The Universe Doesn't Want Linux 6.8 To Exist

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  • čas přidán 16. 01. 2024
  • Every Linux release I'm sure has had it's struggles but it seems like for this kernel release it's a bit worse than normal, so much so that it seems like the universe is trying to conspire against it.
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Komentáře • 429

  • @BrodieRobertson
    @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +229

    I think a lot of you might have failed maths class, a 100% time increase can also be framed as a 50% performance decrease
    In case anyone is still confused. If you have 5 apples and I give you 100% more, you now have 10 apples, if I now decide to take away 50% of your apples you will now be back to 5

    • @tranthien3932
      @tranthien3932 Před 5 měsíci +14

      The video: about problematic kernel merges
      The comments: YoU MaDe mAtH PrObLeMs
      Still, thanks for the vids, Brodie. ❤️

    • @genstian
      @genstian Před 5 měsíci +4

      We all run the latest git compiler, kernel and glibc (so we get the coolest new bugs!), sometimes / 2 and * 2 becomes the same answer.
      (Gcc 2.7 had multiplication bugs)

    • @nomadhgnis9425
      @nomadhgnis9425 Před 5 měsíci +1

      I had to laugh at this video. It seems performance issues is the cost for laziness (high level language). LOL!!!

    • @lordkaczuha4598
      @lordkaczuha4598 Před 5 měsíci +6

      @@nomadhgnis9425 wdym? linux is written entirely in c

    • @Gusto20000
      @Gusto20000 Před 5 měsíci +1

      Completely unrelated question: how comfortable are you switching between black and white background page?

  • @sobieckil07
    @sobieckil07 Před 5 měsíci +550

    There is only one thing to do. The universe is giving us a sign. Kernel devs need to skip the number and call the next release 6.9. Codename: Nice

    • @vaisakhkm783
      @vaisakhkm783 Před 5 měsíci +16

      wow.. yes... it's defently the curse of 6.8, were we get bullied by the universe to make it 6.9....

    • @Megalomaniakaal
      @Megalomaniakaal Před 5 měsíci +61

      6.8 had to be a mess, just to make it clear to everyone that 6.9 will be nice.

    • @happygofishing
      @happygofishing Před 5 měsíci +5

      le reddit funny !!!

    • @ralphorama
      @ralphorama Před 5 měsíci +1

      not funny. cram it, chomo

    • @delancre5858
      @delancre5858 Před 5 měsíci +1

      I'm actually sad, that we pass 6.6.6 minor release so fast, and 6.6.9 wasn't any different. Let's hope we see 6.9 for some time in our lives.

  • @Finkelfunk
    @Finkelfunk Před 5 měsíci +408

    I need a 1 hour compilation of Brody reading Linus' email replies to shitty commits.

    • @michaelwright2986
      @michaelwright2986 Před 5 měsíci +59

      Uncensored.

    • @A_G420
      @A_G420 Před 5 měsíci

      yes @@michaelwright2986

    • @Bob-of-Zoid
      @Bob-of-Zoid Před 5 měsíci +14

      That would be an ongoing series of videos, and at two 3 a week the series could last until long after Linus is dead!

    • @__Brandon__
      @__Brandon__ Před 5 měsíci +1

      I would be up for a monthly update

    • @lenni-builder
      @lenni-builder Před 5 měsíci

      You might be able to start with content from existing videos. Please inform me if anybody did that.

  • @DJ_Cthulhu
    @DJ_Cthulhu Před 5 měsíci +300

    I'm on Debian stable, not expecting to see a 6.8 kernel in my lifetime 😉

    • @WTFShelley
      @WTFShelley Před 5 měsíci +54

      are you off 2.6 yet??? XD

    • @lordofenron
      @lordofenron Před 5 měsíci +9

      Maybe in like 4 years :)

    • @annieworroll4373
      @annieworroll4373 Před 5 měsíci +19

      @@WTFShelley lol. Bookworm is on 6.1 by default!
      Though I added a mainline kernel repo and I'm on 6.6.8.
      Of course, under no circumstances will I remove the kernel Debian is officially feeding me. I'll occasionally take some risks of breaking things, but I'm not reckless about it.

    • @loftypancake
      @loftypancake Před 5 měsíci

      Same haha

    • @mucklus
      @mucklus Před 5 měsíci

      Have you never tried installing custom kernels?

  • @henrymach
    @henrymach Před 5 měsíci +144

    Working with Linus is not for the weak

    • @Kylian381
      @Kylian381 Před 5 měsíci +59

      Yeah. He can be harsh and direct. But in hes position he sometimes has to

    • @MoolsDogTwoOfficial
      @MoolsDogTwoOfficial Před 5 měsíci +54

      @@Kylian381 Better be upfront than be vague.

    • @SuperSmashDolls
      @SuperSmashDolls Před 5 měsíci +21

      He used to be worse.

    • @ME0WMERE
      @ME0WMERE Před 5 měsíci

      @@Kylian381 remove 'sometimes'

    • @Finkelfunk
      @Finkelfunk Před 5 měsíci +18

      Definitely. In the past there were instances where he's told devs to off themselves over a horribly structured commit.

  • @fluffy_fluffinity
    @fluffy_fluffinity Před 5 měsíci +176

    If this is the case with 6.8 we can only pray that the same doesn't happen to 6.9. The nice must succeed

  • @santerisiiranen3924
    @santerisiiranen3924 Před 5 měsíci +10

    Greetings from Finland! Yesterday it was under -20°C in here and today we've had 20cm new snow on top of the existing 30cm. I love it!

    • @michawhite7613
      @michawhite7613 Před 5 měsíci +3

      I head about -40 degree temperatures in Finland a few weeks ago. Finland is proof that there is a reverse correlation between good music and good weather.

  • @Beryesa.
    @Beryesa. Před 5 měsíci +39

    Nah they just want to get to 6.9 faster ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°

  • @merthyr1831
    @merthyr1831 Před 5 měsíci +64

    this is one of those times where a monolithic kernel definitely makes life miserable for linux devs. Having to bisect through thousands of commits while doing nearly hourlong builds each time must be beyond cursed.

    • @methanbreather
      @methanbreather Před 5 měsíci +11

      hour long? couple of minutes. And bisecting makes finding it fast. You might have to do half a douzend builds, less if you have a good idea which area is most likely the culprit.

    • @attilavs2
      @attilavs2 Před 5 měsíci +1

      With "modern" (make is from the end of the 80s iirc) build systems, you only recompile what you change and stuff that depends on it

    • @EvanED
      @EvanED Před 5 měsíci

      "make is from the end of the 80s iirc)" -- Per Wikipedia, Make "was created by Stuart Feldman in April 1976 at Bell Labs", so you're more than a decade too late. :-) Perhaps GNU Make was created around then?

    • @attilavs2
      @attilavs2 Před 5 měsíci

      @@EvanED Yeah, was thinking of GNU make

  • @velho6298
    @velho6298 Před 5 měsíci +41

    It's crazy to think that the merge window is paused because it's a little bit windy.. Oh btw I am Finnish and yes it was -30 week ago

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +11

      I'm sure Finland has actual infrastructure to deal with the cold

    • @michaelwright2986
      @michaelwright2986 Před 5 měsíci +3

      @@BrodieRobertson That might be a little bit unfair to US infrastructure. A lot of it is crap, but you don't build infrastructure suitable for sub-Arctic conditions in the mild and damp Great North Wet--that would be wasteful. As weather gets more extreme, I guess a lot of places whose infrastructure was previously adequate will find that's not the case any longer.

    • @genstian
      @genstian Před 5 měsíci +1

      @@BrodieRobertson neither does australia, but atleast people dont tend to live at just an average low of 1.7c, Liawenee is the coldest permanently-inhabited place in Australia.
      In January 2020, Liawenee’s population doubled to two

    • @petermichaelgreen
      @petermichaelgreen Před 5 měsíci +1

      ​@@BrodieRobertson Sure, but from what I can gather Linus is pretty damn rich. It's his choice to rely on local infrastructure.

    • @TrueHolarctic
      @TrueHolarctic Před 5 měsíci

      ​@@petermichaelgreenhe should just build his own powerplant, I agree

  • @ahettinger525
    @ahettinger525 Před 5 měsíci +31

    It's purely dependent on region. Large parts of the US get below freezing temperatures less then once a decade. Other parts deal with snow and ice every year. The places that deal with it regularly are prepared to deal with it. The ones that don't commonly, are not as prepared.
    It's like complaining that Sydney had a freak storm that dropped a 25cm of snow and their infrastructure sucks because they couldn't handle it. No, obviously they they couldn't handle it because it's not something they ever get.

    • @MrGamelover23
      @MrGamelover23 Před 5 měsíci

      Exactly. The Texas Freeze was a result of climate change. That shouldn't have been possible for Texas to experience. So the infrastructure would have literally no reason to be prepared for it.
      There's also the problem that unlike every other state in the country that can just borrow power from other states, Texas can't because it had to be a special self-sufficient snowflake because conservatives reasons.

    • @tresf
      @tresf Před 5 měsíci +4

      Exactly this. I live in upstate NY where windstorms and heavy snowfall are planned into infrastructure. Texas (especially) has some self-inflicted issues (power) that shouldn't be generalized to the entire union. Other states may not be well prepared for winter weather, but that's certainly not the norm.

    • @cericat
      @cericat Před 5 měsíci +1

      Look it snows in Sydney less often than the USA acknowledges the rights of other nations to not be capitalist. That said burying them under a foot of snow is fairly appealing, just not when I have to be at a tournament in Windsor again, last time I was there I was checking the damn weather reports for if I'd need to call off the drive down, could see snow on almost every slope on the drive down from Tamworth.

    • @ahettinger525
      @ahettinger525 Před 5 měsíci +3

      @@cericat You're missing the point. "The USA" is not worth talking about, because it's too big and covers to many biomes. It's like saying "What's the climate in Europe?" It's a silly question, because it's too big and covers too many biomes.

    • @twenty-fifth420
      @twenty-fifth420 Před 5 měsíci +1

      @@ahettinger525”Whats the Climate in Europe?”
      “Europe is a continent, it has many climates.”
      “Okay, but is the climate in Africa?”
      Yeah, this is a pet peeve of mine. If anything, it is dumb in a way that most people think the world just has like, maybe 5 climates and are clearly not knowledgeable about Koppen/Trewatha etc.
      Also, live in New Mexico. Usually it can snow here, but it didn’t this winter. I don’t wanna jinx it because it is February as I write this, but we might make up for it with a wetter then average monsoon season. Or maybe not even that.

  • @EnternodeCS
    @EnternodeCS Před 5 měsíci +65

    Nothing makes me happier than hearing Linus roast people over hellfire for wasting his time
    P.s. totally agree with him not wanting to drive on icy roads, as someone that grew up in Michigan.

    • @JacobP81
      @JacobP81 Před 5 měsíci +2

      Yeah it's funny. But knowing that the kernel is free makes me feel funny about him roasting them. I know a lot of these devs do get paid with donations and other sources of payment but still.

    • @jongeduard
      @jongeduard Před 5 měsíci +5

      I completely disagree! There is no excuse for such behaviour. I mean Linus is a great and talented guy and his work is amazing, but attacking people personally like this unprofessional and really does not any good.
      Building amazing and stable software together is absolutely possible without this whole toxic climate. I am very certain I can rewrite all those emails in a way that they are at least as communicative, while removing all toxicity from those, reducing the number of text lines and preserving all useful information in those.
      People can make very bad mistakes sometimes and it can be frustrating when those things happen, but I refuse to defend this type of behaviour like Linus shows here.
      Sadly there are more developers in this world which behave that way, but it really does not any good. We can all just learn from each other as humans and being respectful should really number 1 priority.

    • @TheCocoaDaddy
      @TheCocoaDaddy Před 5 měsíci +2

      @@jongeduard I believe Linus dealt with "anger management" at one point, so some of the older mailing list messages might have been (were probably) from before he toned things down a bit. I think Linus can be brash and harsh, but if you look past that, he's usually spot on in his urgency on protecting the kernel. I agree he doesn't *need* to be as toxic as he used to be, but I also "get it". I don't think kernel development is really for "everyone" and Linux is an opportunity to do kernel development on a "real world" OS used all over.
      Still, it's frustrating to have to deal with "dumb" mistakes, especially if we're talking about something as "intense" as kernel development. I don't consider "newbie" mistakes to be "dumb". Things like including a C file in a header file are the kinds of "mistakes" that would frustrate any experienced developer.

    • @mononix5224
      @mononix5224 Před 4 měsíci +1

      ​@jongeduard hard disagree, you can keep your enterprise "professionalism". I'd rather not deal with, nor have the software I depend on be effected by, the disingenuous nature of that environment to a further extend than it already has.

    • @han5vk
      @han5vk Před 7 dny

      @@jongeduard He's not insulting the devs. He's shitting on their work, or lack thereof. If your job is to propagate the good stuff and weed out/fix the blatant errors and you let THAT through, you've failed miserably and need to do better.

  • @A_G420
    @A_G420 Před 5 měsíci +16

    We need a reality TV show about this. Would be amazing!

    • @y00t00b3r
      @y00t00b3r Před 5 měsíci +2

      Starring Guenther Steiner

    • @TheCocoaDaddy
      @TheCocoaDaddy Před 5 měsíci

      Would the kernel developers need to be on the same island or something? :) lol

  • @CptJistuce
    @CptJistuce Před 5 měsíci +35

    It is all a conspiracy to force Brodie to switch to FreeBSD.

    • @jongeduard
      @jongeduard Před 5 měsíci +1

      Is the FreeBSD developers world at least less toxic? Where they understand that working together in a positive way and learning from each others mistakes so much better than all kinds of personal attacks?

    • @attilavs2
      @attilavs2 Před 5 měsíci +1

      OpenBSD > FreeBSD

  • @bleack8701
    @bleack8701 Před 5 měsíci +10

    A single line of code. The best case scenario, if you think about it.

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +1

      Yeah but also the most annoying, at least when it's a complex solution it's understandable how it was missed

  • @ManuFortis
    @ManuFortis Před 5 měsíci +41

    This entire video is a perfect example of what I am talking about when I go on at people about how just because your project/code/whatever is open and worked on by a community of people instead of a business or otherwise, doesn't mean it is automatically better, more secure; or even being worked on by competent people.
    As Linus said himself. I expect *some* quality control. But as Linus gets to experience on a pretty common basis it seems, and as I suspected to be the case based on past instances I've chanced across in the past; people have taken the 'anyone can contribute' aspect way too far.
    Sure, anyone can contribute; but not everyone should. For instance, I don't code. I can bodge a bit with some reverse alterations based on what I see and barely understand; but I don't code. Useful for mods, not for OS's.
    So I don't contribute to the kernel or anything like that. Instead, I try to use some of the new stuff when it comes down the tree. I use the newest kernels when I have hardware that would be useful to try it on, and I let the bug reports go through instead of blocking them. Or send in an email (rarely) explaining what I am running into, that sort of thing.
    More often than not, I find that someone else already has had the same problem I have. So I end up just using their fix instead of sending anything in. If it works, don't bother them I figure. They have other more important stuff to break in the meantime.

    • @BrunodeSouzaLino
      @BrunodeSouzaLino Před 5 měsíci +2

      This makes me remember a panel with kernel devs which happened some time ago. By the way they spoke, they created this situation where they need new developers but put them in an ambient of distrust to the point nobody wants to do kernel development.

    • @Tincan21ify
      @Tincan21ify Před 5 měsíci

      No, not *automatic*. However, there are ample examples of closed software projects failing to continue to invest in engineering to address security issues as they are identified and the opposite with open source.

  • @adamsavard535
    @adamsavard535 Před 5 měsíci +88

    Actually it's even worse. It's a 100% performance hit.

    • @aquilafasciata5781
      @aquilafasciata5781 Před 5 měsíci +17

      Worse, the compilation time is 200% of what it was!

    • @confusioned2249
      @confusioned2249 Před 5 měsíci +9

      @@aquilafasciata5781 this depends on how you're wording it
      if you're talking about an increase, you're only adding 100% of the previous compilation time
      if you're talking about the total length, it's 200% as much as the previous compilation time

    • @cynodont7391
      @cynodont7391 Před 5 měsíci +5

      @@confusioned2249 No! he was right. This is a 50% performance hit ... computed and verified using kernel 6.8 🙂

    • @confusioned2249
      @confusioned2249 Před 5 měsíci +4

      @@cynodont7391 50% of 22 is 11, 22 + 11 = 33
      I have no idea where you got the 50% from

    • @Momi_V
      @Momi_V Před 5 měsíci +11

      ​​@@confusioned2249 It can be a 50% performance hit as in 50% of your Hardware's theoretical 100% performance are gone. Thus stuff takes twice as long. As far as I am aware relative percentages are a complete mess, depending on language, topic, what the speaker wants to put emphasis on / communicate, etc.

  • @FrDismasSayreOP
    @FrDismasSayreOP Před 5 měsíci +11

    I'm in Portland, Oregon, right now. The side streets and sidewalks are absolute skating rinks from the freezing rain, and even the main arterials are very slippery. And yes, drivers here are absolutely frightening in the Winter. (For context, I have lived in the Midwest and Alaska).

    • @tranthien3932
      @tranthien3932 Před 5 měsíci +2

      Yeah, that's some serious driver issues

    • @Hellscaped
      @Hellscaped Před 5 měsíci

      linus lives at 01316 SW Corbett Hill Cir Portland, OR 97219 go say hi to him

    • @gorak9000
      @gorak9000 Před 5 měsíci +1

      I also live in the Portland area (originally from Canada, so winter weather / driving is no big deal for me, but it's scary to be out on the roads here with locals that don't know how to drive at the best of times, never mind when there's a layer of ice). I was away during this year's snowpocalypse, but from what I heard, it was roughly the same as a few years ago.

  • @cyangalaxy
    @cyangalaxy Před 5 měsíci +6

    I actually recently changed from the CPU frequency scaler "acpi_cpufreq" to "amd_pstate" (and enabling CPPC in BIOS as required) using a kernel-param. I did this for purpose of downclocking my Zen 2 processor using the cpupower tool.
    "acpi_cpufreq" only gives you 3 cpu-clocks. "amd_pstate" gives you granular cpu-clock control.

  • @thelanavishnuorchestra
    @thelanavishnuorchestra Před 5 měsíci +4

    To be fair, it has been pretty nasty. High wind with 50 mph gusts and freezing rain was the problem with knocking out power. And after the initial snow day, it's been days of freezing rain, turning the sidewalks and streets into sheets of ice. And of course, Portland doesn't have the most robust or practiced snow response, so the streets have been sheets of ice for some days now. I nearly binned it half a dozen times just shuffling down to the corner store at the end of the block and back.

  • @JacobP81
    @JacobP81 Před 5 měsíci +4

    This reminds me of when I run my Minecraft with the 11 mods, I watch the logs scroll down notice a bunch of errors, ignore them and the games seems to run perfectly.
    Think of the bugs that are known, and imagine all the bugs in the software that we use that just go unnoticed.

    • @attilavs2
      @attilavs2 Před 5 měsíci +2

      It's more warnings/bad practices than actual bugs if you don't have issues with it.

  • @m4rt_
    @m4rt_ Před 5 měsíci +5

    Norway has been having an especially cold weather this year too.
    Earlier this week it reached -24 C in my local area, and it's predicted to reach around -20 C later in the week too.
    But as we say here "det finnes ikke dårlig vær, bare dårlige klær". Which translates to "there is no such thing as bad weather, only bad clothes".

    • @Winnetou17
      @Winnetou17 Před 5 měsíci

      I'm surprised by this. Being in Romania, I thought that in all the scandinavian area -20C is like a chilly autumn. Or normal everyday occurrence in winter.

    • @AndersHellquist
      @AndersHellquist Před 5 měsíci +1

      ​​@@Winnetou17You are correct. -20C is kind of normal. A few weeks ago we had between -30C and -34C for a week and that is colder than normal but nothing extreme. This is in the middle of Sweden. 16:01

  • @natblank0s
    @natblank0s Před 5 měsíci +9

    Linux had a rocky transition to 6.8

  • @JacobP81
    @JacobP81 Před 5 měsíci +3

    6:29 I don't really understand the code shown that well, but it looks like a case of the coder being a bit lazy on that part of the code and that part of the code should have been written better. Applying a 25% margin sounds very arbitrary to me, wouldn't it make more sense to figure out the correct value instead of just doing a 25% increase? Correct me if I'm wrong.

  • @Lampe2020
    @Lampe2020 Před 5 měsíci +2

    I'm in Sweden, not far from Öland. And here the temperature yesterday in the morning was -13.5°C…

  • @KoopstaKlicca
    @KoopstaKlicca Před 5 měsíci +18

    Linus complaining about driver quality is so relatable. It's like tradfic collectively forgets how to function

  • @CronoOfMana
    @CronoOfMana Před 5 měsíci +1

    i live in Vancover WA about 15m away form Portland and yea the ice storm shut down an lot of places and we lost power allready and came back so its wild right now ^^.

  • @bluesillybeard
    @bluesillybeard Před 5 měsíci +1

    Here in Colorado of the USA, it got down to -20 F. (that's like -25-ish in Celsius).
    That may sound pretty cold, but here in Colorado that's just a normal day in January.

  • @anlumo1
    @anlumo1 Před 5 měsíci +3

    I get the feeling that you're always leaving out important words when reading those mails.

  • @oglothenerd
    @oglothenerd Před 5 měsíci +7

    Dude, I live in Austin TX, and you could not have said it better! Yes! No one in Texas was prepared! People actually started dying the streets, and there was a lot of damage from trees falling on everything! The snow storm was insane! We call it the snowpocalypse here.

    • @3333218
      @3333218 Před 5 měsíci +1

      It's funny to read that. I'm from RS, Brazil. We're having massive thunderstorms here. No water and electricity for days, followed by days of blackouts and uncertainty. Trees being ripped from the ground by the wind force and colliding with the electricity cables and generators.
      This happens every year.

    • @3333218
      @3333218 Před 5 měsíci +1

      There' no snowstorms where I live, it doesn't snow, but I'm sure if we had them, it'd be something like that too.

    • @oglothenerd
      @oglothenerd Před 5 měsíci +1

      @@3333218 Where are you?

    • @oglothenerd
      @oglothenerd Před 5 měsíci +2

      @@3333218 Wow, Brazil intense!

  • @fulconandroadcone9488
    @fulconandroadcone9488 Před 5 měsíci +1

    Here first snow of the year means a lot of work pulling cars out of ditches.

  • @OcteractSG
    @OcteractSG Před 5 měsíci

    I live in the area too, and I had to work outside in that weather. Wednesday morning was especially treacherous because of the freezing rain the night before.

  • @MrMediator24
    @MrMediator24 Před 5 měsíci +2

    I saw people driving on ice. Jeep doing 360 while going 60km/h through intersection is a scary thing (likely nobody was hurt that time round)

  • @immoloism
    @immoloism Před 5 měsíci +2

    My new goal in life is find way to write out 07:44 as a reply to a bug report without getting shouted at.

  • @mrkosmos9421
    @mrkosmos9421 Před 5 měsíci +1

    It's on 6.8 already? Oh man, it feels like yesterday when we were on 4.4...
    Oh wait, I'm on an Android 9 phone. It really was yesterday

  • @KuruGDI
    @KuruGDI Před 5 měsíci +3

    I would be interested into a video with the topic: I updated my Linux machine and now I have 50% of the computing power I had before the update. How and where would I report this and would there be an easy way of a rollback?

  • @scavanger1000
    @scavanger1000 Před 5 měsíci

    Okay bruh, temperature hit 18F in Portland, we had no power for like 3 days, although surprisingly the roads have been fine this year. Usually it’s bad

  • @zeburgerkang
    @zeburgerkang Před 5 měsíci

    It does get cold, ice like roads in the mountains near Mt.hotham, probably the other mountain region to the north of vic up in the blueys.

  • @jfftck
    @jfftck Před 5 měsíci +1

    I can tell you that the standards for power delivery in the US is changing because of the issues with weather, the problem with the standards is that they are voluntary in compliance and each state can dictate which parts are being enforced. But that doesn’t stop the individual electric companies from building above those standards.
    I know about this because I worked in the industry and my father was vice president of engineering at an electric cooperative, where he enacted standards higher than required and that resulted in a huge reduction in outages.

  • @FineWine-v4.0
    @FineWine-v4.0 Před 5 měsíci +2

    I hope we live long enough to see a Linux distro that uses a MicroKernel architecture

  • @SteinGauslaaStrindhaug
    @SteinGauslaaStrindhaug Před 5 měsíci

    Here in Norway we currently have one of the coldest and snowiest winters in ages, but things mostly work because snow and cold is something we are used to and have infrastructure for. Of course whenever we have record breaking snowfall in a very short time, it takes a while to clear it all so yesterday with more than 20 cm snow (or something) was a bit chaotic and public transport was completely stopped for long periods and car traffic is still very slow with lots of queues. The average speed on the motorway where it's 80 or 90 km/h limit, is now around 20 to 40 km/h
    But I still feel quite safe driving since it's the kind of winter conditions I used to from 1 hour north of Oslo where I grew up, and most drivers here know how to drive. And everyone have winter tires (except maybe foreign drivers, but they probably have already slid off the road somewhere down in Sweden long before they got here 😅, and those that somehow got here on summer tires before the snow last fall are stuck wherever they parked)

  • @Bob-of-Zoid
    @Bob-of-Zoid Před 5 měsíci +4

    For the few times a reboot is needed, nothing will break if you put it off until you are done using your computer to which you will boot into your Linux OS all changes applied. I do it that way all the time, unless I just updated something with new features I am eager to explore, like I most certainly will with this kernel update, and the coming KDE Plasma 6.0!
    I can drive like a pro on Ice, and it still no guaranty when so many others can't, because sooner or later one of them will take out your car, and possibly you with it!

    • @onceuponaban
      @onceuponaban Před 5 měsíci

      There is however stuff that stops working until the reboot, including trivial niceties such as USB ports. I was once trying to figure out what the hell was wrong with a USB drive that wouldn't work on a Mac nor on my Linux laptop but would work just fine on a Windows machine. After a good thirty minutes, I remembered that my laptop recently had a kernel update and I didn't reboot since.
      Naturally, the drive worked first try after the reboot (still no idea what was wrong with the Mac though)

    • @Bob-of-Zoid
      @Bob-of-Zoid Před 5 měsíci

      @@onceuponaban I never had that problem and have all kinds of stuff on USB and other ports, and if it would change them with a USB driver update, it would do it to other hardware too, and there's also no reason for it. Linux doesn't apply any hardware changes until after boot, because hardware drivers are loaded on boot. USB drives are mounted when you insert them, but that's a software loading it because the power draw is detected, the USB bus is already loaded.
      It sounds like it may be the drive has worn or dirty contacts. Some wear because they are made with cheep metal that loses it's springiness. I had one that did that, and I had to push up on it a bit and gently release the pressure, and then it would work, but a slight bump and it would fail again, of course it got worse, so I just used another one, and trashed the bad one. Ports can have the same problem too.

    • @petermichaelgreen
      @petermichaelgreen Před 5 měsíci

      @@Bob-of-Zoid Nowadays, hardware drivers are loading when a device that needs them is detected. So it's very possible to get into a state where hardware that has been there since before the upgrade keeps working, but new hardware does not.

    • @Bob-of-Zoid
      @Bob-of-Zoid Před 5 měsíci

      @@petermichaelgreen Well, I don't have a USB buss that isn't in use, and I have them all, 2.0 up to C, so maybe that's why, but this would be the first time I hear that, and I quit Windows completely 14+ years ago and switched to Linux.
      BTW: I'm on Arch, and KDE Plasma.🥳.

  • @oredaze
    @oredaze Před 5 měsíci

    I am currently thinking of learning how to program and things like these really make me reconsider.

  • @itstoxicqt
    @itstoxicqt Před 5 měsíci

    Portland is the same as Seattle just less hills. When it snows in seattle even just a few inches, the entire city shutdown. Due to most of downtown Seattle being straight up hill going west to east downtown effectively shuts completely down. We dont own salt trucks

  • @te0nani
    @te0nani Před 5 měsíci +1

    As a guy from Finnland I assume Linus has some things to say about the "Winter" in Oregon :D

  • @michaelwright2986
    @michaelwright2986 Před 5 měsíci

    Hah, coastal boy, eh? In Australia, I lived in Armidale (NSW), and in the nation's capital; and in both places I saw -10 C. It was, admittedly, in the middle of the night in the dead of winter, but it was cold. Also dry, so if you came into contact with any synthetic fabric on a winter morning, there were sparks when you put your hand (or key) near metal. Lovely days, but, +15 and better, but cold as when the sun set.

  • @Burgo361
    @Burgo361 Před 5 měsíci

    We get some ice where I live sometimes in vic, I can confirm I have no idea how to drive on it and I wouldn't want to share a road with anyone when I have to. (Mostly I just drive really slow but hills especially on mountain roads are a bad time)

  • @Tired_Night_Owl_in_the_Woods
    @Tired_Night_Owl_in_the_Woods Před 5 měsíci +1

    You know, even in Finland we had a problem with a snowstorm this week. The public transport was mostly affected. But no power shortage😅 This winter is much colder than in last 5 years.

    • @gorak9000
      @gorak9000 Před 5 měsíci

      It's not power "shortages" it's power "outages". Shortage means "we can't generate enough power, so we're shedding load to keep up and turning some stuff off (aka rolling blackouts)", outage means "a tree fell on the wire and snapped it - someone has to come and cut the tree down and put the wire back up". The shortage is the number of crews that can go around and fix things (and a lack of preventative maintenance, but that's a whole other topic for a whole different video).

    • @han5vk
      @han5vk Před 7 dny

      @@gorak9000 I'm sure you also speak Finnish perfectly.

  • @suvetar
    @suvetar Před 5 měsíci

    He's right about the backtrace, the tree of those includes goes from most recent to oldest, making intel_display_power.c the first file to include, not the last to be included.

    • @suvetar
      @suvetar Před 5 měsíci

      Also the fix has nothing to do with the ordering of includes, that's just a code hygiene issue affecting the same file that needed to be fixed - but regardless, Linus was wrong but I can iimagine his frustration too.

  • @Heater-v1.0.0
    @Heater-v1.0.0 Před 2 měsíci

    What? When this video was made the temperature here nearby Helsinki Finland was -27C for many days and below -20 a lot longer.

  • @snooks5607
    @snooks5607 Před 5 měsíci +1

    5:55 was that sarcasm? because surely it would've indicated worse QA problem if it turned out to be more structural issue in the code that should've perhaps been picked up on earlier in the process instead of it being a random corner case fixable by small change

  • @eriklundstedt9469
    @eriklundstedt9469 Před 5 měsíci

    That finish -16°c would be quite nice for a winter
    I live in the lower north of Sweden(it's in Norrland (north land) but i live in the middle of the country, verticaly) and we got about -18°c although that's a little bit too cold for my taste

  • @tranthien3932
    @tranthien3932 Před 5 měsíci +4

    I say we skip straight to kernel 6.9. Surely, it will be nice 👍

  • @robnobert
    @robnobert Před 5 měsíci +1

    Been without power since Saturday. Many cars and garages crushed by giant pine trees in my neighborhood. We just got ¾" of pure ice coating everything last night to sweeten the deal. All depends what part of Portland you live in. I live up at the top of Forest Park which is arguably the worst except for the Columbia River Gorge east of town. It's nasty out there, got to look out for bad Portland drivers who are mostly actually SoCal California drivers 😂

  • @Tritium21
    @Tritium21 Před 5 měsíci +1

    27c ~ 80f. f = (c*1.8)+32 but for quicker head math f ~ (c*2)+30 gets you in the right order of magnitude

  • @TheAtariSan
    @TheAtariSan Před 5 měsíci

    Good, i am still on 6.5 and 6.6 tkg-bmq, waiting for other scheduler in the 6.7 tkg kernel and since i rarely reboot and need to upgrade hardware in 2 weeks... it won't be happening soon for me.

  • @infinitivez
    @infinitivez Před 5 měsíci

    I lived out near where Linus is in the Oswego area, there is NO way he's driving down to a Starbucks lol. Those roads are a sliding sloshy mess right now. We had to take someone down to PDX today and it was all we could do to get there on time. If this weather would make up its mind, it might not be so bad. Wouldn't say we have the worst infrastructure, but when they gravel the roads thinking there'll be frozen conditions and instead it warms up, everything turns into a gravel and slush slip n slide.

  • @UltimatePerfection
    @UltimatePerfection Před 5 měsíci

    We need to go back to the old kernel version scheme, with the odd minor version meaning there may be some instability, but even minor number guaranteeing stable operation (i.e. just fixing the breakages in the odd version without introducing new features that can introduce new breakages). It worked so well in the Linux 2.x days, it could work again.

  • @y00t00b3r
    @y00t00b3r Před 5 měsíci +7

    THANK YOU for saying "UEFI" after mistakenly saying "BIOS". That's a pet peeve of mine.

    • @Time4Technology
      @Time4Technology Před 5 měsíci +2

      Same here. Still lots of "changing something in the BIOS" out there, where it should be "EFI setup" or similar.

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +5

      The term is often used interchangeably even by people who should know better

  • @autohmae
    @autohmae Před 5 měsíci

    11:16 euh.. no, I believe kexec does reboots faster by having the running kernel, load a new kernel in member and doing a shutdown then calling the new kernel, so you bypass the BIOS, especially on large servers saving many minutes doing a reboot.

  • @bonfromagetech5207
    @bonfromagetech5207 Před 5 měsíci

    In 2018, I went to Norfolk VA to see Nightwish (Finnish band, for those who don't know them) and a snowstorm basically followed us for the whole trip (about 100 miles east from where I live). People were standing in line with umbrellas to keep the snow off, and I thought to myself, "They're probably looking at the crowd outside and saying 'What a bunch of wimps. This is a light shower in Finland.'" It's all what you're used to.
    And yes, the US power infrastructure does suck.

  • @flameofphoenix5998
    @flameofphoenix5998 Před 5 měsíci

    5:49 I like to believe linus is a huge gamer

  • @haxwithaxe
    @haxwithaxe Před 5 měsíci

    I live just north of DC. It used to be every time a squirrel farted I'd lose power. It's gotten a lot better since the local government started threatening the power company to appropriately trim trees. There are power lines that have little logs on them because they hadn't trimmed the trees in so long that they grew around the lines. When they trimmed them they just cut the branches either side of the lines and left the chunk of branch around it.

  • @genstian
    @genstian Před 5 měsíci +2

    The simulation runs on Linux, and something broke its weather simulation code.

  • @srccde
    @srccde Před 4 měsíci

    5:30 Linus didn't disable it intentionally. It's an issue with the Threadripper CPU he's using (and that I'm using, too). Probably, just like me, he's got CPPC enabled in the BIOS but there's still no "_CPC" object present which is, presumably, a bug. It seems AMD _forgot_ to add this feature to their Threadripper CPUs. It should be available, but it is not - no matter the BIOS settings.

  • @scurvofpcp
    @scurvofpcp Před 5 měsíci

    Many motherboard venders will set the bios for max compatibility when it comes to Ryzen products. Especially when they come out with new features.

  • @terminallyonline5296
    @terminallyonline5296 Před 5 měsíci +1

    That's frustrating as hell for a maintainer I bet.

  • @SlavomirDanas
    @SlavomirDanas Před 5 měsíci

    CPPC is undesirable e.g. in virtualization and containerization scenarios where abstracted performance values interfere with hypervisor priority and scheduling rules for individual VMs and containers. This would have affected millions of servers around the world...
    It is also recommended to disable it during benchmarking as it effectively skews results based on out-of-the-box provided values - CPU talks to UEFI which recalculates power and performance values and feeds it back to the OS that adjusts process priorities. That makes any benchmark irreproducible.

  • @vilian9185
    @vilian9185 Před 5 měsíci +1

    how to you open the page that you want to show(4:38)?, a shortcut?

    • @aceae4210
      @aceae4210 Před 5 měsíci +2

      I'm assuming it's ctrl+shift+t to reopen a closed tab, but might not be

    • @ineverknowdoyou
      @ineverknowdoyou Před 5 měsíci

      i think he might be dragging it from another moniter

  • @BitsOfTruth
    @BitsOfTruth Před 5 měsíci

    What about backup generators and cell Internet?

  • @kxuydhj
    @kxuydhj Před 5 měsíci

    i might be wrong on this but i'm pretty sure kexec starts a preloaded kernel rather than loading stuff into a running one. my reason for saying this is that, as far as i know, kdump uses kexec to start a backup kernel when the kernel crashes so kernel crashes are easier to debug. again, i might be wrong, tell me if i am.

    • @kxuydhj
      @kxuydhj Před 5 měsíci +1

      ahh, that explains a lot. thanks for clarifying.

  • @FernandoBiaziNascimento
    @FernandoBiaziNascimento Před 5 měsíci

    9:09 Just read the line bellow that one! XD

  • @nathan22211
    @nathan22211 Před 5 měsíci

    I live not far from the border between Missouri and Illinois, while Illinois drivers aren't too bad, Missouri drivers can be. And my grandma doesn't drive that fast even on highways. There's a 65 min speed limit on the turnpike in Oklahoma and she went under that, most drivers in Missouri would honk at us going slow, but when we went to Oklahoma they don't care

  • @rezonant
    @rezonant Před 5 měsíci

    Linus legit read that include file backtrace backwards.

  • @DougGray-xf3hz
    @DougGray-xf3hz Před 5 měsíci

    Good grief, I’m on 6.1 and loving it. 6.8 - how did this end up in my feed.

  • @Tincan21ify
    @Tincan21ify Před 5 měsíci +1

    Why does the whiteboard behind you say "LINUX MUST BE STOPPED"?

  • @StarkRG
    @StarkRG Před 5 měsíci

    I think Linus was, indeed, reading that backtrace backwards. The only .c file mentioned was the last one which is what everything else was being included from. Linus isn't known for his humble acceptance of tiny mistakes, though, so I don't expect to see him admitting to it.

  • @armynyus9123
    @armynyus9123 Před 5 měsíci

    13:25: The not being prepared for cold weather is getting annoying. Ideologie did hit urban planning departments...

  • @autohmae
    @autohmae Před 5 měsíci

    9:15 which is exactly what he said in the part below it, the part about kconfig

  • @mercuriete
    @mercuriete Před 5 měsíci +2

    Linux 6.8 is not LTS, 6.6 is.
    There is no drama.
    Stay on safe releases and that's it.

  • @b33thr33kay
    @b33thr33kay Před 5 měsíci

    You do have to reboot occasionally on most desktop systems. If you want updates, that is.

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +1

      I hate every single person who spread the lie that you never need to reboot Linux, I've spent years trying to undo the damage those people have done

    • @b33thr33kay
      @b33thr33kay Před 5 měsíci

      ​@@BrodieRobertson Lol, I'm an idiot, I thought you were saying the opposite. Glad to see we agree. 😂

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +1

      Rebooting is very important

  • @jpHasABadHandle
    @jpHasABadHandle Před 5 měsíci +1

    amdgpu has been kinda touchy as well lately, with 7800 XT. Until kernel 6.6, shutdown wouldn't always work, and would get stuck or end with a reboot. With 6.7, I can't reboot the machine anymore, because the GPU fails to initialise. Only a shutdown works right...

    • @joseandres42
      @joseandres42 Před 5 měsíci

      Right, I have been having trouble getting video signal after a reboot. I have to SSH into my machine, shutdown and start fresh.

    • @globalcoupledances
      @globalcoupledances Před 5 měsíci

      6.7 running here without problem

    • @jpHasABadHandle
      @jpHasABadHandle Před 5 měsíci

      @@globalcoupledances Specifically with 7800 XT? That's the point here.

  • @JacobP81
    @JacobP81 Před 5 měsíci

    It seems to me like a LOT is put in the Linux Kernel. Based on what I've heard about it's development anyway. I don't see why all sorts of drivers and such should all be inside the kernel. I may be wrong. But it just seems like with Linux LOTS of stuff get stuffed in the Kernel, wouldn't make more sense to make them separate drivers? May I don't know what I'm talking about.

  • @romanstingler435
    @romanstingler435 Před 5 měsíci +1

    Linus just merged some commits

  • @KiraSlith
    @KiraSlith Před 5 měsíci

    3:26 "32 core zomg!" That's right around the point hyper threading starts being a hinderance rather than a help, and you hit bottlenecks in memory speed.

    • @cylemons8099
      @cylemons8099 Před 5 měsíci

      Those are actual 32 cores not hyperthreading. Or you are talking about parallelism in general?

    • @KiraSlith
      @KiraSlith Před 5 měsíci

      @@cylemons8099 Parallelism in general. When you start hitting 32 cores and above for big complex compilation tasks, what I usually hear from fellow techs is to turn off threading in the BIOS/UEFI. Something about accidentally tying up the same core with two separate threads causing modules to choke each other or themselves? I'm a new-ish CSE, still finding out how little I actually know from my peers.

  • @CyberFreaked
    @CyberFreaked Před 5 měsíci +2

    Sooo much props for Linus :) he keeps the linux kernel awesome

    • @temp50
      @temp50 Před 5 měsíci +1

      Yeah... :/ I have a feeling that at Microsoft someone is secretly waiting for his death so that the kernel development could eventually be put next to Minecraft's repository on github...

  • @LokiScarletWasHere
    @LokiScarletWasHere Před 5 měsíci +1

    Based Linus. The greatest danger in the winter, is other drivers.

  • @RichardJActon
    @RichardJActon Před 5 měsíci

    You could ask Wendell from level1techs about that bios setting I think he built Linus' workstation

  • @justasic
    @justasic Před 5 měsíci

    As someone who lives in Oregon for most of my life, the ice storm is very unusual and thus a lot of the areas that were affected were woefully unprepared for it. Most of Oregon's power infrastructure is above ground on telephone poles whereas just a few minutes north in Washington, most of the infrastructure is underground (thus other family members of mine were mostly unaffected by the storm). I can 100% agree with stupid people in cars, most of the people who were driving didn't have chains on or they had them on incorrectly and then for whatever reason think that chains automatically means ice is not a problem. So you can imagine the chaos from such assumptions ;)

  • @methanbreather
    @methanbreather Před 5 měsíci

    -10C is where I consider putting on a jacket going outside for a smoke...

  • @JacobP81
    @JacobP81 Před 5 měsíci

    15:40 Love the ending. One of these days I'm gonna run that command. LOL
    Actually let me jut that down
    Nuke OS command:
    sudo rm -rf --no-preserve-root /

  • @GoatzombieBubba
    @GoatzombieBubba Před 5 měsíci

    Linus Torvalds is in Portland, Oregon not Finland 13:08

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci

      Correct that's why the weather in Portland matters

  • @JacobP81
    @JacobP81 Před 5 měsíci

    11:39 Another words, "Leave the bug alone, it's not bothering anyone." LOL
    I guess it's a peace of code that doesn't work but doesn't actually mess anything up. Basically just resulting in the feature just not existing.

  • @ZeroUm_
    @ZeroUm_ Před 5 měsíci

    "other drivers" -- for a minute I thought he was dunking on the garbage committed to the kernel :D

  • @christopherstaples6758
    @christopherstaples6758 Před 5 měsíci

    I have had nothing but problems since 6.4 , hell even all the builds disappeared apart from their first release , I love Linus messages

  • @mrpocock
    @mrpocock Před 5 měsíci +1

    Maintaining big oss projects is difficult.

  • @knghtbrd
    @knghtbrd Před 5 měsíci

    Oregon Sunday: oh noes, ice storm! Roads were fine. Today: "oh yay its all gonna melt and be warm!" Roads are sheets of ice. It's starting to melt., but it will just freeze solid since the high is about an hour from now. 2 degrees and raining. 2h it will be slush. 4h and it will be ice sheets again

  • @BatManSWG
    @BatManSWG Před 5 měsíci

    It affects custom kernels too? or only the original ?

    • @BrodieRobertson
      @BrodieRobertson  Před 5 měsíci +1

      Custom kernels don't exist without the upstream project

    • @BatManSWG
      @BatManSWG Před 5 měsíci

      @@BrodieRobertson So better wait next version ^

  • @igorgiuseppe1862
    @igorgiuseppe1862 Před 5 měsíci

    the universe dont want my project to finish either, so i an relate.

  • @SlinkyD
    @SlinkyD Před 5 měsíci

    27°C == free to cool down however you like