Stuff I got Wrong about Greek Mythology
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- čas přidán 17. 12. 2021
- Okay now please stop leaving comments about Persephone and Medusa. Or continue to tell me I'm worng, cause I guess the algorithm likes engagement.
#GreekMythology
For more info on Greek Mythology, check out www.theoi.com/
Thanks to Jonathan Doberski for help with my research.
I love how Hesiod compares womens’ “uselessness” to how bees feed the drones because uh, well
Drones are useless, yeah, but they’re the men. The bees are all women.
So really, to explain how men are cool and women are lame, he grabbed an example where women are cool and men are lame.
@@alexandergangaware429 if I remember correctly, it was a huge discovery when someone tested what would happen if he covered a piece of raw meat, and saw that it didn't get maggots. Until then people just assumed maggots dimply emerged from raw meat.
@@RainbowCornet Covered with a length of cheesecloth, I believe, so it could breathe. That way, the miasma could get to the meat, thus allowing it to rot w/o any flies getting to it
This is why he was a writer and not a biologist 😉
Men literally get tossed out when winter comes cuz they're just more mouths to feed when the baby making is done he really fucked up with that metaphor
with all do respect neither women nor men are drones were all unique in our own way and when he's talking about drones it is reasonable to assume in that context that he's talking about babies. But you gotta understand who Hesiod primarily worshipped, his patron god was Zeus, or at least that's what we can gather by his writings Zeus did not care about women's rights he pretty much just banged everything on two legs whether the liked it or not and lot of times shaped like an animal while he did so to hide from his wife Hera who he Forced into marrying him. So in conclusion Zeus and Hesiod are both assholes who did not care about women and Zeus did not care about consent.
I like when people complain about “getting things wrong” when the whole point of these stories was oral tradition and the different speakers would add their own little twist to their stories. Intentionally changing little details to make the story more interesting to your audience is the whole point of mythology.
Preach
Some guy made it so that the gods looked like real assholes, like the myth of Arachne, she boasted that she was better than Athena at weaving, so they had a contest and when Athena lost, she was uncharacteristically was jealous
@@thatoneguy6142 Well there's a version of the story, I think was made by hesiod which tells the story of pandora, and how pandora's sexyiness distracted others from her cunning cleverness, and that's treated as bad thing, and also side note, apparantly women exist because they're evil acording to hesiod (take that with a grain of saltz)
nah fuck uncle david's version, fucker couldn't tell a condor from a blue jay.
Although it is an oral tradition, that does not make your comment exactly true. It was very important to NOT change things about the stories told and keep it as accurate as possible. I'm not saying there were no local variations at all, because there were, but implying there is a wide range of wild divergences is untrue. I keep seeing people saying "oh there are just so many different versions it's hard to keep up" which is a huge exaggeration. Most of the time you can count the different versions with one hand.
guys if you have an issue with reading or hearing about misogyny, forced marriages, and sexual assault, y'all should've chosen a different mythology to read about cause spoiler alert those are the three things Zeus is best at
This. It's like watching a horror movie and then complaining that it's scary.
@@thegreattotemaster not really. you can be into horror but pick and choose tone/subject matter depending on what you're feeling down for that day. ie if you're recently bereaved and wanna avoid horror where someone dies in a similar way or reminds you too much of your loss. same here, people can be into mythology but wanna skip if they're not feeling a topic one day.
it's a couple seconds of the video, really no big deal loool
Move fuu it raced marriages down 1 peg and put being a honey bastard in there
I guess you never read the old testament lol
Ok? You can still find the stories interesting, and also be critical of the bad parts of it.
I think the misconception with Hades and Persephone comes from the fact that she seems to like him back in the myths after the kidnapping,but honestly that doesn't make their marriage consented by her. Yes she showed jealousy of other women with Hades and love for him,but this is possibly the case at the time, many women probably had to learn to love their partners over time to survive and lead a good life (basically Stockholm ).Zeus and Hera also have some dubious consent to their myth and poseidon needed a dolphin to convince Amphitrite to marry him, also it doesn't help that some greek people committed kidnapping as a form of betrothal.Although hades is not the equivalent of a ''devil'' as some modern sources have made him to be and his relationship with his wife seems even relatively healthy compared to others, it doesn't change the fact that yes persephone did not consent to marriage at least in the older versions of the myth.
This is spot on.
From an Ancient Greek perspective, they might've seen their relationship as getting off to a rocky start, but ultimately it was a lawful union sanctioned by Zeus of all people. So obviously they'd end up being a good match.
But that doesn't make any of it okay by our modern standards.
Well atleast Hades to my knowledge was the least worst God (Morally) of the pantheon.
@@freezalo7521 Exactly( which shows how it's not a very high standard if he committed kidnapping and still ends up being the most ethical among the 3 brothers), but if I were to make a list of the ''most unproblematic gods'' Hestia and Prometheus definitively, but hades is kinda nice to if you think he only gives terrible punishment to... well people who have done terrible things.
@@freezalo7521 I would say second least, I believe Hestia is first but there's really no telling. Very few myths have survived of Hestia, so we can't accurately tell what kind of personality she had whether that was benevolent, violent, neutral or something else. Although based on the story of the attempted coup d'etat of Zeus, committed by Hera, Athena, Apollo and Poseidon, she was mentioned as to having abstained from aiding the other gods which tells us that she probably had more of a neutral outlook than anything else, or was at least cautious of the others.
@@JakeDoubleyoo kinda annoyed how everyone keeps bringing this up as the one thing that's good about Hades, I mean Cerberus can be translated to spotted thus Hades named his dog Spot
Don’t be hard on yourself man. As you said this is entertainment. People don’t tear things like God or War and Percy Jackson to shreds because they’re just somebody’s interpretation
I'm good. I realize most people get what I'm gling for with my cartoons. But I like the idea that they get people interested in actually learning about mythology, so I want to provide supplemental material that hopefully helps point people in the right direction for their research.
weineeerrr
*people actually do tear percy jackson to shred tho
Hate Percy Jackson. Should’ve made Athena single
That is NOT even remotely true. Have you seen the crap groups have given Kratos in God of War? Like how he's somehow a misogynist when he killed an innocent women in GOW3 strapped to chain device because it would allow him to continue? Despite the fact he has killed plenty of men who haven't done anything to him as well in just as many brutal ways but the moment he kills some innocent women only then people say he's gone to far?
Plus I have a few nitpicks about the Percy Jackson books as well (the movies don't exist to me).
I find the Medusa thing really funny because the trauma of assault can be worked through and processed with time but being turned into a hideous monster who can look at nobody ever again is probably more isolating lmao. Plus Athena literally helps a dude kill her later
Hmm now that you put it like that I wonder if that was also an additional layer to her story, as mythology has a lot of symbolism and meta textual narrative behind it.
Maybe the part about her becoming a hideous monster is a metaphor about the self loathing victims tend to feel in these situation that usually prevents them from confronting their assaulter
@@thecabbageman1 I don't think Ovid intended for that to be a metaphor, honestly, but of course if you want to interpret it as such it can work pretty well. In the end of the day, what we make of these stories is up to us.
"Can be worked through"
Yall who try to idk purify??? that myth really don't get inside your sjw heads that back then women were owned by men and if one was raped it was entirely her fault. You people really have to proceed that current world standards do not apply to ancient Greek mythos...
Especially when she was a mere temple maiden and he was a god- a divine being who's words were absolute. Someone refused his offer>he got mad>he blamed them because no one can defy him.
She could still look at people, the just couldn't look at her. You had to see Medusa to be turned to stone, where she was looking had no effect on anything. If I remember correctly anyway...
And they still act like Athena had "mercy" for medusa by turning her into a monster no one could look, I just don't understand their logic
Fun fact, the "Persephone actually went willingly with Hades to the Underworld" is a 1978 rewrite written by the author Charlene Spretnak who wrote the book "Lost Goddesses of Early Greece: A Collection of Pre-Hellenic Myths". Which was intended to make the mythology more palatable for her young daughters, since she didn't want to expose all the kidnapping and sexual assault.
I appreciate you for this very much. Many other content creators, when people mention their mistakes, go like "no I am not wrong there's just many versions" - and never mention what versions obviously.
Exactly, so many people try to justify their retellings but pointing out the diverse nature of ancient myths, ignoring how every information we have on ancient greek myths had to came from specific sources. No matter how many times you make retellings, nothing will change a source people already know about. If a god was mentioned only in the Theogony and nowhere else, then the Theogony is all we know about him, nothing else.
What I don't like with Ovid's Medusa tragedy and its modern interpretations is that Perseus is also beginning to be seen as an evil patriarchal figure who kills Medusa who's a rape victim, although I believe from the ancient Greeks' point of view Medusa was merely just a monster for Perseus to kill. Perseus' story actually already has an evil patriarchical figure, Polydectes, who sends Perseus to kill Medusa so that he could marry his mother.
Same. Perseus was one of those very rare cases of a Greek Hero not only being halfway decent, but actually being _nice._ Ovid's version kinda messes with that.
I actually have kind of a love-hate relationship with Ovid's tellings of mythology. On the one hand, he has this weird tendency to force long-winded backstories into things on top of his personal biases and I'll probably never forgive him for what he did to Hermaphroditos, but at the same time, he created my favorite version of Atalanta and Hippomenes' marriage (where Atalanta not only _genuinely_ liked Hippomenes, but actually laments that they may not be together because he'll lose the race...right before he cheats at the race to win her heart XD) and also created Iphis (Ovid's attempt at writing an anti-lesbian screed that failed because most modern readers interpret the character as a trans man instead).
@@CJCroen1393
Decent by modern standards, they were not exactly made for 21st century karens.
Wasn't Athena the one who gave Perseus his mirror shield so he could fight medusa? Kinda contradictory to say Athena helped medusa by turning her into a monster and then helping someone to kill her.
@@ruyman90 while not defending anything, you could also see it as putting someone or something out of their misery
@@CJCroen1393 Same. I also dislike Ovid's take on Caeneus, which in earlier depictions actually wanted to be a man, and Poseidon granted that wish in a more genuine manner and even made his skin invulnerable as an extra. It comes in sharp contrast with Ovid, who turns it into a rape story, as he does often, and Poseidon's "gift" is something he grants Caenis as a pity wish when she says she doesn't want any man to hurt her again. The implications this story has are just so bad like damn.
I really like how this video explains that no greek mythology isn't One Book that One Guy wrote once and then never touched on it ever again and in fact Something that evolved with time that had many people contributing. Also tbh I'm kind of mad how that point is so easily missed and now we have to deal with "Demeter was a bitch for not letting her daughter marry some old man that was also the girl's uncle" which is a surprisingly regressive take that a lot of modern retelling fall into trying to make Hades x Persephone be the most wholesome couple ever.
yeah hades is by far the most overrated god nowadays
Hades was antisocial so he didnt know how to aproach girls, and he came to zeus. It was all zeus he is the villain in this story
@@hakksemerci9988 yeah hades was a cute emo boy too right? Lol
@@kirbyfazendoummoonwalk9214 probably not cute but he's emo for sure. And I think he is depressed because he never leaves his home (his comfort zone)
@@hakksemerci9988 yeah and i bet you will say that his relationship with Persephone was perfect and apart from the Kidnaping it was 100% consensual?
I hate when people try to tell the "correct" version of Medusa and tell's Ovid's tale. I got in a fight with my english teacher about it once, because she said that Medusa had been raped and Athena transformed her as a protection, and I corrected saying that it was wrong, because I had read a translated version of Theogony and whole rape thing was a retelling by a roman poet with a seriously grudge against the gods and authority (no shade to Ovid, I love his Pygmalion). She refused to to admit I was right and kept presenting Medusa as a "feminist hero".
And as for Hades and Persephone, I once got into a tumblr fight because I asked which was the source that said Persephone went willingly with Hades, because I genuinely was interested in case there was a ancient greek version that actually went like this. Needless to say, there was no source and people got mad I questioned
I have no issue with people trying to reinterpret myths in ways that resonate with them better and make them more interesting, but some people's insistance that they are right and refusal to learn beyond that is frustrating. I see people on tiktok keep promoting the idea that Medusa was seen as a protector of rape victims in ancient Greece and that her image was used to denote women's shelters, even though the only story that potrays Medusa as a victim of rape is a Roman one (Ovid's) and the gorgoneion (which doesn't even necessarliy depict Medusa herself) is kind of a universal symbol that was used everywhere. There is no historical evidence that Medusa was seen as an empowering symbol for SA victims. It's great if this idea resonates with your modern values, and you want to get a Medusa pendant or tattoo as a symbol of strength and survival, I fully understand. But claiming that this is a historical reality doesn't work to legitimize your interpretation. There's nothing wrong with admitting a modern interpretation is a modern thing, you don't have to pretend it's the "original" to make it seem more real.
I think people get defensive for Persephone and Hades because they’re one of the most healthy couples in Greek myth. Heck I think there’s a comic about that couple.
The thing is they are probably complicated. Sure they ended up being healthy but, it doesn’t excuse the kidnapping. But i am living in 2022 and people back then thought differently.
I totally agree with your comment about Medusa. It’s a shame your teacher ignored you
This video gets explains things better
czcams.com/video/Ac5ksZTvZN8/video.html
@@moondivine2288 Healthy? Oh I forgot, falling in love with your emo captor is a thing on the internet
Preach Camila, honestly I agree with everthing you said
Yes!! I'm so happy someone points out that Demeter isn't just an overprotective, inconsiderate goddess!
I mean, she essentially punishes many people for something that is not their fault. So in context overprotective no, inconsiderate, maybe. But that's a trait shared by most gods.
@@bluesnake4626 Technically, she wasn't punishing anyone. She was just neglecting her duties because of her grief from losing her daughter. Yes, this did cause the Greeks to experience winter and kill their crops. But she wasn't doing it directly towards the mortals, she just couldn't process the fact that she allowed her daughter to have been kidnapped while under her care. And it wasn't as if she could have just gone to the Underworld and demand Hades return her since, most of the gods and goddesses were unable to go down to the Underworld unless they worked for Hades in a sense like Thanatos who was the Greek god of death and Hermes who helped guide the souls to the Underworld after they died.
The point of the Hymn to Demeter is that it's a representation of the misogony that the ancient Greeks were. Where they never took into account the consent of women when it came to their anatomy. And the hymn represented every Greek mother's worse fear: Being separated from their daughters against the mother's wishes and the daughter's wishes. And in many of those cases, due to time and location, the mother and daughter may not have been able to see each other again. So it may as well have been as if they were taken to the UnderWorld.
Now, many of the gods had their story or two to showcase how inconsiderate they were in terms of humans. But most of the time that was usually deliberately screwing over the human. Demeter did not intentionally starve the humans out of anger for losing Persephone. She was unable to keep up her duties because she was still grieving the loss of her only child.
@@cosmok-1367 After the half of the year deal, it was definitely just being a real daughter of a Titan move. Not producing any crops for humanity for something that wasn’t out fault
@@cosmok-1367that’s not “the point” of the Hymn to Demeter, nor is it even close to the point. It should be blatantly obvious why that proposition is an utter impossibility.
i have researched hades and persephone a lot, like too much, and i know there is a missing section of the hymn to demeter which is speculated due to context to be the part that describes persephones time in the underworld. anyways love that hades is the background character in his main story.
in ancient greek art the depiction of marriage and kidnapping was the same or very similar. it looks like a man pulling a woman by the wrist. just more evidence that they didn’t give a shit about women
People forget that Zeus, as the father of Persephone, gave Hades permission to kidnap her. The whole thing was a very chaotic arranged marriage
Putting the Theogony together was pretty much the same as putting the Zelda timeline together, but a thousand times worse. Hesiod set himself up to write one single story out of hundreds of local legends from many different towns and cultures, that worshipped many different gods over many centuries which saw multiple cultural shifts and didn't necessarily check with each other if their tales were coherent. The Theogony could only end up with a lot of plot holes and huge mischaracterizations as a result of mixing so many isolated stories. What could have started as individual villages commemorating an strong man's exploits by telling Zeus was secretly his dad, when all of those local tales get put together, really made Zeus look like the ultimate skirt chaser. Even though the Theogony is one of the most expansive sources of mythology, you gotta remember that it was still an undertaking doomed to be glitchy all over, and Hesiod's personal biases really didn't help its case.
Brian
David
Gilbert
It's similar to the Eddas. Everything indicates the sources are different from the original myths, but since there is no way to get access to those original myths anymkre, it's virtually impossible to know exactly how different the original beliefs were.
On the other hand, I usually have a more optimistic take on such scarce sources, as if it weren't for them, we wouldn't even _have_ ways to know about those ancient myths in the first place. It's much better to have an idea of History than to not have History at all; are we really going to get angry with ancient people for not using every single way to ensure every bit of their knowledge would be understandable by some random people born 3000 years after them? It's a miracle we know as much as we already do.
Dude, Greek Mythology is so complex and comveluded with so many interpretations and so much we don't know due to lost or missing information as well as there being a butt-ton to cover anyway you've been doing great, and like you said, it's more for entertainment, stuff like these can't be perfect and you pull it off extremely well in hillarious videos.
And with this all in mind you STILL took the time to address your 'mistakes' which is an extremely humble thing to do. Props man.
Thank you for making this video, it's nice to know that you actually read your comment section and are willing to fix any mistakes you made on your mythology videos as they actually had taught me way more than I thought I knew, and now this video has not only given more info with how detailed the video itself is but has reassured me that I can trust the credibility of them.
TLDR: Thank you for making mythology videos and putting the effort into making sure they're legit.
Also, Ovid loved to paint the gods as the bad guys, which he's not entirely wrong about. Both through modern lenses and the fact that people are looking it up and finding sources that say some things that are not so nice about the gods (seriously, how thirsty does one have to be to change into a swan just to get laid?) and all the gods seem to kinda be dicks (Overly Sarcastic Productiobs Red explains in one of her videos that due to Christian influence, many people have the notion in their head that god=good, which is generally not the case). In the Medusa myth alone, both look like dicks, Posidon raping her and Athena punishing the victim. Interesting stuff indeed.
and the Medusa get killed because a man wanted power. Poor medusa
I prefer the take that Athena transforming Medusa was to give her the power to defend herself even against the gods
…and that Perseus beheading Medusa in her sleep using a mirror shield Athena gifted him + Medusa having Gorgon Sisters was less Athena being “fickle” and more it’s a separate/incompatible myth, which isn’t uncommon for Greek Mythology. It’s all a bunch of “only related because Same Character(s)” wobbily stacked up with a trenchcoat thrown overtop with a bit of duct tape to hold it all together.
Like…really any myth that gets into a hero’s or god’s lineage…gets “time travel paradox??” Which obviously timetravel is largely a Modern Trope; the only Time Shenanigans ancient story that comes to mind are from the Bible and are…only two. One with the “sun standing still” if the guy could keep his arms raised, another with “shadows moving backwards up the temple steps” to prolong a king’s life. (If something similar exists in other cultures’ folklore and mythos…feel free to add-on. Also Capricorn Does Not Count-OSP Red’s already gone over the Capricorn “Myth”)
I think Overly Sarcastic must've misunderstood that timeline because the Greek/Roman pantheon was already losing influence before Christianity even came to be, the Romans themselves were already heading to monotheism via Sol Invictus.
From that perspective, I think most Roman would think the old pantheon were the biggest dicks regardless.
@@DOT107 I think you misunderstood. What the commenter meant, I think, it’s that us in the modern day think of God being good. In Ancient Greece that wasn’t the case. For better understanding it’s best to look up overly sarcastic videos for context. I think the one with that speech is their hades and Persephone video
@@anonymousfellow8879 of course I'd see this kind of answer here
7:43 Okay, I DESPERATELY need a source for the little gorgon on the yellow page thing there because it is ADORABLE.
Real
Am I only one, who thinks that interpretation of Gorgona where she's a a monster with sisters, healing blood and protective implications more, than "Athena just had a bad day"?
Y'know, I was thinking the other day about the story of Athena and Arachne. Arachne was displaying hubris, so, logically, Nemesis should have taken care of her. So why was Athena there?
Learning that said story was written by a Roman definitely explains that.
Well I wouldn't approach Greek Mythology with the mentality that there are hard-set rules for anything. Especially when it comes to the roles gods play in stories.
There are plenty of times gods punish hubris without Nemesis ever being mentioned.
Athena wanted to be Zeus' favorite child, obviously.
It was because Arachne claimed to be a better weaver than Athena, therefore insulting Athena herself.
As far as I know, Arachne isn't mentioned by Greek writers. Virgil and Ovid are the earliest writers to mention her, and Ovid is the one who tells her complete story.
I love Hades but a lot of Hades lovers don't want to admit he kidnapped Persephone. They'd rather read unsourced, poorly written fanfiction.
Greek girl here. If anyone had issues with the first videos.. Jesus they need to remember it's just humor. I personally laughed out loud at the Hestia bit. Lol.. campfire goddess.
And meh.. our history and mythology is so convoluted and comes from so many sources in the ancient Peloponnese and beyond its ok to make mistakes. Growing up we always had "ancient" (like 1930s) books that had Greek myths in them. They had the whole Medusa thing as her already being a monster who lived with her sisters in a cave and persephone was taken against her will but.. eh.. she and hades never strayed so all in all far better than of she had been taken by Zeus
I think most of the misconceptions of Greek Mythology come from Percy Jackson because literally every reading teacher forced us to read it.
Forced us? Honestly, I envy you being forced to read it. But yeah, a lot of misconceptions probably spawn there.
I loved Percy Jackson when I was a kid I can't believe rick roirdan is still pumping out books
What cool school was forcing you to read Percy Jackson. All my school forced us to read was stuff like The Giver or Fahrenheit 451.
I wish mine did that lol, the only time we ever got taught about greek mythology was in one single class and Everything my teached said was wrong (One of the Examples are that the teached said that The Krakken was Zeus,Poseidon And Hades Father)
@@kirbyfazendoummoonwalk9214 yikes. PJO is more accurate than *that* for sure
Thank you for paying attention to the comments and replying to them, being hellenic polythenic myself i understand not everyone is fully educated on this stuff (wich is ok) and i value that you took the time to make this and address the problems :)
Actually, In the homeric hymn to Demeter, Persephone was kidnepped by Hades' golden chariot.
She [Persephone] was filled with a sense of wonder, and she reached out with both hands
to take hold of the pretty plaything.[2] And the earth, full of roads leading every which way, opened up under her.
It happened on the Plain of Nysa. There it was that the Lord who receives many guests made his lunge.
He was riding on a chariot drawn by immortal horses. The son of Kronos. The one known by many names.
He seized her against her will, put her on his golden chariot,
And drove away as she wept. From Homeric Hymn to Demeter verse 15, Gregory Nagy Translation, University of Houston online text.
I don't think Medusa was a 'human' in Ovid's text. Most important, Minerva ONLY change Medusa's hair into snakes. So her body or face are still the same after all.
'Beautiful woman was turned into ugly monster' is not doubt a modern retelling.
It's not, didn't you see the vase? It's literally how was depicted at the time, a hideous monster with talons tusk teeth and wings, if anything beautiful gorgon only with snake hair is a today's thing
I am greek and i really like your videos all of them and i love the fact that you make them easy to understand for everyone everyone else is just hating
In greek mythology every myth has a different story based on where you live so nothing is wrong
keep up the great work
I kinda love this format of storytelling for you though. Telling the entertaining versions, and later laying down a few facts about it. Very nice
I thought the take on Hestia goddesses of camp fires was pretty funny! Keep up the amazing videos!
Chaos being the grandfather of the gods being grandfathered in is really funny
You are such an awesome animator and storyteller, I love what you do!! Don’t get bogged down too much by the comments I know they can be harsh sometimes but you’re awesome and you’re doing a great job
"Cat"
"Cat here now"
"Cat everywhere"
I think the reason why Hades and Persephone are treated as a "Wholesome" couple has two big reasons.
One is the obvious comparison made with Zeus & Hera; who are treated as a very dysfunctional marriage(even though there are several sweet stories between them), which is fair. But that's a very low bar to overcome.
Secondly, as long as my short knowledge goes, Persephone has more appearances as Hades's Wife than her goddess persona, and for what's worth, she doesn't gripe about being in the Underworld. Then again, I doubt any ancient Greek writers would've bothered to establish that.
In conclusion, Hades & Persephone is looked upon as "Wholesome" because their isn't much stacked against them, except for how it began(kidnapping), and as Hades gained more sympathy as time passed, his relationship was looked upon with better light as well.
Yeah, as far as I know, it’s mainly because
Other romantic relationships tend to be messy at best, and horrific at worst(Heracles, Zeus/Hera, Apollo)
And Hades being overall a pretty chill husband, and Persephone eventually loving and caring about him
@@kyellverdonschot9922what did Heracles do 😂
Thank you for showing exact story of Persephone. Shipping culture is out of control and weirdly misogynistic towards the mother when she is sympathetic in older stories
I really hope you talk about the Greek Medusa myth! Btw love your content :)
He did! In the perseus video
@@heyits_joanna yes I know- but that wasn’t the Greek version it was the Roman version
@@ikk1104I know that this comment is one year old but that is Greek mythology. In the video, medusa was born a Gorgon with the power to petrify people from Athena, he said that he only add the Roman thing because it is more interesting.
Lots of cool information in a short and easily understandable video, props to you!
So I'm assuming Hesiod didn't know that the drone bees are the dudes...
So, the algorithm landed me on a couple of your Norse mythology videos (probably because I spent to much time on YT and Thor: Love and Thunder is being marketed right now). But, it was this video that made me subscribe. Admitting any problems while naming sources makes me really appreciate a particular source of my eduTAINMENT.
Edu-tainment sounds like a genre to something.
Edu-tainment is a video game genre, Humongous Entertainment made a lot of them that I played in Elementary school
Jake doubleyoo your videos are funny and a simplified version for and to easily to digest all the Greek mythology good job of making these videos
I would love to see a video talking more about the Roman gods and how they were or weren’t related to the Greeks
I definitely will!
It's pretty complicated. Far from the popular idea that the Roman pantheon is just a copy/paste of the Greek gods.
At 9:45, it looks like Athena is pissed at Arachne for trying to grab food from his refrigerator lol
I thank you for correcting points that was wrong, but I feel like you didn't need to do so. as you said, your videos are mostly ment for entertainment, and I honestly believe that if children have seen them, it would definitely spark an interest in them, if they didn't already have it. you're just spreading the joy of learning around~
As a classicist I really appreciate your work but more importantly this video where you give corrections, not only to your faux pas but the crazy romanticizations of Greek mythology by some Percy Jackson fans.. Re: "the rape of persephone."
i love everything you make jake!
Hey :) I think you do a pretty nice job. You simplify in a funny way complexe constructs which helps a lot of people to get a certain degree of knowledge about a topic.
This comes from a history student. Like I said.. I really enjoy your videos. If someone wants to know more about certain topics - there are hundreds if not thousands of books about said topics. It is not up to you to inform everyone in a perfect way (which is btw imposible - history is subjective and can interpreted in multiple way - best example lovers or roommates ^^). You're more like a documentary which tries to emphasis on the part of joy and fun - which history really needs.
Anyway. Good job.
Unfortunately in Greece until recently weddings worked this way. and no women had no say in their choice of husband, they were married from a very young age to mens who could be much older than them and for the father, the only criterion for choosing the husband was the benefits that the family would gain in social and financial level.
I am not an antrophologist or anything like that, but isn't that how it is in a lot of countries (most?) and in those were women are more free and equal it was like that some time ago.
I think it depends on where the culture THINK it gets it's stability and safety: if it is the clan or tribe, women are more or less seen as an assett/value (not sure of the right word), as we are able to bear children, can work hard and are less likely to fight, especially after we'd children.
In an industrial and postindustrial society the stability and security are more seen as coming from the "society" itself, and women have in it better chances to have/get/acquire more equity.
/all this of course extremely simplified/
@@christinae30 yes (I am not ether)but in Greece 1: it lasted longer, in some places that is still the idea and 2: In contrast to many countries, in Greece women never acquired saying on the arranged marriages over time ...
That sounds very energy-taking!(I don't know the right English word), and hard! 💖💖💖
And it shows why these myths still talks to us
I love your videos man and for anyone wanting more detail videos on Myths with similar style to his try overly sarcastic.
I personally never understand why people find Demeter "overbearing" over Persephone - her daughter suddenly DISAPPEARED and the mother just went to looking her. I never saw any unnatural things in that. I bet if Persephone wasn't kidnapped and fell in love with someone on her own terms, Demeter would just give her blessing and let her daughter go. But Hades kidnapped her and so went on...
I also find startling that today Persephone/Hades are viewed by many as epithome of romantic love (when in most ancient version it was kidnapping) while Helen of Troy and Paris who INDEED eloped together are generally hated. (I know that there are versions where she was kidnapped, but in most versions Helen left beacuse of her love for Paris, and in "Iliad" which is the oldest known version she admits that she indeed abandoned her first husband, "followed" Paris, and later married him). So, we had a story of woman who in most versions desires her (second) husband... yet she and her Prince are nowadays viewed as selfish adulterers, while the story of Persephone, who was kidnapped AGAINST her will is widely romanticized... I can't understand people. 😑
Actually from the myths that I have read Demeter didn’t want Persephone to marry anyone. There were other gods that was interested in Persephone but, Demeter said nah and hid her daughter. She is a little overbearing because it would be nice if she did give Persephone some freedom. Hades wanted to marry Persephone so, he asked Zeus. Because he knew Demeter would say no he encouraged Hades to kidnap her.
I know it is complicated because Ancient Greece didn’t care about women’s rights. If you think about it Persephone was given into an arranged marriage without her mom being consulted. I can’t blame Demeter for acting as she did. I would like to think Persephone is eventually fell in love with Hades, she was given equal power and was feared more than Hades. People did call her dread Persephone. But i also acknowledge that putting modern standards up into past standards would bring up some issues.
I don’t know much about Helen and Paris. From what I gathered because aphrodite promised Paris the most beautiful woman she enchanted Helen to fall in love with Paris. This same goddess did make a daughter fall for her dad so, what happened to Helen shouldn’t be dismissed. I know eventually Helen returned to her husband, though I assumed after her enchantment was broken. This is a topic I probably should look more into
@@moondivine2288 I think that every "love" in Ancient Greece was enchantment - when Menelaso took Helen back, it was because he was "enchanted" himselfs by Aphrodite. (And possibly also, because he was king of Sparta only because of his marriage to Helen, so by killing her, he would trow away his crown.😆😆 Greeks saw erotic love as thing sent by gods and form of enslavement, which might give a pair happiness (because of them being together) or bring destruction (because some people don't want to couple be together).
Gods powers in mythology are tricky - they are powerful but they cannot change destiny. So it seems, Aphrodite could make Helen fall in love, only because that was Helen's destiny. If Aphrodite didn't intervene, Helen and Paris still would meet and elope, because that was in their Fate. (Or at least, I interpret this that way.)
I alway looked on that in symbolic way - love and desire ate so strong things that Helen viewed herself as 'enchanted', because she couldn't believe how much she abandoned and indirectly caused simply because of love for one man. She wasn't comepletly blind - in Iliad she stated she regret her escape. She still shared Paris bed on Aphrodite request - we can view that literally (that she was forced) or metaphorically - that despite all her regret and self-blame for war, she is still too deep in love with him to step back. That she would want to return to Menelaos and end war, but he can't get over her desire to Paris.
She admitted she escaped with Paris, so I think if she really wanted, she would escape now from Troy. But she decided stay, so I belive she still loved Paris after all.
But wheter you call it love or enchantment this wasn't broken - Paris died before Troy fell, so when Helen no longer had her lover, when Menelaos got her back. Helen married third husband, Deifobos, after Paris death, but she didn't love him, and according one version she killed Deifobos herself, during fall of Troy.
I don't know if Demeter hided her daughter from marriage to anyone - but I believe that such version might exist. But we should also ask: why she didi it? Maybe because Persephone was simply not yet ready to marriage? (Meaning she was "too young" - I know they're gods but whatever.) All that gods ask Demetr to Persephone - maybe Demetr wanted to Persephone fell in love first with some god or human.
I believe that in the end Perspehone indeed fell for Hades and was in someway content with marriage, but I still think that begginng of that relationship is problematic and people too much romanticize that couple in modern days.
I watch these because I already know all these myths but it’s fun to see them explain from another angle and maybe I would learn something that I didn’t know before or just something really funny
Actually, Zues is the dad of some 2000's kid who stole lightning.
-Source, Dude trust me
I've always known that your videos are for entertainment, so I never mentioned the 'inaccuracy' of the mythology. Because like, I could somehow tell. Somehow. But really, I love your videos. It's hilarious and accurate when it comes to Zeus! X'D
the story of Hades and Persephone that I knew was that, Hades DID kidnap her, but after a bit persephone fell in love with him and wanted to stay, so when Demeter came to reclaim her, Hades had her eat the pomegranate so she could stay
Your nose mythology videos makes my history class boring, and I love it.
Your videos couldn't be any better, it's like a miracle
I think the trope where Kronos was totally diced and chucked into Tartarus was the story of Osiris. Where HE was chopped into dice by his son and later resurrected.
Just by doing this video, you’ve put yourself far above so many other content creators. I mean, I already personally found your videos to be more entertaining and reliable than so many other creators’. I appreciate that you made the effort to actually read primary sources for your videos, which as you said are edu-tainment, but that doesn’t take away from the fact that there is genuine effort to research the myths first before presenting them in your unique comedic and artistic style.
(Okay, so I’m going to be a bit salty about this for a while, but some time ago in a livestream reading of Lore Olympus by The Mythology Guy, I commented that the whole “Persephone went to that underworld all on her own” thing was absolutely not true, and The Mythology Guy straight up said I was wrong and that it was the oldest version of the myth. I like the guy, his sketches can be funny, but I wish he had done his actual research so he wouldn’t make such an incorrect statement to his wide audience.)
On a side note, it’s kind of debatable on how to categorize modern Hellenic polytheism, as it doesn’t have an unbroken tradition from the ancient times, meaning that it isn’t a natural evolution of the past religion. So many aspects and rituals of religion from back then are unknown, and ironically a source for understanding it may be from examining traditions of Greek Christianity, which probably absorbed many things from the polytheistic traditions. So on that point, I wouldn’t say you were exactly wrong, as the polytheistic religion of today is an attempt at a reconstruction, but not the same as it was in the past.
Man don’t be harsh ! The Greek mythology is a long lore , some of it as you said adapted , I discovered through Herodotus accounts crediting gods like Poseidon, Athens and Libya to ancient modern day Libya , with more lore , culture, practices like The virgin fight festival I would love to collaborate to help
Just found your channel, and love it
Hestia is one of my favorite goddesses, specifically because she represents the value of domestic duties, and by extension the hospitality that was considered a key part of the culture in Ancient Greece. And I liked the campfire joke 😊
The shelf in the background not being level is killing me
I really like this type of video as it allows you to continue to make silly videos that are mostly accurate while explaining the full truth in a more educational way
You are great your videos are really good i hope your Channel will grow
Love you're channel brother
Good video Jake. You just got yourself a suscriber! :D
Jake do be rocking that beanie tho
Honestly there are a lot of sources that mention that there were a lot of mortals in Greek mythology that were punished unfairly in some way. I for one would love to see a musical about all of them coming together as a support group.
Jake and mythology guy should make a crossover
this
They both should also crossover with Overly Sarcastic Productions.
@@CJCroen1393 YES
i love the way how his head moves whenever he starts explaining
Cat in the corner staring at me just disappeared!
man needs to get verified. such a great channel
Thank you for this videos. Greek mythology is very interesting!
SO cool that you made this kind of video
I think the origin story of Medusa where she and Poseidon got busy was created by a woke poet, and I think it was the same guy who made Athena uncharacteristically jealous of Arachne
I think they did got busy because Pegasus and Chrysaor is their kids. But she was always a Gorgon. Athena never cursed her.
You are correct about Arachne, but to declare Ovid "woke"... I mean, come on, what the frick
This should be in the Mythconceptions playlist
I like how he admits that he messes up and doesn’t try to claim that he is right all the time
I think it's interesting to make a distinction between fanfiction and mythology. Unless you're a practicing Hellenist, I think we can all agree that these stories were all made up by someone at some point. They all began as fanfictions. Their legitimacy of a story comes from its incorporation into the body of stories told by practitioners of the religion. This is why many of the stories of the Norse gods are contradictory, because individual poets were adding to the work without consulting each other. Stories composed after others may reference or incorporate their ideas, but there are still stories that are clearly composed by independent authors. Snorri tries very hard to mash all the narratives into one cohesive storyline, but it's not easy for him.
I think there are parallels to be drawn here, too. If a story about the gods were composed by a Greek Hellenist in 100 AD, that doesn't make it any less valid of a Hellenistic myth than one composed in 900 BC, unless your actual goal is to find the most archaic version of the religion. While understanding how the religion evolved and changed over time is valuable from a historical perspective, the older stories aren't "truer" than newer ones.
The whole idea that Persephone willingly walked into the underworld can be traced to a book published in 1978 called "The Lost Goddesses of Ancient Greece" where a woman rewrote the greek myths to make them more palatable for her young daughter. The book itself cites no actual sources, primary or secondary, and so it's largely seen as made up. The more likely theory behind the story is that the Greeks needed a way to get Persephone into the underworld to be a Chthonic Goddess, so they just had the new Chthonic God in charge to kidnap/marry her.
I shall Comment for the algorithm, (also maybe do Heracles next as his tale is really interesting) and finally Hi
When I read the Homeric Hymn to Demeter it kinda felt like the blame was on Zeus obviously Hades isn’t good but Hades goes to Zeus for her hand in marriage
I love videos ignore them your doing a great job bro keep it up
another great video. keep it up
I'm open for artistic license on things. What's driving me crazy is whether or not your shelf and pull-up bar is level...
You missed the part where Hades said he'd do whatever he could to make Persephone happy and she'd be queen of queens
At 9:43 IT LOOKED TO ME LIKE arachne was reaching for the fridge
they are funny no doubt. but I watch them for educational purposes and quote your statements a lot, so please don't misinform for future videos.
I love watching all your videos and them being animated makes it easier for me to grasp information. btw thank you for all the hard work you put into them, they are really entertaining.
2:03 actually the deep dark of the night. Like imagine a hole in the ground that goes really deep but you can't see the bottom because of the darkness that starts form the midle of the hole , this is erebos
Love the pull up bar jake 💪💪💪💪
For me this is scheduled for 12 am
AMAZING
I love the cat in the back round
Im waiting for this amazing video
So fun fact sometimes has he is also referred to as the god of fire which I assume that was one of her titles before Hephaestus was born I haven't done much research but seems interesting
"I'm looking at you, Rickie."
He is filming on his kitchen setup how a legend
The chronos chopped to pieces might be from the osiris myth in ancient egypt myths. I believe he was chopped up and spead around the nile area to fertilize the earth(and stop his revival)
I suppose it could also be a repetition of what Kronos did to Ouranos.
The funny thing is that I am Greek and I don't think we ever made another myth about Medusa then the other one where she was killed I know that's because for some reason in Greece the first thing we know and learn from history class is myths and the 12 gods and from what I can tell there not many myths so some of them are made up but then again you did nice job making making them into videos so yeah 👍
Ps I think it's funny that the people who complain in your comments probably aren't even Greek
I love how there is a cat just chillin in the window behind you lol
Ovid editorialised earlier myths to make the gods seem harsher and more unfair
I think the chopping of Kronos thing was actually conflated(not sure thats the right word but w.e) from Egyptian mythology
"I'm looking at you Ricky" As someone who read all of the Percy Jackson books and have been a fan since i was really young, I laughed so hard