Sam Delivers The News To The Firm About Their Fire Sale Mission | Margin Call
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- čas přidán 30. 05. 2022
- Sam tells the firm that they are about to begin their fire sale, to liquidate all of their assets.
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The way defeatedly says “for the greater good”, like he knows it’s bullshit and knows that they know it’s bullshit, is such a great touch.
What happens, one of those traders says “no, I’m out, won’t do it”
it doesn;t happen because u lose your job anyway and now they earn if all goes 3million. greed is powerfull@@Nill757
@@Nill757 He's fired now without a $2.7M compensation and the rest of the floor has to do his work for him.
@@Pippin1505 that’s not the problem. One word on the street and sale fails. I suppose they have NDAs.
Bloke behind him gave the performance of a lifetime
David Horne.... One of senior in house counsel
lol!
Jared was better.
The reason they had this guy in every scene but saying or doing nothing is exactly how it went down. Big banks put their lawyers in every controversial/shady meeting so that they can claim legal privilege, despite the fact that the lawyer never utter a sound, so that they can avoid disclosing information as they please during discovery.
So if they only sell 92%, rather than 93%, they have destroyed their relationships AND don't get their bonuses, but the firm has unloaded almost the same amount.
the bonus would be tiered
The firm doesn't care, they just want the sales staff to feel motivated to sell everything they can.
Precisely.
yeah, nice way to motivate your team. haha
The losses baked into in the instruments they are selling are more than the entire market capitalization of a major Wall Street investment bank. One whole percentage point is not "almost the same amount."
They understand.
DO THEY???!!!!
Do YOU?!
“The greater good,” how nice of them!
Everytime someone says that I chant "THE GREATER GOOD" like the cultists in Hot Fuzz.
"They believe..." I love how every time Sam makes a speech he makes it sound like he's on the trader's side and is fighting for them against the management.
He was on his traders' side....was legit arguing with Tuld in that partners meeting to not go through with this
Not sound like, he WAS on their side.
@@isthatujeebus Yes, it does seem like it however, having worked in a similar firm, it is a very delicate balance the character Sam has to deal with. He is management but he needs to defend the traders interest. As it is such a cut throat business, they can't be too much on the trader side as redundancies are regularly made purely forthe bottom line.
@@blackcat4859 it's not SEEM like it either. Unlike the real world, we were privy to the management meeting where he expressly stated his objections to the entire plan.
@@isthatujeebus True
while he obviously disagrees with the decision, he also has no Plan B. he strikes me as one of those guys who can afford a version of humanity only because he doesn't have to make the tough decisions.
true, but what is the alternative? The firm is overleveraged, if they dont get it off the books the firm collapses and everyone loses their jobs anyway. The problems were known months if not years...if not virtually immediately. This is fictional, but the banks and trading firms before the crash..at the top...they knew. They all had number crunchers. They knew that the fed would bail out the top banks and that a few smaller ones would be sacrificial. They let one big one crash, Lehman. I mean the US government took over AIG. The whole banking system should have been broken up, the CEOs and boards should have been charged with criminal negligence. There was virtually no stomach for it. There were a few on both sides of the aisle calling for it..but i will bet most of them knew they could call for it and it wouldnt happen so they werent sticking their necks out. WS pumps so much money into politics it isnt even funny. It is our largest industry and has been since the economy was financialized. Ive heard it explained that in 2008, Goldman essentially was first out of the door in a fire, because they smelled the smoke first, but then locked the door afterthemselves because it made them look better. Meanwhile their ex CEO was Treasury Secretary, and another ex goldman person was running the NY Fed (the most important fed bank), and then became the next treasury CEO. The idea that we would ever make the uber rich pay for the economic malfeasance is laughable. I mean the dems barely have a stomach to even try...its at best some of the progressives...meanwhile the GOP appoints judges who are busy tearing down the right of the SEC to regulate securities or the right of the government to classify income.
His Plan B was rejected well before this sales meeting. Watch the entire movie.
Jared looking at their reactions when sam mentions the 1.4 mi. He knew it would be a success.
... and there was the end of Lehman Brothers.
The bank in the movie survived.
This is Goldman Sahs
good movie
I love how he enlightens the tone after disclosing the target bonus payouts. After 2.7M is in their heads, he very well knows it’s sold to all of them. Then he goes down again to explain the depths of the situation I think just out of his will to do the right thing, and at the it he drops that “ for the greater good” line masterfully like he realised enough of BS, you all know the figure you are getting, let’s get to work 😂
It is a really complex thing, but at the end of the day, 2.7M is life changing money.
> at the end of the day, $2.7M is life changing money
About $1.4M after taxes 😅 and considering he's asking them to detonate their own careers as investment bankers... yeeeeesh.
That's not "retire to Tahiti & live happily ever after" level money. That's more like "just enough to retire to a LCOL state" money, or for the young execs, "go to law school / pivot into pharmaceutical sales" moneyn
As one of them, I would've called a snap team meeting just after, agreed to do nothing unless they doubled the amounts and lowered the percentages to 70%. The client managers have the Executive by the clackers!
No one would have followed you, theyd just share the money you left on the table
Hmm, then the executive would be stupid. You think those people are stupid?
Imagine another way the firm has leverage over those traders trying to hijack the company. What happens the next day to you? You think you have a job? You think you can get another job anywhere in securities doing anything?
@@Nill757 Not stupid, desperate! It's the way you sell it. If those traders do nothing, or perhaps inform their competitors, it's game over for the company.
@@shaundeverson2163 unbelievable. As I said, What happens the next day after you hijack your own company, all Wall St knows you did. They also have stock waiting to be released. What happens to that?
@@shaundeverson2163yes and you will also be subsequently black listed everywhere. Have fun at McDonald’s.
Is that the firm's in-house counsel standing behind Sam, glaring at him?
Probably the legal guy make sure everything is in order
@@alexn4255 yeah- exactly what he asked
No, He is basically the second in command of the Firm.
@@suvansh29 the guy behind him he said, not the aus actor
This speech is foreboding. It was during the last economic crash we had in 2008 but we survived. We got through it
we, the system survived. but boy, did a lot of little guys die
I’m curious when the sale is made over the phone, how soon does it become binding and whether the purchasing parties can back out of them by lunch time.
Pretty sure the second both parties have said yes. That's an oral contract and although much harder to prove than a written contract (unless all calls are recorded) then it functions the same way.
@@isthatujeebus All calls are *absolutely* recorded.
Its binding on the phone. Its all recorded. All counterparties make binding decisions. Thats how markets work. Only authorised people are allowed to buy/sell.
Crooks. And they were rewarded for it
Did they know? Did they understand?
That will always be the thing with a complex banking crisis like this over something easily identifiable like a Ponzi scheme. Take Bernie Madoff. You can easily explain what was done that was wrong and point to the criminal acts of a person knowingly defrauding others for his personal benefit.
But here, did the traders know how over leveraged the firm was? Did they know that the underlying mortgages backing these securities weren’t properly risk-rated? Would they have known HOW things got to that point? Would they have had reason to belief that something so egregious was going on at such a prestigious, respected firm?
One of the biggest issues with the 2008 collapse is that the whole system was so large and complex-everyone so detached from every other part of the paradoxically interconnected system-that obfuscation of criminal liability is not just incredibly easy, but a natural part of all of it. There’s no one person we can point to and say “He did it. He performed these specific criminal actions.”. There’s no Bernie Madoff. It was an interconnected system of misaligned financial and business incentives.
This is why we need much stronger banking regulations.
...and we got the bill.
What part of "So that WE may survive!!" don't you get? 💡🤨🤔
The volume of how much i watch this movie is very disturbing lol😢
I wish Kevin Spacey is not a bad person in real... Such a great actor.
He is not a bad person he just did mistake once years ago we all do mistakes in our lives
He has been found not guilty, so, maybe not such a bad guy after all.
Sam said "as a result" like 3 times in a minute in this scene. I wonder why they made that choice in the script. Maybe the character was really nervous, I'm sure that was the case considering the circumstances. I love this movie.
Stress-driven verbal compartmentalization
Too bad Kevin Spacey was cancelled for goosing another man. He was s great actor.
Does anybody remember if they get the two piece of bonus 1.4m + 1.3m?
Yes. In the film, they hit their targets.
@@chrisv741 Thanks buddy
Shows he too manipulates his workers. He turned the whole speech into an emotional thing: you get money and I love you. Shows he aint no different than the boss. Boss just more cruel, that's why he gets the "big bucks". The actor was so good here, that he is acting within the acting. Look at the pauses. Also superinteresting, the vicepresident or Whatsever you call it, leaves the room when he apoligizes and takes responsability for some stuff! Obviously did not want to hear it, he knew bout courts later. The less he says and knows the better. He also remaind real silent on the meeting were selling all was appointed and decided.😮
$2.700.000 in 2011 you can start over, doing something u love. Imagine top executive will get paid at least 27 millions 😅 decent retirement package.
They know that 93% is impossible.
The biggest lie comes after suggesting to, "have faith," which is standard in life.
If I was cutout for this kind of work I would have lived as a minimalist bachelor for 10 years made bank and retired. Many of these people around that table probably need that $1.4million due to living beyond their means.
There’s a part where one of the characters actually breaks down in detail his expenses versus income. A hell of a lot went to booze and strippers
That's almost impossible, once you are in that environment, there is tremendous pressure to keep up, i.e. get suits, or get an apt that is close to work so you can get there at 6:40 all suited up, maybe you need to work 80-100 hours a week and you need drugs to keep up, and then need booze to take the edge off, etc. You want that promo and raise, you have to schmooze with your seniors, it wont be at the library, but instead at the lounge/bar/golf course, time to pick up some tabs maybe?
All this while your fam & friends back home think your rolling in easy dough and want handouts.
@@jayzee316 I would also add that the kind of people that are “cut out for this work” as OP said might not be predisposed toward frugality and minimalism, and couple that with the sort of lifestyle creep you described, it gets pretty hard to “just save money”
@@noahmendoza8548 you're spot on, if you had the personality of minimalist and didnt want to get uber-rich, you likely self-filter from fighting your way into wallstreet as its certainly very competitive to get in. Even the hiring managers would screen for how much you WANT to be a banker, how keen you are, etc. That's how they know they'll get the most out of you.
Look at the education and credentials of the people in that line of work. In this case the junior risk analyst had a Phd. Michael Lewis and others who worked in bond trading had a bachelor's degree and a masters degree in economics/finance. Plus the firms recruit and have training programs. Only the very motivated go into these firms and work to climb up rather than be squeezed or packaged out.
93% sale? But at what cent on the dollar?
His hand gestures while announcing the payout structure seem like he's the conductor of a symphony of sh!t.
Each of those sellers are walking away with at least a 2 million dollar bonus on top of their salaries.
I wouldnt says its enough to retire on, but enough to help while you're transitioning into another career. Maybe make some other considerable investments outside of real estate.
Thing is most of them got a bad rep and changed careers true, however i know a few people who were in the same position back then and after years they came back and were hired do the same job in other firms like nothing happened, some people remember and hate them others just understand and say they would do the same if given the opportunity, others are new to the market and dont care.
So what im trying to say is that there is lots of bussiness to be done when the market is based on greed and short terms gains that they would do bussiness again with those who screwed them back then is that benefits them today, rinse and repeat until the next crash cycle.
@@radicalxg8282 if that’s true, then damn lmao
I don’t blame folks who go back to that as I’m sure there’s a lot of money to be made but sheesh, good luck to anyone who is doing business with them.
At least you can learn about the history of the seller.
In my country Germany the average worker earns about 1.2 mio. € before tax and social contributions during his lifetime. 😉
93% seems like a tall order. Most probably wouldn't make it.
They all went to Buenos Aires until 2014.
If you got any sense you just walk out
Why? If you meet your target you walk out with $1.4m. Regardless of whether you reach it or not you're out the door anyway. Quitting has the same outcome.
The idea that these traders' careers would be over due to this is hilariously naive. Firms who know that these traders were able to clear their books with crazy time restraints knowing what they were selling was useless would hire them to do morally grey shit for THEM now. Firms don't give a fuck about morals, they care about money and how good you are at making/moving it.
Yeah, but not right away. They'd need to take a year or two off, give the hard feelings a chance to fade. Don't forget: the longer you waited to buy, the better off you were when the Fed bailed out the banks.
"Our talents" (i.e., ripping off their own mothers) "have been used for the greater good" (i.e, saving the fat cats while stuffing a cool $2.7 Million in their pockets). Wonder if this BS was included to mock the limitless greed of those who worship money over all else. Even Sam, with a conscience, ultimately sold out because he "need[ed] the money."
I would too. I "want" the money!
If you listen to Will, or watch Big Short, you will see what Sam ment by "greater good" a LOT of Americans got their housing because of Lewis Renery and MBS bond before they got bad. Now most of the traders were not in when the GOOD MBS were sold, but Sam, Will and Jared definitely were.
Essentially original problem MBS solved was that small US Banks had more clients that they would be willing to give a mortage then they really had money to be lending. So you had people who were legit, but were not getting mortages.
MBS solved that and, back in the day, made very good investment vehicle out of it.
Problem was that when the opportunity that existed in the 70s was scooped up that the bankers did not stopped selling MBSs.
No, the movie makes a different point than that. "The greater good" are all the homeowners in the world who got to have mortgages and cars because of the credit created by the global financial system, but who think they, the "regular folks" are different and separate from Wall Street when they're not. The ones who blame Wall Street when they blow things up but who still want full access to the opportunities it provides when things go well and who don't see the contradiction or their place in it. Ultimately it's about how everyone's perspective on morality changes with the market cycle except for the people who really know how it all works - but how those people become abhorrent to everyone else.
@@fenzelian Nailed it.
I love this film, but not all of it is credible. Spacey's character, for instance, is portrayed as very sympathetic - his dog died for Chrissake and he buried it. I imagine a very different kind of person to be running that department in that company.
Rather the contrary - sometimes you have a sympathetic, decent human beings running these kind of departments who are full of dickheads who think they are hot shit because they shuffle numbers around on Wall Street (Will Emerson). Spacey's character has been in the game for far too long to understand what is what. So was Tuld. Across every big company you'll find decent good people calling the shots where you least expect them.
This is the type of garbage that poor people tell themselves so that they don't have to work hard. You have convinced yourself that anyone who is financially successful must be a "dick". You are better than them because you aren't rich, right? Rich people are all bastards.
Such utter nonsense and drivel. The entire spectrum of human personality exists in every strata of the economy. You're not morally superior to a rich guy just because you're poor.
His dog dying was a symbol of his "soul" dying because of this "profit at all costs" industry. He was forced by his need for money to stay with that company for another 2 years.
@@UltimateBargains I thought I was the only one who saw this, i.e. beginning of the story his dog is gravely ill, but he's keeping him alive, then later the dog dies, and when he gives in to Tuld, he goes and burries his dog, like burrying himself/soul and forgetting about it.
Metaphor. Like the blood stains on his hands that he couldn't wash out. He was burying his guilty and culpability.
That pedo is one hell of an actor
Not guilty toad
In real life this will land you in jail everytime
Ummmm, no it doesn't. Watch the big short. One mid-level fall guy got hit, everyone else walked.