PURE IMMERSION! - Sigma Integrale DK2+ 3DOF Sim Racing Motion System Review
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 15. 05. 2024
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Sigma Integrale really impressed us with the DK2 Motion System, and now it's time to have a close look and test drive with the big brother DK2+ 4 actuation Sim Racing Motion System.
Sigma has an interesting approach to Sim Racing motion which translates pure telemetry data to the seat of your pants rather than using canned effects like you find with D-Box and other motion systems. This creates potential for an unrivalled experience when it comes to realism and immersion, but is it the best approach for your Sim Rig?
We'll answer this, and compare the DK2+ to the DK2 and other competitor products in our detailed review video of the Sigma Integrale DK2+ Motion System.
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TIME STAMPS:
Intro: 0:00
Important Informantion: 0:24
Pricing: 1:53
Hardware Overview - Actuators: 7:18
Hardware Overview - Control Box: 14:05
Software & Setup - 20:00
Driving Experience & Conclusions: 29:30
#simracing #sigmaintegrale #motion - Hry
I own a sigma integrale motion system and I litearlly cant stress enough how good their customer service/support is. I have had it for 4 years and ive had 3 issues with my system.. and all 3 times they got back to me within the hr and with full walkthrough. I would love to see any other mfg put work in customer service/relations. I have been blessed by making the right choice at this price point and have full support.
Ok whale
I'm glad you're happy with your purchase. What was that address again please?
Same here! It's insane, they walked me through everything! The system itself is amazing as well.
I watched your older videos when you used the NLR Motion V3 and even the Buttkicker for the first time and seeing what you're testing now and how far you've taken your channel is nothing short of amazing brother! Congratulations on your channels success. Thank you for the amazing contribution and commitment you've given our niche community. Proud of you! Continue to grow! Love from Canada eh!
I have the DK2+ system. It has been incredible, and rock solid. Between that system and my Quest 3, I feel like I am really in the car.
I have the 3-actuator version of this, and it's truly amazing.
Let's hope we soon get a motion system that is what the CSL DD was to direct drive wheels. Until then, our rig-mounted bass shakers will do.
Couldn't agree more!!!!!!!! They would sale so many more if they had one that was obtainable for people who don't already have 20 or 30,000 dollar rigs!
Very good review, the comparison between Sigma Integrale and D-Box in feeling/consistency by game/track and car was very informative. I'd like to see a comparison between all the motion sims you tested, D-Box, Sigma Integrale, Qubic systems by game/tracks and cars.
For the 2 people who can afford it
And something to dream about for the rest đ
It's cheaper than dbox, with more travel...but yes good motion is expensive
meanwhile people spending $2000 on a seat and rig. then $1500 on a wheel and base and $600 on pedals. yes it's expensive, but its not like people are spending that type of money already.
Hahaha nice.
Im happy with my SFX 100 it was only 2000âŹ
Your channel and demeanor is thoroughly enjoyable!
Awesome motion system Will, hope you can do a Review of the DK6 also ! đ
Brilliant video as usual. I have the Slip-Angle for now and really love it. Hopefully I can upgrade to one of these full motion systems in a couple of years.
Awesome tips on the parts that bother you about this setup. Thank goodness you keep making these informative videos.
As always, clear, concise, well articulated product reviews!đđ respect Will...
Been wanting a dk2 or dk2+ for a while now. Primarily play acc and ac1. Getting into lmu. Hopefully this will be the year I can pull the trigger!!
I was waiting for that review! im looking for the dk6 or the dbox and with that review, im done searching. Dk6 it is!
Hi Will and Tom, great video - authentic and informative as always. Your DK2 review from a year or two ago really stuck with me, especially your comment about running the motion quite low so as to get the motion cues without throwing you around. When I got the opportunity to test the DK2 and DK6 I can definitely say I feel otherwise - crank up the power and enjoy the best that the USA has to offer hahaha
I completely agree with the cable length - I did just manage to get the control unit right at the nose of the cockpit but there was not much slack left, and an extra 30cm or so of cable length would be appreciated. Sigma Integrale told me they have revised the control box to include mounting tabs - I personally wouldn't want it fixed to the rig though - more stuff mounted onto a violently shaking cockpit means more stuff that can work its way loose.
Your comment about the LEDs was interesting to me - I found them distracting only when walking around the rig, never while driving. That very slow flicker is what gets me - if the frequency of the flicker were higher so as to be less stark (i.e. imperceptible) I think it would be more comfortable to look at.
My experience with the DK2 was great - it was fast and handled a fully loaded 160mm rig plus me as a driver with no trouble at all - so I wasn't expecting the DK2+ upgraded motors to make much of a difference and it seems like you agree - but it looks like you and I are of similar build, and if somebody is significantly heavier than us then the extra weight capacity could be useful.
Those same upgraded motors when used on the DK6 though - that is a winning combination and well worth the price premium over the lower end options. I wonder if you'd feel the same way when you review the DK6 - since your motion preferences are more subtle I wonder if you'd see the same value I do in that significant price bump.
Thanks for that video and your work. I am on my way to buy my first real big sim racing gear and cockpit and it's daunting to know what to pick.Fortunately your channel is amazing and make the work a bit easier for me. So far I think I like the Next level Racing F-GT 160, but I have no idea about the wheel etc.. it's very difficult to understand what you want without testing it yourself ahah.Anyway Thank you for your work!
Yes, these will fit perfectly on my solid gold sim rig... đ
Fantastic review as always, and those P1000s look nice. I'm a couple months into ownership of my P1000s, and so far, they've been my best pedals I've owned, and it's not even close.
I bought the inverted P1000 and I really like them as well.
I have the dk2+ and It is crazy awesome. Love it. Strong super strong. Everything about this system is outstanding. Customer service is 1000% way better than any other company I have dealt with. Best option in the market in my opinion no doubt.
you really really really have to review the eracing lab rs mega+ system to give us the full comparison of all motion systems... :)
Hi Will, manyTHX for reviewing this Sigma motion system. And I'm wondering if there will be additional motion system reviews from you... specifically the ones offered by DOF Reality? They have a P3 model that looks to be very promising for sim racing & it's reasonably priced too.
Sigma Integrale and Qubic are far and above the two best options.
D Box isn't even in the same league.
I also have the DK2 system, and it's truly amazing. My best purchase ever. The build quality and responsiveness of the system are on another level!
Yeah, I heard they finally caught up and have Heave too!!! đ€Ł
pure immersion for a pure fortune đ
Couldn't agree more.
Cheers Will..đ
Only Sigma I could see in this video was you Will. đ
Wooooooooooooo Sigma!!! lets Go..
Although this is really cool most everyday sim racing fans who want motion will not buy it because of the price. I think most go for sfx 100/150 or eracing lab rs mega+ so I would love to see a review of those one day.
Yeah I'd love to see that too.
I really like that raised peddle mount you have ( the laser cut profile) and the fact you are using more extruded ally to align your peddle bolt holes on. What is it please Will as my Asetek S series peddles don't align to the default GT Prime Lite peddle plate 34:24 ?
5:45
Showing a table on screen would have been VERY helpful. Maybe I'm alone, but I was completely unable to hold all those numbers in my head to make comparisons between the models
Depends how much you use it which is what makes it worth it i race in vr and my motion rig really adds to the experience and i ise it almost daily for the last two years so it doesn't cost much when you start deviding it up to time used and entertainment. Love mine highly recommend not necessarily this one but any motion rig is awesome along with transducer speakers đ
Are they not able to have an option for canned effects for those tracks that aren't laser scanned?
Will, can you provide some information on the "spacer" sections you are using between the rig and the front actuators? I need those exact pieces/sections for installing my own sigma setup and would greatly appreciate it! Looks far more simple/feasible than the alternative I have been cooking up in my noodle.
Itâs just a couple of pieces of profile bolted on with some 90 degree angle brackets.
I had the DK2 and for the most part you don't need VR motion compensation but for the times you do need it you're really going to want it. It was particularly noticeable when rolled due to the environment. Overall, the lack of compensation created a slight level of discomfort and inconsistency of the experience in VR. If you're considering the DK6 then it'll be that much more important. I ultimately returned the DK2 because I was led to believe they'd allow me to develop a driver myself but then they went back on that to develop their own system which is still yet to come out years later. I may consider the DK6 in the future when they release VR compensation but at the same time the price has been making me consider other options that have sway and TL as well. Overall, I do like their design philosophy at SI, I just wish their development roadmap worked a little faster and they had more complete and affordable offerings compared to what else is on the market.
I havewn't been following motion rigs. is this considered better/on par with d box?
Will, when your test motion compensation the best track to understand if itâs working or not is the high banks of Daytona with iRacing. Itâs absolutely impossible to drive that in VR without MC.
Good call!
Thanks!
Thanks a lot for the support :)
Is there a way to add traction loss to a setup like this? Basically rotation on the z-axis.
Any comparison to the simrig sr3?
@Boosted Media, it would be nice if you would have a chance to test new Yaw2 - YAW VR motion sim
Would simrigs sr2/sr3 be australians only local stock and probs the cheapest?
Surprised they sent this over DK6 since this is mostly a DK2 that supports more weight
Will very random but I need help deciding, VRS wheel base or Simagic Alpha, have a local simagic dealer and VRS seller, wheels for the VRS may be more difficult to get good price for as im in Australia but not a huge deciding factor just want the best out of the 2. Price they are both the exact same for me. And second would you pick the P1000 or VRS pedals, P1000's are $100 cheaper so not much cheaper. Please help I'm very confused there are two many opinions and options from people who have not tried everything unlike yourself
Canât you use an ethernet switch, which would give you multiple connections ?
Have you tested any systems with horizontal slip? It seems like that would be pretty cool sensation but I wonder if it is actually helpful information...
We reviewed the NLR Traction Plus system a few years ago. Have another system here which we will be reviewing soon too.
@@boostedmedia will take a look, thanks!đ
Can you use it with ps5.. Or is the a way to make it work with ps5 via a laptop or pc
What a big box for not much inside. I prefer the design of simrig, with the power supply separated from the control unit. This way you can hide the control unit under the seat and the cable management of the actuators is way easier.
Hi there guys!
Qubic QS-220 or Sigma DK6?
đđ»
Best,
Nikos
@boostedmedia if you were buying a new motion system for yourself, completely out of pocket which system would you buy? Currently on a SimXperience Stage 4 w/traction loss. Looking to spend $30-40k.
Edit: a system compatible with monitors not a VR system.
all about this comment at 30:30
I noticed that you have the aluminium profile doubled up where the units are attached. Is there a reason for that? Also, you have the front units mounted on the near side (Closer to you) of the pedals. Mine are mounted to the far side of the pedals. I would assume you would get more sense of motion the way you have them mounted? Just food for thought for me.
I think itâs for optimal balance of the platform.
That trak racer TR120 cockpit is narrower at the front than at the rear. He widened the front of the frame so the actuators are placed rectangularly instead of in a trapezoidal shape.
You say this is "best option available" for purist. Any thoughts compared to the qs-210?
Will be reviewing that soon.
Clearpath servos are a good choice, fast powerful and well priced. The use of a BeagleBone SBC is an interesting choice for controlling it, that's why its network connected. I think its a little overpriced considering its made up of a bunch of off the shelf components, the only custom parts are the aluminium housing and the shafts.
Sounds like your the man to show us a DIY optionđ
@@Itsfranklyfrank oh 100% đ
I was about to comment the same thing.
It also seems weird to me that theyâre connecting full AC power to the board that sends power to the servos for the sole reason that they have a rectifier for the BeagleBone on the board. I would have put AC power straight to the power supply, and just used a switching buck converter to provide power for the BeagleBone.
For a product that costs multiple thousands of dollars, using an internal microSD card for storing the operating system is unacceptable, period. I donât remember the BeagleBone having internal flash storage, so that alone is something that would keep me from buying it. MicroSD cards just arenât reliable enough to be used for anything other than removable/expandable media or hobby projects, imo.
Iâve switched my rig to Clearpath motors they are excellent and customer support is fantastic.
â@@KaminKevCrew If it is a Beaglebone Black, it has 4GB of 8-bit flash on board. But yeah, the OS and app code should be run off the onboard flash if possible. I've used many BB Black Rev C SBCs for my projects at work, so I'm real familiar with them. Depending on the OS, libraries used, and code optimizations, that 4GB can feel cramped if you are running interpreted code (some of my projects were using interpreted python while in development ). Runnung compiled and optimized relieves some of that pressure on the flash.
That said, for a client I currently have several dozen BBBs running compiled python app code on Debian linux from the micro SD card (by client request) without a hitch. These have been chugging along running 24/7 unattended physically but accessed remotely, for over two years. No issues. They're quite robust.
T from Thanos AMC Board inside from controller box? hahahaahaha
Still no QS 210 review?
Maybe you should test the E Racing Lab system. I see lots of negative comments about the price, lets here some negative comments about how its too hard to set up =)
I will upgrade my sim rig and can't decide...
PC or ps5, how much more for a PC that has ps5 graphics?
I have both PS5 and a 4090 PC⊠honestly for 4-5 hundred dollars the PS5 amazing, especially if you pick up a cheap used PSVR 2 and GT7. Plenty of other non VR titles as well and you can use SimHub on a cheap laptop if you want vibration telemetry from games too.
PC is a whole different thing, much more fiddly but great once itâs dialed in⊠even with a 4090 I wouldnât say itâs 2-3times better. Kinda like the difference between a $12 bottle of wine and a $35 one, similar end result.. but taste better in theory and itâs more expensive so it must be better right ;)
Pc bro freedom of playing many games and doing much more better graphics and lot more lobbies
Isnât the maximum weight per actuator? I know it is with others like PT-Actuators Scorpion Actuators so I canât imagine that chunky boy canât keep up or come close to the Scorpions
The weights I gave are for total payload according to their documentation.
Do we need more than a NLR v3 to enjoy some motion on our rigs? I think the price/value of all these systems above 3000 usd is completely overpriced.
Value is clearly subjective. I have owned (and sold) the NLR v3 seat mover. It was great for a while but it really canât replicate movements and haptic feedback to the same degree as a 4 actuator system (the speed, force of movement, different frequency of effects, etc). There is a market for both kinds of systems and the price is yes a lot more for full 3 dof systems like Qubic, dbo, Sigma or a diy sfx kitâŠ.but the experience is very different on the higher priced systems. They are a niche product (both seat movers and full setups) sort of like simicube asking $2k for an active brake pedal.
Are you serious? It's absolutely not the same *movement* system. I tested both and the NLR is like a fairground machine; nothing very natural. Ok, I'm exaggerating, but for me the immersion was broken because of this pivot system.
You should really do a guide on best pedals that arenât activepeds
P2000 end of storyđ
@@SerialDriver not reallyâŠ.. Iâve just bought the srp gtr pedals (his review was of the gt pedals not gtr because they werenât out then) and everyone says how amazing they are
@roeoneill9158 the simgrade vx pro also looks like a great innovative option at aggressive price. Or conspit cpp lite for a well built hydraulic also at competitive price. But on top range before going to AP, the P2000 is the best.
Simtrecs Pro Pedal GT all Day and Night and into next week đđđ
@@SerialDriver I was really searching all over Reddit groups and in the end, loads of people had upgraded p2000-he+-spr gtr, and they always said the srp was number 1 by miled
Less is more with Motion.just because you can go bigger doesn't always mean you should.
Whats the weight limit for this? Like... from human rabbit to human blob? Looks pretty damn robust :O.
Watch the vid bro.
He goes over that in the first 5min of the video
@@biz0r07 yeah, I got there lol, my bad!
you can have also pci ethernet
19:22 with all that wasted space, they could use less material and then provide the consumer with a USB to Ethernet adapter especially since those adapters are so cheap.
Would love for a company to come up with something much cheaper that can give us about 15%-25% what these very expensive motion rigs provide.
Search eRacing Lab
QS210. Cheaper and better
@@GMCRaptor i like what I see though this could be very difficult to fit on my rig-F-GT ELITE.
@@RichAbe23 I have the DK2+ and the F-GT Elite and it fits pretty easily. I have a video discussing the install of it.
@@ashcountach1684 is the overall balance okay with this? Seems a bit compromised there with the two front actuators sitting in the middle of the rig.
yikes. but how bout that car bro?! when are we getting a review on Emira?
I've gone the more affordable route. I pay someone to stand behind me and they shake my chair to simulate the bumps.
My Formula 1 guy just roundhouse kicks me in the side of the head whenever I clatter a kerb
At ÂŁ5000, I'll have two
Use this comment for all who can't afford this.
Keep dreaming and do the hardwork. Soon we will be able to achieve our dream and enjoy the moment.â€
first
To learn how a caching layer works
Third
Your medal, well done đ„
Where's the equipment the other 90% of us can afford?
Got some entry level stuff coming next week :)
There are few fundamental issues on all these closed ecosystem motion systems. First: All software development rely on that single small company, so it have to stay in business, they have to add new games on platform even if business isnt like it was before. Without constant software updates, components becomes just electronic waste. I have seen this happen before other kinds of industries, when business is getting bit tired. Second: When ecosystem is so closed, you are not adding surge or traction loss. And trust me, many of us will want these, or at least likes to have that option in future. Third: Motion compensation many times isnt in these softwares. Yes, you can say it isnt needed on small movements, but when you have it, you sure want it turned on. And time to time you just want crank it up and have fun with DR2.0, suddenly you would really need motion compensation. If you put so much money, why you would like to leave something like this on table. Why would you ever buy something twice as expensive when they dont offer more? Will, you should really review good sfx-100 based system, and give your opinion versus these closed systems.
Systems like this from Sigma are a step above the SFX/homebrew open source offerings. That's why you pay extra...that's why people get it.
@@biz0r07 Are they... They really rely on similar components. motors, linear screws and software. Does these companys have better software developers than Srs? I really would like to see honest comparison with maybe Eracing lab system or with PT actuator.
â@@kajrosenqvist9165 you say similar...why because they are servo motors with a linear screw, and a control box with software? You completely gloss over ALL of the details in an attempt to make your point. I *guarantee* the absolutely overbuilt custom actuator housing and specific bespoke screw and motor choices along with the full integrated custom tuned software (among many other differences) make a MASSIVE difference in the rigidity, accuracy, and smooth (among others) operation of this system vs those open source lower cost versions. That translates directly to things you feel in your butt...making for a sharper, smoother, stronger, and yes - much better experience. That is why people pay more for these systems...it really is not rocket science.
As for your specific critique/concern with the software...one of the big differences here is the level of integration. Think Apple vs Windows, one approach is a deeply integrated hardware->software solution that is engineered and developed to work together, tested and validated, tuned and refined - and the other is a generic platform to do work with various systems/motors/screws/etc. One provides a higher more refined, more robust, precise, fine-grained experience...the other, brute forces its way using what it has. However, lastly...do you really think SRS is the only one capable of producing good motion software? Or even the 'best' motion software? You assume too much and provide nothing but 'trust me bro' vibes with your argument there (and it doesn't even sound like you own any of these systems).
@@biz0r07 Actually when I see this Sigma control box opened, I dont see anything overbuilt. When i see actuators from Sr3, Sigma or D-box, I cant see anything much more rigid than maybe Pt-actuator. I could even say they dont look that rigid at all. I really disagree that Sigma would make their own custom motors or custom linear screws. Almost all DD wheels have pretty similar motors, they feel more and less same and they are still way bigger markets and companys to do something on their own.
Maybe Srs isnt better, but would really think it cant be worse. I bet there is just one guy at Sigma (or similar) keeping or even creating this software. That might be very talented guy, but all rely on him/her staying there. If Srs would stop working or it goes out of business I can use something else like flypt. With Sigma you rely that company will stay on business for long time. At least as long as you care about money you spend.
When I see really serious motion rigs, I rarely see these kind of systems. Thats why I would really like to see comparison against these two.
@@kajrosenqvist9165 the 'overbuilt' was the actuator housing (and selection/material choices on the screw as well)...the thing that translates motion into your rig...the thing that is critical to be rigid. It's a solid machined chunk of metal...thats far beyond what you get in any of the other offerings, especially SFX.
NO ONE makes their own custom motors, not even dbox...however choosing, matching, tuning and programming those motors is the difference here...and you completely ignore that difference. Same goes for the screws...they do actually do some manufacturing on the screws, but yes...precision machined parts like that are a specialty. That's not the point however....again tuning, selection, pricing (they are not cheap screws, SFX are generally built to a price...Sigma's are not built down to a price, hence better).
Again on the software, you speak from a place of ignorance as though you have expertise. I will leave it at that.
Lastly, as for you never seeing these systems - they are a very newcomer to consumer systems. They've been building commercial stuff for many years...their presence is growing and more and more people choose sigma. Just because you fail to see why is not on them or the users...its on you. They do not spend money on marketing...they spend money on engineering.
So, go ahead and pretend that none of the differences I point out are there...however *they are in fact there* whether or not you choose to acknowledge them.
7k + to your door WTF. Here is a nich that needs to be opened up. There's no way in he'll this hardware costs 4k. We need Real competition in this sim racing sector.
Software development costs money. Consider the salaries of experienced industrial motion engineers in California.
I hate motion rigs it doesn't mske it more immersive to me it doesn't feel natural it hurts my concentration. I will never understand the appeal I'm choice the rig sitting still any day of the week. Or shit the one where you get to sit in an f1 car? Yeah that's cool I like that. To much money and not comfortable but still take that over this lol. To each there own I guess?
I will say that rig you talked about is alot nicer for a motion rig not as aggresive.
You should only feel the motion not going crazy with jarring and thrashing.
I ran into a "Boosted_Tom" on F1 23 the other day! I wonder.. đ€đ
Edit: Not literally ran into, although I did witness you (if it was you) get taken out near the end of the race at Vegas
Each person who votes like this Boosted Media video will give away this set (cockpit and DD included), only one per person. I have no proof but no doubt either.