I found this video very helpful in installing a vertical grab bar in my ceramic tiled shower area. I intended to fasten one screw on each end into a steel wall stud & I was looking for a simple method of attaching the remaining four screws. Luckily I found this video on CZcams and instead of attaching grab bar to a steel stud with one screw on each end & the two other screws on each end into molly's of some kind I decided to move the grab bar over & I attached both ends with 6 Walldog screws after drilling thru the ceramic tiles. These screws hold the grab bar solidly to the wall and I'm very confident that no amount of human pulling force on the bar will dislodge it.
Just got mine done, found out you definitely need a tile bit and a hammer drill , used bosh , !! I did 5/16 holes and plastic anchor and screw kit #10 1&1/4 long 50 lbs per anchor , as it's a helper ... Not to support all my weight! , it's great , got the 18" bar at ace , having knee surgery wanting a rail to grab in shower ... People say only mount to a stud.. great if they are in the correct place!! I had none to line up .. tile is plenty... strong
I couldn’t find a stud, I tried a decent stud finder, different magnets , thought I had it Drilled holes nothing, so far you’re method looks like the way to go for me
Thanks very much, very clearly explained! I am going to see if I can find the studs and use them if possible - if not, I'll use this method. Dumb question: can I assume a bathroom built about 1968 has concrete backboard behind the tile? Or could it possibly be plywood?
I'd much rather mount both bars to a stub. Sometimes you can get easy access with a stud finder above the ceramic tile. And on this one vertical bar, you had completely open access to the other side of the wall and could have used a stud finder on that other side of the wall.
Sometimes one needs to consider placement that's appropriate. Im an OT and half of the time I see a home with grab bars, in studs as you suggest and in awful, unusable placement in terms of function which kind of defeats the purpose of installation.
If you can't find the stud, you have to use wall anchors. These videos are good, but not one has addressed the problem of when the wall behind it is an outside concrete wall. I had to find out the hard way on my own. When your wall behind you tile is an outside wall, it will not be a hollow wall, which all these spread apart anchors are made for. No matter how deep you drill, you will not be able to hook up any anchor that has to spread out behind the wall. You have to use anchor plugs, plastic or metal. And make sure the screws are stainless steel, or else they will start rusting in and outside of the wall, with orange seeping down.
this is my problem. i drilled and through the tile and backer there is a .75 inch space and then a concrete wall that pertains to the outside. from the tile to the concrete wall is 1.75 inches total. SO do i drill thrugh and use a concrete anchor to the outside wall?
Hi, I’d be really interested to know if the wall dogs are still holding the bar on, or if you had any problems with them after all this time?? Thank you
The shower is plastic or something so behind it is a 2 inch Gap what else can I use to secure it to shower sadly any ideas would be greatly appreciated
john dubreuil you can buy grab bars that mount with suction cups. They work well on fiberglass shower walls. Just be sure to remove and re-apply them before each use since the suction cups will gradually lose suction.
You will have to drill an exploratory hole and measure the thickness of the material under the tile. Then select a screw size so that the tip of the screw will penetrate the material under the tile and as much of the "threads" of the screw are engaged as possible.
You didn't show how you inserted the two screws under the actual rail itself, and you didn't apply silicon under the cover plates, after all it is a wet seal area
Paul Strausbaugh, somewhere in the video I mentioned that the drill bit I used to drill through the tile is larger than the screw. That way the only stress on the tile is clamping force. I have not cracked any tiles using this method.
You should always use this type of bit, its made for cutting thro the tile coating: www.topline.ie/images/ProductImages/5023969213101.jpg?width=1200&height=627&width=1200&height=627
You should always use this type of bit, its made for cutting thro the tile coating: www.topline.ie/images/ProductImages/5023969213101.jpg?width=1200&height=627&width=1200&height=627
mars1952 OK just to be clear before I start. In the video you said the second drillbit needs to be about the same size as the shank of the screw. In your response to me you said the first drillbit needs to be about the size of the shank. But the second drillbit is smaller than the first drillbit. I hope I making sense here
@@donttrip775 Your initial hole drilled should be the same diameter as the screw diameter and should just be used to drill through the thickness of the tile. Once you drill through the tile stop and change drill bits to a smaller drill bit. As long as the second bit is smaller in diameter as the first drill bit you will be fine. The second drill bit is essentially used to prevent the gypsum in the drywall behind the tile from crumbling. In my opinion, it's not really necessary. Just don't go through the wall with the first drill bit, only the tile and you should be fine.
You should always use this type of bit, its made for cutting thro the tile coating: www.topline.ie/images/ProductImages/5023969213101.jpg?width=1200&height=627&width=1200&height=627
I only used Walldogs. The key to the strength is the drilling/driving technique and the cement backer board. Plain drywall would not be strong enough. On other jobs, I have used Walldogs to hold up static loads and they are still fine after five years. Hand holds have dynamic loads.
@@mars1952 thx for the prompt reply! I'm preparing to install grab bars for a man with mobility issues (he recently had a stroke). I want to avoid a situation where the bar fails. So these wall dogs will work on tile with reliability. Sounds good to me. I've used wall dogs on drywall, plaster, and ceiling tile, but those were for light duty.
@@carlosaranibar4362 cement board can be strong enough just make sure there is backer board there before you drill any holes. Look behind the faucet or knobs.
Grab bars MUST be anchored to studs. Code requires them to hold 300 lbs dead weight. If you do it this guys way and it pulls out you can be liable. I'm a contractor of 30 plus years.
A million years is a long time but they have held up for eight years so far. I think I weighed about 250 lbs when I made this video and I tried to pull them off and they did not budge. I just checked them again today and they are still solid. If they ever loosen even a little I will take them down and fill the holes with grout.
Look @03:55. The drill I used is a hammer drill with a clutch. which is the same configuration of almost all hammer drills on the market. It is not an impact driver or a rotary hammer. If you want to drill ceramic tile with a plain rotary drill, be my guest but in the meantime, I will be drilling 10 holes with a hammer drill for every one hole you drill with a rotary drill and I will wear out fewer drills per hole than you do.
Thank you for pointing out your hammer setting, I see that now. And thank you for the informative video, however we will have to agree to disagree. I feel the proper way to drill in tile is without any type of hammer setting and this is widely accepted. And I get through tile pretty quickly without a hammer setting. Tape, mark, drill slowly and cool, and your bits should last a long time without risking cracking or chipping tile.
I found this video very helpful in installing a vertical grab bar in my ceramic tiled shower area. I intended to fasten one screw on each end into a steel wall stud & I was looking for a simple method of attaching the remaining four screws. Luckily I found this video on CZcams and instead of attaching grab bar to a steel stud with one screw on each end & the two other screws on each end into molly's of some kind I decided to move the grab bar over & I attached both ends with 6 Walldog screws after drilling thru the ceramic tiles. These screws hold the grab bar solidly to the wall and I'm very confident that no amount of human pulling force on the bar will dislodge it.
+Fred Martinez Thanks
Watched this video and it was very helpful! Thanks for posting, it was clear/concise and useful.
Just got mine done, found out you definitely need a tile bit and a hammer drill , used bosh , !! I did 5/16 holes and plastic anchor and screw kit #10 1&1/4 long 50 lbs per anchor , as it's a helper ... Not to support all my weight! , it's great , got the 18" bar at ace , having knee surgery wanting a rail to grab in shower ... People say only mount to a stud.. great if they are in the correct place!! I had none to line up .. tile is plenty... strong
Thumbs up. Very good easy instructions.
Thank you for your help and
drill sizes.
I couldn’t find a stud, I tried a decent stud finder, different magnets , thought I had it
Drilled holes nothing, so far you’re method looks like the way to go for me
Very helpful, thank you. 〽️
Yet another useful video - thanks :)
awesome. very helpful
I prefer a grab bar that doesn’t compromise my waterproofing. Tileware makes a great grab bar so that’s what I use.
Good information
good job
I keep feeling that I was listening to Mr. Rasczak in Starship Troopers
Thanks very much, very clearly explained! I am going to see if I can find the studs and use them if possible - if not, I'll use this method. Dumb question: can I assume a bathroom built about 1968 has concrete backboard behind the tile? Or could it possibly be plywood?
I don't know.
Would you do a similar process to install a "fitness pole" to a tile floor?
What if the tile is very old? Should we worry about it just cracking and crumbling?
thank good job
1:50 Use a hammer drill to drill on tile? Personally I would not recommend this.
I'd much rather mount both bars to a stub. Sometimes you can get easy access with a stud finder above the ceramic tile. And on this one vertical bar, you had completely open access to the other side of the wall and could have used a stud finder on that other side of the wall.
Using special toggle bolts will work just fine. They will not pull out. But any kind of anchor might
Sometimes one needs to consider placement that's appropriate. Im an OT and half of the time I see a home with grab bars, in studs as you suggest and in awful, unusable placement in terms of function which kind of defeats the purpose of installation.
ThNks
How to dismantle baut cover?
If you can't find the stud, you have to use wall anchors. These videos are good, but not one has addressed the problem of when the wall behind it is an outside concrete wall. I had to find out the hard way on my own. When your wall behind you tile is an outside wall, it will not be a hollow wall, which all these spread apart anchors are made for. No matter how deep you drill, you will not be able to hook up any anchor that has to spread out behind the wall. You have to use anchor plugs, plastic or metal. And make sure the screws are stainless steel, or else they will start rusting in and outside of the wall, with orange seeping down.
How is drilling and fixing into a solid wall a problem??
@@TavsIsAbout it isn't. It's the anchor spreader that's designed for use on dry wall, not solid wall. For solid wall, you need a different anchor
this is my problem. i drilled and through the tile and backer there is a .75 inch space and then a concrete wall that pertains to the outside. from the tile to the concrete wall is 1.75 inches total. SO do i drill thrugh and use a concrete anchor to the outside wall?
If only you started from the beginnings😵
Hi, I’d be really interested to know if the wall dogs are still holding the bar on, or if you had any problems with them after all this time?? Thank you
The grab bars are still sturdy but they have not been used for two years since my mother-in-law has passed.
Never drill into ceramic tile using a hammer drill
do you think 2 butterfly screws would work better than wall dog or is that over kill?
I do not like butterfly screws. You have to make a large hole that weakens the drywall or backer board and the bolt then has a sloppy fit.
The shower is plastic or something so behind it is a 2 inch Gap what else can I use to secure it to shower sadly any ideas would be greatly appreciated
john dubreuil you can buy grab bars that mount with suction cups. They work well on fiberglass shower walls. Just be sure to remove and re-apply them before each use since the suction cups will gradually lose suction.
I have purchased 1 1/4 dog screws I noticed you used 1 1/2 is my size screw still ok
You will have to drill an exploratory hole and measure the thickness of the material under the tile. Then select a screw size so that the tip of the screw will penetrate the material under the tile and as much of the "threads" of the screw are engaged as possible.
thanks
Where can one buy the Powers Fasteners?
+Susan Potters I bought them at Home Depot.
You didn't show how you inserted the two screws under the actual rail itself, and you didn't apply silicon under the cover plates, after all it is a wet seal area
Do you use the recommended 3/16 bit for the tile and have you ever had the tile crack or chip when driving the screw?
Paul Strausbaugh, somewhere in the video I mentioned that the drill bit I used to drill through the tile is larger than the screw. That way the only stress on the tile is clamping force. I have not cracked any tiles using this method.
Thanks. I saw that. Do you recall the size you use for the tile? I have 1/4 and 5/16 tile bits. Also do you start in hammer mode?
Oh and I just checked. My tile is porcelain not ceramic if that makes a difference.
Paul Strausbaugh, whatever the tile is made of, you don't want the threads of the screw to bite into the tile.
You should always use this type of bit, its made for cutting thro the tile coating: www.topline.ie/images/ProductImages/5023969213101.jpg?width=1200&height=627&width=1200&height=627
Do you have any thoughts regarding drilling through tiles and penetrating the membrane in a area exposed to water?
Just use some Silicone Kitchen & Bath Sealant Caulk around the screws before before putting the covers on.
Why weren't we shown the process of drilling through the tile? Anybody can run in a screw with a drill.
But how did you find the studs?
Watch the video again, he didn't find the stud, instead, he used wall dog screws.
I think i would be a little nervous for my elderly parents trying to get out of the tub and pulling on the bar knowing its not secured to a stud.
Micheal Ironside?
czcams.com/video/iDSjnZqjdXo/video.html
Do you need a special drill bit to get through ceramic tile?
You should always use this type of bit, its made for cutting thro the tile coating: www.topline.ie/images/ProductImages/5023969213101.jpg?width=1200&height=627&width=1200&height=627
So the first drill bit needs to be about the same diameter as the screw?
About the same size as the shank of the a screw.
mars1952 Great thanks so much. I appreciate it
mars1952 OK just to be clear before I start. In the video you said the second drillbit needs to be about the same size as the shank of the screw. In your response to me you said the first drillbit needs to be about the size of the shank. But the second drillbit is smaller than the first drillbit. I hope I making sense here
@@donttrip775 Your initial hole drilled should be the same diameter as the screw diameter and should just be used to drill through the thickness of the tile. Once you drill through the tile stop and change drill bits to a smaller drill bit. As long as the second bit is smaller in diameter as the first drill bit you will be fine. The second drill bit is essentially used to prevent the gypsum in the drywall behind the tile from crumbling. In my opinion, it's not really necessary. Just don't go through the wall with the first drill bit, only the tile and you should be fine.
You should always use this type of bit, its made for cutting thro the tile coating: www.topline.ie/images/ProductImages/5023969213101.jpg?width=1200&height=627&width=1200&height=627
Would have been nice to see you actually installing the bars instead of showing them already installed
Can you come over and do it for me? 😄
Honest question: Are wall dogs really that strong? Or did i miss a step in the video where he used anchors?
I only used Walldogs. The key to the strength is the drilling/driving technique and the cement backer board. Plain drywall would not be strong enough. On other jobs, I have used Walldogs to hold up static loads and they are still fine after five years. Hand holds have dynamic loads.
@@mars1952 thx for the prompt reply! I'm preparing to install grab bars for a man with mobility issues (he recently had a stroke). I want to avoid a situation where the bar fails.
So these wall dogs will work on tile with reliability. Sounds good to me. I've used wall dogs on drywall, plaster, and ceiling tile, but those were for light duty.
@@mars1952 one more question: is backer board the reason we don't need to find a stud? Kinda like plywood behind drywall?
@@carlosaranibar4362 cement board can be strong enough just make sure there is backer board there before you drill any holes. Look behind the faucet or knobs.
Grab bars MUST be anchored to studs. Code requires them to hold 300 lbs dead weight. If you do it this guys way and it pulls out you can be liable. I'm a contractor of 30 plus years.
Code? Haha
That’s not a hammer drill. It has an impact setting but a hammer drill is a whole other tool and u definitely would no use it on tile
Those screws will never hold in a million years !!
A million years is a long time but they have held up for eight years so far. I think I weighed about 250 lbs when I made this video and I tried to pull them off and they did not budge. I just checked them again today and they are still solid. If they ever loosen even a little I will take them down and fill the holes with grout.
Never ever use a hammer drill on tile! I assume you are calling your tool an incorrect name. That appears to be a clutch drill or impact driver.
Look @03:55. The drill I used is a hammer drill with a clutch. which is the same configuration of almost all hammer drills on the market. It is not an impact driver or a rotary hammer. If you want to drill ceramic tile with a plain rotary drill, be my guest but in the meantime, I will be drilling 10 holes with a hammer drill for every one hole you drill with a rotary drill and I will wear out fewer drills per hole than you do.
Thank you for pointing out your hammer setting, I see that now.
And thank you for the informative video, however we will have to agree to disagree. I feel the proper way to drill in tile is without any type of hammer setting and this is widely accepted. And I get through tile pretty quickly without a hammer setting. Tape, mark, drill slowly and cool, and your bits should last a long time without risking cracking or chipping tile.
I’m only 40 why am I watching this lol
Because you'll need it when your older or dead before you ever use it.lol
@@thaimassage23 Probably won't need it when he's dead
t h .nug a htiw ni wercs a nur nac ydobynA ?elit eht hguorht gnillird yllautca fo ssecorp eeren't we shown
Why, oh why, make a you tube video and then not show you actually doing the project, you wasted everyone’s time
everyone knows to hit a stud when possible. what if there isn't one
There are always studs but they are seldom where you want them to be.