Why Baylan HATES Anakin & Ahsoka and Blames them For the Jedi Downfall
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There's no way he hates Ahsoka. He has shown a bunch of times that he really would rather not fight or kill her.
SW youtubers milking clicks like crazy with these titles and "theories"
I agree. I don’t think he hates anyone. He seems more interested in securing himself financially or materially by any means necessary and Ashoka is just in the way.
Pretty sure he feels sorry for her and even respects that she willingly left the Order.
@@jon6309He’s a Merc. It’s about money and power to him .
I'd have to agree
By trying to undue Anakin's very existence, Baylon will discover the same thing Plageus did, that the Force will do as it wills, and will work against him. Those who think they have the power to control the Force or the future are always humbled by both in the end.
Truer words were never spoken. And you’re right. And I think by the time Baylon realizes that, it will be too late
Always in motion the future is, difficult to determine.
Kriea was right. The force needs to go
@@LucasDimoveo why does it need to go?
@@LucasDimoveoyeah, Force is a bitch.
The worst part of Baylon is that the actor died in the mean time…so we can’t dive deeper unless he is recasted
Darth Vader looed just like Anakin Skywalker at first, then he became a cyborg but was still Darth Vader and when he killed Palpatine he was Anakin Skywalker again but still looked like Vader. Or why can't Baylon have a tragic accident and look different like Palpatine did? That way Baylon can remain a character.
A flaw in the Jedi’s thinking about Anakin: specifically Mace Windu and saying “they boy is too old. He’s not ready. He shouldn’t be trained.” That was exactly the point. This is exactly what the Sith wanted. This shows how brilliant Plageus was. The Jedi won’t train him? He won’t become a Jedi? They’ll send him back to his mother? No problem. The Sith will scoop him up and train him. Hell become a Sith Lord with an already built in hatred of the Hedi.
It’s called CHECK MATE!
Palpatine is a shit master. Anakin would've been a braindead, servile Frankenstein without inside knowledge of the Jedi, and like Maul and Dooku and most Sith in history, die at the hands of the Jedi
*Jedi
But yes, excellent observation.
@@Vlad_Tepes_IIIbut of course you knew what the op meant no point in correcting an obvious typo there is no need
A padawan is often a reflection of their master.
He doesn't know Ahsoka well, but has learned Ahsoka has attachment issues and fear much like Anakin. In fact, I believe it is her attachment issues which kept her from training Grogu more than his. Remember how she reacted when she believed something happened to Sabine while confronting Baylan.
Perhaps Ahsoka has entered the world between worlds to relearn the lesson of letting go. Letting go of her guilt for leaving Anakin and the Order. Not being around for Ezra, Abandoning Sabine, etc.
Before Ahsoka can successfully defeat Thrawn she must let go of this guilt and attachment.
I think Baylan is something like a force empath and mind-reader, possibly with abilities similar to those Kylo used in TFA to read people's minds (though Baylan has had decades to refine them). And he uses them to manipulate those around him to achieve his ends.
When Morgan asks if Ahsoka is coming, the only thing he is able to base his answer on is Ahsoka's mental/emotional state: "..her determination is vivid." He knows not only details about Anakin in the order, but also after his fall when pretty much the small handfull of people that knew Vader was Anakin could probably be counted on 1 hand...but Ahsoka knows, and he had plenty of time waiting for her to arrive at the map site to be fishing around in her mind for things he could use to psychologically manipulate her. This would also make him calling Anakin by his first name make sense as well, as this is how Ahsoka would likely refer to him.
Before he shuts his saber off while tempting Sabine, he seems to focus and reach out with the force. He then shuts his saber off and begins using a lot of personal information about Sabine that quite possibly only she and a few others knew to bait the hook on getting her to giving him the map. Seriously, how would he or any of them know a thing about Ezra, let alone her personal feelings about his status as her only family left?
Heck, he may be using these powers on his apprentice (this one is kind of a stretch, I'll admit). When she challenges him on what is in it for the two of them in the new galaxy, he may be giving her the answer that she would receive most favorably in telling her power such as you can only imagine or some such. Think about how Shin is portrayed - she seems to revel in the hunt, the battle, and seemed eager to kill Sabine both times they fought. She seems to revel in the power of the force and crave more (even seeming disgusted by Sabine when she mocks her for having no power).
Maybe I'm way out on a limb with my tin foil hat strapped securely on, but I don't think he knew a lot of the things he was using to try and manipulate Ahsoka and Sabine, I think he gathered it from them using the force in some way. And it would be a simple explanation for him having a detailed synopsis of Ahsoka and Sabine's history, feelings, and desires.
I agree nice summary
I also think the same. He is no better. He has done his part in brutality. He seems to get info or get upper hand on his enemy by reading their minds.
I think this is partly true, but I do think he knew about Anakin prior to reading Ashoka with the force. I think there is history there. However, what he says to her about her and Anakin's legacy being death and destruction I do think was meant to goad her during their dual. That said, I still think that Baylan has a preexisting opinion on Anakin but I'm not sure it's what is explained in the video. After all, if he really hated Anakin so much he wouldn't be helping Thrawn who is heir to the empire, which destroyed the Jedi. He definitely did read Sabine with the force when they meet at the hedge and used her desires to manipulate the situation and get her to give him the map, no question! However, I'm confident that he wasn't just telling Shin what she wanted to hear, or at least I don't think he said power beyond imagination to simply placate her desires. I think he does have an ultimate goal, but I'm not sure what it is. Maybe it's to create a new order of force users, one better than the Jedi, or maybe it does have something to do with rewriting history using the WBW. I'm not sure but I'm hella pumped to find out!!!
He is right
His motives are right. But bringing a whole galaxy to war to make it "the way you think it should be" is just as evil as Vader.
Surely, if he was a member of the Order at the time, he must have known the reason why Ahsoka left - falsely accused and no one but Anakin believing her innocence, the Jedi Council KICKED HER OUT. She didn't choose to leave them - they left her. Why in the world would she then choose to come back after the lame apology they gave her once her innocence - thanks to Anakin - was proven? Anyone with any sense of self-respect would have walked away, and that must have been a horrible feeling, considering that life in the Order would have been all she could remember. If Skoll hates her for both being Anakin's apprentice, (which was Yoda's doing), and for leaving after her mistreatment at the Council's hands, then he's not terribly honorable or just. Hating Anakin for what he became is perfectly understandable, even if it was, in part, the Jedi Order's fault that he felt he had no other recourse. Blaming Ahsoka is not, so let's hope that doing so was him doing his best to weaponize her unresolved (and unreasonable) guilt against her. Also, it's rather hypocritical of him to accuse her of leaving a path of death and destruction behind her when he is guilty of far worse. He may not have the body count Vader has, but his brutality was on full display when he freed Morgan.
I also hope that Skoll doesn't think that eliminating Anakin will prevent Palpatine's rise to power, because Anakin didn't really have much to do with that. He became Darth Vader after Palpatine had already seized power, and had everything in place to declare himself Emperor (and expect to be able to remain there). It might have been harder without Skywalker, but then he still would have had Dooku and Grievous to fulfill that role. The Clone army was begun at about the time Anakin entered the Order, or shortly thereafter, with Order 66 in place, so that would have happened, too. Besides, if he knows about the World Between Worlds (and how did he find out?), wouldn't he also know that he can't take that route to change the past?
Yeah, Palpatine planned this out very well, he would've risen in power regardless. Anakin DID save him, but even then, the Jedi were already in a situation that would've seen them casted out.
Yes, and the Jedi would not have been at palps office if not for anikin revealing that he was the dark lord they were after. Sure they suspected but not sure enough to go arrest him at that time
@@hectortorres4699
Yeah, either way, Palpatine would've wiped out the Jedi, with or without Anakin.
Surely, Dooku, himself, or another apprentice (could even have Maul join him, in exchange for his freedom) to raid the Temple alongside the 501st.
The 501st was solid in combat, but even then, there's a reason Anakin was tasked with leading the assault. Yes, in part to show his loyalty and devotion to Palpatine and his cause, but also to handle the Jedi Masters that would've ended up killing many Clones in the process
Totally agree.
@@thalmoragent9344i bet seeing dooku and maul attacking the temple would be really cool to watch. Wether maul would have actually gotten his freedom tho… hard to say.
I want to know how Baylon knows Anakin is DV when most assumed he died during the Jedi purge or less believed he died on Mustafar after the temple massacre...
Most likely after the Battle of Endor. Just like how people found out Leia was Vader/Anakin's daughter.
That happened after Ben Solo was born
lets not forget Baylan says her and her Masters brought death and destruction.... He probably felt like Barris and saw the Jedi as the evil they thought they were fighting. Anakin was the ineveitable outcome of the path the council was taking.
I don't think the world between worlds works like that. It's not a way to change the past, but more to peer into the future, and see how things unfold. When Ezra rescued Ahsoka, it wasn't him changing the past, it was always meant to happen that way... at least that's how I understand it, but I understand the rules are wonky.
It literally is how it works. The entire introduction of the place was Palpatine trying to get Ezra to choose a different set of action in the past by walking through one of the gates. The quote on wookiepedia quotes Palapatine, "This mystical realm connects all of time and space..."
Had the death of ahsoka already happened when he was in the world between worlds or was it happening in the present at the same time?
@@kadbenson7540 @LackofFaithify "Filoni implies that any attempts to change the timeline have already been written into the flow of history - meaning Ezra never really changed history when he saved Ahsoka, merely doing what he was always meant to do." The world between worlds can provide you insight/knowledge to change the future/present, but time still flows in one direction in this realm.
Baylan thinks he can, the same as Palpatine
@@meowzzies but timeline wise did he reverse a death that he was always supposed ro reverse or was he looking at the present situation in the world between world, I guess it doesn't really matter either way tho bc it happened and was always meant to
Best Star War channel on the CZcams. Thank you for your amazing coverage!!
It is mostly Anikan's fault, but the arrogant and dogmatic principles of the Jedi Order play apart in this as well.
What I love, too, about Baylan and Ahsoka's interactions was how they were both disillusioned by the Jedi Order and yet are opposite from one another of why they are disillusioned by the Order.
Baylan most likely wants the Order to be stronger with his version of the Order.
While Ahsoka wants hers to feel more natural, opened, and attune to whom ever.
But I would say it’s Palpatine’s who no one is pointing the finger at.
@@tigertank06 Plus if Bailey destroys Anakin the dark future would still come just in a different way. Cut the head of a hydra two more heads were popped up as they say.
I love how people mostly blame Anakin and just give Palpatine the side eye as if hes not the one responsible for the whole thing
Exactly, even Obi-Wan did this in Legends. People seem to forget that much of Anakin's poor behavior in young adulthood would not have been as extreme if the Jedi weren't looking the other way while the child was being groomed.@@alexthedemon2203
@alexthedemon2203
I'm referring to Order 66, with Anikan being mostly involved in the purge.
Plus , he chose the dark side over love.
Palpatine/Sidious was entirely at fault for everything during the Clone War and the starting the Galactic Empire.
Here's an idea: Because the Ahsoka series is meant to be an homage to Heir to the Empire and the Thrawn Trilogy as a whole, what if this is a possible precursor to the Vong War? What if Baylan knows that the Vong are coming, and given the current state of the galaxy, knows that Thrawn is the only one with the military expertise to give the galaxy the best chance for survival? Probably not, because Disney isn't that cool, but what it?
If this theory is true, would it have actually changed the outcome of the Jedi fate. It is important to remember that it wasn't only Anakin who was disenfranchised with the Jedi Order as their were many throughout the course of the Clone Wars who would develop their own innate frustration and hatred for the Jedi Order and the Jedi High Council specifically (Many who would go on to become the Imperial Inquisitors post Order 66).
Great vid keep it up😊
Considering how very unlikely it is to see Baylan past season 1 considering that the actor has passed away, I would tend to believe that his role over the series will be greatly diminished, but who knows.
CGI
Well baylan could be by cgi or in animation form like they could do animated show or a movie where baylan appears
They can get a different actor.
@@renealbrechtsen9743I mean yeah they could but he has been fantastic, another actor wouldn't do the part justice
@@Jfen79That isn't always the case. The idea that a character dies with their actor is incredibly new and not good for storytelling.
I wonder if they'll even recast the role? It's possible they write him out, given that Ray Stevenson sadly passed earlier this year.
Didn’t think he hated anakin but oh well . Baylan still my favorite character on the show !! And his apprentice
I'm sorry, but the result of that duel between Baylan and Ahsoka is just not consistent with who Ahsoka is and how powerful she is relative to other Jedi and SIth. Ahsoka single handedly beat Maul, something that took BOTH Obi Wan and Qui-Gon to do, both full Jedi. Ashoka stood toe to toe with Vader. Ahsoka, as a padawan, held off Grievous, who had already killed DOZENS of full Jedi. Ahsoka beat Inquisitors, dueled to detente with Asajj Ventress, who again, had already killed full Jedi. Ahsoka literally has the spirit of the DAUGHTER in her. We are now supposed to believe that somehow this random dude Baylan, who we've never heard of, is more powerful than Maul, Ventress, and VADER. This better be one hell of a backstory, or its just some retcon crap from Dave.
In the end it was just lazy writing, and obviously a plot device to move Sabine off to the other galaxy to find Ezra, so that then Ahsoka will have to some how rescue them.
@@bobf5360 I felt the same way initially, but I considered a few things in hindsight. I don't thin EITHER of them were actually trying to kill the other. Baylan was just trying to delay Ahsoka until the map was done uploading, and Ahsoka was just trying to get around Baylan to the map. Past the initial exchange, Ahsoka had control of the fight, not that Baylan wasn't making a good accounting of himself, because he most certainly was. But ultimately, Ahsoka controlled the fight to get what she wanted. Unfortunately, when she grabbed the map she was impacted by whatever happened to her. I have a feeling it was more than a burned hand, because she seemed weakened, like her strength was sapped, as well. This was probably due to the Nightsister magic being used to power the map, or at least that's my guess. Once she had a distinct disadvantage, Baylan then gained the upper hand and pressed her hard, using his strength advantage now that she only had 1 hand on her saber. Without her injury, he wasn't able to simply overpower her but after her injury she lost both her ability to mitigate his strength advantage and her mobility advantages she had used to control the fight to that point. Definitely not trying to change minds or sway opinions, but hopefully passing along my reconciled PoV helps give 'some' plausability/possible insight into a way she at least 'could' have lost.
@@bobf5360 Going by that logic Anakin should have wiped the floor with Obiwan at Mustifar yet he has lost to him TWICE! Palpatine should not have died on the Death Star in ROTJ, since hes the most powerful dark side user of that era yet he was thrown down a shaft and died. Vader should not have lost that second duel to Luke yet he got his hand cut off. Power is not everything, victory is never 100% assured, the power of the plot overcomes the usual plot armor.
Do you post sources anywhere in regards to where you were able to find portions of this information? Thank you!
I think do to Ashoka and Anakins sometimes reckless behavior in the past;Baylons first apprentice was killed by collateral damage and he blames them.
You I've been waiting for this kind of video for such a long time ⌚ because ever since I first watched the prequels and learned about why Yoda and mace were wary of training Anakin, and they were proven right about his threat to the order, is something I've always seen and wondered why it was always overlooked.
I think Baylan is aware that Palpatine survived or suspicious about it, he wants Thrawn back for some competition.
Anakin has no scar which make me think he's a clone controlled by Palpatine.
He could wear a glove to make us believe he's the real deal.
Its possible that Baylan calls Anakin by his first name to distinguish from Luke Skywalker.
Baylan Skoll is quite a unique take on a Dark Jedi. He might have fallen from the Light, but not in defiance of the Jedi Order. But because their downfall was what triggered it. Thus his resentment isn't directed towards the Jedi Order's other victims. But to the individuals that instigated it.
Well done 👍
Well if he goes back in time to kill Anakin, Anakin would make quick work of him. Ashoka had him till she burned her hand.
Is it me, or does it seem like Baylan is very attuned to people's thoughts and feelings - even beyond what an average force user is capable of?
If so, it would explain how he knows so much about Ahsoka (and Anakin) and Sabine (and Ezra and the fate of her family) and just what to say to push their emotions over the edge...
Good point, this theory holds some water. But that being said he’s blinded by shin, that will become apparent when she runs him through the gut
@@Mike-we2hb But premonitions/seeing the future is a different skill. (Also, unlike us, he's not watching a show where he can deduce where storytelling and character building is leading towards... 😉)
@@jcompton8507 aye I get that I’m merely saying he definitely blinded, I never once said he’s watching a show. He’s that focused on finding whatever it is he isn’t picking up on some comments the shady looks between shin and the Morgan. Stand to reasons because he thinks she’ll never betray him.
OR….He has no history with either of them, just hearing things later. MEANING….He simply was just screwing with her head. Hmmmm….considering the whole Marrok was StarKiller, I’m thinking it’s what I’m thinking.
If Baylon did feel that Anakin and all from him were bad by association. Then I wonder how he would feel about Luke destroying Vader and Sidious to end the Empire.
Now lets talk about those amazing transitions the editor did
Love this video already we definitely need a back story about baylan skull he is such a cool character
Someone on Facebook Groups suggested that Baylon was the little boy seen at the end of Episode 3 ROTS. 😮
I think you are too quick to say he hates them. He clearly thinks anakin is responsible for a legacy of darkness, but not sure if hatred is the word...
The next episode will definitely be a flashback of baylan or ahsoka and anakin
I hope they give his character a believable death and not something cheesy now that the actor passed away in May.
The Jedi Order during the Galactic Republic were blind. Qui-Gon Was Honestly One Of The Better Jedis. He May Not Be As Good With A Lightsaber With His Age But His Knowledge Of The Force Is Superior Than A Lot Of Jedi👍👍
Id like to know how he knows about the WBW. He wasn't there and i doubt ahsoka and or Esra were going around telling everyone and anyone. And if the old masters knew about wbw they weren't telling a padawan which he was during and after clone wars. How does he know???
It seems to me Baylon is keeping his cards and as well as his motivation is close to his chest. I suspect he had hoped to recruit Ahsoka thinking she taught as he did about Anakin.
But it was Anakin's training of her that made her strong and from his point of view, untrustworthy. So he settled for Sabine, even though it was obvious Shin wanted to kill her.
I think the twist in the tale is with the Padawan.
Like most apprentices influenced by the dark side, they crave power. Baylon personifies that power. Look what happened when Shin fought Sabine? The moment she realised Sabine had no force ability, she cut the fight short in a rather haphazard way and walked off.
When they fought again, it was a different story. Sabine held her own. Shin likely thinks she was fooled and wants to kill Sabine for embarrassing her.
As for Anakin and Ahsoka and their location, after forcing down a few slices of humble pie, Anakin will show her how to use the world between worlds to make her own intergalactic jump. They both owe each other. She for walking away. He for the fight at the battle station.
That has to be sorted out first.
For some reason I feel like he was a temple guard left behind on some far off forgotten planet
You know I truly hope this is where the story will go because that will open a new point of view of the clone wars era
Yoda should've been Anakins master/mentor tbh
Yoda's peacefulness and positive outlook on things would've been perfect.
Baylan, "I don't use my dark powers for personal amusement, I use it to indiscriminately reach my ends.
Apologies if this is a super trivial question, but is the Clone War defeat/atrocities on Jabiim (sorry if the spelling is off) canon? If so, could Baylon be one of the Jedi previous thought to have died in that campaign?
It would have potentially been prior to Anakin taking in Ahsoka and would maybe explain Baylon's familiarity with Anakin via combat and Ahsoka never have hearing of Baylon as his master potentially also being killed earlier in the Clone wars?
As always thanks for the content! Love the series so far, but I'm not much of a big critic anyways, just love to continuation of the star wars continuity for future generations to enjoy.
Jokes on Baylan, if he tries to change past/future, he will get stuck in time paradox xd
It just makes it even more sad that the actor died. So much he could have added to the story.
At some point in time Baylan was Mace Windu's padawan during or before tcw he became a knight, and from a far the knowledge that Palpatine and Anekin killed his former master spiralled him towards the darkside
“Witchcraft”- Baylan Skoll 2023
Now...wouldn't it be funny, if they all show up to meet Thrawn, and him and Ezra are just chillin like bff's. Ezra a much more progressed Jedi being around Thrawn for so many years, and Thrawn being far more humble and in tune from being around Ezra. Now that would be a curve-ball.
I predict that Baylan and Ashoka are going to have an epic rematch of their lightsaber duel inside the "World Between Worlds" itself. And it will be glorious.
Ahsoka is not to be blamed at all. She did all she could. This is very interesting. Baylan might really go back in time. To prevent Order 66,to prevent rise of Galactic Empire. Baylan is exceptional character. Very interesting. He's great. I really look forward to see what happened. Anakin and Ahsoka are not to be blamed for what happened. When you think about it. See you in the next holocron. May the Force be with you too😊
An exciting ride? It just finally rose above dull and listless.
paused on 19th second, half way through transition because I had to chase the kid, best moment to stop ever
I want a Anakin Ghost version VS Babylon! It would be fun to watch tho❤
Baylan doesn't hate Anakin or Ahsoka that I have seen. He only lamented the loss of another Jedi because 'there are so few left', to me that felt like he was comparing them to an endangered species on the brink of annihilation, for instance, we humans lament the loss of potentially dangerous animals like lions/tigers/sharks etc. I think Baylan is more on the side of, "the jedi purge was inevitable because of their own dogmatic ways." The jedi reaped what they sowed for 1000 years. Unlike a Sith Baylan doesn't fill himself with rage, he is calm, collected, and cunning. He fights only when he must, a true hunter so to speak keeping his eyes on his prize. He is an ideal dark jedi, Id almost call him a grey jedi but his dark malignment is clear to see, we just haven't seen the reason for it. A real shame he has passed on his character is already so interesting. Dooku was very much like him, only taken further into the darkside of the Sith.
Baylan . . . Has conveniently forgotten. That Ahsoka walked away. Not just from Anakin, but the order as a whole. Because she had her eyes opened. To see them for what they were. As a bunch of self serving Hypocrites.' And more importantly for her feeling of betrayal. Which was justly founded. Because they were willing too throw her under the bus so quickly. In order too please the senate. And Palpatine! When she was Framed for crimes she did not commit.
if the order had just rescued his mother from slavery, they probably could've avoided Anakin turning evil.
I mean, that would have been great. But, if Shimi was freed then the Jedi/Republic would have to free ALL the slaves in the Outer Rim. You can’t save one or two and leave the rest.
@kneelb4zod360 why?
Contrary to what ppl believe, the Jedi aren't Green Lanterns. They didn't have any legal authority to unilaterally free slaves on systems that weren't part of the Republic. They also didn't believe that their power was to be used for the sake of imposing their will on other beings. It was a total violation of their doctrine, and Revan and Alek's fall is evidence of why the Jedi didn't engage in such ventures.
Baylen is one of the many people who's mask their poor treatment and possible prejudicial judgement behind tradition. It annoys him that Ashoka and by extension Anakin demonstrated the flaws of the jedi and how easily they could have overcome them if they hadn't been so fixated by traditional thinking.
Of course I'm biased due to knowing how successful Legends version of Luke Skywalker will be at rebuilding the orders
You are not wrong I think the real reason baylan is angry at ahsoka and anakin is not because it lead to the jedi order being destroyed but to to see how their traditional thinking lead to the creation of darth vader and the people to blame for what happened to the order is the emperor and the traditionalist people in the order
They aren't capable of writing anything this compelling, unfortunately.
What is that background music?
look at this dude says you can use the dark side for good when he said in past videos the dark side corrupts all good intentions
The force had decided the jedi were to be extinguished. The dark side of the force needed to wipe out the jedi. It's always about balance. Look at the many atrocities the jedi allowed to happen because of their dogmatic views. I'm speaking purely on Yoda's Era. The jedi order of the past were never apathetic. Baylon is refreshing because he reminds us of the jedi and the order from a different era. Just like Qui Gon
I doubt he hate Ashoka per say, it's just he blames her for abandoning Anakin, thinking it was partly to blame for Anakin's fall or as a insult to the Jedi Order.
If he gets to the World Between Worlds he just needs to make sure she gets a different Master.
If he destroys Anakin he could destroy Luke! To stop Anakin's fall Anakin should have been sent on the mission like Palpatine wanted, Palpatine would then be forced to give up his emergency powers and the Empire would not have exited! As Ashoka would have been able to tell Anakin what Maul had said about Anakin joining the Dark Side!
By not sending Anakin as Palpatine wanted the Jedi Council allowed the Empire to rise!
Baylon has to be careful or The Force will create Anakin somewhere else and the Jedi would not know the Sith had returned! Also, Qui-gon and Obi-Wan might have been killed, Padme captured and forced to sign the treaty or maybe killed for refusing, and the Jedi would not know the Sith had returned, the Empire would rise and the Jedi destroyed and Palestine would not have been killed by Vader and it's possible Rey might not exist either! I hate Rey and those movies because she lives and the Skywalkers die! Still, I don't hate Rey for her parts in the movies, just that she lives and Ben dies. If Ben had lived I think I would have liked the movies.
Still, Baylon could do much more evil than good if he is not careful!
He's old enough know of Luke and what he is and his actions as part of the Rebellion and how important he is. So I doubt he would be reckless because he knows Luke needs to exist, or does he intend to stop the circle by destroying The Force?!!!!!!
That would change everything and destroy the Rey movies! Brilliant!
As for Baylon's actor being dead, let him have an accident and look different like Palpatine did. Sorted.
His apprentice totally has a Padawan braid.
Has Baylan been to the World Between Worlds before? Maybe reached it prior to Order 66, hence he jumped into the future. Did he pull Shin out, like Ezra did with Ahsoka. Perhaps Thrawn is able to give him access again? Is there a certain time he wants to jump into, in order to gain ultimate power? Did he know Palpatine? Is there a time that he can overthrow him and become a different type of Emperor? "War is inevitable. One must destroy in order to create."
I think it would be obvious if he'd been to the world between worlds. But since we never heard of him before I doubt he's been there
Just an idea, but could he be the father? When he closes his eyes he is able to know a lot about pretty much anyone... Is he using the World Between Worlds? It's admittedly out there, but I don't think anything is really obvious about Baylan. Other than Ahsoka, Ezra and now Anakin, who else do we know has been there?@@hectortorres4699
If you go back and listen to all of his actual lines, it's possible to interpret that the higher cause he mentions is actually legit. I have a feeling he is only playing along with Elsbeth to reach Peridia and may actually have the intention to eliminate both her and Thrawn. In the very beginning when we meet them I was intrigued that Shin is very suspicious of Elsbeth and asks what kind of magic is she spinning. Baylan does not really correct her for that- and I suspect they have a secret agenda.
I hope this means Baylan goes through a portal to fight Anakin to "save the galaxy" and gets bodied.
I think he just wants to be able to go back and fix everything, which never works out for anyone in the end..
I was thinking that since Baylan knows what happened to Anakin, that he might view Luke as dangerous being the son of Anakin. Thus he feels justified in his actions. And his goal is to remove Luke, not go back in time.
It's mixed. Baylan sympathizes with the Anikan of the past but hates who he became. He blames Ahsoka for leaving Anikan as Baylan is part of the reason Anikan turned
Baylen has a currently unknown higher objective! I’m holding out hope it’s that he is aware of an intergalactic threat (as palpatine my have been)? I’m holding out hope for yuzong vong type of story arc! (Although episodes 7,8 & 9 have pretty much “screwed the pooch” for arcs that good 😤)
I really can't believe that these characters existed
I mean, anakin did storm the jedi temple with the 501st
It's like using people like tools for their own use in different ways
Baylan really is a very interesting character. Such a shame that Ray died after filming, maybe if Baylan survives season 1 they will have to change the plan for him in season 2 (if we get a season 2)
Perhaps this has something to do with Aniken murdering the Younglings in the Jedi temple
Either Anakin was to be trained by the Jedi or Darth Plagueis who is responsible for creating Anakin would’ve found him in Coruscant and eventually have trained him to be a Sith
If I was Balen, I would be saying fuck Anakin, and Ahsoka
He also uses the same stance as Anikin mainly, Anikin probably trained him at least a little.
🙃🎯I wish the "Stupendous Wave" content creators were writers for Disney's Future Star Wars projects
I like hwo much Baylan makes me think of Atris in the KOTOR 2 gameplay.
Think about it both were more traditional jedi that were mistruful of the Order's more rogue elemtents that in their opinions caused chaos and destruction (ie Revan and Anakin).
If this theory holds in the next episodes, both fell to the dark side in a misguided to rebuild an order that no longer exist.
And while they were both right to an extent they are also in embracing the dark side and failing to understand that every calamity that befell the jedi happened for a reason.
He doesn’t hate her. When they were dueling you could tell his demeanor was some what calm to neutral and nothing compared to the demeanor of Darth Maul who hated Kenobi and showed such passion and rage when dueling him. Baylen seems to be only interested in securing himself and his Padawan financially and will do what he deems necessary to achieve that. Ashoka is just an obstacle that happens to be in his way which is how he sees it but he doesn’t have a personal vendetta against her and even hesitates to the suggestion of Morgan to kill her. The only time I saw him hate Ashoka was when she used the force to harm his Padawan unconscious and that’s when the rage showed.
Maybe if those like Windu hadn’t treated him so harshly, he would’ve had a bit more reason to save him instead of chopping his hand off. I know the fall was inevitable, but still! And even if he changed Anakins fate, that plan had been in motion for a very long time! No Anakin Skywalker doesn’t mean that Order 66 wouldn’t happen! He’ll find out that that the will of the force cannot be stopped! It will turn on him & he’d learn a whole new hard lesson!
Anakin's fall wasn't inevitable, which makes it silly for ppl to constantly blame Windu or the other Jedi for the choices he made.
Killing a baby Anakin would have zero impact on the implementation of order 66.
I think this is a fair assessment except for one thing: There are very few people that know that Darth Vader was Anakin Skywalker. The fact that Baylen Knows means that he has encountered Darth Vader before, and found that the annoying Palawan and reckless Jedi has become the blade of evil that ruined his life.
Anakin did not turn to the darkside because of some heavy-handedness or negligence. It was inevitable that the Jedi order would collapse since it depended on the appropriation and indoctrination of young children. Any youngling stepping out of line with the doctrine would risk losing their new home and purpose, returning to an uncertain life of failure. So an innately powerful child like anakin was never going to fit into this dogma since he was NOT dependent on the jedi for his purpose in life. Indeed he felt that the jedi held him back. Through this enforced stagnation, the jedi order was doomed to fall in a way that all rigid and corrupt structures fall - intransigence. Palpatine exploited this perfectly
I don't think Baylan is trying to use or even knows the world between worlds. Unless I missed a bit of dialogue. I honestly think he see's the corruption in the New Republic just like the old Republic and maybe wishes for a stable government and see's Thrawn as someone who can bring this about by destroying what is to create something better, better than the Empire and Republic. As for the Jedi I honestly think Baylan is more a Grey Jedi than a dark Jedi. I haven't see much dark powers or tendencies in him yet. Maybe that's what the whole orange sabers are about. Not fully embracing the darkside hence haven't fully bleed the crystals. Sort of like the purple are to Jedi.
"Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor."
Baylan has an exceptional ability to read the feelings and thoughts of others.
He mentions Anakin to Ahsoka after reading her feelings and thoughts and then uses that to off balance her.
It is also then he discovers that Anakin became Vader.
He does the same with Sabine pulling Ezra's name from her mind and what Ezra means to Sabine while trying to influence her.
I think to find out who his master was we should look at his lightsaber and find Jedi masters who used the large hilt lightsaber
It wouldn’t surprise me if Baylan would use the World between Worlds to kill Darth Plaguies to prevent Anakin’s birth thus preventing the fate of the Jedi but w/ his disillusionment I would’ve figured he be more like Count Dooku who disagreed w/ the Jedi’s dogma but rather than that he despises the fact they allowed Anakin to be trained and Palpatine to rose to power even more so, to add salt to the wound he blames Ahsoka for walking away just when she was overwhelmed with guilt hesitant to training anyone
Baylan clearly hated Anakin, and I agree he was likely of the opinion that Anakin should not have been trained. However, like any self-righteous crusader, Baylan conveniently forgets, or deliberately leaves out, certain details, in that his resentment towards Ahsoka is unjustified and the reason she left the Order was becuz the Jedi Council betrayed her in order to protect themselves from the Republic. The Jedi Order lost a great deal of their standing with the citizens of the Republic during the Clone Wars, as they were no longer keepers of the peace but warriors leading armies into war and chaos and destruction. The Jedi did not start the war but they took part in it, being partly responsible for all the death, violence, destruction, and even the loss.
Luminara Unduli inadvertently caused the deaths of the Martez sisters' parents, and instead of actually helping them she basically left them to their own devices with empty words. The Lurmen held the Jedi equally responsible for the war in spite of the fact the Jedi were only trying to protect people, but Aayla realized the lurmen elder was not wrong, that it only takes two to fight and that one cannot call themselves peacekeepers if they resort to violence. Granted the lurmen people's ways were flawed as well, it was still another perspective to consider
Ahsoka was framed by a fellow Jedi, Barriss Offee, who had been her friend, which made the betrayal cut all the deeper. The Council expelled Ahsoka w/o giving her a real chance to defend herself or even to consider her character or conduct a proper investigation. Granted Ahsoka's actions and behavior didn't hep her case, it is still a monstrous betrayal to be made a sacrificial lamb in the way she was, in order to placate the Republic rather than stand by one of their own. When Anakin unveiled Barriss as the true culprit, only Plo koon made a sincere apology to Ahsoka while the others took no responsibility and even shifted the blame onto the "will of the Force" when it had been anything but.
Baylan ignores this fact, which he surely must have known, in order to justify his contempt of Ahsoka, viewing her guilty purely by association with Anakin, and giving too much credit to the potential of what-ifs. Could Ahsoka have helped prevent Anakin from falling to the Dark Side? I honestly can't say with enough certainty that maybe she could have. Palpatine was a master manipulator and had spent over a decade grooming Anakin, stroking his ego, sowing doubt, and instilling anger and resentment into the young man, all the while presenting himself as a trusted friend and mentor. Anakin had known Palpatine far longer than he'd known Ahsoka, and while their bond was strong I can't say for certain that Anakin would take Ahsoka's word over Palpatine's if it came down to it. Palpatine presided over Ahsoka's trial (and likely saw it as a chance to remove her from the board and tighten his web around Anakin more securely). The fact Anakin didn't request mercy on Ahsoka's behalf from Palpatine suggests that Anakin didn't think Palpatine would in spite of their "friendship". None of us can be certain what might have been had Ahsoka stayed, but I think we can likely agree that it would have not changed the outcome apart from circumstances.
Again, Baylan puts too much stock into what might have been had Ahsoka stayed by her master's side, and it's both irresponsible and unfair of him to. Yes, Anakin is the one who betrayed the Jedi Order but Baylan is forgetting that Palpatine was the one ultimately responsible for the Order's downfall and the rise of the Empire.
Well put
I agree and the man conceit will be Ashoka must save Anakin from being destroyed despite all the pain he caused because he really is the chosen one and brought balance to the force. (Sequel Trilogy notwithstanding)
He could block a lightsaber with that beard.
Baylan is a unique Dark Jedi. He is intelligent and measured in his emotions and decisions.
I don't think Shin is on the same path as Baylan.
She is deep in the Dark Side and full of rage... she let'sthe dark side control her, perhaps to a disadvantage.
Sabine held her own for quite a while against Shin, even though her saber skills are lacking with diminished force sensitivity.
It only came to pass because of the jedis deliberate negligence and incompetence and flat out refusal to actually help anakin the way that he needed help I blame them bare minimum 75% they used him to try and achieve their goals like a tool and completely ignored his humanity they never even truly cared about him maybe outside of Obi Wan so as far as I’m concerned, they deserved everything that they got and on top of that Anakin did fullfill his destiny. He brought Balance to the force before he turned to the dark side the Jedi outnumbered the Sith like 10,000 to 50.
I’m not convinced of any theory yet, firstly the world between worlds, and the cosmic force is not something the new Jedi order is familiar with, remember that the concept of force ghosts is a relatively new thing to the Jedi order.
While it is cool to think about I think more plausible explanation is that Baykal was just throwing Asoka of her game, but wow what a series so far!!!!!
Also why would Baylan promise Sabine that she will see Ezra, and he does seem to be someone that keeps his promises, and a straight shooter, if he’s plan was to tear apart the fabric of time? Not saying that I completely dismiss the idea, but I would like to know a little more about what is in the Chaos region, I think a lot more is going to be opened up there in the next episode.
We probably shouldn't be theorising about Baylan's intentions I mean remember when Marrok's turned out to be nothing?
5:59 there’s also option three about y Anakin never mentioned Baylon to Ahsoka; Anakin spoke with him AFTER Ahsoka left the order. My guess being that Baylon could have also had a Padawan leave the order like Ahsoka and Anakin needed someone to hear from with experience dealing with the pain.
Doubtful that Baylan had a Padawan as he was probably a Padawan himself at that time
He gave her a chance to survive:
when me DIDNT slash her dead and instead hit her lightsaber, knocking her off the cliff,
he was giving her a chance because he doesn’t hate her, he hates what her master DID
Nah. If he should blame any Jedi Knight, it should be Mace Windu. If he had gotten over his ego and big-head and listened to Anakin and Ahsoka, then things may have turned out better.
Jedi Master, Windu was not a knight.
Common normie L take
Windu spoke facts. When they promoted Anakin to the JEDI COUNCIL, he complained that he deserved more. THAT is ego, and power should not belong to the person enslaved to it. Anakin is the moron who fell for the most obvious manipulation from Palpatine, was delusional enough to think he himself could be Emperor. Anakin is an asshole
The blame is Anakin alone.
Stop making excuses for Anakin Skywalker.
The blame is on solely on Skywalker.
If Anakin had listened to Mace and waited for him in the council chambers like he was told, things would've definitely turned out better.