DEBATE: Trinity vs. Tawheed (Dr. James White vs. Jake Brancatella)
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Christian scholar Dr. James White and Jake Brancatella debate Trinity vs. Tawheed live on @Alpha & Omega Ministries @Dividing Line Highlights @DrOakley1689. Thursday July 22nd 2021 2pm EST.
Original Video: • Trinity vs. Tawheed: J...
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James White is holding a self-defeating position. He is trying to put forth a logical argument claiming that logic (philosophy) is below scripture. You cannot use a logical argument to argue against logic. This is a self-defeating position.
Logic and scripture must go hand in hand. We use logic to understand scripture. If logic can be dismissed then why not just accept all scriptures??? If logic is dismissed then anything can be true!!! All religions could then be true. James white recognizes contradictions and rejects one scripture for another, hence he is using logic.
James is using logic up until we ask him for a logical argument for the trinity. He knows that mystics never come to such a conclusion. All mystics including the great Issac Newton, who rejected the trinity on his death bed, come to conclude that God is One.
His belief in the trinity is solely based on unknown greek authors who have a long history of trinitarian religion. (Zeus, Apollo and Athena).
Firas, talk to your boy Joe Rogan. See if he can have someone like Muhammad Hijab or Hamza Tzortzis on his podcast. This would make such a big and positive impact inshallah. You’re cool with Rogan and he highly respects you. Im sure something can be worked out.
You, Hamza and Hijab would make such an amazing podcast. I will serious make tahajud for this
Great point brother.
I don't know much about James White and I haven't watched this debate in full yet, but the argument (at least from Orthodox Christianity) is that revelation is the necessary epistemic starting point, not the created mind of man. From revelation we can ground logic, not the other way around.
This creates a problem for Islam in particular with its doctrine of Tanzih, meaning incomparability or transcendence from created things. If Allah is incomparable to any created thing, how can the created mind of man, using created laws of logic, come to the conclusion that Allah exists?
The Trinity is not three separate gods, but rather one God existing in three distinct persons - the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
Each person of the Trinity is fully God and equal in power and glory, yet they are distinct from one another in their roles and functions.
The Father is God, the Son is God and the Holy Spirit is God, but there is only one God. It is not three different gods because each person of the trinity is one being, sharing the same divine nature.
The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are distinct persons, each with their own individual roles in God's plan of salvation.
The Father is the Creator and sovereign ruler of the universe, the Son is the Redeemer and Savior of the world, and the Holy Spirit is the Sanctifier and Comforter of believers.
Yet each are the same God, united in purpose and character.
The Old Testament:
• Genesis 1:26 - “Then God said, ‘Let us make man in our image, after our likeness.’”
- This verse supports the Trinity by demonstrating that there is more than one being involved in God's act of creation. The use of the plural pronouns “us” and “our” indicates that there is a plurality of persons involved in the creation of man. This implies that there is more than one person in the Godhead, which is the core belief of the Trinity.
• Isaiah 48:16 - “Come near me and listen to this: ‘From the first announcement I have not spoken in secret; at the time it happens, I am there.’ And now the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit.”
- This verse supports the doctrine of the Trinity as it speaks of God speaking in multiple voices, which is a main tenet of the Trinity, that God exists in three distinct persons.
• Genesis 18:1-2 - “The Lord appeared to Abraham near the great trees of Mamre while he was sitting at the entrance to his tent in the heat of the day. Abraham looked up and saw three men standing nearby. When he saw them, he hurried from the entrance of his tent to meet them and bowed low to the ground.”
- This passage is believed to be a direct reference to the Trinity as it speaks of three distinct persons (the Lord and the three men) coming together in the same place. This is a direct reference to the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit as the three divine persons of the Trinity.
The New Testament:
• Matthew 3:16-17 - “As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting on him. And a voice from heaven said, ‘This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.’”
- This passage supports the trinity because it shows that Jesus, the Spirit of God, and God the Father exist as separate persons within the one God. The Father's voice declares Jesus to be his beloved Son and the Spirit of God is seen descending like a dove onto Jesus. This suggests that all three persons of the trinity were actively involved in the baptism of Jesus.
• Matthew 28:19 - “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.”
- This verse supports the trinity by referencing all three persons of the Godhead: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. It states, “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.” This shows that the three persons of the trinity are distinct and yet work together in unity to bring about God's will. It also shows that they are of equal importance and worth, as all three are equally referenced in this verse.
• 2 Corinthians 13:14 - “May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.”
- This verse is a Trinitarian blessing, which supports the Trinity by affirming the presence of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It is a reminder that the three are distinct and yet one, unified in their purpose and mission
@@omarabbasi2682 Yes my friend and here is more coherence to this logic.
1. The doctrine of the Trinity is logically coherent when viewed through the lens of the biblical account. The Bible teaches that God is one being, yet three distinct persons (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). This is made clear in Matthew 28:19 when Jesus instructs his disciples to baptize in “the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.”
2. The Trinity is consistent with the philosophical concept of a "person". A person is defined as a distinct individual with the capacity for self-awareness, relationship, and moral decision-making. All three persons of the Trinity display these traits, as each has the capacity to think, feel, will, and act independently of the others.
3. The Tri-Unity of God is also consistent with the biblical teaching of the unity of God. Although the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are distinct persons, they are all part of the same divine being. This is made clear in John 10:30, where Jesus says, “I and the Father are one.”
4. The doctrine of the Trinity is also consistent with Christian beliefs about the nature of God. God is described as being both omnipotent (all-powerful) and omniscient (all-knowing). This implies that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit all share the same divine attributes, but can also act independently as three distinct persons.
5. Finally, the Trinity is logically coherent because it allows for the three persons of the Godhead to exist in relationship with one another. This is seen in passages such as John 17:21-23, where Jesus prays that the Father and the Spirit may be glorified in him and that he may be glorified in them. This shows that the Father, Son, and Spirit are in a relationship of love and unity with one another.
The Deedat’s era has done its job. Now, we are entering a new one. I call it the ‘Muslim Metaphysician’ era. You’ll be a major asset in spreading the deen in’sha’Allah.
Deedat Era continues to do its job perfectly whenever it's a matter of SCRIPTURE. He beat them from the sayings of the Jesus OF THE BIBLE and that continues to expose and destroy Christianity THE MOST. 😊
Not to forget that Brother Jake is fantastic.
@@Truth-Is-a-Hard-Pill Delusion continua
@@Truth-Is-a-Hard-Pill and heart 💜
Agreed 👍
As a Biblical Unitarian I heartily endorse Jake the Muslim Metaphysician as the winner of this debate
I believe the Unitarian christian follow the real teachings of jesus.they are the real follower of the historical jesus.
@@mohdnorsyarafiabdullah3144 thank you so much for your kind words
@nigel mackiel oh really???? I am a member of the Biblical Unitarian Faith. Why do you say that I'm not a Christian?? Beware of judging me by your own standards
@@mohdnorsyarafiabdullah3144 thank you for your support and I am going to ask you to come to Jesus and be converted to the Biblical Unitarian Faith
@@danielturcotte9146 He wont't come to your Jesus...because I strongly doubt your unitarian Jesus can save anyone apart from himself. Don't you think he only died for himself, if you say he was not God? How would the death of a mere man save the entire world??? That is the unitarian DILEMMA!
If Jesus is not God, then he was merely a human and God's love has not been poured out to all mankind. Only the Trinitarian position makes sense - Jesus is DIVINE in nature (just as The Father is DIVINE), then he took on human flesh (in agreement to the will of the the Father) to die for the sins of the whole world.
If you are a unitarian (regardless of the "Biblical" appendage), you have no reason to refute Islam or evangelize them. You should be asking yourself when you will review the life of Muhammad and become a Muslim...if not I doubt your anti-Trinitarian position would help anyone.
Cheers
Salaam Alaikum,
Watched the whole thing beginning to end and I've gotta be honest, I thought the debate would be more competitive given Dr. White's years of experience...
But this was a landslide victory for Brother Jake, the debate wasn't even close.
Just off the top of my head, Dr White did not:
1. Define the word person
2. Define the word being
3. Explain what it is from his perspective that distinguishes a monotheist from a polytheist
4. James White kept "arguing" that we have to put scripture before reason, but provided no reason as to why one would do that, and therefore isn't really providing an argument to do so (or is providing a baseless argument to do so).
Note: James White also contradicts himself here, as he himself applies the use of reason to the scripture, in order to arrive at his trinitarian conclusion - meaning that when he looks at the biblical verses, he uses his reasoning to decide that those verses support a trinitarian viewpoint, rather than a unitarian viewpoint.
Ultimately, Jake was answering Dr. White's questions, but Dr. White was failing to answer Jake's questions.
The truth stands, and the falsehood falls.
Alhamdulillah
This is how majority of Christian Muslim debates go unfortunately… Christians cop out by saying “god is a mystery” ,”bible is the inspired word of god” and few more catch phrases to defend there absurd illogical stance
LoL. The Trinity is easy to understand. Since God's breath is the same thing as his spirit. God's spirit (very essence) MUST BE ETERNAL. But then you come to the Weight of God's Word. Which is ALSO ETERNAL ( Christ declared himself to be the Divine Flesh of God) 😂 So. 🤷
I agree 👍
@@jerryjohnson4008that makes absolutely no sense
@@jerryjohnson4008fanfiction
Dr White: if the concept of God that is presented to mankind through revelation makes rational and logical sense, and is compatible with philosophical axioms then it must be false.
Jake: Reason, logic, and philosophical axioms are not above revelation, but are compatible with them because God endowed us with reason, logic, and the ability to discover philosophical axioms.
White doesn't make sense when you examine the scripture quotes he brings
0:00:00 | Introduction
*Opening Statements*
0:04:37 | Jake Brancatella - Opening Statement
0:19:26 | James White - Opening Statement
*Rebuttals*
0:34:59 | Jake Brancatella - Rebuttal
0:45:18 | James White - Rebuttal
0:55:53 | Jake Brancatella - 2nd Rebuttal
1:01:05 | James White - 2nd Rebuttal
*Q and A*
1:06:35 | Questions for James White
1:17:00 | Questions for Jake Brancatella
*Closing Statements*
1:27:51 | Jake Brancatella - Closing Statement
1:37:57 | James White - Closing Statement
1:47:46 | Outro
Thanks brother in Islam, on youtube, and on Twitter 😊
Muslims literally *ruled the world through excellence.* Always remember these two names
***Ibn Sina*** 9th century muslim
*Founder of Modern Medicine*
1. Light being a finite wave
2. Objects having their own personal gravity
3. Father of Medicine, (before this point people in the west used chinese type medicine. "So if you look at jupiter you might have excessive bowl movement today")
4.a. Invented numerous medical equipment we use to this day such as *scalpels* etc
4. As if all of that isnt enough. He postulated about the Big Bang (from the Quranic Verse ofc but he brought it to the realm of science and human attempted understanding)
The rest of which Im still discovering about him as its a pain to find info on him
And
***Ibn Al Haytham*** 9th century muslim
1. ***Founder of Science***
2. Founder of Optics, refractions, the camera etc
3. *Founder of the unbiased experimentation method* (repeated experiments to get less bias? Thats this guy)
4. He also wrote on Gravity like Ibn Sina
Here's the kicker and pin this
** 1687 Isaac Newton (read criminal)
Had a copy of Kitab al Manazir
Source: Islamic Era Scientists: Muhammed Hamza El-Saba (Professor Engineering) Sept 2021
"Ibn Al Haytham did a whole series of experiments, with darkrooms with pinholes (like camera) and other devices, to prove that Light Rays enter the eye from the outside. And he founded the Theory of Light Refraction and Reflection.
This work of Ibn Al Haytham, based on experimental observation in the year 100-" I think they meant 1000, "represents the birth of Scientific experimental method. His approach was translated into Latin and taken up centuries later by Roger Bacon, Francis Bacon, and Galileo.**
___***In 1687, Isaac Newton Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica[1], in which he formulated Newton's laws of motions and Newton's laws of gravity, after centuries of their discovery and publishing, by Islamic era Scientists!"***___
Christians Atheists only thro genocide, colonialism, Nazism, r9pe and cheating in various forms
Then stealing Muslim advancements
Christians do what they do best
At least he had the *audacity* to signage the magnificence
"We stand on the shoulders of giants-!"
My butt
What he means is
"We stole your stuff again Muslims"
At least James white recited some very important verses of Quran which most Christian never heard. So thank you mr White for giving dawah to Christian without realizing
Glad I found this comment because when he read all those verses of the Qur'an I thought this same thing.
I politely referred Jay Dyer to debate TMM on his live stream, got a bunch of people cursing me in chat, and got blocked from the channel immediately lol
As a Christian it pains me to say that I believe Dr. White lost this debate. Brancatella brought up good questions which White avoided to answer or didn't understand Jake's objection. This is where his rejection of classical theism (mainly drawn out by Aquinas) hurt James. Hopefully this discussion will have Dr. White look into and understand the stance of classical thiesm.
@@panaderiatecnica5922 simply speaking from a classical theist POV not saying that Trinity is not true, just saying that Dr. White had issues approaching from a metaphysical perspective (Aquinas teachings)
@@panaderiatecnica5922 The Holy Scripture is the only sufficient, certain, and infallible rule of all saving knowledge, faith, and obedience, although the light of nature, and the works of creation and providence do so far manifest the goodness, wisdom, and power of God, as to leave men inexcusable; yet are they not sufficient to give that knowledge of God and his will which is necessary unto salvation. Therefore it pleased the Lord at sundry times and in divers manners to reveal himself, and to declare that his will unto his church; and afterward for the better preserving and propagating of the truth, and for the more sure establishment and comfort of the church against the corruption of the flesh, and the malice of Satan, and of the world, to commit the same wholly unto writing; which maketh the Holy Scriptures to be most necessary, those former ways of God's revealing his will unto his people being now ceased. (from the 1689 LBCF Ch. 1.1)
@@panaderiatecnica5922 Also too, I find it hard to believe that all Christians are not borrowing thoughts from individuals who have come before us. (hence: the doctrine of the Trinity)
@@Toronado2 I believe Jesus Christ is God incarnate of the Second Person or subsistence (more proper term) of the Triune Godhead. I believe doctrine of the Trinity is faithful and aligns with the Holy Scriptures, but I do also believe Dr. White struggled with this debate (perhaps maybe due to a lack of understanding classical theism) and because he was not able to provide a proper response I believe he lost the debate.
@@Toronado2 I believe Thomas was addressing/proclaiming Jesus as God
in short, Jake presented at least 5 arguments against trinity while the dr white presented nothing of value against Tawheed
And james didn't really respond to any of those arguments, he really said humans can't understand it with their logic lol
@@abduallahamin2001 Hi Abduallah, I'd like to test the consistency of your claim. Can you please tell me, ontologically speaking - what is Allah? Please give me a positive definition of Allah's very nature. Im assuming (according to your claim) that we can logically understand it. Thank you.
@@Ttcopp12rt
Did you watch the debate? Br Jake mentioned this surah in the debate Idk how many times
(Al-Ikhlas)
1. Say (O Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم): "He is Allâh, (the) One.
2. "Allâh-us-Samad (السيد الذي يصمد إليه في الحاجات) [Allâh the Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, (He neither eats nor drinks)].
3. "He begets not, nor was He begotten.
4. "And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him."
@@abduallahamin2001
This objection also works against islam as well
There are also things about God in islam that humans can't comprehend
The difference is that our list of incomprehensible things is bigger
That in and of itself makes islam more probable
But let's not forget the resurrection argument and the fact that the "gospel has been corrupted" is a conspiracy theory at best
@@muhammadzamzam9915 Im still waiting for my answer from Abduallah... Please reread my question because you ignored everything I said. I specifically asked for a positive definition of Allahs nature - but S112 does not give a positive definition at all. Im still waiting waiting to hear a positive definition of what Allah is as to his nature - so that I can categorize him according to his being and then test that in different models.
I watched the debate on James’ channel too. James dodged Jake’s questions. He was like ‘well the stuff happened historically in the Bible, and we get the trinity from the Bible, why do you gotta bring philosophy, logic, and reason into Jake ?’ ‘Just accept what God did like I do as a presup, don’t question it’. 😎
@@frankjaeger9068 Are you saying what James White said as well ? In other words 'throw human logic out of the window when discussing the trinity ?'
@@frankjaeger9068 So you are agreeing with James then. You believe the Bible is true b/c it says it in the Bible. You're a presup. There's no 'attempt' to answer Jake's questions from people like James and you, just the waffle and dodge game b/c of the presup position you guys hold. The trinity has to be true right, don't question it.
@@frankjaeger9068 "Of course you can question it". And that is what these dialogues/debates are about. If the foundation/concept of God in your religion can not stand to common sense, sound logic and reasoning, coherency etc when examined by non-Christians then the very foundation ( the most important/critical foundation ) you are believing should be seriously questioned by the members of that religion.
@@frankjaeger9068 that verse you mentioned in Colossians, Christians engage in philosophical debates all the time, with Jake and others, your must know this. You’ve throwing your fellow Christians under the bus.
@@frankjaeger9068
Christians (Trinitarians) have no choice without delving deeper in philosophy.They were contradicting their scripture and now they had to show how they were not contradicting it. Quran never mentions a trinity of Father, son and Mary czcams.com/video/C81QDlpOOCw/video.html
Wow, Brother Jake was literally on fire bashing him with ground breaking arguments back to back and Dr. White just couldn’t keep up; even Jake knew early on that he won’t be able to directly address these issues because they would be the breaking point. Brilliant work to say the least, best thing was starting with Bismillah. Masha Allah!
@@WilliamEllison Loool, nah kid, this ain't like when you christians come along with the same old arguements against Islam with no evidence or any well thought out arguement. These problems of christianity lie within christianity itself and have not been resolved.
@@WilliamEllison why don't you challenge Jake to a debate? I would watch it
@@UriPhoneCracker He will never even in the next zillion years to come!
@@WilliamEllison. And people still don’t get it that 1+1+1=1 wander why ooo because is 3-three.
Jake, what's with these people agreeing to debates, but then not answering questions on the topic.. You smashed him.. Intellectually
@@revertrevertz5438 because the Christians version of the trinity isn’t even in the Quran. The Quran refutes all types of trinity by saying
O People of the Scripture, do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul [created at a command] from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, "Three"; desist - it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs
• Sahih International:
They have certainly disbelieved who say, " Allah is the third of three." And there is no god except one God. And if they do not desist from what they are saying, there will surely afflict the disbelievers among them a painful punishment.
The Quran makes it explicit that God is one alone and that he has no partners
@@revertrevertz5438 and how is the Quran wrong about the trinity. The Quran address every type of trinity and not just one, u think Christianity is the only trinity. The Quran puts u all in the same category by saying that God isn’t 3 or part of 3. If we’re talking about lying then the story of adulterous women is fake as well as 1 John 5:7KJV which isn’t found in any Greek manuscript then what else is fake in the bible
@@revertrevertz5438 the Quran only mentions the trinity twice by saying not to say three and that God is part of three. U do know that there are people that take Mary to be divine and it’s addressing those people who believe Mary is divine. Never said Mary is part of the trinity. Do learn about Collyridianism, those early Christians believed Mary to be God. The Quran verse is talking about the day of judgement where Allah asks Jesus if he told anyone to take him(Jesus) and his mother(Mary) as Gods. Unfortunately there are people that have had that belief or still do
This is not about one smathing another. May ALLAH guide us to the truth , ameen.
@@revertrevertz5438, lol liar.. Majority of Christians pray to Mary.. You worship Mary..
if God is 'soooo unique' that no one can understand, then how can God blame mankind not accepting & obeying Him. It's also meaningless to send prophets & messengers with revelation.
Understanding how tall the arm of GOD and the body of GOD is made up of what, this is all irrelevant to the evidences of the existence of GOD since you can't test otherwise at all, we didn't even reach to other planets with all of our tech and you want to understand GOD and this can be demonstrated objectively and historically. Accepting and obeying GOD depends on the acceptance or the rejection of GOD's simple message, and no muslim makes the claim that the message of God no one can understand nor is hard, it is believing in one GOD and believing in prophet Muhamad and all the prophets before him Jesus, Moses, Abraham, (peace be upon them all) etc. does that seem hard to understand
for carrying a message, we need messengers from amongs us with miracles to prove they are from GOD like prophet Muhamad splits the moon which we have historical manuscripts from non islamic sources proving it historically happened, I have it, send me your email and I will send you. If GOD comes himself to reveal his message the all will be believers then where is the test?
@wolfan no need for mocking others calling then funny ignorant, you might feel victorious over them by humilitating them, but then where did your obejctive go, gone, because you are supposed to say what you say to bring people to your truth not humiliating them sending them away from your truth, so your objective is gone
if god was a man i would have killed him and steal his stuff
@wolfan just easy bro with people, not everyone is blessed with knowledge like yourself, we need to be patient with people when talking to them
@@agadirand4four347 yeah he would be right with christianity because they can't explain their message because they say we can't understand GOD, while in ISLAM we are able to explain GOD's message, a child can explain it ot is that simple to believe in one GOD that is it not 3 in 1 while the 3 are not the same as the 1 but they eventually the 3 are the 1 this is the confusing and when we ask them, they say we can't understand GOD, this is the weakness and the hypocrisy of them
Jake you killed it
RIP
James admits that trinity is illogical at the end --- and he is telling us just to accept.
End of debate.
Jake is a lion may Allah bless you and continue to guide you. May Allah also guide James White to Islam Ameen.
ameen
The only way we can be on a level playing field with God is through the son, Jesus Christ.
I’m afraid Dr. White is not going to recite the shahada anytime soon.
James White complains constantly that Muslims don't understand the trinity accurately but he continues to misconstrue what the Qur'an is. He continues to box the Qur'an in as a revelation that is supposed to address the specifics of his Calvinistic Christian beliefs when the Qur'an continually affirms that it is a revelation to mankind to address all erroneous beliefs and to bring people back to the oneness of Allah. I'm glad Jake pointed out that when the Qur'an says "And do not say Three; desist - it is better for you" the Qur'an is refuting any form of Trinitarian belief no matter the brand of Christianity.
The Quran teaches Allah Mary and Jesus is the Trinity 🤦🤦🤦🤦 So the Quran got it wrong we don't believe that and even the disciples and apostles didn't teach that
@@conflictortiz8906 The Qur’an does not teach that Mary is part of the trinity nor does it go into detail onto any one specific model of the trinity as there are countless models and various beliefs about it. The Qur’an says to not to even say “three” when referring to the majesty of Allah as he is just one God. When the Qur’an mentions Mary the point is made that prophet Isa was born from a woman who was merely a mortal as he was. It is reiterating the humanity of Isa by showing that both he and his mother, the womb that bore here, were devoid of any divine characteristics.
The reality is that no one knows what Christians believe when it comes to the trinity. Watch any of these YT streams or listen to any explanation of it and no two Christians will agree. The beliefs surrounding this incoherent doctrine are as varied as the number of Christians on this planet which is why the Qur’an specifically says “So believe in Allah and His messengers, and say not “Three.” Refrain! It is better for you. Allah is only one God; Glory be to Him that He should have a child.”
@@Tranquility_Auto_Detailing um yes it does 🤦🤦🤦🤦 stop lying man
@@conflictortiz8906 how many different models of trinity have existed throughout history? And Quran makes it clear that ALL forms of trinity is false. You assuming Quran got it wrong is the equivalent of ALL forms of trinity being false. It makes no difference either way as historically there is already an internal conflict of which trinity model is true 😉
@@commandar88 the Quran itself contradicts itself 🤦🤦🤦🤦 how can Allah not have a son but have daughters 🤣🤣🤣🤣 and it says in the Quran that Jesus is the messenger (1) the Word of Allah (2) then the Spirit of Allah (3) but yet one person 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤦you don't know your Quran
I’m tired of Christians appealing to mystery. Do they not realize that even Hindus can do the same thing? Super disappointed in Dr White’s performance.
Hindus do not appeal to mystery, as far as I have seen
@@f1aziz Polytheism is not the same as mysterianism, learn to use those terms properly
@@Repentee No but the Will of God in regard to humans is comprehendable to us
@@Repentee but the fundamental basis of your belief cant be a mystery otherwise we cant differentiate between a true belief from a false belief.
@@youngwolf869 you’re on point
Good discussion 🤗 , I always have great respect for Christians like James white and others , may Allah guide him
ameen
Amin
*Nice Thumbnail! Go always for the Red Pill!*
Based and Haqqpilled
😂😂😂👊
Just watched you on PBT podcast. Well done brother! Love you for the sake of Allah! These islamaphobes are so blinded by their hate of Islam, they do nothing to defend their Bible, all they do is attack Islam!
As a Christian I don’t attack Islam, I explain how Jesus Christ has given me peace and a relationship to the one true God.
You can't really accuse Dr.White of not defending the Bible (protestant version), he has defended Islam from unfair critiques and he certainly doesn't just critique Islam he critiques numerous theological beliefs.
The whole premise of Dr White is that because he has divine revelations, and if you can somehow get the trinity from it, it doesnt matter if it makes sense or not. I call that a 'huge intellectual price tag'. Where in contrast, the Quran alwasy encourages you to use your 'reason' and think about the world and its creator intellectually.
Well said.
You can get Trinity, and Tri-theism and Unitarianism...so which one is correct?
@@Repentee I dont think you really got to the main points of the debate, your points of 2 & 3 is what Dr White is insisting on without responding to any of the problems Jake raised and basically appealed to mystery as a response because he has 'divine revelations'. Of the 5 contentions Jake raised, he responded to 0; he literally said its beyond human logic. So it doesnt matter to him if it makes sense or not. Also all of his rebuttal focus was on weather Quran has the right understanding of trinity as if somehow the Quran should specifically respond to only his model of trinity as if that makes his model correct because he cant specify it in the quran. And btw the historical angle of 'incarnation' is irrelevant to the discussion to weather the trinity makes any sense, total red herring (and not to mention totally wrong on the historical facts, scholars dont even know if the Gregorian year is actually accurate number of years to the birth of Jesus so dont even get me started on the incarnation).
The only argument james put forward is that it was prophesied using hints. Jake should have touched upon that a little more although he did briefly say that jews don't accept that interpretation and that the NT is being read into the OT, not the other way around.
Here's for those who want to jump straight to Jake (and be spared a fate more excruciatingly boring than than listening to paint dry! (i.e. jw's word salads)) :-
00:04:30 - Jake's Opener
00:34:43 - Jake's 1st Rebuttal of jw
00:55:51 - Jake's 2nd Rebuttal of jw
01:06:33 - Q&A ( * _apologies to viewers, there's no way to escape having to hear the lobotomising boredom of jw's monotone platitude_ )
01:27:49 - Jake's Closing Comments
01:37:54 - Jake's Done. End of Debate ( * _as jw lacks the minerals to address the specific questions!_ )
*Congratulations Jake!*
Jake, ur a legend sir, well done, May Allah keep you strong as excel you in your work! You broke him down piece by piece very well, great work sir !!
I assure you, he isn't a legend! He has no clue about Islam, he is merely interested in attacking the trinity.
@@nobleprince1238 what are you smoking. He has more knowledge then you can ever gain
@@af8373 Funny! Read your response again and laugh!! Just ask Jake 3 simple questions and watch him crumble:
1. Why was he initially a Quran-only Muslim and what convinced him about the Sunnah?
2. Why was the Ordeal of the Quran resolved violently?
3. Why does the Quran contain convenient revelations?
If you're really smart and you think I'm smoking something, attempt to answer questions 2&3 without using Google or calling your Imam/Sheikh.
Total destruction.. James White is making no sense. Brother Jake just demolished James white and Just announced his arrival on the debate scene!!! MashAllah. May Allah continue to guide Brother Jake.
Even though James wites arguments made zero sense I hope Allah swt guides him because of his sincerity and respectfulness
Only Allah knows his heart rather say he appears to be sincere because you don’t what his secret Allah knows it
@@Sweeti924 yes you are correct he appears to be sincere
You can “claim” to be monotheistic in your belief of the nature of God all you want, but the fact of the matter is that you’re worshiping a 3 “fully” distinct gods NOT one, regardless of any semantic gymnastics you attempt, because common logic and reason is in absolute clash with your belief. So the Quran is VERY right in saying, worship One not three.
@@MU-we8hz read my comment carefully. Merely claiming to be worshipping one God doesn’t mean that you are. The fact of the matter that they’re 3 independent, each with their own will and intellect and each being *fully* god and each are their own entity as a person THUS 3 DIFFERENT GODS! Assuring that they’re “one being” gets you no where and is a pathetic attempt to cover up a logical fallacy and inconsistency as that’s just semantic gymnastics.
@@MU-we8hz yes he does make clear distinctions between him and the Father. Going back and forth with biblical verses will just show inconsistencies in the narrative incoherent logic. “The Father is the *only* TRUE God” is a K.O. Moreover, Jesus’s knowledge is more *limited* than the father and so was his power. And to add upon that, Jesus is dependent on the Father since he was brought forth, and before Jesus there was no trinity and there never will be… Jake clearly demonstrated the truth and the problems with the christian faith and even Dr. White was unable to address these issues
@@MU-we8hz why are you not addressing the logical inconsistencies in the biblical narrative and in the christian doctrine? Stop blind following bro, isn’t God “not the author of confusion”? Jake clearly demonstrated that your doctrine is in clear *clash* with sound intellect and reason that God has created in us. But you instead, go with conflicting versus of a book with unknown authors, with 100% proven omissions and additions from biblical and non-biblical scholars, how can you still believe it’s the word of God is honestly beyond me. If we take a presumed book to be the word of God and we find just a *single* omission/addition (forgery) then that book no longer holds the criteria of being a word of God *regardless* of what was added/removed! Once you prove it’s been done ONCE, we’ve go no guarantee that it hasn’t been done more or all over the place. The truth is clear my friend, read my comment carefully and may God Guide you to the straight path.
@@MU-we8hz Why you believe that.
@@MU-we8hz why you believe the Bible is reliable source of information
I really enjoyed this, Brother Jake did a beautiful job speaking about tauhid in a way I believe anyone from any background could understand. My journey from marxist atheist orthodoxy to Islam began with looking in to philosophy, specifically haecceity. I look forward to hearing more from you, keep up the good work
Here in Indonesia some Christians treat Mary like deity. They pray to her. They even have many caves where they make high altar for her. You can search "Gua Maria" to know what I mean. Christians who go to these caves pray to her.
I remember when I was kid we watched this opera soap from South America where the main character, a nun, also prayed to her. This is why I grew up thinking Christian took Mary as one of the trinity.
Both apostate prophet and dr. James white went with same argumentation for the existence of god and the trinity and there answers are philosophy is irrelevant lol
P.s was not the debate about tawheed vs trinity and not trinity vs Mary that’s was absolute diversion by dr white.
perfectly ready for the debate, admirable knowledge brother
Religion must make sense my problem christianity doesn't make sense 😥😥
May Allah guide you ameen
Very good debate, this is how inter religious debates and discussions should be. I am tired of low level polemics and rather prefer intellectual debates like that. God bless you and may he guide us all towards the truth
Well done brother! Dr. White didn't even deal with the topic.
james white is a convoluted Word Salad practitioner who bores his opposition senseless with platitude and uses their suffocation + sleep paralysis as a deluded sense of victory.
@@objectiveincision3970 You need the light of Christ.
@@nobleprince1238 .. If such thing existed it would rescue the lobotomising drudgery of listening to james whites's monotone platitude! 😴😴😴
@@objectiveincision3970 No, you simply don't understand his viewpoint. Or you just want to be malicious.
@@nobleprince1238 .. How you managed to shoehorn the word _"simply"_ into your last response is more mysterious than the origins of james white's confidence!
'the questions you are asking produce an answer that go against what i believe, so they are irrelevant." -James White
I felt Jake laid down the gauntlet with his 5 points against the trinity. James did well to put scripture above philosophy. But Jake came back with his ‘logic flowing from God’ concept which destroyed the trinity as basis for any coherent doctrine. Guess that’s why Christianity produced only 1 great philosopher (Augustine) in its first 1000 years whereas Islam offered the world 7 great philosophers (Ghazali, Alkindi, Alrazi, IbnSina, IbnRushd, IbnArabi, IbnKhaldun) go figure why things changed after the west demoted its scripture and moved on with logic after the enlightenment.
What's important that we had a very respectful debate by two respectful scholars.
Masha Allah thank you TMM, well done.
In future timed debates I recommend standing instead of setting.
BarakAllohu fiyk! I love you my brother. May Allah increase your knowledge which is beneficial to the ummah and yourself as well! Thank you very much and jazakumAllohu khoyron!
Superb jake! Thoroughly enjoyed this discussion. ❤️
What!!!?!?!? Setting a reminder now
Thanks to both speaker for this discussion
This was a nice conversation
Absolutely magnificent analysis by Jake barakallahu feehi. Jake is a gem for the Ummah.
Jazakallahu Khairun Jake. You were on point and you were the 1st to argue with Dr White on deep philosophical issues. Dr White should have at least tried to address some of the key issues and he didn't even address the fundamental issue of defining being and persons.
Your channel is so underrated walahi may allah bless you bro. May reward you with jannah. Im really in love with this channel.
Chadian?
@@youngwolf869 ???
Are you a chadian?
Jazakallahu khairan.
Alhamdulillah again i learnt new things today and experience too
James white dodging everything like matrix
For real XD
Haha! 🤣🤣😂👍
Jake kept his cool whilst being so frustrated with Dr White not answering his points.
Awsom as always
Whenever u come to south Africa one day our homes will open for you... Great job my brother
Anyone else notice that Dr. White is left to conclude that his version of God is basically a logical contradiction.
Great arguments Jake.
جزاك الله خيراً
Nailed it
Praised to God for the blessing of the easy and logical concept of Tawheed
Great job bro Jake. With this great take down of Dr. White (no disrespect to James White), now you have scared off Andrew and Jay even more 😂 😂😂 May Allah increase you in knowledge.
enjoyed this one
Jazakallahu Khayran Ahsanul Jaza
Mashallah brother jake you done an amazing job I’ve only recently come across your channel after seeing you I think on ef dawah channel can’t believe I ain’t heard of you before Mashallah your very knowledge and may Allah bless you for your efforts and increase you in knowledge and blessings 🙏
James White is trying to avoid falling into any heresy by doing gymnastics with words. He is basing his whole argument on Bible and his historical reliability. Now if Jake would start to do textual criticism and show the internal and external inconsistency of the Bible, James would have no ground left. But it was not a debate on Textual criticism . I think that's why Jake couldn't do that. And James White didn't respond clearly to any point of Jake.
Excellent debate
jake is an intelectual beast.. may Allah perserve him
Agreed, his intellectual is indeed in another level
ameen
May Allah SW give you victory over James White. While I highly respect the man and his non hostility towards Muslims, he must be defeated.
He will appeal to arguments from authority like saying “I’ve taught church history for X amount of years, so I can’t be wrong about Y”. Or he’ll make it seem like he’s read “hours and hours of Sahih el Bukhari” (which might be true) or he’s read the Quran from front to cover X amount of times”.
I pray you expose his illogical and fallacious conclusions about the nature of the ONE TRUE GOD.
NVM it already happened, I guess lol I’ll watch later InshaAllah
i also RESPECT DR. JAMES WHITE for he is POLITE towards MUSLIMS and is very RESPECTFUL
Yeah yeah you’re waffling mate says the lion 🦁 in this era ends trinity that’s why satan is switching and investing his strength in atheism cause he know it’s ending
Good job bro
بارك الله فيك 🌹
Imagine on that day about which there is no doubt, saying to Allah Azzawajal "I never said the number 3, I only said the father, the son, and the holy ghost was God" They think to deceive Allah, but they deceive not except themselves.... Allah guides whom he wills, and I accept his decree, and I'm grateful he made me muslim! But it is difficult watching some Christians, acting arrogantly behind scripture that a Jew who hated following the laws of Allah given to Musa Alayhi Sallam, had part in writing and changed what Iesa Alayhi Sallam (Jesus pbuh) said. It's like watching a Greek argument for Zeus and Hercules! May Allah guide us all on his straight path and have mercy upon us! And cause us to die muslims and remove from us our misdeeds! Allah'u Akbar!
AlhamdulIllah TakabaAllah for the life of Jake in Islam. One for NJ here.
Allahumma bariek dear brother. You are a gift my friend and are blessed by Allah! Great work!
‘Christian concept of God is right because bible says so’ sums up Dr White’s argument. Whereas Islamic concept is that the understanding of God is innate, any human being should be able to access it if he/she unclouds his mind & heart.
If God is a logical being how does one reconcile the incident of Muhammad and Zaynab bint Jahsh?
If God is logical, how logical are these aspects of Islamic sources:
a. Surah Al Baqara:106?
b. Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421, 6422; and Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609
I didn’t say that everything God does or orders or decrees has to confirm to human logic. I only referred to the ‘concept/existence/nature of God’ as something understandable for a common human being. God Almighty has to be independent and unlimited, as that attribute separates Him from the rest of His creation. This is the concept that a common man can access through his rational thinking. His actions are based on his infinite wisdom and does not have to confirm to human logic.
@@achakmachak The issues with your position are three-fold:
1. Can humans understand the concept/nature of God besides what he revealed or his Scriptures?
2. Are you saying those without rational thinking (e.g those with severe forms of cerebral palsy) cannot understand God? Will God blame such people for their godlessness?
3. If you agree that there are aspects of God that are beyond human logic, how do you determine which ones they are? You cherry-pick whimsically?
@@nobleprince1238
1. Yes. Human Beings can understand that God Exists; He is One, He is Almighty and Unique from his Creation.
2. All creation ‘intrinsically’ looks up to a higher power. I cannot comment on people who have certain cognitive disabilities. My faith tells me that each person will be judged according to his circumstances and God decides that. So we don’t have to discuss this.
3. I answered this in point 1. There is no cherry picking here. For someone to be God, He has to be unlimited (no beginning, no end) and independent, since these attributes make that Being Unique from the rest of creation. That was the basis of the aspects that I mentioned above.
@@achakmachak 1. I'm sorry you didn't answer the question. You merely latched on the first part. Please read the full question...BESIDES...
2. I referred to cognitive disability to show you the fallibility of rational thinking as an access to God's nature. The fact that your deen provides a "way out", doesn't mean neglect the fact that such people are still basically godless, according to your definition.
3. I'll try this question again, please: Which aspects of God supercede human logic? Do you determine those aspects objectively or subjectively?
And one more
4. Would you be willing to accept a Trinitarian's stance that the trinity falls into the category of issues that supercede human logic?
Dr White is a good man who seems sincere and genuine. May Allah SWT guide Him 🙏 I have a feeling he might become Muslim some day, and if and when that day comes itll be a wonderful addition to the community of learned people in ummah , if Allah SWT wills
James White: The trinity is true because its in the Bible
Jake Brancatella: You're finished
Trinitarian believe the doctrine of trinity is biblical( ie it is in the bible).but the unitarian believe the opposite.
@@mohdnorsyarafiabdullah3144 those people still believe Jesus is the unique son of God…..they are close, but still off
In my dimension, James White is talking OFf topic n he didn't address the debate's title.
How about you guys....did he made any sense in your universe?
I am 2 years behind but great debate. Alhamduillah for Islam.
I like Jake the way he presents the topic, was very concise and provides wonderful knowledge to compete the best Christian debater.
لَقَدْ كَفَرَ الَّذِينَ قَالُوا إِنَّ اللَّهَ ثَالِثُ ثَلَاثَةٍ ۘ وَمَا مِنْ إِلَٰهٍ إِلَّا إِلَٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ ۚ وَإِنْ لَمْ يَنْتَهُوا عَمَّا يَقُولُونَ لَيَمَسَّنَّ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا مِنْهُمْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ.
(5:73) They have certainly disbelieved who say, “Allah is the third of three.” And there is no god except one God. And if they do not desist from what they are saying, there will surely afflict the disbelievers among them a painful punishment.
Man it's really difficult watching a grown man strawman his way out of a debate, he had no choice though, the alternative was to argue against the most coherent and natural creed ever.
I have listened to Dr. White for many years, never has he been so utterly defeated!
And may I add, that argument of us just being humans applying our thinking to understand Allah, is unreasonable! As if Allah SWT doesn't understand the limitations of his audience which he created.... He explains to us within the capacity of our understanding which he gave us! When he said Ol Children of Israel, thy lord is but one God, and then you understand that to mean 3, you have now trangressed the boundaries of the understanding given to you by Allah, because no where in the "Old testament" and the new testament does it grant any authority to say such things. There is no God but Allah, alone, with no partners! If there is only one in existence of anything, that makes that unique! If there's 3 of something it is not so unique! Allah'u Akbar!
James is making another common error in regards to the Quran's mentioning "Do not say three" The Quran is referring to all Trinities throughout history. The Quran is referring to the ARCHETYPE of Trinity. There have been countless trinities throughout history that far pre-date Christianity.
"Many other areas had their own divine trinities. In Greece they were Zeus, Poseidon and Adonis. The Phoenicians worshipped Ulomus, Ulosuros and Eliun. Rome worshipped Jupiter, Neptune and Pluto. In Germanic nations they were called Wodan, Thor and Fricco. Regarding the Celts, one source states, "The ancient heathen deities of the pagan Irish[,] Criosan, Biosena, and Seeva, or Sheeva, are doubtless the Creeshna [Krishna], Veeshnu [Vishnu], [or the all-inclusive] Brahma, and Seeva [Shiva], of the Hindoos" (Thomas Maurice, The History of Hindostan, Vol. 2, 1798, p. 171). www.ucg.org/bible-study-tools/booklets/is-god-a-trinity/how-ancient-trinitarian-gods-influenced-adoption-of-the-trinity
All these above mentioned trinities have their own little spin that make them different or unique. The Quran is lumping them all into one archetype.
The pagans at the time knew of all sorts of triune gods. In the book of acts Paul and Barnabas are worshiped as the gods of jupiter and mercury. The pagan Arabs also believed in Allah but also believed in other minor gods.
If the Quran singled out ONLY the Christian trinity it would leave open for some to suggest other type of trinities maybe correct or some other type of combination maybe be possible. The Quran closes the door to all partnerships with Allah.
As for Mary. Christians have invoked Mary in prayer, this is considers Shirk in Islam. Mary is still considered the Queen of all Saints by many Christians.
If that is the case why the Quran does not mention the holy spirit in that verse? And if it includes Mary, why other saints and angels are not mentioned in that verse? When you pray do you say "O prophet"? If I say "O Firas" To whom I'm speaking? To Firas or Allah?
@@gto2111 why should Quran mention what you want to mention? Quran doesnt care about which brand of Christianity you follow, whether trinitarian or unitarian or binarian or quadruplarian or calvinist or jehovas witnesses. It rejects catholics praying to Mary and the Protestants belief in trinity.
@@swalihmm your answer does not make sense. Just like your Quran does not make sense. Put down the camel urine son it seems it causes you brain damage. Lol
@@swalihmm Well the Quran should at least be coherent. You are even more incoherent than your Quran. You make muhammad sound intelligent lol. Why should the Quran bother to be coherent? Lol
@@swalihmm does it reject praying to saints, angels, and the holy spirit? It does not mention it in the verse correct? All you did is confirm what I said. In your mind, you think that's an answer.
jake's opening statement finished jw straight away lol
Great job respecting eachother. Reason can't save someone, only the God who has mercy and grants the gift of faith in His Word
The truth of the tawhid makes absolute sense, while the trinity does not. God gave us a brain for a reason. Man-made theology like the trinity, paganism and Hindu/ pagan mythology are antithesis to reality and God. The light of the One and Only God shine through all falsehood. Amen.
Absolutely fantastic answer from Jake @ 1:26:55 ! ! Brought the deluded baked bean right back down to earth!
james white is a convoluted Word Salad practitioner who bores his opposition senseless with platitude and uses their suffocation + sleep paralysis as a deluded sense of victory.
@@Veritas-dq2hs .. Agnostic
@@objectiveincision3970 Can you explain your reasons for being agnostic? Just asking sincerely and not looking for a heated debate.
@@hamzazulfi .. I don't have a good reason to be Agnostic tbh.. other than procrastination. I can assure you that Islam is way more coherent than the overall illogical nature of what james white laboriously and mind-numbingly waffles about (like that Pastor in the Simpsons) !
Allow me to let you into a little secret in their minds.. *it's not that they don't see The Truth in Islam* .. it's quite simply the *sacrifice + discipline that they're running from* - combined with *sunk cost* loyalty - by way of trying to intellectualise their reluctance with convoluted paradigms scraping empty barrels to help themselves sleep better at night.
I on the other hand will be honest and tell you that your religion *adds up* and *harmonises* life, nature + the universe better than anything else! .. it's just the discipline that's making me drag my feet.. but in my heart + mind I have no doubt!
@@objectiveincision3970 Fair Enough. I think I know that most people who have at least watched some debates and discussions with Muslims know that Islam has a very logical and coherent view that is almost impossible to deny in a valid fashion.
Maybe the problem with me is also procrastination. I believe in Islam but I am having trouble acting upon it.
However, I would encourage you to take Shahada and slowly work on yourself.
What were you before agnosticism?
Where are you from?
@@hamzazulfi .. Let's just say I'm from a Western upbringing whose explanations for life have more holes than a sponge!
I'd go as far as to say that a significant number of modern academics suffer a mental disorder to overuse language. Case in point james white. Rather than guiding those he claims he wants to guide, he instead blurts engagement hindering techniques by way of endless words, platitude, verbal smallprint, diversion and mini speeches that fail to make instant sense - something epidemic right across the whole psychopathic spectrum from academia through to media & especially politics. *Through the overuse of words, they make sure no one can get to the root of anything.* Their strategy is to confuse and bewilder the listener, whilst tied up in their own knots that reveal little to no substance when eventually untied!
The Quran beautifully strikes the balance between being clear to the lay man.. without suppressing the analytical logical scientific mind and its flourishing growth!!
بارك الله فيك
DR. James White failed to attack tawhid position, and defend trinity. He was appealing to revealing over philosophy (I guess the topic of the debate was comparing the ontologies). Great job Jake.
For the argument of asseity, his answer was that the being poseses asseity, but the thing is that actualisation of the being is within the persons. So it the attribute is possesed by the nature when it is actualised it is within ther persons, he reaaly bad known about theology.
i once had a debate with a TRINITARIAN CHRISTIAN in a WhatsApp group on the topic TAWHEED v TRINITY
he spent several hours, paragraphs, discussing the "DIVINITY of JESUS" and not even ONCE, not even a sentence or a word about "THE HOLY SPIRIT" 😄
and when it was time for a "CROSS EXAMINATION" he told me "HE HAD NO QUESTIONS OM TAWHEED"!😳
ALLAAHU AKBARR !!!!!
if you find out what tawhid means - you will have a heartattack xD
@@TheAbrahamMichaels
Do humor us...please pagan cross worshipper.
@@shiroboo525 Tawhid means Unity, not oneness. I know that worshipping a stone 5x a day will take too much of your time to look it up, but if you spend 4x to worship ur stone and miss the 5th to look up "Tawhid" - you will know that it means "Unity" and not "Oneness" xD
@@TheAbrahamMichaels Is that bowel opinions...
The whole idea about the Quran misunderstanding the trinity is so ridiculous. There were multiple theological ideas like the trinity, modalism, arianism, etc. Not everyone was an "orthodox" trinitarian Christian and if the Quran described every theology it disagreed with in detail would not be very concise or helpful for most people. Kudos to the speaker for hitting these points. I wanted to jump through the screen when Dr. White mentioned these arguments but I'm glad the speaker responded well, mashallah.
This is a good debate, it would be cool if you did one against frank turek
Mashallah good job bro
I’m very disappointed. Dr James White has had some tremendous presentations in the past. Unfortunately he resorted to many cheap missionary tactics and deceptive practices here.
Masha Allah brother Jake, True lion of Islam may Allah rewards you Janat Alfirdoos
Tawheed is so simple to understand, it isn't even debated at all. Trinity is full of contradictions and fallacies.
hopefully, WLC will come to this Patreon with brother TMM or with TAP
1:27:55 geez this final closing statement was 🔥🔥🔥
Great job, brother Jake! You really killed it. If Dr. James had any chance to defend his faith logically and philosophically, he wouldn’t have left that chance. But you left him and Christianity no room in the realm of logic and reason! Of course their next option is to seek a higher authority over logic and reason. You responded to that perfectly. But I still believe we can take that discussion one step further by debating them on the authority and the authenticity if the Bible.
I live in the Gambia. I followed Shabir Ally and he was very cleaver but this brother is a prodigy. May God increase you in knowledge
Without any regard for the outcome this debate was very classy and a good example of what interfaith dialogue should look like. I hope to see more such discussions so that people can develop a better understanding of each other and their beliefs.
Can you get WLC for a debate or discussion on your channel ?