Elenda, the Dusk Rose - Deck Tech l The Command Zone 194 l Magic the Gathering Commander EDH
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Show Notes:
We're breaking down Josh's Elenda, the Dusk Rose deck from the latest episode of Game Knights. Come see what makes this unique brew tick and just how explosive a Commander she can be!
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JLK's Elenda Deck List:
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Blade of the Bloodchief and Elenda were made for one another. Each creature that dies would put three +1/+1 counters on her. C'mon now!
Blade of the Bloodchief, Phyrexian Altar, and Corpse Dance. Infinite mana, tokens, and infinite power commander
You don't even need the blade, just Elenda, altar, and corpse dance. You only need one other creature in play and six mana to start the combo and go infinite. Or two other creatures and 5 mana, or 3 other creatures and 4 mana. Obviously the blade would lower the starting mana requirements, but it's not really necessary.
Tokens do hit the graveyard.
tappedout.net/mtg-questions/do-tokens-hit-the-graveyard/
Tokens Do Go to the graveyard. Then Statebased Actions are checked and they cease to exist. But they are there long enough for hits the graveyard/dies effects to happen
4 episode 200 my suggestion is each of you invite two of your favorite people from pass game nights and then play your personal favorite Commander decks not Commander Decks that you just built for the show but your personal decks like how you actually play in a real game
Mark Wells this
Yesssss
yyeeesssss, 6 player game!!!
I know this will be a lengthy thing but play the worlds bigs edh game, set a world record lol
William Henry with all the guests from the gameknights when possible
I feel like the card "Hatred" would be good for this commander. Pump her up, swing in and gain the life back. Then sac her and get 20+ vampires.
I want another video on her with the new rules
Thanks guys :)
U basically have the choice now u send her to the graveyard then u can put her back into ur command zone making her sorta broken going with phyrexian altar and ashnod altar infinite land and just a draw for sacrificing creatures u win from doing nothing but sacing creatures
Is... Is the bottle of Siracha in the background being... slowly emptied?! You can't eat the set, Josh!
I noticed this too lol! for all we know that could like bottle 3 or 4 at this point :P
I haven’t seen this mentioned in the comments, but Elenda, Nim Deathmantle, and ashnods altar is infinite vamps and colorless mana.
"Hangarback Walker, a new card from Kaladesh." .....wut
I mean Hangarback Walker is from the Kaladesh plane so the confusion makes some sense, but...yeah...
I guess they confused it with the walking ballista.
And even then, that would be from Aether Revolt.
krisdaschwab912 kaladesh is the name of the block
Magic is a game of specifics. Get the set right
Am I the only one who thought Jimmies shirt said Fuc at first?
I was about to post this exact comment
I was about to post this exact comment
You did post that exact comment
Its the future war cult from Destiny. If you didn't know that is
livestream, people suggest a commander, you guys have 1 houe to make a deck then battle it out
I like that one :D
Additional rule: no EDHRec, only Gatherer & co
hi guys! im your new subscriber! i enjoyed watching you all play. i missed playing. now i just watch you play. keep it up! hope to see your channel wont stop. thank you so much
Why not try a brew with jumbo commander? If he'd be up for it? And maybe talk about the difference between your metas, and typical deck templates
This was a really great deck tech guys! I love how Josh was so down on Elenda in the set review then found out how sweet she was. My one note is I think Merciless Eviction is way too good not to run since it gives you more mass artifact/enchantment removal and can be a creature board wipe if you need it to be
pulled this outta our recent booster box unboxing! need to make a deck around her for sure!!
Now THIS is some nice commander content!!!
Great guys!
For Episode 200 you could try and do Twitch Plays Pokemon style Commander game. Where 3 players are just normal players but the 4th players decisions are decided by a community vote on twitch.
You guys rock....by far the best mtg related vids out there!
Also, a fun little extra on Tragic Arrogance, you can actually choose an opponent's artifact creature as their creature to keep AND their artifact to keep if you wanna wipe even more (same with enchantment creatures and enchantment artifacts).
I love how they are using what happened in Game Knights as an example.
I really like your decision to look at Elenda's second ability as a one of game winner. Really cool.
I had to double take when I heard it takes 3-4 months to make 1 episode of Game Knights. They where in town 6 weeks ago, and it takes 6-8 weeks to finish it?
Sad Days. I checked the time between *Commander* Game Knights. About 5 months in between the most recent two.
I wonder why people keep spamming the comments for more Commander games lol
With the recent update that commanders are now considered to die even when going back to the command zone, what direction would you take this deck if you included Vito, thorn of the dusk rose and Teysa Karlov? Been trying to work my deck out as a budget deck due to Elenda price, and I have way to many cards i am wanting to put in it.
Love the future war cult shirt jimmy👌👌
Where is Bloodcrazed Paladin a 1B with flash and it get's a +1/+1 for each creature died this turn. Keep it after a boardwipe and play it before it is your turn.
I still don't like Elenda, but you guys at least made me curious for her. Thanks guys! You are awesome!
4v4 EDH tournament with the MtG CZcamsr community? You're doing a great job. Always enjoy your videos and podcasts! :D
I really like this commander. For me its the interaction with the command zone and dying that really makes it, it would be dull if going to the zone triggered her, powerful, but dull. This way its got a unique angle, I do wonder though if it would make more sense to run this like Josh (I think it was josh) ran his marchesa deck where she wasn't actually the commander, that idea always sounded crazy to me, but this commander seems sorta built for it.
Gift of immortality to keep her from dying
But if she doesn't hit the graveyard then you don't get the vampires.
maxspecs she dies then comes back
Anyone know why this isn't available for download on Collected Company like all the other episodes are?
An easy way to recur Elenda for those who want to do it a bit slower is to use delve style mechanics. If you can exile elenda from your graveyard, she can go back to your command zone, and it'll help you cast the spell. Just a thought.
Gift of immortality works so well with Elenda. She does so her effect triggers and then when you save all of her tokens she gets beefed up again and you can either sack her again or wait until gift of immortality attaches to her at the end step to do it all again next turn.
YAS A NEW COMMAND ZONE VIDEO! WOOHOO! TODAYS A GOOD DAY :D
EPISODE 200 IDEA: You guys should record yourselves going to Magic events and Local game stores interviewing people on their thoughts about the Commander Format. Seeing all the different people who play or don't play and their reasons could be an awesome way to open perspective. Whats their favorite commander? Do they play Casual or Competetive? Are more or fewer players preferred?
Love the show guys amazing work as always.
A solid budget addition is Restoration Gearsmith, can revive your Commander or Altar.
But Blade of Bloodchief, come on :D
1. Repeatable effects trump one offs. 2. Recurring Elenda from graveyard to hand saves you having to pay additional costs for playing her from the command zone.3. The black "Palace" enchantment, Phyrexian Reclamation, and Ravos are all very good tools for those problems. 4. About 2/3 threw the video you guys agreed that this deck would be better with red, because both white and black lack the tools to deal with lots of artifacts. Planar Cleansing, Merciless Eviction and Austere Command are all useful tools with regards to dealing with artifacts, enchantments, and creatures.
It's probably a lot of work, but it'd be fun to have a massive Game Knights release for episode 200, perhaps with some classic decks. At the very least, it'd be awesome to see a game of Game Knights unrelated to a set being released, with just you guys and some friends simply playing EDH decks that you enjoy. That's something we've been asking for for a while, and it'd be an awesome Episode 200 present!
Relic of Progenitus would bea nice inclusion to the deck. It serves 3 purposes. It hates graveyarddecks, it acts as a cantrip if you dont need it and you can remove Elendra with a single tap from the graveyard and then put her back into the commandzone for a single colorless mana.
If you ran gift of immortality and some other reanimation stuff elenda could keep coming back, throw stoneforge masterwork into the mix and the token generation could get huge.
So question, with a card like sadistic hypnotist saying “use this ability only when you could cast a sorcery”, if you had a vadalken orrery out, could you use its ability like an instant? Because now you can cast sorcereries at instant speed?
No since your not casting a sorcery your using an activated ability.
Might be worth a revisit with some of the new stuff that's come out recently plus the reworking of the rules
Honestly a cool idea you guys could do is the 2 and 3 color wedges and who is your favorite commanders for each
I pulled a promo Elenda on prerelease, and have been working on a more Tribal Vampire-oriented deck for it ever since. Any suggestions?
I am very tempted to put her in my (still under construction) Triad of Fates deck as part of the 99. I already run Reveillark and Karmic Guide, along with an engine to use Triad up to six times a turn. (aka bounce/exile three things a turn.)
A nice addition would be Shade's Form. It would automatically reanimate Elenda, and it would let you pump her power just before her death to generate more tokens!
I recommend complement this video with Jumbo Commander’s deck tech. There is a lot of similarities but also a few ideas extra on Jumbos channel.
in this deck too, no it that betrays? if you're gonna be a sacrifice shenanigan and you have that much mana generation etc, the 11 mana for getting anything your opponents sacrifice under your control (to maybe sac those things to your altars) is not a bad deal :3
Dusk to dawn is a combination boardwipe that could save elendra and pump her. It can also bring her back
Supernatural stamina and Hatred are two very important cards for this deck :)
Hey Josh and Jimmy! At 26:48 , Jimmy is saying that white and black has no access to "real artefact destruction". You have Purify that costs 3 generic mana and 2 white to destroy all artefacts and enchantments. Austere Command can also do this. Certainly, it gets yours destroyed as well, but it's certainly as real as it can be.
I don’t care if game knights gets spoiled (even if this video did come out before game knights). Please do a spoiler time stamp so you can talk about what happened in game knights. I think a lot of people would like to hear you talk about it/reflect.
Taylor Pace Because why not add to extra editing time instead of just not mentioning specific plays in a game that had 3 other specific commanders and that are nearly useless in a deck tech anyway?!
Andrew Sparkes dude, it's like 2 minutes of extra editing
Severian Geerts It still requires going back to something that has already been effectively entirely finished, when they don't have to at all, if they just don't mention things totally irrelevant to a general deck tech (like one-off specific outcomes that happened one time).
There is no reason to say "This happened in the game", when you could just talk around it without needing to edit, like Josh talking about the 'possibility' of Cathar's Crusade making huge tokens - he still achieved the exact same point without actually saying "And that happened!" He even pointed out this is NOT an aim you should actually work towards, so talking about it more than mentioning it quickly makes it seem more important than it is to the deck, despite it being a hugely important moment last game.
That's the real point here - a deck tech and one, single game are different beasts. This podcast actually highlights that if we DID speak about Josh's actual used strategy in Game Knights, we'd be focusing on a suboptimal, back-up strategy more than the actual deck-tech's real strategy that he didn't get to use.
Taking out "And that happened!" is still two minutes of editing for less than a second's worth of a half-sentence irrelevant to a general deck-tech, plus it distracts away from the real aim of the deck, ESPECIALLY in this Elendra case!
My point is not they can't mention things that happened on GK, at all, (like mentioning the Cathar's Crusade thing in a "It CAN happen but there's other, better stuff too" - not an "It DID happen" - way) but that explicitly pointing out specific plays that happened in one game is literally no gain and may actually be a hindrance to the more general deck tech. So just not saying it is even better than pointlessly editing something that never needed to be said in the first place.
i like the idea of adding eldrazi monument. it protects and allows sacking for alenda and provides late game pressure when you get your tokens. swing for 28 flying lifelink indestructible? also with the sac ramp it should be easy enough to cast
hey buddy's :D just a litle french dude passing by to train a bit his english xD and i realy do like how you present those commanders decks
Feel like dread return could be worth it as a recursion option, since its flashback synergizes perfectly with Elenda.
Life commander game with your guys decks
Do a contest for 2 viewers to play (either in la if they can, or via Skype) with you live!
Warning: Long Post but I was talking out my own ideas for the deck:)
I think you should consider a BW Token Reanimator build, with a TON of recursion, and you might be more happy with the power level of the deck. Your best route to victory is playing, sacing and recurring Elenda as much as possible while taking advantage of whatever your sac outlets provide in addition to the tokens. It might not be strict "card draw", but recursion can lead to overwhelming card advantage, and tends to snowball.
For example, Phyrexian Reclamation, Nim Deathmantle, and the super sweet Enduring Renewal allow you to sac and reuse your boss without worry, and basically means you can always have access to your best card.
Random fun Elenda combos if built towards recursion:
Enduring Renewal, Hero's Blade and Ashnod's Alter means you can make 4 tokens and 6 colorless for every BW you spend. (with Phyrexian Reclamation it's 4 tokens, 5 colorless for each BBW, which still ain't bad)
Gift of Immortality, plus sac engine, plus Hero's Blade is 4 tokens and whatever the engine gives you each turn (including your opponent's turns). Any static power bump (like an anthem) works too.
Nim Deathmantle plus Ashnod's plus Elenda is infinite recursion, infinite colorless, and infinite tokens.
These combos also work to some degree with any etb token producer, so adding some stuff like Angel of Invention (which pulls double duty by pumping your team) means you have more options. In fact there are a lot of cards that have overlapping utility in a token reanimator strategy (Ravos=recursion and pump, Marshall's Anthem=recursion and pump, Teysa Orzhov Scion=sacrifice, removal and tokens etc.) so you'll have a ton of redundancy and random powerful combos will just pop up as you play. Anyway it's just a thought, but I think you'd be more happy with the result and less peeved about the command zone rule.
could you make her into a delve commander(for the zone shift to get her back to the command zone) or would that not work?
Watching this deck and building it with the new rules. Found out it doesn't really matter if you use cards like undying malice. She is an all star in my extus aristocrats deck, so time for her own deck now.
I'm beginning to think Ogre Slumlord is a beast in sac/graveyard based commander decks. It's so under the radar. Even after it put in its work, people are going to look at the other high profile cards around it. It does so much and nobody will ever look at it. If you have this out and play Fleshbag Marauder/ Merciless Executioner, the other players are going to look at FM/ME because it caused them to sac a creature, not the guy that just crapped out ~4 deathtouch rats.
Can't you put athreos in and stack the death trigger with putting her back in ur hand ?
You could run Terror effects to load Elenda with counters. Black has a ton of destroy effects that lets you hang back until you want to win the game all at once.
Maybe a livestream while your playing with your playgroup, or patreons? Would be cool to see some of your usual decks again ;)
Nim Deathmantle is probably the best recursion for Elenda. Deathmantle + Ashnod’s + Elenda + any creature means you get infinite mana. Sac non-Elenda body, elenda gets a counter, sac elenda, let her die, get 2 tokens, 4 colorless floating, use that mana for Deathmantle, you now have more bodies to sac to Ashnod’s than you started with, and elenda will start at 3 power. At this point, you just need to sac twice for Ashnod’s, and you will always be able to recur elenda, and need an outlet for the mana. This also means that you can use additional sacrifice outlets for some pretty ridiculous utility. Phyrexian altar means you get perfect manafixing, Ayli means you can exile everyone’s nonland board, Hypnotist empties their hands, that new Demon from Amonkhet (?) that is demonic tutor on a stick. Running tutor effects adds consistency to the combo. Honestly it seems like it kinda breaks the commander to me, mandatory to play in the deck if you’re not concerned with powerlevel
EDIT: As an afterthought, this card is being disregarded by a LOT of people because it’s a 4 mana 1/1 without regarding the capability and synergy it has with strong recursion effects. Thinking of Elenda as a commander for combat damage or a relevant body seems like a mistake to me, when her combo potential is incredibly high. She is effectively always tutored for you, meaning you effectively have an 8 card hand to assemble combo pieces in. She’s a 1/1 with lifelink that spawns that same body off the bat, which is mediocre, but if one creature dies and elenda dies, you get a 2/2 with lifelink and 2 1/1’s with lifelink, which isn’t the worst for 4 mana. Additionally, while I understand orienting around tokens, that seems mildly redundant if you consider recursion, which effectively makes a token engine out of Elenda, Deathmantle, and Ashnod’s. Commander tax becomes less relevant as, in a recursion shell, elenda’s cost is irrelevant when you get the maximum benefit from having her die. I could be wrong here, but this card seems massively underrated in commander
Josh u should squeeze somewhere in the deck Gift of Immortality from theros. 3cmc aura that when creature dies u return it to battlefield and at end step u return the aura at it again. It's like it was made for her
I would think Athreos God of Passage could work since its text says when creature dies return it to you hand unless target opponent pays 3 life, Yes it does give the option to the opponent but the text suggests that Elenda would actually die therefore you would get the tokens and Elenda into your hand
23:23 I love you guys 😂😂
If you play cards like Bojuka Bog while Elenda is in the graveyard. When she is exiled, can you choose to put her back in the command zone instead?
Toxic Zer011 yes
Shirei shizo's caretaker would work very well with Elenda, so would Gift of Immortality. Thanks for the video!
Nice Future War Cult shirt Jimmy! But Dead Orbit is where it's at ;)
I'm liking the deck but Teysa is my commander for a BW "aristocrats" deck, but Elenda will definitely be a creature in the deck for value.
What do you think of Elenda in an ayli eternal pilgrim deck?
Captivating Vampire would be kinda good in this deck. +1/+1 to your vampires and you can tap your tokens to control the opponent's creatures.
Fell the Mighty is a variable boardwipe that can let you kill the board and keep elenda or kill the board and keep like blood artist or w/e
Also wipes like Languish could be used to kill tokens whilst keeping Elenda out
Ravos soultender and oversold cemetery are very good recursion cards that help with the aristocrats strategy AND Elenda itself
The 3 containers of salt next to the bottle of sauce reminds me of playing commander on mtgo.
Nutritional yeast is high in B vitamins. I recommend it from time to time as a good way to fortify a diet.
the song is called havana - camila cabello
Mortuary and Ashnod's Altar with Elnda is amazing
My thoughts on Elenda - both my Abzan +1/+1 counter deck and my Mardu Aleshananigans deck are really REALLY interested.
So I know you guys have to make these lists on your own as you played said games before the cards were even spoiled... But no Relic of Progenitus (to put her back in the command zone)? Volrath Stronghold? No Phyrexian Reclamaion? I understand you wanted to go all in on the explosive turn but still feel like this is a missed opportunity! But regardless, interesting list. :)
(Nim Deathmantle goes infinity with her easily too.)
Thanks for pointing out the Relic of Progenitus thing. I am surprised I've never thought of using it that way before!
The problem is for every card you add, you have to take one out. It's hard to refine an EDH list.
daemonCaptrix True. But Relic is also graveyard hate so that's never ever a card you should feel bad cutting another card for. And Volrath's Stronghold is a land. Honestly I think those two you can't argue against. Hell with Elenda Volrath's read: pay 3 put her on top of your library or back into the command zone, whichever one is most advantageous to you.
The first thing I thought of when I saw this in the context of commander was phyrexian reclamation. I mean, even if she dies as a 1/1, you just recur her to your hand, even dodging command tax.
Nazgir - Sheoldred, Whispering One. End of game.
You guys should do a tier list for best commanders if you haven't done one
I guess the most powerfull way to explore Elenda's hability is combo her with karmic guide and reveilark. If you have any altar (such as ashnod, phyrexian or dementia) or Teysa Sion of Orzhov.
I'd suggest Marshal's anthem for this deck. It's both recursion and pump for your team.
I originally built a token deck with anointed procession and white vampire token cards, but I found her and did some research, I think the best way for my deck is sunbond, and blood chief blade. On top of that if I get indulgent aristrocrat into play and blood artist then I can gain up to 6 counters on her per sacrifice by the aristrocrat. And of course the aristocrat help buff up the token army along with drana, liberator of malakir. And if I feel the situation needs it malakir bloodwitch to end game, anyone have suggestions for my type of build?
When are you uploading this to your website
You guys should do a really fun draft tournament inviting your past guests to attend and run a few different sets, a fun old one like Urzas Saga and something newer, dealers choice
I wonder if Elenda would be better as part of the 99 in a deck like Alesha, because since it's power is less than 2 you just recurring her at the same time with her in the deck you can create another possible win condition. Because everyone knows to get rid of Master of Cruelties which shuts down one main win condition for the deck.
Change the rules text of dies to when a creature leaves the battlefield due to state based actions or destroy effects. This way you can have 2 separate wordings.. 1 that cares about the card going to the graveyard that replacement effects negate and 1 that cares about the act of a creature "dying" which replacement effects dont change. Cards like child of alara could be erratad to say when it goes to the graveyard from play.
I was specifically looking for a commander like this; I wanted one I could keep on killing and bringing back from the dead again and again.
How do you guys feel about doing an Emperor format Commander deck?
She would be a good add to my Atraxa deck possibly? Proliferate could get her there in a hury.
you could try out the Sanguine Bond and Exquisite Blood combo as as back up plan
Bloodghast /w Skullclamp and any other sac outlet in this deck would also been insane.
Live the dream Josh - tainted remedy + beacon of immortality! Plus TR fixes condemn/swords to plowshares so enemies lose life with their creature. Auto include in any b/w deck with lifegain for me.
Could Teysa, Orzhov Scion be good in the deck ?
Feels like this deck really needs dedicated cards to bring back Elenda. Not necessarily a full re-animator load out but there are a lot of cards that can supplement the core strategy: Volrath's Stronghold, Palace Siege, Athreos God of Passage, Ravos Soultender, Sheoldred Wispering One, Nim Deathmantle. All enhance the primary goal of value through sacrificing. If nothing else Volrath's Stronghold needs to be included.
I also would not want any changes to how she works. She's never going to be tier 1 strong, but she does create interesting constraints on deck building.
Josh! I think you missed a solid synergy with Nim Deathmantle, helps keep Elenda alive and can be a wincon with Ashnod's altar.
nice one :D
Sprinkle in Gift of Immortality as a backup plan for profit.
I think that Elenda is actually a pretty good commander. She is relatively new, in fact RIX is released tomorrow, and people can actually find different angles to build around her and that's what I like. I made an Elenda build with a lot more reanimation stuff, like Dread Return and Dusk / Dawn (which can often act as a one-sided wrath!). Also I'm quite curious why Josh didn't include Nim Deathmantle, 'cause it comboes with Ashnod's Altar for infinite colorless mana and tokens and "dies" triggers. However my build tried to be more flavorish, so I included Twilight Prophet and stuff like that. Also I made more extensive "back-up", so my build has more ways to pump my team, for example Sanctum Seeker.
All in all, I think Elenda is a fun and moderately powerful general.
Wouldn't targeted graveyard hate, like Relic of Progenitus, withered wretch etc help with getting Elenda out of the graveyard and back to the command zone?
Their is another infinite combo you could put in the deck in the form of exquisite blood which is a 5 drop black enchantment whenever an opponent loses life you gain thaf much life. And sanguine bond which is a 5 drop black enchantment whenever you gain life target opponent loses that much life.
i like Fanatical Devotion in token decks, 2W Enchantment, Sacrifice a creature: Regenerate target creature.
sac outlet + protection
Elenda's "unfortunate wording" does make her more interesting, and I'd probably keep it, but if it was going to be changed, I think "leaves the battlefield" would be perfectly fair. Because she loses the counters, it wouldn't be at all broken. That change would definitely push her towards an equipment theme so that you aren't relying on the counters, which might be interesting.