HW News - LTT vs. GN Warranty Beliefs, Intel A750 GPU Benchmarks, i9-13900 Delid
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- čas přidán 9. 06. 2024
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You can support us directly & get our warranty (which is RETROACTIVELY applied and covers some accidental user damage!) by buying one of our Large Volt Modmats: store.gamersnexus.net/product...
or you could also buy one of our Medium Modmats here: store.gamersnexus.net/product...
We offered a warranty since DAY ONE with our Modmats back in 2017, but now, we're making it even better. Read about OUR 7-YEAR WARRANTY here for Modmats: store.gamersnexus.net/modmat-...
Grab a GamersNexus Tear-Down Toolkit with 7-year warranty here! store.gamersnexus.net/product...
In this HW News, we're responding to LTT's warranty beliefs and to an invitation for 'friendly competition' by getting competitive with our own warranty and store policies. This is regarding the recent Linus Tech Tips Backpack warranty concerns. We'll also be talking about Intel's A750 benchmarks vs. the RTX 3060, AMD's X670E motherboards, the upcoming Ryzen 7000 CPUs, and rumors about the RTX 4080 and RTX 4070 apparently having lower power consumption needs than previously expected.
Like our content? Please consider becoming our Patron to support us: / gamersnexus
TIMESTAMPS
00:00 - News This Week
01:35 - Recapping the LTT Backpack Warranty Controversy
04:29 - CZcamsr Warranty Battle (& GN's Response)
11:46 - Intel A750 Benchmarks vs. RTX 3060
16:08 - X670E Motherboards Announced for AM5 AMD CPUs
21:53 - NVIDIA Missed Revenue Target & Blames Gaming
25:35 - Ryzen 7000 Specs & Price Rumors
28:20 - Rumor: RTX 4080 & RTX 4070 Power Draw
29:45 - Intel i9-13900 Delidded
31:01 - Threadripper Pro 5000 CPUs Now Available
32:52 - Huge, Unforgiveable Mistake
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Host, Writing, Editing: Steve Burke
Video Editing: Andrew Coleman
Writing: Jeremy Clayton
Video Editing Assistance: Mike Gaglione - Hry
We offered a warranty since DAY ONE with our Modmats back in 2017, but now, we're making it even better. Read about OUR 7-YEAR WARRANTY here for Modmats: store.gamersnexus.net/modmat-warranty
You can support us directly & get our warranty (which is RETROACTIVELY applied and covers some accidental user damage!) by buying one of our Large Volt Modmats: store.gamersnexus.net/products/modmat-volt-large (these are on back-order and will ship within the next 2 months - you'll want to get on this list to guarantee you get one!) or you could also buy one of our Medium Modmats here: store.gamersnexus.net/products/medium-modmat-gpu
Grab a GamersNexus Tear-Down Toolkit with 7-year warranty here! store.gamersnexus.net/products/gamersnexus-tear-down-toolkit
Watch our recent Newegg video here: czcams.com/video/iywx09SVETE/video.html
He's not the first
CPPC Tech was first
Steve find a solution of Europe shipping, glad to open a store just to sell your merch here...
Thanks this is great.
Are we supposed to be excited or give you plaudits bc you’ll send customers one screw and one rivet in case theirs breaks? Grandstanding at its finest. You’re better than this.
Linus 2022: “We have the potential to push each other to be better”
Linus 2023: “WTF bro?”
lol
Money twists people.
"the margin isn't all there to just keep it all , some of it is there to support people when they need it" ..... Thank you Steve!
Or you could just make the product cheaper and help everyone...
@@orcbloodtech422 Nah mate, cheaper is not always better. The price should reflect the value of the product. If you make it too cheap, you lose money and people who don't really value the product will buy it because they can and it becomes a waste. Its a waste because you can't offer a warranty and your reputation suffers. Its also an environmental waste. Take writeable CDs for example, they were initially expensive so people were careful what they chose to backup, then it became cheap and people just burnt anything and everything. I would guess more than half the data recorded on personal CDs are probably never looked at again and it just created a massive land fill of plastic CDs. Another example is the RC scene, hobbyists get really into it, so they're willing to pay the high cost. They're not rich but they afford it because they don't spend their entertainment cash elsewhere. I agree with this because the environmental impact would be high if every Joe Bloggs bought an RC just because they can. You can see this effect in the dumb RC toys for kids, they are cheap and crap and a blight on the environment.
Typical Sellout Linus
@@MrAkaacer lol if you think garbage is a problem, we have more than enough room to throw away garbage than ever this is merely an enviorentalist myth. Arguing that something shouldn't be cheap because we will use it more kek.
@@382u3uuej unironically arguing that more garbage isn't a problem, incredibly deranged
This was the warning Linus was asking for and he successfully ignored it.
jesus christ I found this randomly now and im like holy fucking shit!! :D
Almost exactly 1 year before :D
@@pratyushdesai3910 Yeah you believe this is random... when it is evidence of a pattern of behavior by Gamers Nexus, this is far from his only video that attempts to start drama and it isn't just with LTT it is with anybody that is bigger than him in the same space.
pole riding this hard lol @@thomgizziz
@@thomgizzizimagine pole riding a 100mil company. Linus isn't gonna be your friend lol
A $250 backpack should last minimum 5-10 years with regular every day use. That is a PREMIUM price. My $300 camera bag has 7 year warranties and it's one of the reasons I bought it.
I got a $20usd (probably knockoff) Superdry backpack, and that lasted me through high school and all but my last year of university.
Warranty contracts are precisely there to solve disagreements about the meaning of "trust me".
But I mean I understand Linus's viewpoint. Like he's being dumb for saying it because we'll he's saying the quiet part out loud, but yeah if he died or LMG was "closed" then they wouldn't have to honor any warranties because the entity doesn't exist anymore. I get his point but I think him saying it was kinda pointless because it just invites people to disagree simply to curry favor with their audience.
@@michaelf.2449 No that's just not a good point. I don't think Linus is dumb enough to set up the company that it would close automatically if he died. I could be wrong, but that would be pretty effing stupid! A warranty is a contract between the customer and the company, not between the customer and Linus. And the company should have procedures in place to honour warranties. I doubt in either case that Linus would have to deal with the warranties personally - again, that would be very stupid if that's the case. LMG is large enough that those kinds of things shouldn't get Linus' attention. He's running a business. People shouldn't have to have an opinion on whether he is a good guy or not to know whether or not the business would uphold the warranty.
@@cookiemonster208 the business will uphold the warranty, but if the business no longer exists then the warranty is meaningless. I guess I just understand what he means either you trust him to do the right thing or you don't, and no warranty is going to cover you if he doesn't want to do the right thing. He would've been better off saying his "warranty" is his word and that they stand behind their products instead of telling people the truth that if Linus doesn't want to cover it then realistically he won't have too.
@@michaelf.2449 No, the warranty is there SPECIFICALLY to cover you if he doesn't want to do the right thing. It holds him legally accountable for that very scenario. It's literally the entire point of having a warranty.
@@nicedreams7192 Yes I completely agree. Warranties are meant to protect the consumer from the company and provide a legal standing for the consumer to seek recourse, but how many times have you bought an item that had a warranty lifetime or not, and the company just not reply or make the process of claiming the warranty so confusing that noone can complete it? It's a common tactic and it works because realistically you have no recourse short of hiring an expensive lawyer and they know that.
Tdlr; warranties are all shit and you should only buy from companies who you trust will honor their products because your chances of forcing a company to do anything are nearly 0%
3:43 I mean I would send back a shirt with no holes in it. Kinda difficult to wear that way. Doesn't really function as advertised.
hahahaha, excellent point!
my man was ready for that joke
@@alreadyfuell he has been training for this moment his entire life.
Well there's your problem... Billet Labs did not get a proper warranty from LTT.
Underrated comment
"You're going to return our prototype, right?"
"Trust me bro"
It's funny, I am subscribed to Linus, but I never considered them your competition. To me, the vibes are so different that even while both channels talk about computers and technology in general, to me you two are in completely different spaces.
Same! (Well put, 100 % agree here)
@@EFXVoila Agreed
Well right after GN stated they were expanding and buying new equipment to be the first channel to have actual machinery to do product testing, Linus did exactly the same the following months with the LTT Lab "idea". That was a very low move in my opinion.
@@Herr.Mitternacht you think he just did it on a whim because Steve was doing it? Highly doubtful
@@chadhowell1328 Of course they did. They took GN's idea of expansion and created the lab to compete directly with Steve's content. Check the timelines and you'll see how Linus just stole the idea and run with it.
Steve,
I have been a Materials planner and estimator for 8 years. You nailed the warranty statement! Our company also warrants product the same way. We view products in 2 ways. The consumable part of the product vs the indirect material of the product. We don’t warrant the consumable part (The rubber mold in your case) because it is designed to absorb “X” force over time and is designed to breakdown intentionally (Like a Grinding wheel, designed to breakdown and quality is decided by the rate of consumption). We do warrant the indirect material (f.e. The metal retaining ring inside the grinding wheel, which is never designed to break)
This is a great comment and shares a ton of valuable insight to how you view it in the Materials industry! Thanks so much for posting.
Not to mention when something is being sold for such a high price in comparison to other high-end products.
Wear components are "software" lol
0n 6
@@fshn4x4 Softwear. 😂
I'm a lawyer and not wanting a "written" warranty but making warranty-type claims is unwise. You can end up in a lawsuit where the court/jury writes that warranty for you.
I think he's trying to avoid a formal warranty process given most of his customers are in the U.S. As you just noted, the U.S. is more corrupt than hell itself, so I understand his position.
If you're a lawyer, you'd know written things don't really mean a lot.
@@noxix7641 Wrong! Thanks for playing
One can hope! 🤞
@@Mavendow I know the republicants are making a mess of everything #locktrumpup. Thanks for agreeing.
Linus had 2 clear warnings to steer the boat, this and the screwdriver. He didn't listen and now he's paying the price. Now even his ex-employees are coming out.
Linus's shady-ness goes back further than a lot of people realized
No legitimate pc enthusiast has watched ltt vids for actual info since about 2018.
There’s no way this doesn’t come up in WAN show in a couple hours.
I can hear Linus nervous laughter right now
Might not, WAN show is imminent... Posted 30 mins before it is due to start... I say due but we all know they are slow to start
It’s probs gonna be in the wan show, they’ve done topics that weren’t on the pre prepared sheet before so yea
I’m sure they don’t have it in their doc, but chat, floatplane or twitch, is definitely going to bring it up and ask for an opinion. Friendly competition is fun.
Hot take Linus can't help it
Never forget: businesses will do the absolute minimum they are compelled to by standing law and consumer protections coming from said law, nothing more. Companies are not your friends, to quote Linus - and no, he does not get to be the exception from that.
No, companies will do whatever makes them money. If doing more than they're technically required to do, will give them customer loyalty and thus long term profits, they may do that. It all depends on *us* actually factoring in a company's behavior into our purchasing decisions.
@@seeibe that is no longer true in modern society
@@morzinbo a current example: for mostrode microphones you get a 10 year warranty. Sennheiser i.e. repairs all microphones built after WWII if at all possible. Things like that still exist. You of course pay a higher price for it, but in return get a product designed to last.
@@morzinbo depends on the product, market, reputation etc. For companies where their entire business depends on keeping the trust of the public/customers, it absolutely matters. If a reviewer were caught with their hand in the cookie jar doing deceptive practices, they'd get lit up so hard and nobody would care what they have to say anymore. Once trust is lost, you don't get it back easily, if ever.
They repeated that quote on their podcast/WAN show today and clarified that they are a company so yes it applies to themselves. But Linus basically said he was wrong for what he said and it was a communication issue not bad intent, so they're going to fix it in theory.
He also said they don't have an express warranty period for anything, but that the internal policy is "make the customer happy, make it right" however long ago they bought it. Dunno if that's true but don't have any evidence to say it's not either.
Back when I just got into PC building, I followed all the big names for all the info but years later, GN is one of the few sources left that I occasionally come back to since I'm satisfied with my PC right now but want to stay informed, and you guys offer the most complete reviews. Call me crazy but I'm kind of turned off by tech videos where the thumbnail is 90% an exaggerated reaction shot of the CZcamsr's face instead of the product they're reviewing
Yeah, LTT's clickbaity thumbnails and video titles and general sense of "this channel only exists to make the maximum amount of money" feeling are a complete turn-off for me. I check their channel sometimes, watch a few videos and get super frustrated with their low quality content. LTT is like tech videos for toddlers while GN is tech videos for grown-ups. I'm not expecting much from LTT's labs thing either even if their testing itself would be done properly. It's all the other stuff they do that keeps me away from them.
GN and Hardware Unboxed are the only two (English) channels I find informative and trustworthy.
Those thumbnails are so stupid. I hope this trend dies soon. It feels aimed at 12 year olds.
Those screen caps are THE WORST....its like its part of the "How to be a Super Cool CZcamsr, Bro" handbook which also states a minimum of 32 jump cuts per minutes, at least 1 zoom in and zoom out for no reason every 30 seconds, cut away to an image or clip of something unrelated to what you're talking about because its "hilarious" plus many more cool tips.
@@Kepe Yeah, was watching their new video about the creation of the new LTT screwdriver...$85 shipped to my area...where he mentioned at least 3x how expensive it was for them to create it as if he's trying to justify the expensive price.
@@MrAxelStone - Project Farm tested it. The only screwdriver that did better cost twice as much. It is a actually a very good product.
Looking back on this incident, there were so many red flags about Linus' beliefs and actions
Wow, Steve actually went for it. The absolute mad lad!
Steve is pretty impartial. I tend to support him more.
Envy is in the air 😂
Someone with a big enough megaphone had to.
True true true.
@@Marin3r101 its also just a difference between a slightly more technicaly consumer channel and a big entertainment/media consumer channel
Back when they announced the screwdriver on the LTT store I messaged their support asking about whether they had a lifetime warranty like iFixit. The reply (much like this case) was that they didn't provide a warranty but would "stand by the item 100%" and "assist however is necessary". Very weird and vague wording and a bit of a turn off for such an expensive product. Besides the fact that manufacturers should offer statutory warranties in a lot of countries, I don't see why a warranty policy is such a hard thing for them to lay out.
They'll figure it out.
@@JGnLAU8OAWF6 but they wouldnt without that push from everyone around.
@@JGnLAU8OAWF6 It should be figured out before they released a product. If this was MSI or Corsair saying “trust me bro”, Linus would have 10 dedicated videos on how that’s terrible.
@@cyjanek7818 exactly. For me the worst part was linus using his dead as an excuse.
@@starner00 Seems like they spent a LOT of money on the backpack and screwdriver, and don't want to provide returns ala Bethesda with the canvas F76 bag.
Coming here from the linus scandal of 2023, this video puts a lot of these past problems with LTT in a very different light.
5:11 “… push each other to be better”. Yes, about that Linus…
I've never ever heard of a company extending warranties retroactively. That is such a gentlemanly thing to do, massive props for that one!
I think first time I heard a company doing that was Arctic Cooling with their Liquid Freezer II AIOs, where warranty was 2 years at the launch but they retroactively extended it to 6 years in like couple months or so. As a someone who bought one of them when it was only 2 year warranty, I was very pleased with that decision to make it retroactive, and TBH would have felt little harsh not to be included as it was still so new product. But nevertheless very nice from GN to extend that warranty retroactively, especially when modmat is not a new product like Liquid Freezer II's were.
microsoft did for the xbox 360 but for very obvious reasons.
@@philhalo66 did or were force to do 😂
@@leevi6026 just wanted to say that yeah, I knew about one before - Arctic.
I've seen it happen on power supplies and I've seen it happen on all one coolers as they ended up being more reliable than expect it's also happened on some ssds that ended up being worse than expected so you might actually have to use it
The big problem with this "Warranty Feud" is, as I've said before, that this is all coming from Linus "companies aren't your friends and you should not buy products on the promise of features to be added at a later date" Sebastian asking for people to *just trust me to do the right thing bro*.
Don't get me wrongm I enjoy the channel. I appreciate much of what he with LTT has done for the tech space. But as for this issue, and much like his other myriad hot takes, he's just wrong.
If you advocate for the right thing to be done for consumers at all times, you don't get to be the exception
Well said man! I 100% agree!
One of the things wrong :
A fucking backpack at 250.
A hoodie for 100
A pillow for 90
They're crazy. Extremely dumb and crazy.
It's not a "premium" product, it's a scam.
I love the channel, but my fucking god they don't see the problem with their shitty merch
this. linus shows quite often he thinks he is above everyone else
Linus is kind of out of touch now with a large part of his original audience. He is a rich man, pretending to care about value and what average consumers spend money on. He is not an average consumer. CZcams pushes his videos now so it probably doesn't matter to him. Things change I guess. Just move on if you don't like the content anymore just don't watch it.
@@jonathanellis6097 absolutely disagree. People like you think they're the majority but you're just the squeaky minority.
This was the precursor to todays video.
Hasn't this one aged like fine wine given the most recent controversies at Linus Media Group.
Before my next build I will be getting a ModMat. You guys are great!!!
Thank you!
Hi GN
Highly recommend the Mod Mat.
I got the Mini for my Service & TestBench, it is AWESOME!
Highly recommend it. I was really impressed for everything that came with it, the versatility, the quality of product. I always go into purchases with a very low bar however I was exceptionally blown away by my modmat purchase. Truly a good product that I've used a ton since I got it.
"You can sell products without warranty" In my country it's actually often required by law to provide a warranty, and I think that's a good thing..
Some just don't need it. Like washing machine detergent, for example. Or products where the return window covers them. If you buy bread and it's moldy, that's covered by the return window. No separate warranty needed.
@@eye776 Agreed, LTT is a sizable brand, selling to primarily their own audience and fans.. why would you not want to offer coverage if you're selling a quality product that you stand by? I'm sure they wouldn't intentionally push a bad product but failing to stand by a normal use case warranty.. ehhh. Red flag.
@@GamersNexus Well Tide offers the standard consumable "refund for return of UPC or remaining product". Repeat abuse just leads to denial/blacklisting but.. even that exists
@@eye776 EU has a legsl statuatory guarantee. It is not the same as a warranty. You can get into actual trouble for messing that terminology up.
@@jonatanrullman Yes, you are correct. EU has a 14-day withdrawal period for online shops and a 2-year legal guarantee that applies for both online and in-store sales.
Fortunately, warranty in the EU is not a matter of opinion but strict regulation.
One of the very few things they do right.
@@MrR-Mi guess getting taxed sucks. Free education, free medical healthcare, human rights, warranty laws, consumer protection,...what does the EU do wrong - besides Frau von der ähm Leyen?
@@MrR-M It's nothing they came up with or someting. Wast majority of these European countries had these laws way before they even entered the EU So the EU's only job was to make the law unform everywhere.
Unfortunately for EU residents who bought the backpack, LMG is a Canadian company without any international branch/partner/reseller that would fall under EU regulation, so doubt any complaints will go far.
@@MrR-Mwell we do no force citizen to pay stupid taxes ..or have divorce only benefit the wife...or paying thousands of dollars for kids education just to have the kid not being able to name 3 country....and much lower crime rate...and not having to deal with road rage at every corner( been in USA/uk for a grand total of 3 years)every single day
But yeah we do things right in EU ( uk is not EU thankfully)
This motherboard news is one of the funniest things I've heard lately. You even manage to make motherboards interesting
Bet! I was hurting… Steve was on a roll so hard he shut himself down
Extremely
Just when you thought Steve raised the bar enough. He says, “Here, hold this mod mat for 7 years.”
Next thing you know it will be 14 year warranty
im not sure I could hold it for 7 minutes... 🤣
I can't even reach the mod mat he is holding it so high.
i mean it's only a mod mat. there's nearly no failure point.. that's super easy to warranty, barely an inconvenience. It's curious to see GN stance when they will make a product that suffer way more from use.
@@ethan-fel im gonna need you to get WAAAAYYYYY off my back about this... 🤣
On a backpack that is $250 USD, it should come with a warranty, I have a SOC backpack that was half the price and it has been great with a warranty. Especially since LTT is bragging about durability.
Linus is nothing but a reseller. You can find 95 percent of anything he sells elsewhere minus logos etc.... For 1/4 to half the price.
Sheep buy it up. I sit back and laugh knowing my money is invested properly and not in someone's else's pocket making them dividends.
GN is actually an exception for me. Because they care and you can tell. Linus would be a nobody if he was to start fresh today and try to build a successful business. NCIX was the coat tails he rode to success, mainly because they sucked so bad 🤣.
Hell, I bought an Osprey backback for $130 and it has a lifetime warranty.
@@Voyajer. what is the warranty though does it cover if it happens to tear what happens if you stab it what happens if it just discolors because you left it out in the sun for 18 weeks all depends on what the warranty actually is if the warranty is worth anything also it matters if the company actually holds to the warranty contact them send it in they take care of it few and far between where that happens
I am a teacher, so money can be tight. I bought a backpack from a particular big-retailer (the one that started as a dime-store) for $35. It has a lifetime warranty. They tend to last me about 3 years before I have to get a replacement, are waterproof, have a cushioned area for laptops, and look pretty darned good. I simply cannot fathom not offering a warranty on a backpack that costs nearly 10 times as much.
@@profosist That is true of all warranties. What warranties do is provide a legal framework that proves a company will back its products. In the business world (the whole world really) verbal promises mean nothing.
LTT has become more of a merch channel than a tech channel 🤣
Like half their videos is shilling their products and sponsors imagine the money Linus is swimming in
Every Two minute of long video there is an LTT merch ad...
They care about money and is "fine"
Yes, I'm also here after the "VIDEO" about Ltt.
We can't say that Linus didn't get the message a year ago. He just decided to ignore it and play stupid until it was too late.
This whole thing is so stupid, because if linus actually means "we'll take care of you, we're on your side", there is literally a formal procedure intended to ensure that exact thing, it is called a warranty, just use the word
I think linus is only specifically talking about trusting him in regards to a lifetime warranty. But in that case if he believes in his products he should give at least a 5 year warranty.
the worst part is that LMG really does stand behind their product....so it really doesnt make sense.
@@theglowcloud2215 Agreed
The seemingly hardline refusal to use the term almost feels like it's trying to be purposely opaque to avoid potential legal consequences of not supporting customers.
Also the entire part where his family gets in trouble over potential warranties in the future etc makes very little sense. In what world would family members even be held accountable? Unless it's explicitly written into the founding of the company and signed by them, it should be illegal to hold them accountable. Heck, in any healthy business, you are not personally accountable for it unless it's a self-owned firm where you deliberately position yourself as accountable if you don't have enough base capital to let the company exist on its own merits. And with LMG I highly doubt base capital is the problem.
With every statement Linus put out, it just seems weirder and weirder. As in, I am starting to truly question how the LMG company as a whole is being owned and managed. If a multi million revenue company can't afford to have written warranties, then something seriously fishy could be lurking in the finer details.
The best thing about "friendly competition" is that there's so much going on in the space that one outlet can't even cover it all - with more people doing in depth analysis, it means we can get more details from more products quickly, and for major products with a lot of attention it means that a second opinion is always checking your work and adding to the data. There's literally no lose here.
Some people might argue "hey if you've watched an LTT labs video on (x) why would you watch the GN video on it too?" but when I'm thinking of buying something, I tend to shop around for reviews and analysis, so if I'm interested I'm gonna just watch both videos.
-----
LTT have a lot of catching up to do though, for analytical content. The last major video I watched of theirs for researching a product I was actually interested in was a long video comparing 50 sets of earbuds to find "the best ones" They tossed out several very well regarded sets for "bad packaging" without testing anything, then recommended Raycons (which are very average earphones at 10x the cost they need to be) - I love the content from an entertainment standpoint, and I'm hoping LTT Labs will step up to the plate for serious analysis.
LTT has fallen over the years in terms of analytical content, instead opting for crummy youtube titles to get clicks, focusing on the almost pointless 4k and even 8k and networking setups, or talking about companies doing this or that.
I miss the days before Linus setup his own company, because he originally used to go over tech like anti aliasing and explaining the different types, which ones are good for IQ, which ones are good for performance, etc. Now all he does these days is just do what he wants, not what the viewers want, and I want him to do what GN is doing and what I watch GN for, which is for in depth analytics.
I do hope they are successful, more info for us is always better. But I 100% agree with you about LTT, they are often adding in usless data like packaging to the final result. I think that this will be their biggest hurdle. Their "hard data" videos are washed out by focusing on infotainment and also having slight subjectivity towards certain things. GN is much more focused. Heres the data - take it as you may, heres chart after chart - not Steve juggling a CPU while making faces at the camera and then seeing if it still boots after while getting a similar bench score.
There's also the LTT video where they 'tested' to see if bad cable management effects thermal preformance with one set of hardware, one case, one fan layout, and some random stuff they stuck inside the case.
I personalty would take any analytical content from LTT with several tons of salt until they have a consistent track record of objective reviews and not the subjective bs that says very little if anything about the product or test they've put out somewhat recently.
LTT has been, and likely will remain, far more on the 'entertainment' side of the entertainment-education/information spectrum. But that is what is required if you want to keep that many people employed. So they may have some great analysis but who knows if they continue it when the videos do much worse than their norm.
LTT is horribly biased and constantly shilling products. They're like the fox news or Alex Jones of tech news.
Watching this now gives so much important context to the recent 'Problem With LMG' video.
You can see how friendly and encouraging Steve is being, and you can tell he never dreamed that Linus would respond to criticism like the faceless corporations that both he and Steve criticize on a daily basis.
And yet once it became clear that Linus would consistently shirk responsibility and shift the blame, how else could Steve possibly be expected to respond if not the same blunt and direct way that he deals with any other corporation, (like Alienware etc.) ??
"The margin isn't all there, to just keep it all, some of it's there to support people " This is why I love this channel and it's commitment to quality content and products.
gamers nexus didnt invent warranty
@@TheTastefulThickness What does that have to do with my comment? I didn't mention warranties at all.
@@Tsinij now im explaining your own comment and what "support people" means. Ok then
@@TheTastefulThickness It's quoted from the video you didn't watch. Steve was talking about outreach to people in need. You have confused yourself.
"the margin is there to support people when they need it."
Spoken like no company, ever. Thanks for actually having ethics in a world of "shut up, I already have your money".
ethics is following the law or a code of conduct. this is 100% a bedrock of solid moral foundations.
"Spoken like no company, ever" - False
It's literally how every warranty works.
Lots of companies have this view. The margin isn't just a profit to the owners. It's the uncharged support calls, the warranties, the unexpected returns, the travel, research, ... for next generation product, the cost of the experiment products that ended up being failures, the trade fairs, advertizing, ...
Just that most people only look at production cost in relation to sell price and forgets that in some cases, the production costs will be less (or even way less) than half of the company's total costs for the product.
One problem with margins is that it's hard to figure out how big they need to be to give a decent profit - when a product is new, it's very hard to predict what the full support costs will be for that product. Not so much an issue if it's one of 1000 products. But for a company that only sell one product or maybe 5 products, it's easy to fail badly with the guestimates. So it can be better to set a bit too large margins than too small - a customer isn't helped by a company going bankrupt. Then they get zero support and warranty. And too low price sets customer expectations, making it hard to increase the price if the costs ended up higher than intended.
But lots of companies are not trying to maximize margins to maximize their profit. Not making the profit too high can allow a faster growth by being competitive.
So lots and lots of small comoanies has this kind of ethics. The problem happens when companies gets large enough to end up on the stock market. Then the board and the stock owners starts to see it as a money making machine and focuses more on this years bonus than the 10-year growth. A family company really cares a lot about the 10 year growth. And cares very much about reputation and happy customers.
Just that it's the big companies that are most visible and colours our view about company ethics.
@@TheGoncas2 yes, you're right. And warranties are directly calculated into the BOM right next to marketing and profits. This is exactly how ever singly company working under normal law operates.
every company does that exact thing, it's the standard formula when pricing your products.
Aged like fine wine
Intresting CZcams RECOMMENDATION VIDEO from 1 year ago :D
The LTT backpack is $250. It better have a warranty for that price. But when it comes to cheap things like a shirt or a mug I don't care about a warranty on that.
if the stiches break from normal use you are still covered... if you make a huge gash in it... well treat your stuff properly and no you won't be covered.
I know. His prices are insane and he comes with this bs to explain why he wont give warranty.
Like 250 bucks for a backpack, 50+ for a very basic screwdriver. He is really exploiting that parasocial relation for all its worth
@@MariaCorrea-mr2gy and you just show you have no clue what it costs to make such things from scratch and have it produced in smaller batches, it's not like huge companies that order a million+ of each
@@LiLBitsDK That does not change the fact that the pack is expensive, if you are confident in your product then even a 3 year warranty is fine. No warranty at all is a piss take.
Or just buy 5 good backpacks instead and have a lifetime of replacements.
I hope the fans done make this “feud” bigger than it is. Both companies are pretty civil. The fans should not be hostile.
Goodluck. Fanboys only have 1 braincells to work with, and that's all of them combined. The last disagreement both side made it more than what it was and had to be addressed accordingly to settle their stupidity.
It's just two companies pushing each other to be better!
There are Linus haters everywhere that's never gonna happen
The only way to not become hostile is not to be a fan, fan means fanatic, and that is exactly how they act.
Objectivity is impossible for most people, and most fanatics believe they are an important part of what they are a fan of when really as an individual they do not matter at all.
I don't hate Linus, I just dislike Canada.
This is actually kind of funny watching this now.
This gotta be a lesson that when someone goes full corpo, they go full corpo. Linus is no different than the companies he criticizes at this point
GN's straight forward transparent approach to everything, even when difficult for them from a sponsorship perspective, is why they are the only CZcams merch brand I have ever bought. It's refreshing these days to see a group dedicated to excellence and integrity, and I am happy to support that.
I love LTT. I thought that LTT bag was the best bag I have ever seen. I just don't agree with the warranty. I definitely will hold off on the bag for now until I see any improved update. I will gladly buy a GN bag if they come out with one though! I bought the mouse mat and it's the best mouse mat I've gotten. Amazing. It really is refreshing to see a company this dedicated to excellence and integrity. SUPER refreshing. Might get myself a mod mat now...
so true!
What kills me about this whole warranty thing, is how Linus used to always state, that the way you could tell the quality of a power supply was the length and coverage of their warranty. But now because the warranty is an inconvenience to him, it's nothing but rhetoric and doesn't mean squat. This is why no matter how much of a fanboy you are for LTT, don't take his word for it that he'll cover your issues. If he really stood by his products he would back them with a warranty.
That's the difference between Linus before the money and after.
Nothing he says is worth anything. Every syllable that he says is paid for by some company.
I agree, I had to disconnect from the whole lot
Linus is out of touch. He’s a wealthy man now. I started falling off of his brand when he started reviewing teslas, boats and house renovations.
@@ottersRneat The one segment when he stated that $250 is not a lot of money is when he started losing me. When told that someone who earns $1,000 and loses 250 that's a big blow, his reply was "it's not that big of a deal" and that it's not a lot of money for him.
He literally started his whole company from a house, how can he not remember where he came from?
@@ottersRneat The biggest thing to me was when you had to buy merch to leave a message.
What if you already have everything you want/don’t like any merch. His “you should get something” approach is weirdly wasteful to say the least
When your testing overlaps with LTT's testing, we the viewers should contrast and compare. If your results aren't within a reasonable margin of error one of two things happened: one of you messed up something in testing, or the product tested is actually different. Both are important discoveries that should lead to us asking further questions.
Or one of them is shilling.
@@ShortArmOfGod Which leads into one of them being wrong, it just changes it from being accidental to intentional.
@@ShortArmOfGod I would say that would fall under the “messed up something in testing” category myself.
@@ShortArmOfGod - And we all know who that would be....don't we.
@@buggerlugz6753 Omg stop you might hurt his feelings! 🤭😂
In the end we could not trust Linus to do the right thing.
Love GN and LTT both. Friendly competition never hurts, just makes a better product for us.
"Just makes a better product for us" --100%
If it was fair competition, then yes. One group reports the truth, the other shows ads as if they're reviews.
@@kaydog890 ouf
Nah, LTT got too much in political stuff for me, mainly bashing Trump, I get it you don't like the guy now shut-up about it and tell me about tech!! GN on the other hand does a great job at sticking to tech even when politics are actually involved. That's why I'm still subbed here but not there.
@@kaydog890 so true
PS.: Also hipocritical, I remember Linus specifically stating clear lines between review, ad and showcase before he got big, now it's a non-issue anymore to blurr the lines.
LTT: "Major manufactures should have warranties on their products and should respect that contract"
Everyone else: "So are you guys gonna warranty any of your overpriced merch"
LTT: "No"
Fuck that
Literally on wan show they said the backpack margins really aren't the greatest
@@rpmm24 And? Why does that stop them from supporting a product they are making and selling? Trying to cite price as why you don't want to support it long term makes it seem like you're using known poor manufacturers and don't feel like dealing with that
The big problem, as I've said before, is that this is all coming from Linus "companies aren't your friends and you should not buy products on the promise of features to be added at a later date" Sebastian asking for people to *just trust me to do the right thing bro*.
Don't get me wrongm I enjoy the channel. I appreciate much of what he with LTT has done for the tech space. But as for this issue, and much like his other myriad hot takes, he's just wrong.
If you advocate for the right thing to be done for consumers at all times, you don't get to be the exception
@@rpmm24 Then don’t make one? A product without a warranty is a worthless product in my opinion (unless it’s a known “throwaway” product like sleeves for Magic the Gathering cards or some shit that you replace in a few months anyway).
I love the level of transparency you have with everyone Steve. Big businesses could learn a lot from you.
Don’t think so, Steve is just a witch-hunt snob that preys even on his friends did it with Austin Evans and now with LTT. Two weeks have passed LTT has a lifetime warranty now that surpasses the 7year GN has and he hasn’t said a thing at least he should have contacted Linus before lashing out like this even if you don’t consider him a friend maybe as a professional courtesy. Transparency is way more than saying bad stuff someone else did transparency is saying both the good and the bad and recognizing when someone ammends their mistakes transparency is more than a headline.
Macroeconomic headwinds is code for: 'We've bent over the gaming sector repeatedly for at least a decade and now customers are finally saying enough is enough'.
Nah its code for Macroeconomic head winds.
No surprise the price of GFX cards falling can be exactly tied to the moment the Fed started to raise interest rates. Stick to the conspiracy bs tho.
@Chris-xl6pd so wait, you think they lowered the price when interest went up?
LTT: " "we'll stand by the item 100%" and "assist however is necessary." If you actually stood by the item 100% then you'd just offer an actual warranty.
There always was an internal warranty, just no external written warranty. Linus admitted it was a mistake not have a written one and in the process of creating one for the store.
Check out today's WAN show. Linus explains what happened on his end, his intent and also commits to an actual Written warranty which apparently is well underway.
@@TheBaldr An "internal" warranty is useless to consumers should they need to seek legal avenues to deal with a company. A warranty is a layer of protection that only exists if it is explicitly provided.
Linus needs to think before he talks.
@@krae6695 Not actually true. Have you actually ever read the fine print on a warranty? ALL of them are written in such a way that they're basically always at the discretion of the manufacturer. If they decide that they don't want to honor the warranty for any reason, the language in the warranty will always back them up on that and protect them.
It's the simple fact that having a warranty in writing makes a certain level of commitment and obligation to the whole thing. Even Ebay has something in writing that covers a buyer if a random seller "does not offer returns", and these are primarily used items. Or take Framework laptops as an example, a company that Linus himself financially backed. I'm pretty certain that a consumer isn't going to drop a big chunk of their hard earned cash on a laptop based on the fact that Linus has been around for a while, is trustworthy, and if something goes wrong, they have Linus' word that they'll "take care of it". If anything, a written warranty creates more sales, because it shows that the seller has confidence in their product and are willing to commit to backing that product up.
Framework laptops, not Mainframe.
Also, having a warranty means that you would have implemented processes in your company to fulfil such warranties - instead of people making arbitrary decisions as to whether or not to honor the warranty.
@@cookiemonster208 Or mechanisms to deny them. Warranties are, for most consumers, just a marketing strategy. They give a false sense of security to the consumer, that's it.
"I'm pretty certain that a consumer isn't going to drop a big chunk of their hard earned cash on a laptop based on the fact that Linus has been around for a while, is trustworthy, and if something goes wrong, they have Linus' word that they'll "take care of it"." You have more faith in people than I do. I'm certain people would do this and wouldn't think twice should they lose their money.
@Elijah Your comment is so incredibly ignorant..
How can you not love Steve and the GN crew? Constantly push others to do better for the industry. Newegg and LTT to name a few. So proud of this channel.
Easy:
- Steve immaturely bashes RGB at every opportunity and still likes to claim RGB is malware which is wrong
- Steve has an extremely monotonous voice
- grading "humor" (constant Nvidia Ti jokes, constant Gigabyte bashing, Intel "back to you steve" etc) it's not funny after the 3rd video
People who adore Gamers Nexus are pretty much Redditors which is why Steve addresses the Reddit users directly in social media.
Give me the negatives for Linus.
Foreshadowing here that GN absolutely shat on LMG 367 days later lol.
Re: warranty, I agree fully. Warranties do have value in a very real and legal sense, and also by claiming "we'll take care of any issues" without a clear written warranty (in place at the time of purchase!) Linus is opening himself to unlimited warranty claims. It is absolutely reasonable for people to want to know where they stand before dropping CAD $250 on a frikkin' backpack!
It's $250 USD. That's about $315 CAD.
@@joshjlmgproductions3313 Ooof, yeah for that kind of layout for a backpack, I'm going to need a bit more than a vague assurance by Linus that warranties are meaningless and the "we got ya bro"...
You don't need a lawyer for small court claims, or to file reports at the better business bureau, but you do need to not be gladly bending over for the company.
@@PhantomPhoton If a company doesn't want to honor the warranty, they won't, no matter what was written. It really makes no difference what is written, only how they act in face of actual issues and support requests.
@@nevcairiel - As Steve noted, you have a lot more avenues for getting satisfaction in the face of a bad product experience if there is a warranty than if there is not. Of course, as the price of the item goes up, the value of the warranty does too. For example, warranties on vehicles and cameras tend to be honoured because these items have sufficient value that people will pursue a legal or regulatory remedy. Warranties for inexpensive items may have less value because shady companies know someone isn't likely to pursue a remedy for something of low value.
Even when not pursuing a legal or regulatory remedy, negotiating with a company for what you would consider a reasonable resolution of your issue is much easier if the duties and obligations of both parties (the seller and the buyer) are explicitly spelled out. Steve pointed this out as well.
As always, you should consider the source of a warranty. A warranty from the Hudson's Bay Company (which has been in continuous operation for 352 years) is likely worth more than a warranty from a fly-by-night manufacturer selling things on Wish. However, if you buy something from HBC without a warranty, then you are at the mercy of the good will of the store and consumer protections laws if something goes wrong, whereas you have a legal representation from HBC if you have a warranty.
I love Linus, he lives a 45 minute drive away from me and is a local success story. But he has an ingrained "laws and lawyers are bad" streak in him that does him and his fans a disservice.
A USD $250 backpack is something I would not like to purchase without a warranty. My luggage from VIA Rail came with a warranty, why doesn't this?
Imagine positioning yourself as a right-for-repair advocate, but not even providing a warranty for your own goods.
@Deadpoppin You're right. You're expecting your customers to need repair things more often when you don't believe the product is worth providing a basic warranty for.
@@barnett25 But warrenties only exsit becuase of the other guy not having one or Goverment action... Like in the US alot of things sold has a one year warrenty as federal manddate... Some states have lemon laws for defective new cars all of these are to protect the consumer from scams and just bad products.
Hes so proud about the features of this backpack, and for a tech channel, having all of the features listed accurately is typically... VERY IMPORTANT. If replacement or repair services are a MARKETED FEATURE, I, as the informed consumer, want to know what the FEATURES of that coverage entails. Its not about promises, its about a clear cut line between me and you about what solutions are available and when they'll be applied.
Declaring vague lofty-sounding bullshit with nothing actually backing it up is a Vancouverite staple. You live here long enough you become accustomed to it.
Oh boy. The signs about LTT's interesting (self serving) business practices have been there for awhile, huh? 🤣
Yeah, the mental gymnastics you need to make to come up with, "i didnt want to give warranty because in case i died i dont want my family to have to deal with warranties" is some 5yo levels of rationale.
In Norway the consumer law essentially gives us a 5 year warranty on purchased products. Seems to work well, although some vendors occasionally try to bullshit their way out of it.
5 years??!! No way you can successfully claim 5 years on everything. If this is true, then Linus was right by saying warranties are complete bs if the company refuses them.
To clarify, it depends on the product. The normal legal guarantee is two years. Examples given are shoes and childrens toys.
Products and parts expected to last much longer (like smartphones and furniture) come with five years. I think the tricky thing can be proving which category a product like a backpack falls under.
@@Kennykazey It's also up to interpretation and reasoning, not just the type of product. Hence, variables such as price is an indicator of the quality of the product and consequently, lifespan.
For example; if you buy a backpack priced at $250, it's reasonable to expect that it should last longer than a $25 backpack. 2 years is the baseline minimum.
@@impoppy9145 It is true, if the product is "expected to last over 2 years", which a backpack is, it is not up to the company, it is the law, hey can't choose to not honor it without trouble.
@@MajkiBoyVids Come on be realistic, we aren't born yesterday. How would the consumer be able to prove anything? You have to send the stuff back to the company. Humans can just lie, you know. You didn't know that?
Linus would be the first one to complain about another tech company making these statements about having no warranty.
Whinus does have a tendency to do just that...
@@vailpcs4040 He's been getting worse. His views used to align with a wider audience in my opinion, but I think he's become more egotistical
Thanks to GN you made Newegg take back those awful Gigabyte PSUs which I was forced to buy as part of bundle. Guess what I did with that money? Yep I bought a ton of tacos, jk I bought a mod mat. Really like it. Keep holding companies accountable.
This aged like fine wine
No warranty = no purchasing
I'd rather take a limited warranty at best.
@@barnett25 Nah, that's bullshit. At the end of the day, the day ends, and that's it. Warranties follow the law. You can try to eliminate some liability for missuse, but if the product does not comply with manufacturing standards, or is in other way not what the company advertised, that's where warranties protect the consumer.
Your "trusting the company" argument is laughable. People believed CDPR, as they produced quality product before, and held them to high regard. Do you want to discuss their lass product? A company is a company. They are not your friends. It's somewhere you buy product from. If they try to weasel around policies set to protect consumers (like warranties are) that's a red flag, and it's on you if you want to continue the "trust system". It's your money.
@@barnett25 My PSU's are under a 10 year brand warranty. I've RMA'd one after 7 year use and got an equivalent PSU as a replacement unit. The only gripe I had with the issue is that it took almost a month to be resolved, as it's the maximum legal time companies have to resolve an issue.
Doesnt matter if it's "crazy to you". It's not blind trust. It's a legal binding document. But I understand. People misstrust what they fail to comprehend.
Gotta love Steve here singlehandedly delaying the Wan-show by posting a video calling linus out minutes before it normally starts lmao
They're supposed to be friends though, Linus has brought a lot of viewers to Steve's channel and vice versa. I agree with what he's saying, it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
@@brendakowen7481 yeah I agree with what you say and whilst a big fan of linus I've gotta say he handled this warranty stuff really badly for the first week
Watching Steve have a mental breakdown over the mobo names makes me feel justified in my similar opinions
I feel like that was a fair response to the LTT warranty thing. I'm also glad that they ended up listening and are getting things formalized on that front. This is what happens when you have reasonable discourse and provide constructive criticisms in an informed way.
Well, no. Linus is still being ridiculously hostile on Twitter and his weekly podcast about this- He's clearly still absolutely irate about it, which is basically his M.O. This was LTT's legal counsel either inward or outward going "You need to knock this off before someone ends up in litigation." - He's being forced into this despite fighting it. Being blunt, Linus is a borderline hardcore libertarian, he would not offer a warranty like this unless it's "You do this or the product does not ship."
@@ParadoxicalThird he’s not irate about the warranty, he’s irate about the response from people who were never going to be a customer anyways. The warranty meant nothing to a majority of people buying because they knew they would be taken care of it needed. The ones who threw a shit fit were trolls with no intention of buying a thing in the first place. He was attacked personally and most wouldn’t be happy about that including yourself.
@@chadhowell1328 that is the correct take. Many others just don't seem to get it.
@@chadhowell1328 He is irate because he is a man child and relies on click baits. He should grow up and realize it's the internet. And for the longest time he still doesn't act professionally while taking credit for his crews work. It obvious that he has a lack of professionalism in this industry.
@@AFlyingCookieLOL reading your other replies it’s clear you’re a hater making no real points but rather just hateful opinions. Good luck with that
If it was a cheap backpack, it would be different. And your take on this and your history...just made me buy a mat from you. Well played
Yeah $250 bucks for a backpack is insane. Especially without warranty.
My RX 480 was $200 and comes with 3 year warranty ffs.
@@titan_fx Update on the backpack, during the WAN show Linus did say that all backpacks will come with a limited lifetime warranty. Sure that Gamers Nexus will update people on this next HW News update
Linus is a scumbag, people who know know. This isn't the first dirty thing he's done.
@@titan_fx He never said no warranty. He said no *lifetime* warranty. It's clear in the tweets as well.
@@emenesu
Maybe on the wan show he only talked about lifetime, but on Twitter he literally said:
My point is that lifetime warranty or any warranty period means nothing.
"Begun, the Techtuber Warranty Wars have..."
In all seriousness, thank you for taking so much time to provide a thoughtful, respectful discussion of your warranty practices and warranty philosophy and your thoughts on LTT Store's approach.
Your position on customer service makes me wish I could purchase things from y'all more often--looking forward to when you start competing directly with Newegg. ;)
I have wanted one of your toolkits and mod mats for so long! Once I have some larger accommodations, I will be sure to buy one. You all really deserve the support for all that you do in the consumer and tech space.
I actually ordered one even though I live in a tiny appartment in the Netherlands. It really love the mat just as a giant 'mouse mat', it's a very nice material. Really just a cool product.
I was thinking to buy one of their mouse pads because it would be cool to have something in my PC setup from a channel I really like and supporting them through this as well, but when I checked one or two days ago it would cost me 47€ with shipping, which seems quite much for a mouse pad, on the fence now if I should buy it. But well, merch is always more expensive than normal products and somewhat unique as well..
Would be great if the shipping would be cheaper and/or the mouse pad $5 less, though, but I guess that's just the problem living in Germany and buying something from the distant US.
Hi Steve! This stance on warranties is extremely pleasing. I was very disappointed with Linus for his new, consumer unfriendly hot take, and I'm so happy to see that you are willing to speak against it, even if you are friendly with him. After years of watching you on and off, I'm finally deciding to subscribe because this is something I want to support, and I appreciate you being in this space.
I love how the first thing he mentioned wasn't disappointment with Linus but a reminder that it was just a live show answer from a sudden question and it should be taken with a grain of salt...
@@TheDeathmail and the guy clearly knows nothing about the very good history LTT built over YEARS taking care of their customers. It was a bad 3 second response on a live show but their actions have spoken much louder than him just saying "There isn't a written warranty" when in the past they have shown themselves to be completely willing to mass-replace customer orders when a stitching defect did show up in the beanies and follow up with the manufacturer to correct it for the future. Everyone here is talking about Linus supposedly being sketchy by an offhand response but Steve has been around for years to see firsthand that Linus and LTT as a corporation is pro-consumer and literally jumped on a couple seconds of livestream to make big news despite being able to EASILY reach out to Linus for a direct comment/correction. No he'd rather throw it in as his HEADLINE topic for HARDWARE news just to a week later say he's no longer going to cover non hardware related LTT things.. Kinda seems like even Steve realized he jumped the boat with this one.
I get that Steve did point out it was an offhand response but there is no way he couldn't have foreseen this "Us vs Them" spin making it look like LTT is standing behind said comment when he could just ask Linus if that's the case. FFS Linus has on multiple occasions called Steve live on stream for a joke, I'm pretty sure he has his number.
LTT sadly went downhill in the last couple of years...
Steve (with both E's) deserves credit for dealing with the extreme (all E's) stupidity of pc gaming hardware branding approaches.
had a good laugh at that part - it was chaotic
Linus definitely missed his calling as public relations manager for Blizzard/Activision.
He's not that far gone yet.
@@fobinc He's been that far gone for about 4 years now.
I just want to say I love how open you are about everything you guys do and that you want to do what’s right for everyone. I will definitely buy whatever I am looking for from you guys just for that.
Mark of a true company is that they directly address how they take care to make sure they only sell quality. Pre-ordered the foil skeleton shirt and I can't wait to receive it later this year. This is one of the channels worth each every penny of support one can give.
Whoever edited in that "or warranty" in at 14:52 you are a wonderful person and I hope you have a fantastic week, because that was perfect
loled indeed
Linus Tech tip warranty - trust me bro
Here's a tech tip: Don't buy from LTT Store.
GN's integrity and transparency set a standard that LTT has never even been interested in achieving. I enjoy some of LTT's videos, but when I want real information I can trust for making decisions, there's no place like GN. Let the games begin!
I stopped viewing LTT videos long time ago. Even Jay (jays2cents) is less annoying. LTT seems to have lost its direction in terms of "tech tips". Just a bunch of noise from a 30something who;s testicles still haven't descended.
@@geepeezee5030 True but Jay is constantly making fun of people calling them "depressed" and "having a really bad day" then tagging them and all of his fans go after that person. He's entertaining but he's a bully on twitter so frequently. Twitter brings out the worst in everyone i think.
@wondras LTT kind of leans more towards "tech entertainment" than cold hard facts. short catchy fun videos that have some info in them. where GN is the opposite, long data dense videos with a lot of info that are sometimes entertaining.
Man I need a friend like GN in a way that it's someone blunt with your faults but mature enough to dish it appropriately
Totally agree with your warranty position.
Linus position of “well handle it bro” is meaningless. Sure you have to trust him either way, but having laid out guidelines helps everyone be accountable to that.
“We’ll handle it bro” is a non-commitment. That’s the difference.
Appreciate all you do and how you’re pushing the industry with better warranties.
It's just as atrocious as Linus' position on workers' rights. "Nah, we don't need worker representation / unionization. If you don't trust me to treat you well, why would you work for me? And btw. if you have an issue with me, you can always go talk to my wife." I really don't get how any self respecting person can still work for him.
@@seeibe I mean I agree with you that his stance on workers rights is trash but people still work for him because he's probably a overall good boss. And if Linus is true to his word and does foster a healthy environment the people are going to continue to work for him. I wouldn't quit a nice job with a nice boss just because of one bad opinion they have or even multiple bad opinions as long as he continues to be a good boss.
@@seeibe His wife does business management, not HR.. Quit spewing nonsense.
@@seeibe I mean for him it might be true, that worker rights are not as important, since he has a small "family" owned buisness with employees, that can afford to lose their job, but only a small part of the workforce has the luck to be employed in such an enviroment.
@@EliteProductions3129 It's nonsense that he quite literally said on the WAN show.
I gotta be honest I don’t watch this channel as much as I should. Many times it is too technical for me. But man I can only recommend the stuff you guys do and extending warranty like that is unheard of! You’re such good sports about it and doing all of this for us!
Thank you very much :D
They already “made it”, past the hardship, so I’m not in a position to feel bad for them, but definitely a channel worth my full unreserved support
Cancelling my backpack order, you bring up good points Steve.
Linus may be appearing as a “good guy” and “we will take care of it” is not going to be a reality for a businessman. He’s out to make money.
Given you made this comment 14h ago and not Friday, you just lost your place in the queue for a product that will have a warranty and was intended to have one, even before Linus put his foot in his mouth. 😂. You should have watched WAN show after this.
@@bipbop3121 UR missing the point here. We just don't want to support the product that initially don't want to provide a written warranty, and will only provide one, after a backslash.
@@Joshuae On the other hand, LTT has always HEAVILY supported everything on their store without a written warranty. Example: Steve wants you to return a shirt if it's damaged. LTT will let you keep the first shirt and send a new one. If you claim your shirt never arrived, LTT will ship you a new one without question. Until now, LTT didn't sell anything that might require a warranty so it's understandable that they weren't necessarily prepared in that area. But without a warranty policy their customer support is _better_ than Gamers Nexus.
@@kaldo_kaldo I never said that they have a bad history of customer service, in fact, they have an excellent one. But you can't tell me you are sure it wont change in the future.
And if we originally settle with no written warranty, and only "trust me bro" , then after a few years, LTT will have a new management, and possibly don't want to continue this trust me bro bullshit, LTT customers dont have any right to demand warranty, right?
I hope you realize the importance of the written warranty. and the hypocrisy of linus, holding companies on high standards, except his own company.
@@Joshuae You are correct in everything you said, but you did miss something: the warranty relies on the manufacturer being trustworthy.
They could put out a warranty and make it so strict that no one ever gets a replacement. They could just not honor the warranty at all or just do it selectively - your only recourse is taking them to court. Are you really going to spend $10K+ battling a multi million dollar corporation because your $250 backpack's bottom fell through in 6 years and they won't replace it when the warranty is 7 years? Definitely not.
So what really is the point? It's all down to how much you trust them either way. And as an aside, have you ever heard of a backpack requiring a warranty? It's kind of absurd.
Linus just announced on the WAN show lifetime Warranty on the Backpack after acknowledging the mistake of the previous show. Nice to have people like Steve and Linus driving the industry!
Yes, it's nice to have people like Steve who corner people like high-pitched-squeak-who-likes-to-drink-his-own-koolaid into back peddling. As they say, "you're not sorry for doing it, you're sorry for being caught doing it". Not the first and not the last time.
@@neetop1557 Did you have problems with LLT Store support? Because I haven't! Or are you just talking tra sh about people you don't like? lol
@@costafilh0 whether I bought something from them and whether I had issues or not is irrelevant to the subject at hand. That's a textbook strawman argument right there.
@@neetop1557 well... If you are not speaking from experience I rest my case! If you had watched the Wan show they clearly acknowledged they were wrong and are fixing it! And even without a clear documentation on warranty I still can't find any one I know nor online that had any problems with their costumer support. And different from you, I can speak from experience! So keep on ha ting on the internet if that's your jam! Good look with that!
@@costafilh0 yes, I don't speak from experience - I avoid supporting cults. Cults are built on a blind "trust" towards their leader. Serious businesses are built on terms and conditions defined within the framework of law. The only reason your cult leader started backpedalling is because of the public backlash. Not the first and not the last time. I started watching him in 2009, in case you're interested in why I'm cynical.
I love the mentality and outlook y'all take to your profession. It doesn't matter what field you are in, if you aren't trying to improve and learn every single day at work, then what's the point in even trying? Love you guys, from your neighbor in the other Carolina.
It's exactly because of stuff like Steve's stance in warranties that's displayed here that made me decide some time ago that Gamer's Nexus will get some of my money before Linus will get any of it.
Agree, unsubbed from Linus his channel's years ago after realizing he's for sale to the highest bidder...
@@benjaminsmekens2344 You do realize that Linus has dropped sponsors multiple times, not to mention the ones he just outright rejected without ever even taking them on in the first place?
The fact that a two testing Labs also have media outlets that are big enough that they cant be blacklisted means PR and marketing departments can't crap on us consumers anymore. This is so good.
I've heard a story about the glory days of IBM, where IBM refused to offer a warranty, because the warranty would imply a limitation. IBM lived off their reputation, and their approach to problems was just "We will take care of it if you have a problem". They basically did "take care of it" as well, their commitment was good, and customers didn't complain. Just an interesting take on the warranty concept.
Yes, but that can be either a variable or a bad experince. If one does it right, others might not. That is why in the EU there is a minimum 2 years warranty for pretty much all devices. (Not clothes and other pieces that wear and tear).
Don't think that business model would work today anyways with so many scammers and people with technology looking to make a quick easy unearned buck
@@FlorinArjocu The 2 years "warranty" in the EU is not technically warranty though. There's a different legal term in German for it (that doesn't seem to exist in English) and it means you can claim a manufacturing fault for two years. However, after 6 months you yourself have to prove that it is actually a manufacturing fault and not user damage or whatever. And that is really hard to do and you'd basically have to go to court. So basically it's just a 6 month guaranteed warranty for manufacturing faults because in those first six months, the manufacturer/seller has to prove that it's not his fault but yours.
This is completely seperate from manufacturer warranty, where the manufacturer can do whatever they want (either nothing or complete lifetime warranty or anything in between)
Steve: I love you calling Linus on his nonsense. There's a reason GN merch is the only merch I own.
About the written warranty, my phone had burned OLED issue and I submitted to service centre, and company refused the repair because my phone had a scratch on side ( not screen just body part ) and the reply they gave was the burning OLED display was due to physical damage to side body plastic of phone
So yes written warranty are also same as no warranty nowadays
Manufacturar was RealMeme btw
This video aged like fine wine
I got your toolkit a while back. It's working fine so far. I appreciate you are including the 7-year warranty retroactively to all people who had purchased before. Looks like it's time to get Modmat.
For as big as Ltt is they should definitely have a warranty, they plug their merch in EVERY video so I think it’s only right to do so. And for $250 they should have a 10 year/lifetime warranty, it’s the least that they could do for charging that much for a backpack…
dude, you do realise that ltt offers great warranty and support for their products right? after all this dumb arguments happened people came out to speak about how great support is, got sent the wrong size shirt? heres a new one, keep the other one, shit like that
@@ultratronger oh, you just copy the same comment to everyone, nice
@@ultratronger dude you realize Osprey, Cotopaxi, and Patagonia will fix your backpack for free or for a small price for life and they have bags that cost less than 250 USD.
@@ultratronger It does not matter if there support is amazing or not . You have to outline what is covered and what is not so its known and easy for everyone.
Wait, they're trying to sell their branded merch "tech" backpacks at Osprey or Eblerstock prices?!?! What in tarnation...
Any plans to update the mod mat with new diagrams like DDR5 or ATX 12VO?
I've wanted to order one for over a year now, but I always figured the next run would be updated, so I kept putting it off to get the most out of my money. Is an updated version coming or should I just order one now?
I think they'll end up doing a new version of it like they did with the Volt Modmat
Make it clear, and concise what you cover. I'm not buying a $250 product with no warranty. Fuck that.
It's already expensive for what it is over hype
the ltt labs comments rings so different now
You either die a hero or live long enough to be a villain.
The best thing Linus can do right now is say, "you know what? You're right - I need to formalise my warranty process". It would nip all this in the bud right now. It hasn't gone too far yet to reverse course. If he doubles down and gets in a to-and-fro with Steve, it will only hurt his business and damage his reputation. It would probably bring new subscribers to GN though. It's all upside for GN and all downside for LTT. Big moment here, Linus - don't screw it up!
That exactly what he did(committed to a written warranty) and it pretty much shut up most anti-comments here.
Indeed, he can make the best of it by replying directly and being like "yep steve was right we are expanding many places at once and we don't have the margin left, and that's on us, and we'll have to do better and then as above formalise the warranty process"
Hopefully he takes it personally and it becomes a drama though because Drama fuels entertainment and i doubt Linus would lose too many people doing it, and GN would gain greatly lol.
I don't mind Linus but he legit seems like the "we are better than thou" kind of undertones when i watch his videos, fun and interesting as they are i always feel like that team are jumping too high before they're ready.
They had already committed to getting a warranty in place before shipping a few days ago, and doubled down on that today with a draft-ish reading on their live show.
@@dawfydd it does feel as if they are trying to do to much to fast
@@kelvin1316 that is precisely what is happening . From here they’ll either rise quickly, or fail quickly. Intense period
this aged like fine wine
Good guys GN again. You are consumer focused and always morally on point. And it's not just to look good but because it actually reflects your values. And this is why so many of trust your reviews over many other tech channels.