Rhys is the new Tamlin
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- čas přidán 5. 04. 2021
- As you can tell, I'm not a fan of what Maas did to my boy Rhysand in the latest book. He and Feyre both suffered a serious case of "you must stay out of the plot, and these contrivances will make sure you do".
Art:
Zutara Royal Family by Ardawling www.deviantart.com/ardawling/...
Rhys and feyre + Rhysand: Charlie bowater
Find me on instagram: / gry_ranfelt - Zábava
I love how the original Tam Lin story literally has the lead girl (Janet) CHOOSE to go to Carter hall to sleep with Tam Lin, she gets pregnant, immediately starts picking herbs to induce a miscarriage (so an abortion), and when Tam Lin finds out he’s SUPPORTIVE. She tells him she doesn’t want to be a single mother, so she’s not going to have the kid, but if Tam Lin were human so they could raise the child together, she would 100% keep the pregnancy. Tam Lin is immediately like YES, I support you, I love you, and I want to raise this kid with you; I’m being held captive by the fairy queen, if you can help me escape you can have your husband and kid on your terms. And then SHE RESCUES HIM FROM THE FAIRY QUEEN WHILE PREGNANT!
HOLY FUCK I need to read this! Thank you for sharing that!
Wait this plot is from which book....what am I missing
@@rupojasengupta4398 The original folk tale. Tam Lin is a folk tale! Overly Sarcastic Productions did an episode on it for a short and funny summary.
And if interests you, there is a song as well written about this ballad by the same composer of Hadestown. If I remember correctly, you could listen it on vox.
I like how a realm filled with magic and mythical race could not have a c-section either.
And I recently learned c-sections have apparently been done succesfully in South Africa for hundreds of years, so, well, magic clearly can't cut it.
@@gryranfelt5473 - Science triumphs, case closed. Haha
Just can’t get past how in the original Tam Lin the heroine pulls of a daring heist/rescue mission and faces of against the fairy queen while pregnant. She was saving the baby daddy. That’s...the whole plot.
Here’s the thing that COULD have made the books really interesting: Make Feyre an unreliable narrator because Rhysand MIGHT (is) be controlling her.Tam Lin could still done his plans, but all the good moments are twisted by Rhysand to make Feyre his.
Pray that this is it.
The entire books are really problematic. I enjoyed the first three books while reading, because that’s pure fiction, but I really didn’t want to read the rest and I will not do it, because I can’t deal with Rhys fake-feminsm anymore and everyone acting as if Tamlin‘s the only one doing bad things, while everyone else is doing bad stuff too
Feyre‘s just a rich housewife at this point
I agree. The way the whole narrative treated Tamlin got exhausting. Like, it was much more interesting when he just "got bad" because of trauma, but to then redcon his backstory etc. so Rhys could be this sweet boi, it was disappointing. I enjoyed the first two books a lot, like, they weren't pieces of art, but they did explore interesting topics, like going from one relationship to another. I just wish things had been allowed to stay more complex. (And boy is the forth book problematic with a big P).
the same is with chaol from throne of glass series, everyone is blaming him for everything.
OMG I LOVE YOU. Yes Rhys is so fake and gross and they treat Tamlin like shit for one fucking mistake
@@gryranfelt5473 YESS ^
that's why i absolutely love when Nesta in ACoSF tells Feyre "that's your mate's money, not yours"
like... YASS QUEEN SLAYY EXACTLY
i hate what happened to Feyre and Rhysand, where she is just pretty wifey (and rhys had the attitude to get mad at tam for trying to do the same thing???), and he is a huge ass (don't even get me started about additional Azriel x Elain chapter???) - he's talks "you always have a choice", "you'll do as you please" was a bvllshit the whole time
this whole books where like yasss, trauma, ptsd, so life-changing, but when someone reacts to trauma not in a nice way (tam's overprotectivness, nesta's hypersexualisation) then suddenly everyone has a problem with it?
I really didn't like Rhys in this book either. It just makes zero sense Mr "It's your choice", wouldn't bother to worn his WIFE that having his baby had a chance to kill her. Not only did he not tell her, but he actively took measures to keep that shit from her. WTF. Did Rhys go Republican or some shit? Who cares if the woman could die! Force dat birth! Grrrrr.
Absolutely infuriating
But if you think about it... he only ever gave a choice when it benefitted him.
- He conveniently offered her the bargain under the mountain when she was dying.
- He gave her an ultimatum to either work with him or he'll send her back to Tamlin.
- Feyre is the only one who can fetch Tarquin's book but hey, it's her choice to either damn prythian or get it.
- He made the choice about Feyre's pregnancy.
- He forced Nesta to do his bidding using Elain.
- He forced Azriel to stay away from Elain.
And that's just naming a few... I never liked him but him and Feyre straight up pissed me off in ACOSF.
A 500 year old high lord acting like a kid, throwing tantrums left right and center, and Feyre acting exactly like Tamlin, the guy she ran away from, towards Nesta.
Yes, Nesta needed help, but come on.
Rhys is worse than Tamlin.
He always was! At least Tamlin apologizes for his shit
Notice how the creater liked most of the peoples comments but not yours 😂 she disagrees with you
@@girlsapearl4964 Hahaha, I probably didn't see it or was neck-deep in exams at the time xD Officially liked!
Yeah Rhys has a long history of keeping vital information from Feyre at the expense of her well-being. At the beginning of ACOMAF, he knew that she was basically being kept as a prisoner in the spring court. He felt her PTSD, saw how thin and neglected she was, and knew how dangerous it could be if no one taught her to control her powers. But he leaves here there till the last minute. Not to mention he’s known she was his mate since she was resurrected, and he knew how abusive and neglectful Tamlin was, but he was still going to let her marry him because “it was her choice.” It was a choice she made on limited information and he refused to share more with her until he had to. Kinda like keeping the winged baby was a choice she made based on limited information and he refused to share more until Nesta forced him too. A lot of people were surprised by Rhys’s behavior in ACOSF. I was not.
@@missanthropy6174 bruh Tamlin literally had the right to wage war for taking his 'property' Rhys didn't HAVE to do anything in the first place! He saved her at the wedding when he REALIZED what was happening, but literally couldn't risk doing anything until it was drastic. He was the one who trained her powers. HE was the one who made her his equal. And HE let's her fight badass in war. He never locked her up. Also, how was he supposed to say he was her mate? "Hey, uh btw, I know ur still healing with all the trauma and stuff, but I have a freaky magic love connection now sooooo-"
She could have shifted 6 weeks into pregnancy. That baby is the size of a pea. It's ridiculous.
Hahaha, exactly xD
that is what makes it dangerous for the baby. being the size of a pea.
Honestly, ACOTAR should've been a standalone. After the first book it only gets worse and it's filled with misogyny, demonization of the traumatized and depressed characters, pro-life bs, slut-shaming, body-shaming and even more abuse. Not to mention that Feyre becomes such an unreliable narrator right from the beginning of the second book because Maas changed her mind about who should be the MMC.
Man I just found this video and wish I saw it sooner. Feyre is a high lady but Rhys’s friends would choose him in a heartbeat over her any day. So much for high lady.
Tamlin has been utterly destroyed and if he doesn’t get some sort of healing arch it would be such wasted potential.
Personally I don’t like when characters have at the end of the series unless you see the characters actually having to BE a parent. And I don’t just mean holding a baby with no personality and looking happy/annoyed. I mean actually being a parent while also reading from their perspective and going through changes and stuff. I don’t like Twilight, but one of the things I did appreciate is that a lot of the books’ conflict happens AFTER they have Renesme, and because of Renesme’s vampire weirdness, she actually has a little bit of a personality and presence. Her story/adventures doesn’t END with her having kids, which would lead to a lot of development/struggles in and of itself. I’ll also give Katness a pass, because she has an entire scene at the end of seeing her kids play and struggling to be happy because she’s still living with the trauma of all she went through, and how the world is still changing and she knows she’s going to have not only stay a part of that, but teach her kids to be a part of it too. Like, don’t bring a kid into this unless you’re actually going to show them as the main character trying to parent their specific (real) child. Bridgerton take notes.
Aaah, very, very good points. And I agree, that's a strong part of Twilight for sure. In fact I love vampire Bella, to be honest. She becomes an interesting character once she's a vampire.
One thing with series, though, is that if there's going to be a seocnd book/season where the theme of parenthood is explored, I'll give it a pass. In the case of Bridgerton, however, the big issue is that it wasn't Daphne who struggled with wanting to have childre, but the duke, so we neeeeeeeeeded to see his reaction aside from just smiling.
As a struggling writer myself, seeing stuff like this get published and have a huge fandom is really discouraging. And now Hulu is making a tv series……
Try to flip it to a positive - if this can go big, why not you?
I try to learn from these very popular books that I myself don't find as engaging as more long-form epic fantasy like Stormlight Archives, the Elderling series, She Who Became The Sun and other stuff that IMO are higher quality (Their world building goes deeper, the structures are more complex, they push into new territory, they've got more elements going on at the same time, characterization is both more subtle and complex).
I think a lot of it has to do with:
1) Ease of flow (simpler stories are easier to follow along with, thus easier to read quickly and engage with)
2) Ease of emotion / accessibility of emotion.
3) ROMANCE (who doesn't love a good romance?)
Notice how the fantasy/romance section of the fantasy market has an almost fanficcy feel to it (and I mean that in the most positive sense of the term, I love fanfic. I lived off of Three Houses fanfics for a year). Like, they dare delve into the emotion and spend a lot of time on basically nothing plotwise happening, but emotional stuff happening. (I would also say that a lot of the emotion gets explained to the reader. There's not a much of between-the-lines detective work for the reader to do. The author often dishes up the character analysis for you. This is creating a sad precedent and need for everything to be said to the reader which I personally find sad, but that's a whole youtube video on its own.)
I think these things are a big part of the separator between fiction directed more towards women than BOTH men and women (we could get into the downsides of fiction directed toward men, but that is also a different topic). The vast majority of the people consuming ACOTAR are women, while Stormlight, Elderling and Poppy War are more 50/50.
Romance sells to women. That's just how it is. I personally really love stories that do a good mix up of things, like what Cruel Prince and Six of Crows did.
I say I try to learn from these books, but then I go in entirely different directions, but, well, understanding how and why my stories differ from the fantasy-romance genre helps me accept that my books will have a harder time, because the audience is just different. Romance SELLS. So ask yourself what it is you really want to create, why it's different from the stuff that blows up, and whether you're okay with that difference. It's hard. We all want to make it big.
But do you want to make it big more than you want to create stuff that truly matters to you personally?
I absolutely agree! SJM has written herself into a corner with Rhys. He was disgusting in ACOSF. Not even considering his outright bullying of Azriel.
Daughter agrees. She even went so far as to say Rhys may become another Hybern.
Foreshadowing with mention of a king destroyed by his queen and his general.
yeah I really enjoyed the Cassian and Nesta storyline, the friendship storyline, and the parts with Azriel but I lost all care for Rhys and Feyre and agree with everything you’ve said about Rhys.
I don't like trash talking others, specially people I don't know. Still, Sarah Janet Maas has proved time and time again that she gets turned on by some very unhealthy things. I mean, I'm just fascinated by it, and how public she is about it and almost none of her fans seem to register that.
It's an interesting topic - where the line between fantasies (indulged freely in erotica) and what we actually want (shown more in non-erotic fiction, in lack of a better term) goes, and how to navigate that. In erotica, it's very clear that there's a fantasy element of sexual character that the people enjoying the given work wouldn't necessarily want IRL. Take for instance the rampant "alpha millionaire" genre - I've read a few, and man, those guys are just awful, a relationship with them would be suffocating. But it's a fantasy, it's for kink, and as long as the reader is self-aware enough to realize that, I don't believe there's harm in it.
What SJM is doing, and what Meyer and E.L. James did before her, is more problematic, pulling these fantasies into stories with a supposedly genuine attempt at developing characters and handling larger topics, such as trauma in the case of SJM. So when SJM first builds up things in one way, Tamlin starting out problematic but with some good, becoming worse and worse, then Feyre going to Rhys and him being all "your choice", then slowly eroding him as well but NOT pointing it out in the same light as was done with Tamlin ... it feels a lot like gas-lighting, doesn't it? I've mentioned authorial control in some videos, but I really want to make a full video on the topic. There's some clear manipulation going on here. And ALL OF IT would be much more functional if SJM was honest with herself and the reader that Rhys is totally problematic and manipulative and too-alpha for anyone's good, and she's let Feyre slump into the role Tamlin wanted her to be in. If she actually worked on that relation, discussing how easy it is to fall into toxic roles, or back into bad patterns, it could be interesting and compelling. Instead it feels like being spoon-fed poison and told it's candy.
being w tamlin seems more interesting rn than being w rhys… can y’all believe this shitt cuz it’s true
The way i hate "happy ending with a child" trope is just... out of this world. Don't get me wrong, i like children, sometimes they're cute addition to the plotline etc. etc., but in ACoFaS? Feyre starts wanting a child only because she's having and existensial crisis (wtf girl, child isn't supposed to make you feel better or whole, work on your issues or he'll end up calling 300 yo women "mommy"), Rhys literally came seeing the image of his son (that made me throw a book across the room crying and throwing up ngl)
I like this serie, but what happened to Feyre and Rhysand in acofas and acosf (started even before that) was not only just a clown, but the whole circus
Heartily agree. Why is the child seen as this epitome of rewards for a relationship? As if it isn't hard. As if seeing a couple evolve through those hardships aren't worth watching, but can just be assumed to be a dance on roses. I also simply don't buy useless pregnant Feyre.
I completely agree. I kept wondering when the Cursebreaker was gonna make an appearance but she never came. And they knew exactly the risk there would be in making that deal that bound them. Now suddenly Rhys can't do anything remotely dangerous because of it...yeah, real genius move that was.
Yup XD I expected them to have more common sense than making such a stupid move, but oh well - it's ROMANTIC ;)
they really pulled a twilight bajsjsjsj (bella being extremely sick and on the verge of death when pregnant)
In twilight, though, the pregnancy difficulties made sense. Half-vampire fetus eating her from inside? Yeah, that would make her frail and useless(er).
In ACOSF I was just like "why doesn't she transform?" every scene they talked of the pregnancy X)
I only like Lucien 💀
LOVE LUCIEN
Let's hope she never actually gives him proper screen time or she'll probably ruin him, too ...
Hopefully
Same!
Ik just disappointed in how writer's havent written the truth about pregnant women ..they are terrifying. They are usually mean and in charge the entire time they are pregnant and no one wants to set them off. Ive seen it so many times.. pregnant women scare the crap out of me
Yeah honestly I hated most of ACOSF
And yet some people like it more than the others xD
There’s a Reddit discussion going on based on this video. The only thing I wanted to point out is the POV of acosf- it’s not Feyra. Let’s remember that Feyra and Rhys promised to never disagree in public. We have no idea how she reacted in private- and I have a hard time believing that she didn’t blow up at Rhys. It makes sense that Nesta wouldn’t know about any argument considering that she lives in the House of Wind. Not trying to defend Rhys and the Inner Circle for their betrayals- just pointing out that Feyra’s perspective didn’t exist in the book.
This is a good point, and it does work with what Feyre says in book 3 about wanting to keep internal conflicts private. However, Nesta isn't the only POV - Cassian is a POV as well, and he's damn close with Rhysand. There was an obvious opportunity for us to see Rhysand regret his actions through Cassian's POV.
Neither does the new POV's change the core actions. Rhysand keeps this crucial secret from Feyre for months. Nobody calls him out. There's no actual consequences to this. It's a ploy to get Feyre out of the plot and make Nesta the champion of the day - something that could've been done much more interestingly by making Feyre a badass pregnant woman and put her and Nesta on a mission together. (Never mind that the fact that the pregnancy is a problem is really contrived.)
The fact of the matter is that Rhysand removes Feyre's bodily autonomy. It's inexcusable :/ And not very in character IMO.
@@gryranfelt5473 agreed. It’s a pattern I’ve noticed with SMJ- that she poorly writes characters that are not the mains of a book. The biggest example of this being Mor. And I still have a hard time believing that Rhys would act so much like Tamlin considering how much he despised Tamlin’s controlling behavior- I always go back to him telling Feyra that too much love is harmful.
@@mskittybbi I honstly feel ACOSF is an elaborate fanfic.
@@gryranfelt5473 yeah but we have to remember that Cassian took Nesta t the mountains right after she told feyre I get what you say but there so going on in the book and also feyre still had her body autonomy, she just has a High-risk pregnancy, and for that, she would not be able to go on a mission like all the others. a mission like the ones in the book would actually harm her and the baby. (sorry my mom had a high-risk pregnancy with my brother so I remember she wasn't able to do a lot of stuff because of it because of the danger of miscarriage)
@@MariaAguirre-mu5tq Having a high-risk pregnancy isnt't taking her body autonomy away, is her capability of decision over her own body that's stripped away from her because her husband doesn't tell her all the information about the pregnancy that he knows, risking everything and making decisions on her behalf when she is completely capable of making those decisions over her own body and life herself. Rhys literally jeopardizes the entire future of Prythian because he doesn't tell Feyre about her certain death in childbirth (taking away her choice), fully knowing he'll die too. Also, she doesn't even have an opinion about it, despite being her life that's at risk and she is told to not transform because it can harm the baby, which is explained as "potential harm" while her death is certain, so maybe, just maybe, her opinion and decision will be to not continue with the pregnancy so Rhys and her can be there to protect and help Prythian in the upcoming war or her decision could also be shapeshift, even if it hurts the baby, which again is just a possibility, so she doesn't die in childbirth and Rhys doesn't die with her.
I read the first book and I am not sur if I should read the rest or not? I don''t want to ruin the story by reading something I might not like.
I really enjoyed the progression from book 1 into book 2. The third book is sort of meh - I like the first third but then it gets a bit superficial. The last book I do not recommend at all. it actively undoes a lot of the trilogy's work.
It's a trilogy with its pros and cons for sure, but I genuinely recommend that you read book 2.
Correction about Fayre with her cycles, it's twice a year, not once every two years. So she's had a few cycles before she got pregnant.
Yeah I’m dropping the series i genuinely can’t deal with this.
I wanna read the next one specifically bc Lucien will theoretically have a bigger part to play, and I wanna see if he snaps on them the way they deserve. “Better friend” my ass 😂
I hated this book! And now I hate the series.
For me the way Tamlin And Nesta treated Feyre is exactly the same. Both went through traumatic experience and later on traumatized Feyre. The difference is that people are justyfing Nestas actions bc of trauma but not Tamlins. Even though actually Tamlin had good intensions and apologized(which still doesnt justify his actions i am just saying he technically acted better than nesta and yet is more hated) For me SJM wanted to find a villain of the book and its stayed on Tamlin. In ACOSaF i felt like she was trying a lil bit to hard to justify her actions and for that wanted to make other characters look worse. I honestly dont get it Why she had to make Nestas and Feyre relationship a thing since Feyre founded a new family so for me it would be better If the go No contact. I feel like Rhys has not become Tamlin yet. For me he is not abusing her yet but honestly This series might be a cycle of abuse wheres Feyre beaing First abused by Nesta fall later bc of that to the abuse of Tamlin. So I am wondering If she would break the cycle with Rhys or stayed In a once again abusive relationship.
Eu fico muito em dúvida se o tamlin é abusivo ou tóxico por causa de um transtorno pós traumático.
Only acotar and acomaf are good in my opinion...cuz all others I think are stretched ....its jus my POV...and thats why I wouldn't read others...iv read acotar and acomaf...thats all!!!
You know, thank you for this video! I’m a writer, I mean I’m 12 so no one takes me seriously, including me. But this video gives me ideas for books, so thank you 🙏
If you keep at it, one day soon, people will :) Glad to have given some inspiration 🙌
Your age does not take away from your writer title!
It is good to start young and to learn at a young age. I hope future writers write more consciously about relationships.
I liked that about a series of unfortunate events. Pregnant woman being like a secret agent and doing bad ass stuff, jumping off high places, yes!
I think it’s a balance. Jumping off high places and doing combat IS a very hard task for a pregnant woman, not to mention dangerous. But the more trained you are before pregnancy, the more you can do (but for everyone the bar will become lower, and that’s something I personally want to explore as a writer - the reaction of competent women to no longer being able to bring their A game but still showing up and doing important work). And magic is certainly a way to get around the limits of pregnancies depending on how the magic system is set up. SJM decided to make Feyre even less useful than a human pregnant woman, so yay, very empowering choice. I work with so many women who keep showing up and doing important work far into late pregnancy. This trend is bullshit. We can acknowledge the hardships and weaknesses while elevating/focusing on the strengths. Feyre could absolutely have been part of the plot here, even if in more of a magical role.
Totalmente de acuerdo! Apenas me encuentro con este video y me encantó. Amo la saga, soy muy fan, y es difícil opinar de ella de esta forma debido a que el fandom tiene muy idealizados a sus personajes incluyendo a Rhys. Le tengo mucho cariño a Rhys pero si es cierto que nos intentan vender este personaje como "feminista" y perfecto, y el problema llega cuando nos intentan mostrar a Rhys como el perfecto e ideal pero resulta siendo ilógico debido a la falta de coherencia en las acciones de el propio Rhys (como cuando Rhys siempre quería que Feyre tomara sus propias decisiones y luego el no se lo permitió al no contarle sobre los riesgos del embarazo). También me recordó a Tamlin y note estas similitudes entre el y Rhys que obviamente cambia debido al contexto de la situación pero ahi siguen estando las similitudes de sus acciones. Y luego esta Feyre, la sigo amando pero personalmente le tome un poco de rabia a ella en este libro por que se olvidó completamente de quien era, perdió su voz propia comportándose solamente como la amorosa madre que no hace nada mas que sentarse en el sofá. Y también tenia la esperanza de que ella se molestara un poco con Rhys (e incluso con su circulo de amigos) por haberle mentido tanto tiempo sobre algo tan importante pero no lo hace, lo deja pasar y le resta importancia (y se no tenemos su punto de vista en ese momento pero al menos Cassian lo hubiese notado), básicamente perdió su espirito de guerrera para convertirse en la Mary sue de Rhys :/
Fue difícil encontrar a alguien que comparte tu opinión sin que te cancelen en twitter jajaja
Me gusto mucho tu video y tu contenido
Feyre se pierde desde el momento en quecse empareja con Rhysand. Le perdona de la noche a la mañana todas las atrocidades que le hace Rhysand en el primer libro, porque según él todo fue en nombre del amor 😒. Pero a Tamlin lo crucifica por encerrarla? No hay lógica. Feyre termina arrastrándose por Rhysand. En el segundo libro se deja humillar en la corte de las pesadillas posando casi desnuda y dejando que Rhysand manosee. No hay logica en los traumas de ella. Matar a inocentes la tramó, pero todo lo que le hizo Rhysand cada noche se le olvido ?
Es algo que no tiene coherencia alguna. Y ella permite que la siga controlando a lo largo de toda la serie. Pero parece que puede más el poder sexual que ejerce Rhysand sobre ella que su propia autonomía 😔
Wait I haven't read acosf, is it worth it? Omg im so scared and I'm worried that rhysand is toxic and I'm falling for a toxic relationship
To me it felt like reading fanfic. It's not up to bar. There's barely a plot. There was a lot of potential here - especially in the Feyre/Nesta dynamic - but little of it was played with. I'd say skip ACOSF and keep your love of Rhysand. Rhysand was never as "perfect" as the story made him out to be, but here he's downright toxic and goes against many of his actions and words in the other books.
@@gryranfelt5473 that literally sucks, I always have such high expectations for sjm and it makes me sad to know that this book isn't as good as most put it out to be
Hes always been toxic. He literally drugged Feyre in ACOTAR for "her own good" and made her erotic dance on him half naked knowing it was humiliating her. Never apologized, only explained.
@@fandomsnwriting yeah, going back now I realize just how screwed up that relationship is and (even if it isn't real) it shouldn't be smth ppl like you know what i mean?
@@myrissaroberson717 yes! And when they say Tamlin shielding her in the freaking mansion was worse it makes me SO MAD.
6:41 the same goes with rowan from throne and glass series
I disagree with everything you say here.
But love the discussion and hearing different reactions and perspectives to the same story. This is Nesta’s story who doesn’t respect or care for Rhys until the end and she’s upset with Feyre and going through her own depression and coming into her own identity. I liked that we saw Feyre and Rhys from a viewpoint that is outside of their own intentions. Often we love a character and overlook their flaws because we see who they are inside and how they see themselves. But no one is perfect and in this book we only see them from their actions towards Nesta and not their intention inside. We get a little of their intentions because of Cass telling some of the story but I thought the story did a good job of Nesta figuring things out and dealing with her own failures and how to come into the person she wants to be versed the one she has been in past actions.
Also, the whole, “just let the baby die”, is short sighted individualist perspective that many people (men and women) would never consider choosing, so it’s not an “easy solution” like you present here. I think that dilemma is a very common one and worth exploring in fiction. Just because you wouldn’t choose to go forward doesn’t mean others would look at it like you. I thought some of that struggle Feyre and Rhys went through was a good storyline.
Very good thoughts, and thank you for voicing them so kindly :)
I absolutely understand the not wanting to have an abortion. Even people who are pro-choice will often find themselves unable to go through with it. My problem with the story here is that it's never even brought up, despite the fact that everything is pointing toward Feyre dying. And in the end, she does die, only Deux Ex MachiNesta brings her back. Rhys had no plan, and neither had Feyre. Why is both of them dying better than having had an abortion? It seems pointless to me. It was very irresponsible, risking to leave all of the Night Court without a leader at a restless time like this. Considering an abortion would be the responsible thing here, no matter how wrong it felt (And I do absolutely acknowledge that many will feel wrong about that, which is fair). In any case, since death was so certain, having Feyre try and shift back to the form that could actually give birth would've been the simplest thing - if the baby died from it (I still don't see why, that explanation was too thin and convenient for my taste, I'm not convinced) then at least Feyre wouldn't die, and they would have been proactive about the situation. And if the baby survived, yay, fantastic. The big problem, really, is that Rhys "it's your choice" doesn't give Feyre the most important choice - whether or not she wants to live or die for something. He makes it for her. That, in my opinion, is unforgiveable, and a lord/king/emperor/leader is used to doing very, very difficult, uncomfortable things, so even though I know this was hard for him, he should've told her - instead of telling everyone to keep it from her, surrounding her with people who were lying to her. if it was so hard that he couldn't physically get it over his lips, asking their found family for help to communicate would've been an alternative path forward. In any case, punishing Nesta like that for telling Feyre the truth is neither here nor there in my opinion.
I did like quite a few moments from Nesta's struggles. I'm all for the bitchy, angry characters who can't seem to get their acts together. Bring the mess! My personal wish was simply that Feyre, Elain and Amren had been more involved. I would've loved for a Nesta/Pregnant Feyre going to save the world plotline while resolving their issues. I was so ready for crying about Feyre and Nesta finding each other. But that's just how I would've liked to see it go. The climax was quite good, I liked Nesta staying behind so her friends could win.
Have a nice day and thank you for taking the time to comment :)
@@gryranfelt5473 I’m glad my comment came across nice because my intention was to have a fun book discussion. Yay. I did actually think a lot while reading about why the baby being born problem wasn’t developed better. If it was Feyre’s perspective, like in the last books, I’d have expected much more strategic thinking and this left us with something to be desired. Even if her choice was to die, which is very in-character for Feyre (to die for who she loves) it seems like they would have told their friends, you’re taking over the kingdom if we die. Overall I was happy with Nestas story and didn’t miss Feyre and Rhys so maybe that’s why I didn’t dwell too much on this issue. But your points in the reply do remind me of some of my “during reading questions”
Now that this book is over, what do I read next 😢 I just finished Naomi Noviks book spinning silver then went onto this SJM book and feel like both were so entertaining I don’t know how I can pick another good one. 😆
@@daniellerussell9650 It's good point that there was much going on behind the scenes we didn't know of - I wish that had been played up more, though. If that was her choice, I wish that decision had been delved into, that her sisters had been given a chance to say "hey, you can't just die!" and, as you say, preparing the friend group for taking over.
The big problem was that by the time Feyre was told there was such a choice to be made, she was so very far along. I also have to admit I don't see the point of dying a martyr for someone who's going to die with you, anyway, and taking your mate and your people's sovereign with you in the process. It just doesn't seem very well-thought-out with zero gains xD I would get Feyre so, so much more if there was a quest of sorts where she had to achieve something to survive, and she decided to risk it, to take that chance for their child. It would also have made her a lot more pro-active, as in this book Feyre mostly just cried and sat on a couch, which I was a bit flustered about. Just because she isn't the protagonist doesn't mean she can't go do her own thing off-page. And again, I don't think Rhys has any right being the douchebag about it that he is when Nesta reveals it. He kept a life-or-death choice from his wife. He should be begging for forgiveness, not sending Nesta out for punishment. (And it's true we don't know if he begged for that forgiveness while he and Feyre were alone. He very well may have. I don't need to see that fight to believe it was there and Feyre kicked his ass, metaphorically. But Nesta's self-hatred for telling Feyre, along with Rhys' anger at her for doing it, did not work for me - to me those reactions were not deserved or warranted. If the angle had been more that Nesta knew it was the right thing to tell Feyre, but that she shouldn't have done it that WAY, in spite and with cruel words, that she should've done it earlier in a calm setting, that would've made me actually be with her as she walked through those mountains with Cassian, it would've made me feel her regret. As it was, when she was so full of self-loathing, all I could think was "girl, you were totally in the right, Feyre needed to know". Along the same lines, if Rhys had come out and been apologetic, admitting he just couldn't tell Feyre, and that Nesta was right to do as she did and he regrets his overreaction, that would also have sat better with me.)
Haha, ooooh, the book-hangover is the worst. That's how I feel about finishing the Red Rising series, though that's a bit of a different genre (dystopian science fiction with a rebellion and lots of battles and awesome friendships). I've considered reading Spinning Silver though, but I was a bit underwhelmed with her Temeraire series (It was cute, but I'm not that into historical fantasy where the fantasy elements don't change the history.) Is Spinning Silver that good? :) You might enjoy the Folk of the Air series by Holly Black, beginning with The Cruel Prince. I gobbled those up. They have a good balance between romance and plot and have a VERY different, more cruel, fae folk than ACOTAR. (You will probably have another book hangover though ...) An old favorite of mine is The Hollow Kingdom by Claire B. Dunkle. Fair warning, it's about goblins trying to steal a girl underground to spend her life there.
What else do you enjoy reading? :)
@@gryranfelt5473 I think I would have liked some of your suggested plot lines here. :) I did understand why Nesta thought (incorrectly) she was wrong for telling Feyre. She definitely delivered in the wrong way. But Nesta had a level of self hatred going on that I see as depression and SJM goes through a lot of the coping skills later in the book to start Nesta herself seeing she has value. But at the time she tells Feyre she doesn’t believe that about herself. This bit of writing about Nesta overcoming that depression is what makes me enjoy the book rather than not.
I love red rising series!!! I have The Cruel Prince on hold at my library, so now I’m extra excited for it to come in. Something about a book recommendation rises it for me.
Spinning silver was very enjoyable for me. It was the two women’s stories and overcoming and figuring out how her business enterprise works and tough decisions for me. I read Uprooted by Naomi Novik as well and enjoyed but not like Spinning Silver.
For other books/series I’ve loved: Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss … however it’s a beast in length and I had to be in a certain mood to get through it. (I was traveling for work for 6 weeks working 10 hour days and it was snowing so nothing to do after except read in hotel 😂). And the saddest part of the series is we don’t know if the series will ever be done. It’s been like 10 years with no next book.
I love like love love love Louise Penny’s Armand Gamache series… murder mystery (so warning there) which I don’t go after a lot but the themes of human nature and how people love and sometimes don’t I really like.
A short standalone I liked was “All Systems Red” by Martha Wells.
@@daniellerussell9650 I do love any book touching on those topics, and I especially enjoyed the implementation of meditation. As someone who used meditation as one tool to get through depression myself, I thought that was very sound advice - although I was a bit frustrated with how quickly they grasped it. Meditation can be very ... aggravating, haha x'D That's one of the reasons I really love the meditation scenes with Eragon in The Eldest, book 2 of the inheritance cycle. Damn, that scene just got the pain of sitting still.
Yay for Red Rising! It really was an impressive book, I loved Darrow to death, although the author frustrated me to no end with how he treated the Mustang/Darrow relationship in book 3. (Sigh, that will no doubt be a video xD)
Hearing someone else speak well of a book is definitely one of the most important things for me in reading it. I've now heard nice words for Spinning Silver twice, so I'll have to check it out :) Also adding the Armand Gamache to my goodreads tbr, but we'll see ... I'm not much of a mystery reader, I often don't realize I'm supposed to try and figure things out. Give me court intrigues and I will try to figure out the schemers, but a murder? Eh. The detective will probably handle it xD You saying you're not much into mystery but still liked it definitely says volumes.
I loved name of the wind to bits, too. I've heard there's going to be four books, which I predicted like four years ago, so yay, he finally accepted his fate. But yeah, I'm not buying any more books until the final one is out :/ I'll have to reread it too, like you say, it's been ten years xD
If you enjoy high adult fantasy with beautiful prose and complex characterization, I'd recommend She Who Became The Sun. It's a tad on the slow end for many readers, but I looooved it. It's set in China (don't remember the year) and is about a girl who ends up claiming her brother's name in order to survive the horrors of a famine - and that leads her on the path to greatness. It's wonderful! (But brutal, fair warning, although not that graphic)
Not to criticise, but I would just like to inform you that the Fae have their cycle twice a year. Not once in two years
yeah, but if we are being honest, Rhys is always trying to solve the problems by himself without asking for help when he knows he needs it. and it isn't until he is called out on it that he accept the help. because if we look at it he never talked about his trauma with Amarantha until feyre told him to tell her and many other things. I feel like he wanted to solve it by himself because it was a high-risk pregnancy and like it was said in the books all the c-sections ended in killing the baby and the mother. and also we cannot look at it from a modern perspective because even if it's fantasy the tools to try it and what I can only imagine could be the time period it's not described as a modern one. and we can't compare Tamlin's actions to Rhys because it's simply not the same situation, Rhys lied to her because the truth of the pregnancy could affect the well-being of her and the baby due to the amount of stress and anxiety ( the first three months of any women pregnancy are the most dangerous one's and because the baby it's so small it would only take a great amount of stress to induce a natural miscarriage). Tamlin was abusive and possessive towards her. Tamlin wanted to keep her away from people, isolate her so that she could love him and only him. he wanted to control her in many ways. besides in the acosf book feyre does more as a high lady than only stand there and look pretty, she helps Cassian, gave him advice for Nesta on how to help her, and more things that I don't remember as of right now. and we also should take into account that acosf is from Nesta and Cassian's POV not Rhys or Feyre's so we don't know what she is doing or thinking aside from her interactions with the narrators.
Also, Nesta told feyre about the pregnancy not because she wanted feyre to know the truth, it was because she got fed up with people being hypocrites to herself and wanted feyre to suffer just like she was, and we really don't know what she said to Rhys after that. we can only assume what happen and I don't think feyre took it lightly. and Rhys reaction was even though it was a little exaggerated it was completely justified because of what he has lost in the past and what he might lose now thanks to Nesta and he knows there's a new treat coming so I can only imagine the amount of stress, anxiety, anger and let's not forget about the PTSD he still has about the previous war the fought a year prior to acosf. and we never see him deal with any of it or get any help on the books.
I'm sorry if I'm coming off as rude but I just finish the book and I don't have anyone to discuss it with and I will love having a book discussion on the matter
@@MariaAguirre-mu5tq Yeah, but a natural miscarriage wouldn’t have been the worst thing, considering that in that time period a LOT of women had miscarriages (often multiple) and survived. It would have been safest honestly if she had an early trimester miscarriage. Unless he was prioritizing the pregnancy over Ferya’s safety. ALSO: The original Tam Lin myth actually includes the main heroine (Janet) trying to have an abortion. She was picking herbs that, when brewed into a tonic, were said to induce a miscarriage. And while in reality, those herbs rarely if ever worked, in the myth, it’s implied that they WOULD work if she went through with it, she just chooses not to because (blah blah she only wanted to terminate the pregnancy because she didn’t want to be a single mother and then she finds a way to save Tam Lin from the Fey queen so he can be a stay at home dad like he wanted and she can have a family on her terms blah blah). So it’s just very odd that none of those abortion techniques were tried or even mentioned in the book, when they were literally described in full in the original fairy tale from the time period this book takes place. And SJM COULD HAVE written in a few chapters from Feyre’s perspective to show her reaction. These aren’t real people. Saying ‘we don’t know what happened behind closed doors but she PROBABLY did this’ is literally writing fanfic to fill in an important dramatic beat SJM didn’t write for her main characters. But Ferye’s thoughts and feelings on her own pregnancy, her reaction to Rhy’s smothering behavior, how she deals with his betrayal-these are things the story doesn’t care about. Rhysand seems abusive and controlling and uninterested in Feyre’s feelings about her own body or her right to choose the type of care she wants because Sarah J Mass HERSELF is utterly uninterested in those things. Which means, yeah, Rhysand is abusive in this, she messed up when writing him in this. I just don’t understand why she would want to tell THIS story for Feyre if she didn’t want to write it from Feyre’s perspective. I mean, it’s an interpersonal drama/emotional conflict/character development JACKPOT for Feyre, and a great opportunity to further develop Feyre and Rhysand’s relationship. She COULD have been furious with him, and betrayed, and point out how he’s always saying ‘it’s your choice’ only to deprive her of the ability to choose how to handle her pregnancy or, worst comes to worst, spend her final days; Rhysand could have been defensive and say he was only trying to protect her and he didn’t want her to be miserable; Feyre could have told him it doesn’t matter, literally all of her friends and family had to lie to her about her own pregnancy and death for months because of him, and she never wants to be in a situation where all her loved ones know more of her MEDICAL INFORMATION than he does; he could have apologized for hurting her, but an abortion or c section was almost guaranteed death-he knows how fairy pregnancy goes-and he couldn’t bare to see her go through the emotional pain he was going through knowing she was going to die, and he didn’t want her to grow to hate the baby inside her knowing there was nothing they could do; that’s when Feyre could drop the bombshell about human abortion methods-herbs, medicines, exercises, things all human women old enough to bleed are taught about; she could have explained that there WERE other options, ones she knew about and he didn’t, and they could have tried all of them if Rhysand hadn’t forced her own doctor to lie to her; she could have told him that his refusal to accept help and his insistance on solving problems on his own are not behaviors she can put up with when they cause him to take away her personal agency-and now they’re going to cost Feyre her life; she could have told him that she’s an adult and has a right to experience all the pain and hard decisions that come with being a pregnant woman or being fatally ill or any other adult situation, and she DEFINITELY has the right to choose how to cope with her own death; she could have told him that he cared more about the pain HE would feel having to see his wife struggle with her own mortality than he did her right to have opinions and agency in her OWN life; Rhysand could have realized “shit, Feyre’s totally right, and now Feyre’s death is on me”; Rhysand could have, instead of letting himself drown in guilt and self hatred (which would force Feyre’s focus back on HIS emotions), talked to her about how she feels about the pregnancy, and what she wants to do next; they could have then gone over all of the options with Feyre’s doctor together, and Feyre could have started doing her own research and calling alternative medical professionals based on HER knowledge of pregnancy; through that, she could have discovered an ‘experimental method’ of treatment where mumbo jumbo someone has to give up their magic (whatever Nesta did); she could have asked Rhysand if he’d be willing to try this and become human for a bit until they found a way to change him back, and he agrees, telling her that she spent most of her life human, and even though it may be scary for him it’s not a curse, and he knows from Feyre’s transformation that his mind and soul won’t change just because he’s human; Rhysand could reflect-quietly, to himself-that as much as he loved Feyre, he never fully respected her as an equal, because he deep down thought she was always at a disadvantage for having started human, always one step behind; but now he realizes she isn’t an intelligent capable woman in SPITE of her origins, but instead because of them, and though her life has been shorter her background is just as rich as his; Rhysand’s relationship with Feyre could have now affected more than his opinion on one woman, it made him realize that even with less technology and power than fairies, human minds and human culture are equal to Fey culture, and writing them off not only hurt his relationship with Feyre, but is hurting Fey society as a whole. All that COULD have happened! But Sarah J Mass just...didn’t write any of it. Which means that *whoops* she wrote Rhysand like an abusive asshole in this book without writing any closure or emotional growth to conclude the plot thread and make his actions forgivable or, at least, worth including in the book instead of writing literally any other reason for Feyre and Rhysand to be out of the main plot.
@@nicolersands I don't get why y'all so angry. This is just fiction and characters make dumb decisions. This is not the reality. People read Dark Romance in which the female lead forget her damn rights and no one points out that. This is just a book, so get over it. I don't get all the hate. English is not first my language , I hope you get what i mean
@nicolersands you are an amazing story teller. And you should write a story exploring such complicated interpersonal Relationships....i would read it if u wrote
I actually disagree with most of this. To begin, the concept that Feyre could not shift during the duration of her pregnancy makes sense. And here is why, in the book it states that when Feyre shifts it is on a molecular level. Witch means that during this shift were all here molecules are in motion the umbilical cord could become destabilized, ruptured, or simply stop working because her body was going through a transformation. Now a rebuttal used for this argument often is that the only part of her body shifting was the desired area, however this is untrue. As stated before whenever Feyre shifts her entire body shifts as well wether we are able to see it or not.
Second I don’t think that Rhysand was acting like Tamlin I think the author decided to put that part into the storyline to simply show that Feyre and Rhysand have problems and that we all make mistakes. She did this because at the end of the “court of Thorns and Roses” series there was a very perfect feel to there life and relationship. So she did that to add depth and extra development to the characters.
Most of all I would just like to say that I am definitely not attacking anyone just sharing my opinion in this section after watching this vid.
We all make mistakes,we acknowledge them,apologize and grown. Well Rhys DIDN'T,the problem with him making that big decision to keep the truth to Feyre,and take the decision to have or don't have the baby from her,letting her be happy about a thing that he know will literally take her life away is that he don't acknowledge it in the end,and when the only person in the book say Feyre the truth,as it should have been,he literally tried to MURDER her. Now a mistake is something you did not knowing the consequences,Rhys now what would happen if he didn't tell the truth to his wife,and give her the right to make her owrn choices (like always say,but is clearly show that he love making choice for others)
And the wors of all,he tried to murder her sister for telling Feyre the truth,that literally sick,trying to murder the sister of your wife is obviously awful,for telling her that she gonna die? Bitch are you crazy?
And in the end he didn't apologize to Feyre,he didn't feel bad for what he did,he wasn't called out for no one,Sarah j maas didn't write a couple simple problem or mistake,she write a BIG problem that could happen in real life (keeping for Your wife that she could die in pregnancy) and didn't solve it the right way.
@@Moonlightss320 we didn't see what happened after that because Cassian took Nesta to the mountains and they both agreed to never disagree in public.
First off, don’t no one fight me: I still love these two as a couple.
I think the point here is the narrative choice, which I agree. It’s inconsistent.
It becomes shitty Twilight in this book.
Agreeed!! ❤
I agree. I enjoyed the first two books. The third was fine as an ending, but the magic is in book 2. There's a lot that can be critiqued, but ultimately it worked. Silver Flames feels like bad fanfic.
The cycle is twice a year
Well ... feysand cuz the Suriel said so so THEREFORE IT IS LAW. honestly....Tamlin wasn't that bad if a character...but the way he handled things was not ok. He apologized, but then would Immediately neglect Feyre again. Rhys trained her to harness and better understand her abilities. And while I'm sure there are some flaws....there are in every relationship. But it was no where near as bad as Tamlin's. It shows that you shouldn't fall in love with the first guy who says I love you....I mean I know he did... But it was suffocating. And he got several chances to change ....when I tried giving him a chance...and he immediately went back and blamed Rhys for Feyre leaving. Like Rhys lets Feyre go badass on a battlefield if she wants. But I think Tamlin did deserve more character development...but I honestly don't think Rhys was a bad character at all.
There's two cycles at year ,not just one..
Also are we not sus that Amern is also pregnant in ACOSF…
I totally agree with you! Thank you for saying this!🙏🏽
Completely agree with all everything you said. It just didn't make any sense.
No. Just no lol
It is not Ri sand. It’s Rheee sand. If you listen to the audiobook it will show you. I’m sorry but it’s just a bit annoying that you’re doing a video about a character and don’t know how to say his name correctly.
Hahahahhahahahaha Rhys is not worse than Tamlin nor he can be compared lmao Nobody was forcing Feyre to have a baby. They literally wanted that, they were really happy :)
Dumb Rhysand fan
Tamlin is a bad guy bc he didn’t involve her or tell her information that she was very much entitled to, he wanted to protect her and went way overboard in doing so, and he wouldn’t even educate her about the changes in her own body and how they might bring her harm in the future. Rhysand does the exact same thing in this situation.
I don’t hate Rhys, but he could be a lot better.