Renault Zoe 52 kWh range test
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- čas přidán 31. 10. 2019
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I have the previous version of the ZOE (ZE40). To preheat the battery you need to be plugged in and program a departure time in the car. The car will preheat the battery to 15degrees, makes a huge difference in winter range.
Good advice!
7:39 one does not simply...suggest charging stations to Bjørn Nyland.
The OBD Port is now on the A pillar where you open the front bonnet.
So same as every car before 2017 lol
@@charliek9394 No, my car has its OBD port between the 2 front seats, in the mid console, just behind the cup holders, and my car is build in 2005 !
Yeah. My Megane 2 has the obd near the cup holder in front of the gear knob... 🤦
Please Bjorn, post a range comparison table at the end of the video, for all the EV u have ever range tested. So people can compare the real world range of different EV much more easily.
Vince W Maybe this will help: ev-database.org/
At the bottom of the page, they have country versions for Germany, the Netherlands, and UK
As soon as you can, try de Peugeot e-208 please !
e208 has only 7KMH to recharge
7KWH is the power to recharge for alternatif current, type 2.
Zoe is 22 KWH
The time to recharge dépend on this valeur.
@@AHD270 KW not KWH, guys...
SUMNERify in some countries, the e-208 will be sold with an optional 11 kW charger. DC charging is 100 kW though compared to only 50 kW for the Zoe
ev-database.org/car/1168/Peugeot-e-208
@@chrisobber5604 *kW and kWh. It's kilowatt and kilowatt-hours. Not kelvinwatt and kelvinwatt-henrys.
I have the old Zoe ZE40 and I drove it at 100-110kmh for 190km with -1 degrees outside (20km range left in the end). So it definitely got quite a bit better.
100-110km/h makes a huge impact compared to 95km/h in the old zoe. The consumtion will rise significant above 95km/h.
@@kleincamper 95kmh odometer/90kmh GPS!
@@kleincamper Yeah for sure but the new Zoe's battery is also only slightly bigger and the car is now heavier, so I don't expect that much
Nice yet another Renault Zoe 50 test 👍🏻 the Zoe is still a nice car here in the Netherlands for people who want to buy it them self (not a company or lease car) good pricing new and second hand. Cold weather and EV cars I hope one day they can ‘fix’ it the range drops like a rock even on my Ioniq I noticed this week it’s cold ish here in Holland now.
The more Zoe / affordable EV cars test the better Bjørn 😇
Keep up the great work you do for us and the 🌎
Fabio Marzola Tesla Model 3 for sure
Re battery size, need to know that when charged to the max Zoe takes round 20-25 km to get from 100 to 99% and then when it reaches 0% it can still drive another 25km. In total round 50km which on average translates to 7.5 Kw and thats the difference.
I'm no longer sure whether I still watch Bjørn to test Norwegian fast EV's or to test Norwegian fast food :-)
Please do the 1000km challenge with new Zoe :D
up
With that car could be a nightmare xD
1000km PITA Challenge
He already did. (Now @ January 18 2020)
On the previous Zoe, there could be a couple of kWh between 99 and 100%. Sometimes up to 3 or 4. Might be something to check next time.
That's a BMS error.
That's odd. I definitely get a full 41 kwh from my ZE40. I do find the range drops off quite a lot in cold weather but I am in south of the UK so temperatures below 0 degrees C are fairly unusual.
Why don't all car makers add the Battery Temp on the Display's screen? Even Tesla, VW, Merc, Audi don't......also why not show Percentage and KM range together while charging?
mrlintonious . I’m almost certain my Kona E shows the percentage and Km range, I’ll check.
Yup, it does. When you get into the car and it’s charging, it shows only for about 10 seconds ; rate of charge, length of time until completion, Km range, and the percentage in the battery.
Battery Temp and how much juice (kW) it is taking from the charger.
You usually don't want to bombard the consumer with too much information/clutter, but they could add an option for it.
that is uninteresting stuff for everyone outside of the bubble.
Hardly.. most cars have detailed info like that for fossil fuel engines etc.
SOC might not be linear in energy (Wh) but in electric charge (Ah). As voltage drops when you empty the battery you would get out more energy out of the top percentage points than the percentage points at the bottom. Some people claim it is that way in the Ioniq, but I have not measured it myself.
You definitely made the right choice! Cinnamon, caramel and chocolate are the best.
I ordered one yesterday :)
Just watched this video again with interest. There's a lot of discussion at the moment in the UK with regard to the Zoe's usable capacity now that more cars are coming online, will you be doing some summer testing at all?
The cold weather does affect the available capacity, but also the first Zoés have a "faulty" BMS. I got mine checked today and it was giving a SoH of 94%. I got the car in January so it was an early version. I got it updated and the garage told me I now have 100% SoH. This should help me going from 47 to 52 kWh available and from 350 to 400 km of range during the summer with a consumption around 13 kWh/100 km.
If you get your hands on a new Seat Mii electric some kind of video about it would be very great!
From my experience. 99-> 100% charging and 100->99% driving (~10km) correspond to about 3% charge energy / range.
I think the Zoe uses air from the cabin heater/ac to help the battery. If you don't use heating the battery temp can drop.
The OBD port is in the left foot area. The tools for the older Zoes don't work, the ZE50 uses a new protocol.
Which OBD 2 do you use how much data does it show ?
@@ksteSFSintec Selfbuilt solution using Raspberry Pi and MCP2515 based CAN-interface. github.com/EVNotify/EVNotiPi
Still in development, requires testing. Provides basic data like voldtage, power, soc and temps.
I really want one of these but I’ll need to wait for a second hand one $$$
Also my first time driving one of these today.
It seems that thermal management of the battery is the most important factor in the design of an EV. Surely other makers could have learned from Tesla?
Well Renault wants to learn from Tesla, but they have to sell a cheap car like the Zoe... It's not the same as the Model 3, and also they want to save much money as possible because it's a Zoe of course... It's like a 9.000€ ICE version....
Yes, Tesla's superb care of the batteries is something all other EVs builders must learn or just copy. Using simple air cooling is like cooling a combustion engine only with air like 40 years ago in VW Beetle, Fiat 500, Simca 1000
Many of the cars Bjørn is testing have a tendency to gravitate towards Bolleland for 'energy charging' 😅
Bjørn Nyland have you checked the car manual for the OBD2 port? Maybe bellow the steering column? It has to be in a easy do access place!
Bjorn please make also the 120kph consumption/range test
That'll turn out even worse, I guess around 200km.
I love the interior of the new Zoe. Shame the car is so small...
The white E-soul looks nice. The Zoe doesn't look much smaller side by side, at least on video.
Unfortunately here in Brazil this new version has no forecast coming
Darn pretty disappointed in range. Can you do a test on a hot day? Australia gets the Zoe 50 around June next year and I want to get an idea of summer range! So far it seems a Kona EV 2nd hand will be a similar price ($55k AuD) so might be a better option.
Great video btw!
Bjorn, in Romania the new Zoe seems to be available either as ZE40 or as ZE50. So maybe you had a ZE40 version for testing?
I think the range is good if you consider the temperature and the price. Also the Zoe is a city car and I like that it's now more highway- and winter-capable than before.
Would be interesting if
Bjørn could post a price of this model!(without incentives!)
+300k norsk kr
A city car would not need that range however in my opinion. Alot of first time buyers are only looking for EV's and cant afford a more expensive car. So they might consider a Zoe. I know I did.
@@MortenHolje The same goes for me :) the Zoe is a perfect city car which is still able to carry 5 persons and has a nice range for longer trips
@@Flyfan24 congrats with the purchase! Trying out myself on Monday.
Saw another Zoe test today and the tester said that Renault claims approx 150 mile range in cold weather. Your test seems to verify that point
I was curious about that car weight station. We don't have those in the UK for cars. They're just for goods vehicles here
will you be getting the Polestar 2 sometime soon?
Damn I was really hoping to get the new Zoe, but it seems that with the price bump, and now this it won't be as compelling. (I live en DK) hope you can test the e-208 soon :)
Were you using the a/c or heater ? ; in the Smart For Two Ev using either decimates the range in the winter by at least 1/3 and who wants to travel further yet be freezing cold?
@Bjørn Nyland i did a test today on my Renault Zoe 2019 and was very surprised...Charged at a station that gave 22kw and paid 22.80 SEK and charged for 22mins and 26 seconds and got 7.6kwh...then i went to another station that i could charge the car with a 43kw charger the exact same time but got only 7.27kw and paid 43.19 SEK. so this second charger that claims to charge my battery double as fast not only lied about the charging speed and also got little less kw but also i paid double the amount of money...i would understand paying double amount of money if the charging speed would be double as fast!
Zoe 2019 (ZE40) can not charge faster than 22kW. So it is a perfectly correct number for the 43kW charger.
The real bummer is when you get to a charger station with a cold battery (like
Hi Bjorn. Can you do a 1000km challenger with a Model 3 SR+? How do it compare with the LR? Thanks
!
+1
That’s a great idea 👍
Oui bonne idée !
Have just read article in UK motoring magazine where Renault claims only 150 miles (240 Km) in winter driving, so your figure exceeds this. Re the undefined parasitic loads, how much does the aircon draw to keep the car warm? Enjoyable and informative video BTW.
Earlier ZE 50 Zoe's need a BMS update, my Zoe was thinking the SOH was down to 82%, and now after the update its SOH 99,8%
Liquid Battery Management is a must have, thx for the Test Bjorn
Actually, no. It really does depend on how fast you charge and discharge the battery. The Zeo with it's maximum 22 kW charge power us not really siited for liquide cooling, if anything, it would hurt its overall economy ;D.
Zoe has always suffered from the cold. I remember getting only about 85km at about -5 deg C in the original 22 kWh model. Heat pump was very slow to warm up the cabin too, you had to dress warmly in a Zoe!
The heat pump on my 22 kWh Zoe was great. Just don't put in on Eco mode, it will drastically decrease the output of the heater.
how about the very recent factory recall/delivery stop due to mandatory software upgrade for all new Zoes? Has it been done for yours ?
The BMS update hasn't needed to be done from ZE40 models or above.
So it was you.. :P Taught i saw you when i drove past Autoria, but i was not sure. :)
I believe, nothing is wrong with the battery nor anything else. A range is depending on the style you drive, speed, road type (hilly, flat) and outside conditions (e.g. temperature, where electricity consumption is much more), + drive on Eco mode or without. We have Zoe for the last 2 years. On the motorway, with 120km/h, we can do only about 150km. Whereas, in the city with Eco could go up to 300km (possibly, even more, never tried to do only city) with one charge.
When Peugeot E-208l?
Interesting fact
Renault is probably one of the few big car companies (possible the only one, but I believe other french brands are doing the same) which got into the EVs market using a relatively old motor design which is the brushed electrically excited synchronous motor. All the other big players, Tesla, VW, Porsche, Toyota, Nissan, BMW, Jaguar, Hyundai (most likely chinese brands as well) are using brushless Permanent Magnet (PM) sychronous motor in their powertrain. Not sure if the new 2020 Zoe is still using the brushed design, but definitevely older version did. The small Twizy is equipped with it.
The brushless PM-excited designs are better for performance point of view (torque/power density, efficiency) due to the fact that the field is produced by a magnet rather than electromagnet (losses /overtemperature / bigger volume). And we do not have the problem of the consumption of the critical brushes (some failures were reported in older Zoes).
For cost point of view, the brushed electrically-excitated designs have clear advantages (Rare Earth magnets are very expensive and price suffes of instability, being mainly sourced from China). Another advantage is higher rotor overheating capability since no magnets are used. Definetively a surpassed technology in traction machine, but "if it works (for this specific application) why not".
The brushed electrically excitated sychronous machines are still a big players in the lowest class of 48V mild-hybrid architecture...and of course in electrical power plants.
The Zoe is one of the few EVs capable of charging off three phase mains. Is there a relationship with the motor controller in some way?
@@PaulMansfield No, because you have to charge in DC and controlled way the battery anyway (like all the other competitors), with 3-phase you can deliver simply more power in an efficient way. If other competitors want, they could do the same easily but I guess they know the the majority of home do not have 3-phase supply (in Italy typical energy residential contract is 1-phase 3kW, switch to 3-phase is normally above 6kW).
Motor controller is based on the same logic of the other competitors using synchronous machines (closed-loop space vector control), the difference is that in the Renault's electrically-excited design you have one more degree of freedom given by the DC rotor excitation current.
hi ,could you please redo this test when you can as iam considering a zoe50 and would really like to know does it defiantly have a 52kwh useable or less? my Renault dealer says it defiantly has 52Kwh useable but your test seems to say different. Thank you .
If you had driven south you had got less elevation and higher temperature. Under 10 degrees Celsius you got lower range, as I already experienced this year with my Tesla based RAV4 EV. Tested the same car 2 weeks ago and the salesman said normal range winter time is 250 km .
Nice car , but how about the Peugeot e-208 ,will you review that EV because it looks better than than Zoe and seems like a good cheap EV for the masses .
Great video man , keep it up !!
Peugeot is having a lot of problems with the e208, and the Zoe has more range and it's less expensive, more than 30k for a tiny Pug and probably with issues is too expensive. Greetings.
Any news on the Mini Cooper SE?
Great review. There's a LOT of lies about REAL autonomy/ range... Car manufacturers are now lying about ranges the same they do with fuel average mileages
We have Zoe with special low-friction tyres here, and in the vid Bjorn shows snow tyres, the worst to me ... huge difference in friction between both, am i wrong ? Could explain part of the loss ?
I think that it was a combination of cold weather effect plus the additional drag of winter tyres. As others have said Zoe is a good city car.
I think the battery was cold. In that case I am not surprised that you could get only 42kWh of juice after charging 50kWh. This is typical energy drop of Li ion chemistry. At 0 degree Celcius you get only 90% of the capacity. This number depends on each chemistry (which is unknown of this new model). I am sad that my former colleagues of Renault did not succeed in convincing the top management to add « cold weather features » (battery heating system) for Norwegian market (which is a huge market for EVs).
To view charge % and remaining charge time you have to lock the car.
OBD port is above the left footrest ;)
hey man don't you have the range test of mg zs ev
Hey Bjørn, this is an old video, but I hope you still follow the comments :) I checked a couple of "Zoe range" test videos, and I believe the problem with the calculation is that Zoe only shows the consumption of the drivetrain but not the whole car. So heating/cooling is excluded. Because all warmer "range tests" has higher "usable battery capacity". Your is the lowest, so if we investigate the picture from a little distance, the only difference between the tests is the temperature. What do you think about this?
That can't be correct.
Lots of Renault Zoé in France. A nice and good enough city car, but not designed for long trips apparently. 😀
Try to charge 100%. in my ev makes big diference in range.
Try your hands on Tata Nexon electric. Range 312kms
How long did it take to recharge?
Was there any fault with this perticular car? 42 kWh sounds bad.
How much iss top speed of the Zoe? And how long could we go if we go Pedal to the Metal?
Zoe (40) and 22 were limited to about 135km/h..
I noticed the 99% SoC is a "windows 99%" and is actually more like 95%. It's stuck on it a long time and it will add >30km range going from 99% to 100%. Much more than 98% > 99%.
Still very good range for a city car.
My new ZOE R135 ZE50 is now 6 months old, driven about 4.700 km has an actual range of about 260 km - sunny weather, no wind, flat streets, speed 100 km/h, outside temperature 17 °C, batterie-temperature 20 °C.
SoH - contolled by dealership is 82,7 % - cell-voltages are nearly identical 9-11 mV difference - nothing wrong to see about damaged cells.
RENAULT daily advertising is "This is how electric mobility works today" - Waiting for answer of RENAULT Germany - where my 395 km range is ...
Hi
Bjørn I don't think it is faulty either, its part of the software protecting the Battery 5% is really 10%. Also the difference between SOC & SOH + 2 degrees celsius is about 15-20% lose in thermal efficiency. I think this batteries Air based thermal management is crap, useless. Liquid cooling is better we've known this since WWII.
In the brochure i received from Autoria in Ski it says "Bruktkapasitet(used capacity) 52 KW". I asked the salesman and he sad that the real capacity is closer to 60KW. What do u think about this Bjørn?
czcams.com/video/uQvnEso4mUA/video.html
@@bjornnyland My mistake. It actually says KWh. Again, where is the rest of the power?
@@bjornnyland Normally 1% of battercharge should equal to about 3.3 km. It looked like u added 6km of range while the battery capacity was still showing 99% and it was still charging. Can there be a hidden buffer there?
E208 and E2008 please we need some real world numbers for these cars.
Fair guess about the battery and winter. You will just have to drive faster :-)
Bjorn, do you know for sure that Ionity reports kWh before the charger losses ?
Why is it so much to ask for a smoothly working infotainment system? I mean, for a couple hundred euros you can have a very smooth ipad or any other tablet, why are car manufacturers so bad at it? I cannot imagine it creates huge cost benefits if you put shitty CPU/GPU/RAM in there. Especially, if you do put a slow system the car just feels so much cheaper (or so much more valuable when the system is smooth..). These systems really look like they were designed in 2010 or something with the laggy zooming on maps and input lag when you touch the screen. Anybody care to explain? Even costly non-EV Audi's or Mercedes still have laggy infotainment systems...
Economies of scale, 1 euro saved on 100.000 cars starts to make sense for the accountants.
UI design is actually really really difficult. There's a reason almost every phone/tablet uses either iOS or Android - software that has already been designed and optimized over decades. It's very difficult to create such a thing from scratch.
That does not excuse these car companies of course, in the end the ultimate reason is to save money, but it isn't just a few hundre euros is what i'm saying.
@@bubberlad interesting. thanks for sharing
80% of the battery in more than one hour: this is the main problem. There will be more and more fast charger > 100kw, even in cities (see for example the plan for corri-door 2 in France). This is the new minimum for all cars. Not so important to increase the battery capacity if you can charge very fast.
My 24kw nissan leaf 2014 does 0.9 miles per % when outside temperature is above 6 degrees Celsius below that it drops to 0.6 of a mile per % on average. Going by miles / km per percentage is probably more accurate than the cars estimated range and the you compair directly different vehicles performance.
*24 kWh
Does this car have a heat pump? Or does it use a simple PTC system?
Zoe's have heat pump :)
Well yeah, the whole missing of ACC is why I'm not buying this car. It seems better than the previous Zoe, especially the interior. But from the outside its still not pretty enough, plus the ACC missing is why I'm not going for it at current price point. Maybe if Renault drops prices to where they are now with a leased battery it's worth reconsidering. Or if they bring a model that resembles the Zoe RS prototype car, which is awesome.
Hi Björn, heating and charging works when the keycard is in the slot.
We already had the keycard in the slot and no heat.
This is a pity. In my zoe (2017er model) it works like that.
By the way thanks for your Videos!
You can preheat/precold with the Renault app. But is a pain to get working. You need to register as owner in the Renault Website.
There is a well known cheat for that : you have to get the key out of the car, and press the preconditioning button on key. This will heat for 5 minutes.
Repeat as often as necessary.
The reason behind that is that Renault considers the driver prefers to get out for a coffee, and saves temp conditioning for the battery...
@@ceituna The preconditioning button that was on the 22 and 40 versions is not present on the ZE50.. :(
Thanks for another great video about EV. it would be exciting if you could make a video about the new Ioniq under the same conditions
Renault web site quotes 180mi for Zoe winter range. Cars with liquid heating / cooling for the battery do cost £10,000 more! Please talk like for like.
Where can I find good rubber carpet for the Zoe ?
haha same problem....did u find any?
OBD port is still under the rubber mat in the middle storage area in front of the gearshifter?? Was there on the old model.
No the OBD Port is now on the A pillar where you open the front bonnet.
@@renault5turbode Ah they have changed it. Not a bad idea since the old one was well hidden.
@@Tsenngu They changed it because on that place is now the wireless charging for the phone. And every new Renault has now the OBD at the same spot on the a pillar.
renault5turbode nope. The wireless charging is under the gear shifter, it's a bit hidden. In front of the shifter is the mat where you put your key on when the battery of the key is dead, for the car to recognise it because you don't have any key slot anymore.
Bjørn, a real-life challenge would be to test the Zoe at 0C or below at night ie under cold conditions with the heating and lights on, and at motorway speeds which in European continental countries is around 130 km/h. That is when you need really good range, and when you don‘t want to stop for eg an hour in the cold and darkness to charge the battery. I estimate that half the wltp nominal range would be a good estimate of the real range under such conditions.
And here i am in my electric Smart doing 80km in the winter and being happy :))
Didn't know you're speaking german: "Scheisse!" :-)))
Your version is strange 🤔 cause in France we can do easily 395 km 🤔
Really? Can you reach without eco 390km?
I notice that the tyre pressure here was 2.5 Bar. Some other car you tested was running with 3.0 Bar. How do you determine what tyre pressure to use??? The energy consumption will of course depend highly on the tyre pressure! Do you juste drive the test in the state they hand you the car or do you set the tyre pressure yourself?
Inside of driver's door.
Oh so you always adjust it to the factory spec? Ok that makes the comparison fair. I always use 3,2 Bar and the energy save is huge! :-D
8:26 actual range
Sheeeet man did you let an ape loose in the zoe? Where did all those scratches on the roof lining come from ;) Cheers
It's some kind of design that actually looks like a electric circuit
Perhaps the banana box test was actually done before the range test and those are marks from the banana boxes....
@@Ron3. yeah or it was an ape ;)
@@FancyaBevMate Could be right - got to empty those banana boxes somehow !
Nice parking 😗
What is atwack? It's called airconditioning right?
Google HVAC
If you use CanZE, you can see that the real state oif charge is 95% and on the meter inside the car it shows already 99%
So that percentage inside the car is somewhat fake.
I think Renault like to prevent, that people charging more than 95% so the battery stress is not that high.
I hope you test e208 in the near future
100% battery and eco mode on will you bring you over 300
And not driving in 1 degree
5:12 scheiße! This is Not Germany 😂
scheiße? WTF?
Google English: Crap
Google French: Merde
Norway 😁
Imo, the new Zoe is already dead against the new e208/eCorsa.
The e208 has 100kW charging, the Zoe is limited to 50kW,
And the e208 battery is watercooled, the Zoe isn't.
I'll doubt it. I think it was a good choice to go for a 22kW AC charging and cut the cost on a faster DC charger. Remember that this car wil mostly drive in cities + suburbs. There is better AC charging support. And if you have you're own AC home charger you most likely will never need DC charging with this kind of range.
e208 charging only 7KWH in AC
The range is only 250km.
@@AHD270 11kW with the 3-phase charger option. And 340km WLTP range.
u need to charge in DC and not in AC :)
Why do batteries lose capacity when the temperature goes down?
"Capacity" isn't the actual capacity it's the energy output before the voltage goes lower than certain level. A battery is a chemical energy storage. With a decrease in temperature, rate of a chemical reaction decreases, which, in this case, decreases the voltage.