The Magnus Protocol Episode 16 - Review
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- čas přidán 15. 05. 2024
- Trey's theory on Drowning starts at 11:30
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I still maintain that episode 7 was all of the fears. Each donated item represented a different fear, and it was done on Hilltop Rd.
It was definitely an attempt at a grand ritual
I have been of the opinion that Lena isn't trying to trick the employees. She tried really hard to not hire Sam in the trailer, she lets Ted quit in episode 1, she has done small things that shows she at least kind of cares about everyone, and in this episode she tries to fire Gwyn because she put them all in danger, which are all things Jonah would have never done for ANY reason.
Really good point
My personal opinion of which entity relates to the subject of drowning is just "it depends". Every time I see these kinds of discussion I just remember the end of season 2, when Leitner is explaining to Jon about the entities for the first time and Jon asks him "what about bones?". The answer that Leitner gives him is (more or less) that bones by themselves aren't tied to anything, that it depends on what they represent. If they are a reminder of human mortality (like in MAG 29 - Cheating Death, where "Death" is a skeleton in monk robes, and after the soldier wins he is himself turned into a skeleton to take the monks place) it's The End, but if it's about the physicality of bodies (like the whole thing with Jared Hopworth and The Boneturner's Tale) is The Flesh, or if it's about the structure of human bodies and changes of it to make it feel wrong (like Michael as The Distortion having "long sharp fingers" that "seemed to have too many bones", I think I remember people describing it), it might be The Spiral. I feel like more frequently the basic "theme" of the fear might be more important than just the "object" through which the fear manifest, so if the fear of the ocean is about being lost in it, how impossibily big it is and the shear scale of it (or of something in it) dwarfing you, it's The Vast; if the fear is about being unable to breathe, of trying desperately to draw in air and just being suffocated by water, of it burying in water everything you've ever known, than it's the Buried; or if it's about what might be hiding in it, of every possible unknowable monster or threat that could be beyond where we still have enough light to see through the water, than it's closer to The Dark.
I still agree that sometimes it's multiple entities together, but I feel like it's more in the cases where the basis of the fear is not so clear cut, and when there's distinct aspects of the basis of multiple fears built into something more complex, hard to separate or put in one box or another (both being things that are happening a lot here in TMAGP).
Also, about this episode, the fact that the pain in the heart seems like a physical manifestation of the rejection that the subject was suffering makes me think that there might also be a bit of The Lonely here, but I'm not sure.
Thank you for talking about how she said "the views cut her" and how it sounds so much like "the Angles cut" because I thought the exact same thing listening through todays episode.
just heard the episode and came straight here
Red string time: I think the OIAR is founded on the idea that categorizing the fears into the 14 is at least in part what allowed them to get coherent enough to attempt rituals; the OIAR's mission is therefore to categorize them with such granularity so that they can't "combine" or "organize" into something like "The Buried" or "The Vast". The very idea that there are such larger entities behind individual avatars might be a hazardous thing to think in this universe, lest they materialize like the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man in Ghostbusters, and when the OIAR acts it's to put down someone who's trying to do what Smirke did. Like, Bonzo is a tolerable evil as long as nobody ever tries to put him together in a category with a spooky Russian circus and med students learning so they can pretend to be humans, you know? And that's why all the signifiers of the fears we're used to are all mixed up in these cases; it's the result of active effort to keep everything mixed up.
Good idea! I can only imagine how difficult it would have been to mark Jarchivist with like 300 different aspects and not have him die XD
Who knows? Maybe the web allowed the final beholding ritual to work BECAUSE the category were irreparably large
I honestly think that magnus archives was all about proving the fears were not seperate, rituals cant be done seperately, the eye finger boot metaphore implies that they are all the same creature. And the overlap is further proof that they are all the same being, its just humans rawing lines saying one thing is iffrent than another
If you're still feeling like relistening, give 195 a try. I saw a theory that the drowning victim in TMP 15 is them, continuing their statement in the first person this time, and I can't shake it. Even if it's wrong, the parallels are spectacular, and it's another case of vast-buried-dark-etc. And there's a monster under the surface of the water, which brings me back to the tattoo in TMP 11 and maybe back to Alison Leshi.
I'm not sure if who gets what case matters, but today's played on Sam's computer; Alice was just in the room, listening.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who mixed up the cemetery incidents!
I felt like there were a number of "can't be an accident, it's possible they're teasing us" references. There's "dig" (buried), the fact that people set Madame E's door (spiral) on fire (desolation), and that the three-word location code to the grave's location was "from vision ruled" (eye).
I really, really wonder how they swung that, by the way. Having such a Magnus-suited combo in a cemetery that has some very old and much more recent people buried there, in London (just north of Camden, actually, which I've been waiting to pop up again)...It's too good!
Definitely heard the heartbeat, been watching Magnus Archives again and Elias describes himself as the "heart" of the institute, so interesting callback if so. Also, there was a little noise when Lena was considering Gwen's request to be sent on an assignment, almost like she was perhaps mind-reading her (if the OIAR is indeed a place associated with the eye) or using some kind of other power perhaps?
re: vast/buried, i think the same situation can be different fears depending on who is experiencing it. a person who is more afraid of buried would see drowning in lots of water as that, and someone who is more afraid of vast would see drowning in a lot of water as that. i dunno what drowning in two inches of water would lean towards XD
i panicked in a pool as a wee kid, and i still have some vague memories of it? just barely? and there is the sense of, i can't reach safety, it's just too far away - but a family member did reach me and pull me up, so that didn't really stick too much? but there's also the feeling of, this water is pressing in on me. and swimming as an adult, i sometimes feel it's hard to breathe because the water is pressing on my chest. and that has stuck with me more.
so while both vast and buried might try to get me with drowning, buried would probably get more food out of it :P
so anyway, i think you are right that drowning is pretty strongly inclined to both vast and buried, and i suspect a lot of other common traumatic experiences could also swing several different ways
My question is WHY did Lena send Lady Mawbray after the caterer? What did he do that Lena/her superiors needed him removed?
I wonder if Mowbray was sent after the caterer, or if the caterer was just Mowbray hunting on her own. I'm expecting at some point we hear about unauthorized meals
Hey. Great work, brother. Insightful, well thought out, a huge help navigating the waters of Magnus…
I’m on my third go through of MA, this time with a pen and paper handy…MP has exceeded my expectations.
Some episodes contain more than one entity, so drowning is the buried whether it appears in a vast-centric episode or not
Absolutely, that's why I said I thought it was interesting in hindsight for the Vast and the Buried to be interacting in an episode at all since they are opposites, and how it could tie into what were seeing in Protocol.
The entities are still all connected after all, or so we think at this point anyway. But I could just be wrong! That's the fun of theorizing.