Ep. 8 - Subwoofer Setup | Stop losing OUTPUT! Gain matching | Home Theater Gurus!
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- čas přidán 30. 09. 2019
- How to properly gain match your subs so each sub is pulling its fair share for the most overall output. Subwoofer Setup step one. Move on to ep 7 for REW alignment or 9 for Subwoofer Setup Basics. Home Theater Gurus
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Great video, thanks for sharing the knowledge
@Van Alfred 🤔 why would you wanna do that?
I’ve probably learned more from your videos than I have in the last year about HT and I’ve watched a lot of videos and did a lot of reading. You use 3 aspects of teaching (explanation, visual, and demonstration) which proves to be quite effective. Thank you for making this channel.
Thanks! I'm no teacher and definitely not made to be on camera so it's good to know they're helping.
@@hometheatergurus Nah some chicks dig the bald look. And you have the gun show goin on, so all good mate.
@@herewegoagain404 thanks! 😂
@@hometheatergurus You teach very well in my opinion.
So greatful to stumble across this & episode 7. 👏👏
Have two new subs coming in a couple weeks and just received my umik-1 and downloaded REW . Thanks for all the good info !!
Your videos are knowledge bonanzas... I am learning a lot from them. And it is helping great deal in doing my own room corrections. Thank you very much and hats off to you for taking time and sharing your knowledge with the all.
Thanks Manoj!
God I love your videos and the empathy in your face and expressions in moving your 100 lb. + subs to gain match them properly 🤣. Thank you for all the work you've put into this series. Your definitely my hero for this year for sure !!
Thanks Diamond! You know many of my videos I worry are gonna suck but thankfully they still seem to be helpful. Thanks for the kind words!
I been playing with calibrated 🎤 and REW for a few days. I finally set it up nicely on my position. Then I decided to move microphone 🎤 to 2nd seat next to me. Measurements were all over the place. Just 3 ft makes a huge difference in my basement
Thank you, this was exactly what I was looking for. You made this very easy to follow. Great job!
Thank you so much for posting this video tutorial! I've literally transformed my room by applying the steps here and in Episode 7. Thank you so much! You've definitely got another subscriber from me! You ever in Philly, you've got a beer on me!
Awesome ! These are the comments that make the videos worth it!!
Great video. Super helpful.
I have 2 extremely different subs 1) a Paradigm PS1200v.3 ported 12" and 2) a Martin Logan Dynamo 700 sealed 10". I followed your excellent directions very closely making sure to place each sub in precisely the same location over and over.
It took several tries to find a test tone that both was not in a room mode and was "representative of overall response". I thought I had it at 53 Hz; but eventually found that gain matching at 75 Hz gave me the best alignment across the majority of frequencies from 23 Hz (the tuning point of the PS1200) to 100 Hz. It's impossible to align the ported and sealed subs below about 30 Hz. Surprisingly the tiny 10" sealed sub has increasing output (with a sine wave sweep) below 31 Hz.
I guess the point of my post is to share that if you have very different subs, you should keep experimenting with test tone selection when gain matching until you get "best alignment" across a range of frequencies (not just at one frequency).
Thanks very much! You taught me awesome information which I didn't know before! Excellent!
Thanks for all the great videos! You indicate place all the subs in the same location for gain matching. If this were impossible due to the fact that one sub is in a permanent location in a closet as I didn't want a 12 cubic foot box in the room, where should I place my other subs for gain matching? In front of or next to the permanent one would be my first choice. Btw the wall is cut out so the driver is firing into the room. Thanks again.
Thanks man for this update from Ep 7 nicely done.
No problem. I screwed up not including it.
I think I'm missing the point. If you place the second sub in the same position and set it to match the first sub, wouldn't the output change if you place the second sub in a different location? I have dual SB-1000 pro subs, one outputs greater than the other due to its placement.
Very enlightening, thank you! Regarding the alternate to place the mic at the sub vs move the sub.........I have a front facing driver and a floor facing driver (SVS PB-2000) . Is the mic placement a viable approach with the floor firing sub and if so how place the mic. Thanks.
Awesome video Steve. Question, when doing this with umik do I change the file to noun 90degree file? I do know when measuring from mlp you select the 90 degree file.
Ughh, thanks for the videos I guess, you've now completely sold me on the mini dsp hence the ugh and I guess. At least they're not too expensive but I thought I was done spending money on my low end. I hope mini dsp cuts u some checks fellas. Good job
If you have to measure your subs with the umik1 close up to the cone if you can't move your subs around in the room - do you have to change the calibration file in REW to the non-90 degree calibration file? Or just leave it on the 90 degree calibration file? Thanks!
Great content on your channel👍🏽..I just subscribed. Can you tell me which plugin you are using on your MiniDSP? I have a MiniDSP( not the HD or the balanced unit, just the original MiniDSP ), and use the 4 Way Advanced plugin. Is there a better plugin that I should be using? I run four subs, all different than one another.
My current plugin doesn’t let me make use of the two sub preouts on my Marantz SR7013 AVR, which I would like to do, it only allows for one input to be used. Is the plugin that you use in this video only available on the MiniDSP HD? Thank-you for your help.
I can't believe I've never thought about this. I've just been letting Audessy do the matching.
Do we need to do anything different for a back firing sub like the M&K MX 5000? It also has two 12" drivers in push and pull configuration.
Planning to use my PSA S1512 near field and to add a PSA S3012 on front. The S3012 is essentially a “double” version (dual woofer and twice the amp power). Would you gain match the smaller sub higher or leash the bigger sub down? I guess the smaller sub being near field won’t need to work hard anyway and bringing things down is protecting the hardware in a way? Thanks your your videos!!
Stacking 3 subs on top of each other, kinda like a DIY version of the REL 1508 predator stack. 6 subs in total, all fed off 3 XLS2002’s. Do I gain match each sub, or gain match each stack against each other? Same boxes, same drivers (SI SQL15’s on order) same power, 1050w @2ohm to all 6. Thanks and great videos.
this is a very informative video. Can REW be used to level match multiple sub or must it be done with an SPL meter? I own 4 SVS PB 2000's and A SVS SB 4000 Ultra, but I'm curently only using the Quad PB 2000's. My room is rectangular and i have two SVS PB 2000's stacked in the front left corner and two in the front right corner. I Just purchased the mini DSP HD and the Umik-1 mic. I would like to know if level matching is necessary for matching subs? Since my subs are sitting in the front left and right stacked, would i need to invert any of them using the mini DSP HD? My current Avr has parallel outputs, but in the near future I'll be upgrading to an AVR or Processor with independent Sub outputs, so that i can integrate my SB 4000.
Thank you for getting back with me trying to set my subs up. So is gain matching the first thing I want to do. I have 2 subs on the same wall one is a svs pb 16 and a pc 4000. It’s a down firing sub. Yes I can’t move them they are 2 big. In your video you said put the mic 6 inches from the driver. Then play a tone. I’m sorry but what is a tone. Is that the sound on rew when you do a reading.
If so where would you put the mic for my svs pc 4000. Would you just put the mic 6 inches from the speaker as you would do the pb 16. Remember the pc 4000 is a down firing sub , so the driver is on the bottom of the speaker
Really appreciate these videos! Probably a dumb question, but I'm building 2 devastators which will be running off a single channel of a 2 channel amp (at least for the time being). Do I need to gain match these since everything is identical? Thanks!
Great explanation.
I've 4 subwoofers going into my new room. 2 of them will be wall mounted passive dual 10" subwoofers behind the screen and 2 will be powered sealed 12" at the rear of the room. How would I go about gain matching them?
Are you gain matching at the listening position or gain matching the subs to each other . In you example, the rear sub is closer to your listening position than your front sub so it will play louder at the listening position if it’s gain is matched to the front sub.
I have a dual sub setup at my front left and rear right. The rear right one is very near to me (next to the couch). I did this gain matching and then EQ my subs as with Ep. 7. The sub closest to me became too loud, to the point that I can hear/feel it coming from the direction of where it is. So I reduced the near field sub gain by 3db and EQ them again. They sound more natural and non-directional now. Has anyone encountered the same issue?
Hahahaha this guy is the bob ross of home theater videos 😂🤘🏼 good stuff
😂 Maybe you're one to something. I just need a big wig so I can get that fro going!
That's high praise.
Simple question. If using 2 of the same subs, like SVS. Using the digital app and setting the subs to the same gain level in the app would do the same thing right ?
I have four matching JBL.Powerbass10 subs. My room is 14' x 24' x 7' almost exactly 2000³ feet.
The driver is floor loaded and the port side loaded. As far as the setup goes my system spans the long wall and I prefer aesthetically pleasing because I'm married for 33 years and the benefits outweigh the costs of powered subs being placed where the performance is tweaked to the nth degree.
That being said, does the direction of the port master at all in sub placement when the driver is hiring level loop carpet that is glued to the concrete floor? Would it be advisable to make a solid acrylic (think corian countertops) plinth under each sub for better dispersion? I don't know how sound waves perform especially at the lower freqs. I could literally make some 4" thick slabs and cut a parabolic some on the CNC if I thought it would net results. Your opinion means a lot and I have a lot to learn. Subbed this channel for sure!
I have both my subs at either side of the tv, how do I gain match them, do I pull one out to a spot in front of the listening area, measure it then the second sub, then put both back into place? Am I on the right direction.
If I had veins popping out of my biceps, I'd probably tell people to move their heavy subs around as well, LOL! Nah, I kid. Good stuff . . .now, back to Ep 7 . . .again!
Haha.. Last time I moved mine in the theater I ended with a hernia... True story. Sadly... Haha
Interesting. So when I play the tones on my subs and get them both to hit 80db...what am I doing? Is it not the same as this?
Oh and both of my subs gain are at half way.
On my receiver my left sub is at -4.5 while my right is at -2.0
Also my left speaker is about 13.1 feet from listening position while my right is 13.5 feet
Nicely done thanks, I have 4 Klipsch subs 2 12” SPL120 and 2 RW12d, the 2 12” spl 120 are at the front of the room and the RW12d are at the rear of the room, my Marantz SR 8012 has 2 subs pre outs using 1 pre out with a splitter for the 2fronts and second preout with a splitter for the rears. The avr is set to mono for the subs, is this the best way to go?
Thanks. Its definitely not the best but to really improve requires you to dig into ep 7. And yes it's very worth it!
so if you don't have a mini dsp. should I gain match my 2 subs like in this video
and then run ypao?
What if you have multiple subs running off one amp getting the same signal
Should I ajust the SPL of my speakers with white noise or pink noise?
If I'm level matching all speakers to -75db. Should I use my Umik-1 or my digital VLIKE Sound Level Meter?
Just curious, I gain matched my two subs and one needed to be bumped 7db. Is it normal when looking at the output volume for that sub and it be a few db higher compared to the other because I had to boot it by 7db? Or should both look like they are outputting the same level?
My subs are built into the attic, there are four of them, Infinite Baffle manifolds with 2 x 18” drivers. They are located a 1/4 into the room as dr floyd recommended. My main seating position is just forward of the rears. I’ve set each one to 75db from listening position.
Good layout. Ep 11 actually explains the science behind why that layout works and what exactly it does. I used to run IB subs at one time. Lots of fun.
@@hometheatergurussetting four subs in their final place to be 75db independently at MLP is different to this video.
My question is, is it best to gain match multiple subs when the subs are in their final places spread throughout the room (like @firmbutton6485).
Or like in this video. Where each sub is gain matched in the same location in the room which will probably mean when subs spread throughout the room are no longer gain matched at the MLP?
🤔
@@MrOkcyurwinAlso confused about this now - if I set each sub to 80db in the same spot in the room and then move them to different places, from MLP each sub might measure 65/70/75/80 for example at MLP which seems odd to me?
@@HomeTheatreUK-oo4he what I find suits my equipment and doesn't leave me constantly thinking I'm doing something wrong is:
Set each individual subwoofers gain control to 80-90%. As long as it's higher than you are ever going to need while that sub is being pushed hard in the complete system.
Connect all 4 subs to a minidsp, and place the subs around the room in their final places.
Volume match at the MLP (75db each speaker) using the individual gain adjustments in the minidsp.
Finally, level check all four subs playing together at the MLP, using the “input gain“ slider in the minidsp. This brings down the for subs increased volume down to 75db.
This way all subs are running well within their own limits with enough power on hand for any dynamic surges that will come up.
If you find one sub is lacking then simply increase all four subs at once via the input gain via the minidsp.
Also, we tend to over think stuff.
What we are doing is making sure all subs will have enough wattage when things get tough. Just go high on all the subs own gain/volume setting and then tame it down in the minidsp.
Any adjustments are done in one place in the minidsp and you don't ever need to touch the subwoofers again 👍👍
@@HomeTheatreUK-oo4he u have to correct it in your dsp.. but i think u also have to make a sweep when u are aligning the subs in the same position, u dont want be close at a "null" doing your spl measure.. when placing the subs at proper position, do another sweep of each sub, and correcting the average loudness level in the frequency range of 30 to 80hz on the dsp on 1 sub front or if u have 4 also one in the back....
Thanks for another helpful video - and as after watching Episode 7, I have questions.
1. I have 2 down firing and one front firing ported sub. You indicated putting the mic right in front of the drivers. My SVS cylinders are down firing with the ports at the top and have a plate on the bottom below the driver. Must I disassemble them and lay them on their side or is there another way to address this. FWIW the front firing is a much more capable sub than the 2 cylinders that are pretty evenly matched and it's ports are on the front of the sub below the driver.
2. If there is not an option other than removing the plates from the bottoms I assume I would have to elevate them so that the drivers would be the same height off the floor as the front firing sub no?.
3. One cylinder and the front firing sub are native 20 Hz tune. The other cylinder is native 25 Hz but can be tuned to 20. Assuming I'll be employing a Mini DSP and Audyssey should I tune the 25Hz sub down to 20 to match them as most conventional approaches suggest or leave it at 25 so it's operating (assumably) optimally within it's native range?
4. . Having 3 subs and a challenging space I was going to attempt an Earl Geddes approach for placement. Any opposition to this or alternatives you'd suggest? Geddes work is really the only substantial reading I've found on 3 sub configurations. FWIW the room is 13' x 21' x 8'. Yes - I'm backward. I have no option but to have the mains along the long wall.
Thanks again for another great video. I hope I haven't worn out my welcome with all of the questions. I just don't want to find out I've made the wrong choices down the road after aligning - EQing - Audyssey. I know it will take time but I"m trying to ensure it's the last time I'll do this for a while.
In the same situation and like an answer to this question.
My main listening position is a few feet closer to my rear sub than the fronts. They are all identical make and model. I spl matched them to the mlp before time aligning. Was that wrong? Should I have left them just gain matched and reading a different spl at the mlp instead?
If I gain match different model subs in location A, when I place them in their final position a,b,c before time aligning, they will have different spl readings at mlp. This is the right way?
With 2 matching subs with 1 having a longer wire run than the other, will that sub need a bigger gain to compensate for the extra resistance in the wire?
Doing this Friday (ep7 and ep8). Do I run Audyssey first then do ep8 and ep7? BTW, I have 2 identical subs...Elac Debut 2.0 sub3010 and they only have an app and in that app it has volume and gain.
I was looking for a little advice. Equipment: Emotiva RMC-1L, MiniDSP 2x4HD, 2 SVS PB2000 Subs, DIRAC room corrections. I Did the alignment, and then ran the DIRAC room corrections software. It seems off. I’m concerned the EQ from the DIRAC is messing with the MiniDSP alignment. I put in a house curve for the miniDSP, but it doesn’t seem to do anything at the lower volume settings, as opposed to before the MiniDSP, I had a Harmon curve in the DIRAC EQ and the low end came through nicely at lower listening levels. any Help would be great. What am I doing wrong.
I must be doing something wrong. I’m using the tone generator in REW and I’m playing a 50htz tone and I get 85 dB on sub 1. I then remove sub 1 and put sub 2 in its place and I read 85 dB, but when I adjust it in the mini DSP for sub 2 on output 2 nothing happens in real time. Only when I adjust output 1.
Have a small doubt, we should gain match the subwoofers after or before audyssey?
Man u got lot of AV knowledge 👍 Today I learned some good things about gain matching.Thank u very much for sharing the knowledge.
You're welcome. I'm really glad you found it helpful!
Man I wish I found your channel years ago. Any advice for gain matching with an IB set up (4 drivers that can't be moved) and dual subs?
Great videos, very informative. I have two subs that have different tuning frequencies (SVS PC2000 is tuned to about 17 Hz and a Monolith 15 that is configured to 14 Hz). Should I configure the Monolith to be tuned closer to 17 Hz, or is having one sub at 17 Hz and one at 14 Hz ok as long as they're gain matched?
Thanks!
Yep that's perfectly fine. I would just gain match them using either a tone or pink noise then when you set the high pass filters per episode 7 you'll just set each one at a frequency to protect the sub on that channel. So one output you'll want to roll off at 17 and the other around 14.
How are you measuring hz. Are you using your digital volume level on a sub.
I have 2 of the new SVS PB-1000pro subs, which have a digital gain control, is this step still necessary? if I can go into the app on both Subs and set both to the exact same gain level?
Can we use the SPL on REW to gain match the subs?
Hey bud. I probably went this with one one of your episodes. But I have 2subs with one output (wired together internally on my Denon) not good. Lol. But what I forgot to mention is one of my subs is wireless and of course the other ones wired, if I do Odyssey EQ would it be better if I hardwired the other one? One is Directly behind our sitting area, and the other one 12 foot behind the TV. I tried to get a match him like you said in episode eight, but the one behind the couch is blowing my freaking head off. So of course I turn the game down and it does sound better. When you get a moment, just tell me what you think. Thanks for all your help again bud. I hope your house is doing well. Ps. Really ridiculous question coming. But where do u buy your v- neck tee’s?peace man!!
Thanks for the video, and the whole series, it's a fantastic help. One question:
I have 4 sealed subs for my room. 2 15" in the rear corners, and 2 18" in the front corners. I put larger in the front because they're further from our seats. I wasn't expecting to gain match all 4 subs (left and right yes), I thought I'd have the fronts playing a bit louder, before then time aligning them all with the miniDSP, as per episode 7.
Are you saying that I should limit the SPL of my 18" subs to match the 15", or should I allow the 18s to go a bit louder (because they can, and they're further away)?
Many thanks
As I understand it, they should be gain matched so they're outputting the same spl with the same input from the receiver when placed in the same location in the room.
@@kaufmanat1 Yeah, that's what the video's saying. But I don't like it. If one sub is bigger/more powerful than another, why limit it? The subs will be aligned to get the best overall performance anyway, and then EQ'd (as per episode 7).
I have a miniDSP 2x4. Is it normal that it reduces my sub volume by 10db vs the tone directly from my Onkyo??
I have one 15" sub in the front and two 12" subs against the couch. the two 12" subs are daisychained how should I messure them?
Great Video Thanks
Thanks!
I have def tech 8060 towers and a single PB-2000. The subs in the towers roll off at 40 hz. Would it be beneficial to match them all using a 50 Hz tone. The subs in the towers just have a volume knob and not a true gain knob. Thoughts?
Yep a 50hz tone will work fine. As for the volume knob it's really a gain knob (input attenuator) some companies have just labeled them as volume. The setup is explained in the sub set up episode.
Great video! Quick question though. If I'm placing a third sub nearfield right behind my listening position, will I still leave the sub behind me playing at a higher level since it will be gain matched with the two subs from farther distances away? And would this lead to localization issues or other negatives? Thanks man!
I need this answer!
I’m in the same situation and ended up spl matching my subs to the main listening position.
After aligning and eq I have a beautiful blended slope.
I just wonder how it would differ if I left them gain matched instead. Don’t really want to redo everything but might have to go get my answers!
We need this answer!!:o
Hi Steven. I've gain matched the plate amp on my 2 identical subwoofer. Now the 2 subs are in different locations (1 is much closer to me than the other and my Yamaha pre/pro has independent sub outs). I am not using the minidsp but was wondering if each of the sub channels should have a different level setting in the pre/pro because of their location?
I have the same question, did you find an answer?. subs are gain matched at the one location, but what happens when you return them to their original location (back of the room, far corner, etc.)
So do you do this before or after running Audyssey? If before, do you then ignore Audyssey telling you to adjust gain to get in the green zone?
(All based on not having a minidsp)
I have 4 subs 2 pc 2000 and 2 pc13 ultra so do I need just to level match 1 of each in the same spot and just put the same settings on the other 2
Do I run my AVR's calibration before or after gain matching both subs?
What about stacking subwoofers? I'm about to do that since I don't have room in my condo to put a second sub anywhere else. I just bought a slim Dayton Audio 1000L that's going to be laying flat making it down firing and I'm going to have my ported front firing sitting right on top of it. Both are 10 inch 100 watts but different make and model. Thoughts?
You can stack and the gain adjustments would still need to be matched. Just be aware you'll lose the benefit of multiple subs if the subs are stacked with no subs anywhere else. See the episode on sub setup and room modes for an explanation of multiple sub setup and why and how it works.
Where do you set your gain to start? Once you've gained matched them do you never touch the gain again? I say this because I currently like my gain on the subs at - 10 and my AVR trim /level at - 11.
That was my first question as well. If you're using subs that have built-in plate amps, what's the best gain/volume to set those at before you start?
Hello, I have two identical PSA subs. Does the gain knob on each sub have to be placed identical or if one HAS to be set higher or lower because one sounds lower than the other, does this mean the lower sounding sub is bad?
What about the level in the receiver? Once you run Audyssey, it will adjust the levels of all speakers to one another, and you don't want the sub gain to be to low or high so that it drags the other speakers up or down. Any tip on how to deal with that in an easy way?
I cover this either in this episode or episode 7. Audyssey will have you set the overall level at the beginning of its setup. If it needs adjusting and you have a mindsp you can adjust the group of subs on the input. If the subs aren't on a mindsp you must adjust them on their Amps and recheck gain matching.
Great video. I have 2 subs- 1 x12" rear port and 1x8" down-firing. The 8" (Definitive Tech 400 series) sub has a built in crossover (so only a gain knob on the back) @ 140hz. Will this 8" sub create issues for tuning these 2 subs together or will my minidsp HD be able to manage this? Wondering if i should ditch the 8" and get a proper 2nd sub sub with dials on the back? Cheers
You can definitively use it to fix issues with the other sub but yeah it'll struggle to keep up especially down low. Of course a lot depends on your listening levels. I'd probably set a filter on it around 30hz or so to keep it from killing itself trying to keep up down low. A more similar sub is definitely not a bad idea. That said I'd definitely use it for now as it can be very useful if it can fix some issues in the other sub.
@@hometheatergurus thanks for the feedback!
I can set those filters in the mini dsp correct?
I've only just set my umik-1 up yesterday and been running some mukti sub tests in room. Yet to actually use dsp though as I'm just getting familiar with testing. I did notice on rew the DT 8" sub was very wonky down low around 20 to 35hz then kicks in solid around 37 38hz. My bic f12 jumps striaght up around 22 to 25hz to 85 odd db.
Really appreciate what your doing here in your video series. Learning a ton. You inspired me to upgrade my speakers, get a umik and minidsp. Thanks! The wife is a little upset though... have cables hanging out everywhere in the family recroom lol 😂
@@hometheatergurus Hey buddy. OK... I now have 3 subs set up in my HT. An 8", 10" and 12". You mention setting a filter for the 8" so it wont kill itself on the lower frequency. Trying to figure out how to do this in the 2x4 HD. How do you set the filters? I have the 8" setup on the 3rd output.
I am just about to build the curve and start EQ of my 3 combined subs. Fun stuff! As always really appreciate your videos and feedback. Cheers
@@ScottMcGregor1 hey Scott, I explain setting filters in ep 7. It's probably 3/4 into the video.
I’m confused, why use DSP? Can’t I just adjust everything in the receiver? (Yamaha A2070)
so shortly, this video is for you, if you have different brand subs or different models/sizes..? But if you have same brand and size, then just turn the gain knob to the same, and your all set?
I discuss this situation in the video. Its advisable to confirm they're matched but they "should" be OK set up the same if they're identical subs
In a two driver enclosure, when measuring 1 driver, the combination of both drivers should be +3DB, theoretically.
With loudspeakers yes. With subs it's up to 6db every Doubling z depending on room gain. For instance in my room with 2 subs, I gain around 5db.
dumb question alert: how do i measure the volume of a down-firing sub. do i try to put umik-1 under sub, or turn sub on its side?
put mic in the port
for 2 SB-2000, do I chose pink noise or frequency ? if they are identical, adjusting the gain one is enough?
Pink noise is fine. Just make sure they both output the same spl. Being identical you should be able to just set the gains the same and not even have to measure but it never hurts to verify.
Does this apply at all if I'm using the exact two subwoofer and place their volume dial at the same exact position?
If they're identical you "should " be able to set the gains at the same spot and be fine but it never hurts to verify.
If I have two identical subs do I need to gain match them?
Hi, so basically can I conclude that if I have two exact same subs and miniDSP can set subs at 12 o'clock , the AVR at 0 dB, and adjust the SPL from the miniDSP?
I had the same exact question. Did you ever get the answer? Lol
So if I did this correctly, does that mean that after an audyssey calibration, that the sub levels should be almost the same values, + - a few db? This is without a miniDSP.
Thanks
This is for guys doing they're own alignment as in ep 7. If you do this then use dual outs and use audessey it'll just mess it all up as it has no clue what the actual levels should be as it's measuring the room, not the subs.
So you don’t even need your theater setup or theater room? Just measuring SPL with the same sub location and mic placement etc?
What’s about lvl matching?
If I have 3 walls and subs placed asymmetrically, should I match lindens using an SPL meter before doing any measurements?
Watch the video and it will answer that much better than I can here. It explains what to do when a sub can't be moved.
What to do about inwall subs with dual drive like JBL Synthesis
If all subs are the same you can just set the gains equal. Or measure at one of the drivers and compare at the same point at the same driver at the other subs. The room influence will be minimal so close.
You say I can use a 50-60Hz tone, but to make sure I don't have any nulls in that frequency. How would I know? Would I need to run a 10-100Hz sweep or something first? You also mentioned I can use Pink Noise instead. Pink noise is 20-20K Hz right? So this would still be OK?
Play the tone and you'll know if there's a null. It'll be audible.
If I have different subs i.e. SVS PB2000 and a Martin Logan 150watt 10 inch should I still gain match even if the subs aren't a matching set? Will the ML not limit the SVS severely?
The svs may not be louder than the ML sub. You'd expect it to go lower but the driver itself may not be as sensitive. So depending on where the two are tuned the ML could have more output say from 25hz (just an example) and up. But sure you'd expect the 12 to go lower so from the pint where the 10 is tuned and down the 12 will be doing the work. The subs should have filters that protect them from high output below tuning so you soukdnr have to worry about setting filters as it's more of a diy sub thing. So yes I'd gain match as seen in the video.
GREAT Video! Could I gain match my subs if they are NOT in the same place? My 175 pound subs are exactly the same distance from my MLP, just on each side of my entertainment unit. Could I set up my SPL meter so that each driver cone is the same angle from the meter? Or will room gain play too big of a factor?
Thanks. Yes you can and I actually cover this In the video.
I have an NX6000D and I just ordered a Mini-DSP. When gain matching, should I just set the Behringer to about 12 o'clock and then use MiniDSP from then on? Or would I want a slightly higher base gain on the Behringer?
Half is fine. Its a good place to use as a baseline in case someone jacks with the knobs or heck you may want to get a little boost for a song you can bump it up then go back to your baseline.
Thank you. So if I use 12:00 on the NX6K, I would then do all my gain tweaking in the mini-DSP.
Steven...What if my subs vary? I have 2 Jl Fathoms (front facing single subs) and Two power sound audio XS30Se (dual driver opposing faced). How would you measure properly to assure gain match? Thanks in advance
Unfortunately you're screwed.. Just joking. Sorta. Opposing drivers aren't easy but the best way is to place a regular sub in spot, get spl, and then move the sub and place the opposing driver sub so that the center of the cabinet is where the regular subs cone was. With the subs facing 90 degrees. So if the regular sub was facing you opposing subs are facing to the sides.
Hi
I whanted to try out 4 subbs in my room.
I have 2 svs pb4000 now and i could borrowed Home 2 XTZ 12.17 Edge subbs. Im trying one in each corners if i like 4 subbs in my room i probloby get 4 matching subbs but i could get my hands on 2 xtz for now youst to try it out. How would you recomend to set them up and drive them i can have them all ports open or have them seald. Maybe better to try seald in my small room 1500 Cubic feet concreat seald. Can i set up my mic were my best seat for movies and volume match them from there.? I have a Arcam avr550 whit Dirac Live. So if i go in to my computer and dirac live i can messure my subbs one by one is this ok or is my room going to do bad things to the sound that way and i need to put the mic up front against the drivers one by one and messure that way..?
Arcam avr550 reciver youst messure for one subb. So after volume matching them and i calibrate it youst calibrate for one subb for al my 4 subbs.
Hope you not what i mean you have done a great video to explain but feelt that in need to ask anyway sorry.. ☹
I youst watch movies in this room.
I have sliders on my 160lb SVS subs so I can just slide them around :)
Same!
Should we put the subs to gain match in one of our dedicated spots we put the subs?
You can.
INTERESTING, I came up with a way to gain match my subs, please tell me what you think? I own a Yamaha rx-a3070, it has dual sub outputs and can EQ them using ypao, my subs are 2x emotiva basx s12 300w class D r/ported and 2x accusound 8.6xd 12" 200w class A/B
r/ported, configuration front/rear, yamaha feeds front emotiva and accusound daisy chained to it, emotiva left front and accusound right front, rear once again yamaha feeds emotiva and it's at chest hight with accusound daisy chained to it, it sits mid way on the right side of room, in setting gains on subs, I run ypao, I then go straight to results, then to levels, looking at subs results, say front ypao is turning them down 2db, I go to gain on subs and turn them down a bit, this could be either way depending on results, I'll run ypao a number of times until sub level results show me font/rear 0.0 db , this would mean I've gain matched the subs at the subs using ypao, yes? My results, the emotiva rear is at a lower gain level compared to front, by 2.5 notches on gain, the accusounds I've matched the gain on them.
The only thing I'm not doing is spl of emotiva and accusound to compare and match the out put levels of each, should I do this?, being different amp types, power and sound would this come into play too?
As it is now I'm getting a great response and chest slam that can take your breath away LOL.
So basically I don’t have to do do this at all if I have to identical SVS PB16 ultra?
Theoretically you shouldn't have to.
So how do we level SPL match after all subs are at 50% gain and then we place the subs. Is this done during room correction?
If you've gain matched the subs gain knobs may not be all at 50 percent. That's what you adjust to match them. If you have a minidsp or Behringer amp you can do it in their software as well
What do I do for level matching. Where do I make the adjustment.
Is gain matching and level matching the same thing. Or is it 2 different adjustments in the mini dsp.
I see how you adjust the settings on gain matching but I did not see how you adjusted on level matching.
We're just setting the output before we begin aligning the subs so each sub works the same. This done in the minidsp output for each channel used. After the subs are complete and after you've calibrated the rest of the speakers you'll set the level of the sub system using the AVRs sub output or minidsp input level adjustment. See the episode on calibrating for reference.
When I do gain matching what db should I set it at on the generator on rew. I was using 75 db but my marantz avr was on 71. I had my subs set to -20 and my sub level in my avr to -10. Is this correct
I gain matched my subs but when I run Audyssey, it has me lower the gain to proceed. Doesn’t that defeat the purpose of the whole process? I’m using a MiniDSP so adjusting the gain is easy. I’m just struggling with the process when immediately after I complete it, Audyssey tells me to adjust it more? Thanks so much, videos are awesome!
Not at all. If you're using a minidsp correctly your avr sees one sub, if you turn it down you'll do so on input one so it turns both down. They are still gain matched because you didn't individually adjust the spl which would be done on the outputs of the minidsp.
@@hometheatergurus that makes sense. Thanks!
This assumes the subs are equidistant from the seating position right? If one or two are closer to the seating position then they will be much much louder than the ones furthest away.
Am I wrong about this?
same question.. make no sense.. i think u also have to measure and do a sweep for each sub at the same position.. then at the back or front another sweep, placing them in the correct posiion and then correct the loudness , so another sweep etc until they match "globaly" in the range of 35hz to 80hz
Would this gain matching be done after running your receiver setup? Thanks!
No this is done before you use auto setup when using one sub out. This would be in combination with Ep 7.
Home Theater Gurus thanks..ps..I’ll have to watch Ep 7 at least 10 more times.There is a lot of info in there to comprehend..but all good. 😳😳
If the subs are the exact same model, do they still need to be gain matched?
No they should be fine as long as gain knobs are set the same. I'll emphasize "should". Doesn't hurt to verify.
I’m so confused.
I’m using 1 sub out from my marantz 7704 to 1 input on my minidsp. Then I have 2 outs going to an inuke 6000, and 2 more going to a crown XTI.
In my Processor it’s set to 1 sub. If I go into the level section in my marantz and play pink noise only 1 sub turns on. Shouldnt all of them be playing?
Yes all outputs/subs should be playing. See ep 7 for the routing and crossover page setups. This is where the issues are most likely at.
I also show this info in ep 41 and 42.