Stihl ms 461 R vs. Makita ea 7900 p Bone Stockers
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- čas přidán 18. 02. 2019
- I had started both of these saws previously to get them warmed up a little. Not sure why the 7900 was such a bear to restart....
The 461 had a little bit tougher go in the knots with the first runs being equal but the 7900 being way low tuning wise. Knots can easily cost a second or two.
In the second runs, the 461 was still dealing with a pretty good knot contingency where the Makita was not and came in a couple of seconds quicker.
The spring mounts in the Makita have it pulsating a little bit more with an aggressive chain I noticed as well.
I had run these two in another head to head were the knots were not a factor and the times were just about exact. The 461s come rebroke in where the Makita/Dolmar saws do not. This 461 has about a tank on it while the Makita has only burnt a few oz. That would be a testimony to the Makita....
Published numbers: Stihl 461 is 6.0 hp. Makita 5.75 hp.
They seem pretty close to the same to me.
I am currently available for custom saw modifications. Please shoot me an email if you are interested.
danger_cat@rocketmail.com
Thanks for watching. - Zábava
Great video Jack. I really enjoyed the last couple of videos with the stock saws going head to head. Be safe.
Can't wait to see what you can do with the Makita. God bless.
Always wanted a 7900, really love the sound, how they idle and rev out really reminds me of my dads old husky 480cd, great sounding saws on top of being a good unit.
Dolmar/Makita 👍
Indeed!
i guess it's kinda off topic but does anyone know of a good place to watch newly released movies online ?
@Declan Thaddeus lately I have been using Flixzone. You can find it on google =)
hotsaws101....I don't know a lot about nothin but know a lot about sumthin and your knowledge and vids spot on! Far as i can tell anyhow. I love saw chainin and cuttin wood! Keep on keepin on brother!
you are using for makita a stihl bar with 1.6 mm (0.063") groove ?
Hey Jack. Nice vid but that rpm seemed low both my slr 7910 makita/dolmar revs higher. I have heard tho if you use that hd filter with the slr exhaust version saw it doesn't like it.... could be that, apparently it flows worse?
Rick hi. Higher to what reading exactly? Which tach? What elevation?
The 7910 Dolmar/7900 Makita is supposed to have the 12.5K limited coil. But, since anything in this world can happen, if you purchased one of the super early ones it is possible that one of the earlier version 13.8K coils made its way on to your saw.
This is ~ 3900' in elevation. The lack of air plays a part. The coils are listed at 12.5 for the miss by the factory literature. Doesn't surprise me that ~ 12.250 is the limit here since they varied in the 13.8K version also from ~ 13.3 to 13.8 from what I had seen.
The flow in the slr tube is counter productive. Based on that, there would/must be a limit when considering it from a physics perspective.
My guess from looking at one it's lower rather than higher.
Thanks for watching.
I'm getting 12,600 on my Dolmar 7910. Using a PET1000 tach. Not sure of the differences between mine and the newer Makita version though.
Since it is rev-limited (pretty low, but a big saw), and you went to the stop on the carb, and then backed out just a little, after porting/muffler, and coil, it will need a lot more fuel. I know you sometimes actually open up the carb a little. But, for a "regular guy" with just a muffler and coil, or maybe just a muffler, and leave the rpm's low, is that carb ok, or is it goof, and you need to replace it with an older Dolmar one?
Blanko hi. Belated, sorry.
It will depend upon your chains - specifically how they are set up and therefore cut.
In a stock saw the "new & improved" super low limited coil might not be a hindrance. You will have to ascertain that part.
I guess that if it is not acceptable, then an older coil might be in store.
Regarding fuel mileage, stock saws are whoa-fully fuel inefficient.
I get about the same amount of run time in my zipped saws as what the stocker yield. Get a lot more done also
Might be my chains there...
Thanks for watching.
@@hotsaws101 Thanks so much for the reply! Appreciate your wisdom.
Hi hotsaws! What oil would you recommended for my stock dolmar
7900? Is Motul 800 road racing ok or would you recommended something else?
Best regards!
There is many good two stroke oil, good one is Castrol xr77 mix 35:1 ratio.
Domlar 7900 hi.
H1-R from Bel-Ray.
I looked around for the Castrol. Doesn't seem to be available in this neck of the woods. Across the pond, they have it everywhere.
The xr77 shows promise as good choice but I've never ran it to know "fir" sure.
I run around 48/50:1 personally on most saws.
Thanks for watching.
@@hotsaws101 I think when your saw running hot weather and heavy cutting work, gasoline mixture need also ricinus compound.
Hello. you will make a video ported 7900 vs ported ms461
I have a MS362. What can you do with it, performance wise?
T. Jeff hi. From a week ago: czcams.com/video/kc2aK0R5oLM/video.html
There are other vids in the collection as well. Thanks for watching.
Great comparison!
Do the stihl bars work no issue on the makitas. I was told you needed an adapter from baileys or to make an adapter to run stihl bars because of smaller studs on the makita
Kenneth hi. Not without the adapter - then they do. Thanks for watching.
Can you Please give me a part # for an unlimited ignition coil? I got ea7900 and need more rpm!
Thanks.
Watch bayou country power saws he does a lot of work with the domar saws and he will help ya out with any questions that you have
get a coil from an older (2012) 6400 dolmar, get an older muffler too. go for the extreme duty air filter assembly too. they make a fuel additive called (DAVID LILES FUEL ADDITIVE) FROM FLORIDA that will give you about 30% more power. I have some brand new 6400 (2012) dolmars that we used to jug up to 7910 size. we just about double the power like that. Call Chris at 810-650-1853 if you want to buy one, they are about $1,000.
how do you use the stihl bars on the Husqvarna mount saws, do you have a spacer that you put in? ALSO are you taking any saws in for port work
Michael hi. Yepper. Before you could buy the Dolmar/Makita version retail, I made my own.
Shooting me an email is the best first point of contact.
Thanks for watching.
Tried emailing you not sure if you have the same email
So which do you prefer
What make/model of tachometer do you use?
I’m pretty sure that’s a decibel meter.
@@jonnda LOL. That's a tach
Love the Dolmar :-) thanks for comparison. Beste Regards aus Deutschland ;-)
Dolmar perfecta motor 👍dolmar love me
Is there any chance that you ever weighed the 7900 and the 572? Just the saw bone dry
Dont get the 572, the top cover has vents cut in it that blow chips right into your eyes. Other than that its amazing.
What do you use 2 stroke oil for your chainsaw and proportion ? Thank's.
leSeb hi. This would be a good place to start your seasrch: czcams.com/video/XIxgOQ4GsNM/video.html
50:1 for the most part. Thanks for watching
I'm a big fan of Motul 800 offroad at 40:1. The lower end and bearings really love this oil, good viscosity. All the saws that ran on this oil looked very good inside after hundreds of hours of use compared to other oils or lower ratios.
I think that Dolmar/Makita is going to be a beast once you do your magic touches to it Jack. It's sad that Makita is doing away with the Dolmar name. Have you worked on any Efco's before. I watch almost all of your videos and I haven't seen one. There is an Efco/Dolmar dealer near me with 1 Efco MT8200 (82 cc's) left for sale. Unfortunately, Efco doesn't even make that big of a chainsaw anymore. Only about 64 cc's max now.
John hi. I surely hope so. Agreed. No. Buy it, Send it over.... The big two are pretty entrenched world wide. It seems like the smaller players struggle to acquire market share. Thanks for watching.
Makita is owner of Dolmar since 20+ years ago.It is now that they are using their colors and brand on the saws.
Honestly that dolmar must not be broken in i got the exact same model saw swinging a 28 inch bar and mine cuts way faster than that even though i want may more power haha i had put close to 10 tanks though mine before it broke in and started running way better
Chase hi. I addressed this in the description. Thanks for watching.
Is that normal for starting a dolmar? I'm thinking about buying a makita.
NTC hi. Not usually. This ~ 4000' in elevation and pretty cold. I had let them both warm up quite a bit before the filming started and did not completely clean out the crankcase on the Dolmar.
They have a SUPER low high rpm limit. It's around 12,500. In stock form not such a big deal. Zipped, it a real problem.
Thanks for watching.
hi. what size bar are you using?, whats the longest on the 7900 you think makita can handle?.
my 7900s horible to restart too especially when out of gas.
conmanumber1 hi. 32" bar. Depends on the state of tune of the saw. There is a video somewhere in the collection with a 7900 Dolmar sporting a 42". I never noticed that being a problem. But, then again, I never use them in stock form. Thanks for watching.
@@hotsaws101 Do you guys warm up saws prior to maxing them out?, I like to warm up then cool down 3 to 4 minutes either end. I use Amsoil
Muito bonita essa Makita
Chain seem to be little hungry 👍
Greg hi. This is the exact same chain that the little saw that could (362 c-m Psy-Ko) used to whip this very 461. It's the saws and their state of tune for the most part. Thanks for watching.
I thought the same.
Is there any news on the Makita front regarding production? There seems to be less places to buy new 7900s these days; last I looked there weren't any on eBay and Amazon only had a few. Kind of concerns me, as I'm looking to pick one up before summer.
Cameron hi. idk. Cannot get a hold of the local rep either. Need some ?s answered.... Makita bought out Sachs (Dolmar) quite a few years ago and "lost" the "Marqué". I think that they are serious about supplying the market but are still switching gears from closing out the Dolmar line and the transition has not gone quite as smooth as expected/hoped.
Thanks for watching.
@@hotsaws101 I see "local" tool vendors that sell Makita everything, but they seem a little reluctant to take up the chainsaws. I think you're onto something with them wanting to purge all the "old" Dolmar models. Hopefully there will be news on the new model front before too long.
Let's see a match up between 572xp VS EA7900
Luke hi.
It's a 70.57cc saw going against a 78.58cc saw. The 572 is rated at 5.7hp whereas the Makita is 6.0hp, both in stockly form. I don't think the 572 is going to win.
Once zipped, and all things being equal, the 572 is not going to win.
But maybe at some point we will take a look at the differiantial.
Thanks for watching.
The makita 79cc has been wonderful for me; powerful, runs a 28" oregon bar with a D76 chain 72 teeth 7/16" (3/8) with zero issues. It doesn't start up first time usually, but once I have it going its more consistent than any other saw I have. The pull cord needs a little working in to make it possible to start standing; they guy in the video is a BEAST for being able to pull it like that brand new after what I've experienced. A little more robust than the stihl 461 IMO; I'm personally not a fan of M-Tronic; I like the simple old school tech, and the makita is as close to a no frills, pro saw as I've found. Best stock teeth around. The tightening mechanism is flimsy so constant cleaning, and care is needed to keep saw at full function. I will saw the Stihl 194T is the best in tree saw for me; although the husqy and the makita battery make good backups. Also in case anyone is reading this I also have heard good things about echos for the price point
I've been eyeing a new 462cm, but this 7900 looks more and more attractive. Love the rounded shape of it all, seems to be way easier to clean than the Stihls.
The guy pulling the saw over is real narrow, but as wirey as could be. I own the 7900 and it ain't to bad to start. I have a few old muscle saws that are man killers to start without the decomp. My Mcculloch 125c has something like 205+ pounds compression and my poulan pro 655 BP has right at 200 pounds compression!!!
@@bkb5668 hi. After years on the end of a pistol grip a guy will get that way, lol.
I have built a few saws for fallers working at 6k & above. A 390 that was over 220 at sea level is an example.
There is an art to starting the old skool mo-chines from what I've found.
Thanks for watching.
jack why was the 461 chugging so bad?
Andy hi.
Stocker. Struggling with a falling chain set up for a zipped mo-chine.... in fact if memory serves, they were both lagging a little.
Thanks for watching.
Ms 461👑
my Makita 5600 is a hard starter sometimes
any chance we can get these in 720p or greater?
Yes, as @Andrew Hill said @FishFind3000 Google takes some time to convert to 720P or higher. So it's nothing that Jack did wrong.
Rakers too low on the stihl??
Wedge 850t3 hi. Same chain on both saws. It's one of my felling chain used on a saw that is zipped and run WAY better than either of these.
Thanks for watching.
I’ve been very unimpressed with all stihls saws. The 461 should be able to pull a 32 with ease in softwood. Anything over a 25” and it’s underpowered
You might have just tried a bad one. I have a 362 that pulls a 25 like a scalded dog in hardwood
You are right. I work for a tree company and i dont think stihls oil enough even when turned all tge way up. I have a echo 680 with a auto and manual oiler and it cuts better than the 461. I dont like stihls because they are starting to make them so you have to take them to the dealer to have any kind of work done to them.
Install a high output oiler. I agree on the stock oiler
I've run a 28" bar on my 441 with relative ease. I would run a skip or semi skip chain and make sure your chains sharp and rakers are right. I dont have much in the way of softwood here,its mostly oak,and maple I'm cuttin.
Guy certainly wasn’t helping the jews escape Aushwitz back in the day so yeah his saws are trash
Is that a D009 bar ??
Jay hi. A large Husqvarna mount.
Thanks for watching.
Does the label still say Made in Germany?
Yes
i ordered the Makita
How do you like it so far? I'm trying to decide if the big mak is the best bang for my buck
Chain kinda tight on the dolkita eh
I run my chains tight. It's purposeful.
Also, this video - czcams.com/video/EHXr5QxN_Ac/video.html -
was added to the collection to enlighten those that lack understanding on the safety side of things. Take a look...
@@hotsaws101 i like no sag, no drag myself. Chain tight enough to snap back into rail, loose enough to rotate by hand with minimal friction, being only from sprockets and oil.
You flooded it badly!!
Dave - Sorry man not true.
Flooded badly is when you cannot get it started and have to take the spark plug out, crank it over a bunch of times and then let it air out for a fair amount of time. At that point, the spark plug can go back in and then starting it.
So then, your assessment is not so.....
I *HAD* this same issue with my Dolmar 7910. I now never use the decompression valve. Every time I do it floods. Its really not a tough saw to pull without the decomp. anyway. I had it flooded so badly once that it had to be taken apart and cleaned because it wouldn't start
Green earth..... the vid stopped just a little early ......
Joe hi. Yah, my assistant was a little trigger happy on this day. The whole flock is like this, sorry. We did have a discussion and will get the wardrobe malfunction remedied next time, whenever it stops snowing in this neck of the woods.... Have a blessed day, on His green earth!
Tenho uma makita 7900 e uma sthil 381.A makita perde pra 381 .
What does the saws maximum rpm matter when the actual cutting rpm is the same for both saws? It seems like you would want to tune the saw for best performance at the rpm at which the saw operates at. A good analogy would be holding your car engine at the rev limiter and claiming that it's a good way to test your engine's performance. Makes no sense. Irrelevant. Manufacturers implement a rev limiter for bone heads. When did it become a good idea to pin the throttle on a cold engine?? Quit grinding the rakes down so far..
Arthur - it is for reference and comparison - that both/all saws are running relatively the same. So that one saw doesn't have an unfair advantage because it running more on the pipe.
Actually, it's not a good analogy. 4-cycle car engines are designed run operate at a wide variety of rpms - the majority of which are below 3000. Saws are designed to run with "your foot on the fire wall at all times". Or, wide open throttle. Especially the newer Stihl® saws.
Also, running at their best requires modification to happen. Stockers operate ~ 8/10,000 depending upon elevation, weather conditions, operator input, etc.
Ummm, both were well warmed up RIGHT before the filming started.
I use saws in my "day job" that rip and actually need a chain with the stops taken down a long ways. This is one of those chains. What you see here is a chain set up for a saw with power, which will then also tell you something about what happens when a stock saw gets ahold of it, and then struggles to pull it...
Using a hungry chain and I got an EA7900 and a EA5600. Way more durable than Stihl in my opinion
That stihl is defective, theres something wrong with it.
Jason hi.
No, there is nothing wrong with either. It is around 4000 feet in elevation and the log is frozen. Additionally, both are stock and struggle to pull a chain set up for a zipped saw - by design there too.
Thanks for watching.
Idk Mr hotsaws101 I think there is something wrong too calls epa lol
Why are you so herky jerky when starting your cut? Are you deliberately trying to stall the saws? Not smooth!
Mark hi. There are several responses in this video as to the "y" on the chain chatter. Might take gander. Then view the Psy-ko-ized 362 whoopin a stock 461 with this very chain within minutes of this session.
Thanks for watching.
I want to love the dolmar but the single piston ring setup shys me away call me a stickler 😆
Single or double ring does nothing for long term reliability. All the rings do is providing a seal, 1 2 or 3 of them, it doesn't matter for an engine so small, the performance and lifespan will be the same.
I have two Husky 266 saws, both single ring. One is a 1981, the other 1983. Both still run strong.
ROCKER GAUGE TOO LOW MAN
Regis hi. This is the exact same chain that was used on the same day in the video link: czcams.com/video/kc2aK0R5oLM/video.html
It's not the chain….. Thanks for watching.
At least 10 inches of bar there that you don’t need lol.
Colton hi.
There is more chain weight the longer the bar.
There is more parasitic drag of chain on the rails, both inside and top, the longer the bar also.
Both of those tax the engine more.
So if a guy is wanting to test a saw, or three, for actual power, having more chain is going to help in the process.
Additionally, and as far as I can remember, this is the same bar, chain, and test subject, that the ms362 I built for Mr. TJ is seen pulling through the knot section and besting a stock 461.
Thanks for watching.
hotsaws101 I have been trying to learn some stuff on here about makita saws. So is a makita pretty much a dolmar saw?
@@coltonswindell689 Makita (Corp.) bought Dolmar 12/15 years ago. The platforms, sans paint color & plastic dye, were as identical as you can get from two "different" brands.
They produced the 6400, 7300, and 7900 in the "Dolmar" brand for the majority of time. Congruently, was the 6401, 7301, and 7901 in the "Makita" brand. I never really noticed a difference in those except for the color, but I never looked into either until ~ ten years ago.
They changed the 7900 to 7910 and the 7901 to the 7900, dropped the "Dolmar" namesake, and changed the "Makita" color scheme to the orange & black it is now.
This is a brief overview only.
Sort ya rakers out
I had responded to Regis & Greg already regarding the chatter and/or struggling.
The chain is one of my falling specimens. Set up for use with a zipped saw.
Stock saws are innately underpowered and will not handle the same setup - teeth angles, stop elevation, and/or gullets - anywhere near with a ported saw will.
Also, one of the Psy-Ko zippkited 362 I built handled this same chain, same day, nicely while besting a stock 461.
Chaine mal affûté
Jean - Ou, du bois vraiment dur et gelé qui donne au stockeur une course pour son argent ...
Rakers are too low
That was purposeful.
I addressed this very point, a long time ago in a response to Mr. Dombroski.
Thanks for watching.
I love saws but man it's almost an awful sound STOCK NOOOOOOO!!!! ha ha crazy to think they are so held back in performance by the factory and well the "greenies" in politics
Josh hi. I personally won't take a stocker off the landing. They cut like as nose bleed...… Thanks for watching.
It’s a common mis-conception that the 50:1 ratio was “mandated by the epa” and that the Saw “lasts longer” on 32:1 in NORMAL operation ie felling and bucking ... You have to run the piss out of the Saw at 40:1 or lower otherwise carbon buildup becomes a problem ... The excessive oil (40to1 or more)HOLDS in heat and also REDUCES the OCTANE of the fuel ! 50:1 with good gas and top notch synthetic mix oil has been PROVEN by multiple Real-world tests to give SUPERIOR PERFORMANCE period !
@@fabzacres-blackcat Nothing you say is true except the first part regarding 50:1 being mandated by the EPA, which is indeed false. It's not EPA, but it's still politics. Outside the US, Canada and Europe, Stihl recommends their oil to be used between 40:1 and up to 25:1 in their saws! Why would they do that, if 50:1 is so good? Hmmm.
@@em4703 try reading your manual ... mine says minimum 89 octane non-ethanol 50:1 ratio ... have a Merry Christmas
Nothing like a cold start, out in the cold, then running the crap outta the machine! Cold seizure on the way! Since these get modded and torn apart, guess they don’t care? Should be dogging them in a bit more and cutting a bit more from the front, just MHO. I think you maybe flooded the Makita trying to start it? 🤷🏻♂️🙄🤔 Can’t give it a thumbs up, sorry.
Peace
George hi.
I've never cold seized a saw. I've owned and wore out a lot of different "nuker" saws over the years.
Sitting in the SUV, heater on high, until just before. I've started them up at some point before the record button is pushed also.
The end of the lower tine is in a different location on all saws. That is, elevation (distance from the teeth vertically) and distance from the drive side case. This means the leverage aspect is also different on all saws. So with any particular chain set up, one saw might be perfectly suited and another marginally suited at best...
Talk about an unfair advantage and/or bad comparison. Dawgs in is it.
You might consider getting yourself some top tier mix oil. That also helps.
Once a guy gets properly educated, things become more clear.
I am thankful you watched. Sure wish the assumptions were dealt with in ? form though.
@@hotsaws101 Hi and thanks for kind reply. ☺️ You obviously are more knowledgeable on the subject, and have an advantage on me with the tech side of things! I’ve done a fair bit of cutting in my day, so to speak. Thanks for the clarification and please accept my apology for just assuming things I did not know. Dummy me just read where you said you had started them previously! Idiot here! Including that info below the video does help. You are correct, and I am guilty of not phrasing or posting my comment like I should have! That’s on me! One of my saws is a 45 cc Husqvarna that I’ve had since new, circa 2005/2006? Still running, and nothing other than regular maintenance has been done on it. I always use good oil, and ethanol free gas, but recently have been using Pre Mix with great results! I will change it to a ‘like,’ and I will give you a Subscribe! Hope that helps you and no hard feelings? Stay safe and Healthy! 👍👍👍😁✌🏻
Holy balls you cannot handle a saw!
First time Eric
Elvis couldnt sing 😂
Seriously? Go somewhere else.
eric smith dude get your head out of what ever it is in to man you probably won’t be able to fine the choke on a saw
I guess the sarcasm was lost in my post! 😬. I know who this guy is and is probably the best faller I’ve seen on CZcams!
if you still have limiters on , your too lean, take them off.bottom the main screw and turn out 2 1/2 turns to start with. then power test unit. lean out carb to get max rpms and then richen it up to get a 400 rpm drop in rpm. I would not waist to much time on that carb. we had many that were bad from Germany. they were run with crappy fuel in Germany and some fuel stayed in system and it went bad while in storage , which could be a year. most of the replacement carbs are not anti pollution units. were you smart enough to check your final filter on the bottom of the carb. try a CARLTON A-1 3/8 ,050. full chisel chain and use the Carlton raker gauge to set rakers. what am I waisting my time on you for, your aren't smart enough to take good advice. the woods is going to get you.
Chris -
The title has "Bone Stockers" right in it. So if you alter, well anything, then it's not an accurate representation of what you get in two saws fresh of the self, which these two were - and the Bone Stockers concept.
The brush stroke idea of "just do this" with the needle/s is a complete fallacy. It is ~ 4000' in elevation. If anything, the "Bone Stockers" have a tendency run to rich at this height.
Again, the chain was one of my felling chains used on modded saws. I'm pretty sure that this chain is the one used when my 044 SMOKED a stock 660. So, it is the lack of power in the stock saws.
I think that the idiot figure pointing is interesting. I think that for what was shown here, maybe looking in the mirror might just be the place to start....
hotsaws101 well said. You don't even need to waste your time on condescending know-it-alls like this guy.
What an idiot. Jack probably has forgotten more than you know. Sound like a keyboard commando. And judging from your pic , you probably get your exercise getting out of your easy chair. Way to go jack for your calm response. Better than I could. Your videos are awsome by the way