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Coraline Theory - Part 9 - Spiderwick & the Seeing Stone - The Fangirl
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- čas přidán 12. 11. 2016
- I think I found a connection between The Spiderwick Chronicles and Coraline. Decide for yourself if it fits, but I think this cross-over theory could cover several plot holes with Miss Spink and Forcible!
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#coraline #coraline10 #spiderwickchronicles #seeingstone #othermother #thefangirl
Spink and Forcible were actually canonically romantically involved with each other, according to Gaiman, but men trying to seduce two beautiful women who appeared uninterested is absolutely accurate. I love these videos, I just figured I'd share that tidbit.
triggerhappy0404 They aren't sisters and I've found out, after rewatching the movie.
triggerhappy0404 Bc 1) they're never said to be sisters, anywhere 2) they look different, have different names and no evidence of husbands 3) it's canon they're romantically involved, so why on earth would the creators make gaycest canon and not comment on it being gay instead of gaycest?
LESBIANS!
Aha! I knew my gaydar was going off!
Their actual dimbats
I still don't get how you could ever think miss Finke or forcable could be 40-50
**the awkward moment when your name is Lucinda and you're dying because you have finally found something that mentions your name even though it is of no significance**
I know you've been getting this a lot, but the ladies next door must be older than you think. For example, in the graphic novel they do look over 70 years old and I wouldn't describe them to look any younger in the movie, either.
Technically, both Spink and Forcible are correct about the item: It revealed lost things (eyes/souls) and bad things (all the grey false areas).
40s or 50s? they look 70 dude...
By the time my Grandmother was 70, she looked like Skeletor from He-Man. To still be that "plump" and lively, I don't think they can be that old.
The Fangirl I know a lady who is turning 100 this year and is very plump
The Fangirl I thought that they were more like 70 or 80 tbh. Especially with their reliance on walkers or lack of eyesight. Most fifty year old people are well functioning unless they had a lot of health deteriorating habits. Most people's health start deteriorating around 60 years old
AJ Roman not even there both actually 128 years old by then but they around die probably being around 40-70 years old
I agree, they have to be older than 40 or 50. My mom is in her mid 50s and looks like Mel, Coraline’s mom. My grandmother is 87 and definitely looks like Ms. Spink (not to mention that both my grandma and Ms. Spink use walkers. I don’t know too many people in their 40s who use walkers)
I always assumed that the women made the “seeing stone” out of candy. And that’s why it melts when the beldam throws it in the fireplace. Plus wasn’t it shown in a earlier scene that the candy was hard and stuck together, so it probably wouldn’t be that far fetched for something to be carved out of it. I’m on board with all the other stuff in your Coraline theories! Keep up the good work!
i thought they created the stones with theyr needels out of the candy clump haha
So I just went through all your Coraline theory videos and this one caught my attention. I'll start off with saying that I agree with alot of your theories, but not his one. It seems like this theory is a little stretched and basically depends on the seeing stone and the fact that England and Maine both have a city named Brighton, and the rest is conjecture. The thing is, while we don't see alot of seeing stones in movies they're not unheard of or even terribly uncommon. They're more commonly known as "Adder Stones" and while they're said to have quite a few magical properties one of things they do is allow someone to see through faerie or witch traps or disguises when you look through the hole in the center. Adder stones are also most commonly found in the UK and Ireland and in Germany. So it's not entirely implausible that they both have adder stones since Spiderwick isn't the only person whose ever had one. And this could also mean that the ladies were talking about Brighton, England since that's where adder stones would be more common. Do with this information what you will, just my thoughts. Also, keep up the good work.
kawaiikitsune382 Iowa has a Brighton too
kawaiikitsune382 fairy or witch trap you say? So basically Coraline saw the container of what the ghost children need to find and it connects that she saw the children's eyes or whatever it was to a fairy or witch trap 0.o
kawaiikitsune382 this could actually fit into the Mythos if the Beldam is also interdimesional to the point of accessing worlds where fairies exist (aka spiderwick / any fairy universe) etc. It explains how she has weird plants that aren't based on anything real, like everything else. Also why Mr. B is BLUE, bc he could be from some other dimension like Corpse Bride, Frankenweeine, Nightmare Before Christmas etc. Also may fix timelines bc not all dimensions are on the same time or have events happen in the same order.
aside from adder stones there are several other lore and mythologies that use various objects to see the unseen some even go as far as being creature specific. youre right this theory is a stretch
But does it atcually have "power" to see fairys
it looks like the ouji board thing
Maria Korovessi planchette*
Yes it does
I thought they made it out of the Taffy with the chopsticks or what ever it is
BoRaiChoWins it was hidden
Same... Another question though: Did you know that the father's study is on the bottom floor? I have no clue why I thought it was on the top.
Is it just me or is the moon (just above the castle (1:01)) looks exactly like a smile with eyes?!?!
Ooh... creepy....
Shaked Oved 。・ω・。 that's where the beldames eyes are
Shaked Oved 。・ω・。 kool
Shaked Oved 。・ω・。 it's not, it's the button but it's not the full button yet
It’s the Cheshire Cat winking at ya
I know this is old, but I figured something out! If you go to an artist who worked on the spiderwick movie's design and art, in their portfolio, you can see early designs of the seeing stone! One of them is a triangle!
I'm not sure its a stone at all. i mean isn't it thrown into a fire and destroyed? last i checked stones dont burn or melt
its old taffy
Might be glass because you can melt and mould glass
theyre called adderstones because they used to made from snake skulls hence the name.
‘Stones don’t melt’
Lava: …
@@mars-nf9cj lol yes let’s make lava by throwing a rock in a fireplace, please try it and report your findings lmaooo
The houses also look like the house of that was in Beetlejuice/gues, the movie-
and that had some curious ghost stuff that involved a shape shifting (sexy) spirit-guy and doors that lead to odd places.
Also- what if the Lady is related to Oogy Boogy? like his daughter?? Like that one girl out of the three kids? (nightmare before christmas)
There is no evidence plus this Theory is a long stretch I’m not buying this one
The first spiderwick chronicles book and Coraline were published in the same year, this totally works
AMAZING THEORY!!!! Those two movies are my favorite movies ever!
Thank you! :) I'm surprised more people haven't made a similar connection, since the seeing stone is so uncommon a thing in film.
when i was watching coraline (i happened to watch it only recently after theorizer on netflix) i was thinking, "mmm spiderwick had one of those things too".. i only thought of plagiarism tho
The Fangirl it isn't uncommon on tales, specially fairy tales, and both these movies are based on books so...
Spiderwick...Spider-witch... :O ?????
oooooh, that works. 0.o
it would be spiderwicca.
I always say “Jared Grace, leave this place.” To bugs in the house, to my cat when he gets into something, to friends when they clock out at work. Nobody ever knows what I’m quoting. Praying the spiderwick fandom rises up so I can have my moment
I really love the Spiderwick books, and by extension the movie. I also like Coraline (obviously) and I thought about this myself. Thank you for making a video on this, I never got around to look at the details, but I did see the connection with the stones.
I never noticed that! I love spiderwick!
So, if the seeing stone coroline uses makes the Other World turn grey and all, and if Coroline is in the Other World Limbo, then why doesn't the world turn grey when she first looks into the stone when she's with the Ladies? A small hole, but i still love your work
but the seeing stone is made if candy and melts? Unless it's just hidden in the candy and the beldam melts the rock with magical fire?
I really like The Spiderwick Chronicles ((books and movies)) and also Coraline so when i heard about this video i was really heckin excited
Wait!Look at the seeing stone very closely.Do u see what I see? Iluminti confronted!
The first time I watched the movie and saw the stone the first thought I had about it was Spiderwick Chronicles so it's cool you put my thoughts in a theory!
I got shivers while watching this.
been wondering about this, actually,ever since I noticed the seeing stone similarity, but couldn't put it together..thanks..now, I can imagine two of my favorites connected.
That is enough for me tonight. I'll view the rest tomorrow. This Spiderwick and Coraline connection was great. I got a real grin from Arthur traveling around watching burlesque shows. A man needs some entertainment...am I right?
queendsheena1 it was long stretch I for one am not buying it
I have just re watched the movie and i have some interesting notes that might aid to your research.
1. The beldam reuses the same doll, for all three ghost children, and for Caroline herself. However, she did not reuse the button eyes, she gave the doll new ones !
2. Caroline was looking for the old well with her dowsing rod and was called a Water Witch by Wybie.
3. Wybie said that his grandma was hesitant to rent the place to people with children.
4. Dad mentions the house is 150 years old.
5. Random one, Coraline is left handed, she was scene eating with her left, and when she went to shake the Beldam's hand, she stuck out her left hand.
6. The first two visits, was a night and when the parents weren't around and the brick wall was back in the morning. Most ghostly encounters happen at night in haunted places. The last two times the door was opened, but the parents weren't around for that either.
7. Bobinski said the mice told her not to go through little door
8. Wybie mentioned that the doll is as old as the house ! ? 150 year old doll ?
9. Black cat mentions that she tries to keep him out, but he loves to play that game with her, he comes and goes as he pleases.
10. Cat " or She just loves something to eat !"
11. Beldam " even the proudest spirit can be broken, with love" I am convinced that the beldam represents the black widow spider. Every clothing she wears has some black and red pattern in it. Similar pattern to the black widow spider. Spiders have eight eyes, the two black buttons have four holes in them, creating eight different view points.
12. The two sisters chose the 1921 candy jar to give to coraline, not sure about that one yet, something about that year 1921.
13. Green triangle good for finding lost things.
14. If the Black cat was working for the Beldam, why would he help corlaine get the Third ghosts eye, instead of just letting her lose the game. As far as the movie goes, this cat has never had button eyes and he says that their is no other me and he comes and goes as he pleases.
15. THEIR IS NO OLD WELL IN THE OTHER WORLD ! which is why she tried to drag Caroline back to the house, instead of just falling down the well !
I think the biggest clue, for the movie, is that their is only one old well and it only exists in the real world, not her world. Just like their is only one Key !
Thank you for the notes! I really like the 8 holes in the buttons and the fact that she changes the dolls button eyes!
I work most of my theories off of the belief that Caroline gets trapped in a limbo Pink Palace world (kind of a 2nd floor to the Other World), and the cat is there to make Coraline believe that she has someone she can trust. Notice when Coraline enters the Other World for the last time, we see that the Beldam can actually create human eyes, but chooses not to. I think that is so Coraline thinks the Limbo world is the real world, as she thinks that button eyes are all the Beldam can make (which we know isn't true).
Yes that is an interesting theory about a world in between the real world and other world. My biggest issue is with the game that Coraline agreed too. The terms were that if she couldn't find the three ghost children's eyes and find her parents, she would have to stay their forever and get the button eyes sewed in. When the rat ran off with the third ghost eye, Coraline lost the game, and would have had to stay in the other world. However, the cat helped her get the last ghost eye and help her find her parents. Another unusual thing with the black cat is his eye color. Usually when you see a black cat associated with a witch, the cat has green eyes. the writers of this movie decided to give the black cat blue eyes instead. Last thing, what would be the point of creating the limbo world, when she had the game already won, until the cat intervened with the Bedlam winning. If the cat was working for her, he would have just let coraline lose the game. I know this doesn't go with your theory, the cats actions throughout the entire movie just doesn't add up to this theory. you mentioned that you went to school studying film, and every detail in each shot is done on purpose, so what do you think about black cat with blue eyes, and the face that their is no well in the other world ? The movie takes another approach to this story.
Ah, yes, but consider that you're right, and Coraline did already lose the game - the Beldam could have easily called the cat's interference cheating. But she didn't. She also could have easily killed the cat after Coraline threw him at her, but she didn't. Why not? Because the goal was never to keep Coraline in that part of the Other World, the goal was to chase her into a different area where Coraline could be trapped and fed off of long term. Besides, if the last child was in the Other World in 1960, and the average cat lives for 15 years, how would the cat know anything about the Beldam liking games to begin with? Why is one of the cat's ear tears in the shape of the Beldam's claw? And how did the doll get in and out of the the real world in the cat or the Lovat family didn't assist with that? We see what the mice do, the mice did not transport the doll.
In part 6 of my theory, I explain what the Beldam's food source is and why it's beneficial for a Limbo Pink Palace. In part 7 I have maps for visual aids that might help clarify my thoughts on how the Beldam's Lair and Limbo Pink Palace work out, which also means that there could be a well in the Limbo area but not the Beldam's Lair, because deception is the key for the Beldam's food source to work. As for blue versus green eyes, I've never heard of that. But, you are making the assumption that the Beldam is a witch. I've yet to take a position on what kind of creature she is myself, but I think she's beyond the typical definition of a witch. Familiars can also be used by magicians and demons, and I'm sure other creatures I've never heard of as well. And, actually, cats with green eyes also symbolize prosperity, so there's conflicting lore on many details like that. Similarly, the fairy ring could symbolize evil, a portal to the fairy world, or a containment barrier to keep anything from coming out of the well. If you want to get into details of the mise-en-scene, why is Bobinsky's skin blue if he's supposed to be alive? How can he make such physically impossible jumps? And why does Coraline's mother tap her fingers exactly like the Beldam's?
Miss Sp and Miss Sf are confirmed to be lovers
Originally adder stones were made from snake skulls hence the name. And since the beldam is a spider, their natural predators in most mythologies and lore (harry potter for example) are snakes.
Omg I LOVED reading Spiderwick, I finished it really quick!
Hey Disney Fangirl I can't wait for that video with the theorizer...... You and the Theorizer are amazing!!!!! Could I help you guys?
It would be a very interesting video, but there's nothing in the works at this time. My door is open, though, should The Theorizer ever be interested! lol
ok for your pleading at the end I subbed.... :) u actually pressurized me... o_o
I had already thought of doing a detailed study of aot once it's completed but looks like I can go with Coraline until then....
That's awesome I wanna see a fic now
Also, consider the fairy circle around the well in Coraline, plus the fact that Arthur was taken by fairies.
in what world do these ladies look like they’re between 40-50 years old??? my grandma don’t even look like that yet and she’s 81
And also the 4th stone is said to be “pink” is that a hint for the pink palace?
There is a folk tale from Italy that I think perfectly fits the bill
A spider that can turn into a human that COVERS THEIR EYES that likes to eat children’s souls
That traps people in fake pocket dimensions ITS THE SAAAAAME
NORBOLINEWICK?!
How come the three other pink palace memories know about the Beldam. They help Coraline as if they know what is going to happen
I watched spiderwick chronicles a few days ago
Also for your Coraline Part 2 Theory the dates are the years the three children moved in.
The dates are only for the three children if you follow the theory that says that. I have a different theory based on my belief of what's happening. Remember, theories are just observations until a creator comes out and confirms something said. But, by my calculations the three kids moved in/were abducted in approximately 1850, 1880, and 1960, so I politely disagree with The Theorizer on what the candy jars represent. :) Thank you for watching!
DogePlayz // Minecraft and More yes it is
no way that pioneer girl is from 1921 lol
@@snowflurries2486 bro responded to a 4 year old comment
What I learned from Jon Solo since he made a breakdown on Coraline from the book, he said that the stone with a whole in it *(Seeing stone)* is actually made from a snake's saliva and/or a snake's eggs.
Maybe that is how Arthur Spiderwick got it from before the pixies abducted him.
With regards to the toffee, Brighton in the UK is famous for sweet production; most notably bonfire toffee and Brighton rock.
we don't have taffy in England, I'm not even sure what it is
Dannie Spokes I feel odd liking this comment, but seems to fit the theory..
Dannie Spokes you guys dont have laffy taffy
Elley Henderson nope
It's like a chewy-caramely treat.
Anna chewy fruity or chocolately treats
IKR they do I thought the same thing
I thought the Brighton comment meant Brighton Beach because I always associated taffy with boardwalks, idk.
I thought the same thing.
Spiderwick Chronicles - February 2008
Coraline - February 2009
?
That's very interesting
I love Spiderwick
Well in the movie on the behind the scenes they say tht they got the idea from 3 real children its supposed to be based on a true story the house is located in Main they also tell u in the movie
I want to rewatch Spiderwick, I want to read both of the books Coraline an Spiderwick
The sisters don't look to be 40-50 to me ... they seem like they are much older. Miss Spink uses a walker and Miriam Forcible is wearing a wig. She has like no hair left. And the wikipedia pages say that the sisters are 97. I think they look/act waaaaaay to old to be 40-50. No way. It seems much likelier that they are in their 80's or 90's.
I know im late but im watching coraline right now and i saw a mushroom circle around the well and the house in spiderwick had a mushroom ring to protect it. I mean its a funny connection🤷🏼♀️😹
The moon is a button
0:00 (gasp) BRAK!😀
Hello everybody. Hello everybody. Hello everybody. Whooh-hoo-hoo!
omg this is greate I just realzied that one year ago when I was in my exchange year in Brighton..
I found such a stone 5:04 at the BrightonBeach!! (the type 3)
and i still have it..
the only Thing thats wrong it was in Brighton ENGLAND.. but Hey! Coraline from the book also lives in England..
what if coraline was related to the spiderwick family in some way?
I had always assumed Arthur invented the seeing stone
Omg that’s the boy from the good doctor ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
It is! He’s always been a great actor!
The little stone is the main reason I first watched Coraline. I thought it looked similar to the stone in Spiderwick so yeah
I don't know how I missed it for so long myself!
The Fangirl Omg senpai replied hi! (~OwO)~
Reminds me of hag stones. Look up a hag stone and it’s the same thing. You look through them.
I also think gravity falls exist in the same universe
1 both in Oregon
2 the weird stuff
3. I swear I see the same glass triangle in gravity falls
I'm thinking of more evidence
Hey! I have an idea! What if A Winkle In Time is apart of Coraline and Spiderwick? Fangirl, you reminded me of a scene in the book that matches with Spiderwick being in the other world and not ageing. That is exactly what happens to Charles and Meg's father in the book! He gets trapped in "a different world" and doesn't have a sense of how much time has passed. Because when he left, Charles was just a baby and when they went on the journey to find Megs father, Charles is 8 in the book, I believe and looks about 10 in the movie. Could that be possible somehow?
I have one of the seeing ston
Nuuu! I thought it was Brighton, Colorado!
those seeing stones are Hag Stones and they can't really be found anywhere I mean yeah very very rarely they could be found at random places but they are usually found in Shore areas though they are still rare and all they are used to see the other side of things or ' supernatural things ' like monsters or fae
I forgot to mention it allows people to see into the faery world itself o-o
I was born in Maine
I'm not so sure they actually are connected as in the special features of the spider wick movie they said that it was based on a real life story it's just that they changed some of the names, so if they are that would mean that Coraline was real
You
Need
To
Guess
Who
Is
Awesome
read the first word ♥️💖♥️
As far as the houses go, they are both Victorian style, so of course they look similar.
They couldve moved the house thou
The seeing stone is made out of taffy right? Maybe there is a meaning behind the taffy dates. The three dates maybe represent the children who died cuz of the beldam. The taffy or seeing stone can help u see the bad things around you. But what if the three children controls the stone? And why triangle with a hole to see bad stuff?
yoooooo what if the seeing stone was in THEIR taffy jar. idk if it is but just a suggestion's
the seeing ston looks like the quija bored peice
The seeing stone showed her see was in the real world when she got it derp
Hey look an Abe's Oddysee thing!
i own a black cat
why would they give that to her if she's being controlled by the beldam? Just wondering... And, sure, this video (I think) came out before that was established, but...
Well I mean Coraline in the book takes place in England
Yeah Coraline is the movie that broke me from even wanting to look at the book when talking about a movie because so many people want to use BOTH as facts, even when they contradict. In more recent videos I’m a lot more strict about keeping book details out, lol.
nice and i just noticed that you changed your name
Thank you, and I did (sort of). I moved Disney Fangirl to my nickname since my channel is getting dominated by non-Disney subjects now.
I don't know what 40-50 yr olds you know, that look as old as Spink & Forcible. 😅
“I’m almost to 100 subs” aw
have an idea about coraline
Beldam also means beldon that means a looney place
Coraline means heart maiden
Beldam means
1 a ugly evil looking old lady
2 a grandmother
3 a looney place
Who else is a grandmother and who is a evil ugly lady
wybees granmother and the Beldam/Other mother
look at the picture of the seeing stones agin and then look at the bottom of the seeing stons and you will see one that looks like one from coriline
Wait, Caroline is in the real world at the end of the movie and throwa the key with the broken hand right? She didn't throw the key at the beginning?
one problem I am a really big fan of spiderwick and I thought watching this wouldn't he just be into fairies that there no way of meeting the two sisters
didn't you say that when we see Ms Spink and Forcible and Mr Bobinsky that they were in the other but I think we saw ms Spink wave at the moving men mean she would've had to of seen them
Oh the fairys and the belldam sound simlarll and you did macke a thiory about the belldam being a fairy
How sus. DeTerlizzi and Black stole Neil Gaiman's idea!
What happened to your Coraline theory 8 video? i have been watching them in order but couldn't find it. Is it possible to do a recap if it was removed?
I’m not sure why it’s hiding, but it says it’s still public and available: czcams.com/video/9EzgZwvFvQI/video.html
Why cant the sisters spink and forcible ever agree on the seeing stone or coralines tea leaves
I think I have a tiny theory
To get the taffy again in 1938 they would haft to go get it there for when the children were kidnapped / stolen my the other mother / bedlam the weren't there there for they probably didn't know the children were taken/ kidnapped? I really don't know please correct me if I'm wrong I need help lol
WAIT WAIT WAIT WAITTTTTTTTTTT, How did the beldams hand get out the door cause thats a body part and so HOWWW TF would it get out?? That gives more evidence to why Coraline never escaped the beldam. But I have some evidence that she did escape but im not 100000000000000% sure about it, Did she have a model of Whybies Grandma?? Btw
Illuminati confirmed
They made the stone out of taffy. Your theory may be true, but that's not his stone.
I do like this idea, but i have something to point out.
Your Coraline timeline puts Ms. Spink & Forcible as having moved into the Pink Palace in 1921 as they aged out of the Burlesque Circus, and this video states that Arthur Spiderwick would have met them between 1915 and 1921.
This puts their meeting six years before the ladies move into the Pink Palace, at most, and once you've passed childhood, six years isn't going to radically change your appearance unless you make an effort to do so yourself. Meaning Ms. Spink and Forcible would have already been older women by the time they met Arthur, and while they definitely still could've been traveling with the Burlesque Circus at that time, I don't think they would have been as enticing or interesting to a young Arthur as they would have been when they too were younger.
Taking this into consideration, would Arthur have still given them a Seeing Stone if they showed interest in his research?
I'm not sure I'm following you there. Did your sentence get cut off? Yes, I think Arthur would have met Miss Spink and Forcible before they retired during one of their tours.
the moive was out in 2009
I'm English....IM NO LONGER SAFE
Coraline is British ,but in the movie they made her American