Bloodborne Cut Content - Vileblood Queen Alpha - Unused Character Dialogue
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- čas přidán 2. 05. 2019
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So the Vileblood Queen at Castle Cainhurst wasn't always a tsundere lady named Annalise, but once had a totally different demeanour and shared more than just her bloodline with the Doll and Maria. This but of cut content gives us some weird, interesting context for the once much-more-explicit relationship between all these characters. I hope you find it interesting!
Thanks to Elgato for Supplying the Elgato HD60 Pro used to create this video: www.elgato.com/en/gaming/game... - Hry
So in the video I stopped short of going into too much lore, but what do you'se all think the deal is here? Obviously Maria is explicitly related to the Vileblood Queen in the final game, and the Doll is born from Gehrman's "curious mania" after his time spent with Maria, but do you think this whole paradigm was originally planned to be way different?
Bloodborne's original story was probably meant to be a lot less vague and a lot more character-driven than previous Souls games, much like how Sekiro is written. The fact that so many pieces of cut dialogue and character interactions, such as Father Gascoigne in Central Yharnam, survived in-game all the way up until the Alpha version and the network test suggests that much of this largely finished story was cut out at the last minute, which only makes me want to see an older version of Bloodborne even more.
Maybe it has something to do with the unused king in blue boss?
I think Maria might have been created out of the scrapped plotline with the Vilebloods. Originally, Gehrman was going to be involved and the doll was to be based directly on the queen. The person she lost was her child. This also ties in with the Child of Blood plotthread which barely remains in the final game.
It's interesting that Logarius in the final game uses a scythe, like Gehrman, while previous versions of him as the king of Cainhurst didn't. The same thing that happened with Maria and the queen could have happened with Gehrman and Logarius.
@@ManiaMac1613 So I guess that begs the question. Did they cut it because they felt like something wasn't working or, did they cut it because this is their process for writing games like this OR did they cut it because they felt like they needed to make the game more of a mystery like their other games?
Muh retconned lores.
Bloodborne content in 2019 after the release of Sekiro?? What a pleasant surprise
I wonder how much cut content bloodborne has jezz is insane
That's what was thinking, to bad sekiro doesn't have much replay ability
Vilebloods either have blood of the Dragon's Heritage or Rejuvenatinh Waters. Bestowal ninjutsu uses blood of its enemies, but since they are immortal they use their own blood except Sekiro doesn't use this. The Divine Dragon could also be a great one since there is a sleeping shrine maiden, so the divine realm could be a dream. There is also a Japanese armor set in the Old huntet dlc.
@@TheJbiz84 I went back to Nioh to finally tackle "Way of the Nioh" difficulty after Sekiro and I'm blown away at how retardedly difficult Nioh got.
@@Merc7734 I never even finished. Didn't hook me.
Fromsoft: vileblood queen too much waifu, must rewrite.
She became a tsundere
lmao ikr
I don't wanna be rude but I thought your icon was a pussy I'm sorry 😂😂😂
Vileblood Queen still waifu, jokes on Fromsoft
Indeed lol
Got a feeling that the ring you find in the tombs would have a lot more significance in the pre-release bloodborne.
What ring?
Ring of bethrodal
Curious to see what happens if you try to "contract" with her whilst having the Ring of Betrothal in your inventory.
@@yanih7 You get the option to propose to her and get a bit of extra dialogue. However, nothing special happens when you sign up for the Vilebloods with the ring already in your inventory. I tried it in NG+.
@@fatcatsarethebestcats5510 we're all talking about the Alpha version obviously
THAT'S THE MAIDEN IN BLACK'S VOICE ACTRESS.
Demons souls
Luna it is also the doll’s voice actress
@@MarionetteDuAuguste True, but I'll always remember her as the demon who gave me strength so the world could be mended. q3
while her other voice actress is the same one as qualanas
@James 1137 After playing Bloodborne and then going to Demons Souls you can really feel how unrefined the latter's gameplay mechanics are.........it's a rather clunky game tbh. It's still a lot of fun though, but frustrating if you've played any of the newer Dark Souls games/Bloodborne. It's definitely not for everyone.
I always felt that the whole Cainhurst section was a bit underdeveloped.
Nah. It felt complete to me. Byrgenwerth was.
Feels like the Vilebloods are supposed to be a more notable group in the game, to rival the church, but they scrapped out an entire side story and instead choosing to focus on the Great Ones, moving Maria to DLC
Yup, and as someone who still hasn't left Cainhurst to complete the game after 40 hours of play this irks me immensely.
Bloodborne 2? Vilebloods and great ones? Also the death of Kosm and meeting Oedon?
There is no win situation for picking which content to develop... T.T
I got that feeling too
Also her quest just stonewalls no matter how many dregs you give. Cainhurst is very paranormal in that you get sent a letter and things open on their own. Yet it seems like the queen wasn’t really expecting you. Logarius was also a completely different character and his theme doesn’t even match his name.
*Bloodborne devs :nobody will ever find this cut content*
*Lance : hold my beer*
omni mystiic *hold my bloodvile
Did anyone notice that the abandoned Doll's fingers twitch?
What's the time stamp? :o
@@anonymousraccoon8923 8:50
@@akamiddlechild thanks mate
Personally, I've always theorized that the Doll, and not Gehrman, was the host of the Hunter's Dream, and that the Doll there in the workshop is the sleeping, "waking world" Doll of the dream.
doesn't she also turn her head towards you really fast
"I will not die... TARNISHED as I am..."
HEY
I’m not the only one who knows the reference!
I presume they changed it last minute to make Annalise look less innocent and to avoid the executioners looking like the main bad guys.
The base game voice is a lot more regal anyway
In all due credit, the Church looks pretty by itself already. The literally screams that they're the bad guys
The Executioners committed a genocide over flimsy pretenses. They're monsters.
@@codafettthe Vilebloods were vampires that kidnapped the peasants from Cainhurst and Yharnam to use as blood sacrifices. The Church wasn't always evil.
Still love anything bloodborne related. Dope game /10
Alfred: Foul tarnished...
Finally another person who realized that reference!
I keep feeling like there was a lot of lore/plot tied to Cainhurst that was axed at various points. Like, "bind our tongues" and "this wretched mask"? What does the mask do? Impede her senses? Suppress some kind of "blood magic" like Queen Yharnam?
Stops her from drinking blood probably.
Also her quest just stonewalls no matter how many dregs you give. Cainhurst is very paranormal in that you get sent a letter and things open on their own. Yet it seems like the queen wasn’t really expecting you. Logarius was also a completely different character and his theme doesn’t even match his name.
It probably limits her powers. She's likely as powerful as Maria otherwise.
Fromsoft: "There, we removed the waifu voice. Hunters won't be attracted to her anymore. "
Hunters: *Spends 300+ hours on Pthumeru dungeons looking for the ring of betrothal.
*Blood dreg offering intensifies.
I honestly wish the Vilebloods and their area was expanded upon. It’s one of the shortest in game and yet, it has a lot of interesting elements that only exist through item description.
I agree, it's easily the coolest part of the game. In a game already filled with cool stuff.
isn't it more likely that the queen of the vilebloods was the original basis of the doll, with maria being invented as a retcon after the queen became annalise?
Thats not a bad theory at all. The ages of gehrman and laurence would match up here too. Maybe then, it was the three of them together that beckoned the moon presence? An independant hunter, the first vicar of the heaking church, and queen of the vilebloods, enemy of the church. Maybe rhe blood of all three meshed together in such a way to make the beckoning possible... a lot to consider here.
I don't think it's necessarily an "either-or" scenario. If you follow the present story of the doll/maria it can actually be tied together pretty easily. Maria/Annalise starts out as a member of the Cainhurst royal family. She goes on to join Gehrman's workshop and becomes a hunter, during which time she takes part in the desecration of the fishing hamlet. Seeing just how horrible the atrocities committed there were, she renounces her role as hunter and tosses the Rakuyo down the well, leaving the workshop and returning to Cainhurst, taking her place as queen of the Vile Bloods.
Her departure then causes two significant ripple effects. First it leaves Gerhman dejected and abandoned, leading to him creating the plain doll in Maria's image, and in turn leads to all the hunter's dream stuff. Second, because she has renounced the Byrgenwerth scholars for their cruelty, it sparks the conflict between them (and by extension the church) and the Vile Bloods in the first place, giving a more solidly rooted reason for the two groups to be in conflict. From there Martyr Legarious attacks and manages to lock Maria/Annalise away, until the player character is able to free her, where in she becomes a friendly NPC and you're left to piece together all of this backstory bit by bit as per usual.
I think this works really well from a story perspective, and personally I think it'd actually make more sense than Maria's current incarnation given her supposed motivations. She detests what happened in the fishing hamelt, so much so that she renounced her weapon and title of hunter, yet despite that she's willing to give her life to protect that very incident from being discovered? It always seemed like a stretch to me, though you can kind of twist it into making sense if you try hard enough. But having her not only cut ties with the people responsible, but also become enemies of them and directly act against them, seems to make a bit more sense. Plus it covers up the discrepancy of her supposedly casting aside her signature weapon, only for her to fight you...with her signature weapon, seeing how queen Annalise is obviously unarmed and stripped of anything that would have hinted at her being a former hunter. Not only that but it creates an interesting contrast between the doll and the queen, both of them npcs who would have helped you on your journey, one an idealized creation who continues to support the hunter's workshop, serving with blind loyalty, and the other the actual person who has forsaken the church and the hunters because of what she has seen, because she knows the truth and has gained insight into the truth of things. I think that kind of thing would have played in really well to a lot of the central themes of the game.
I think you could have even preserved the final Lady Maria fight as we see in Old Hunters, even with this vastly different narrative. Instead of being the real Maria, it's more a figment of her former self, a manifestation of what she would still be if she hadn't abandoned the workshop. Or maybe she's a "perfect" version of the plain doll, Gehrman succeeding at using the Moon Presence's power to create a seemingly real and exact copy of Maria, the way he remembered her rather than the way she really is. Perhaps she only appears if you complete Alfred's questline and you bring the lump of flesh into the hunter's nightmare, or perhaps she appears regardless, but having the lump of flesh allows you to influence the boss battle somehow, like the music box when you fight Gascoigne (it would have been cool to have more stuff like that in the game honestly).
It also adds to the seediness of the church, where you're first led to believe that the Vile Bloods were evil, and the church were simply fighting them out of righteousness, but then later find out that THEY were actually the monsters all along, and that the executioners' "justice" was actually an attempt to cover up a loose end that could have exposed one of their darkest secrets, which is much more in line with the true nature of the church. It then makes Alfred's questline even more of a shock/gut punch, when he ends up murdering someone you've realized too late was actually your ally, which then in turn makes the over the top, near villainous ranting he does a lot more appropriate.
@@pdragon619 good pnt
@@pdragon619 Ooo I love this interpretation! It would be an outstanding fan fiction :D
BEGONE WITH YOU, YOU'LL SPOIL MY FOCUS
Well? What was that about?
@@vehicularmanslaughter8601 your name is praise the sun and you have the sun covenant as a profile picture and you didn't get what he meant ? Someone missed a soul game
@@Nokronz are you joking or serious?
I cant tell
@@vehicularmanslaughter8601 did you play ds1 ?
How much goddamn cut content is in this game already?
You could make an entire sequel out of all the cut content in this game!
Have you tried entering a contract while having the marriage ring in your inventory?
Unfortunately, long before restoring this character, we extracted all of her unused dialogue and we know for sure she has nothing further to say. I datamined every aspect of her and cross-referenced it with everything I triggered in this video and can confirm that I showed everything there is to show. Sad but that's all there is.
"I will not die, TARNISHED as I am"
ELDEN RING WOOOHOOOOOOO
Here, take this "like" good man, a blessing upon you and you heartfelt kindness...
I love how straightforward your videos are. You show everything thoroughly yet succinctly. No drawing anything out. Most other creators would stretch it out over say 20 minutes.
Anyway thank you, been years now. But can't get enough bloodborne.
Seems to lend credence to the pre-DLC theories that the Doll was partially based on the Vileblood queen. IIRC JerksSansFrontieres was one of the people proposing that.
JSF was basing that on Lance's in-progress work in the first place.
Has JSF ever been wrong on anything, that guy is so based.
@@schpeelah not true. he proposes it in his Hunter's Dream video from 2015.
@@scrubstadt8387 JSF is friends with Lance and has behind-the-scenes access at the "so I found something in the files", long before Lance releases anything, as well as content Lance will never release because he only makes a video when he can demonstrate it in-game. This process takes a long time - the video with Gascoine saying Umbasa was only in April, even though the fact that there is a removed line where he says that was known for years.
@@schpeelahJSF's Dream video that I mentioned was uploaded towards the end of 2015. Nobody knew how to datamine PS4 games until March 2017, which is why there weren't any cut content videos pertaining to Bloodborne until June 2017(sanadsk). The Umbasa line being discovered in the 2014 Alpha had nothing to do with Lance, and was achieved by going out of bounds rather than through datamining.
it lowkey makes me sad that we didnt get this annalise. now whenever i go to cainhurst i will never see her the same way again
“Tarnished as I am”
Caught that too lol
The doll and Maria also share the same pants! No one ever mentions that but the boots are the same
Alpha Version Annalise: *Tarnished,* as I am.
Miyazaki: That just gave me an idea.
WAIT! Did she said "TARNISHED as i am"????
Yeah I definitely heard it! IS BLOODBORNE RELATED TO ELDEN RING!
Sick, more Bloodborne.
8:10 holy shit, that's significant.
not really
@@trollzilla shut it
One thing that always fascinated me was the in Hemwick, that castle in the background is so detailed and feels so almost reachable. I've heard people say that it might've originally meant to have been Cainhurst before the devs went with the Van Helsing movie inspired aesthetic and the dracula reference with the spooky carriage.
Even the building where the Hemwick witches are fought feels like it was meant to be bigger, with a way to access the upper levels.
Really hope those areas get explored one day
Have you looked into the ring of betrothal you get from the chalice dungeons? I have always wondered if the ring might of originally had some other purpose than to propose marriage to queen Annalise and get rejected. Keep up the great work!
Oh it would be so cool if you could form a contract with her that way.
FINALLY! I've been waiting for this for months!
I got u fam
Once again I don’t understand the two people disliking these videos. What exactly are they expecting when watching one of them
is it always two?
could be bots, but also, it's the internet and some people just do stuff for strange reasons
bots
Yeah I guess bots, I mean I don’t care really, I was just curious about the reasoning because this is really neutral content. Also the fact that lance Mac Donald is probably giving up a shit ton of his free time I must assume to entertain a bunch of people he doesn’t know. It can’t be much fun sorting through all these games like this but the pay off is def. worth it.
ripples L I believe I made a similar comment on the most recent video before this and it was 2 dislikes that time as well. Might be more but they are almost instant, within the first hour. This channel is one of the few I have clicked the bell on because of my unhealthy obsession with bloodborne so I caught them both relatively close to when they posted
When I see YOUR Videos popping up in my Notifications I squeal in delight
The Bloodborne Cut content videos are among my favorite videos of CZcams, thanks for making them! I dread before the day everything is found and restored
Why do they cut so many of this actresses lines. The humming, Marias dialogue, and now we see that she had another entire role!
So well matched and put together, appreciated
This is really fantastic, must take a lot of work! Cool to see all this cut content!
Tarnished! She said tarnished!
The description reveals one important thing from the lore point of view, the Hunter's Dream and the contract between the Moon Presence & Laurence along with his associates was established AFTER the WAR between the Healing Church & the Vile Bloods through Queen Annalise's Great infant one's umbilical cord.
Yeah, that's big. "Desperate times..." indeed!
I honestly wish this was the version of her we got. Unfortunately the queen in game has no real character, aside from her rank but here we get a fascinating character despite her minimal dialogue that makes her far more tragic, making you wonder if she's become so kind after being locked away all this time or if she was framed by the church perhaps for the scourge of the beasts despite having nothing to do with it or the church just trying to get rid of a rival who has done nothing wrong. Either way is fascinating and makes me sad we didn't get this version of her in game.
Really enjoy your cut content videos. It’s fascinating to see the game and story before it was revealed
Bloodborne is still one of my favorite games of this generation.
I really appreciate these videos, thank you, keep up the great work :)
It's odd hearing the word "Tarnished" now.
Anything that lets me hear more of Lady Maria / The Doll's voice is great in my book, so thanks for this! As for the relationship between these three characters, man... I wonder how much of the story was changed during the course of development and how much of it all now open to us is confusing us because we're mixing the final story with cut pieces.
Awesome find, I love these cut lore style videos. Really makes you wonder what could had been :)
Amazing content as always, Lance! You're keeping interest in soulsbourne alive!
Also, I really like your camera work in these.
You are the one of the few channels for which I’ve turned notifications on. Awesome work as always!
This ist really interesting hope to see more, thx a lot for such a amazing work 🙏🏻
Your hard work and your amazing videos it's what makes you special
Thank you lance
Thanks for your hard work, this is very interesting stuff.
These videos are so interesting. Great work
Excellent work Lance! Keep on digging!
I get so happy whenever I see your notifications pop up
Oh god that final tease, please do a lore analysis the unique perspective of cut content could offer so much!
Your videos = pure gold Lance!
"You...are a friend." My big softy heart is bleeding affection for this character now!
I like how you don't go into speculation for 10 extra minutes, concise and informative!
I hope for Bloodborne 2 more than anything. Please FS!
Kepp up the content! Thank you for this
Awesome work. Sincere thanks every time
Thank you, Lance!!
Man, I want so much to know more about the Vilebloods.... Thank you for the content!
I like your videos on Bloodborne very much!
Love your work dude - keep it up :D
Lance if you keep this up eyes are gonna spring from your brain.
Thx❤️❤️ I love this vids
Can you test the marriage ring with this new dialog? And great job, its a good way to know more of Bloodborne's lore! 😉
I wish Bloodborne actually had a story, instead of the swiss cheese of story elements that we got.
We have a story, but theres no plot. Thats all FS games except for Sekiro :)
It'd be really cool if Maria/The Plain Doll/Annalise were originally all meant to be incarnations of the same character. I think it would actually make a lot of sense and flow with the story pretty smoothly.
Maria/Annalise starts out as a member of the Cainhurst royal family. She goes on to join Gehrman's workshop and becomes a hunter, during which time she takes part in the desecration of the fishing hamlet. Seeing just how horrible the atrocities committed there were, she renounces her role as hunter and tosses the Rakuyo down the well, leaving the workshop and returning to Cainhurst, taking her place as queen of the Vile Bloods.
Her departure then causes two significant ripple effects. First it leaves Gerhman dejected and abandoned, leading to him creating the plain doll in Maria's image, and in turn leads to all the hunter's dream stuff. Second, because she has renounced the Byrgenwerth scholars for their cruelty, it sparks the conflict between them (and by extension the church) and the Vile Bloods in the first place, giving a more solidly rooted reason for the two groups to be in conflict. From there Martyr Legarious attacks and manages to lock Maria/Annalise away, until the player character is able to free her, where in she becomes a friendly NPC and you're left to piece together all of this backstory bit by bit as per usual.
I think this works really well from a story perspective, and personally I think it'd actually make more sense than Maria's current incarnation given her supposed motivations. She detests what happened in the fishing hamelt, so much so that she renounced her weapon and title of hunter, yet despite that she's willing to give her life to protect that very incident from being discovered? It always seemed like a stretch to me, though you can kind of twist it into making sense if you try hard enough. But having her not only cut ties with the people responsible, but also become enemies of them and directly act against them, seems to make a bit more sense. Plus it covers up the discrepancy of her supposedly casting aside her signature weapon, only for her to fight you...with her signature weapon, seeing how queen Annalise is obviously unarmed and stripped of anything that would have hinted at her being a former hunter. Not only that but it creates an interesting contrast between the doll and the queen, both of them npcs who would have helped you on your journey, one an idealized creation who continues to support the hunter's workshop, serving with blind loyalty, and the other the actual person who has forsaken the church and the hunters because of what she has seen, because she knows the truth and has gained insight into the truth of things. I think that kind of thing would have played in really well to a lot of the central themes of the game.
I think you could have even preserved the final Lady Maria fight as we see in Old Hunters, even with this vastly different narrative. Instead of being the real Maria, it's more a figment of her former self, a manifestation of what she would still be if she hadn't abandoned the workshop. Or maybe she's a "perfect" version of the plain doll, Gehrman succeeding at using the Moon Presence's power to create a seemingly real and exact copy of Maria, the way he remembered her rather than the way she really is. Perhaps she only appears if you complete Alfred's questline and you bring the lump of flesh into the hunter's nightmare, or perhaps she appears regardless, but having the lump of flesh allows you to influence the boss battle somehow, like the music box when you fight Gascoigne (it would have been cool to have more stuff like that in the game honestly).
It also adds to the seediness of the church, where you're first led to believe that the Vile Bloods were evil, and the church were simply fighting them out of righteousness, but then later find out that THEY were actually the monsters all along, and that the executioners' "justice" was actually an attempt to cover up a loose end that could have exposed one of their darkest secrets, which is much more in line with the true nature of the church. It then makes Alfred's questline even more of a shock/gut punch, when he ends up murdering someone you've realized too late was actually your ally, which then in turn makes the over the top, near villainous ranting he does a lot more appropriate.
5:15 Turn on captions:
"Cease this, I am Queen of the Vilebloods. The Healing Church binds our pants. Now off with you..."
Bloodborne is in my top 5 games and I appreciate what you do Lance. Thank you.
Thank you for keeping Bloodborne fresh in our hearts and minds.
It is interesting to think that this 'Queen of the Vileblood' could have been the original Lady Maria. And that the story of Lady Maria could have been less heroing and far more tragic.
This is just my own head canon. But if this were true the Mask could be to prevent her from speaking out against the church. A sort of Vicomte of Bragelonne / Man in the Iron Mask type story. The reason for her undeath could have possibly been due to the hamlet incident. Or something else entirely. But regardless, it's fun to speculate what the original backstory for this character would have and could have been.
I've been seeing a lot more Bloodborne videos lately since Sekiro dropped, and that brings joy to my heart. Keeping the dream alive. ❤
I admire your work man excellent job 👌👏🙄
love ur vids!
Amazing work, after all these years still a lots of secrets to uncover. This game truly is mysterious and fascinating 😮
Hey Lance! One thing I've always been super curious about was how, if you look up at the Grand Cathedral from the streets of Yharnam, you can see what appears to be a large, square-shaped platform atop it, over the rooftop and above the face of the clocktower. It terminates in what looks like three large tombstones/monoliths directly above the face of the clocktower, itself. I've always been wildly curious about what that was meant to be used for, if anything - it almost struck me as a sort of boss arena that wound up never being utilized. Have you ever been able to get up there, somehow, and investigate? Apologies if this is something you've already looked into!
Bloodborne is my absolute favorite game, and 4 years later my interest for the lore still the same as when the game was released.
my guess would be that this was supposed to be maria before they started thinking about what to put in the dlc. Yes i know the hunters bone with the maria description is near the real hunters dream but that could have been added later in the development.
I guess in the alpha version, queen annalise is more benvolent, and more kind to us, and it seems to me that she's bored over the fact that, she is immortal n cannot be killed
NO SHIT SHERLOCK!
Great Job Man
Awesome work
awesome video. bloodborne is an amazing experience
Great content, as always!
Wanted to ask, is there any new insights on Nier:Automata?
Between cut content and glitches this game has so much packed in it it really does not need any DLC if they actually restored or fixed the glitches. Well done Lance.
Great job lance
Amazing! Omg so much content cut! There are more to come?
Very interesting, as usual!
Hmmm. That extended part after approaching is very reminiscent of Lucatiels first two pieces of dialogue
Kool I love ur vids brother
8:50 whoa.... did her hand just move?!
keep diging！good for you👍🏻
To hear that voice again.... 💣😍😍😍 "Soul of the mind, key to life's ether...."
So nice to still see something new from bloodborne. thanks
btw. Can we expect anything Dark Souls 3 related?
Nice video! I'm curious, is there any hidden dialogue regarding the ring of betrothal? It had very little use in the main game and it would be neat to see if there was anything else relating to it that was cut.
It's a miracle Cainhurst wasn't cut altogether, there's SO MUCH in the Alpha.
Thanks again for awesome