What is With Giga Roller Coasters and Their Big Brake Runs?
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- čas přidán 1. 06. 2024
- Giga roller coasters are some of the most impressive and popular amusement attractions ever built. But what's with the massive brake runs found on Giga roller coasters built by Bolliger & Mabillard? Let me try to explain.
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Time Stamps:
Intro: 00:00
Orion is a Giga: 01:40
Brake Runs Explained: 04:24
Summary: 11:35
Conclusion: 13:40
Video Sources:
Kings Island - • Orion: New for 2020 at...
Coaster Jeff - • Millennium Force at Ce...
POVs belong to Kings Island, Canada's Wonderland, Carowinds, Cedar Point, & Hershey Park - Zábava
Ryan almost went for some different kind of POV’s here 3:56
Underrated comment. Needs more than 2 likes this is genius xD
I was hoping someone else noticed that! lol
Rip
Ben Adelstein ;)
👑
I'm at the beginning watching a Hamilton ad and I can already tell he's going to do a long college lecture about block brakes
Same, honestly whenever I see a Hamilton ad, I don't skip it, I love that musical
I had the same ad XD
Got it too
Me too :D
Asher McCready ugh I hate Hamilton with a passion
3:56 had me dead
LMAO
what even is x videos lol its not showing up when i google it
@@auzk2js71 💀
@@auzk2js71 Your innocence must not be tarnished.........
@@auzk2js71 maybe you shouldn't be on the internet than 😆
The brake runs are insecure about their size, stop talking about it.
Why are they insecure if they’re giant?🤤🤤🤤
@@utilitariancritic Just like tall people can be insecure because they stand out so much
Brake runs be getting bullied left and right here
CoolioJoe100 ayyyyyy I don’t know if that was intentional or not
Stop the bullying of the brake runs!!
How Ryan met Nadine.
Ryan: hey girl. You’ve ever heard of block zones?
“for those unfamiliar”
@@shane9245 A block zone is a section of a ride
@@G_Force-cx2mr where only one train may occupy
A giga wild mouse scares me. Being whipped side to side 300ft in the air is honestly bananas not to mention how much more expensive it would be having so much support at that height
Would honestly be a blast, the view of Lake Erie at cedar point would make it A tier
Ryan: If you don't know what a block section is
Me who has seen all of the problematic coasters videos: you have mentioned it once or twice
I had to stop, let it breathe, and come back today. I am an expert on Blocks at this point.
Ryan: If you dont know what a block zone is....
Me: Here we go again
A bit redundant, but thanks to his redundancy on it, when I popped in on the problematic roller coaster series mid run, I quickly grasped what he meant and could relate to railroad signals :D
However, I still want more technical videos like this on different coasters, not just problem ones and I hope he can gather some info to share.
Orion is a great and fun ride, the brake run doesn't feel like 87 feet off the ground but more like the conclusion to a great layout
I thought it was a nice smooth friendly ride. It didn't really thrill me which is what I want from a giga. But I do think you're right that the brake run didn't feel too bad at all.
Just rode it 3 times yesterday. Very smooth, and best coaster I’ve been on.
@@JayFlowie a 300ft drop isn’t thrilling? 🤓
@@scottyjbd not really anymore. I've done it so many times now that if it isn't forcefully pushing me, it doesn't feel intense. Snappy transitions make for an exciting coaster for me now. Rmc, and blitz coasters mostly or a really huge g pull
@@JayFlowie that’s alright if air time isn’t your thang. To each their own!
Coaster Enthusiasts: Complain about MCBRs ruining the pacing of the ride.
Also Coaster Enthusiasts: Complain about the MCBR being placed right before the final brakes.
Why don't they just turn them off but have them in the middle of the ride
Because that would reduce rider capacity. Block brakes must always be on so that they can bring the train to a complete half should the block ahead be not clear for some reason.
Also coaster enthusiasts: complain about capacity
Coaster enthusiasts: complains about basically anything.
@@marcustulliuscicero5443 just saying, steel vengeance's mid course was never on for me
Came to learn about brake runs, stayed to see the Coaster Bot font be used
ElToroRyan: Explained
I thought it was a coaster bit video from the thumbnail
oh wow that is Coaster Bot font 😂 didn't even realize hahah
You made your own font? That's pretty cool, who made it?
robotboy1010 HAHA YESS
Here’s how I see it, if Apollo’s Chariot can be considered a hyper roller coaster at 170 feet, then Orion is a giga coaster.
Yes! Apollo’s Chariot along with Phantom’s Revenge are the rides I bring up when I tell people Orion is a Giga!
Exactly. Goliath's drop at Over Georgia isn't 200 ft+ either
THANK YOU
NorCal Thrills exactly but it still classifies as a hyper because ya height is 200ft but the drop is 170 feet
Yes thank youuuuuuuu
Honestly, the "issue" with Orion being less than 300 feet tall is simply because its tallest point is on an elevated section of terrain. If the ride had been built on flat ground it probably would have been over 300 feet tall.
Exactly all of the other gigas are built on mostly flat land they probably would have increased the cost to much.
Kings Island doesn't need their giga coaster to be extremely massive to draw in crowds. If they just know if the drop or height is at lest 300 feet, you've already won people over. In fact, no one is going to even care that the height is 287 feet tall, and has the drop at 300 feet. People who use the metric system ain't going to care about the imperial measurement system, because they don't know how to use it. Plus, Orion looks just as tall as any giga coaster out there.
@@TonyKimtheamusementparkfan
I mean, it's basically gigacoaster sized. It just kinda got screwed because the station and lift are on a hill.
@@TonyKimtheamusementparkfan id say considering the coaster is in The united states the vast majority of riders are going to not use metric. Sure youll get a few people from out of the country but not a ton. The park is in the middle of nowhere so aside from the park there isnt much reason to be near there. Columbus and cincy are both over an hour away and they would be the closest tourist locations that would draw in the international crowd.
Yeah, all they have to do is dig a 13 foot deep hole right under the crest of the lift hill and they'd have a real giga coaster
Another important reason to have the brake runs so high is to give the final brake a steep angle so empty trains will be able to clear it quickly. One of the biggest delays on the Intamins like RoS and TTD is waiting for magnetic brakes / copper fins to retract and then tire driving drains through the now open brake runs. With a steeply sloped final brake run, they can just open the friction brake at the end and "voila" the train, even empty, rolls at a decent clip into the next block.
Andy Wong very true!
Even Intamin realized this, as shown with Kingda Ka.
@@ElToroRyanI’m in line for behemoth rn lol
That feeling when you mix up Rcdb with xvideos
classic mistake
wait a minute
I feel like B&M gets too much s*** for their decisions. You have to acknowledge that they do a great job being relatively equally appealing to both parks and riders. Like with Fury, they managed to make a GTA-winning, 6000+ foot coaster have such a great capacity with no midcourse break run. That’s insane when you really stop and think about it!
people will complain about everything, but back in 1991 Steel Phantom/Phantoms Revenge (Kennywood) has always been considered as a hyper coaster, with a drop over 220 feet yet only having a height of 160 feet. Both Kennywood and Kings Island are taking advantage of the land they have.
Not always. But it should be. The most important aspects are speed generated and the incentive to go just a bit further ($) to make the goal.
A coaster with the height but substantially short on elevation difference such as Big Apple is the one that's cheating.
I thought Phantoms Revenge aka Steel Phantom was a Mega Coaster.
@@ArrowThrills You can count as that
Just matter of venn diagram
@@bocahdongo7769 huh ?
B&M is actually genius. They learn and change. Using altitude to naturally slow trains down to reduce wear and tear on the track.
I love B&M for little details like this. I knew about the 'moving the mid course to the end' thing, but never even thought about the elevation reducing wear and tear. Thanks for your videos, I absolutely love these deep dives into the technical details.
Without the midcourse, I feel like the rides are better paced as well, as you don't have an interruption mid ride.
Diamondback at Kings island is a perfect example.
@@ArrowThrills Diamondback has a mcbr though!?!
Depends on the ride - some coasters, like those with a mid-run launch element, can leverage the drastic change of pace of a mid-ride brake as a benefit to the overall experience. It just depends on how much care the manufacturer put into the design, and probably a bit of theming too.
Those break runs are bigger than my meal portions
B&M’s designs are brilliant. I love these nerd videos.
B&M literally thinks of everything, and that's what sets them apart from other manufacturers. Idk a single B&M coaster that has had significant downtime and break down. I've had that happen with Behemoth and Yukon Striker, but they were up within 10-15 minutes, and no other problems. It's amazing what B&M think of technology-wise.
@@TonyKimtheamusementparkfan That's very true, but that reliability comes at the cost of intensity... Older B&Ms were like intamins, very forceful, whippy, intense, nowadays B&Ms can be kinda boring. I still like them, but they are getting too graceful... There is no better comparison than Raptor at Cedar Point and Banshee at Kings Island, Raptor is whippy, fun, intense, but pretty smooth, Banshee is too drawn out, not forceful enough, and has actually gotten pretty uncomfortable
@@coastaku1954 From what I gather, Intamin generally seems more willing to take bold risks with new ride designs; but then, as a consequence, they end up with more of the sort of coasters that end up on the Problematic series here.
Whereas B&M is a bit lower risk, and perhaps more conservative on their designs; but they’re just so consistent and reliable and don’t have nearly the same rate of goof-ups that Intamin seemingly does.
In any case, both companies have introduced some really great stuff. Intamin I think has a lot more claims to fame on record-breakers and unique/bespoke stuff; meanwhile B&M is kinda the ultimate standard-bearer of “here’s your whole entire catalog of really solid steel coaster variants”.
All of that aside… The most important battle, and the only one that really matters: Beefy boxy spine track? Or super truss track? Which reigns supreme?! (I actually kinda like both in their own ways, to be honest. So I guess we need someone else, somebody less ambivalent than me, to decide-once and for all-which type of track is the clearly superior one. 🙇♂️)
@@jgottula You know... I actually prefer the Box Spine Track... Nothing, and I mean NOTHING beats the famous B&M Roar! Prolly the loudest B&M I've ever heard is Green Lantern at Great Adventure
Another bonus on a long brake run at the end is that if there is a malfunction you still get to enjoy the whole ride!
That happened to us last week on orion
Huh, it’s also good for park operators-technically there’s no obligation/overhead to give guests front of the line passes if they’ve already experienced the complete ride!
B&M : So how long do you want the brake run to be?
Cedar Fair: yes
Still better than the clones six flags does
NorCal Thrills facts
Ride is still high-quality :)
@@NorCalCoasterMedia Agreed.
Excellent as always. B&M understands throughput and reliability. Your comments about block checks and evacs are spot on. This design is a direct result of operational experience. There are fewer motors and prox switches since the brake run relies less on drive motors and more on gravity to return the trains to the station. Vekoma's newer installations do a good job of swiftly returning trains to the station once they pause on the break run but they rely on pinch tires. When I first saw Leviathan's layout I thought it looked short but it's a very good ride. I haven't been on the other 2 yet. The enthusiast in me wishes Orion had one or two more camelbacks before the brake run but the park operator in me gets it. My favorite coaster finale is the original SROS at SFDL when it opened in 1999 without the trim brake. Ending the ride with insane (and non ASTM-complaint) negative G's is a moment I'll never forget. I wish Orion ended like that, but the benefits of the brake run as you described are for the greater good. You're very good at this and I hope the industry benefits from your observations.
My man really just made a 5 paragraph 3 point essay. School really taught you well I see.
B&M literally thinks of everything. No one would think to put an extra brake zone between a train coming to a stop and a train waiting behind the station, except for B&M. Take a look at all their coasters that run three trains, and that's exactly the case. B&M is the best when it comes to thinking of everything to make a ride reliable. These brake runs are a clear example. I was confused too when I saw this huge brake run on Leviathan when I first rode it in its opening month in 2012, but now I can appreciate just how smart this company is with all their rides, and that's why B&M is my favourite coaster manufacturer. They're expensive for a reason.
3:57
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I'm a former B&M Giga coaster brakerun complainer, but you've enlightened me with your video. I will happily take a shorter wait time than an extra airtime hill or helix any day of the week.
B&M is literally the best from an operational standpoint. I’d recommend a GP To Enthusiast video called why B&M is the best or something like that. He goes into detail with what makes them better than most manufacturers
Block zone ryan
Damn, nobody noticing you. Guess I’m the first. Btw, did you see what he was about to look up at 3:56?
3:56 that's gonna get you demonetized
He's willing to take the risk for a few laughs.😂😂
Your kidding ?
excellent content
@@ArrowThrills no because mentioning those sites can get the video demonitized
🤫🤫🤫 idk what you’re talking about!
3:46 how much for you to engineer that
a 300ft wild mouse would slap
Gigacoasters have enormous amounts of kinetic energy and are designed for pacing, rather than being simply record breakers. They are destinations attractions.
By having a break run be so high off the ground, gravity does all the work of turning that kinetic energy into gravitational potential energy. Slowing down the train before the break run has to engage. This saves wear and tear on break runs, while making it far simpler to safely, reliably stop a train at high hourly capacities.
Imagine how much heat needs to be dissipated from break pads on a giga coaster during every break run cycle.
Customers dont like perceived inconvenience even if its beneficial to the company. Less wear and tear? Customers just complain the cosster sucks.
B&M hyper and giga coasters to me have always had an underlying theme of being massive giants, and the tall huge brake runs just serve to fit them well
This video has made The Swarm's slightly confusing break run make a lot more sense, thanks Ryan!
These brake runs are very similar to those that GCI have used for years on their 3 train rides. However B&M have figured it out perfectly, as with the GCI brake runs, the train takes a while to leave it, therefore the dispatch interval has to be longer, since the train can’t leave the lift until the other train has cleared the brake run. with the B&M version of this, the brakes barely slow down the train, therefore it takes nowhere near as long to leave the block as the GCI ones do. This means that the dispatch intervals can be smaller, therefore throughput higher, if GCI used a system similar to this, their rides could have higher throughputs, which would be good since most of their rides can do no more than 980 riders per hour (the exclusion being wodan at EP)
This is why i like the mystic timbers approach with the end shed. Extra block section entertainment
B&M brilliant once again got it
I mean seriously, they advertise their rides can operate for 2 months without a single breakdown
Only one, ONE, of their coasters is closed currently and it's in Kuwait of all countries. Sure some of their rides have been relocated/renamed (Iron Wolf now in Six Flags America), but they're still running!
And aside from Iron Wolf, which coaster is notoriously rough? Usually just the Stand Up models which most are now floorless models, and as a result, SMOOTHER!
B&M Just simply GETS IT with their rides!
Intamin makes high quality rides too, but they're so expensive! 4 Pre-Fab woodies, that's it, too expensive, their Giga/Hyper coasters not as efficient as B&M's, their strata coasters, awesome as they are, have frequent tech issues due to weather or some other variable. Intamin inverts aren't even popular either! Their best models are Blitz/Accelator/Impulse models (as they're all launched), Family coasters, and Loopers, basically almost all smaller models.
I would argue that the next best company right now in roller coasters is RMC, considering they can just re-track woodies into beasts and they build amazing ground up coasters too at an affordable price! Mack Rides right after.
10 hours ago, all the B&Ms in Ohio were closed.
Mainly because it was 3:00 in the morning in Ohio, but still.
Orion may not be the best Giga ever but its still a really fun awesome coaster. One thing I really like is how intense that helix is on Orion its definitely better then Fury's Helix. It may not be the tallest giga but its definitely the best themed Giga Coaster out of the 4 I've done. I was really impressed how they themed Area 72 and the queue line
I think that the rule of thumb, should we care to make any, is that a coaster is a giga if it has a total height between 300-399.99 feet OR has a drop of at least 300 feet. Both give the same feeling of height. If we were to raise the entire track of Orion 13 feet up from its original position, so that the crest of the lift hill is 300 feet off the ground and the bottom of the drop was at ground level, the ride experience would be pretty much identical, other than seeing from higher up
“Before we start, you need to understand what a block section is.”
Me, a massive train nut: “I am 4 parallel universes ahead of you.”
Right there with you. In case anyone’s wondering, signaling systems on railroads are split into blocks that either be occupied or unoccupied, like on a roller coaster.
Are they practical? yes.
Does leviathan's break run give Dragon Fyre Insecurities? Also yes.
Orion is a giga. Period. Its like saying Lightning Rod's lift hill is only 50 ft above the ground at the top, but once it uses its terrain it has a drop height of 165 ft.
Saying that Orion isn’t a giga is like saying PotC at Disneyland is 0 feet tall and has no drops.
Can we just appreciate the color schemes of these rides 🥰
So b&m is amazing at never making there rides unreliable. So they did the height because of slowing it down easier. And the length of the brake run because of capacity. Love this company dude
Chimera they got some rides that are complicated but most of there rides are really amazing and reliable idk what you talking about mang
Chimera yeah you’re right. Most of there rides are near perfect. Some of them aren’t, same with any prototype or new model. They are definitely for reliability though.
Thanks for making this video! You have all of the knowledge necessary to address such matters in a technical way, and these things needed to be said.
Love the explanations because there's no excuse to dislike them anymore, that rider capacity is GODLY!
Amazing video, I never even thought of how the reason why they’re so high is so the train can enter slower!
you are the man for including the metric system! its like almost all roller coaster channels just dont care about the non usa viewers. so thanks!
Thank you for the in depth explanations of these things. I feel like I am learning something new every time I watch one of your videos!
Every time Ryan gets into the definition of block zones, it's just got that "The FitnessGram Pacer test" vibe to it 😆 Love your videos dude
I have some friends that used to be in maintenance at Six Flags Magic Mountain and they all prefered working on B&M coasters over pretty much anything else in the park. They design coasters to be easy to maintain, something that a lot of other manufacturers don't do as good of a job with.
Great video! However, the B&M's at Kings Island ride operators are not needed at each block to release the trains like you said. Block Checks can be done all at the drive panel. At least as of 2013. - Former Diamondback Supervisor :)
I can confirm! I witnessed a block check on Orion last week, and when the train got stopped on the “midcourse brakerun,” they were able to clear the blocks from the station and not have operators go out to the block.
Wow! You always put so much effort into these videos! Thank you mang!
Great Explanation. FURY 325 also controls pacing by the speed of the lift hill. If a train hasn't hit the break, the lift hill speed is slow. As soon as the previous train clears the break, the lift hill speeds up dramatically (then slows back to normal speed at the very top). It's so efficient, that if three trains are running, the operators in the station are hard pressed to keep up. Disappointing about the support break on Fury 325. They're started testing today and hope to be re-certified soon. Can't wait to get back on.
The block zone description in every video is like a drug to me. I NEED MORE!
Great Video , love your technical insight to these coasters . Keep them coming !
Ryan thanks for explaining, because I've always wondered why Giga coasters have large break runs.
Informative and told with clear love of the art-form. Bravo, ElToroDawg!
Your channel has re-sparked my love for roller coasters. Considering I live between kings island and cedar point, I need to get back out there.
I rode Orion a couple weeks ago. One of the best coasters I've been on
Thanks for the super informative video as always!! Love your content
Great content as always Ryan, thanks!
I love these videos, ElengineerORyan!
always informative and entertaining, thanks ElToroRyan.
Intamin is the only company that uses the term “Giga.” B&M classifies Leviathan, Fury 325 and Orion as “Hyper coasters.” They also classify Hollywood Dream: The Ride as a Hyper coaster even though it isn’t over 200 feet tall.
Thank you El Toro Ryan for your great content, it's very relaxing to listen to
Spot on about the Giga-coaster term. B&M uses the term hyper coaster to classify ALL roller coasters that are the airtime, non-inverting coaster style, regardless of height.
Love these videos. Been obsessed with brakes and block sections since RCT2 and Nolimits coaster. No lie.
I’ll call this block......
Block
- Eltororyan 2020
Very informative. Thanks mang
Wow nice vid! I’ve wondered why the brake runs were long for a while and I finally got an answer. Also this vid was really well put together and fun to watch.
Aaaaand now straight to play planet coaster and rework my brake runs hahaha great video. Really enjoyed it. Love your content
Thanks for enlightening me with this smart explanation video. Keep up the good work Ryan! Now I know why B&M build their final breakrun high up the ground. Yeah, I heard some coaster enthusiasts complained about that, but after your explanation, I also learned from Park/Ride operator's perspective. Really appreciate that!
It all makes sense now, everyone should watch this to understand so this high brake run giga meme goes away.
I swear nothing bothers me more than coaster enthusiasts complaining about Orion's height and length
this is really informative! Thank you!
very interesting , just ride this beast yesterday and don’t mind waiting for it , great ride love that first drop
Best coaster channel..you sure love them blockzones!
I personally love B&M coasters. They're always so smooth and enjoyable to ride. They might not always be necessarily the most thrilling, but they never disappoint.
I love how you added the Metric System to the vid!! Thank you, all the way from Australia!!
dude i love your vids, so much detail and knowledge in them. as a person who has been obsessed and watching coaster vids forever, i've been playing out your channel lately! even made some of my rct builds better xD keep up the good work!
the best part about watching this channel grow is seeing more b-roll footage from Ryan's trips
I was waiting for someone to do a video on how these brake runs work :) B&M is so smart when it comes to brake zones, and let's face it, EVERYTHING.
Don Helbig, long time enthusiast and Digital Marketing Manager of Kings Island actually provided the reason why they made Orion 287 feet tall. First and foremost, Kings Island’s desire was to build a giga, and when they were designing the layout, they realized that if they wanted a 300 foot height, they would have to extend the length of the lift hill which would require the drop to be further back. Extending the length of the lift hill meant that it would have to extend over a valley, and they wouldn’t be able to take advantage of this natural drop-off. B&M and Cedar Fair realized that it was pointless building a a 300 foot lift hill and having the same drop only to completely ignore Kings Island’s natural terrain. They ultimately decided that they could get the same drop they were planning with a 287 feet high lift hill, and with this, they could actually use the natural terrain to their advantage. For all of those naysayers who say Orion is not a giga, the chain invented the term giga, it has the same 300 foot drop as other gigas, and it shares similar elements with other gigas. Bottom line, if the park calls their 31 million dollar investment with a 300 foot drop a giga, it is a giga. Sorry for the long explanation, but great video! I hope that people stop complaining about long brake runs now! LOL! B&M is just next level!
I guess it would cost more to make the lift hill taller.
I think Raging Bull at SFGAm makes a good compromise (I know, it's only a hyper, but still). It has a real mid-course brake run with more ride after it, but due to the layout of the track, it is incredibly close to the station. From the station, it is faster to get to the top of its mid-course brake than to get to the top of the lift hill. And with such an early brake run, you can reliably dispatch trains every 55-75 seconds, presuming you have the right crew and no issues with guests.
Love these vids!
Will definitely take these into account when designing future creations!
The metric conversions are highly appreciated! Great video!
Great insight on the long break runs by B&M!
You make awesome content! Appreciate you, your friends, your work, and the hours of information and entertainment. 😁😁🔥🔥👏👏
I love roller coasters and I’m so ready to go back to Cedar Point when it opens back!
Such an insightful video.
I love when you cover my home park Wonderland! Levi!!!
Good insight man!!
If you use a different style of braking you can make the brake run in a hill which makes it much more obvious, while keeping the same properties. Just look at Kingda Ka, Full Trottle and Cheeta Hunt.
If I were a roller coaster designer I would also do a mid-source brake run on an airtime hill. This way you get fewer dead spots in the track.
Your video's are great! It sounds like you put a lot of effort in converting the imperal system to the metric system, so I would like to let you know that it is highly appreciated! Keep up the good work :D
Also, after this video, I was able to combine your remarks on the correct brake system on Gigas + something I realized watching POVs (the lift hill seems to work on two different speeds, starting at a slower pace then speeding up half way through) and I could replicate a working full-capacity 3 train dispatch system on NoLimits 2 . Before, I could only work with 2 trains because I couldn't nail that sweet spot, and as you explained, that would be a terrible bottleneck IRL. That's so AMAZING, thanks a lot for this video!
Even as an enthusiast these were some new information for me. Thanks!
Suuu dude. Love these videos, Noone understands how much I love rollercoasters