Why Palpatine Was Glad Tarkin Died on the Death Star - Star Wars Explained
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That's a Palpatine paradox: he keeps complaining about incompetent subordinates, but when competent one comes - he will be ambitious by default, as all competent people. That scares Sidious, and he wants them dead or removed... replacing them with... someone less competent, but than he is not satisfied enough.
huh, i’m surprised that’s not a more well known phrase among Star Wars fans you’ve coined there- the “Palpatine Paradox”.
I like it
@@fionnbarrcasey5247 I think once the sith became the superpower of the galaxy Sidious slowly started losing his ability to socialise and take people for their word and relied more on his own dark side senses and what the dark side itself said about his pawns.
Well no one ever said Sith Lords were level-headed or always rational.
Sidious also definitely suffered a decline in his people skills after ascending to power and not needing to play by those rules anymore.
I think that's the paradox of all authoritarians and dictators
I wonder how he really felt about Grand Admiral Thrawn since he was insanely intelligent AND an alien.
I will point out that letting Tarkin be in command of the Death Star was also Palpatine's greatest mistake. As Tarkin was the one who ordered the destruction of the peaceful planet Alderaan. From there, it caused countless planets and people to turn against the Empire, as they were revealed to be truly evil. This is also another possible reason why Palpatine was glad about Tarkin's death.
Wouldn’t surprise me if alderan was targeted by palpatine as the alderan royal family was heavy rebellion supporter
@Nicolai MyshkinHoly shit Nicolai. Ur right! these guys are commies. 😆. Funny coming from a name like urs. But, ive lived in Cali since i was born and totally agree it's not the same as it was. Society wise. Sad.
@Nicolai Myshkin LMAO
Took the words right out of my mouth.
From a lore perspective, one has to question whether _Sideous_ really desired a functional, stable and triumphant Empire - in contrast to a prolongued, perpetual conflict that will erode both sides as eventually reflected in domestic failures and disullusionment of the New Republic.
Hijacking entire super star destroyers for a 'counter-offensive' didn't exactly help an Imperial Navy in it's missions.
Palps put a lot of weight on what Tarkin thought. In the novel "Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader" Tarkin had asked if he could speak openly. Sidious told him "I suggest you make a practice of it."
lol
Sidious would have killed Tarkin himself even if the main Rebel base on Yavin 4 had been destroyed. Tarkin had permission to use the Death Star, but Sidious believed it would be used against either a military target or a world that was almost unknown. When Despayre was destroyed by the Death Star, there was no uprising because it was simply not well known, and in any case it was a prison planet. Alderaan on the other hand was well know, well loved, a civilian, almost ideal world, and outwardly appeared to be nearly totally Imperial aligned. Yes, some citizens were Rebel leaning, but that happened on many worlds. Not only did Tarkin NOT get the Rebel base location from Leia, he also sent a message to the galaxy that went a lot like this; "Disobey the Empire and die. Obey the Empire and die". Rebel ships caught the action on camera and broadcast it to all the people they could, and the result was everything the Emperor did NOT want; FLOODS of recruits for the Rebellion and still more worlds cutting ties with the Empire. Basically, Tarkin was lucky to have died aboard the Death Star. Sidious and Vader would have made his death the very definition of excrutiating.
If Tarkin survived in Legends, Sidious would steal Scar's lines from Lion King before executing him.
Palpatine: Before I end your wretched life along with your ambitions, here's my little secret . . . (leans to his ear and whispers) I killed your son!"
Yep, in Legends Tarkin had a son whom he loved. And Tarkin manipulated Vader into bumping said son off to make Tarkin the genocidal madman we're familiar with. Read the Legends Dark Horse Comic "Darth Vader and the Lost Command" for reference.
I believe Tarkin was counting on the Deathstar itself being a deterrent to rebellion and the propaganda excuse could have been made that since the Alderaan royal family were traitors then the entire planet were traitors as well and had to be dealt with. It would also send the message of fear that only obedience to the empire would be tolerate and we wont just come and genocide you or replace your leaders we will erase you if you rebel against us. Thats a powerful message and its holds another message as well that no one is beyond the Emperors reach and no one is above reproach, you are just a cog in the machine to us and utterly disposable. In that sense I disagree and I think Palpatine would have approved of the action as long as Tarkin had kept the Death Star intact and functional. Ultimately he was foolish because he knew the rebels had the deathstar plans and failed to do an investigation as to what the rebels may have discovered as a weakness. In a sense the Empire's fundamental character flaw is that its leaders are overconfident and fail to calculate any small variable that could defeat them as they are over eager to bask in triumph. I mean the battle of Endor the Emperor could have just put Luke in a prison cell and ensured the defeat of the rebels and the turning of Luke were done one at a time with Vader leading the fleet to crush the rebels or had him protecting the shield generator. Say is Leia and Han died on Endor then Luke would have had more impetus to turn to the dark side. The problem the empire had in Tarkin and Palpatine is that they were so overconfident about their victory and in their untouchable status they they failed to ensure that a real overkill was achieved. The way you win a battle when you have superior forces is to ensure at all cost that your most valuable pieces cannot be touched and there are no unknown variables. Without Vader protecting the sheild generator then it was always vulnerable to the rebels destroying it. With the rebels possessing the death star plans Tarkin has 0 clue what they know about and is taking a huge risk using the Deathstar against their base as they will have nothing to lose in sending everything against it and employing their hidden advantage. In a sense the destruction of both Deathstars is due to the Empire being impatient, arrogant and giving the Rebels the opportunity to employ hidden advantages against the empire. I mean the Emperor knows the rebels are trying to destroy the shield generator and they are confident they can do it, maybe your best legion of troops isnt good enough and you should have Vader down there as your trump card because with Luke captured and imprisoned the rebels lack any tools to counter Vader. This should be villainy 101, do not give your opponent any chances to exploit your weaknesses and you should mechanically ensure total control of all variables with overkill. Hey whats the one thing that can allow the rebels to win the battle of Endor? Destruction of the shield generator. Okay lets use an overkill force including Darth Vader to ensure they cant achieve their objective. If you dont know all the variables or forces your opponent has in play against you then you should probably withdraw and gather more intelligence instead of taking things to chance. I think me sitting here at my computer screen being a nobody has come up with a better doctrine than a supposed military genius. After the destruction of the first deathstar you think the Empire would have learned something.
It reminds me of some statement that a prepper made that you should figure out what imperishable supplies you need for survival for 6 years. Then one you calculate that amount get 5 times more than you think you need.
By the battle of Hoth, the Rebels are still a small band. Where did all the recruits go?
@@gumdeo The Rebels didn't have everyone on Hoth; indeed, in the opening crawl of Empire it says 'A small group of freedom fighters'. Most of what they did was hit and run. Besides, you can help a cause by getting them money etc, and I suspect that's what happened.
yep the rule of fear does not work if you do not give way out form the fear of judgment. Simply put destruction of Alderaan made the current up rising different than all the others because rebels felt they had nothing to lose.
As Palpy put it, “Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen.”
"Including them blowing up that really expensive battle station?"
~ choking sounds ~
I've seen some good explanations as to why the emperors vision of the future did not come true. Basically he is unable to see contingencies where the light side of the force was too strong. There were many examples of this, but the most obvious is the Ewoks. These cute little guys were simply not on the emperor's dark side radar
Always in motion is the future.
@@bryanx0317 Or, and follow me on this, he airquotes sees the future. Did we see him make a prediction that anyone with the information he had access to as a man couldn't make? Did he foresee Ozzel coming out of lightspeed to close to the system? Did he see Rogue One stealing the DS plans? Heck, with the carnivorous teddy bears, wasn't a light side issue involved when they took on the 501st- and if you can't "foresee" more than a few hours in the future, yeah, calling shenanigans.
Gotta remember, dude is a master manipulator- and convincing certain people (cough Vader cough) that he can see the future, i.e., seeing what bullshit you're planning, might be good idea.
@@Sephiroth144 well it did reveal that Anakin had a son who could if he was to be turned become a very powerful ally.
Palpatine was supremely impressed with his own ability to manipulate his way into power. Because of that, he saw similarity to himself as superiority, and therefore wanted people similar to himself to rise to higher positions. If he had been less self-absorbed, he would have recognized that type of ambition in others as a liability, and would have instead sought to promote people who were capable but not dangerously self-serving. Unfortunately, the Sith philosophy is inherently self-defeating in this way. That's what happens when your philosophy is based on whatever the most evil position happens to be.
If he was the best Sith Lord ever he would have just dominated all the minds of his highest commanders like Tenebrae would have… and inherently the dark side is not evil… Just as the Jedi are not good…
Palpatine is w :D
@@isessogroup The Sith philosophy is to pursue personal power at any cost, which is inherently evil. But you're right that the Jedi aren't inherently good. Their purpose is to preserve the balance of the Force.
If the force were an organism, the Sith would be a virus, and the Dark Side would be an infected cell that has been converted to the virus's purpose and no longer serves the organism. The Jedi would be part of the immune system.
Even if Palpatine did mind control his highest officers, that misses the point: He's letting people rise in power on the basis of their ability to manipulate and backstab, rather than their competence at whatever their actual function happens to be, which is a completely different skill. He was lucky with Thrawn being adept at both military command and organizational politics, but overall, letting cutthroats rise just fills the top tiers of an organization with people who are incompetent at their jobs and dangerous to their superiors.
That outcome is not conducive to the survival of an organization, but it's what the Sith philosophy promotes. Or the Rule of Two Sith, at least.
And even with mental domination, if you surround yourself with dangerous people, there will always be a risk of one of them finding a creative way to take you out anyway.
@@Shin-Chara Your confusion is heartbreaking. The force does not NEED the Jedi to balance it. The light and dark are sides of a WHOLE with different routes to the same well of power… the goal of both is to manipulate the everflowing and ever present force. For either to try to destroy each other completely has been proven that the force harshly bites back. There are more teachings and overstanding you must acquire before making such a lengthy post. Palpatine did not adhere to the Rule of Two. The Rule of One and his Empire have been expounded on in his writings
@@Shin-Chara honestly I find the emperor to be one of the most interesting siths that's ever existed. From a political standpoint he's the best Any Sith or force-user has ever been in galactic politics. From a military standpoint he is the worst any sith or Jedi or any other Force user has ever been.
You can talk about the Jedi all you want but they ran the republic's wars for over a thousand years. The old sith were constantly backstabbing each other but they managed military Empire for over a thousand years.
He was able to effectively defeat all of his potential sith opponents and defeat the Jedi and take over the Republic but he couldn't keep it for more than 20 years.
I truly believe if any other sith or dark Jedi took his position they would still be in power by the time of the sequel trilogy.
A fascinating note:
Tarkin had slaves, at least in Legends.
One is a Mon Calamari known as Ackbar.
Yes, that Ackbar.
He rarely spoke about the times he spent as a slave, but in one book he mentioned that Tarkin in his better moods would often talk about strategy and war to him.
He learned a lot from him.
Gail Akbar be like…well my old master, here is your last lesson.
And in the end, ackbar became one of Palpatine greatest foes
Imagine talking strategy to a fish who cleans your floor
Palpy never listened to Micheal Jacksons Man in the Mirror and it shows
I wonder if Tarkin and Thrawn agreed or disagreed on certain things since they both were high ranking officers in the Empire
Well, Thrawn disagreed on the Death Star while Tarkin was all for it.
The Chances of thrawn Agreeing with that Want to be psychopath of a Month Are slim to none
@@hellstrom4209 I wonder if Tarkin thought maybe Thrawns Tie Defender program was a good idea or not and maybe like Thrawns military experience strategies as well
@@brianpark3395Honestly it was his fault that the tide defender program did not go on with because there were exhausted resources for that stupid death weapon.
@@jamalsodipe772 The weapon as planned by Tarkin was not a bad idea. The Emperor should have known better though.
The Emperor wasn't a fool. He knew that Grand Moff Tarkin was power hungry. Tarkin was in command of the Death Star. Tarkin had the thoughts of becoming the Emperor himself.
That's why all those Stormtroopers were stationed on the Death Star.
They didn't take orders from Tarkin,they took orders from Vader.
@@jamesricker3997vader could also lazerbeam sidious.
I saw a Short clip where Christopher Lee talked about calling Peter Cushing and asking him "WHAT is a grand moff tarkin?"
Peter-"I haven't the remotest idea dear boy..."😂😂😂😂
The destruction of Alderaan also had the opposite of the desired effect. *Proof* that the Empire was so evil that it would literally destroy its own worlds left too many people with a sense that there was nothing left to lose. The Empire might destroy their worlds simply as an object lesson. Tarkin neglected to consider that an animal that is scared enough may lash out without regarding to reason.
Alderaan was harboring rebels and was not peaceful
@@darbyohara - The same could be said of Coruscant. And a lot of other worlds. How many were the Empire going to blow up? At what point would the people decide "Enough!"? The Death Star doomed the Empire ironically by showing that Palpatine's talk of "peace" was really a quote from the Sith creed: "Peace is a lie..."
@@daniels7907 the emperor was on corescant. He ain’t blowing up the planet he’s on
@@darbyohara - My point exactly. But his presence there didn't mean that the city-world wasn't infested with rebels hiding amidst the teeming population. This is what made the Death Stars impractical. Alderaan was sparsely-populated in comparison but its destruction caused an upsurge in people joining the Rebel Alliance. So what would the destruction of one of the ecumenopoli do? How many times could it be done before the Empire's economy broke and the masses just all rose up because they had nothing left to lose?
@@daniels7907 no the Death Star was the the most practical weapon. It has the ability to create peace simply thru the fear of destruction. Even the rebels admitted if the empire has a weapon that great what hope do they have to resist. Without magic (the force) they’d never have destroyed it.
Tarkin wasn't a friend , he was a asset .
When a asset is gone , you simply get another one .
Tarkin was too ambitious , and would have become a problem eventually.
M.
He's probably thinking about family guys version
I feel like this explanation demonstrates Palpatines absolutely evil personality. It shows that no matter how much you please him, he is still 10 steps ahead and does not trust you. This actually surprised me that he does not trust Tarkin.
Yea u just more of a chess piece to him is all 😂 ♟️
Love this. I read the Tarkin novel and loved it. Tarkin wasn't a lap dog by far, but I don't think he planned on turning on the Emperor. It would've been interesting to see the unrest between Vader and Tarkin play out a little more.
I think it just another dumb eu/lore stuff added to Star Wars. Why would Palpatine be glad that someone like Tarkin died?
@@ouissam2502 Because Palpatine was evil and didn't want anyone who could've replaced him around.
@@troyhencely He was evil sure and wanted to stay in power but that doesn’t mean he can’t see usefulness in other beings and tarkin was was one of his useful servant. Besides Vader was there to keep some sort of eyes on Tarkin.
Oh Tarkin was not stupid he knew turning on the emperor would spell death for him instead he choose to be a close ally of the emperor which allowed him alot of power
@@ouissam2502 "He was evil sure and wanted to stay in power but that doesn’t mean he can’t see usefulness in other beings and tarkin was was one of his useful servant."
So was Vader, and Palpatine planned to get rid of him once he found someone better (Luke) and Vader started to become a liability. Palps has lost two of his apprentices before now, and didn't give a s*** about either of them.
Tarkin's hostile rivalry with Vader also made him a liability to Sidious since he hoped they would work together to make the Empire unstoppable.
I'm not so sure about that.
Sidious also respected the rule of two which was (among other things)all about rivalry and competition.
But iirc. these two really fell on the other end of the horse.
It makes sense because at that point he didn't have much need for either Tarkin or Vader, basically Sidious himself was made too overpowered canonically compared to any other OT character to the point there doesn't seem to be any reason to keep them beside Sidious's sadistic need to keep torturing Vader.
Made one mistake Palpatine didn’t hate aliens it was just a useful tool to control everyone
I don't know- pretty sure aliens are part of "everyone", and Palps pretty much hated everyone...
He was a snobby aristocrat from an isolationist world. He almost certainly did.
@@seekingabsolution1907 mas ameeda?
@@jchockey22a useful idiot, to probably counter arguments of anti-alien sentiments. He was a pawn on Palpatine’s chess board.
Palpy didn't care for anyone besides himself.
I don’t know it Palpatine hated aliens…his master and first apprentice were both aliens and his rival yoda (who he respected) was an alien too. The sith themselves were races of aliens, so I think the people he aligned himself with liked humans more but I don’t think he would personally hold such a trivial belief when all he wanted was power, just my opinion
^ true about the sith also cant forget the sith purebloods badass red skin and times some are born with red eyes already other times nice orange and such and very powerful in the force not fully but stronger than ones who are not purebloods.
@@GriffenSpadeIsBack [Deep breath]
Palpatines list of hate
1. Anyone who has ever, will ever, and could ever even slightly inconvenience him
Palpatine didnt hate aliens his plan was that the master sith should be human only because humans control the galaxy at large and thus the sith can takr their revenge easier
I know you won't see this but I really do thank you your videos brought me back into Star Wars
Thank you for watching and supporting!,
He saw it lol
'i KnoW YoU wOnT sEe ThIs'
Tarkin was clearly becoming a rival. Maybe not in the force but as a dictator. Sidious realized he may need to get rid of him.
Luckily Luke save him the trouble.
I'm surprised that Palpatine should have been concerned about any ambition Tarkin may have had. There was nowhere to advance to from where the Grand Moff stood, and he had no possibility of ever becoming Emperor, as that position was only ever held by Sith Lords. Tarkin was in the perfect position for himself, and appeared quite content to hold that position for as long as he could remain capable, or until he decided to retire, had he not perished when he did.
Only ever held by Sith Lords in ancient history. Those were in different atmospheres, though, where the Sith openly controlled those empires (as evidenced by their names “Sith Empire”). In the Galactic Empire, there was no precedent for that, as Sidious was the first emperor and knowledge that he was a Sith Lord was a closely guarded secret. I can’t remember right off, but I think Tarkin knew, or at least suspected, that Palpatine was a Sith Lord. But, like his knowledge that Darth Vader and Anakin Skywalker were one in the same, it’s information he kept to himself if he knew. So Tarkin, being arguably the second most powerful person in the Empire and having the resources (read: Death Star) at his fingertips to enforce his will, he stood a very good chance of succeeding if he ever made a run at overthrowing Palpatine.
@@Engine33Truck I actually think the only real way Tarkin could take the Emperor’s place is if the Emperor died from natural causes. Tarkin would make certain Vader would not be able to witness the Emperor’s death in this case, and once Tarkin had the Royal Red guards on his side, he would proceed to tell give all imperial troops the order to “execute Order 161” (the military order the Emperor created which would be used in the event Darth Vader either turned against the Galactic Empire or attempted to go to a planet the Empire didn’t have record of against the Emperor’s demands).
As powerful as Darth Vader is, there is no real way Vader could defeat the military might of the Empire on his own. Plus, a large part of the cycle Vader had that kept him fully aligned with being Vader and not allowing himself to become Anakin again before he knew he had a son in Luke Skywalker was the idea that there was no possible way the remaining Jedi nor the Rebellion would be able to forgive him regardless of how much he secretly may have wanted to join Ashoka Tano as well as any other friends Anakin had who survived the end of the clone wars
@@CraigMcGuinn we know that, but Tarkin didn’t. Tarkin was familiar with the Jedi. But the Sith were considered extinct until 32BBY. Their re-emergence most likely wasn’t public knowledge, chances are it was something the Jedi covered up. So in Tarkin’s world, the Sith were likely nothing but hushed rumors. Him being smart, he likely figured out that Palpatine was a Sith Lord, and they were basically the polar opposite of the Jedi. But he more than likely had no idea of the Emperor’s true power. He wouldn’t know that he has no chance of overthrowing Palpatine, much less killing him.
I believe one of the reasons that Vader was on the Death Star with Tarkin was to keep an eye on him for the Emperor.
As it was stated, Tarkin was ambitious....maybe ambitious enough to use the Death Star on Coresaunt itself?
Even a Dark Lord of the Sith can't survive planetary destruction, and take out the Emperor and rule himself with the power of the Death Star at his back. It would be easy enough to convince most of the admirals and administrators on the Death Star to go along with him, and the ones who didn't could easily have "accidents". Tarkin was certainly cleaver enough to spin a story that might convince those assigned to the Death Star that what they were doing was for the greater good.
The reason Vader was on the Death Star was because Palpatine put him there, under the control of Tarkin, to humiliate him for some failure or offense to the Emperor that I cannot remember at this time. And Vader was pissed. He was planning on killing Tarkin, Tagge, and several other high ranking officers who irritated him for reasons. I know Tagge was marked because he made the mistake of talking down to Vader, and also Vader found him to be arrogant and inept. Eventually, Tagge did fall into Vader's hands after Palpatine released him from his punishment.
@@nurseactual the real reason Tarkin was allowed by Palpatine to be ranked above Vader was because of the results of the hunt Vader had previously ordered Tarkin to perform.
Vader ordered Tarkin to pick the planet for the hunt as well (the reason Vader wanted Tarkin to organize this hunt is because Vader felt it had been a long time since anyone challenged him in a battle he fought in).
Tarkin and the 20 imperial experts he hired began to hunt Vader on Valax. Tarkin armed the experts with flamethrowers so Vader’s lightsaber could not fully prevent the damage the weapons could cause him.
Long story short is: after Vader has killed all 20 imperial experts over the course of the hunt Tarkin lures Vader to the top of a mountain and appears to surrender. However just before Vader becomes able to strike Tarkin down Tarkin lowers his body to the ground and says “the taller you stand, the quicker you die”.
Immediately after a lightning bolt that Tarkin knew would come shoots from the sky and incapacitates Vader (as a result of his suit’s weakness to force lightning also making it weak to large amounts of external electricity)
"Even a Dark Lord of the Sith can't survive planetary destruction"
I don't know, he survived the second Death Star's destruction. "Somehow Palpatine returned."
That sounds like an incredible fanfiction waiting to happen. Tarkin and his cronies take out Coruscant and go absolutely hog wild with the Death Star.
Palpatine had nothing to fear from Tarkin. Tarkin couldn’t possibly hope to ever overthrow the Emperor. Being one of Palpatine’s closest advisors he likely knew Palpatine was a Sith and could easily kill him, he didn’t have the respect of anyone other than Palpatine, no one would be loyal enough to him to support a coup against the Emperor. He was more hated than feared within the Imperial ranks.
But he was powerful enough and ambitious enough to cause the Emperor some problems
@@jamesricker3997 Tarkin at one point considered using the Death Star to assassinate the Emperor but decided against it, believing Palpatine likely had a fail safe that would stop him from doing so.
@@thunderstudent he was right to fear that lol
I think an issue is that Tarkin was essentially a power driven materialist and he eventually would have butted heads with the Emperor because he would not have understood the metaphysical principles of the force being used to direct policy and military matters and I dont think Palpatine could explain it to him without Tarkin becoming more ambitious and seeking to use those principles for his own advantage. Its like lets say magic existed and to a degree anyone could access it and use it as a weapon but the government has convinced people only bullets and ballistic weapons work. They do this because they want to keep the power of magic for themselves while keeping a bunch of stooges around to keep the general population in check and working as slaves. Tarkin for all his intelligence is basically like a commanding robot to Palpatine that he does not want to give any more power or knowledge.
I watched a video from this channel a week or so ago, detailing why Palpatine was disappointed in the Empire. This video helps explain why Palpatine's disappointment is, in a way, all his own fault. What we get is a cycle of (self) abuse.
Step 1: Allow your subordinates to fight and claw their way to the top, so that only the strongest, most cunning, most ruthless survive.
Step 2: You feel that your subordinates are too powerful and you fear that they may overthrow you. (Not an entirely unfounded fear.)
Step 3: Kill your powerful, ambitious subordinates, before they kill you
Step 4: Complain that competent help is impossible to find.
Step 5: Sulk.
Step: 6: Avoid all ancient Sith spirits, as they ARE laughing at you.
Step 7: Orchestrate a new civil war.
Step 8: Allow yourself to "die."
Step 9: Your clone, using a new name, unites the galaxy and ends the civil war.
Step 10: A new Empire is declared. Huzzah. And now, we need to make sure that the Empire is run by only the best people. Return to step one.
Palpatine to Palpatine "Come back, baby. It'll be different this time. I promise."
That was pretty much how Hitler ruled Nazi Germany
moment palpatine said "lord vader you are free to dispose of tarkin as you see fit" haha vader going have field day with it
I think the fact that tarkin had an openly negative view against the force made his ambition more of a threat. His lack of respect for the Sith gave Sidious no reason to beleive Tarkin would see Sidious as above him forever.
I think that woulda had alot to do with it.
This is extremely cold and calculated. Fits for Tarkin. He reigned with terror,fear and suppressed others. He shared many traits and attributes with Palpatine. Like Obi-Wan said to Anakin: if we do everything for victory,we risk loosing most important-our honor. He said everything. I don't think Tarkin was threat for Emperor. Sidious would get rid of him but,he wasn't a threat. May the Force be with you too. Have a nice day :)
Palpatine, like real world dictators, incels, and others with “small pp energy”, was threatened by competent subordinates. He knew his power base, while near absolute, was also relatively fragile. He also knew Tarkin had the intelligence, ambition, and resources to stand a good chance of overthrowing him if he really wanted to try.
@@Engine33Truck who knows
Tarkin was very ambitious and was a threat to Sidious and Sidious did say Tarkins days were numbered if Tarkin survived he would’ve suffered a painful death by force lightning and I think Tarkin knew it that’s why he stayed on the Death Star and he was very overconfident
I don’t think he would’ve died that way. Tarkin was arguably Palpatine’s greatest/favorite asset. But also Palpatine’s biggest threat. Palpatine, as a person, is not unlike Hitler or Stalin. When subordinated those two respected failed them or became inconvenient, they often gave them the option of suicide or implied execution. As close as Palpatine and Tarkin were for decades, I think Palps would’ve given Tarkin the same option. Also, the imperial propaganda machine had painted Tarkin as essential to the Empire, someone to be respected by the populace. Palpatine may have had to worry about Tarkin’s execution or disappearance putting Palpatine in a precarious spot with public opinion.
@@Engine33Truck I feel Palpatine would of made Tarkin take the blame for Alderaan after the Death Star was destroyed people were outraged about Alderaans destruction so he’d make Tarkin take the blame saying he went rogue or something and giving him the execution in front of the galaxy Tarkin at the end was a pawn to be used and discarded and he would’ve certainly outlived his usefulness
Palpatine's SOP (Standard Operating Procedure) was to recruit people for a specific purpose and function, then to dispose of them once that purpose was fulfilled. See also: Maul, Dooku, Rampart.
A couple things. First, Tarkin was well aware of the Death Star during its development. He was one of the biggest contributors to the station, and that was the main reason behind his bitter rivalry with Director Orson Krennic. Second, he reached the rank of Admiral in the late part of the Clone Wars, during which time he was the prosecutor of Ahsoka Tano during her trial. It was after the war that he became a Governor and then sometime before 5 BBY he became Grand Moff.
Because he knew Leia is Vaders daughter and he’s disapproves that he would execute her without his approval .
To those who either don't have time or want to save it, the answer starts at 7:00 into the video
Thank you, good sir.
Thanks.
It’s because whether Tarkin wanted the throne or not he is the most logical rival. Tarkin is a rallying point for military officers who would prefer to have one of theirs lead. Tarkin is both ruthless and competent. He isn’t some old dude with a butt face wearing a bathrobe at all times of day. Moreover, Tarkin doesn’t use a weirdo in an iron lung as his enforcer.
According to palpatine’s journal entry in the book of the sith tarkin was growing too ambitious and his days were numbered. Even if the first Death Star was a success palpatine was going to get rid of tarkin. Especially if he was in control of the death star
Interesting point of view. I agree with you. Well sited and well articulated. You do awesome work and thank you so much!
In the rogue, one noviliisation . In-between chapters there is a copy of a text message exchange between talking and krennic , tarkin explains exactly how the death star will be used. When finished. ( to suppress rebellions ) including the destruction of as many worlds as it takes for the message to sink in , with every act of rebellion, the death star will be used. . With ( illuminating) effect.
I noticed a plot hole in the Tarkin Doctrine's scripture. How could Tarkin have given Palpatine the idea for the Death Star during the height of the Empire when Tarkin was seen on the bridge of a re-painted Venetor-class Star Destroying overseeing the first stages of its construction alongside Vader and Palpatine at the end of Revenge of the Sith? In fact prototype plans for the Death Star were shown as early as Attack of the Clones, with the implication being it was Dooku's idea, not Tarkin's.
He suggestion happened before he even knew of the Death Star's existence. Its explained in the video that Tarkin didn't start the project just took it over and took credit for it.
Aka "Great minds think alike" in action or in this case "Tyrannical minds think alike".
@@Warcrafter4 Except he was on the bridge of the Star Destroyer looking over the beginning of its construction in 19 BBY. He's right there in Revenge of the Sith. Go back and watch the last few minutes of that movie.
So, that just means he knew about it by that point! I mean he could have developed the doctrine over the course of the Clone Wars to the beginning of the Empire, with Sidious putting him in charge of overseeing the Death Star project as its was being constructed as Tarkin was pro superweapon so he'd be keen on overseeing such a weapon's destruction! Tarkin's doctrine simply outlined how to use such a weapon to maintain imperial rule through fear! Tarkin & Palpatine were like minded which is why Palpatine was okay with him dying!
@@RaphBlade7 In this very video Stupendous Wave said Tarkin developed the doctrine as a Moff, after the Republic was "reorganized into The First Galactic Empire," and that an idea for a Superweapon was part of that.
So either Tarkin thought that huge moon-sized scaffolding was something else entirely and Palpatine replied to him with "Oh well what a coincidence, I happen to be working on one such super weapon right now! You even saw it a few years ago!" or somebody made a bit of a continuity goof.
@@AceSpadeThePikachu I always thought that this scene was years later
Siddious knew Tarkin was to ambitious and was going to have to be dealt with. Tarkin being on the Deathstar when it was destroyed saved Siddious from having to deal with him at all problem solved.
Tarkin was a Himmler Counterpart. Palpatine being the Fuhrer of course. Thrawn being Rommel, the war hero who was at odds with his empire. Vader being Goring, a brutish thug leading the frontlines of the war. And then Goebells which essentially could be the Grand Inquisitor, The head of the ISB, or even Dooku. And then Krennic and Gideon who could easily take the place of Rudolf Hess or Bormann
Tell me you watched ancient nazi mysteries on discovery without telling me 😂😂😂😂
@@pyotrbagration2438the galactic empire was designed by george lucas to be space nazis,to be the bad guy to defeat in order to free the galaxy from brutish space fascists.the references are no myths.
Vader is more like a mix of Goering considering his early life and Skorzeny due to his role.
The question remains; Who was Dirlewanger most similar to?
Maybe Jabba? Or Grievous with his army of droids he seen as expendable?
Yeah despite the fact that the idea of Himmler being at odds with Hitler is not really true. Anyway i would probably compare Vader more to Walter Model.
Rip Tarkin
One of the best Star Wars villains.
keep them comin brother, great videos & effort
And we're sure Palpatine doesn't have a mustache? Because he seems to be twirling it a lot.
As Sidius said to Vader, "I do not wish to rule a galaxy of the dead!". Although Tarkin did have permission to due so, he seemingly figuratively and literally slowly blew that out of proportion given it would give rise for more rebellion one planet at a time for each dead one
The fact that tarkin rushed Vader by himself while trying to hunt him is amazing
The Death Star was also the pinnacle of mining technology. When destroying planets the material becomes highly accessible as asteroid size chunks. Imagine how much raw metal a planet's core is worth.
From a different point of view, you could say tarkin is one of the most evil and villainous person in the Star Wars galaxy that not even palpatine can rival if you count heads
"That guy gave me the creeps." Palpatine; on Tarkin
Love the content bro
It’s so good
Thank you so much!
5:12 Tarkin knew of the Death Star since the beginning, he’s next to the Emperor and Vader at the end of Revenge of the Sith
Death Star plans were made before the clone wars
Something to think about with Tarkin’s character. Much is said about his position within the Empire, and whether he was a threat to Palpatine. When A New Hope was written, filmed, and released, the Empire had a much different dynamic than it did in ESB and ROTJ, and it’s noticeable. The way George envisioned the Empire at the time was a bureaucracy controlled by the military. The officers in that meeting room weren’t just the Imperial equivalent of the joint chiefs of staff, but he envisioned them as the real power controlling the Empire, and the emperor as merely a public figurehead mostly controlled by the men in that room, led by Tarkin. So in his original design, Tarkin basically WAS the emperor in all but name, and Darth Vader was noticeably subservient to Tarkin. Just like Darth Vader was originally the character’s actual name and he wasn’t Luke’s father, nor was Leia his sister. When George changed directions slightly with the rest of the trilogy to turn Emperor Palpatine into a Sith Lord, him and other creators made an effort to flesh out Tarkin in written works and make it all sensible.
So tarkin was Sejanus in the original idea. I'm not going to lie sometimes I think that George Lucas should have kept a lot more of his original ideas rather than going with the magical emperor idea. I remember in one version of the original series the Jedi in the sith both serve the emperor and that the sith should have took control and pushed the Jedi out. Kind of like the praetorian guard (Sith) vs the Varangian Guard (Jedi).
Great video! 👌
Palpatine:to Lord Vader: I'm glad tarkin died on the death star...
I'm confused. Didn't the death star already been planned in the clone wars? How tarkin suggested a super weapon when one was already thought?
He didn't know about it at the time, he just thought tactically it was a good idea.
Note: In another video even Thrawn didn't know until he figured it out on own.
You're not supposed to ask that 😂, just accept the disney canon
@@jenisia3600 It's a movie about “Space Wizards” it's not supposed to make sense.
@@SaraNightfire1 That is what Disney would like you to believe.
Tarkin was gettin' too big for his britches
👍👍👍👍
“Our researchers have found evidence..” oh god you’re killing me 😅 like this is real
I'm a tad confused. I thought Sidious was super pissed at Tarkin for letting a farm destroy not only the Empire's greatest weapon, but denied to personally punish Tarkin for it.
_"Tarkin, give me back my Death Star!!"_
The idea of Vader choking Tarkin is honestly very entertaining.
good video!
Tarkin was such a good character.
Tarkin was lucky he died in the Death Star, it was mercifully quick compared to what Palpatine would have done to him
Honestly, classic star wars was great, Tarken was a legitimate threat to vader and palpatine. He knew a lot of things, competent and has many of the traits Palpatine and Vader had being only a normal human. He didn't have the force, but didn't need it he was simply that effective of an officer and individual. A solid villain in his own right and id wager he scared Palpatine though he'd never admit it.
Palpatine: That buffoon Tarkin has only sped up the downfall of the Empire.
Vader: I tried to get him to stop. Does that help?
Palpatine: You should've tried harder, Vader. You should've tried harder.
I'm less surprised that Palpatain was wary of Tarkin than I am by the idea of Vader having such trsentment towards him. Based on their having been somewhat friendly since before Anikan became Vader; I'd have thought Tarkin was one of the closest thingd Vaden had to an actually friendly aquaintance.
Then again, Palpatain probably enjoyed playing them against each othet to make them resrnt the other. Ueh, so, uhm, never mind.
It is said " Evil by its very nature, always turns in upon itself"
Now it makes sense, Wilhuff Tarkin is like Heinrich Himmler: a future backstabber.
I'm definitely a "Thrawne-Type"
You have 2 options
1) Let the size of your one, or two, giant space weapons be the image of your empire, seeking to inspire control a dissuade rebellion
2) People are already familiar with your Stardestroyer class ships, now imagine if the size of your fleet saw you able to _keep_ 10-15 ships around each empire controlled world, with enough left over to double that presence at a moments notice, from the surrounding area. The size of your naval fleet would be more than enough to spread the word if your control.
Yularen was only a colonel, not a grand admiral.
Back before the expanded universe really took off as a result of both the prequels and Zahn's thrawn novels, the first star wars novel had a photo lineup of tje characters including Tarkin who was mentioned as wanting to become emperor. Keep in mind this was one of the earliest version of the book (a gold cover).
A big part of why Tarkin got to the position he did was because he was part of one of the wealthiest and most influential families in the Old Republic.
In fact,his family took Palpatine under its wing at the start of Palpatine's political career, so Palpatine's rise to power wasn't just because of his dark side powers,it was also because he had the patronage/support of one of the most powerful and influential families in the Old Republic
Something Palpatine never forgot
Palpatine’s master Plagueis was also involved in that scene which is how he met Palpatine.
@@buyerenogurlfwendo2106 That's Legends though, who knows what current canon is
Well in Legends. In Disney canon Tarkin was probably too loyal to Palpatine to worry about. I mean after all hard to think a guy is plotting against you when his first reaction to Vader Force choking him is to be glade Vader is loyal to the Empire.
I thought it was going to be that sidious liked the fact it was like the captain going down with his ship
Simple way to counter your strongest conander (tarkin) is make him a complete equal to vader, because as u climb the ranks your fighting everyone but vader vs tarkin keeps them both on there feet and distracted from going higher instead they focus on staying at the top
So Tarkin hated aliens, did he? Anyone else think that's the sole reason why during Ahsoka's trial, he asked for her to be given penalty of death?
Before watching the video I’m guessing it is for one of two reasons:
1-Tarkin was in charge of the Death Star and therefore he deserved to die for his failure.
2-He had doubts about Tarkin’s loyalty.
Do a video at some point of what Palpatine thought of Grand Moff Tarkin vs. what his thoughts were of Grand Admiral Thrawn. Who was Sidious more impressed by?
We need a series on the Empire leading up to A New Hope.
Amazing
Sidious - Tarkin is admirable. I like him.
Tarkin - Lord Sidious, I need a raise.
Sidious - I hate him.
What is the lore on the 'hatred of aliens' in Sheev Palapatine, raised on a planet with Gungans - and 'mentored' by a Mun ?...
I just remenber that scene on star wars rebels when Vader threaten lothal's leader (dont remenber the category) and she Talk back to him, so Vader said she would respond to tarkin and she got complitely terrified, says a lot of tarkins reputation and authority
Tarkin was a manchild who failed to grasp the basic necessity of life which is what ultimately lead to the fall of the empire as a whole.
The scary thing is, had Thrawn been in charge, he'd have solved the main flaw of the tarkin doctrin, and the empire may have never been defeated.
Fear of punishment on it's own merely builds resenment, but fear of punishment, combined with reward of service makes one fail to notice the pot even heating up.
Without reason to fight, people tend to ignore the world getting worse around them.... Thrawn would not foolishly waste the deathstar's power on a single and beloved planet. He'd use it on a smaller, well known but more neutral positioned planet's *moon* throwing tidal forces out of wack and showing the power of the deathstar while 'sparing' the citizens.
But before he even did that, he would provide actual *benefits* for serving the empire, thus making the cost of rebellion seem completely irrational in reguards to the status quo.
The carrot, always works better than the stick, as the stick should only be used when the carrot has failed.
*You better not be taking notes future dictators, otherwise I'll start sabotaging you*
tarkins family were crazy idiots who wanted the strongest of their bloodline to survive,the rest gets eaten by the carnivorous fauna,this mindset that only the strongest survives and you only get power if you take it away from others because life itself was for him one single power struggle against everyone else,he failed to realize that people can work together instead of brutally taking whatever someone has by force.this idiology of him dominated every corner of his career and led to the ultimate downfall of the empire. Tarkin wasn't a manchild,he was a psychopath.
Advice to future dictators, take a screenshot before they can edit this comment.
Tarkin sounds like he was planning his own coup against the Emperor; gaining more power and rising above the ranks to eventually surpass Vader himself, with only The Emperor left in his way. There is no doubt Tarkin would have eventually gathered enough Imperials loyal to him to stage his coup.
It's interesting to compare Tarkin's policies vis a vis The Death Star to the policies of The United States and The Soviet Union vis a vis nuclear weapons. Firing The Death star on a planet is comparable to nuking a country on our world. At the time, we did not consider The Manhatttan Project immoral, and we demonstrated nukes on Japan in an effort to get them and the world to accept a new order. Tarkin and The Empire were not at war with Alderon, as we were with Japan, and the Post WWII era on Earth seems somewhat more benign than The Empire. Our world is as if The Death Star was constructed at the behest of The Republic, while it was beset by an alien ideology, in order to deter that. However, Tarkin's goal with The Death also appears to be one of deterrence, rather than the destruction of thousands of planets.
Imagine if Krenic was still in charge of Death Star in New Hope.
I wonder what sort of outcome will occur?
Im of the opinion that Tarkin could hae done well, simply by having a number of planetary leaders meet on the Deathstar, show them the power of it by destroying a Dead World and they informing those leaders that failure to deal with treasonous forces on their worlds would be seen as Treason against the Empire.
Mass evacuation of civilians would be seen as a sign of Treasonous inclination.
Palpatine decided to get rid of Tarkin after the Scarif debacle.
Luke Skywalker and a pair of photon torpedoes saved him a lot of trouble.
Tarkin forget one important thing. To rule by fear one shouldn't anger their population too much, lest they might rebel even futher.
Tarkin was the most powerful and ambition man in the empire after Sidious and Vader with being grand moff of oversector outer and with massive military power of Scourge squadron at his command and in the dog eat dog would of the empire, would probably made an eventual grab for power over the whole empire. So now wonder emperor was happy to see his destroyed onboard the first death star.
Not only Tarkin was a military genius he would have been the next emperor
I would be interested to see if Palpatine would promote Tarkin should have the rebellion been crushed in Yavin 4.
According to Legends sources, Tarkin would have become a Supreme Moff, second only to the Emperor in control of imperial territories, next to the Commander in Chief, Vader, but this time in all aspects.
Interesting how in canon the Supreme Commander of the Imperial Military is a lesser rank and the one above the Joint Chiefs, but the role remains vacant for the most part outside of Grand General Tagge's role.
Palpatine was not the only person that was happy tarkin died aboard the Death Star. Although I was sad Yularen died on board, I was very happy to see tarkin was dead.
He honestly deserved to die, but he also was given the option to evacuate. So he was incompetent to not take that opportunity to evacuate.
The color theme contrast on the thumbnail makes me think that tarkan chose the destroy ending and sidious chose the control ending. 😉
One thing I didn’t understand when watching rogue one was how the Death Star 1 had the ability to use a single reactor ignition when in episode 4 it had one firing mode I don’t know a lot about this. If anyone has a explanation I would love to hear it.
Basically they just used the super laser on low power mode.
Tactical genius yet plot armor caused him to throw away sense during the battle of Yavin
His pride became his undoing.
Tactical genius that failed basic reconnaissance when interrogating Leia about the rebel base.
No tarkin obsession with making statements was shown before that. Had he did what krennic said and vaporized Jeddah instead of just the city the rebels never would have gotten the plans. Plus his decision to destroy Alderaan was stupid as hell. He should have destroyed mon calamari instead. Would have done a lot more damage to the rebellion plus it was a legitamate military target
@@George-Hawthorne yeah because a general wouldn’t have an escort fleet, deploy more fighters etc.
@@mider9996 was there anything interesting on Dantooine? Other than the rebel holdout that had just been emptied just barely in time?
You serve evil loyally enough and eventually bad things happen to you.
Tarkin was really the Tywin Lannister of Star Wars
I believe Palpatine secretly suspected the death star was going bite the bullet, so he let Tarkin meet his fate. Palpatine would have eventually did away with Tarkin
It just occurred to me, wouldn't just about everyone figure out that Darth Vader was Anakin Skywalker once it was known that Obi-Wan snuck onto the death star? Because Vader made it no secret, at least to Tarkin that Obi-Wan was his "old master" and wasn't it public knowledge that Anakin Skywalker was the apprentice of Obi-Wan?
Tarkin could always go to Coruscant with his Death Star and kill the Emperor.
then starwars could have stayed just one movie no more movies would have been made. no empire or return of the jedi. or prequels. the good news would be no sequel trilogy though
Unlikely since Vader was placed on it to keep him in check. The moment he’d tried pulling that kind of move, Vader would’ve ended him. And nobody on the station would’ve listened to the order out fear of what both Vader & the Emperor would do
I love your videos man don’t ever stop giving us the information 💯💯🪬🤟🏾🖤💚
Palpatine: "Tarkin was always an ass kisser."