mine. As for putting a can on this rifle----Not a Clue--sorry, Thanks for Watching..
I JUST HAD MY 1517D OUT, SHOT TEN GROUPS THIS WEAK. A FLYER FOR ME ,IF THE BULLET IS THREE EIGHTS OF AND INCH FROM MY GROUP,THAT A FLYER, IT SHOOTS A DIME GROUP P.S. I AGREE THE ACCUTRIGGER IS HEAVY AND CHEAP.FOR THE TIGHTER GROUPS IT HAS TO BE IN ONUCES.
20 year old Meg tech. Stock from Walmart for $60. 100 yards steal sight. Dead nuts
Some years ago I purchased a CZ American .17 and did nothing to it. I shot 1/2 inch to 1/4 inch groups at 100 yards. The 12 power scope I have on it does not allow me to see 1/8 inch diamond bulls at 100 yards, I have to guess where it is at.
Thanks for the vid. I'll be bedding my A-17 Target soon..
+indianxbullet Let us know how it works out.
I thought I was the only one that didn`t like the Savage trigger. I had 2 and got rid of them. I still want an A17 though. What to do?
Interesting the bedding part... considering it to my Savage .308 with a Boyd stock. Can I use JB Weld for bedding?please confirm best product for it, if any... Thank you
I did a video using JB just to show it can be done, No more, No less. Would I recommend it, Not after using it. If you are going to start a new hobby, start off on the right foot. Google Brownells Acra glass gel. Can you use JB?? Yes. Thanks for Watching.
I JUST GOT A A17, PLANNING ON PUTTING A STOCK LIKE THAT ON MY. WHITCH STOCK IS THAT. I KNOW YOU SAID BOYDS BUT THERE IS ABOUT 16 TO CHOSES FROM. THANKS.
Wow!
Thanks for the video, much appreciated, can you tell what compound you are using and where to get it please!
www.midwayusa.com/product/1023724374?pid=474097 or www.midwayusa.com/product/1006499518 Either brand will work fine. Brownells is probably the best to work with. www.brownells.com/tools-cleaning/gun-tools/stock-tools/acraglas-gel-resin--hardener/
For your next video, could you do Ruger 10/22 with a Boyd stock? There are many 10/22's and I for one would like to watch you do one. But, only with a Boyd stock. "Thank you", Jim
James Payne Believe it or not, I do not own one. Thanks
What lube/oil are you using? I just purchased one and upgraded to the Boyd's stock and bedded the action/ barrel. Gun functions flawless up to 40-50 rounds then fail to feed or fail to eject. I know it's a lubrication issue. Help would be appreciated. Gun has only had about 100 rounds through it so far. Thanks for your videos.
+hookbrian I use Pro Gold gun grease on the delay lug on top of the bolt, Any good grease will do fine here. On the rest I use Slick 50, It was once sold in small containers, It is by far the best oil for my guns that I have ever found. I think it is now only sold in 1 quart cans in the auto parts dept. Your rifle works great for 40-50 rounds then starts to fail??? Not being there to see it, That sounds like it is getting to dirty to function, If you are using CCI A17 ammo try not to, It has proven to be very dirty stuff in my rifle.
thank's i'm doing this to my guns
My Ruger is a 10/22. It shoots well at 50 & 100 yards. With glass bedding, I am sure it will shoot better.
James Payne I have never glassed a 10/22 but every one I have seen done had the barrel full length bedded and the action was floated. They claim it works very well. Good Luck.
I have a Savage A22 .22LR Target with the heavy fluted barrel and Boyds laminate thumbhole stock. I am thinking about doing this to it.
That's what i have on my A17 my barrel itself has a lot of play.
Hi there Cave Dweller,
have you run CCI 20 grain FMJ through your A17? I did OK at 50 metres but it didn't want to group well at 100 metres. And even at 50 metres not to be compared with CCI TNT Hollow Point but did do OK. I'm curious to know if others have had difficulty with CCI 20 grain FMJ in their A17 in terms of groups. I hunt European Hares and European Rabbits here in New Zealand. The hares are a good challenge and are big! The rabbits are really a byproduct of my hunting hares. It is also my business.
Your videos are really important to me. My A17 is right now at the local gunsmith getting bedded - but with Savage synthetic stock as I have to lug it up and down some mean hills here and also I'm happy with the synthetic stock. I am not using a bipod out in the hills either as that for me is just more "stuff" to lug around on my back or in my hands.
After watching your videos I didn't go and buy CCI A17 ammo either which can only get here in 200 round bricks. I would like to do better with the FMJ as not always I can get a headshot.
I have Leupold VX2 4-9 x 40 mm AO scope on my A17. It is good.
The accutrigger is great for me. I really like it.
Thanks for putting in your time and effort into your CZcams videos - very helpful for me. Keep up the good work.
- Andrew
I've never seen FMJ rounds for the HMR. Let us know how bedding the factory stock improve you accuracy, I bedded my factory B-MAG stock and that helped a lot but it can;t hold a candle to the laminate aftermarket stock. You are right about the weight If i remember right it's 1 lb more than the factory plastic one.
Hi there Cave Deweller, can you move your barrel at all in your stock? I have my gun back from gunsmith and there is some flex at front end of stock. Shot six hares Saturday here dusk time here in NZ bit not happy with some of the placements (all went down though) and still not hitting like yours on paper.
Laminate stocks are very stiff, I have zero flex.
I believe the bedding of the synthetic stock has made a difference. I am now doing all head shots. But also more rounds have gone down the barrel too, etc., etc. More than likely I will still get the laminated stock as having some difficulty over 100 metres but having said that, I need to work on uphill/downhill shot placement. All has to be head shots. I haven't run the FMJ again. I think the barrel twist on the A17 will be too tight for CCI FMJ 20 grain. I am running CCI TNT Hollow Point 17 grain and cleaned the rifle today and it really wasn't dirty. And to date, no misfires. I felt the CCI TNT Hollow Point is VERY accurate. And there can always be the possibility of my own error and not the rifle or ammo as every shot at these hares is different (now up to 28 hares taken and over varying distances/terrain including uphill/downhill shots, short flat shots, long flat shots, etc., etc. Yeap, I was holding high on a couple of uphill shots instead of holding low...just because of automatic reasoning so I will need to consciously hold low.
And they are crafty buggers these hares. This is the European Hare (Lepus europaeus) wild in New Zealand as feral animal. Will be doing feral goats soon but not until have laminated stock.