The egos of these younger guys don’t match up with the lack of skills and the lack of tool inventory. It takes about 6 to 8 months for the Bullshit train they came in on to catch up with them.
Don't demand undeliverable expectations from your techs. Making them stay late past closing just to catering to customers that walk in 5 minutes before closing and wanting an oil change.
Dude amen to that! I can't stand fleet companies. They'll take forever for approval, and the second they do, they expect the tech to stay and fix it, and sometimes it's not always an easy fix, I can't stand these ford's with the lane departure cameras.
Happened to me at a shop I used to work for.... I literally cleaned my tools, washed my hands, put my clothes on, then comes my boss saying there's a lady that's needs a oil change done. I told him OK have fun doing that oil change I'm out. 😂😂😂
No other occupation requires an employee to own 10’s of thousands in tools, constant training to stay up to date, physical strains, all for $18-30 an hour on average. Most of the time I’ve only gotten a raise after finding another shop and putting in my notice. Suddenly raises our value, or let’s us know we have some. Sad it has to be this way, but you have to be good at the trade and willing to move if needed. A good shop won’t let it be that way…which is why I’ve been at my current shop over 15 years.
It is sad. The only time I make any significant difference is by switching jobs. It's more than just the mental reset, it financially helps by switching every few years. I personally have two decades as a heavy truck mechanic. From experience I can attest it is common to have less wage and more personal cost than a general labor on any job site. You have to have the heart, mind and body in this and never expect fair compensation. That way when it does come (if ever) you are eternally grateful. Locally it is a sparse area to get any local talent and a huge demand here. However there is no compensation to pay people to be interested in the field. This is especially true when there is such wage compression. Again, locally there is less than a $4 per hour spread from starting mechanic to top experienced mechanic. I have been told by previous employers that we will do the same job so we all deserve the same wage. No true understanding from a shop business owner of what really needs to be acquired over years. Truly sad but it's the life I chose 🔧
@@fumanpoo4725 and you can make as much! The pay has not kept up with the cost increases. Shops want you 6 days a week 10 hours a day and have your own tools. Smaller shops also dont offer shit for benefits. Pay for your own uniforms. Its getting crazy. I was recently laid off and im close to “you want fries with that” Laughable out there really is
I've been in the industry since 2018, started out making $12.50/hr and now I'm at $45 + bonus. I have the money in tools and all that. Only ever worked on imports (dealer and indy), that definitely helped. Still leaving, I'm taking some evening classes at a local college. Whenever I meet the guys that have been in this job for their whole career I want to quit.
I’m about a year and a half into the Toyota TTen program at a community college. I’ve been working at my dealership for a total of 2 years now, 6 months of it was in the express lane. Now, I’m in the main shop as a line tech. I’ve actually got quite a bit of certifications, but because I’m technically still “in school”, the dealership still has me stuck at the $18/hr flat rate I was at 8 months ago. The other day, I did a V6 engine on a Sienna and I’m still getting paid 18. What’s more ridiculous, I have to work out of my overflowing roll cart because they won’t give me my own bay. Which means I have to rush to get big jobs done or I’ll be getting yelled at by a co worker the next day. It’s no surprise why they can’t find good people.
you need to find another toyota dealer asap. The dealer will never value you as a real tech since you started as a rookie with them. If anything come back years later. That school excuse is bullshit like the rest of this shitty industry. plus warranty times paying shitty for repairs and nothing to diagnose, get the fuck out of here lol. Dealer life is ass. This industry is ass.
went to CC got my ASE certification. just for a dealership to start be off at 13 an hour. said fuck them now I do fire alarm system making 18.90 been with the company for 10 months
I worked at Toyota as a tech for 24 years. I stared as a lube tech and did the same but was not smart that time to realize how bad I was getting screwed. I know see jobs for lube techs in central California starting 16-17 an hour. If you look on indeed dishwashers start the same. Amazon pays 19-21 starting depending on the schedule. There is no benefit in being a tech with that low pay. Find yourself another career. I started as a lube tech and was a full blown tech before two t-ten techs even became a full tech.
Poor working conditions and pay is a very common theme in shops. IMO the only guys that should be making less than $20/hr are the lube techs. Id recommend finding a very small independent shop where the owner appreciates his techs and pays hourly.
One problem is when you have techs who started in toxic shop environments. Also some shops will hire a 2 cert tech and expected master tech level work. Learning to diagnose vehicles is something im still learning and growing at. Having quality training and continuing education is a big make or break.
@@Los831 Another big issue especially with the changing tech is so many shops are lacking information. I went on a interview and the shops only source of repair info was Identifix.
You can go to John Deere in my area and make $28-30 starting out as an assembler or you can work on cars for $15 starting out. What job you gonna pick? I know a higher-up in John Deere who manages a section of assemblers (about 30 guys) and he makes $45/hr. He’s got 4 years experience, and I know 3 auto techs that have 4 years experience that are making $24/hr. Again, what job you gonna pick?
Finding good technicians is hard. Finding good management and shop oweners is far HARDER. Everything comes down from the top. If the management is good the technicians will be good. If the management sucks the shop and the technicians will suck. American soldiers in North Africa during WWII were considered garbage by both the British and the Germans until Patton showed up. I know because my father was one of them. Once George took over things changed. Erwin Rommel noticed.
Unfortunately some shops don't get it. They must think anyone can work on cars. Unless you luv working on cars you will wind up hating it because of the rate of pay or the shop you work for. You ultimately get what you pay for!
I once heard it was more common practice to pay the best mechanic you got 30% of the shop rate, possibly 33%. This was hourly, not flat rate. 6.5 years ago I was hired at 30% of the shop rate hourly. I wish somebody could explain this to me but now I am 22% because the shop rate went from $85 to $150 in 6.5 years. The business grows and the best mechanics do not see any benefit long-term. The longer the employee is there the worse it seems to be.
My old snap-on rep had a sign on his truck that said " quality isn't expensive, its priceless." Well that applies to the man holding the wrench too. You get what you pay for.
Pay is HUGE problem in the auto industry. Spent almost 20 years in dealerships, had to hold hands of unfit gravy sucking techs then get told that as an A tech I should be doing A level work all day every day. Then have to fight for every single tenth on a ticket, then be expected to give up evenings and Saturdays and lunches if the customer was waiting. And don't you dare question why the shop rate went up $14/hr but here's your 50 cents/hr. Left dealer life 4 years ago yesterday and you couldn't pay me $100/hr to give up running my own 1 man shop and doing all the required tasks myself. Owners and managers of dealership always have and always will look at technicians as sewer scum, a necessary evil of the business operation. Don't miss it, don't recommend anyone get into the field. Get into the construction trades, make a good paycheck and you'll have money to work on your own cars and still enjoy them
I’ll make it really simple for you, based upon my own experience with four ASE master certifications, a couple of dealerships, and a car tire and maintenance chain before I left the business to go fly jet aircraft. The main thrust of these employers is to pay the technicians as little as they can get away with….. so they’re not getting and keeping the best people who have the most talent. They’re getting the people who are still in the business who haven’t left yet, and more importantly, there are others who are never going to enter the business because they immediately see the difference between the lifestyle and the pay working on cars and trucks compared to what they could be doing……such as writing apps for the iPhone….where they can get up at whatever time they want, they never have to get cold, they never have to get hot, they can play as much Fortnite as they want to, and with a few apps written for the iPhone every year they never ever have to mount a tire or do an engine diagnostic, and make better money. It’s a no-brainer for them….which is why kids are not going into this business.
All the above is true, and I know kids that would go into this business, but then they get a taste and see the incredibly low pay... Incredibly LOW PAY. And the shop is charging $100+ an hour, and jacking up the parts by 1000%... I would not give the field a second look, and not walk away, but run.
Problem is you have alot of guys who have been grandfathered into thier position and should have been fired long ago but since he is Billy’s grandson they won’t fire him
I’m a shop foreman in Atlanta that’s been at my Honda dealer for 16 years and he is exactly right, it’s not easy but they are out there it’s getting tougher and tougher especially trying to find people that can actually perform the functions they say they can. Some or a lot of techs we interview and hire say they can do one thing but in reality they have vastly over estimated what their true skill level is, it’s just part of the game and process of trying to find good quality help.
I was a former Toyota tech 24 years. I love your videos and the work ethics you have. There are so many good auto techs out there and never get enough. Pay, time off, healthcare. Best advice I personally can give to the younger kids that is wanting to be an auto tech is this. Do not be one. There is no good benefit to being one. Just look at a lot of CZcams videos and read the comments. Talk to local techs. They will all tell the same type of story. Do something better and you will not regret it. Sorry to be negative but it’s the truth.
Much of the labor shortage is self inflicted, at many shops and dealerships where the younger techs wanting to learn look around and don’t see a viable career because of pay. If the management and writers are constantly cutting the necessary hours and telling techs “I’ll make it up on the next one” that good tech is not sticking around, and the upcoming tech is looking to another carreer.
Yep. I left auto and moved over to heavy equipment. I know work rebuilding cat transmissions and I make 22 an hour hourly. Was just tired of my hours getting cut and not enough business for it in my area
Not getting a good technician for $15 an hour - no lie. Here in Detroit you can get a starting wage flipping burgers for that. Let alone the expenses of being a tech, certifications, tools, diagnostic equipment, it adds up and $15 an hour doesn't begin to cover it. Thankfully, I have a great employer and an awesome work atmosphere. Great video sir 👍👍
Well said, when I was living in seattle shops that paid low wages, most are out of business. So that part of the industry is taking care of that on their own.
That funny because because I'm having trouble finding an employer who 1. Shows up on time 2. Knows what quality looks like 3. Knows how to fix a car themself/Doesn't make excuses for the guy who can't diagnose a car correctly and then expect me to fix their comeback without compensation 4. Write up work orders instead of looking at pictures of motorcycles all day. Not to mention the shop owners that say "We got a new guy I know he's full of shit but I hired him anyways" We would be better off understaff than overwhelmed with a moron. Please interview people don't be shy to ask them how they would diagnose a no start. If you hire a service manager whos never worked in automotive be very clear when you tell them you are not a mechanic you are here to answer the phone. the Mechanics are out on the floor because I can't afford to have them at the front counter.
I got lucky and moved to a state where it's hard to find a Tech who can fix a sandwich let alone a car. I am golden right now loving a great life working Union.
the pay is a huge problem especially for higher cost of living areas. I dont know the cost of living in your area but toss in commute times/gas/tools you need to cover that and then make enough to live. Your also right about communicating to the workers how what when . I like scheduled format. Certain times/days to do certain things. Order of operations and that type of stuff. Most shops just eing it daily and never get a flow going
I’m a 20 year old technician and I agree give the young kid a chance 😂 I applied at 18 To a truck shop Boss gave the chance and I clock 105 hours a week at the shop now When I say truck I mean 27ft to 53ft semi trailers And like he said in the video my boss don’t even come breathe on my neck every 15 minutes They only come when you need help,
i work for a great owner but the person who runs the shop is a micromanaging psycho. recently started there and in 3 months i've done more warranty work than the last 7 years combined. harassing your employees for speed constantly does not work. also its crazy how in our industry the difference between someone who makes you 2000 a day and 500 a day might be 5 dollars an hour and they don't want to pay it.
I’m sure every shop has gone through this. I’m in the same boat. My old boss got fired because we have been busting our asses off and he gave all of our flat rate guys an extra dollar raise. 😂 Now this new guy is trying to say u better give me that same energy or ur fired 😂😂😂
I've never understood it but I've seen it a lot. They will say I can't pay a guy $25 an hour. Then they will pay two guys $18 that together don't produce as much.
I checked the Inflation calculators for what my starting wage(with zero prior work experience) is now equivalent too and it came out to $20/hr in todays money. I actually think that's a bit low because I know I was making more money than people stocking store shelves at the time and yet today you can go find a job doing just that for about $22/hr in the same city.
@Jacks Garage I used to live in one of the largest cities in the US(top 10 or so) and $22/hr comes from people I know that still live there. And just like when I was young and starting out, that $22/hr wage is not something you can afford to live on by yourself in that city. At least back then, the gas was cheap, so I could afford to live out in the suburbs and commute almost an hour to work everyday. Although I still couldn't afford to rent a cheap apartment on that income alone.
At this shop we have the issue of techs thinking they’re better than they are. They talk themselves up big in the interview but do not perform when here
I agree that's a very common problem in the industry . Just as big of a problem is owners / managers talking their shop up to a good tech and the place is run like dog sht and they try to f'k the tech on hours every chance they get. It really does go both ways and unfortunately I don't have the answers to fix either issue .
A lot of these shops don’t want to pay the money . They rather hire younger techs with no experience or tools . Only to save money on over head , in turn , a mechanic with 10 years experience and 10k worth tools and education is only offered 3 dollars above the minimum wage ?!?!? Take my advice young guys work at an independent shop till the work feels like repetitive or till you feel you have enough experience to move up . From there move into Heavy line or Apply at the dealership with your experience I will be making a video on this soon, should I shout out flat rate master on my video ? Stay tuned
Having motivated management is key as well. Lots of owners are either tired of the industry or are only concerned with how they are spending the profits for new things in their personal life. Some owners think you dont need to keep training to keep up with new tech and those guys will wear you down when you are a tech that wants to get better. Pay well and encourage staff to keep learning if thats what they want to do
yup , i go through this now that we are seeing 2020 and newer cars coming in off warranty I try to keep up with tech and I know my limits of my tools and skills. Most of the customers I have got to know over 20 plus years in one building have been very greatful for my Honesty on my limits.
No way in hell Id ever go back to being a technician. Degree in auto technology and tons of certs and I couldnt move up from oil changes and tire rotations, even when outperforming my "peers". No thanks.
@@JamesValentineBaja1000 says a lot about technicians being whiny babies when someone comes in and wants to make money. I’ve never seen so much backstabbing bullshit in my life, by a bunch of people that can’t hold my tools let alone outwrench me.
Great video with lots of common sense. You have to be willing to pay for quality on the one side, and if you want a good wage you have to be willing to do a good job (and everything that entails). This brings up in my mind a question - how does a qualified and quality tech actually locate a good shop? How to avoid starting at a shop that’s only going to be a disappointment?
Flat rate master,you would be shocked what it’s like here in tn, the dealers pay less than the local Taco Bell, some of the independent shops pay 400 a week with no benefits,contract labor. Needless to say there are a lot of bad techs here lol, customers expect to pay 50 bucks an hour labor rate….., anyway,if your good they will pay thank god. But it to hire an experienced good tech here would require a labor rate that they won’t pay, thus I work alone 12 hrs a day at my shop.
Real sad. That's why I left the automotive field. Between the cost of tools & additional training it's just not worth what the shops are paying. Hopefully they will pay the better techs what they are really worth in a tough field, or they will just go into another field that pays more.
When I left my last shop I was fed up with the guy in charge. Kept wanting more and paying the same rates. Decided one day to just say screw it, I'll finish the vehicles I have tickets on and go find a better shop. Boss never said a word. Just looked back at me in the mirror and said "It's been a hell of a run, enjoy retirement"
I did a short phone interview , offering commission based pay . I asked how is the commission calculated . 17% of weekly billing of your work. I asked about guaranty min pay. He said no. A fluctuating pay like that would hurt. Its great if they can feed you $8k plus a week and you dont need to buy tools.
The new generation is different than the past generations of older mechanics. Will you said it right of the bat employers expect but few are willing to train up techs and a pleasant work shop , currently the avg length of time is what 2 years . When I started the avg employee length of employment was 20+ years . Manager play a large part in my area we hv a dealer paying 45 an hour and there retention rate is still terrible
here’s the crazy thing i was at a mom and pop shop getting paid 18 dollars an hour for a year didn’t think i was the greatest but saw there was no way to move up there. i’m looking through indeed and a local kia dealer had an add up so i said what the hell might as well see what’s up with it out my resumè in. got a call 5 min after interviewed started at 20 an hour hourly they waited until i was was billing 40+ hours regularly then so about 3 months and then bumped me up to 30 an hour flat rate! been billing 50-70 hours a week (physically there 40) faster forward 3 months they pull me in the office with my service manager and the operations manager tell me i’m the future of the shop and that i’ll be running it as the foreman in about a year and bumped me up to 35 +4 an hour incentive for production/being on time an hour along with getting me master certified by june! long story short this was going to be the last shop i went to before calling the automotive world a failure and going to work at a warehouse, sure glad that didn’t happen! because i thoroughly enjoy doing all types of diag and repair!
These principles apply to almost ANY profession. It ain't science rocketry. The problem is, almost any profession actually hopes to hire the best / smartest people and then (falsely) convince themselves that these super-smart new hires can not figure out they are getting screwed on pay / benefits / culture. S A D
Our problem now is the managers who are hiring new employees as well as general managers/owners in this industry. The passion potential employees used to have is not the same. Pay rates for exp should not be the same for everyone.
After 24 years I quit the auto repair industry because the shop managers they were hiring were just our of college with business degrees. They had no idea how to run a shop or how to use techs strengths to increase efficiency in the shop. New techs out of college got paid peanuts but were more qualified to do their job than the managers that were hired for top pay.
FRM always criticizing the labor earning individual. Never the gatekeepers in the office. I get sick of elite POS in the office that take it upon themselves to decide how much a job pays and shift all that available money into the parts because they make more money like that. It's also BS that they make money off the sale of parts I recommend and they call themselves salesman. Not too hard to sell a tire to a person that has a flat. Service writers are sad sacks of crap that should offer their slave more incentive to make that lazy SOB any money.
In germany, in Independent shops, the owner usually is a technocian too and works on the cars, too. Like everyone else. And the paperwork gets done by a secretary or similiar to that.
Guys, as an engineer, I can tell you that automotive technician has morphed into quasi-engineering skills to work on the modern cars. Now don't run out there and advertise your skills or shop services as "engineering" because that is a licensed occupation, but Im just observing that what I do as an engineer ofr the pharmaceutical and general production industries, is very similar. Anything done on the south main auto channel is very similar tom what I do every day, but not on autos, on production lines for anything that is made, just like "how its made" show. When required skills morph into this, it takes a particular type of person to tolerate and gravitate toward it, and you have to pay for that, sorry, but thats how it is, the days of hiring a plumber and having him work on cars is over, sorry.
Omg so right every tech that has contacted me that tells me they can do everything is a parts changer and the A-techs I personally know myself included start out conversations saying “I’m not the best tech in the world” lol. The majority of shops don’t wanna pay for a really good tech but even the ones that do can’t find anyone the job I quit 4 years ago to open my shop still hasn’t replaced me he’s offering 80k salary 100% paid health insurance 8-5 m-f never stays late wrench’s down at 5 no weekends ever friendly environment u don’t have to go 150mph like a dealership
I don’t do a lot of the diagnosing and engine trans rebuilds but since I have been at the dealer I’ve made one call wrong and that’s cause I had 2 waiters at once and service writer asked me to look at one real quick I though it was a truck bed latch but it was the handle but I didn’t really get to look at it
"They want them to show up on time". Or.........show up, period. Also, agree completely. The pay is, of course, very important. It is what it is in 2023. But, yes, a decent benefits package including good family health insurance is as important or even more important than the pay.
Its simple. The amount of knowledge/tools you need vs the amount you get paid is not worth it. Most techs are doing just enough to get by to finally break free of the industry. You are in debt $100,000 in tools and boxes, like my god what a horrible return on your investment! Then you are paid flat rate so you never have a break or if you make a mistake it comes out of your pocket. Don't take my word for it. Go into a shop and see how young most of the techs are, condition of there bodies, are they happy or would they leave? Its designed to make you invest all your money, youth, knowledge only to spit you out a few years later.
Industry seems to be turning around. A good tech that can actually use the 100k tools they have can make over 100k in a year pretty easy if they are paid accordingly per hour
@@germ294 It is turning around but slowly. Everyone always talks about how easy it is to make a lot of money as tech.... where are they? Its a super small percentage, and believe me I am happy for them. This isn't a third world country where we work for peanuts. We are American, there is plenty of money going around and its time we took our share.
This is why I hope once I’m done at my community college for automotive I can find a place that will be willing to train me further. I have a lot to learn and don’t want to start somewhere that expects me to be fast and completely know what I’m doing yet. All the shops in my area really struggling to find any experienced techs and don’t really want to take on new people that need further training. That there is what is really making shops struggle to find workers
Stay away from big chain stores and large new car dealers. Find a smaller used dealer whose reviews for their service dept are good. Thats the places that don't push you into flat rape (not a typo) and will have good seasoned guys to mentor you. I got my first ASE cert in 05, and every day I learn something new. Pick the old guy's brains to every bit they will let you. We've figured out a lot of little hacks that make life easy. I always liked seeing younger guys like you wanting to learn and seeing them grow. Just be sure to be on time everyday with a good attitude and those people will respect you and want to help you. Also, make damn sure you play it safe when you have days off and want to party. All you need to destroy everything you are working on is a DUI. If you're having more than 2 drinks, have a ride lined up ahead of time. These days insurance companies decide who gets the job, not the shop.
@@nickwarner8158 ya chain store is where I currently work at which they treat me really good but been stuck as lube and tire tech cause we only have one tech who does our repairs. Luckily it’s not flat rate at all but pays little less. Been there a year and half so far and have learned lot when we are slow. Definitely don’t gotta worry about partying I rarely drink and have 3 kids take care of. Sadly I’m 33 so little late getting into this field but it’s much more enjoyable that working factories
I’m 10-15 minutes late every single day they knew going in it would be like that I take my kids to school before work but I stay when someone needs to finish a car and I do it every time
I knew it was fucked when i found out that at the dealership i work at , us lube techs are getting paid 14 an hour while our lot porters are getting paid 17 an hour. How do they expect us to pay for thousands of dollars in tools and to have anything to live on with pay like this.
I was the small town kid and they didn’t want to show me or answer the questions I asked. They didn’t even give me a chance and they said nope well the foreman made the executive decision to say no. Now I’m out of the auto industry with a college degree.
New to HVAC after 20 years in the Dealership making way more money now than I ever did before and a way better work environment. Glad I said goodbye. Good luck everyone else.
If you don’t mind me asking. What do you think a Top tech should be paid. A tech that has his own scanner and 4 ch scope and knows how to use it efficiently. shows up on time able to work on anything that comes in the shop and does what ever it takes to get that job done.
I am an older guy who has been working on vehicles my whole life. I can work as hard as anyone I know. I own all the tools any tech would be expected to have. I am getting ready to retire from being an Ironworker. I would like to find a job as a tech in a local shop. With no formal training, but knowing a fair amount about fixing and maintaining everything from heavy equipment to chainsaws, how crazy am I? What should my expectations be?
It would seem to start at the training level. How good are the automotive courses in any particular area? My certificate automotive course on weekends at a local community college was far superior to a associate level automotive course that seemed to have instructors that did not have a lot of experience in the field. I would have been better off in a apprentice program at a shop that was willing to further train me. Back then they were not desperate enough to have those in place. Now that there is a shortage in people willing to work with their hands & in particular the automotive industry (investment in tools vs. rate of pay, etc. makes the situation worse) I could probably pick & choose where I want to work. For me working on trains became a better option. Now that I'm retired from that field I have no regrets. My pleasure these days comes from working on my own cars.
When I went to high school, we used to have auto shop, welding, paint and body, etc... Now, all of that is gone, and has been for nearly 30 years. Many kids could walk out of high school and right into a shop. Not so, few if any could even install a headlamp in a 72 Buick, much less knowing which end of the hammer to use. If they were lucky enough to live on a farm or have a father that liked to wrench, very few young folks have any real world skills, or commonsense.
The cheapest are those one man shops that are owner operated. A shop near me has had the same job post online for a year now looking for a mechanic with 10years experience and only offering $20-$25 an hour not flat rate. In California of all places lol
I just hired a very solid A tech in 5 days. You can get a very quality tech, pay, benefits, culture, Schedule, condition of shop and tools / equipment, etc. all play a factor. Take care of your people as a priority and treat them like a human and they will stay.
Every industry is, many of us old farts are retiring and or getting ready to. The training most folks get in almost every field has gone woke, or is so over burdened with red tape and regulations that they barely function. And then throw in all of the immigrants that are only here for the money, will not learn the language and could care less about much of anything except themselves... Need I go on? Just my own personal observations.
I'm 63 and would like to work as a tech. I'm retiring from a professional job after 29 years. However, i do not want to fully retire. I was taking night classes until Covid-19 and I did an internship at a Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep dealership. I have always enjoyed working on cars and would like to do it until i decide to fully retire. I know it may sound crazy but any suggestions on how to break in to the industry? Thanks DB
Also with my comment I’ve thought of switch to a mom and pop shop but I don’t want it to be the same with the same waste of time from the 4 dealers I’ve been at they have all been the same
Everyone makes mistakes, doctors have insurance, shop has insurance, tech was told by shop owner just install part xyz. Who gets fired when that job comes backs?
Having a good working Environment is a tough one tho. That's subjective. Not all tradespeople are extroverted. In fact all lot are introverted. But i say being treated fairly, providing coffee and drinks.
For you shop owners stop hiring people with no tools and expecting your other technicians to provide everything they need when sometimes they don't even know how to use tools.
Trust me I'm in that boat! I've even hired techs with 20 years experience and a disaster as well! I've offered competitive pay according to the experience of the tech and cash tips included...the big issue I have is the lack of efficiency and lack of knowledge issue but them wanting to make $30+/hr. It's like I hand them the work and I even help them without having them go through diagnostic part...and they still screw up and always have to catch them doing stupid stuff...oh but they complain that they don't get paid enough cause there jobs take forever to finish. I don't have time to stop and teach the basics while I'm trying to bring more work and deal with the business part of the shop. For that I rather work on my own since I end up having to fix the rest of their repair or comebacks. So I basically gave up, and I'm handling the shop by myself just fine. I just restructured my shop for faster style repair...not those engine overhaul, transmission swaps, etc, and kept my jobs more efficient for myself to still sleep at night. Yes it's more work to keep up with customers, accounting the jobs, but now....less comebacks, less expenses, and I still make money....oh and can sleep at night. All it takes is adapting to it...until someone shows up one day like how I was as a young tech that has enthusiasm to really learn and care about it.
Is there actually any chances for a guy returning to the field with prior years experience as a r&r guy? I’m hopeful that I could find something that just let’s me turn a wrench again but I’m not certified for anything. I was always able to either figure it or if it was something I didn’t understand I would just ask the guys that I worked with for guidance. But that was over 15 years ago. Not sure about now though.
Your job is what you make it they say. I try uplift service and quality to justify price. Everyone else want to work at a dumpster and race to the bottom.
I've been professionally turning wrenches for just over a year, before that I spent a lot of time working on my vehicles, working on my friends vehicles, etc. As I sit right now, I consider myself pretty proficient at steering and suspension work (cant recall the last time i didnt beat labor time on steering or suspension work, regardless of vehicle, and especially on American trucks and large SUV's, I pretty regularly cut labor time in half), and middle of the road at diagnosing suspension issues, I prefer to get confirmation from another tech before I say "this vehicle needs this" in most cases. I'm also pretty decent at some heavy line, transmission drops, etc. I want to get into more engine work just to be a little more well rounded, but i dont enjoy it the same way i enjoy steering and suspension and heavy line, and i generally dont beat labor, and honestly i dont do enough of it to get really, really good. Any recommendations for how to get into it?
Steering and suspension flat rate time pay much much better than engine work. Most engine jobs pay less than 10 hours when you knownyou will easily have 20 hours in it. I remember the 80 and early 90s honda head gaskets (had millions of vacuum lines etc) only paid about 4 hours to replace the head....but it paid 1.5 hours to replace an axle....just stupid.
@@86753091974 that’s something I’ve noticed…this morning I had upper control arms & lower ball joints on a Silverado, pays 6.5, I did it quicker than the other tech in the shop doing a oil pan that called for 3 (and he’s a pretty experienced tech, knows what he’s doing).
Toxic shop or moving to a new city are really the only 2 reasons good techs are looking for a new job. Good shops generally pay good techs what they are worth to keep them. I hired 2 of the move in techs on the answer to one question. I called their former employer and asked if they would hire him back if he moved back to their city. The answer was yes and so.... I got 2 good employees....
Good shops that pay techs enough to stay without having to be asked aren't as common as you might think. Good on you for doing so but even the "good" shop I work for right now I had to have more than one meeting with the owner before I was fairly compensated after 5 years being there.
Because in the one shop I ever tried working at that was flat rate the same people got alllllllll the work and made their 70 hours a week EVERY week sometimes 80 while the people outside the clique fought to make 40. Just the way the shop boss handed out the work.
You fail to say how difficult these high tech cars are to fix these days. I was told at school years ago that we were actually on par with engineers. 4 techs were getting out 1 was coming in. Nobody learned a dam thing. You cant expect an assembly line of cars being fixed quickly with hightech problems. Some take extra time to get repaired correctly. Other shops can't fix it. Most shops just care about getting quick money. They don't care about the tech or how difficult the problem is. Disrespecting techs is a big problem. Knocking cars out is not the answer. It makes it sound like your bagging groceries. This is a hightech, difficult, thankless, abusive career to get in to. Don't do it. 40 year GM tech, with 6 dealerships, retired, ASE Master tech with L1 and diesel training. Also have 2 tears in my right rotator cuff, bad knees, can't hear well because of extreme noises throughout career. I paid my dues and now I'm having my say.
Im not sure there is a labor shortage vs a pay shortage. Right now starting pay in this area for a entry level tech is the same as McDs or HD. No room for buying tools. As a aging tech , cost of living has out paced my pay considerably and can no longer afford to buy tools. Fun times ahead
I've only been a dealer tech for a year but was a "military tech" for 9 years prior, I try to learn everything I can every second. If we all have that mindset and learn from each other what to do and what not to do we all get money and the shop shines
What pisses me off as a consumer, I am not a professional mechanic, truck driver, own my own rig. But have had to learn how to wrench due to lack of qualified mechanics. To my point, when I need work done in a shop, and I am paying upwards of $200 an hour, and find out the techs are making on average $20... A. That just pisses me off. B. I know I am going to have to go behind the tech to figure out if he has done the job correctly or fix his screw ups. That has happened one too many times, hence me learning the trade. C. I will more than likely never go to that shop again. I honestly only know of one shop I would trust in the country, and he is 700 miles away in Griffin GA. Even a shop I trusted for stuff on my car, I am finding shoddy work there too. More diagnostic tools, I am going to need another tool chest, and shelving. I have four full right now. One is a 72" chest, a stackable and a top unit... I hope you guys get your industry together.
hey bud thats your shop. im a 26 yr old tech on my fucking job. I work fleet and I'm a top performer with 90% efficiency all these other snowflakes my age my foot is on their neck. I'm leaving pretty soon to ford/lincoln so I can move to the heavy line otherwise ill be a oil and tire for 20 years like all these older guys if i stay fleet. A fucker like me could do this 12-16 a day like its nothin. My dad waited an hour before his shift started at work so I did too.
So here's my situation. And I really don't know if I should speak up or not. Really could use someone's opinion on the matter to know if I'm tripping or not. The other day I noticed my co mechanic got some bolt on ball joints on an old camry and got paid 3.2 for the job. Crazy out of the roof labor for like 30 minutes of work. Today I get 2 pressed in lower ball joints and two bolt on ball joints on a lincoln totalling 4 hours which is normal. Should I feel some type of way or should I just continue wrenching, minding my own business even though that's bothering the fk out of me. And this isn't the first occasion, I've caught them plenty of times changing the labor numbers. This also makes him look more productive than me even though he's under me and I'm constantly having to help him through jobs. I feel like this happens everywhere and pushes mechanics out, i know i feel some type of way and ready to leave. I also don't want people to think I don't want him to eat, because he's a hell of a worker but come on. Sorry for my rant.
I would find a better shop to work at or even working on trucks or maybe even on trains. I could not work at a dishonest shop that rips people off. How would you like it if it was someone you knew being ripped off?
Just wondering was the book labor time for the bolt on ball joints correct? As in thts what there book time calls for. If so than I wouldn't be upset tht they got what it pays. Yes it sucks watching guys get gravy work while you're getting the rest of what's left. But tht shouldn't be the other guys fault but the blame should be on the manager for not distributing the work more fair. Ngl I stepped away from this industry cause of similar things happening with flat rate (which unlike the frm, I personally think flat rate should be abolished.) Happier ever since making tht choice, and can still work on cars for cash on the side. Being a mechanic or tech doesn't hold you to just a shop, we got a skill tht others can't do. And ppl will hire someone to work on there car for cheaper than a shop would cost. Keep your head up man.
If your going by book labor you have to know what the book labor is, 3.2hrs sounds more like a control arm labor cost. If your working flat rate just make sure your getting the correct labor time for what you do. As long as the hours are spread evenly and the work load is even distributed amongst liked skilled tech just log your hours....now if this same guy is getting all the gravy thats another issue in itself.
we need to find writers that actually want to sell also, not idiots that dont even try to sell and just tell you to pull the car out and say the customer doesn't want anything when in reality all they did was sit on their ass for 10 mins. Dealer life sucks.
If you pay better than anyone else, you will attract the best candidates. Period.
The egos of these younger guys don’t match up with the lack of skills and the lack of tool inventory. It takes about 6 to 8 months for the Bullshit train they came in on to catch up with them.
Or the best liars
Yes but be prepared to fire the liars
If you are a top shop that provides top pay, the bottom 25% of performers should be on the bubble anyway.
@@JoseMartinez-tr5my ding ding ding this is the way.
Don't demand undeliverable expectations from your techs. Making them stay late past closing just to catering to customers that walk in 5 minutes before closing and wanting an oil change.
right
In other words don’t be a crap shop.
Dude amen to that! I can't stand fleet companies. They'll take forever for approval, and the second they do, they expect the tech to stay and fix it, and sometimes it's not always an easy fix, I can't stand these ford's with the lane departure cameras.
If the shop owner wants to stay and do it we'll be my guest. Now if a technician offers himself to do it take care of that guy...
Happened to me at a shop I used to work for.... I literally cleaned my tools, washed my hands, put my clothes on, then comes my boss saying there's a lady that's needs a oil change done. I told him OK have fun doing that oil change I'm out. 😂😂😂
In England we have a saying. Pay peanuts you get monkeys 🤣
Monkeys dont eat peanuts they eat bananas
We have the same in Ireland 😂
@@eddieds312 yes you are correct but it’s just a funny saying 🤣
No other occupation requires an employee to own 10’s of thousands in tools, constant training to stay up to date, physical strains, all for $18-30 an hour on average.
Most of the time I’ve only gotten a raise after finding another shop and putting in my notice. Suddenly raises our value, or let’s us know we have some.
Sad it has to be this way, but you have to be good at the trade and willing to move if needed. A good shop won’t let it be that way…which is why I’ve been at my current shop over 15 years.
was at the same shop for 22 years , PO was great , 5 years with the new owners.......moving on
It is sad. The only time I make any significant difference is by switching jobs. It's more than just the mental reset, it financially helps by switching every few years. I personally have two decades as a heavy truck mechanic. From experience I can attest it is common to have less wage and more personal cost than a general labor on any job site. You have to have the heart, mind and body in this and never expect fair compensation. That way when it does come (if ever) you are eternally grateful. Locally it is a sparse area to get any local talent and a huge demand here. However there is no compensation to pay people to be interested in the field. This is especially true when there is such wage compression. Again, locally there is less than a $4 per hour spread from starting mechanic to top experienced mechanic. I have been told by previous employers that we will do the same job so we all deserve the same wage. No true understanding from a shop business owner of what really needs to be acquired over years. Truly sad but it's the life I chose 🔧
You have to buy your own tools? WTF? McDonslds don't make you buy your own fryer or grill.
@@fumanpoo4725 and you can make as much!
The pay has not kept up with the cost increases. Shops want you 6 days a week 10 hours a day and have your own tools. Smaller shops also dont offer shit for benefits. Pay for your own uniforms. Its getting crazy. I was recently laid off and im close to “you want fries with that”
Laughable out there really is
I've been in the industry since 2018, started out making $12.50/hr and now I'm at $45 + bonus. I have the money in tools and all that. Only ever worked on imports (dealer and indy), that definitely helped. Still leaving, I'm taking some evening classes at a local college. Whenever I meet the guys that have been in this job for their whole career I want to quit.
I’m about a year and a half into the Toyota TTen program at a community college. I’ve been working at my dealership for a total of 2 years now, 6 months of it was in the express lane. Now, I’m in the main shop as a line tech. I’ve actually got quite a bit of certifications, but because I’m technically still “in school”, the dealership still has me stuck at the $18/hr flat rate I was at 8 months ago. The other day, I did a V6 engine on a Sienna and I’m still getting paid 18. What’s more ridiculous, I have to work out of my overflowing roll cart because they won’t give me my own bay. Which means I have to rush to get big jobs done or I’ll be getting yelled at by a co worker the next day. It’s no surprise why they can’t find good people.
you need to find another toyota dealer asap. The dealer will never value you as a real tech since you started as a rookie with them. If anything come back years later. That school excuse is bullshit like the rest of this shitty industry. plus warranty times paying shitty for repairs and nothing to diagnose, get the fuck out of here lol. Dealer life is ass. This industry is ass.
went to CC got my ASE certification. just for a dealership to start be off at 13 an hour. said fuck them now I do fire alarm system making 18.90 been with the company for 10 months
I worked at Toyota as a tech for 24 years. I stared as a lube tech and did the same but was not smart that time to realize how bad I was getting screwed. I know see jobs for lube techs in central California starting 16-17 an hour. If you look on indeed dishwashers start the same. Amazon pays 19-21 starting depending on the schedule. There is no benefit in being a tech with that low pay. Find yourself another career. I started as a lube tech and was a full blown tech before two t-ten techs even became a full tech.
Poor working conditions and pay is a very common theme in shops. IMO the only guys that should be making less than $20/hr are the lube techs. Id recommend finding a very small independent shop where the owner appreciates his techs and pays hourly.
Get the fuck out of the dealerships and find a place that pays high hourly wages like carmax
One problem is when you have techs who started in toxic shop environments. Also some shops will hire a 2 cert tech and expected master tech level work. Learning to diagnose vehicles is something im still learning and growing at. Having quality training and continuing education is a big make or break.
so many shops will not take the time or effort to get any training for techs
I agree with this they expect quality work but don’t want to invest in building techs up to get them where they need to be !!!
@@Los831 Another big issue especially with the changing tech is so many shops are lacking information. I went on a interview and the shops only source of repair info was Identifix.
Then theres the flip side you can have more certs and they dont care and wont pay more. Common in this area as you need ZERO licensing to work on cars
You can go to John Deere in my area and make $28-30 starting out as an assembler or you can work on cars for $15 starting out. What job you gonna pick?
I know a higher-up in John Deere who manages a section of assemblers (about 30 guys) and he makes $45/hr. He’s got 4 years experience, and I know 3 auto techs that have 4 years experience that are making $24/hr. Again, what job you gonna pick?
Wow, that's incredible & it is the very reason good techs are leaving the industry.
Is it a Union job ? how much do they pay in dues ?
@@Mac-mu9cs they pay union dues but if there making $28/hr they will still make about $25/hr after their dues
Watching videos of people working in automobile assembly lines got me considering the simplicity of their job and how little stress they go through.
Starting out with no experience?
Finding good technicians is hard. Finding good management and shop oweners is far HARDER. Everything comes down from the top. If the management is good the technicians will be good. If the management sucks the shop and the technicians will suck. American soldiers in North Africa during WWII were considered garbage by both the British and the Germans until Patton showed up. I know because my father was one of them. Once George took over things changed. Erwin Rommel noticed.
Unfortunately some shops don't get it. They must think anyone can work on cars. Unless you luv working on cars you will wind up hating it because of the rate of pay or the shop you work for. You ultimately get what you pay for!
You are 100% correct
I once heard it was more common practice to pay the best mechanic you got 30% of the shop rate, possibly 33%. This was hourly, not flat rate. 6.5 years ago I was hired at 30% of the shop rate hourly. I wish somebody could explain this to me but now I am 22% because the shop rate went from $85 to $150 in 6.5 years. The business grows and the best mechanics do not see any benefit long-term. The longer the employee is there the worse it seems to be.
My old snap-on rep had a sign on his truck that said " quality isn't expensive, its priceless." Well that applies to the man holding the wrench too. You get what you pay for.
Pay is HUGE problem in the auto industry.
Spent almost 20 years in dealerships, had to hold hands of unfit gravy sucking techs then get told that as an A tech I should be doing A level work all day every day. Then have to fight for every single tenth on a ticket, then be expected to give up evenings and Saturdays and lunches if the customer was waiting. And don't you dare question why the shop rate went up $14/hr but here's your 50 cents/hr.
Left dealer life 4 years ago yesterday and you couldn't pay me $100/hr to give up running my own 1 man shop and doing all the required tasks myself.
Owners and managers of dealership always have and always will look at technicians as sewer scum, a necessary evil of the business operation.
Don't miss it, don't recommend anyone get into the field. Get into the construction trades, make a good paycheck and you'll have money to work on your own cars and still enjoy them
I’ll make it really simple for you, based upon my own experience with four ASE master certifications, a couple of dealerships, and a car tire and maintenance chain before I left the business to go fly jet aircraft.
The main thrust of these employers is to pay the technicians as little as they can get away with….. so they’re not getting and keeping the best people who have the most talent. They’re getting the people who are still in the business who haven’t left yet, and more importantly, there are others who are never going to enter the business because they immediately see the difference between the lifestyle and the pay working on cars and trucks compared to what they could be doing……such as writing apps for the iPhone….where they can get up at whatever time they want, they never have to get cold, they never have to get hot, they can play as much Fortnite as they want to, and with a few apps written for the iPhone every year they never ever have to mount a tire or do an engine diagnostic, and make better money. It’s a no-brainer for them….which is why kids are not going into this business.
All the above is true, and I know kids that would go into this business, but then they get a taste and see the incredibly low pay... Incredibly LOW PAY. And the shop is charging $100+ an hour, and jacking up the parts by 1000%... I would not give the field a second look, and not walk away, but run.
Problem is you have alot of guys who have been grandfathered into thier position and should have been fired long ago but since he is Billy’s grandson they won’t fire him
I’m a shop foreman in Atlanta that’s been at my Honda dealer for 16 years and he is exactly right, it’s not easy but they are out there it’s getting tougher and tougher especially trying to find people that can actually perform the functions they say they can. Some or a lot of techs we interview and hire say they can do one thing but in reality they have vastly over estimated what their true skill level is, it’s just part of the game and process of trying to find good quality help.
As a foreman at Honda are you base pay, salary, commission?
Pay them salary a guaranteed pay even if they don’t hit the hours!! That’s the problem they need consistency
That’s the problem. Pay and benefits. It kills some shop owners to pay current wages. It’s 2023. Not 1983.
100% correct brother.
Truth!
Facts
I was a former Toyota tech 24 years. I love your videos and the work ethics you have. There are so many good auto techs out there and never get enough. Pay, time off, healthcare. Best advice I personally can give to the younger kids that is wanting to be an auto tech is this. Do not be one. There is no good benefit to being one. Just look at a lot of CZcams videos and read the comments. Talk to local techs. They will all tell the same type of story. Do something better and you will not regret it. Sorry to be negative but it’s the truth.
Confirming this is in fact the truth. MANY other industries/careers pay as well or better for much easier work.
Much of the labor shortage is self inflicted, at many shops and dealerships where the younger techs wanting to learn look around and don’t see a viable career because of pay. If the management and writers are constantly cutting the necessary hours and telling techs “I’ll make it up on the next one” that good tech is not sticking around, and the upcoming tech is looking to another carreer.
"We'll get em next time"
Yep. I left auto and moved over to heavy equipment. I know work rebuilding cat transmissions and I make 22 an hour hourly. Was just tired of my hours getting cut and not enough business for it in my area
This is the only trade talking about kids you don't see 50 year brick Mason or welders talking about they're oldies a bunch of bs
Not getting a good technician for $15 an hour - no lie. Here in Detroit you can get a starting wage flipping burgers for that. Let alone the expenses of being a tech, certifications, tools, diagnostic equipment, it adds up and $15 an hour doesn't begin to cover it. Thankfully, I have a great employer and an awesome work atmosphere. Great video sir 👍👍
Well said, when I was living in seattle shops that paid low wages, most are out of business. So that part of the industry is taking care of that on their own.
That funny because because I'm having trouble finding an employer who 1. Shows up on time 2. Knows what quality looks like 3. Knows how to fix a car themself/Doesn't make excuses for the guy who can't diagnose a car correctly and then expect me to fix their comeback without compensation 4. Write up work orders instead of looking at pictures of motorcycles all day. Not to mention the shop owners that say "We got a new guy I know he's full of shit but I hired him anyways" We would be better off understaff than overwhelmed with a moron. Please interview people don't be shy to ask them how they would diagnose a no start. If you hire a service manager whos never worked in automotive be very clear when you tell them you are not a mechanic you are here to answer the phone. the Mechanics are out on the floor because I can't afford to have them at the front counter.
I got lucky and moved to a state where it's hard to find a Tech who can fix a sandwich let alone a car.
I am golden right now loving a great life working Union.
Pay is not worth doing the job, other industries pay a lot more.
the pay is a huge problem especially for higher cost of living areas. I dont know the cost of living in your area but toss in commute times/gas/tools you need to cover that and then make enough to live. Your also right about communicating to the workers how what when . I like scheduled format. Certain times/days to do certain things. Order of operations and that type of stuff. Most shops just eing it daily and never get a flow going
I’m a 20 year old technician and I agree give the young kid a chance 😂 I applied at 18
To a truck shop
Boss gave the chance and I clock 105 hours a week at the shop now
When I say truck I mean 27ft to 53ft semi trailers
And like he said in the video my boss don’t even come breathe on my neck every 15 minutes
They only come when you need help,
Ford will offer techs $45 per flat rate hour. And then expect you to overhaul a trans for 7 hours
On what car?
i work for a great owner but the person who runs the shop is a micromanaging psycho. recently started there and in 3 months i've done more warranty work than the last 7 years combined. harassing your employees for speed constantly does not work.
also its crazy how in our industry the difference between someone who makes you 2000 a day and 500 a day might be 5 dollars an hour and they don't want to pay it.
I’m sure every shop has gone through this. I’m in the same boat. My old boss got fired because we have been busting our asses off and he gave all of our flat rate guys an extra dollar raise. 😂 Now this new guy is trying to say u better give me that same energy or ur fired 😂😂😂
I've never understood it but I've seen it a lot. They will say I can't pay a guy $25 an hour. Then they will pay two guys $18 that together don't produce as much.
I checked the Inflation calculators for what my starting wage(with zero prior work experience) is now equivalent too and it came out to $20/hr in todays money. I actually think that's a bit low because I know I was making more money than people stocking store shelves at the time and yet today you can go find a job doing just that for about $22/hr in the same city.
@Jacks Garage I used to live in one of the largest cities in the US(top 10 or so) and $22/hr comes from people I know that still live there. And just like when I was young and starting out, that $22/hr wage is not something you can afford to live on by yourself in that city. At least back then, the gas was cheap, so I could afford to live out in the suburbs and commute almost an hour to work everyday. Although I still couldn't afford to rent a cheap apartment on that income alone.
Important add-on to finding someone that shows up to work on-time and that is being ready to work at the start of their shift.
At this shop we have the issue of techs thinking they’re better than they are. They talk themselves up big in the interview but do not perform when here
I agree that's a very common problem in the industry . Just as big of a problem is owners / managers talking their shop up to a good tech and the place is run like dog sht and they try to f'k the tech on hours every chance they get. It really does go both ways and unfortunately I don't have the answers to fix either issue .
@@johnmilner5485 totally agree with you on that. Every shop has told me the same thing for 17 years…”we’re always busy. NEVER run out of work”
Your shop owner Wes is the man! Thank you for the great content!
A lot of these shops don’t want to pay the money . They rather hire younger techs with no experience or tools . Only to save money on over head , in turn , a mechanic with 10 years experience and 10k worth tools and education is only offered 3 dollars above the minimum wage ?!?!?
Take my advice young guys work at an independent shop till the work feels like repetitive or till you feel you have enough experience to move up . From there move into Heavy line or Apply at the dealership with your experience
I will be making a video on this soon, should I shout out flat rate master on my video ? Stay tuned
Having motivated management is key as well. Lots of owners are either tired of the industry or are only concerned with how they are spending the profits for new things in their personal life. Some owners think you dont need to keep training to keep up with new tech and those guys will wear you down when you are a tech that wants to get better.
Pay well and encourage staff to keep learning if thats what they want to do
yup , i go through this now that we are seeing 2020 and newer cars coming in off warranty I try to keep up with tech and I know my limits of my tools and skills. Most of the customers I have got to know over 20 plus years in one building have been very greatful for my Honesty on my limits.
@@Mac-mu9cs I wish more shops were like that.
I want to thank FRM for giving credit to new guy instead of discrediting his efforts.
No way in hell Id ever go back to being a technician. Degree in auto technology and tons of certs and I couldnt move up from oil changes and tire rotations, even when outperforming my "peers". No thanks.
Lol. Says a lot about you.
@@JamesValentineBaja1000 says a lot about technicians being whiny babies when someone comes in and wants to make money. I’ve never seen so much backstabbing bullshit in my life, by a bunch of people that can’t hold my tools let alone outwrench me.
Great video with lots of common sense. You have to be willing to pay for quality on the one side, and if you want a good wage you have to be willing to do a good job (and everything that entails).
This brings up in my mind a question - how does a qualified and quality tech actually locate a good shop? How to avoid starting at a shop that’s only going to be a disappointment?
Flat rate master,you would be shocked what it’s like here in tn, the dealers pay less than the local Taco Bell, some of the independent shops pay 400 a week with no benefits,contract labor. Needless to say there are a lot of bad techs here lol, customers expect to pay 50 bucks an hour labor rate….., anyway,if your good they will pay thank god. But it to hire an experienced good tech here would require a labor rate that they won’t pay, thus I work alone 12 hrs a day at my shop.
Real sad. That's why I left the automotive field. Between the cost of tools & additional training it's just not worth what the shops are paying. Hopefully they will pay the better techs what they are really worth in a tough field, or they will just go into another field that pays more.
When I left my last shop I was fed up with the guy in charge. Kept wanting more and paying the same rates. Decided one day to just say screw it, I'll finish the vehicles I have tickets on and go find a better shop. Boss never said a word. Just looked back at me in the mirror and said "It's been a hell of a run, enjoy retirement"
i would really like a video of what a shop foreman does. we dont have one in our shop and ive been thinking of maybe making it a thing
I did a short phone interview , offering commission based pay . I asked how is the commission calculated . 17% of weekly billing of your work. I asked about guaranty min pay. He said no. A fluctuating pay like that would hurt.
Its great if they can feed you $8k plus a week and you dont need to buy tools.
WOW! Seventeen percent? They pay new truck drivers more, and our wages have been stagnant for well over 30 years!
@@michaelwright1602 so has this industry. What does it cost to get a CDL these days
The new generation is different than the past generations of older mechanics. Will you said it right of the bat employers expect but few are willing to train up techs and a pleasant work shop , currently the avg length of time is what 2 years . When I started the avg employee length of employment was 20+ years . Manager play a large part in my area we hv a dealer paying 45 an hour and there retention rate is still terrible
I always had trouble working at dealerstip doing 90% of the work, Having to buy 90% of the tools and only get paid 20% of the labor Rate,
here’s the crazy thing i was at a mom and pop shop getting paid 18 dollars an hour for a year didn’t think i was the greatest but saw there was no way to move up there. i’m looking through indeed and a local kia dealer had an add up so i said what the hell might as well see what’s up with it out my resumè in. got a call 5 min after interviewed started at 20 an hour hourly they waited until i was was billing 40+ hours regularly then so about 3 months and then bumped me up to 30 an hour flat rate! been billing 50-70 hours a week (physically there 40) faster forward 3 months they pull me in the office with my service manager and the operations manager tell me i’m the future of the shop and that i’ll be running it as the foreman in about a year and bumped me up to 35 +4 an hour incentive for production/being on time an hour along with getting me master certified by june! long story short this was going to be the last shop i went to before calling the automotive world a failure and going to work at a warehouse, sure glad that didn’t happen! because i thoroughly enjoy doing all types of diag and repair!
Good for you man!
These principles apply to almost ANY profession. It ain't science rocketry. The problem is, almost any profession actually hopes to hire the best / smartest people and then (falsely) convince themselves that these super-smart new hires can not figure out they are getting screwed on pay / benefits / culture. S A D
Our problem now is the managers who are hiring new employees as well as general managers/owners in this industry. The passion potential employees used to have is not the same. Pay rates for exp should not be the same for everyone.
AND you need to pay for experience
@@Mac-mu9cs Sadly, experience often does not equate to competence/expertise. This applies to any type of work.
After 24 years I quit the auto repair industry because the shop managers they were hiring were just our of college with business degrees. They had no idea how to run a shop or how to use techs strengths to increase efficiency in the shop. New techs out of college got paid peanuts but were more qualified to do their job than the managers that were hired for top pay.
FRM always criticizing the labor earning individual. Never the gatekeepers in the office. I get sick of elite POS in the office that take it upon themselves to decide how much a job pays and shift all that available money into the parts because they make more money like that. It's also BS that they make money off the sale of parts I recommend and they call themselves salesman. Not too hard to sell a tire to a person that has a flat. Service writers are sad sacks of crap that should offer their slave more incentive to make that lazy SOB any money.
In germany, in Independent shops, the owner usually is a technocian too and works on the cars, too. Like everyone else. And the paperwork gets done by a secretary or similiar to that.
Guys, as an engineer, I can tell you that automotive technician has morphed into quasi-engineering skills to work on the modern cars. Now don't run out there and advertise your skills or shop services as "engineering" because that is a licensed occupation, but Im just observing that what I do as an engineer ofr the pharmaceutical and general production industries, is very similar. Anything done on the south main auto channel is very similar tom what I do every day, but not on autos, on production lines for anything that is made, just like "how its made" show. When required skills morph into this, it takes a particular type of person to tolerate and gravitate toward it, and you have to pay for that, sorry, but thats how it is, the days of hiring a plumber and having him work on cars is over, sorry.
Omg so right every tech that has contacted me that tells me they can do everything is a parts changer and the A-techs I personally know myself included start out conversations saying “I’m not the best tech in the world” lol. The majority of shops don’t wanna pay for a really good tech but even the ones that do can’t find anyone the job I quit 4 years ago to open my shop still hasn’t replaced me he’s offering 80k salary 100% paid health insurance 8-5 m-f never stays late wrench’s down at 5 no weekends ever friendly environment u don’t have to go 150mph like a dealership
I don’t do a lot of the diagnosing and engine trans rebuilds but since I have been at the dealer I’ve made one call wrong and that’s cause I had 2 waiters at once and service writer asked me to look at one real quick I though it was a truck bed latch but it was the handle but I didn’t really get to look at it
"They want them to show up on time". Or.........show up, period.
Also, agree completely. The pay is, of course, very important. It is what it is in 2023. But, yes, a decent benefits package including good family health insurance is as important or even more important than the pay.
As a new technician my employer started me off on a base salary allowing me to learn the shop. When i was able to bill 40 hrs i was moved to flat rate
Its simple. The amount of knowledge/tools you need vs the amount you get paid is not worth it. Most techs are doing just enough to get by to finally break free of the industry. You are in debt $100,000 in tools and boxes, like my god what a horrible return on your investment! Then you are paid flat rate so you never have a break or if you make a mistake it comes out of your pocket. Don't take my word for it. Go into a shop and see how young most of the techs are, condition of there bodies, are they happy or would they leave? Its designed to make you invest all your money, youth, knowledge only to spit you out a few years later.
Industry seems to be turning around. A good tech that can actually use the 100k tools they have can make over 100k in a year pretty easy if they are paid accordingly per hour
@@germ294 It is turning around but slowly. Everyone always talks about how easy it is to make a lot of money as tech.... where are they? Its a super small percentage, and believe me I am happy for them. This isn't a third world country where we work for peanuts. We are American, there is plenty of money going around and its time we took our share.
This is why I hope once I’m done at my community college for automotive I can find a place that will be willing to train me further. I have a lot to learn and don’t want to start somewhere that expects me to be fast and completely know what I’m doing yet. All the shops in my area really struggling to find any experienced techs and don’t really want to take on new people that need further training. That there is what is really making shops struggle to find workers
Stay away from big chain stores and large new car dealers. Find a smaller used dealer whose reviews for their service dept are good. Thats the places that don't push you into flat rape (not a typo) and will have good seasoned guys to mentor you. I got my first ASE cert in 05, and every day I learn something new. Pick the old guy's brains to every bit they will let you. We've figured out a lot of little hacks that make life easy. I always liked seeing younger guys like you wanting to learn and seeing them grow. Just be sure to be on time everyday with a good attitude and those people will respect you and want to help you. Also, make damn sure you play it safe when you have days off and want to party. All you need to destroy everything you are working on is a DUI. If you're having more than 2 drinks, have a ride lined up ahead of time. These days insurance companies decide who gets the job, not the shop.
@@nickwarner8158 ya chain store is where I currently work at which they treat me really good but been stuck as lube and tire tech cause we only have one tech who does our repairs. Luckily it’s not flat rate at all but pays little less. Been there a year and half so far and have learned lot when we are slow. Definitely don’t gotta worry about partying I rarely drink and have 3 kids take care of. Sadly I’m 33 so little late getting into this field but it’s much more enjoyable that working factories
I’m 10-15 minutes late every single day they knew going in it would be like that I take my kids to school before work but I stay when someone needs to finish a car and I do it every time
I knew it was fucked when i found out that at the dealership i work at , us lube techs are getting paid 14 an hour while our lot porters are getting paid 17 an hour. How do they expect us to pay for thousands of dollars in tools and to have anything to live on with pay like this.
I was the small town kid and they didn’t want to show me or answer the questions I asked. They didn’t even give me a chance and they said nope well the foreman made the executive decision to say no. Now I’m out of the auto industry with a college degree.
New to HVAC after 20 years in the Dealership making way more money now than I ever did before and a way better work environment. Glad I said goodbye. Good luck everyone else.
If you don’t mind me asking. What do you think a Top tech should be paid. A tech that has his own scanner and 4 ch scope and knows how to use it efficiently. shows up on time able to work on anything that comes in the shop and does what ever it takes to get that job done.
I am an older guy who has been working on vehicles my whole life. I can work as hard as anyone I know. I own all the tools any tech would be expected to have. I am getting ready to retire from being an Ironworker. I would like to find a job as a tech in a local shop. With no formal training, but knowing a fair amount about fixing and maintaining everything from heavy equipment to chainsaws, how crazy am I? What should my expectations be?
It would seem to start at the training level. How good are the automotive courses in any particular area? My certificate automotive course on weekends at a local community college was far superior to a associate level automotive course that seemed to have instructors that did not have a lot of experience in the field. I would have been better off in a apprentice program at a shop that was willing to further train me. Back then they were not desperate enough to have those in place. Now that there is a shortage in people willing to work with their hands & in particular the automotive industry (investment in tools vs. rate of pay, etc. makes the situation worse) I could probably pick & choose where I want to work. For me working on trains became a better option. Now that I'm retired from that field I have no regrets. My pleasure these days comes from working on my own cars.
When I went to high school, we used to have auto shop, welding, paint and body, etc... Now, all of that is gone, and has been for nearly 30 years. Many kids could walk out of high school and right into a shop. Not so, few if any could even install a headlamp in a 72 Buick, much less knowing which end of the hammer to use. If they were lucky enough to live on a farm or have a father that liked to wrench, very few young folks have any real world skills, or commonsense.
The cheapest are those one man shops that are owner operated. A shop near me has had the same job post online for a year now looking for a mechanic with 10years experience and only offering $20-$25 an hour not flat rate. In California of all places lol
I just hired a very solid A tech in 5 days. You can get a very quality tech, pay, benefits, culture, Schedule, condition of shop and tools / equipment, etc. all play a factor. Take care of your people as a priority and treat them like a human and they will stay.
Nice Fuel high speed ratchet
Doctors are in the same boat too
Every industry is, many of us old farts are retiring and or getting ready to. The training most folks get in almost every field has gone woke, or is so over burdened with red tape and regulations that they barely function. And then throw in all of the immigrants that are only here for the money, will not learn the language and could care less about much of anything except themselves... Need I go on? Just my own personal observations.
I'm 63 and would like to work as a tech. I'm retiring from a professional job after 29 years. However, i do not want to fully retire. I was taking night classes until Covid-19 and I did an internship at a Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep dealership. I have always enjoyed working on cars and would like to do it until i decide to fully retire. I know it may sound crazy but any suggestions on how to break in to the industry? Thanks DB
Also with my comment I’ve thought of switch to a mom and pop shop but I don’t want it to be the same with the same waste of time from the 4 dealers I’ve been at they have all been the same
I'm a machinist and I can say if you want good machinist that want to learn you have to pay something reasonable
Everyone makes mistakes, doctors have insurance, shop has insurance, tech was told by shop owner just install part xyz. Who gets fired when that job comes backs?
Having a good working Environment is a tough one tho. That's subjective. Not all tradespeople are extroverted. In fact all lot are introverted. But i say being treated fairly, providing coffee and drinks.
For you shop owners stop hiring people with no tools and expecting your other technicians to provide everything they need when sometimes they don't even know how to use tools.
Trust me I'm in that boat! I've even hired techs with 20 years experience and a disaster as well! I've offered competitive pay according to the experience of the tech and cash tips included...the big issue I have is the lack of efficiency and lack of knowledge issue but them wanting to make $30+/hr. It's like I hand them the work and I even help them without having them go through diagnostic part...and they still screw up and always have to catch them doing stupid stuff...oh but they complain that they don't get paid enough cause there jobs take forever to finish. I don't have time to stop and teach the basics while I'm trying to bring more work and deal with the business part of the shop. For that I rather work on my own since I end up having to fix the rest of their repair or comebacks. So I basically gave up, and I'm handling the shop by myself just fine. I just restructured my shop for faster style repair...not those engine overhaul, transmission swaps, etc, and kept my jobs more efficient for myself to still sleep at night. Yes it's more work to keep up with customers, accounting the jobs, but now....less comebacks, less expenses, and I still make money....oh and can sleep at night. All it takes is adapting to it...until someone shows up one day like how I was as a young tech that has enthusiasm to really learn and care about it.
You don't pay enough that's your problem listen to the video boomer. You're not gonna find techs worth shit at $25 an hour
Is there actually any chances for a guy returning to the field with prior years experience as a r&r guy? I’m hopeful that I could find something that just let’s me turn a wrench again but I’m not certified for anything. I was always able to either figure it or if it was something I didn’t understand I would just ask the guys that I worked with for guidance. But that was over 15 years ago. Not sure about now though.
What is the pay for a VW hvt? (High voltage technician). In the Atlanta area?
Your job is what you make it they say. I try uplift service and quality to justify price.
Everyone else want to work at a dumpster and race to the bottom.
I've been professionally turning wrenches for just over a year, before that I spent a lot of time working on my vehicles, working on my friends vehicles, etc. As I sit right now, I consider myself pretty proficient at steering and suspension work (cant recall the last time i didnt beat labor time on steering or suspension work, regardless of vehicle, and especially on American trucks and large SUV's, I pretty regularly cut labor time in half), and middle of the road at diagnosing suspension issues, I prefer to get confirmation from another tech before I say "this vehicle needs this" in most cases. I'm also pretty decent at some heavy line, transmission drops, etc. I want to get into more engine work just to be a little more well rounded, but i dont enjoy it the same way i enjoy steering and suspension and heavy line, and i generally dont beat labor, and honestly i dont do enough of it to get really, really good. Any recommendations for how to get into it?
Steering and suspension flat rate time pay much much better than engine work. Most engine jobs pay less than 10 hours when you knownyou will easily have 20 hours in it. I remember the 80 and early 90s honda head gaskets (had millions of vacuum lines etc) only paid about 4 hours to replace the head....but it paid 1.5 hours to replace an axle....just stupid.
@@86753091974 that’s something I’ve noticed…this morning I had upper control arms & lower ball joints on a Silverado, pays 6.5, I did it quicker than the other tech in the shop doing a oil pan that called for 3 (and he’s a pretty experienced tech, knows what he’s doing).
Toxic shop or moving to a new city are really the only 2 reasons good techs are looking for a new job. Good shops generally pay good techs what they are worth to keep them. I hired 2 of the move in techs on the answer to one question. I called their former employer and asked if they would hire him back if he moved back to their city. The answer was yes and so.... I got 2 good employees....
Good shops that pay techs enough to stay without having to be asked aren't as common as you might think. Good on you for doing so but even the "good" shop I work for right now I had to have more than one meeting with the owner before I was fairly compensated after 5 years being there.
Because in the one shop I ever tried working at that was flat rate the same people got alllllllll the work and made their 70 hours a week EVERY week sometimes 80 while the people outside the clique fought to make 40. Just the way the shop boss handed out the work.
You fail to say how difficult these high tech cars are to fix these days. I was told at school years ago that we were actually on par with engineers. 4 techs were getting out 1 was coming in. Nobody learned a dam thing. You cant expect an assembly line of cars being fixed quickly with hightech problems. Some take extra time to get repaired correctly. Other shops can't fix it. Most shops just care about getting quick money. They don't care about the tech or how difficult the problem is. Disrespecting techs is a big problem. Knocking cars out is not the answer. It makes it sound like your bagging groceries. This is a hightech, difficult, thankless, abusive career to get in to. Don't do it. 40 year GM tech, with 6 dealerships, retired, ASE Master tech with L1 and diesel training. Also have 2 tears in my right rotator cuff, bad knees, can't hear well because of extreme noises throughout career. I paid my dues and now I'm having my say.
Im not sure there is a labor shortage vs a pay shortage.
Right now starting pay in this area for a entry level tech is the same as McDs or HD. No room for buying tools.
As a aging tech , cost of living has out paced my pay considerably and can no longer afford to buy tools. Fun times ahead
I've only been a dealer tech for a year but was a "military tech" for 9 years prior, I try to learn everything I can every second. If we all have that mindset and learn from each other what to do and what not to do we all get money and the shop shines
Managers aren't qualified to hire quality tech's. 🤯 Let alone keep them happy 🙂. Js
Usually, those who you help grow tend to be the ones firing you.
It’s the warranty that’s screwing the techs over. It just doesn’t pay. 90% of cars that come in are a warranty job
What pisses me off as a consumer, I am not a professional mechanic, truck driver, own my own rig. But have had to learn how to wrench due to lack of qualified mechanics.
To my point, when I need work done in a shop, and I am paying upwards of $200 an hour, and find out the techs are making on average $20...
A. That just pisses me off.
B. I know I am going to have to go behind the tech to figure out if he has done the job correctly or fix his screw ups. That has happened one too many times, hence me learning the trade.
C. I will more than likely never go to that shop again. I honestly only know of one shop I would trust in the country, and he is 700 miles away in Griffin GA.
Even a shop I trusted for stuff on my car, I am finding shoddy work there too. More diagnostic tools, I am going to need another tool chest, and shelving. I have four full right now. One is a 72" chest, a stackable and a top unit... I hope you guys get your industry together.
Hey Is the newest guy older ?
The young guys don’t work full weeks and always late . I’m just telling you what happens in my shop.
hey bud thats your shop. im a 26 yr old tech on my fucking job. I work fleet and I'm a top performer with 90% efficiency all these other snowflakes my age my foot is on their neck. I'm leaving pretty soon to ford/lincoln so I can move to the heavy line otherwise ill be a oil and tire for 20 years like all these older guys if i stay fleet. A fucker like me could do this 12-16 a day like its nothin. My dad waited an hour before his shift started at work so I did too.
✌
How old was the guy you let go? Maybe he was inexperienced and was just getting started. Could of been better I’m sure
👍👍👍👍🔥🔥🔥
Some techs are near 40hr and are absolute trash
FRM 😀😊😀👍🏼
Nothing surprises me anymore... however today's technician's surprise me is showing up Early! Not on Time.
Or they pay well and then feed all the crap to the new guy. Been there done that.
So here's my situation. And I really don't know if I should speak up or not. Really could use someone's opinion on the matter to know if I'm tripping or not.
The other day I noticed my co mechanic got some bolt on ball joints on an old camry and got paid 3.2 for the job. Crazy out of the roof labor for like 30 minutes of work. Today I get 2 pressed in lower ball joints and two bolt on ball joints on a lincoln totalling 4 hours which is normal. Should I feel some type of way or should I just continue wrenching, minding my own business even though that's bothering the fk out of me. And this isn't the first occasion, I've caught them plenty of times changing the labor numbers. This also makes him look more productive than me even though he's under me and I'm constantly having to help him through jobs.
I feel like this happens everywhere and pushes mechanics out, i know i feel some type of way and ready to leave. I also don't want people to think I don't want him to eat, because he's a hell of a worker but come on. Sorry for my rant.
I would find a better shop to work at or even working on trucks or maybe even on trains. I could not work at a dishonest shop that rips people off. How would you like it if it was someone you knew being ripped off?
Just wondering was the book labor time for the bolt on ball joints correct? As in thts what there book time calls for. If so than I wouldn't be upset tht they got what it pays. Yes it sucks watching guys get gravy work while you're getting the rest of what's left. But tht shouldn't be the other guys fault but the blame should be on the manager for not distributing the work more fair.
Ngl I stepped away from this industry cause of similar things happening with flat rate (which unlike the frm, I personally think flat rate should be abolished.) Happier ever since making tht choice, and can still work on cars for cash on the side. Being a mechanic or tech doesn't hold you to just a shop, we got a skill tht others can't do. And ppl will hire someone to work on there car for cheaper than a shop would cost. Keep your head up man.
If your going by book labor you have to know what the book labor is, 3.2hrs sounds more like a control arm labor cost. If your working flat rate just make sure your getting the correct labor time for what you do. As long as the hours are spread evenly and the work load is even distributed amongst liked skilled tech just log your hours....now if this same guy is getting all the gravy thats another issue in itself.
Probably cause they don't want to pay a fair wage for a Techs time.
Thats some dirty stuff this same shop pushed u out because you're filming from home now...
we need to find writers that actually want to sell also, not idiots that dont even try to sell and just tell you to pull the car out and say the customer doesn't want anything when in reality all they did was sit on their ass for 10 mins. Dealer life sucks.
You also need to make it clear to the tool truck guys if you try and poach my technicians for other shops you'll be banned from here
You may want to look into why they are leaving in the 1st place. just a thought
Pay does not mean good techs
High pay doesn’t mean quality work or attendance
Yeah, it does; 50% of flat rate works! ($120. an hour for shop, $60. an hour for tech!