A New Tenon Cutter For an Old Purpose | Engels Coach Shop
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- čas přidán 22. 08. 2024
- A new fence tenon cutter helps when cutting tenons on these 10 foot tall logging wheels. Combining it with the traditional style cutter I am able to cut these 1 3/4" spoke tenons. It's a three step process, but building and restoring horse drawn vehicles sometimes makes you figure out how to get something done.
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#wheelwright #blacksmiths #loggingequipment
Thankyou for the many journeys. John & Amy(woof)-Wyoming!
I can almost smell the carbon brushes on that drill motor!!! Very fine work, Mr. Engels...
That's the smell of getting things done. Something the younger generation will never know with brushless motors.
@@johncollins719no that’s the smell of burning out the motor. Let the tool do the job don’t force it. That’s how you burn a motor out.
Two Wrongs make a Wheelwright... Great work......
Good one!!❤
"You are using it wrong," "Yes, that was what I was after!"
I had that in wood shop. I was planing the sides for a small chest across the grain. I liked the effect it gave. The shop teachers assistant "tried" to correct me. I pointed out that it was the effect that I was after.
I'm sure the "wrong" way to cut tenons was solely for fence rails or furniture supports where tenons cut with the long grain parallel to the framing member is critical. A wheel spoke doesn't have the same stress that would shear the tenon, so wrong is "wright" for wheels! Thanks for another great video and the trivet trivia!
Your last comment reminded me of the Bumper Stickers of my youth, (from when cars HAD Bumpers!).
One favourite read: "Make Love , not War. (See driver for Details)."
Then a second came along: "Make Love, not War. I'm married, and do BOTH !"
I recall seeing a variation on the trivet theme: Behind every successful man is a surprised mother-in-law.
The patience of Job. One more wheel.
Doing that many spokes would drive me crazy. Thanks for doing them.
My favorite saying on a trivet was at a friend's house in Seattle. Originally mounted above a door in the kitchen, it was a square piece of porcelain in a cast iron trivet. Later remade as welded in the bottom of a 6 inch cast iron pan. It read, "I wear the pants in this family and I have my wife's permission to say so!"
Hi Dave and Diane ☺ well the long awaited cutter does work, whith a bit of help from the home made one at the start and finish, those spokes a pretty tough on the big drill, it's sure earning it's corn and a rest,lol. I'm sure you'll be glad to see the fellows starting to fit, and so will we. Thanks for another interesting video mate, stay safe, best wishe's to you and Diane, Stuart and Megan UK.
Always a pleasure my friend..
Those pithy sayings remind me of a a sign I once made for my old dad's workshop: "I cut it twice and it's still too short" :)
Those older drill motors were tough as nails, but lugging it is going to let the smoke out of your drill motor.
A modern day drill would have burned out long ago. The old stuff was built like a battle ship.
For the most part, you are right, particularly home or hobby versions . There are new "industrial" drill motors that are built for long tough work.
Trouble with lugging the older motor is that RPM equals cooling. Slow max horsepower lugging will definitely over-heat the motor.@@milesbrett7002
I concur captain, if that old drill was a cat, it would definitely be missing a few lives
Well Dave, if it turned out right I reckon it can't be wrong. Great job on the tenons.
Those tenon cutters sound like they really make the drill earn its pay. That's pretty funny about the picture in the instructions showing you the right and wrong way of doing it. Thanks!
That tennon cutter sounds like a turkey caller!
OMG, it really does! Bonus entertainment!
Poor turkey, he has a cough! Get him a hot tottie quick: Wild turkey, lemon and honey! 🤣
There is a machinist out there somewhere who could make you two or three cutters of decreasing size. That would reduce the material removed and strain on your drill.
And maybe a more powerful drill....
That's so informative really did you know space crafts landed on MARS any can be made
@@peter-fuppe-fuchs The drill is powerful. That drill will rip your hand apart if you tried to do that without a stand, it's just that the process is very inefficient. A modern drill would not be able to do this, it would work once or twice, everyone would uuu and aaa, but on the third try the magic smoke would come out and it would be dead. About three or four modern drills would work and those be expensive. Like i'm sure my Hilti 500 would do it, but it also costs almost as much as an average car (here in Europe).
@@johnrobichaud130 maybe you can take a trip there….
Want to look at Barker Tenon Cutters, they do a whole range of long tenon cutters that will a produce 6" - 11" long tenon. Ref: TMC11/2x4x8
That's a brilliant tool Dave does the job and takes the pressure
Off the drill 👍👍👍👍👍👍
Your tenon cutter works much better than the store bought one
Really appreciate the opening film and the music.
Hello Dave
I've been watching your videos for a while and I'm impressed with your work. It's always great to watch you.
Best regards Juergen from Germany
Isn't it amazing how many tools can be adapted to do things their designer never knew they could!
Youre an Auld genuis on them wheels
I saw my Father making smaller wheels Fifty years ago all by Hand
Fantastic Skill keep uo tge Good work
Martin Murphy all the way from Wexford Ireland
what a great noise! thank you for figuring this out, it was driving my brain crazy imagining how the tenons would work.
If it's "wrong" but it works, It ain't wrong! 😀
Awesome video, thank you!
I have one of those geared down drill motors, amongst my hoarder collection of others, as well old school large angle grinders !
Fantastic work you do, at an ASMR pace I love ! 👍👍
Thanks for the funny story much appreciated brought a smile to my face 🤣🤣🤣
Head and shoulders above most Wheelwrights. Admired craftsmanship.
My folks had cast iron cooling tray that hung on the wall. It said “pa is boss as everyone knows, but what ma says always goes”. Glad to see your new tool made life a little bit easier on you and your drill.
Love watching you. A true craftsman.
i'll bet you are happy not to have to listen to that drill whine for a little while. i worked in construction and we used an air powered drill and inpact gun and chainsaw
and crane and diesel air compressor and a diesel pile driver. that was a lot of noise every day. now i try to enjoy quiet in my retirement. but i make an exception for
your show. it sure beats having to do it myself!
Thank you so much for the travel into the past. So neat to remember things about a childhood that has shaped your life today.
I love all your videos (I think I've watched nearly all of them) and I especially like the extra incidental bits like the story at the end of this video. Interesting, educational, useful (sometimes I learn something that is transferrable to my occupation), plus you make me smile and occasionally laugh out loud. Thank you. Please keep on doing what you're doing.
Good to see that this new tenon cutter worked out, but it is really not a good (or rather, unfinished) tool design. Ideally it would have a bolt parallel to each blade such that its head keeps the blade from backing out. Additionally, by adjusting the bolt in and out you'd get fine control over where the cutting edge is. These bolts can be easily added on a mill, or even a drill press with a good vise. Don't have to be anything large, 5/16 or even 1/4 Allen head would do just fine.
Many signs on the wall at Main Street Diner in Midland, TX. One of my favorites: Behind every successful farmer there is a wife that works in town. 😂 Those town jobs with insurance benefits sure help. Good day to all!
That was real funny. Thanks for sharing the humour.
I sure enjoy the intro video clips along with the other content.
Hi Dave and Diane, we all make do the best we can with the Tools we have, if you were doing lots of Loging Wheels would it pay to fabricate a Bigger Tinnen Cutter? Have a wondaful Day!
Outstanding job on cutting those tenons, sometimes you have to use the tool in not the "correct" manner that the designers thought it should be used. You made it work to do the job you needed it to do in a safe manner.
Hi Dave, and Diane, WOW. I'm so impressed by your perseverance from dealing with these logging wheels. You just take one thing at a time, and make it right before you go on. Even waiting for a new auger would have driven me crazy. Behind every successful man, there is a woman to make him see things differently. That's what I have in my life, and it has worked well for both of us. Thank you for sharing, and take care.
Contact cement wet or dry sandpaper on a dowel to sharpen your new cutter. All the best Danny
Hi Dave. Great as usual, thank you. The incompatibility between the manufacturer's directions and your job is that their design is intended for upright posts and rails at ninety degrees and your job isn't. The saying that your parents did not have on display is "Necessity is the mother of invention".
I wish I had met you when I was younger
Mr. Engles , I’ve been away. Last I saw you were discussing maybe slowing or retire!
I’m glad to see a recent video. I am in awe of your work/skill ,dedication.
Could you please update me here as to the shop status ,future? I’m sure we all want to know! I’m 65 and love your beautiful work!
Dave isn't taking any new work, but will continue to work on his own projects. He has 3 projects to finish for customers.
LOL, the technical writer for the fence tenon cutter manual may need to write a foot note in those instructions ; *(except for wheelwright use). Bet they never saw that application coming. As always, thanks for posting these videos. One of the highlights I always look forward to every Friday (and now with mid-week bonus material).
Lol
That tenon cutter would make a fair turkey call. You'd have every gobbler in ten miles strutting his stuff. I hope you are going to show building the second wheel, so we can see how all the tweaks on your method work out on spokes that aren't already shaped at the end. Your parents must have visited Amish country at some point. :) My mom had some of those trivets too. They used to sell them in tourist gift shops in Lancaster County. I really appreciate you showing how you work these things out. You have a very creative and resourceful mind.
Pushing boundaries is the foundation of knowledge building, I love and respect what you do and your desire to share it.
What a grueling job.Anyone other than Dave would be frustrated.His patience is incredible.
Once again thanks for the video.
Always a pleasure. Informative and funny as well.
Thanks for sharing with us Dave, guess we will see if you was wrong in the next video. My money is on you!! Stay safe up there and keep up the great videos and the fun you all have around there. Fred.
Gotta recognise Dianne's editing on this one! She's getting almost as good as Karen on Cutting Edge Engineering Australia!
Watch these 2 shows and Essential Craftsmen religiously
CEE one of my very favorites too. I love watching expert craftsmen performing their magic.
Are they the ones with the dog called Homeless?
With all that work I really hope you get paid well. I really enjoy watching you work, you are truly the of your trade. But let's not forget, your a woodworker, welder, black Smith, seamstress, ect. That's why I enjoy watching your videos. Plus let's give a shout out to your wife for all the work she does, on these videos.
Wow, I never heard an electric tool labour that hard and still be okay. There´s a LOT of torque to go around in this, please when You address the drill take us along. I´d like to see how that´s built, the plug must be glowing after this. Thanks from Germany
Keep your old drilling machine in honor. New ones would burn in seconds😉 greetings from germany
I am surprised you haven’t cut the end off that new tenon cutter and added a piece to make the pocket deeper. You have all the tools needed to do that. Metal lathe, welder etc.
It's always a pleasure watching you work Dave. You are a true inspiration.
This one is a great tutorial on how you developed your process, which seemed to be a little bit of a challenge to work it all out. It passed through my mind about “how was this done in the olden days?” If you know how it was done and could demonstrate the differences between then and now, I for one would be very interested. Great work Dave it’s always a pleasure to see a new video is available to us.
Always enjoy watching your Channel interesting to see how things were done awesome craftsmanship! Make sure you keep that drill all greased up! You're really pushing it bad boy! Columbus Michigan
A lot of tedious work involved and working through issues as you go. Sadly, you get it all worked out about the time you finish. Thanks for sharing.
Wow, that drill is a real torque monster. Thanks for the video.
Some times I find doing the wrong thing the writing way work’s very well. Keep it up 😅
Decades ago a good friend of mine loaned me an antique hand tool that did this job. It worked pretty good and helped me to clean up some tenons made of white oak I needed for a 2 wheeled Red River Cart I was making to use in living history events of the North American Fur Trade.
I think I would try adding a rake angle to the cutting edge on your tennon cutter to give it more of a slicing action rather then just brute force cutting with the entire edge at the same time. I imagine a 30 degree rake back would cause the chips to eject away from the cut better and hopefully require a lot less power. It might be worth a try on the next wheel since it is just a simple blade modification. Hope it helps if you try it.
The wrong way lol.
You're right, wheel #2 should go a lot better.
Thanks for sharing!
I was just typing the suggestion of lock-tite behind the blades and shzam there you go! Nice workaround for the problem
Great video. I worked In plumbing Construction. We use what is called a core drill. It is like your drill setup with the same motor, but it also has an external breaker box attached with a meter.if I
The pin goes in the red it can burn up your drill. Just a way to monitor your amps.
As with any process, it's running really well just as you finish with the final item in the batch.
The only detail that I can still comment on is that your black tenon cutter. If it were balanced there would be less wobble
I ever loved to see all those contraptions and specialized tooling in Your workshop. Still got better with explanations and a glimpse into the little tricks You use to reach the deciding difference between "just another tool" and "my working system" (edit: ...to then do it wrong anyway 😂). As a boatbuilder I built specialized tooling and jigs and devices for little steps of but important machine-work throughout my career, and I still love to see how other trades are perfecting theirs. Thanks for sharing!
I did log outdoor furniture a few years back and remembered that tenon cutter that I had bought. That was a pretty pricey rascal as I remember......lol
I'd really like to see the gizmo that was used to do the original spokes. Maybe sometime you could comment on how you charge for work like this and the mud wagon. Since you have to invent your way through these projects, I don't see how you can bid them. Then again, there probably are few out there that could even take these on.
Seems like the commercial tenon cutter should have 2 set screws. The could design it to make that possible.
@EngelsCoachShop: I was looking through a book on antique tools and one of the things that was profiled, was a couple of Wheelwright shops.
One had a hinged workstation hub frame. You could work on a wheel in the vertical or horizontal position without changing stands or taking the "in-progress" wheel off the work stand hub. You just pull a pin and hinge over/lay over the wheel from the vertical to the horizontal position. The work stand hub works as normal in either position.
Something like that would save you a lot of "groundwork" and "underneath work".
Don't know about you, but that kind of work isn't as easy as it was. Getting down, not too hard. Getting back up.... a different story.
You can put a paper shim between the knife and the cutter body, we use them all the time in the machine shop to keep stuff from slipping, its really surprising how much firmer you can clamp stuff compared to metal on metal
We used to do this many years ago on a spindle moulder with a square block to hold the cutters deffinatley works
as i posted, they even make a Loctite bonding agent for that. I posted 660 which is a general purpose bearing retaining compound or 638 which is meant for steel on steel that has small contact areas. I just don't think thread locker is going to work well since it's based on threads being present. Then again, sometimes things work when they shouldn't. 1 in a million odds just means it doesn't happen often.
Ha Ha Dave, your last comments are very funny. I too remember little things just like that from my childhood.
Well done as always! good humor at the end!!!!! I get it.
Great video and project.
I have been following you for years, every time I watch with increasing amazement!! Your work is beautiful and... educational!
Thank you very much for all those beautiful videos! Niek
Cutting some flutes down the sides of the cutting will relieve the pressure building up and allow the cutter to spin more freely.
Nice work around to achieve the desired result
Thanks Dave 👍
Your comments toward the end are much appreciated. Keep telling the stories behind the thinking..
Very good Dave
A sanding drum the same radius as the cutter chucked in a drill press will sharpen the cutters.
8:41 try using a bearing retainer compound between the blade and the tool . Loctite 609 , 620 , 641 or 660 or one of the Permatex retaining compounds. Bearing retaining compounds are specifically designed to have extremely good shear strength , but it will release if you loosen the screw and tap the back of the blade with a pin punch.
I fixed a 6mm pin into a loose fitting hole with Loctite 609. The surface area of the adhesion would be similar to the blade of your tenon cutter. It took around 6 tonnes to press the pin out after curing.
The tool manufacturer's suggestion of abrading the tool surface and expecting a hardened steel blade to notice any significant increase in friction must be the height of wishful thinking
Thank,Dave!
Brilliantly inventive work. Looking forward to the rest of the series especially the tire setting. Thank you.
Just a smidgen, what a wonderful old word. Thank you, look forward to each episode. St.Paul,Minnesota.
Thanks Dave.
I appreciate you allowing us to come along, right or wrong. God Bless you and Mrs. Engels.
Hey there.
Drill and tap a 3/8-24 hole behind and parallel to those blades and fit a backing gib type screw.
This will allow precise adjustments and keep them from moving out.
A small drum sander with fine paper works well to sharpen them.
Dave thanks for sharing those memories with us 🌴👍👍😎🌴
Let’s send a bit of love for the drill. It’s giving it’s all on this one. 👏👏
I hope you're being paid handsomely for all the time, effort and skill your putting into this job.
I liked your little truisms! Can't wait to tell my wife, Do you have more of them?
There are a few in the other comments.
Hello from Canada. I suggest you check out Veritas power tenon cutters from Lee Valley Tools. They have contoured and straight blade versions with a much better blade retention system. Cheers.
Thank you. We have a Lee Valley catalog.
You're welcome. @@dianeengel4155
I see you have reached 200000 fans. Congratulation.
Thank you.
Here's one for you Dave: "Tough times don't last, tough people do".
You could put a shim in behind the top of the curved tenon cutter blade to reduce the cut depth. and a small packer in the slot in front of the bolt could help stop the blade sliding backwards.