IBM Model M keyboard ultimate roundup!
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2024
- The iconic (and iconically clicky) IBM Model M keyboard has been a fan favorite for three full decades now - an unbelievable run in computer years. I take a look at the major revisions in this video, and I also answer the question of whether it's still worth buying one in this second age of mechanical keyboards. Is the Model M still the One True Keyboard, and if so, which one should you get?
Some helpful links mentioned in the video:
All of the different model numbers and minor variants of the "Enhanced Keyboard": deskthority.net/wiki/IBM_Enha...
The screw, nut and bolt mod featured in the video: deskthority.net/workshop-f7/i...
Another site with slightly different instructions: wiki.geekhack.org/index.php?ti...
Phosphor Glow will bolt mod your keyboard for you: phosphorglow.net/
Keep in mind that everyone does the screw/bolt mod a slightly different way. There's not one way to do it.
Buy a pre-modded Model M on Ebay: ebay.to/2lWfkQy
Where to get the screws, nuts, and bolts in my video: www.mcmaster.com/
Part #'s:
Screws for screw mod: 91099A107 (I chose these on purpose for their undercut flat head)
Screws for bolt mod: 92005A029
Nuts for bolt mod: 90591A111
You can also get the required 5.5mm long socket there: 7195A38
Unicomp if you just want a new Model M, but I can't vouch for these yet, and my understanding is that the quality isn't quite the same (then again, some say the same about the blue logo Lexmarks): www.unicomp.com
IBM PC image attribution: Rama & Musée Bolo (commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...)
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/ modernclassicyt - Věda a technologie
First job from school. I had to help in the despatch department sometimes. The securicor parcel labels were generated on an IBM 286 pc. Straight away I knew there was something special about the keyboard. After the machine was retired the keyboard somehow found
it's way home with me and I've owned a number of them over the years
I'm still using the blue one since mid 90s.
I bought a Blue Label Model M for $40, and I'll never look back (although partly because it is a fantastic conversation starter)
Great video!
I currently own two 'black and white label' model Ms from 1987-88. These have a detachable cable like the earlier silver label model M, so that attached cable is probably more common on terminal keyboards. Interestingly, the 1987 white label keyboard has metal stabilizers while the 1988 keyboard has the plastic stabilizers, so you can't tell what type it will have by label alone. (Personally, I think that the plastic stabilizers feel much better.)
Two other interesting design features that changed over the model range are the switchable key caps and drainage ports. Early IBM keyboards had easily switchable key caps on top of plastic stems, while later Lexmarks integrated the stem into the key cap. The feel is slightly different, though I personally have no preference either way (aside from the fact that it's just sort of fun to pull the old style key caps off with my bare fingers.) Later IBM and Lexmark models also had drainage channels built into them that early IBM keyboards did not. This meant that spilling something into these keyboards didn't mean certain death for them.
I hadn't typed on one of these in years but I still remembered exactly how they feel. My school district had only IBM PCs for most of my years as a student, from 1989-2001. Even in the late 90s/early 2000s they were basically the same. I found a crate full of them in an old warehouse a couple years back and I was able to take a few. They are just great tactile feeling keyboards that rarely break, and when they do they're easy to repair and clean. I clean one frame and keys in the dishwasher a few times a year on a light cycle, and it comes out just fine.
Excellent video. Typing this comment on a "compact" Model M2 and I have to say nothing compares to the smooth actuation feel of a well looked after buckling spring switch. I should note that I am the original owner of this keyboard and have always looked after it, so buyer beware if you are looking for a used one.
Got a 1991 Mexican Model M (IBM branded, grey logo, detachable cable) a couple of years ago for only 25 bucks.
Back in the day when you buy the Model M, the company Cherry MX made mechanical keyboards since 80s, and ALPs too (among many others, clones or not). Another thing are the gaming mechanical keyboards, i think SteelSeries was the first
I am using model M even now :) great keyboard!
Great video! As it happens, I'm typing this comment to you on one of the first Model M's, a p/n 1390131 with the early "barcode" (Model-F-style) label. (Okay, what can I say-I'm a keeb geek.) Model M's were so well made, you can usually clean them up and they look and work like they just came out of the factory-and what fun they are to type on! Those were days when companies didn't make things intentionally shoddy so you'd have to keep buying them over and over... What a concept, huh?
Hmm... I just looked in my basement and found two Model Ms with 1984 labels. I did contract work for IBM in Boca Raton back then and got a passel of these keyboards from Engineering. Never been used. And yes, the tactile feel is awesome thanks to you reminding me that I had those stuffed on top of the HVAC ducts along with a bunch of PS/2 keyboards. Thanks for bringing back memories of those days. I stopped using a couple others because they didn’t have the Windows key (which I use a lot) but I’m thinking I may want to start again. Seriously, thanks.
Nice! I have some keyboards with windows buttons if you want to trade. I'll even throw in the one with the built in calculator. :)
I just bought a K70, and had been using a Model M for quite a while and I do miss the typing. I wish unicomp would make a more modern LED backlit model M, I'd be in love
I do miss backlighting when I type on a Model M these days too. I know some people don't need it (and some other high-end mechanical keyboards like the Das Keyboard don't have it), but I often use my PC in a darkened room.
I used a unicomp model M keyboard awhile back. As far as I could tell, it was a nearly perfect clone of the model M in the key feel and appearance. Maybe not quite as heavy, though they do make several different models, some more hefty than others. They even make a model that has the thinkpad track pointer and mouse buttons. They are also available in white and black. A very nice keyboard and reasonable in price.
I bought the Unicomp Classic 101 March 2021 and now September 2023. Used a few times and was put into storage. Recently rediscovered and noticed "P" key was acting erratic requiring two or three taps to make contact. Contacted Unicomp and was given RMA but would cost $48.00 plus $16 shipping. After doing my own disassembly I found all but 6 plastic rivet heads were broken off. Unicomp claims this issue was resolved before I purchased in 2021. I would not advise purchasing from Unicomp based on my experience.
@@LanceMcGrew Have you tried the bolt and nut mod to replace those rivets
Believe it or not, I just got 2 Model Ms for free from a craigslist ad. Older guy whos son was making him empty out his house. Old CRTs, keyboards, mice... it was truly the land of beige. Both keyboards are blue logo, but one says made by Lexmark with a non removable cord, while the other just says it was made by IBM and does have a removable cord. The weird thing is that the Lexmark is a PS2 connection and the IBM has a similar connector, but with a few less pins so not PS2? Also, one is missing the down and right arrow keys and the Unicomp keyboard I had before hand DOES fit the same keys, but its a slightly lighter color tone of grey.
I'm typing this with my 42H1292 from 1996. It looks brand new, feels amazing, and was under $100. I totally agree that if you aren't a diehard collector, disregard the color of the label. They're all awesome keyboards.
no wonder they are co comfortable, want one of these to using with my laptop..
Have you compared your Model M keyboards to the Unicomp Ultra Classic? I would love to know how they compare.
I haven't, and I probably won't buy another Unicomp :) AFAIK the Ultra Classic is just the same exact inner assembly with a smaller case around it, but I really can't say if that'd make it better or worse. The tooling should be a bit newer, at least, but I doubt they're using any thicker plastic.
I went from a silver label to a Unicomp. The feel is so close, that I can't be sure I'm not imagining the difference. The mold quality isn't _quite_ as nice, but it's still above average. I've typed on a _lot_ of buckling spring keyboards (including a brief job using mainframe terminals) and I've had no regrets about my Unicomp purchase.
Yea, I had one for years. They're a quality product, especially for the price. I remember when I bought one and I got looks for spending almost $100 on a keyboard. And now that seems quaint.
Hmm, not sure I can agree with not being able to tell the difference. My unicomp feels crisper and more hollow, and the keyboard itself is much lighter with creaky plastic. My model M feels fuller and thicker. Not saying they aren't worth the money, but I also wouldn't put them in the same class, but rather, as a second rate version that is similar.
Regardless, neither feel as good or as satisfying as my model f. However, I do have time invested in it as I did a full foam replacement with foam that won't fall apart with age.
That said, I only use my model f or model m's in the office. I would never use it for my recreational computer. Horrible rollover and long throw leading to fatigue make them horrible for gaming. I use clear switches with lighter springs.
Old comment but I love using the M for gaming. However, I think the F would be better since the F has NKRO and is lighter.
Unicomp's molding process is utilizing old worn out tooling. I heard that they are replacing the old tooling.
@@rich1051414I agree with your statement on model Fs being superior.
I suppose they're great to type on, but I remember them being hell to listen to when someone else is typing. A friend revivified his old Model M last year, and it convinced me I wanted none of that. However, I've been using a clicky MX blue knock-off, and it's pretty nice. Looking at Alps (matias) switches as something that combines the tactility of buckling spring without so much noise.
No, you can't really use one in an open office. But they sound sweet when you're typing yourself, so at home, go nuts.
Cherry switches really don't compare to buckling springs or even older Alps switches (as you can see in the video; my Corsair uses MX blues). I used to have an NMB keyboard with clicky Alps switches, but those weren't much quieter than a Model M. They felt good, though, but they wore out quickly. I don't personally feel like any keyboard that doesn't audibly click can really replicate the clicky feel, though. The click is a natural byproduct of the mechanism, so removing the click requires either damping it somehow or changing the way the mechanism works, both of which compromise feel.
@@ModernClassicMaybe try a rubber mat between the metal backplate and membrane, that might bring the noise down.
Back in 1999, I picked up a BLACK M13 for the same price. I almost sold it when I saw how much they were going for on fleabay, but decided I liked it enough to keep. I found another at a garage sale, in it's own box, seemingly unused. That's my backup, but I don't think I will ever wear out the first one. By the time I die, maybe my grandkids will be able to sell it for enough to finance their college tuition.
good video
it's amazing I made it to a video about keyboards from my desktop without even using mine; just the mouse
I have multiple IBM Model M keyboards. Guess I'm a bit obsessed with them lol. I have one for my gaming/personal computer setup which I also use for work since I work from home these days. Used to use my other one at the office.
I have bolt modded a few of these keyboards and can say it can be a real pain and be tedious to get it to a level where everything works 100%. For example, on the one I'm typing on now at times the ctrl key gets stuck as being registered as me holding down ctrl. Other times the n, p, or h key would repeat on me. I'd type h in a word and it would register two h characters. I would say that the screw mod may be a better choice to try. Though, I've gotten the hang of bolt modding. I type a lot and havn't seen the bolts fall off yet. I suppose one can use lock tight on the threads also. I've learned also not to tighten the bolts too much otherwise you'll get a keyboard that may not work at all properly.
I've named my keyboards lol:
Rhonda - My IBM Model M that has that beige IBM logo with black lettering. Its been bolt modded and I've had to replace the barrel plate along with some of its buckling springs. This keyboard is used a ton and is the keyboard I am typing this message on now.
Mandy - My IBM Model M that has a blue IBM lettered logo. Not bolt modded and was never taken apart yet. It works well to this day but currently is sitting in my drawer.
Cindy - My IBM Model M that is older than Rhonda and has same style logo. Backplate was very well made and I only bolt modded this keyboard. I had a parts keyboard I took some stuff off of and put on this keyboard. It is a fully functional well made satisfying to type on keyboard
Rachael - Also a older keyboard just like Cindy and Rhonda. Bolt modded this one as well. Works very good.
All keyboards I've worked on are very clean. I've taken all components off and have refreshed/repaired anything found broken. For example, I've had to use conductive paint to fix some of the printed circuitry on the plastic membranes. I like the feel of the older ones and also can say that the blue IBM logo one is also great to type on.
I have used a friend's new gaming mechanical keyboard when I stayed over however it is nothing compared to my IBM Model M keyboards. His keyboard did repeat keys at some times but he was saying I type too fast but whatever.
In any case, I've geeked out enough about these keyboards :). I don't have all the keyboards in front of me so I otherwise would of posted the manufacturer dates as well.
I've been programming for 30 years. In fact, I learned Pascal in 1992 on a PS/2 with this keyboard. I was glad that we phased out this style of keyboard. When you work with other programmers, you don't want to hear the sound of their keyboards. It is distracting and it affects your productivity. Most programmers type faster on modern keyboards. The extra force required to type on these old fashioned keyboards just slows us down. If you want to use one alone at home, more power to you. Just don't bring one into the office.
You may prefer a lighter force, but most membrane keyboards actually require more actuation force than the Model M. As I say in the video, IBM literally helped write the book on ergonomics and they did a lot of research into the "ideal" actuation force and key travel to reduce repetitive stress injuries (these things are interactive; if you increase one, you need to increase the other). The Model M was designed to give the least amount of physical stress to your fingers as possible.
Way back, I bought several of these, and also many IBM computers. I shouldn't say "bought" because the flea market seller gave them to me for free because at the time, it was considered junk.
That was 20 years ago now, wow :D I wish I still had that old IBM computer, it would actually be worth a bit of money now!
If you had even one, I'd probably buy it from you! I've been wanting an original IBM PC for a long time. I remember using one at my friend's house when they were new - it felt very "adult" and high end compared to other computers at that time.
you should try a cherry mx green. if you like force of buckling springs id like to hear your opinion on green switches
Great video! This is one of the best Model M roundups I have seen, keep up the good work! I have 2 IBM Model M’s, one is a 1992 black label and the other is a 1996 blue label. The Blue label is actually NOT made by Lexmark but by IBM in Scotland. IBM still made Model M’s well into 1997. I disagree with your view that there ‘aren’t any real differences between years and models’. My black label Model M has a much more consistent key feel than my blue label and the stabilisers feel a lot better. But I feel that the blue label has a better build quality over the black label. A lot of rivets have gotten loose on the black label but none have shown any signs of wear on the blue label. It feels a lot sturdier and inconsistent, if that makes any sense. One day I would like to compare them to Lexmark branded and Unicomp models.
There are too many variables to really accurately quantify "feel", which was a big part of my point. The only thing you can really control for when you buy one of these is how new it is, which is the only way you can at least try to avoid the rivet issue (for now), and hopefully get a cleaner keyboard too. So you may as well get a blue logo M, despite the stigma of them being "made by Lexmark".
I don't really know anything about Scottish Model M's... I'd be curious to try one out but that is a different factory using different tooling, so things may well be different with those. All the US Model M's, from the silver label through the blue label were made in the same factory in Kentucky using the exact same tooling, and they all feel more or less the same except for different levels of wear and tear from what I can tell.
I have (and am currently using) a 1992 Model M. It is a black label and no mention of Lexmark on the cast or sticker. BUT there is on the controller chip. I have the detachable cable and the speaker grill.
Sadly I did get liquid in the keyboard a couple weeks ago and have since bolt modded it since I had to remove the plastic rivets to clean the membrane.
Honestly though. I can't stop using my Model M.
I used nuts and bolts, typical bolt mod. If that fails... Good ol' blue loctite. Works for a vehicle's suspension components, it'll work for a keyboard.
Also, the unicomp model m used to be absolutely inferior to the model m, but their new model m, comes almost identically close to the real thing, and it has a windows key...
Are the 2002 IBM Model M's still buckling spring ones?
I began my computing life on the model F. When I started using model Ms I actually didn't like them. Mainly because the position of the function keys - which I used a lot back then - and the the arrow keys and home/end/pgup/pgdn being separated. I also found it too noisy.
Up until today I still use the arrows on the numeric pad because the separated arrows and home/end are annoying.
Do that Unicomp review pls!
Well to be honest i havent owned a Model M keyboard since the 90's.
The closest to one i have is an XT/AT Honeywell Keyboard 'Model 101WN' its quite funny when people saw it hooked up to my main PC
What are the dates on the square label m? It looks odd to have a square label and no rainbow metal plate.
I Used my "blue one" to type and using during gaming until just a few years ago.. Then, a horrible day, I dropped a shot of Jägermeister into it. Heck.. I better find it now and rapair it!
I have 1 unicomp and 1 grey logo model M keyboard, both have the "+" and "enter" keys from the numerical keypad not working, do you know any reasons for that? I think they have the same problem causes. However, I have a blue logo and 1 silver plate one. Model M is my favorite keyboard that I will not use other new style mechanical keyboard.
I bought the Unicomp Classic 101 March 2021 and now September 2023. Used a few times and was put into storage. Recently rediscovered and noticed "P" key was acting erratic requiring two or three taps to make contact. Contacted Unicomp and was given RMA but would cost $48.00 plus $16 shipping. After doing my own disassembly I found all but 6 plastic rivet heads were broken off. Unicomp claims this issue was resolved before I purchased in 2021. I would not advise purchasing from Unicomp based on my experience.
The only thing I really got hung up over was changeable keycaps and being able to remove the cable. I also got a blue logo one made in 91 with detachable cable and not a single rivet being broken. I wonder if they change the plastic or if it will break in a few years :c
My blue logo M has changeable keycaps - yours doesn't?
I use a Dell AT101 as my main keyboard. The Alps switches have a fairly similar feeling and I was able to get mine new in box for a very good price. In terms of quality it seems that nothing modern compares favorably to the tanks of the past.
Old comment but does yours have salmon, pine black, or bamboo black switches?
I dug 8 of these PS/2 Model M's out of the barn to standardize on. I have cables for 4 and ordered more cables for the rest. They all work in a PS/2 port, however, the PS/2 to USB converters I ordered from them don't seem to work. One one of these videos they said you need a special converter as the regular converters are for keyboards that were already "USB compatible". Any clarification would be helpful.
Are what you have really "converters" or just "adapters"? The latter will let you plug a PS/2 device into a USB port but it doesn't do anything to the signal. A converter actually has electronics that convert the signal. Usually these have a little box or "wart" at the end or inline somewhere. That's what you need if it's not what you have. Most of those should work, and do from what I've read.
@@ModernClassic Yeah, i found the keyword I needed to include... "Active" ps2 to usb converter. I ordered on e yesterday we'll see how ut goes. Half my mobos have ps2 ports on them, half dont. My main nachines do so aive been enjoying them and remapping useless keys with Sharpkeys. Right Cntrl toWindows key seems to be the most useful remap so far, and scrolllock to mute.
@@ModernClassic PS/2 Model 30 and 50's, we would of gave the whole stack of them to you free. Oddly, in retrospect, they probably would of made good POS terminals for places like Autozone or library terminals, but by the time we got them, everyone was rocking a Pentium 233MMX so an 8086 and 286 with VGA monitor and less than a gb of ram were looking beyond pretty crufty.
Still got a barn full of 486's and Pentiums, and al the classic 8 bits... Kayrpros, Heathkits, Osbornes, PETs, Vics, Apples, Macs, Commodores, a Timex, a coule of TRS Model 1, II, and IIIs. You would think I'd be all over them but nope, it's too much of a hassle now to even set one up and wire it together on a table and boo them. No space, no interest.. because.. no internet.
Every now and then I want to fire up a C=128D or Macintosh SE, but then the moment passes and I just watch a video online :)
@@choppergirl Well I might still be interested in some of what you've got in that "barn" :) especially the 8 bit stuff but even maybe some of the older 486's. Let me know if you do really want to part with any of it. Maybe we can come to an arrangement.
I have an IBM Space saving keyboard that I picked up out of the trash. I know it worked with my Win Me machine, but I'm thinking about using it with my Win 10/ Debian machine.
You should try the mx black switches.They are linear and i guess feel the closest to the model m. I can't believe it didn't die in 17 years, some old laptops, mice, monitors etc still work to this day which is crazy, all the latest parts break in 3-5.
Buckling springs aren't linear, though. They're tactile and clicky. MX Blues are the closest, but they're still not very close. Still, they are what I use most of the time.
mx greens are a lot closer in terms of actuation force, though also harder to find on most keyboards. a lot of what people miss about buckling springs turns out to be their stiffness.
No, all modern switches suck. I tested them, they are scratchy as hell.
@@kaitlyn__Lnope, it was the crispy feel. They also have a truly good feel about them. It was more than the stiffness. I have a switch tester, I tested the green switch on a switch sample. They suck
@@MitchellJBridges I mean, I hate greens. But I also don’t like buckling springs much - I’m a white or blue ALPS gal (or Kailh Box)
Found one on fb mp near me that is only AUD$150 tempted to buy it just to try it out and join the retro kb club ^^
I actually found the Unicomp model to have softer springs than my 1986 1390120 (which has the Mandolin crystal that was at the epicentre of a public outrage a couple years back).
What’s the Mandolin crystal ?
@@maxtwentynine5968 that’s the crystal that provides the clock pulse I think
I bought the Unicomp Classic 101 March 2021 and now September 2023. Used a few times and was put into storage. Recently rediscovered and noticed "P" key was acting erratic requiring two or three taps to make contact. Contacted Unicomp and was given RMA but would cost $48.00 plus $16 shipping. After doing my own disassembly I found all but 6 plastic rivet heads were broken off. Unicomp claims this issue was resolved before I purchased in 2021. I would not advise purchasing from Unicomp based on my experience.
Does your model m use din5? How do you convert it to USB?
Wow os that first one you use cleaaaan
I own a unicomp keyboard. My model is for Canada French, with layout pc105. my keyboard has an extra key between the z and the left shift key. and somewhat different layout to the right of the P key.
I have nothing but accolades to say about the keyfunctions. Its tactile feedback great. I make fewer typing errors than if I had the regular membrane or keyboards with chicklet keys
I bought the Unicomp Classic 101 March 2021 and now September 2023. Used a few times and was put into storage. Recently rediscovered and noticed "P" key was acting erratic requiring two or three taps to make contact. Contacted Unicomp and was given RMA but would cost $48.00 plus $16 shipping. After doing my own disassembly I found all but 6 plastic rivet heads were broken off. Unicomp claims this issue was resolved before I purchased in 2021. I would not advise purchasing from Unicomp based on my experience.
@@LanceMcGrewStop spamming bro
Unicomps are the same, more or less, minus that heavy steel backplate. They also sell replacement parts, and service Model Ms.
I bought the Unicomp Classic 101 March 2021 and now September 2023. Used a few times and was put into storage. Recently rediscovered and noticed "P" key was acting erratic requiring two or three taps to make contact. Contacted Unicomp and was given RMA but would cost $48.00 plus $16 shipping. After doing my own disassembly I found all but 6 plastic rivet heads were broken off. Unicomp claims this issue was resolved before I purchased in 2021. I would not advise purchasing from Unicomp based on my experience.
@@LanceMcGrew yikes i didnt know they were that bad. well, good excuse to do the bolt mod to those snapped off posts. i got a feeling the plastics they use arent the same as the IBM days, as well as comparisons are out there showing the hardware tooling is wearing out. shame, thats the same factory and crew that made the OG stuff, its changed hands a cpl times til they bought it out (was IBM, them Lexmark, etc)
I'm jealous, your Corsair K70 has the proper logo. Mine has the strippers tramp stamp :(
I have a white label without a logo at all. It was a taiwan import, exactly the same as Corsair's model, except without a logo. It's the TKL version though. Amazing how that logo constituted a $30 markup. It also had a numpad that matched it available, which corsair didn't use for rebadging. You can find it on amazon if you have a keen eye :)
dude my corsair mouse has the tramp stamp too. Fuck the marketing retards who thought that was a good idea.
lmao it was a pain in the butt for me to find a version without the fucking stamp; us fans shouldnt have to freaking do that!! I always liked their products but not enough to let them put a yellow tribal crap on the logos in my black and red themed setup.
Why not use some Nylock nuts or maybe a tiny bit of locktight on the bolts?
I'm not sure I'm understanding - on which bolts? There are only four bolts, all in the back - they're not responsible for any of the problems.
I should have been more clear. I meant the bolts you would use to replace the plastic rivets (aka The Bolt Mod). You mentioned that they would eventually loosen off after years of typing. I was saying they should have used Nylock nuts or maybe a tiny bit of Locktite on these bolts to keep them from vibrating themselves loose. Ya dig?
With the bolt mod, yes I can see that loctite would be helpful. For all I know it's common to do that, but I haven't seen it in any of the writeups I've looked at. I was thinking to do the screw mod myself for my good board, which doesn't use nuts (just screws directly into the plastic), and has the benefits of not fouling the back of the case with the nuts and also no need to worry about them coming undone. I might do one actual bolt mod first just to demo it (It's a lot of work so I go back and forth on this), though, in which I will probably use loctite... Or at least talk about it. Since it will be an old terminal board for demo only if I do the bolt mod, I may not actually take the time to do everything. Hopefully at some point I actually get around to this... I've had the materials sitting and waiting for months.
As long as it's not a rubber dome, and not a unicomp, then you're good to go.
Its important to note that the Model M used a buckling spring over a membrane, and the Model F used capacitive buckling springs, which to many are superior.
I noted in the video that they use a different mechanism. I have used both; I was using the Model F when it was new on the market. I don't believe one is inherently superior in feel, although the Model F's are better built. When comparing keyboards, it's important to remember that most of these have at least 30 years of use on them at this point.
Modern Classic Also capacitive buckling springs allegedly last for many many more keypresses
Almost 38 years now
My OUTEMU blue sounds more tactile than cherry MX blue, and also many people says they are better even they are cheaper to get, since my keyboard literally cost half of Logitech or Corsair with blue MX, you can actually hear springs in them, quite similar to sound of model M spring's "tng" tng" but ofc steel plastic, also feels better compared to what I read about blue MX and heard from reviews. Btw my keyboard is uRage Exodus 800
there is a reason at 17 yrs old there is an ibm model f 122 on my desk predecessor to model m
Did you ever review the Unicomp?
+Rich Levin Not yet. Still looking for a decently priced used one that's the same model (most people seem to own either the 122 key monsters or the ones with the smaller, thinner case).
I bought the Unicomp Classic 101 March 2021 and now September 2023. Used a few times and was put into storage. Recently rediscovered and noticed "P" key was acting erratic requiring two or three taps to make contact. Contacted Unicomp and was given RMA but would cost $48.00 plus $16 shipping. After doing my own disassembly I found all but 6 plastic rivet heads were broken off. Unicomp claims this issue was resolved before I purchased in 2021. I would not advise purchasing from Unicomp based on my experience.
If the MODEL F had been made with the separate CURSOR key lay out, there would have been no need for anything else. The F was perfect for numerical data entry ( Of which I have done a lot of)
Yeah but the main idea was cost as well. An F is way more expensive as a capacitive PCB is more expensive than a membrane.
proud owner of a sliver label 1988 here.
did you eventually get yourself a unicomp? where's the comparison video?
No I didn't - though I still plan to at some point. I've got an Ebay alert set up looking for a decent deal, but I'll probably end up just buying a new one (it's really only fair to test a new one) and then selling it once I'm done with the video.
Modern Classic OK - I'm curious as to your opinion as I'm still trying to figure out whether to try buying myself a difficult-to-find decent condition M or go for a unicomp. Thanks!
I'll definitely get one soon. Maybe even this week.
You'll be happy to know I just ordered one from Unicomp. Once I get it, I'll do a review/mini teardown.
Modern Classic Excellent! Look forward to you helping me make a decision ! :)
I am the proud owner of a Lexmark Model M that does in fact have the speaker grill
Yo si tuviera la oportunidad tambien me compraria el IBM modelo F es la madre del cordero de los teclados IBM.
i am getting a brand new ibm blue logo for 250 usd do you think it is a fair price
Too expensive. I'd hold out for a better deal.
Ahhh, I would buy it, but the Alt key is too far right. I tried a similiar one, and I was constantly hitting space instead of the right alt, which is terrible for somebody speaking Polish, which has special characters in almost every single word (stuff like "ęóąśłżźćń")
very pleasant video it would have been absolutely perfect with a Unicomp keyboard fitting in your overall picture. Seeing how dedicated you are to keyboards, which i absolutely understand, it's surprising you resisted getting one if only to comp it. Actually.. it's not surprising when understanding psychology. If the Unicomp proved to be worthy that would hurt if only a little all you build up sweet past memory. That's quite clear from your default a priori denigration of the unicom because it does no longer bear the ibm logo and you need it to disapoint you. In fact that would be a relief wouldn't it ? Yes we are all fan boys of some brand, tool or car one time or another. Before you label me anywhere with respect to Unicomp/IBM i am completely neutral never owned anything by either brand and am just shopping for a mechanical keyboard.
On a different register, i think the M design is not perfect and I see ways of improving it to attract a much bigger market today, without dropping any of the features that make it great. A great startup should really have a try at it and make the true Rolls royce or Lamborghini of keyboards. It should be unicomp but they seem satisfied to offer museum copies without trying.
I don't think I "denigrated" Unicomp. I simply said it's not the same keyboard as an IBM Model M. Lexmark-made IBM's were made in the same factory by the same people as earlier IBM-made Model M's. This was a roundup of IBM Model M's; a Unicomp Model M is not an IBM Model M, it's a different company with a different factory.
Where can I get a Model M that isn't highly-priced.
The typing feel of the model F is vastly different to that of the model M. The Model F used captive buckling springs while the M uses a buckling spring over membrane switch system. It is fact that the Model F was both higher build quality as well as (according to the overwhelmingly vast, vast majority) providing a better typing feel, crisper, more refined. Even if both would have used the exact same switch mechanism, things like construction, materials, back-plates would still effect the feel of the keyboard. There is really no reason to prefer a model M over a F, except for layout., which honestly just takes some getting used to.
Cherrys are junk, and always were, in both quality as well as tactility and sound. I prefer most rubber domes over cherry switches. Also not all rubber dome designs are cheap or bad, take Topre for example, slider over rubber dome over conical spring over captive PCB. I'm typing on a HHKB right now. Topre keyboards are widely regarded to be amongst the best typing keyboards ever made, I can only agree with that. I actually very much prefer a Topre board over a Model M, you should try Topre sometime, they are a bit costly tho. Getting a used, NIB one on ebay is always an option.
I've typed on plenty of Model F's, starting with the brand new one in the 1980's that I mentioned in the video right up through about 10 or 20 used ones that I demoed at a warehouse in PA a couple of months ago - I wouldn't describe the typing feel as "vastly different". I doubt most people would even notice any difference. As I mentioned in the video, Model M's do have a tendency to get scratchy over time and if not kept clean, so I wonder if people are comparing either a) dirty old Model M's to a Model F, or b) new Unicomp Model M's to a Model F. I've owned three used Model M's and all three were gritty and scratchy. The Lexmark that I bought new is as smooth and refined as the new Model F that I used in the 1980's. Unicomps I have no experience with yet, but I've heard their build quality is not as good as even Lexmark, so they might not hold up in comparison to a Model F either.
I haven't ever tried a Topre but I would like to at some point. The way they've been described in various places I've read doesn't sound like something I'd be into, and that's kept me from really seeking one out, but if I come across one someday that I can at least demo, I'd like to see what they really feel like.
Sorry but Model F's are completely different in feel and sound to a Model M.
The Model F buckling spring is so smooth it feels linear up until the point the spring buckles and you feel it reverberate under your finger. On a Model M you feel more of a quick 'snap' than you do springs vibrating under your fingers.
Floss mod the springs. Then you'll thank me.
@wobbled I am replying you now from my Model F. I agree 100%. I had try Model M's in the past and the feeling of the F is superior in every aspect. Sound, feeling, smoothness, tacticlity, everything! Nothing come closer to it except beam springs :D
I've tried also razer's green switches, cherry's but the old school team (Alps, BS etc) can't even compare with the modern ones. And after 100.000.000 keypresses my Model F broke down i will make sure that i will replace every switch myself for another 100.000.000 :)
The only reason I didn't get the IBM model m is that my desk is not big enough
ROTFLMAO US$ 150 average price for this keyboard on ebay? They even put a build in 1991 proud comment in the title
And i'm through 5 apple keyboard since 2011. Just a single drop of water and they are dead. But they are overpriced apple ...
who buys apple is a sheep
@@mnemonic6047 well, some Apple products can be good, like the AEK
I'll just keep with my good ol' Dell rubber-dome keyboard. Incredibly satisfying, and clicky!
dat is better than my gpro
is it mechanical?
It's a buckling spring mechanism. Mechanical, but not in the way modern mechanical keyboards are. A different type of switch.
i still use ibm keyboard ...
did I really just watch a 15 min. vid about a keyboard?????
yes and you relished it so much you had to write that comment to spend more time on it.
Samster Birdies got one for 50 euros
lRedPosion I got one out of the trash last week.
Best keyboard ever though. Everything else is like typing on soggy waffles.
Did you really just act like that was such a big deal?
The blue lable one in this video is not made by Lexmark but IBM UK...
It's made by Lexmark in the USA. The label is pretty unequivocal about that.
I still have the keyboard that came with my Tandy 1000RLX 20+ years ago. I think it was just a ripoff of the Model M but it's a great keyboard, better than anything newer.
If it's like the keyboard that came with my 1000RLHD, it *looks* like a Model M but has a totally different feel. I find the Tandy keyboard a little tiring after not very long, but I can type on the Model M all day. If you haven't yet, see if you can try out an actual Model M to compare with your Tandy. The Tandy 1000 keyboards were apparently based on the Fujitsu Peerless: deskthority.net/wiki/Fujitsu_Peerless
It's exactly the same as the 1000RL keyboard -- watched your video on that computer immediately after this one and thought to myself "well now I look stupid" LOL.
I'm sure my love for the Tandy keyboard is familiarity more than anything else - my parents bought that computer when I was 9 years old and I was still using it when I was in high school - when it was wayyyy obsolete. Back then I couldn't wait to get rid of it, now I wish I still had it!
The only thing stopping me from using the Model M for everything is because it's 2KRO, making it unusable for many of the games I play. Everything else, though? Mmmmm... buckling spring.
Yes, for what I use it for I don't notice that at all (even games), but I guess there must be some games that require N key rollover.
So, the Model M doesn't light up? F*ck it!
I couldn't live without my windows key, unfortunately. Too many macros to use.
Also I skipped to the middle of the video and thought it was Microsoft Sam talking for a bit.
I find the Windows keys to only get in the way. I've honestly never used one intentionally. Have done so unintentionally a bunch of times, and it's a major annoyance when it happens.
Really don't know who Microsoft Sam is, sorry!
Modern Classic Microsoft Sam is one of the default text-to-speech voices on Windows (or at least Vista and later) I believe.
Good video overall, but kills me to see you typing incorrectly, that looks so uncomfortable the way your right hand does 80% of the work lol
It's actually very comfortable since it lets me angle my wrists naturally.
Modern Classic I've just never seen someone type quite like that before :P
I can type a bit more "normally" if I will myself to do it, it just doesn't come naturally and I type slower and less accurately when I do it. I obviously never took lessons, just started typing and built up speed on my own, and this is just what feels right.
Wow, those MX Blues sound *awful* compared to the M!
i bought my old Model M out of a pile of Model M keyboards at a university surplus store in 2007. hastily threw it away in a move in 2013. Regret it to this day...and not buying the whole pile of them when i could!
The problem is the lack of Windows key. Can't be productive on modern PCs with a keyboard that doesn't.
Ctrl + Esc brings up Windows start menu i never used the widows key. Currently typing on the IBM 1983 just restored Model F xt capacitive buckling spring it sounds even better than a Model M & The Model F xt has true Nkro [NKRO is an acronym for N-Key RollOver and refers to the ability of a keyboard to correctly identify and register all the keys that are simultaneously pressed on it. ] Aka Still can play any games on it. Where the Model M only has two RollOver fine for typing but not gaming on so called gaming keyboards they call it no ghosting but those are made up names. I play pubg on pc all the time with mine it's a 5 din plug you can get a soarer converter 5 Din to usb on ebay to use on new pc & even learn how to re-map keys with the software that someone named soarer that wrote the code for made on geek hack site hence the name of it . I have had them all new so called keyboards Corsair duckyshines with reds blues & greens they all seem too die or break in a year. This is the best feeling to type on & once you do type on one there is no going back but the layout is not the same but you get use to it. There is many videos out there Of keyboards fun too watch indeed but might make you change your mind. if you watch enough of them or type on one your self. Quarantine got you board watch this czcams.com/video/4_qA5OZFJ1I/video.html stay safe out there cheers.
Sorry to be difficult so many years on but I've never understood the love of noisy keyboards. Never. As long as the keyboard I'm using doesn't hasten arthritis, it's fine. I've used many kinds over the years including the one mentioned here and a keyboard really is just a keyboard in most cases. I use a MacBook Pro most of the time and its keyboard is perfectly fine.
The point is "noisy" keyboards are better ergonomically. IBM were at the forefront of this. The research they did on ergonomics is still followed to this day, down to the ideal actuation force and the tactile bump during actuation. No "quiet" keyboard can come close to the ergonomic ideal simply due to the methods of construction required. In other words, it's not the noisiness some of us like. The noise is a side effect of the way the keyboard is built, and it's built the way it is for ergonomic reasons.
that intro made me deaf
The actuation force for a buckling spring is so high and the sound so loud I have no clue why people still love the darn thing. Just get a topre ffs!
Yes, you are right. But it is high on paper, in real life it is very good for typing. Have you typed on one?
Well it is fun to type on but I like my actuation force to have matching numbers with my age :p
Flash Man How can you type on switches with 12 grams of actuation force?
Llegna Belac
Appling water to burnt area 😢
That's why he only uses 4 fingers to type lol