KERDI Shower Pan Mistakes and How You Can AVOID Them
Vložit
- čas přidán 14. 05. 2024
- This video shares KERDI shower pan mistakes and how you can avoid them. For more tips and tricks visit homerepairtutor.com
#howto #diy #bathroomremodel
KERDI Shower Pan Mistakes and How You Can Avoid Them
0:01 KERDI shower pan mistakes
0:24 Shower pan framing mistakes
0:52 How to sister new floor joists
1:10 Plywood subfloor installation
1:50 How to cut KERDI shower pan
3:26 How to extend KERDI shower pan
4:23 How to apply thin-set mortar to plywood
5:06 What trowel to use for KERDI shower pan
6:11 How to waterproof KERDI shower pan
These supplies were used in our video:
-KERDI Shower Pan 48" x 72"
-Schluter ALL-SET Mortar
-KERDI Trowel
-KERDI-BAND
-KERDI-KERECK
Some product links may be Amazon affiliate links. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases at no additional cost to you.
Want our newest DIY videos? Subscribe to our channel and hit the notification bell to see every upload. We upload new videos every Saturday.
Disclaimer:
Videos produced by Home Repair Tutor are provided for informational, educational, & entertainment purposes only. Some of these projects, materials, and techniques may not be appropriate for all ages or skill levels. Home Repair Tutor does not make any claims of the safety of the projects, techniques, or resources listed on this site and will not take responsibility of what you do with the information provided by this site. Viewers must be aware by doing DIY projects on their homes they are doing it at their own risk and Home Repair Tutor cannot be held liable if they cause any damage to their homes. Home Repair Tutor cannot claim liability with all applicable laws, rules, codes and regulations for a project. - Jak na to + styl
I’ve seen many videos say the thin set isn’t water proof allowing water to Penetrate under the KERDI Membrane or penetrate into the subfloor.
Unfortunately those videos are misleading. The creator typically bashes Schluter for two reasons. Before I continue, I want to say that I'm not paid by Schluter. Some times I accept free materials if my client is already using the Schluter system. And I pass those materials on to my clients at no charge, so I don't make money. With that out of the way, here's how Schluter works. The thin-set (using ALL-SET as an example) bonds to the fleece of the KERDI pan and the fleece on the KERDI-BAND or prefab corners. If the thin-set is applied with the proper trowel and has the proper consistency, the mortar will anchor into the fleece. As the thin-set mortar cures, more crystals anchor into the fleece layers. These crystals create a physical barrier that literally makes the water molecules too big to pass through.
The key is this, because the fleece layers are impermeable and ALL-SET is modified thin-set, you need to allow the thin-set to cure based on temperature and humidity. For instance, if you live in Florida and the shower is installed in the summer, I'd allow the thin-set to cure for 24 to 48 hours at a minimum. But if you live in Pittsburgh and install the shower in January, the temperature is low and the humidity is probably low. So the shower can likely be flood tested 24 hours after completion.
It's sad, but a lot of those CZcams videos that bash Schluter do not discuss these principles. Additionally, you come to find out the CZcamsr making the video is sponsored by another waterproofing company. For instance, they might bash Schluter then you see them sponsored by Tile Redi or HYDRO-BLOK. Yet the CZcamsr doesn't disclose this. Thus, I feel it's misleading and inserts fear into the viewer on purpose just to make the person want to watch the video. Keep all that in mind when you see videos bashing any waterproofing product.
@@HomeRepairTutor thanks.
I got the 1/8 x1/8 trowel to use and I'm going to make sure to mix well add the amount of water for doing the membrane making sure to cover all bases with the schluter product so I should be ok.
All my walls are plum and level.
May I ask is it ok to use another water proofing product over the kerdi board so not to take a chance or it's not recommended .
I see so many people doing it but I'm not sure?
What so dam confusing is I'm looking at people who've been doing it a long time that are having problems.
This stuff isn't cheap either.
@@HomeRepairTutor what youtuber ?
I did this at my home 9years ago. Had never used it before and it was great. Zero leaks and its a complex shower with multiple body sprays, rain heads, steam, speakers and lights.
That’s terrific 🙌🏼🔥🙌🏼🔥
Great video, thanks Jeff!
Thank you 🙏🏼 hopefully it’s helpful.
Good stuff ! Thank you 🙏🏿
❤️❤️❤️
Schluter sponsored my workshop which was awesome. Hotel , meals and happy hour paid in full. I still float traditional fat mud...deck mud showers but info and prep key.
🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
Thanks again for all these great and informative videos! Before I install my Schluter shower tray, I'd need to replace a 40"x36' rotten subfloor. Does it matter if the grain of the plywood is parallel to the joists as opposed to perpendicular?
I thought since plywood is cross laminated and each layer is of different direction and this is just a small area, it should not matter much. Please advise, Thx!
It’s best practice to have the plywood grain be perpendicular to the floor joists. And it’s critical to have the joist span follow the Schluter Handbook, eg 16” on-center with 3/4” plywood. To me it’s worth the time to make the plywood as sturdy as possible. The screw size and schedule are also important
Another great video! Something I have wondered about before is while installing kerdi fabric or kerdi band, how much of the thinset do you squeeze out with the drywall knife? Obviously you want it embedded nicely. But do tou think it's best apply a lot of pressure or go over it multiple times to get everything you can out, or to go a little more lightly?
Thank you 🙏🏼 when I embed the thin-set I try to express out just enough to get the banding flat, but not more. Mixing ALL-SET to the membrane consistency (8 quarts of water per 50 lb bag) and using the right trowel make the waterproofing so much easier
Great video! I have seen you rip off the 3/4 inch off the perimeter in previous videos, as you mentioned its flat. Im still confused though..... by ripping off the perimeter 3/4 first and then removing say 5 inches off each side and then reinstalling the 3/4 inch is it not at a higher elevation being that the pan is sloped, meaning that butting into the now more narrow and thinner pan this 3/4 inch strip is now abruptly taller leaving almost a step as opposed to a smooth gentle slope?
You’re correct, there’s a height difference. I feather that difference with ALL-SET, let it cure, and then band it. Because the 3/4” perimeter and tray create a seam, I’ll use a custom piece of KERDI to waterproof it to accomplish the two inch overlap
Hello Jeff, Can I put another 1/2" plywood over the 3/4 subfloor then install the pan. It give more support I thinks.
Hey Jeff, THANK YOU so much for the detailed info and excellence your videos are about!! I'm 2 inches short on one side of the pan and I have 2 extra inches on the other side. Can I "extend" the shorter side with my 2 extra inches of shower pan and then water proof it to avoid using the dry pack mortar?
Hey Chris, thank you! Send me an email at jeff@homerepairtutor.com along with a few pictures of your shower pan. That way, I can see what you’re dealing with and can give you some ideas
@@HomeRepairTutor really? You’re awesome!! THANK YOU for helping a total stranger!! I’m done for the day but I’ll be back tomorrow
Thanks for all the great videos. I have started a complete gut and remodel of my master bath (my daughters room). Im using kerdi for the first time and have worked hard to make my studs plum. im now ready to set the kerdi board and pan. my shower is 4.5' x 38" including curb. would one 50 lb bag of all set be what id need to mix to set the pan and curb? Also i plan to wall tile to the far edge of the curb so should i meet my kerdi board and sheetrock in the center of the curb and then use kerdi band on that seam? that would allow me to cover that seam with tile and cover the kerdi band also. is this how you would do it? i plan to joing your website.
Thank you and sounds like you have a great project. Based on your shower pan footprint, I'd mix about 25 pounds of Schluter ALL-SET with 4 quarts of water for the pan and curb. Schluter recommends using 7.5 to 8.5 quarts of water for a 50lb of ALL-SET. Thus, to mix a half bag, I weigh 25 pounds, add 4 quarts of cold/clean water to the bucket, and add the ALL-SET to cut down on the dust. Then mix it per the directions, e.g. 5 minutes of mixing, 10 minutes of slaking (sitting) and 3 minutes of mixing. Then use a 1/4" x 3/8" square notched trowel to set the pan and curb. I can send you additional videos of all that to help out.
As for where to end the waterproofing. If you can end the board outside the shower, that's preferable. Here's why, I like to bond the board to the curb and waterproof those transitions with banding and the prefab corners. Again, I have lots of videos on all that as well and would be happy to explain further based on your specific project. If the banding extends beyond the tile I feather it with Setting Type Joint compound (first coat) because it dries harder than premixed joint compound. Once it's feathered, you can prime and paint the joint compound.
Hope all that helps but let me know your questions.
@@HomeRepairTutor my shower is actually 4.5’ X 36” plus the 4” curb. So 40”. I plan to cut the curb height down and use kerdi fix and band to seal it.
I’ve watched all your stuff but can’t find anything about using mud and paint over kerdi band. I ask someone else and they advised not to but I trust you. I’ll runs it to the edge flush with curb then use kerdi band to join with Sheetrock. Mud over that with what kinda mud? Then I can paint over that. If you had a video would be sweet. I have a premade niche so I framed for it. I hope my figures are correct. Didn’t want to try to cut and add it after I start tile. I’m using 12x24” tile vertical in shower walls so I think I’ll be ok.
Thank you for your great videos. I am in the process of my first shower renovation and have followed much of your advice. I have a question regarding my Kerdi pan. While dry fitting it, I stepped on it and cracked the Styrofoam. The membrane itself is fine and the foam backing is still smooth. Would it be OK to still use this or should I replace it? Also, I used GoBoard for the walls and painted over the GoBoard sealant with Red Guard. Can I use Schluter thin set (which is modified) over Red Guard when laying the tile?
I’m not sure about that cracked foam, I’d call Schluter technical support and see what they say. Wish I could help a bit more on that question. You should be able to tile over the RedGard with modified thin-set. What kind of tile are you setting?
@@HomeRepairTutor 12x24" 1/4" porcelain tile. Red Guard says you need a polymer-based modified thinset and GoBoard can use any kind. So will the Schluter work? Thanks!
@@CosmoKramer5B Schluter ALL-SET is modified thin-set mortar, you can use it for the large format tiles. The correct trowel size is the one that provides 95% thin-set coverage. Either a 1/4” x 3/8” square notched or 1/2” x 1/2” square notched trowel would be a good place to start.
I personally like using redgard or hydra ban. With a drypack bed. It's never failed me.
Curious whether it would make sense adding redguard on top if the kerdi membrane
Same question
here's another tip mostly for homeowners but contractors sometimes think they don't need to. Read the instructions slowly, carefully and follow them especially if you think you know what they entail. What a simple mistake that would be if a manufacture comes out with a revised product.
Great tips 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Jeff, Schluter recommends 1/2” square trowel for the shower pan but you recommend 1/4” !!!
No, they recommend a 1/4” x 3/8” square or u-notched trowel on page 24 of the Installation Handbook, here’s the link resources.schluter.com/media/psi/lowes/Shower%20System%20Installation%20Handbook.pdf
@@HomeRepairTutor i must have mistaken, but that 3/4 tip is amazing, appreciated jeff
1/4 by 3/8s actually.
Hello mate, what brand of pants you have on, cool pockets
I like Duluth Trading DuluthFlex pants
Do you have any experience laying porcelain tile from China.
Any problems with it or is the quality okay?
From reputable company, but I only have used italian porcelain before! Thanks
It’s hard to say, I feel like tiles are all problematic in some way. I always want to see the tiles in person to assess the mesh (mosaics), edges, and if possible how it will score and snap
@@HomeRepairTutor
Excellent advice, thank you for the reply!
I am assuming that it is made in China is not much of an issue for tile.
can i install a shower schluter pan on a shower that has already a shower curb installed? instead of doing a mud bed the pan looks easier since the floor is leveled. but since there is a shower curb installed i was wondering if the thin-set has to squish out of the schluter pan ? or do i have to leave a 1/8 gap on the pan so the excess thin-set can come out?
Can you clarify the project a bit more? Are you trying to install a new Schluter pan to concrete or over an existing shower pan made of dry pack?
I normally tear out all of the old shower, including the curb. That way, I can design the shower based on the tile I’m using and be 100% sure it’s properly waterproofed.
If I set my Kerdi Shower tray with the Kerdi Trowel, do you foresee any issues with adhesion later on?
Did you already set your tray?
When you tile your floor and walls, which do you do 1st? Opinions seem evenly split on this. I would like to do my floor 1st because i need that extra little bit of height for my full tiles to work out to the ceiling. Your videos are great! Thank you!
Thank you 🙏🏼 I set the floor first and leave an expansion joint at the backer board, about 1/16 to 1/8 inch. Then I protect the tile floor with Ram Board and tile the walls. Again, I leave a 1/16 to 1/8 inch joint between the tile floor and tile walls 👍🏼
Would it be ok to set a shower tray first before putting up membrane andthen using kerdi band ?
I agree logically the kerdi membrane will have a natural overlap
What do you recommend for the curb? I'm only a young architect
These days I mostly use 2 inch KERDI-BOARD to build custom curbs
Wait, when you reuse the 3/4" edges aren't you creating a new weak point in the shower pan, and a potential leak? I thought the whole point of a shower pan was to be a solid base.
I second this question!
The kerdi band will cover this and seal it.
Now I want a Wendy's Frosty
Haha, me too. Every time I mix thin-set that’s all I can think about
I wish I had the courage 😩😩
🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
Every KERDI install just looks wrong from the basic perspective of layering a water proof membrane.
In every non KERBI install the floor is installed first, then the walls… for obvious reasons.
Why not with KERBI? The mortar used isn’t waterproof.
The first thing you need to understand is how the system works. The waterproofing occurs when thin-set is between two layers of fleece. The thin-set mortar anchors into the fleece layers. And as time passes, the mortar crystals grow. The crystals continue to anchor into the fleece and create a matrix so tight that the water molecules are too big to pass through.
@@HomeRepairTutor With these "dynamic" materials, are they proven to last? I would be worried about anything with a chemical change occurring over time. It's a lot of trust in this system, though apparently it works!
@@HomeRepairTutor haha- keep drinking the schlueter kool aid ! sounds like ou took one of their greta marketing/training sessions all expenses paid plus lots of swag. two water permeable materials do NOT make up[ a non permeable system without a chemical reaction CHANGING one of both materials. The fleece doesnt change and the thin set all set doesnt interact chemically with the fleece. If you want a waterproof joint use Verdi fix BUT schlueter america does NOT encourage this correct way as its TOO expensive nd they want their already overexpensiev products system to competecinnunrqeulated use market-this set is OT allowed in EU, Why ? ITS NOT waterproof !! You have to have a really messed up install with any system even DIY fro visible water damage leaks to appear in even 5 years let alone 1 year. Good luck getting builder or shouter to help you then. Verdi fix is a great product, schlueter drains are excellent (tho some are better), but the way it attaches their leaking fabric with mortar is not the way to create a 50 year shower.
dafuq is curty shower pan. we do concrete son
That's one option, but still requires skill and understanding of how the principles and methodologies work so the shower will perform. Thus, in that sense, KERDI and concrete are similar - you still need skills for both and attention to detail.
@@HomeRepairTutor correct which bis ERXCTLY why you should use a liquid waterproofing mebeerane like Hydroban, 3 coats.