Can I get rid of the F and E tank in the loft?
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- čas přidán 20. 10. 2022
- An often asked question, so can it be done?
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Thanks Al. - Jak na to + styl
Did exactly that a couple of years back as I had an extremely noisy system with a screaming pump in the airing cupboard upstairs. I ripped out the old tired 3 port (Y Plan) valve and the blocked air separator (H pipes), screaming circulator pump, expansion tank etc. Replaced with 2 X 2 port valves, auto bypass valve (S Plan), new pump, expansion vessel etc, relocated pump from upstairs and put next to boiler in the garage. Now a lovely silent sealed system that holds rock steady pressure and no dirty water.
As others have said in the comments, not something to undertake if you don't know what you're doing. My boiler and cylinder had been replaced before I bought the house and were only 18 months old at the time. This type of installation was also detailed in the boiler manufacturers (Baxi) installation manual.
Thanks Adam lots of useful info there.
Good video derek, first thing to check is if your existing boiler is compatible to be converted to pressurized, you can either look in the boiler manual or contact manufacturer direct and they will let you know, another thing people forget to check is the pressure rating on the existing hw cylinder coil. keep up the good work derek
Thanks Lee.
Great video as always, sealed systems always run better, but wouldn't try it on an old ideal Mexico ect, as it may pop the heat exchanger and be new boiler time
Great tip! Possibly not for old boilers.
Oddly I was just told about this at the weekend as our f&e is pushing hot water up the expansion pipe, cycling it through the tank!!
Just released this video in time then.
You could have a blockage in the air separator or the 'H' section of pipes where the feed tank connects or a badly designed system which is often the case.
@@adamdavies163 had some fun with this system. Had to change the hit water tank as the coil had come away from the inside and was doing all sorts of exciting things. Its still cycling through the f&e header though. Im thinking there's a blockage in there somewhere and it's backing up.
@@egon2875 Yes can take quite a bit of work to get an older system to work correctly. I would check for blockages around the section of pipe where the filler and vent pipes join onto to the main pipe run. Also the pump could be set too high for the system or pumping the wrong way.
The issue with increased pressure in the system - is there a similar risk of exposing underlying weaknesses in the pipework if you replace a vented hot water cylinder with an unvented cylinder (with removal of F&E)?
Asking as the current vented tank appears to have a little leak so am going to have to get it replaced sometime soon.
Only if you increase the working pressure too high.
The valves failing on these expansion vessels and the system depressurisating requiring constant manually topping up from the filling loop seems to be a very common problem.
There are swings and roundabouts with everything.
Love your videos... Why do I have to clean the F&E tank every year to get rid of the orange custard that accumulates and if left would block the feed pipe to the central heating system? Please let me know what can be done to stop this from happening! I have to clean my in-laws tanks too...
Not much you can do, it is the action of the boiler and rust in the radiators, along with black sludge oxide.
@@dereton33 Thanks, that's what I thought!
@@dereton33 we had one of these tanks until 2012 when air source heating was installed but the pressure has been on 0 on the air source boiler since it was installed
Or... drain the system to get rid of the crud, refill it, put an oxygen inhibitor into the tank, and check the pump doesn't pump water into the F and E tank when it starts up. If so drop the speed down on the water pump by one if available and recheck, then run system to ensure all rads still getting hot. Circulating water into the tank adds more oxygenated water which attacks the rads producing iron oxide or rust. No circulating water into the F and E tank means the water in the tank can only absorb oxygen at its surface, and the oxygen inhibitor absorbs it. It is also slightly caustic ie. not acidic, which minimises radiator attacks going forward.
i keep asking this question ... kinda, but no one seems to quite get what i am saying. I have a water tank in loft that supplies just the COLD taps in bathroom, and the toilet - absolutely noting else. I keep getting told i would need a pressure cylinder, but i have a combination boiler - it has nothing to do with the loft tank. Maybe i am the one misunderstanding, but i would love to know in that situation why i need a pressure cylinder?
You can get rid of it easy, it does not need a pressure cylinder. as that tank is just for storing clean water. Just cut the main to it. And connect it to the feed to the cold taps and cistern. I will do a video on how to do it for you.
Ive a heat only boiler which Im considering having replaced with a system boiler so removing the F&E tank.
Great.
How would you stop the water when replacing a trv valve etc with an F&E tank you would use bungs what would you do if this was fitted ?
Yes use the bungs best way.
The bungs essentially seal the system temporarily to create a vacuum. With a pressurised system its already sealed. So let the pressure out and you have your vacuum.
Liz truss had an F and E tank government FART AND EXPLODED
A case of bring back the Boris now, ha ha.
@@dereton33 I agree come back bojo all is forgiven 🍺🍺🌿🌿🔥🔥
Doing this will be a bit dodgy unless you know what your doing......
If you have an old cast boiler it won't take the pressure and will split also you would need to fit a overheat stat with manual reset to the boiler as well as a water pressure sensor and these would need to be wired in series via the boiler stat and gas valve solenoid and this is just to stop the boiler exploding...... the other thing you need to remember is your pipework under the floors will be old and the joints will be very fragile to say the least and may not be able to take the increased pressure and you will end up with leaks , to sum up , doing this is not really worth it and could be dangerous
Sorry Al , but this is a
No No from me.... 👍
I think if you kept the pressure low, say under one bar you would be alright. A cast iron boiler would need a hell of a lot of pressure to split. These kits would not be available if they were not safe. I do say though that if you are not competent then a professional should fit it.
I value your videos, but I would not install this. If there is no pressure sensor on the boiler, it could overheat and cause damage or worse.
Shouldn't be an issue as most boilers have flow sensors which will compensate, or you could add a pressure sensor to the pipework with a boiler cut out on, a bit like a mini plant room
@@pallsmortion4750 possibly, but I would not risk it. Best case the over run stat could shut the boiler down, but making an ov system behave like a pressurised system, (potentially without safety controls), is dangerous.
Cheers guys.