Conflicting Opinions on Tainted Grail: Kings of Ruin
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- čas přidán 15. 07. 2024
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- TimeStamps -
00:00:00 Hello, hello
00:00:34 Introductions
00:01:50 Overview
00:03:54 West’s thoughts
00:07:18 Changes in this version
00:11:10 Kadeus’s thoughts
00:14:15 Jesse’s thoughts
00:16:25 Jesse’s reasons not to play
00:18:08 Kadeus’s reasons not to play
00:19:18 West’s reasons not to play
00:21:14 To summarize
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Tainted Grail: the Fall of Avalon is an unforgettable, solo or cooperative adventure experience for 1-4 players. Blending Arthurian legends and Celtic mythology with a unique vision, it allows you to impact the game world in deep and meaningful ways. A deep, branching storyline allows you to tackle problems in different ways, ensuring no two games play alike. Difficult decisions or harrowing choices wait behind every corner and seemingly minor tasks may reverberate with major long-term consequences.
In a land slowly sinking into the Wyrdness and torn apart by conflict; surviving each day is a challenge on its own. Starvation, sickness, violent weather, and random incidents all conspire to end your journey. Guardian Menhirs, that ensured safe travel throughout the realm, are slowly going dark turning simple logistics into an involving puzzle. To overcome these challenges, your character develops along several conflicting lines, such as Brutality / Empathy or Practicality / Spirituality. These traits unlock a rich choice of mutually exclusive skills and lead to different deck-building strategies, making character advancement meaningful and deep.
The character you develop is going to be tested during dozens of combat and non-combat encounters. Sometimes you will need to brute force your way, but often diplomacy might be a better option. Regardless whether you fight with your strength or your wits, our unique dice-less encounter system makes resolving each conflict fun and exciting, while keeping you immersed in the game.
In Avalon, there’s a legend waiting behind every stone and every tree. All locations have their own rich stories and secrets to discover. Places and characters are often much more than they seem. As you slowly put all the pieces of the larger puzzle together, the land will always have a surprise waiting for you just around the corner. Many secrets can be discovered only after several games. Created by one of the best polish fantasy authors, Krzysztof Piskorski, the story of Tainted Grail: the Fall of Avalon aims to push the boundaries of non-linear narrative, building upon the rich experience.
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Gameplays part 1 & 2 coming this week! A full 5 hours of story driven glory!!
Whoop whoop!
Too many good games are coming 🤣
We play using the app set up on our pc so rather than having to constantly pick up the books we just key in the passage and it's read aloud to us. It takes care of the narrative, secrets, dreams, nightmares, and menhir lighting. And it's free! Hopefully they make one for the new version.
Thanks for the preview. Really looking forward to this.
Quack
Thanks for the insight, especially with the upcoming launch of the campaign. I am in Jesse's shoes in that I have not yet finished the base game but have had a couple of extremely enjoyable attempts at getting into the game.
I’m excited to see the gameplay. The world building in tainted grail seems very interesting to me and am considering this one
Played through Fall of Avalon, Last Knight, Age of Legends and Red Death. Suffice to say I am looking forward to this with a slight amount of anticipation. All played at 2p and I really can't imagine playing it at higher player count.
Totally agree on max 2p. I even prefer 1p, 2 handed.
Ty for the video!
LOL, took me almost a year to finish the main campaign for Tainted Grail. I'm on the "Last Knight" campaign and am really looking forward to the 2.0 updates to cut the grind a bit.
Big fan of the storytelling, world building, and I definitely agree that it is absolutely best played solo. Can't wait for the new Kings of Ruin!
So much of that original story I didn't get to experience thanks to that branching questline. So many status' that left me wondering "when would that have happened!?"
I own full pledge od the original, played like 7/8 chapters of the first campaign. When they announced sequel I was like "Cool, intresting, but I didn't finish first one." And I from practical reasons I slightly shifted towards other, shorter games.
In 3 next updates I reevaluated my opinion and now I'm fully on hype train 😛
balanced review, thanks.
Thanks for the video. I am very much looking forward to this campaign.
One thing you didn't touch upon that I am curious about is the expansion content that might be available. How do you feel about the Red Death expansion that was available for the original campaign? Curious if it held up to the original game.
Quack! Looking forward to the gameplay!! I haven’t seen Devon in a while. Will he be visiting again soon?
In November. That hamster is hard to nail down. He is going to Essen next month.
The guidepost system to me looks better and I'm excited to try this, but I also don't know if it is totally for me.
That was a damn fine discussion on tainted grail, thanks. Went with the all in astronomical price option and have no idea how I'll wait 1 year+ for it to arrive.. Story of our lives...
Question, just on the topic of reading out the text, did you guys use app narration at all? or is there a bunch of text that isn't covered in the app narration? as a rough percentage, how much would you say is app narrated vs not (manually read), or is every bit of it narrated?
Thanks! :)
I am debating going all in now too. Gah! I have to back Twelve Sins of Herakles next month, I have all in Kingdoms Forlorn coming eoy as well as Aeon Trespass Cycles 4 and 5. So many games to come to my door and so little time. The FOMO is so dang strong.
I want Tainted Grail so bad but have decided to wait until I receive the 5 big Kickstarter games that I’ve been waiting forever to complete before I commit to another campaign. Hurts my heart. 😢
How does this compare to Oathsworn? I would consider Oathsworn to be the crown jewel of the genre. How is this version improving on the the rather large range of issues with Old Tainted Grail? Is the writing any better? Oathsworn in my view was better written and narrated. The narrative experience was overall much more captivating. TG is narratively not even in the same league.
I will see if I can get a question answered! A question from someone who loves games with incredible stories, extensive lore and where you spend several months invested in the game, like Tainted Grail! So, the question, right. While they're mechanically different, what would you prefer if you (Quackalope or anyone else up to answer the question) had to choose between Kings of Ruin or two additional kingdoms to Kingdoms Forlorn?
I'm unsure if I can justify getting both, but both hit that sweet spot of a darker fantasy world where the story, setting and lore are significant. I figured Quackalope have tried them both, and loves these stories, and might give a good idea of them :)
Anyway, thanks for the video! Looking forward to the gameplay videos :)
Kings of ruin is where you sound like you would be happiest. It fits what you want in a game. Deeper story more emmersion.
It's fun to say it i never have any issues with original TG. Grinding were non-existent one for me and my girlfriend. If you focus on exploring locations we were floating in resources in every chapter of base campaign. Played all 3 campaign, make amazing combos and so broken characters by end of each stories. Cannot wait for this one. By using synergies between cards, one focusing on combat other on diplomacy it was much easier to go through the story and challenges. This is only game in which if you don't use notes and create a minimal and locations specific statuses, etc it's almost impossible to remember all things which happen, where to go ,what i need, etc. This is one of best writings besides Sleeping Gods we have a chance to experience. But you need to invest your time and efforts into the world. It's not right in your face. So the game is not for everyone. Everytime I see glomhaven mention as narrative driven game. It's not. It's a scenerio base dungeon crawler. I prefer if people will compared it to Oathsworn and some other narrative games open world games like Sleeping Gods for example. I always have impression like people expect easy, very streamline game but get very different experience.
A question for the community. I missed the orginal FOA and am planning on just back that in the upcoming Gamefound launch. For those that played the orginal, is that the right play? I don't mind a slog or complicated mechanics. I really want to play the orginal, but want to make sure I am not missing something. Thanks for any input.
The new campaign takes the old concepts and brings them into a more accessible puzzle.
An Elden Ring boardgame is coming!
Do you have any more info about the update pack?
Late to the comments here, but I think between this release, making a 2.0 to the original FoA, and the 2.0 release of Etherfields, I hope that AR has realized the fiddly/grindiness was the biggest thing that needed work in their approach to games and we see cutbacks or better streamlining of gameplay. It's working great on Etherfields for me and I hope ISS had this taken into consideration. Hopefully I'll find out soon when it gets to North America backers!
They made good changes for sure.
The campaign has opened - and it includes a v2 update for the original Fall of Avalon game. Having struggled with certain aspects of the original it looks like v2 fixes some of them.
Exactly
I get rather fed up with 'soundbite' criticisms of games, that as West described, become accepted opinion for those who haven't played them. The frustration is that more nuanced insight can be drowned out by these soundbites (e.g. "it's grindy"). Nuanced insight is far more useful in deciding whether games are right or wrong for us.
I very much agree on the quality of writing - the benefit of getting an established professional author writing the story / dialogue.
The combat (in the original) didn't work for me, but probably works better for solo and 2 player games (I tend to play with 4 or more when I game), but I do think it's a good move for them to change the diplomacy to make it more distinctive.
Very fair. I think TG has a great deal of solo play going for it.
Are we going to see Evan on the channel eventually? I only saw him once on one of the livestreams
Haha, he is not as fond of the camera!
what I did not like about TG is that when you have story point 1.0 and can choose between 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, and 1.4 no matter what you do you always end at 1.5...So why give me a choice in the first place ? Than I can read a book...
This one gives you more of a if you have this, then you can go to the next part of the story.
KDM or TG:KoR?
I really do need to get around to playing the original. I only bought it in the last month, but it still sits there calling me to play.
Like a duck in the night
I saw more than one comment making caveats about the combat mechanic, and there was something similar said here on 18:20 or so.
What exactly makes the card mechanic be a bit of a polarizing concept? I got a bit concerned about backing the game after reading more than one comment on this.
The combat system is very unique. You have to match symbols on the cards to create combos. It's not easy for some people to grasp.
I want this so bad
Quack
Quack quack
Is this like a Jaws of the Lion to regular Gloomhaven? Or is this another full game of Tainted Grail?
This is a full immersion big and bold feeling game. It's not a smaller feeling game.
Quack?😱
First quack!
Too many bones over Tainted Grail? OMG, I found TMB very fiddly, unbalanced and swingy experience... and I loved Tainted Grail.. ;)
I think I like your the best at this length, it makes you younger than the completely bald head.
Tainted grail is too much game for me so had to comment something 😜🐦
Hahah thanks - I think xD
The exploration and story part of the original Tainted Grail was engaging and well done. But, the game systems behind everything else are really cludgy. There's a lack of polish and thoughtfulness is now things work together. The game also seems designed for solo play with rules for more players feeling tacked on. There's also a huge potential for large amounts of downtime for one player. Little tweaks to the system aren't going to fix it, because it needs a more significant overhaul to make the gameplay enjoyable.
We have a two player game play coming
I disliked 7th Continent, so I never got Tainted Grail as they seemed too similar. I have heard TG was a better, more streamlined game though.
These two games are quite different. For example I love card driven combat in Tainted Grail and I don't mind some gring.
Quack a mingo
I HATED TG so much, the grinding/survival aspect totally took me out of the game. These changes they are making for the new TG makes me definitely want to check it out
It's amuch less grinding game.
I am still dumbfounded that everyone likes the wriitng. I have not tried this, nor will I but Tainted grail the writing was not that good. Read more books. It had mistakes, inconsistancies, drudgery and was no where near as good as the praise. Sometimes I wonder if everyone got a different copy to mine.
Read more. Game one was just drudgery. I sold mine and will not continue. Am curious of this one on its own but praising it due to number one is a bit of a false praise. Glad to hear they made play experience better than the logistics of one.
Interested in what the story is was the only plus point here but I get better satisfaction with Sleeping Gods or even Gloomhaven than here. Yes I am negative but I was massively disappointed with the first tainted grail. True, some like it. It was definately not for me. I would NOT send people to this.
That’s ok - we clearly all like the writing and I think it’s fairly rude and dismissive to tell us to “read more”
Your prerogative - but not a convincing argument.
@@Quackalope sorry you do not like the critical analysis. That you enjoy the writing is your opinion. That it is high quality ia not. Many rating and other professionals reviewers refuse to jump on the hype train.
The first had errors. Some major such as the holy grail debacle at the end of the first chapter to the end of the second. Enjoy the game but as you said. Those who enjoyed the first eill like this, those that did not. This will do nothiing to change that.
I shall play other games. Good luck with this
@@paulwastney5134 so basically your opinion is wrong mine is right, with a drop of appeal to authority, some people really are hardheaded.
The writing is good. Maybe not award-winning, but certainly on the upper side. Your “read more” is bullshit gatekeeping; you are not the authority on whom we all depend. I enjoyed FoA, and I’m widely read. It’s some of the best world-creation I’ve seen in any game, in any format. If the game is too tough for you, move on, just don’t put the failures (and there are valid criticisms , just not this one) where they don’t belong.
Cringe