Satan Makes NO Sense
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- čas přidán 29. 08. 2024
- Why Did God Create Satan if He knows all future events and Why Is Satan Still Alive and given His Own Realm? Why do people need to pray when God can hear all thoughts and know the hearts of everyone?
Links for Jonathan MS Pearce:
www.patheos.co...
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@ATipplingPhilosopher
#JonathanMSPearce #Satan #Prayer #ATipplingPhiliosopher #Gnostic #GnosticInformant
Links for Jonathan MS Pearce:
www.patheos.com/blogs/tippling/
CZcams:
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@A Tippling Philosopher
satan slapped your butt, pulled up his pants, and left. You did a good job, you will get some followers and maybe some fame.
Stop interrupting your guests. You are a terrible listener
Everything makes sense because there is a seed of evil in the world that oppose the will of The Creator. You two gentlemen are confused about Pharaoh and the Egyptians treatment of Israel, yet today the people of God are still mistreated, gun down and hung from trees unrighteously in the land of America.
Evil exists until the coming of YAH ALMIGHTY!
@@dethstark or it was a fable combined with a parable of ancient times with many lessons. The Torah was mostly from oral tradition and spoken word.
God scattered the Israelites via captivity and humans thought it was wicked of God to do so. But how much harder is it for a German mad man to exterminate a group of people he cannot easily gather in one place? This is an example of God's knowledge vs. Man's knowledge
I clicked because I misread Satan as Batman but I'm glad I'm here 😂
lol
Coincidentally, Christian Bale, the best Batman ever, thanked Satan after a Golden Globe win. The win was for portraying Dick Cheney though.
That makes no sense.
How?😂even the thumbnail is a huge banner. Either way, thanks for the laugh.
Nice profile photo!
As a person who was raised catholic and lost faith around the age of 13 (27 now) this topic hits home incredibly. Basically every subject you guys covered I've thought about immensely growing up. Incredible video guys
Maybe this is because Gnosticism is about to get its due.
@@easter_sunday what is the truth? christain gnostism? i assume its osmething compl;etly else?
@@NightmareRex6
I have this belief in regards to freedom which I believe to be a very real sort of spirit. When freedom is pursued without any sort of moral guide or ground, too often the pursuit of freedom will indulge in events of degeneracy, chaos, violence and destruction which are detrimental to the welfare of a functioning society. Religion, in terms of service to society pursues that grounding through redress of human behavior. Jesus Christ performed miracles not because that was his aim and purpose. The testimony of those events are towards the validation of his teachings, of how to live one’s daily life, and to treat one another in a community are holy by intention as is fellowship between friends, neighbors and family.
The challenge for mankind is to have and pursue freedom with this grounding as the foundation of a successful American society. It is the marriage of the Holy Spirit and the spirit of freedom, and when the bond is honored by a people, the Will of the Father shall be done in thy name.
And do not worship freedom, for her coin requires blood, labor, and sacrifice to earn her token of affection which is necessary for the Liberty by which to worship in the first place. Freedom, as a woman’s love for a man tends to go, is never free.
But as far as a spiritual interpretation of spirits as the inspiration behind the actions of men, I see freedom as the bride of the Holy Spirit, and from this foundation Revelation pursues fulfillment.
Gnosis will be found in the balance between the natural and the spiritual. Mankind pursues neither through the desecrated temple. 🔥
@@scottmcloughlin4371 how would we know what it was without Liberty in which to define it?
Gravity is just as much a thing as the insufferable rage one must feel hearing these two morons in the video sussing out their grief that creation isn't a hospice for their type of retard
If Satan is a rebel against God, then why does Satan punish other people who are rebels against God?
because its only santa claus for adults .. neither exist so a moot question.... but thats the ridiculous part of the god belief ( magic)... people ask questions about something that doesnt exist...
Satan works for God.
I know...mind blown. But, since having free will is a thing. Testing that will is his purpose.
He doesn't. He give them likes, fame, money, pleasures... Then throw them to the garbage like used condoms. He tend to take God's throne, he need some puppets for this job.
He doesn’t according to the buybull.
@@Tyndalic prove it. What is that verse?
"God" is the anti-Spiderman. With infinite power, comes zero responsibility.
I like that
You got his number 🤣🤣👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
In a way you are right. GOD doesn't have to do anything. HE doesn't need us at the end of the day. We need HIM.
@@paulglover6525 What do you need him _for,_ given that he never does anything? We need vehicles because they get us from place to place, we need warm clothes because they keep us from freezing when it gets cold, etc. We need "god" because he...?
@@kevincrady2831 Created us and is the only one who can create life out of and deliver us from death. HE gave us the intellect and the materials to make cars and cloths. You need to use your brain and start giving HIM adoration for not destroying us because of our evil ways toward one another. Have no faith in mankind. History shows us that we don't change.
God got mad at people for being the way he made them. So he drowned all the kitties and puppies and bunny rabbits. This is what Christians call perfect wisdom.
Yep
Seems legit
Not exactly. The fallen angels were playing with flesh and DNA too. He drowned most of the world because he didn't actually make it and people were evil. Noah was saved because he was sought God and wasn't genetically messed over
Absolutely not how the story goes
@@jesusisdead and because God has an incest fetish. But wait... How.much.more genetically messed up can you get than being the result of incest?
There is comfort in delusional thought and belief. I’m glad I left it all behind. My only regret is that I didn’t do it until age 55 or so.
Only Judaism make sense
@@kofiboat779 If you're a Jew!
The bible was edited by man and was originally meant to be a instructor manual. Satans way of having us fall into his traps of being unfaithful to God by hiding the full manual and tricking us. If we hads the whole manual, we would have the tools to become perfect again.
@@paulustarsus Judaism is not for one race its a religion for everyone. If Judaism makes sense to someone more than Christianity the let them find God that way and let God judge them. Humans are all inmates in this prison and no one can judge another inmate unless they want to receive the same judgment. According to the Judeo-Christian Bible.
Any updates on your life experiences after turning your back on God?
Very well said: When people say my thoughts and prayers are going out to you. It will make them feel better and a cop out helping anyone.
I hate the word “prayer” too… I prefer “ visualize” ☺️
@@missmeggie6461 It's not the word, it's the concept. You are begging to someone in power to bend the rules for you.
@@juanausensi499I see what you are saying.. but that’s not what I was talking about. I understand the concept.
I don’t like the word prayer because to me it’s tied to Christianity and that’s why I don’t use the word. Now if we’re talking about the actual concept.. I don’t see it that way.
There’s nothing wrong with tapping into Source to either ask for guidance, or help when feeling lost and frustrated. It doesn’t mean your copping out , I just think intention is everything .
@@missmeggie6461 Ok, so what is 'visualization' then?
@@juanausensi499 I just told you.. lol
When I am feeling lost or frustrated.. or needing a bit of strength, I look to the Source of all things and I say “ please show me guidance”
That is all. I don’t ask for this or that, or to become a millionaire, or to get me this or that… is that so wrong??
I think not
Tom Waites got it .."Ain't no such thing as the devil that's just God when he's drunk"
That's God indeed.
That's a good one, I'll have to remember that.
Hardly most parties dancing drinks are happy go round festivities so no thats not a drinking party guy... its an idiot with smack and a gun or something
Is God always drunk?
@Theseustoo Astyages yep your right was paraphrasing but it's still a great line by Tom
If God is all powerful, Satan does his bidding.
God is all powerful, but not willing to be all controlling. If He were all controlling, He would be a tyrant, and that's not good.
@@JatnaRD
Well, God DID drown many millions of humans including all the babies in the Great Flood. That's a pretty controlling and tyrannical act if you ask me.
@@Reno_Slim
It took Noah 75 years to build the ark
not one single person believed
@@shannakellett9104 the hell does that have to do with him still killing millions of humans and babies?
@@shannakellett9104 if he can kill humans amd babies then he can kill Satan.. But he does not!
It's turtles all the way down. And gods all the way up!
DarkMatter2525 is amazing, by the way.
His content is great
It's nether
I just can't understand how people actually believe these beings exist and when you read the bible it just reads like the authors made this god talk to himself. Its all so mental to me.
People fear death they miss their loved one's when they die so if it was a way to not die but live in paradise and still be surrounded by friends and family it's not really that hard to want to believe plus it's the fear of hell that's instilled in you from childhood the old carrot and stick thing but what messed me up is when I held my 3 year old daughter and asked myself was there anything she could have done to make be think she deserved to be tortured forever because of how worthless and broken she was and as a man whose capable of love but not infinite love cannot think of a reason an all powerful god surely could have came up with something better than this🤔
We are social animals. Myths , help us achieve terrible things , and great things.
What you're "taught as a kid" sticks with you. That's why advertising works so well. As an adult you grab a coke and you don't know why: Coke does. Talk to any racist "that's just the way I was raised". --- Works for religion too. Never underestimate how lazy people are. They peak in high school and worship the Kardashians. --- dumb as fuck.
If youve watched literally almost anything else in this channel you'd know even these people talking about this stuff here believe there are other beings that exist beyond humanity and some beyond our comprehension
It's all designed to get you to give up your time here making holy rollers rich instead of actually living
I am attaining true gnosis, thanks to Jonathan and The Gnostic Informant
Awesome
Adam decided to disobey God in his pre-fallen morally-perfect state despite direct contact with God and did so in an apparently short amount of time after his creation. What does this say about being unimpressed with the infinite being after direct contact? What does this say about God's so-called perfectly-created Adam?
Seriously, couldn’t God have created an innocent sinless morally perfect being in direct contact with God able to go more than a few days without disobedience?
What this also says is that God is so unimpressive in person that a morally perfect free-willed being in direct contact with God will, in a very short amount of time, choose to ignore him. Funny enough, the only other example of morally perfect beings directly interacting with God, the angels, did the same thing.
Shouldn’t Adam and the angels, after being in direct contact with the infinite being, have known the consequences of ignoring God? You would think that they would not have taken the course of action that they did. None of this makes sense.
Well said John.
Additionally, the jews in Sinai after they fled Egypt wanted a golden calf to worship. They literally seen some of the most amazing events that this god did not show any other people, and yet wanted to worship a piece of metal. And Aaron, who was the high priest and actually got to meet the one true god too, was the one who made this golden calf.
This tells us all we need to know about this "god"
Moses was so impressed by God when he saw the golden calf, he was so pissed off Moses tossed the tablets down and broke them up. Those tablets that had been provided by god and written on by the finger of god. Makes perfect sense...
@@davidburroughs2244 Yeah, it's almost as if the bible is full of shit or something.
Excellent logic - unfortunately logic and reason are alien concepts among the god squad.
I wouldn’t put much credence in the Creation story in the Ezra-Constantine Bible. That particular story and myth was created by a fallen angel named Anuhasaj and Osiris the false. The main falsehood of that story being that Man fell. Completely untrue. It was the Angels who really fell, not Man, who was created in an immature and embryonic state and has been growing toward perfection ever sense. Just as our Creator designed everything in existence.
I'm pretty sure Yahweh wasn't too worried about grape. You could sell your graped daughter to the grapist. Obviously having a non-virgin daughter unmarried in your house was MUCH more of a concern than what hell her life could be. Satan is never associated with violence against women in the bible, know who is? ... Yahweh. Yahweh is totally into it.
God shouldn’t have created Satan right from the start….all problems solved.
As for prayer??? We might as well just talk to a wall or the air.
Well maybe god was bored so created his own horror movie - even sadistic gods must get their entertainment somehow !
"The idea is that God has this Divine Plan for everything. Worked it all out in advance long ago, set it in motion, and it's been working all this time. Then you come along and pray for something. But what if what you pray for isn't part of the Divine Plan? Well, what do you want God to do? Change His Plan? For you? I mean, it's a DIVINE PLAN! What's the point of being God if some schumck with a two-dollar prayer book can make you change your Divine Plan?"
--- George Carlin
Whenever someone tells me that they are going to pray for me, I tell them they might as well fart on a pop-tart.. you will get the exact same results
You actually have to believe it’s pretty simple🙏❤️
Every human innovation is a testament to the uselessness of prayer.
I had these same thoughts about 45-46 years ago. It's just logic.... Haven't been to a church since.
Any updates on life after this?
@@eddystang5213 lol. Well it's been 4 fucking decades. So ok I would guess.
yea i know hell is real but when try to read the bible its just a big wtf i think its ment to be read for the esoterics rather than the litterals.
Why would God need validation from us? We are like ants to him. Besides validation comes from inside yourself or it's not real.
Satan might not make sense, but he does make awesome music!
Hell yea
If Satan had actual taste in music, it would be country. He went down to Georgia and challenged a hillbilly to a fiddle contest for God's sake. Lol
Haha "starway to helleven" LOL
“Everybody knows that all the best bands are affiliated with Satan.” Bart Simpson
I am Compleeeeeeeeeeeeete
One of the best deconstructions of Christianity I've seen. Pearce shows us how placing correct contextual rationality destroys the entirety Christian theology.
I was happily surprised to see Derek Lambert make an appearance. Being raised and living in the south for much of life, the Good Ol' Boy banter while discussing these things just made me thrilled to my core.
Theology can be diluted by man. I’m agnostic because we may assign attributes to “God” that aren’t there. Some crazy cosmic game of telephone.
You don't even need logic, simple chronology shoots down much of the Old Testament, which swiped much of its material from previous religions. The Satan of the NT sounds suspiciously similar to the Debbil in Zoroastrianism.
Definitely didn't destroy it for me. Bless God!
@@eddystang5213
Eddy...
It may come to pass, that one day you'll wake up and the realization of the complete nonsensical nature of the story will fall upon you.
Yes, you can inoculate yourself by never reading, listening, watching or learning about anything outside the book, but truly a sad specimen you'd have become. Knowledge of the actual, material world you've operated in every day of your life, provided by people who devise hypothesis and then test and test to make certain it's valid is where the biblical exit ramp begins.
If it took 400 years before the Gospels were written in books that's a long time to be really Accurate
Bingo!!!! It was subject to many translations, also!!!
I don't know what point you're trying to make, but if your point is in defense of the bible, then your brain has obviously been destroyed by religion. Yes it took hundreds of years so write that ridiculous book, and that ridiculous book is comprised of copies of copies of copies of copies of translations of copies of translated copies! We have no idea what the original text said, so anyone who is not skeptical about the accuracy of that ridiculous book has some severe mental deficiencies
Glad I found this channel. You both have brought up very good points. I also appreciate your humor. Your recount of the story of Job was too funny.
There is a wonderful short story by Philip K. Dick: "The golden man" that shows how omniscience ruins everything other omni's stuff. Because if god is omniscient and he knows everything that was, is or will be then he cannot be benevolent or omnipotent because everything is _always_ done according to plan, miracles and all that stuff. It is exactly the same as saying that a vending machine is benevolent when it gives you a candy bar every time you put a dime in it. Benevolence and omnipotence requires free will, which god cannot have if he is omniscient...
thoughts and Prayers are a form of energy .. so yes Prayers do work
I don't understand how Job was supposed to be about faith. He lost his kids. Getting more kids don't make up for the kids you've lost. And the God of the bible never explain to Job why he had to go through all his problems.
A great conversational piece, some great examples if you're up against a theist. I really enjoyed learning the problems with prayer and Satan, I never would have thought about it in that way.
It’s just whining they offer you zero solutions. Same as someone pisising and moaning about the world but do nothing to improve it, except complain. Don’t be so gullible. If you were stranded in a forest would you feel safe with men like this, theorize and complain or a strong person who is a doer and strong. They are useless Negative Nancies.
Why would you be “up against” a theist?
@@fancycrafts7774 They're everywhere, plus I still have have Evangelicals on my mom's side, Catholic on my dad's side. Not to mention numerous friends that are still believers.
@@nicolistruszkowski3355 I guess I was asking why you would argue with one.
@@fancycrafts7774 Not that I would want to, but if the topic came up.
Ahhhhhh prayer...telepathic begging
Prayer: when you care enough to do the very least
I prefer "wishing hat".
One thing I could never get my head around is why Satan would need souls. Most believers will start by saying that he wants to enslave man, but to what end? Does the devil,an eternal entity, need to harvest crops for food? Is the devil a master architect, and need labor for building?
Biophotons.
Electricity for the holographic Reflected manifestation
To the contrary, Satan makes perfect sense. To those who believe the teachings of religious fundamentalism but aren't quite happy as a result, Satan functions as an Emmanuel Goldstein. All of the stress caused by the belief system can be blamed not on the entity they worship, but on some third party who ultimately has no power but is set up as a boogeyman.
It makes all the sense for people in power having a scapegoat to avoid criticism. But it makes no theological sense.
This Emmanuel Goldstein metaphor is a bit ingenious. I applaud you if it's an original thought
Thanks for showing how ridiculous the whole religion thing really is.
I an simultaneously a Christian and an Evolutionist.
Thank you for your content and thank you for bringing Jonathan Pearce for the interview.
I love the questioning especially about how God performs all these miracles and the Egyptians don't believe it. The question about Pharisees seeing Jesus miracles but not reacting. Wow?
I was steeped into Christian apologetics and listened to them. I don't anymore. They make too many bad faith arguments.
Derek was funny. LOL
The Earth is round. Therefore if you face opposite of Mecca you're still praying towards Mecca. It's just further around.
Is the universe round?
That's convoluted, why not just pray towards the closest wall to you?
Isaiah 45:7 - I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create EVIL: I the Lord do all these things. This is my end all be all of verses for believers. The answer to the problem of evil is your god. If it was god's ultimate plan for Jesus to come he needed to created evil/sin.
this is my new favorite channel. keep up the good work
I went to Jordan a few years ago and the bloke showing us around was desperately trying to keep a straight face when he pointed at a 10 feet tall lump of rock in a vaguely human shape and called it Lots wife!!!! It was very funny!!!! 😀😕
I didn't realize Lot's wife was that tall. She could play in the WNBA.
That mean they had to be Giants but no one ever pays attention to that part
Really enjoying these discussions with Jonathan. Thanks.
When you think about it the Bible is a "how to" guide on how to stop Satan... which is a character made by God to apparently keep him from dying of boredom 🤔
Your killing it! Keep up the great work my brother!
Not only does prayer not help medical outcomes, no one ever regrows a lost limb. Never, ever happens, no matter how much the person needs it (to be able to feed themselves and their family, etc), how pious they are, how much they pray, or how much others pray for them. If you can’t pray for something you or another person really needs & get it, then it just doesn’t work. People know this, so they pray for strength, health, & safety, which may or may not happen anyway.
How is prayer different from every single Manifestation movement? People manifest by asking the universe and many are successful, many pray and it comes to pass. I’m just pointing out a fact, you are just to angry, why, I don’t know , and I’m sorry I don’t care. I’m not saying willing things is real or not just saying be objective vs being an Angry Angie.
@@bluwng “many are successful” in the same way that many people survive gunshot wounds to the head. There’s a large number of individuals who survive, but I wouldn’t count on it with a gun to my head.
The measurable fact is that medical outcomes for those that pray or manifest are no better and sometimes worse than outcomes with placebo. We are not so myopically special that the universe or its creator bends to our inconveniences.
But it is a comforting delusion to have. Big Brother is always watching and really cares about you.
My favorite quote from a comment section will forever be this: “Yeah there were a hundred children who died of malaria today but I’m glad Jesus helped you find a parking spot, Karen.”
@@matthewsteele5229 thanks. The real big brother is watching I’m sure they can read our conversation to gather metrics in order to asses risk.
Prayer is like training wheel variety of invocation. It's all magic.
Try on the story of Indra's palace and his architect's dilemma. Building for a god has no ending. Until Blue Brahma shows up, points to line of ants and reveals each was once an Indra in a prior incarnation. The palace was declared completed and the builder went home.
...might look that one up...from Indra to ants and back again.🐝🌈
You say it so perfectly 🤗 Thank You guys 🌹🌠Love You all !! 💜🖤
Scary how long I was Christian thus believed an Omniscience Omnipotent God gets to & wants to torture me, to test me, to see what I'll do but extremely limited knowledge me is never allowed to ask why or for proof
Its not what you think you've been deceived they mix lies with truth God loves you
@@jonnsmith556 oh how about you do me a favor and tell Jesus that the political party that promotes cruelty to the poor (which is against Biblical doctrine), that proudly promotes cruelty to immigrants (again against Biblical Doctrine), turned money lenders like Mitt Romney, Steve Mnuchin, Wilbur Ross into demigods (again against Biblical Doctrine and more hated than gays in the Bible) are being openly and proudly promoted by preachers and prophets claiming to come in Jesus name and are Winning destroying America bringing in a new Dark Ages to the world. Maybe if Jesus condemns the people who mocked Christianity by literally bowing to a Golden Donald Trump Idol at CPAC I will consider giving it a sixth chance but Ron Desantis has a better chance of taking the Florida knockoff of the SS of NAZI fame national thanks to Jesus
@@emmanuellynch4713 tell Jesus what? What are u talking about first of all it's called free will it's the same reason u can say and do as u wish and what does that have to do with anything that's exactly my point people use the word and twist to benefit there earthly lives there's corruption and deception that doesn't make it any less true, bad people do bad things and there NOT following the true message of christ
@@emmanuellynch4713 and the people destroying this country are Democrats anyway
@@jonnsmith556 Pretty sure the Bible said something about judging a tree by its fruit. If your very human friends or family members allowed people they were friends with spread rumors destroying your reputation and getting you fired from your job without defending you, do they get to just say I wanted to see what they would do and didn't want to encroach upon their free will? Yet you trust a God that not only allows things like that all the time but even worse in the book of Job. If I started a charity and after it became internationally recognized I allowed without condemning a bunch of Thugs to wear the uniforms and use the charity's name to steal, rape, money launderer, and commit acts of violence; me and my charity would rightly be condemned RIGHT? But how many people in history introduction to Christianity was violence resulting in enslavement or worse but now they are expected to blindly accept Jesus? Jesus can send the victims to hell for not accepting him as the benevolent God when the last thing they saw was the rape and enslavement of their society under the Crucifix because "those weren't true Christians"? Were you cheering for Xerxes in 300? The people of India and countless others had a better understanding of how vast the universe was thousands of years before Christ's birth but Jesus trusted his word with a bunch of flat earthers who even around 95 A.D when Revelation was written thought you could put a star from space on Earth without destroying Earth completely, the Sun could be snuffed out without instantly taking out our universe and didn't understand the moon is just reflecting sunlight not creating light. AND GOD DIDN'T CORRECT THEM because the Bible being accurate about outer space would be taking away humanity's free will BUT sending EVERYONE who didn't believe the Bible because all the inaccuracies to BURN for ETERNITY is perfectly reasonable?
Several years ago, some friends of mine had an eight-year-old son that was suffering a major hearing defect in the left ear. Surgery was scheduled on a Thursday.
On the Wednesday evening prior to the surgery the family went to their local church, as they did each week, for a Bible study and prayer time. During the prayer time their prayer was that the surgery on their son would be successful.
Thursday morning when the eight-year-old woke up, he ask why everyone was shouting. The reality was no one was shouting.
The family, realizing something that happened brought to the surgeons attention what has going on. They repeated the hearing test that they have done many times and determined that the hearing in the left ear was 100% restored.
A miracle? I believe so.
No.. they finally discovered q-tips and what they're used for. Miracle
“It’s not what Jesus said to do” pretty much sums it up.
Great video guys, very logical. Keep going, all we want is discussions
If God is omnipresent does that mean he is in Hell too?
No. His omnipotence allows him to remove himself from certain areas
@@hamzz6824 Why did God gift Satan with his own realm when he threw him out of Heaven?
@@hamzz6824 Can he remove himself entirely, or he's not omnipotent enough?
@@hamzz6824 Illogical. Omnipotence necessitates omnipresence. If God can cause himself not to exist in any realm, then in those realms God has no power. If there is any realm in which God has no power, then he cannot be omnipotent.
@@hecticnarcoleptic3160 Child: Is God so powerful that he can make a rock he can't lift?
Adult: Is God so omnipotent that he can cause his own non-existence?
Bravo
The books of Job and Revelations were the reasons I was never a "true" Christian. And, as I grew older, and began to objectively unpack those bible books, I found the inherent contradictions unacceptable but carried on in the faith, regardless.
Today, I'm glad that I finally got to that point where religion no longer makes sense to me. I do not have the strength or capacity for mental gymnastics.
Speaking of virtual signaling we also have identity politics. What is a christian? It's a goddamn identity. LMMFGDAO
Hahahahahahaha! LMMFGDO, as well...
This is a great discussion I love this page its been 20 years I was 20 at the time when my eyes were opened to the truth about religion especially christianity and islam. Keep bring the good stuff Gnostic Informant their are people like me who question the ideas we were taught all our lives
God has been playing games with humanity for all time ...
To COMPLETE the circle... if GOD is omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient, and god is satan/evil, then god is also the SUFFER-EE... also the EXPERIENCER of the suffering.
Wouldn't Jesus still be in hell paying for all the sins of the Christians he supposedly saved from his father's wrath? They always depict Jesus as being in heaven with God. If he is in heaven, what was the sacrifice/atonement thing about? According to my understanding of the Bible, his body was tortured for 6 hours before he died on the cross and was buried by Joseph of Arimathea. So, Christians are in a tizzy about Jesus being tortured for 6 hours in punishment for EVERY Christian's sins. Then, within 3 days, his body disappears from the tomb and he is seen walking around again. And, depending on what gospel you read, tells you how fast he ascended to heaven to be with his Dad.
Yet, the people who weren't given enough evidence to believe in Jesus are EACH supposedly in hell for an ETERNITY paying for the same type of sins the Christians were doing on Earth. How is that fair?
With all things considered, the tale of Lucifer is illconceived; the 'bringer of light' merely sought to emancipate those like himself; for this he was condemned to darkness. In this battle, the good guys did not win. The devil is portrayed as terrible, to dilute the inherent evil of those in heaven. (Note - all of this is fiction.)
That story makes no sense from the start.
Adam was the only creature in all of creation with free will. It says so in the book of Genesis. None of the angels were given free will. That means Lucifer would have to have been created specifically to rebel.
@@almitrahopkins1873
no free will?
why did 200 angels go with him ?
@@shannakellett9104 Are you denying the "truth" as it is in Genesis? Adam was the only thing in creation given free will, according to the text.
It also says "In the beginning, there was formlessness and void. God said, "let there be light" and there was, and it was good." Lucifer means Light-bringer in Latin. How could the light be good if the light-bringer was evil?
@@shannakellett9104 I'm going to offer you another possibility.
The Jewish hell is a cold, dark place, far from the light and love of their God. Could it be possible that Lucifer was sent out to be a beacon of light in that darkness, far from the light and love of heaven? Or is it too difficult to comprehend that there is no "bad guy" to blame your sins upon?
That seems to fit better with that "forgiving god" that Jesus spoke about, doesn't it?
@@marklong1775 Then explain why there are still Jewish people.
It's more likely they were referring to the Aten.
Your points and I as a believer (I seek truth and believe in something greater than us but not a xtian or any religion), but what about this? Why don’t we try to approach the Bible in a more psychological way and the structure and lessons in there can also help a lot, not everything is bad about religions and I am not religious
"everything that satan supposedly does is actually the will of god". Nailed it. No more scapegoating god's evil onto satan. Put the blame where it belongs.
Nah.. because Satan has the option to not do it? Maybe?
@@DanielM1224 maybe they're co-conspirators? If "god" allows it he's ultimately responsible.
Satan is just a title that means adversary or accuser. Pretty sure the god of the Old Testament is a satan and in charge of the satans.
@@sustainablelife1st Hmm I can kinda of relate that to the "Two sides of the same coin" idiom.
lool someone having fires sight of your action does not make them responsible for that action..God sets parameters for all reality included what can be done doesn't make God responsible for the sentient beings choice from free will
I was raised I guess in retrospect half ass Catholic until I was about 13 or so my dad told me it was my choice to go to church instead of a twice a month requirement, hence the half-ass statement. I talked to a couple of different priests and many other people who supposedly understand religion trying to figure things out as a young mind. A child sometimes has an easier time pointing out the fallacies than adults who's critical thinking surpasses that of a child. Their ultimate ultimate UNO card was always you/we aren't meant to know the mind or plan of God and are incapable despite being made in his image. There's nothing you can do with that once you poke holes in every answer they just recite that you are privy to such wisdom. When you are a young man and realize that even the people in authoritative positions do not have a clue what they are talking about and blindly believe dogmatic ancient visions it makes it virtually impossible to believe that this is truth or reality in any sense.
That's exactly why I walked away at 16. I'm too stupid to even hear the answer? Really? It's very much like the government says "we kept our illegal activities classified to protect you" or parents saying "I told you so" because they don't know and too lazy to think about it. --- not my "god". If god wanted me to lean more, become more mature, be like him: more and more questions and answers would be part of the process. -- Not 'as soon as you start to critically thinking, the entire idea falls apart'.
God after Satan questions Jobs loyalty to him “alright, bet.”
Kind of strange don't you think? An all-knowing deity needs to test someone to find something out about them. And Satan, knowing god knows everything that has been, is now, and will be while also knowing that god could just will the outcome he wants to occur at any moment, actually bets against god. Satan must be monumentally stupid, yet we are supposed to fear his "cunning." Any gambler would bet against that sucker any day of the week.
@@wesbaumguardner8829 Or Satan was confident that Yahweh was not omniscient
@@wesbaumguardner8829 that's all just story🤣
I predict, a thousand years from now, God's name will become Stan Lee, Marvel Universe will become a holy book🤣
The fact that human beings have a massive inability to naturally accept any accountability is a great argument for us being made in the image of the christian god.
And also that we’re jealous, violent and vengeful creatures
The way God is portrayed in religious texts is a figment of man's imagination, The real source is just energy.
Yahweh and Yehovah were real beings.
Isaiah 45:7 "I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things" By his own admission, we know who "God" really is.
Zoroastrianism pure and simple, 2nd death/lake of fire and baptism from Egypt, book of genesis largely from adapted/mutated mesopotamian/sumerian beliefs and ancient Canaanite pagan religions fill in lots of the rest it's so evident.
BINGO!!!
All that slapped on top of real Jewish events, you meant to say?
I would hesitate to say it's clear-cut Zoroastrianism, since our understanding of Zoroastrianism in this era is extremely foggy. But, it's very clear, like you pointed out, that the whole mythos of Christianity is based on the patchwork of other cultures, including also the mystery religions and Hermeticism. Gmirkin's theory that the Septuagint was not only written in Alexandria in the 3rd century BC, but largely INVENTED during that time aligns with this, since we can see that Alexandria was a syncretic hotbed and the Library of Alexandria, housing texts from so many different cultures, was right there.
@@LordJagd The idea of Satan seems to have evolved after the Israelites were conquered by the Persians, probably based on Ahriman (Angra Mainyu).
Google Debunking the Devil by Michael Sherlock.
@@LordJagd basically very obvious evidences of religious and cultural/worldview syncretism and parralels that just got more personalized, they changed the furniture around to suit their specific needs and agendas more or less, it's undeniable. Robert M Price and Richard Carrier especially opened my eyes to these connections I was previously only vaguely familiar with or not at all, everybody needs to know and understand these things and connections before they start pointing at bibles and text excerpts with their word of god jimble jamble shtick.
The Devil is inside us, figuratively speaking. That inner voice that we debate with daily when deciding whether to do what we know is wrong or not to do what we know is right while easily justifying our desired choices and often passing the blame.
Read James 3rd chapter & Job 41st chapter
That be nice to split myself into a million pieces and jump into the 1 piece and make a 999,999 minions not me tax them to hell, make them do all that i want and yes pass all blame guilt along to them, etc while i chill with a margarita
I would agree to the theory. Potentially we have the ability to be a demon through our actions. Or be.... Hmm... Decent? I don't like the silly idea of angels.
In esoteric studies 2 is for man and women duality. So if we have man=2 +women=2+child=2 would be 6. So 6 is man.
I put no faith in esoteric. Books or any thoughts/religion i just learn and find it interesting.
@@skepticalgenious I too find it to be interesting. Having and applying faith in one's own higher mind or power is what one should do, as opposed to their lower egotistical carnal mind or nature, that so-called reptilian brain. I'm referring to logic, rationality, good judgment, reasoning, good sense, proper thinking, and such. Now, that lower carnal mind has its place. It makes a good servant but a bad master. Angels, IMO, are an aspect of our thinking process. They are epiphanies, those eureka moments that come to us unexpectedly seemingly out of nowhere although the wheels had already been put into motion by the God of our being, that higher mind.
7:60 - God wasn't simply walking around, he was walking "in the cool of the morning".. as apparently, those mesopotamian afternoons get too hot for him.
And despite the fact there were only two people on the whole planet, God was unaware of their transgressions until he sought them out and found them to have covered themselves.
Quite a far cry from the all-knowing, all-powerful God of the later stories.
And , keeping with the Satan theme, Satan in Job doesn’t think Yahweh is all-knowing or he wouldn’t have made a bet with him.
@@scienceexplains302 I suppose that could be attributed to Satan's prideful nature, but it's an interesting point nonetheless.
@@drlegendre Prideful nature doesn’t explain it if he knew he was going to lose the bet.
Prideful nature would explain something such as claiming to be able to win a bet, but never making the bet.
God's first and most beautiful angel 😇 Lucifer
My three favorite people - thank you technologists for bringing them and us together 🔥🔥🔥
This will only make sense to someone trying to find a reason to reject God.
My reasons were given to me. I never went looking for reasons to disbelieve. And as a result, my parents disowned me, I lost most of my friends, but now I know the difference between knowledge and finding comfort in delusional beliefs
Whatever makes you feel better about being such a pathetic loser that you need an imaginary friend to cope with reality.
Darkmatter2525 does have an episode about what you guys described. Gods all the way up until they reach humans that made all gods
czcams.com/video/ODetOE6cbbc/video.html
"Gods all the way up" - that's hysterical! I never heard that phrase before. Did you just come up with that?
GENIUS !!! PHOTOSYNTHESIS ....MAYBE WE WILL EVENTUALLY GET THERE !
Also, along the 24 minute mark he gives a pretty thorough explanation of the nature of Prayer, the why's and how's of it all. Sometimes even Christians can treat prayer as if God is some kind of magic Genie. But in reality, prayer is a way that we communicate with who we believe is our holy creator. Our heavenly Father. We believe that we have a relationship with HIM just as you might your parents, or a friend. We want to communicate with HIM. He's our God. We worship him... You know how the world worships celebrities and athletes and all that.. imagine worshiping, praying to and loving "someone" who is flawless, won't let you down, trustworthy, holy, and WORTHY. Oh yeah and he made a way out of the consequences of sin (which is death)... HE made a way out of that at the cross through Jesus. THAT'S why we love him. Praise Him. Thank HIM. Pray to Him and NEED HIM.
I mean we could worship OJ.. but oops look what happened. Or we could worship R Kelly. But oops look what happened. Or we could trust and pray in ourselves.. but oops we can't even avoid covid. Or decide when we die. Or prevent gray hair or anything else...
What has your prayers done?
Who is Him? Are you speaking about Jesus, Mithra, or Osiris? Or maybe EL, Kronos, or Enlil from the writings of the Torah. Point is the stories, ideas, and traditions of Christianity is heavily borrowed from Pagan religions or mythology. Instead of running to the bible christians need to run and pick up a history book. This blind faith is delusional
Evil is a human idea, in nature there is only cause and effect.
There is cause and effect for sure, but you can’t deny that there are evil people.
I'm wondering if God had gotten rid of the thing that tempted Satan while he was in heaven. As an angel Satan did not temp himself.
Oh snap!
Well said!
Maybe everyone got tempted..and only Satan fell for it?
@@DanielM1224 ...god got rid of the competition...made..Satan..swim with the fishes.
I still don’t understand why the religious version of God is the only version that can exist. That God feels easy to disprove but what about a creator and spiritually? Reincarnation? No one seems to touch on that at all.
Yes I always thought it strange that the 👿 punishes evildoers. Well shouldn't they be having a party down there? The 👿 or Satan is evil right? Unless the 👿 or Satan is working for God by punishing the evildoers.
Aroud 26:00 talking about prayer. In Christianity, Jesus says don't pray for specific reasons because God knows what is best for you before one can even think of it.
what also makes no sense is how ppl keep using the image of the baphomet to represent the devil. the baphomet is not the devil. also neither is lucifer.
fair enough
Not anymore than Pagan Roman cherubs are angels, at least. The Medieval/Renaissance painters would have had to eat a lot of 'shrooms and Datura to portray biblical angels justly.
@@tracywalker6813 greco-roman mythology pre-dates the abrahamic faiths. our society tries to connect everything to the bible.
Apparently the statue of liberty is not a woman and is in fact Apollo or Lucifer
@@AlchemicalForge91 libertas aka eletheria, & yes she is a light bearer as is prometheus.
Great conversation! Well done!
Also God knows everything but couldn't find Adam once 🤣
Joe biden moment..
You guys are too creative for your own good 😅😅😅
15:19 What a Magnificent Monster! The TRUE "God of the Bible," before whom most Christians lie prostrate in abasement, whining, and beseeching, begging for forgiveness of their "sins," and requesting the fulfillment of their material desires!
"Nothing fails like a prayer." Dan Barker.
On point,thanks for discussing these topics:)
Don't take Satan away from me, he looks right on heavy metal record covers
So you admit that ur a satanist?
Who will we write songs about now??? Damn.
If we have free will then I choose not to go to hell...with out "Jesus".... Needing to save me..
My father liked to pray very loudly everytime that our family went to a restaurant when I was a younger person. I was always embarrassed. He never did the same at home. He got to find out if there is an afterlife some 15 years ago... or not.
😳😳
Apparently we cease to exist at death. We don’t find out anything.
Sounds like he was jonesing for that self fulfilling Xian persecution. A lot of cults tell their followers to be bleeding ass ulcers so they know they love Jaybuz enough.
@@scienceexplains302 Then why is something answering my prayers and communicating with me twice now?
@@MrLaughingcorpse All of us wish for things and some of those things happen. People of every religion attribute that success to their god(s).
If you could demonstrate that something was “answering your prayers”, you would still have no way of knowing *what* was responding. I am not calling you a child, but the first analogy I thought of was a child asking Santa 🎅 for a specific Christmas 🎄 present. His parents hear the request and get it for him.
The child has as much evidence for Santa as you have for a god.
Of course, anything that could respond to your inner thoughts would have to have some superhuman powers. For all you know, it could be a demon who will use your wishes for some larger evil later on.
Thank God, then that gnosticism explains everything. It explain evils, account for objective morality, explains why the world appears designed, it explain how it can be a system that makes it the case that you can be liberated through gnosis etc etc . . . or wait a minute . . oups . . it does not explain any of that or any thing else . . .
Please Brothers and Sisters, we can't understand God because he's perfect, we are not God like him, we're just human after all. Unfortunately satan will use our lack of knowledge about God to question our God himself, just be still and be contented that God almighty unconditionally LOVE us all. I know you all in this life have circumstances that questions God coz I've been there too. We'll if you really want to know God? read the holy Bible with open heart and mind, and surely he will reveal himself to you and he will give you answers which SURPASSES HUMAN UNDERSTANDING. satan uses this channel to lead you far from God and torment you all in hell. PLEASE MUST AVOID THIS CHANNEL. I'll repeat God Loves us all.
Nice irony.
You're joking right?
Excellent dialogue
Why were the Egyptians so blase about Yahweh miraculously tormenting them? Obvious. It did not happen. We know the exodus was complete fiction So most probably was the rest of it.
They forgot to mention all those crazy events and miracles for some reason
The Egyptians would have documented all these woes bestowed upon them even if they wouldn't credit Moe and Yaweh. At the least, they would have propagated how their brave Pharaoh got the kingdom through the crisis.
@@tracywalker6813 They would of said something at least
Yeah it's wild you'd think someone would have written that down but instead it's entirely absent from the historical record like it didn't happen at all or something.
The intro alone gets you a thumbs up.
I have never been able to not laugh in the face of the Christian Literalist when they tell me they believe everything in the bible really happened. 🤣
The greatest Trick the devil ever played was making people believe he doesn’t exist
The greatest trick that man ever committed was making morons like you believe that God is real
I need to get this off my chest.
I never murdered a child or ordered the murder of a child. This God, according to the Bible, has personally killed tens of thousands of children and has ordered the mass slaughter of children numerous times and in particularly grotesque ways.
So I'd appreciate it if he stopped demanding that I beg his forgiveness while admitting my wrong doings. You might as well have Adolph Hitler judging me for behaving immorally.
The allowance of free will, but with the influence of corrupt colonizers, including blinding you to the reality of the uni/multi/omniverse and/or "God(s)"?
"Satan" is us, too?
The argument is then "but why would God allow this?" To that it could be said, because if they made everything better, we wouldn't learn anything from the inevitable causes and effects?
It makes more sense that the colonizers are "Satan" and "God" shows us how st*pid we are, for trying to be "him" in a linear sense?
All the bad stuff is colonial cause and effect, though there is some "help" if asked for, by the angels, as we have plausibly experienced?
I'm a former Orthodox Christian searching for answers before I say F it and renounce all religions believing only in a God I experience yet never see nor can confirm. Gnosticism seems closer to what I may fit in so I will use your channel as a major form of research. Thanks in advance!
God explains less and less all the time. The gaps get smaller every year.
The far end of this is god doesn't exist.
And I've briefly discussed this with JMSP myself. 😍
Fact
God never explained anything. Not every response is an explanation. An entity made of unknown material using unknown processes and forces does not explain anything, it is just a placeholder word serving as a wall against further inquiry.
An explanation needs to use something we already understand.
@@scienceexplains302 Yes, good point. At best, gods, fairies, demons and everything else supernatural were the best conjecture at the time. They never explained anything.. They merely covered for lack of explanation.
@@RickKasten Agreed.
Another great show my friend.
Fantastic cameo from Derek!
the brightest light casts the darkest shadow
These 2 have a great flow
The way we exist now was never the perfect the will of God. We were born in an garden and now live in a concrete jungle
So God is not all-knowing?
@@toxendon being all knowing has nothing to do with perfect will
@@jesusisdead Well... Yes? If God knows ahead of time that Adam and Eve would fall for the temptation of the serpent (who God allows in the garden) and yet went ahead and created them and let the serpent stay - then either God could have made it so that Adam and Eve wouldn't be tempted and fall, or it was his will that Adam and Eve be tempted and fall, or else God is either not omniscient or all powerful
@@toxendon God is all powerful as in he is the source of all energy. Thats what all powerful means. Not that he overrides your free will. Without free will you are just God. Puppets are not individuals. I understand why people get this confused. God lives by his own character because he is all powerful and has unrivaled restraint
@@jesusisdead Preventing someone from doing an action is not the same as taking away their free will. A police officer doesn't take away a criminal's free will to choose an action, he just prevents the criminal to act upon his free choice. Being a robot means not being able to choose any action. It does not mean choosing and action and then be prevented from acting it out. And besides, if God can harden pharao's heart, kill infants and drown the earth, smite sodom and gomorrah, its a bit of a stretch to say he couldnt safeguard adam and eve from the snake or the tree. because those previously mentioned actions SURE AS HELL took away some free will