Dual Wall Cups Suck!
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- čas přidán 13. 05. 2024
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Dual Wall coffee cups are very popular for their sleek glass appearance and simple design. However, are dual wall glasses really any better at keeping your tea, coffee, or other warm drink WARM?!?! In this video we dive in to see if dual wall cups are actually all they're cracked up to be.
#coffee #barista #espresso
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This video actually sold me on those glass cups🤣 had no idea the outside stayed cool. Thank you
For that exact reason I ordered a set of 4 yesterday!
@@bobomar5289I now have about 4 too😆
I think the initial difference of temperature between the two is a larger effect than what you state: I’m looking for glassware that will minimize total immediate heat drop, not just keep it warm for longer, as I’m not a slow drinker. Dual walls are definitely the big winner based on your graphs.
Man, I got my first espresso machine (Breville Barista Express) a few days ago and your videos have been such a helpful tool in learning so much as a beginner. Keep up the epic work!
I got dual wall cups last summer for cold drinks, and I noticed the ice wouldn’t melt for noticeably longer. I didn’t count but It’s say it lasted at least twice as long. They are more comfortable to use and the body heat doesn’t melt the ice. Maybe they don’t perform as well for hot drinks, but I became a fan of dial wall glasses since then.
Hot drinks are a completely different story. You WANT the heat to escape out the top
glad to hear this, was looking to buy some and all i drink is iced coffee, wanted them for this exact reasoning!
I use a stainless steel insulated cup for my morning coffee to work.
Coffee stays HOT for hours.
For around the house i like my double wall glass mugs.
They absolutely keep coffee warmer, longer than a traditional mug. If it does get cold, being glass, you can just pop it into the microwave.
Also works good keeping cold drinks cold.
Doesn't sweat like a traditional glass.
Interesting but my experienced with dual-walled mug is that it retains heat significantly longer than normal mug. You may have overlooked other factors such as wind, temperature differential and duration of physical contact that affects heat flow as well.
As well as having an insulating cover of foamy milk on the top of the beverage
Have you ever tried those phase changing Coffee Joulies before? I love my ember mug and after using a dual walled espresso cup for like a week, I really didn't like that initially held its temp, and really prefered the initial faster cool down of a ceramic cup so that it is more in the drinkable range faster (instead of just having to stir it a bunch and wait a few mins for it to be drinkable)! I also used to have phase changing metal spheres from Coffee Joulies for my automatic pour over machine that quickly brought the temp down to a drinkable 140 degrees, and thenmaintained that temp for a decent amount of time. I kept them in the carafe to give me more time to drink the larger portion! If you have tried them hat are your thoughts on Joulies?
Another thing to consider too is the size mug you are using. Here, he compared similar volume capacity mugs. I've often seen people pouring their 10 oz coffee into a 16 oz mug or some similar situation, and that will definitely affect cooling rate.
The Ember mug has been one of my favorite purchases ever
I found it far superior to dual wall mugs
I sip my coffee over like an hour or so and having it warm still is great. Plus drinking coffee at that perfect temperature all the time greatly improved the flavor
The dual wall with lid I also hate because it keeps it in the hot temperature zone for too long and by the time I remember to check it’s room temp
I don't think keeping a drink warmer for longer is a common use-case people have for these glasses. But yes, valid point. Also what I don't like is that you have to wash them by hand, in a dishwasher they can get messed up quite easily
Really? I always stick mine in the dishwasher with zero problem
It never crossed my mind that dual wall would retain heat longer, seems like common sense that it’s not a thermos
@@paul--b fun fact: thermos are, in fact, dual walled. That's how they keep things warm
@@Emma-dh7by no shit
@@paul--b someone got up on the wrong side of the bed 😂
Did you do the test with foamed milk on top? You’d have thought the foamy milk would act as an insulating cover. (Air after all is the best insulator) As in my day to day experience they definitely keep flat whites/lattes/cappuccinos etc hotter. Maybe it’s the smaller opening on my current ones, but I’m getting a Kruve imagine (because of how good the cheap ones have been) so I’ll soon know if it works less well at keeping my flat whites hotter. With americanos or filter coffee I wouldn’t bother with dual walled glasses.
Hi, i am brazilian and your content is very good !
My set up is Breville infuser with Breville grinder , in my country is very dificult access many brands .
But What dou you think to upgrade grinder like a Baratza sette 270 for espresso , cause i think Breville in fines ajustment suffer to bring a good consistency.
What your opnian to upgrade a espresso machine in future.
Thanks a lot.
For years,I have been using a dual wall stainless steel mug with a lid to keep my 12 oz coffee hot. I am a slow drinker. I preheat the mug and it keeps my drinks hot for a very long time. It is much, much cheaper than a ember mug and works great!
Love my small Yeti Mug for that reason!
I bought a 4 pack of dual walls, but that's because they're really convenient to pour the espresso in with the milk and chocolate in my breville milk frother. And they look great.
Temperature in my beverages mostly comes from the milk 😅
So, do any espresso 2 to 3.5 ounce double walled containers with a sipping lid?
Great content! Just came across your channel! Hey, I see you got a 58... Have you used a cafelat robot much? I'm trying to decide between flair pro 2 / 58 or robot!?!? Can you weigh in on this??? (I currently use a Picopresso as a daily driver which is really good actually)... (New to espresso game)
Get the 58, by far the best workflow and espresso quality
Apples to oranges comparison. First review I think you have missed the mark.
Double walled glasses are intended to provide hand comfort from heat, cold & condensation. They also provide a practical way to check crema for depth and texture, and an overall aesthetic view of espresso shot or cappuccino layering. Double walled glass does these things very well and at a good price point ($8)@).
They are not intended to hold the drink temperature for an extended period of time as I understand the Ember does very well.
Hi, which would be the best option from these coffee machines below. Which makes the best coffee ☕️ and which do you prefer between the following...DeLonghi La Specor OR Ultimate DeLonghi Dedicialista Arte OR Delonghi Prima Donna. I'm so confused in picking the best machine.
I have the Nespresso Touch. I need a bean to cup machine. Can you please help decide or can you do a video 📹. BTW love your videos
Hello, I don’t review bean to cup machines, sorry
Totally agree, dual wall cups don't work for keeping the drink warm, I have a bunch of the Kruve's and they don't keep as warm as a porcelain....they look good and take up a lot of space, that's about it!
Those kruve glasses are epic!
Agreed!
Dual wall hand protection, single wall feel on the mouth. Best of both worlds
I had two dual wall cups. They did not keep my coffee any warmer and broke way too easy. One broke just from stirring my coffee(very,very gently) and the inside of the other one broke as soon as the coffee was poured into it. You have to be really careful with them.
Please check If there is one hole on the bottom of the dual wall mug ,it is especially important for dual wall mug to balance pressure when temperature change suddenly .
I literally dropped my Bodum dual wall latte Cup on the Hardwood floor and it didn't break. I put them through the dishwasher several times. There's a little silicone seal glued in the bottom of it where the hole was created during Manufacturing and it's not showing any signs of coming unglued
I have 1 cappucino, 1 latte and 2 espresso Kruve. Other thab looking fantastic, it's almost good for nothing. Especially the latte and cappucino kruve where u have to be extremely careful when handling them. They are extremely thin and very slipery when washing.
Yep. I had a pair and accidentally broke both of them while washing within 9 months, and I rarely break stuff. The angles on those cups just make them want to shoot off of your fingers
@@Stan_sprinkle And the Latte and cappucino cups are so insecure to even hold.
I had the carafe dare I say it shattered. Really I think to much coffee stuff are made to look good but are way to fragile for coffee brewing
@@mikni4069 best is still Loveramics, notneutral and ACME cups.
@@timzlow There many local ceramicists that are equal or better K.H Würtz from where I live is amazing, I also have one made as an exact copy of medieval cups. Figgjo from Norway are also good to those you mentioned.
Great video, there's just one thing I really missed after you mentioned the lid: the temperature graphs of dual wall with lid vs porcelain with lid. It probably wouldn't have added much to your point, but it's really like a big glaring scientific hole. :) What if, after putting a lid on, the heat loss through the walls becomes significant?
I left that out intentionally because it would depend highly on the thermal resistance of the coaster being used in relation to that of the walls of the cup. For example, if I used a perfectly thermally resistive hypothetical material vs a thin cork coaster
But what about the fact that ceramic mug gets hot to the touch and these dual wall glass ones don't radiates heat that way. It's only losing it through the top in the general sense in such a short period of time.
Didn't know that the dual-wall had barely any impact on temp, thanks for sharing!
Where can you get insulated lids?
I tried them and don't like then either, they delay the cool down for espresso, it could be argued that increases evaporation of volatiles before you can drink your espresso. I'd almost go the other way and chill the cup if it wasn't such an inconvenience.
Hey JLE, so nice to see you here. I love your stuff.
Could you tell me more about the evaporation of the volatiles? Would some of the taste of the drink be lost due to evaporation?
I haven't seen your new video yet but I will definitely watch it.
@@kg-Whatthehelliseventhat that's the theory anyway, but I'm not sure if it makes a big difference
if i use it with cold water, does the moist go inside?
Not sure I understand the question
If you’re asking about condensation, no it will not go inside the dual wall, or on the outside of the cup. They’re very good for that
It is insulated so it doesn't transfer the Heat or the cold to the outside. He's generally missing the point of a dual wall cup. This is the first video that makes me question the reasonable logic of this creator. In a general sense most of the heat goes up and all the top of course but the fact that a ceramic mug gets hot and these don't, the fact is ceramic mug will condensate in cold and these don't come on prove the point their insulated and therefore you're really only losing significant Heat at the top in the short amount of time you're going to be drinking a coffee. He solved that by putting a coaster on top. I do this with ceramic top from a mug that got broken and it works beautifully, doubles the length of time I can enjoy a warm coffee without having to have an ember mug
when i brew my tea in a dual wall mug i cover it with a small plate. it definitely holds the heat for longer like that, allowing the tea to brew properly.
If you cover the top absolutely!
@@LifestyleLab_ for clarification, it also holds longer than a covered ceramic mug. that is why i like it.
I'd like to see a temperature chart of DW + lid vs normal cup + lid!
Think a Yeti or clean canteen mug with a lid. Significant difference in retained temperature. I have a ceramic lid from a team of the got broken that sits pretty well on top of my dual wall bodum latte cup. It doubles the length of time I can enjoy a warm coffee
As you said, both type of cup do lost temp over time quite similarly.This fact alone make me choose... double wall cup for the reasons you mention: they are cool and keep most of temp away of your hand. The negative is that you have to dissociate exterior temp with liquid temp! But after a couple of "burning" your tongue experience, you remember it for good :)
That's so weird. I've always thought my dual wall mug held onto heat much longer than my other mugs. Something I also really hate is how thick the edges are for sipping. It might sound odd but I feel that a thin / sharper edge makes my sipping experience better hence why I've been looking for simpler glasses but haven't found any with a handle cause man those glasses get insanely hot.
Kruve does this very well. The bottom of the cup is dual wall, and then it narrows to a thin glass lip like a wine glass. Best of both worlds
@@LifestyleLab_ Love the Kruve ones but man they are pricey boys
I always find that ceramic or porcelain cups contaminate the taste of the coffee somehow. I really don't like the way coffee tastes. I have this issue less with a cappuccino but still. I found I prefer RVS coffee cups (mine are double walled too).
It could just be a temperature thing since flavour perception is temperature dependent and a 6-degree different is quite significant. The "contamination" could just be the additional flavour that you can perceive at a lower temperature.
Either that or your cups have contaminated glaze and/or scratched glaze with contaminated porcelain / ceramic layer. Could be quite possible in certain parts of the world.
But I think it's just the temperature.
@@testdasi I'm not saying that cannot be the case as I'm really not sure but I notice the difference in taste everywhere I go. Be it at a friends place, at home or even a cafe. And its always the same weird flavor I'm getting so that's odd. Which makes me think its not a temperature thing as the temperature is most likely a little bit different everywhere I go. In fact, I have 2 sizes RVS cups of which the bigger cools down a lot faster and I don't get that flavor in either of them.
I use dual wall mug for espresso only. They taste so good and have such a small volume that they are finished way before they have a chance to cool.
A vacuum filled chamber dual wall mug would keep coffee warm a long time, but obviously couldn't be made of blown glass.
Thanks for the review. But the idea was not only to keep the drink warm, but also to better reveal the coffee's descriptors.
Lol I keep my mugs in the fridge overnight. You don’t want your coffee to stay hot. The coffee is still warm and drinkable when you pour into a cold cup, but the cold shock prevents early oxidation that degrades the flavors. Specialty coffee does better to cool off first before the flavors open up, anyway
i just make coffee in an insulated coffee server, and pour into my mug bit by bit
What about the ICOSA Brewhouse cups?
They're very nice!
Not dual wall though
As a filter drinker primarily I've gravitated towards heavy porcelain mug, Le Creuset and Loveramics in particular, precisely because I want my filter to cool faster to a drinkable temp. I generally brew into the cup as well so it's a bit like a poor man's frozen metal ball technique that's all the rage at brewers comps! I've the fellow carter but, invariably, if left for more than 30 minutes closed post-brewing the coffee tastes stewed and stale, like hotplate diner coffee.
I didn't think insulation to keep the drink warm was the selling point of dual wall cups at all was it?
then what is the point?
If a normal cup is too hot to touch, it's too hot to drink anyways. So preventing you from burning yourself can't be the point either
@@tommihommi1 1) The mouth can consume food and drink that is far hotter than what we can touch. I'm surprised you aren't aware of this!? For example you can sip a hot tea, but imagine pouring that hot tea on your skin. No bueno 2) When you first pour the drink, dual wall insulates the drink so you don't burn your hands even for the initial period you can't drink it yet.
The WHOLE point of dual wall is, as he mentioned at the beginning of the video, to protect your hands from the temperature whilst providing a modern design and not requiring a handle.
@@sAmiZZle82 Just because you can drink it without hurting yourself doesn't mean you can *taste* it, and good coffee is about taste.
Also, consuming overly hot drinks is correlated with increased throat and mouth cancer.
@@tommihommi1 but you can taste it and it doesn't scald your tongue or mouth. This is my whole point. Go back and read point 2 as well.
@@sAmiZZle82 for point 2, that's what handles and tall cups are for.
I find keeping them on the espresso machine while it's on does help 🙂
This will help more for traditional cups than dual wall ones, because they hold on to more heat. (And take away more from your drink if not pre-warmed)
Good day,
I checked out your channel but only for a minute. I'll see more later. I'm hoping to see a few videos of you roasting in real time.
I roast coffee as well. The past 6 months I have gotten a lot better yet I still feel something may need fine tuning. Are you open to roasting questions? Thank you so very much 😊😊
But the Kruve ones look so nice! My drink never lasts longer than 2 minutes anyway 😅
Nothing wrong with going for a nice looking cup!! They are stunning
This is the first time I heard people think dual wall glass will help drink warm for longer. Is it such a common misconception, or this video just overblown it for click bait?
Very common misconception or misrecommendation I see going on in the comments of past videos
Embers are great except for there battery longevity to price. Espresso is my game and Nuova Point serves me well…preheated of course 😉
No mention that the seal breaks and water starts getting in the “void”? That’s the real reason these suck!
Amazing take! So basically, warming up a regular cup before pouring the drink would be good enough to avoid initial temperature loss. And the rest of heat nevertheless would be lost from the surface! I have been using double walled glasses for almost 2/3 years (including Fellow Stagg) but never thought of this logic. I broke so many of them and kept buying, but now, I see a much better logic for not buying them anymore! Thanks.
I don't see a reason to keep my espresso hot for longer - it tastes better when it is cooler, and that's why I never keep my cups warm. For lattes I can understand though.
Dual wall glasses are really cheap, for that reason it gets my vote
I prefer the looks of a dual wall cup. Also I prefer sipping on very hot liquids.
I actually bought my dual wall cup, because it looked cool.
Nothing can take that away! They do look awesome, AND keep your hands from getting hot
Glass is bad to contain heat, instead of porcelain or sandstone.
Glass with an air gap is a completely different story though. Assuming the top isn’t wide open… haha
Dual wall is just flawed concept prone to breaking or puncture and forget the surface area is the biggest cause of temperature loss
For everyday drinkin', I like the Avensi dual-walled glasses. They look great, are fairly thick gauge (I find the Kruve glasses really thin and fragile), feature a single-wall thin lip for pleasant drinking, and are designed on purpose to cool a drink to a drinkable temp with swirling (a high side wall increases the surface area with a swirl). Perfect for a morning cuppa. To keep coffee hot for a long time, I like a Fellow Carter Move. Also dual walled, feature a thin lip for pleasant drinking, fit in a car cup holder, and keep coffee really hot for something like 12h. These will hold more liquid than an Ember, are sealed and can be thrown in a bag (great for road trips and work travel), and use no power. At least for me, an Ember falls in this middle area where its advantages are done a little better by other drinkware. To each their own though, thanks for the vid!
The Ember Mug is the best stupid product out there. It does it’s job extremely well. Highly recommend.
😂
I honestly don't see how an empty space can keep coffee warm better than a solid mass of thick hot glass. I put some hot water in the cup some seconds before making the coffee or just put it in the microwave with water inside and the hot cup does an excellent job at keeping the content warm.
I also never burned my fingers with a hot cup because, unlike the ones you're showing here, the ones that normal people use have handles.
Physics!
With a dual wall, the heat needs to cross far more liquid > solid and Solid > air transitions which are inefficient at conducting compared to a solid material.
Liquid > solid, solid > air, air > solid, solid to air. This is by nature very insulating
@@LifestyleLab_ False. With a dual wall cup you have a hot liquid surrounded by a poor heat conductor. With a hot thicked-wall cup you have a hot liquid surrounded by an even hotter material with a high thermal inertia. You'll have a hard time finding a physicist that agrees with you that the former will keep the liquid warm for longer.
You're intentionally skewing your test by using a solid cup at room temperature that will obviously absorb heat from the coffee. Of course coffee will lose more temperature if you put it in a cold container, only that that's not how coffee is served.
So you’re arguing that the better insulator… is a worse insulator?? If this is the case, why aren’t thermos’s just thick material instead of dual walled with an air gap?
The cup material cannot be warmer than the peak temperature of the liquid put inside, where would that heat come from?
I’m an engineer, I understand thermal dynamics. You’re making zero sense.
@@LifestyleLab_ There's a reason you used a room temperature cup in your test instead of recreating a real life use case, which would be using a hot cup with a handle. Because you know that's the only way the coffee would lose temperature faster than in a dual wall cup.
Except they lost temperature at the same rate… the difference was only immediately upon putting the liquid in. Which was explained. After the cup was up to temperature, they lost temperature at the same rate for the next 40 minutes..:
The faster your drink cools, the better you can taste it.
I use dual wall only because they look cool 🤷♂
Nothing wrong with that!
I love the look
sooo your conclusion is that cups with lids retain the heat better than without lids...?
REALLY
My conclusion is that dual wall cups do nothing for heat retention UNLESS there is a lid. This may seem straightforward to you, but this whole video was spurred by years of comments from people suggesting dual wall cups to keep drinks warmer longer.
I'm not sure how you can say they suck when you can say they look cooler, don't burn your hand, and they keep your drink warmer for longer. What other metric are you using for comparison than those??? Additionally, no crap a mug which costs $150 and uses electricity keeps it warmer. This is like comparing apples to oranges, they're not even in the same ballpark as one another. I find it funny that he knocks the glass mug by saying it doesn't decrease to drinking temp. fast enough! Isn't that the whole point of having an insulated cup??? That only means the cup does what it's claimed to do. lol. I don't know if this guy gets paid by ember, but if so, ember needs to find someone who doesn't talk out of both sides of his mouth.
This video is purely to dispel a very common misconception I see in the comment section of people suggesting dual wall cups to keep drinks hot longer than a standard mug. They are not effective in doing that. This video does not downplay any of the other benefits of dual wall at any point. (Cool hands, cool looks, etc…) In terms of improved heat retention, an open top dual wall cup does suck. This is the point of the video. Not as deep as you think Brock.
RIP me@@LifestyleLab_
In reality they don't, we drink from them so we suck, from them.
Click Bait?
No clue what you are talking about?
Don''t know the deference between Thermos and Cup?
I normally like your content but this video is very not thorough. dual wall shines for cold drinks. when the drink is hot, evaporation is the main driving factor vs. conduction. when the drink is cold, they reduce heat loss from conduction and condensation.
This video was purely through the lens of heat loss as it’s a very common misconception I see in the comment section that dual wall glasses keep drinks warmer longer. May seem obvious to many, but is misunderstood by an equal or greater number of folks. Hence the video. Admittedly, could have added a section that summarized the positives that ARE true about dual wall glasses such as hand comfort etc
Bro you need to fix your frame rate on your videos, you look choppy as hell.
That would be your monitor sir. My videos are in 24fps and display just fine :)
Your video is pretty much one big fat CLICKBAIT. Dual wall cups are designed to hold your fresh coffee without burning your fingers. They are for small volumes of liquid such as an espresso or a ristretto wich can be finished in a couple sips. RE-heating even if its softly your coffee with an ember mug is just another american gimmick to destroy perfect coffee (ask the italians what they think about it). If you want large amounts of hot coffee just go to mcdonalds and ask for refills, personally i'm going to stick to my italian ristrettos served in dual wall cups, gone after a few sips? I'll make another.
You sir are a 🔔 end
Well that’s not called for
Title is a joke. Your comparison is ridiculous. Better then a traditional cup but then goes on to compare it to a thermos mug. And there for it sucks. Sort it out you waster
Yikes... you're an angry elf
Not angry and not a elf. But time waster such as yourself deserves some abuse. Go make some more stupid pointless videos 👍🏼
How DARE someone make a video with an opinion you disagree with in addition to years of providing the coffee community with high value tutorials and product reviews. I should be taken out to the woodshed!
This video is ridiculous and has a click-bait title. I'm disappointed because I usually really like this channel.
Dual-wall mugs are meant only to save your hands. Why would you test a dual-wall mug for it's ability to keep your coffe warm when it was never designed to do so.
I think the ember mug is great, but this video makes it seem like you're desparate for views.
As someone who runs a coffee CZcams channel, I have seen literally hundreds of comments suggesting or claiming that dual wall cups will help keep drinks hot. It’s a very common misconception, and I don’t think it’s all that misguided as people assume it will have similar advantages to dual wall thermoses.
The title was literally addressed in the first 20 seconds of the video. No need to be overly salty, my views are fine thanks :)
My drinks stay hotter for much longer in a dual walled cup even without a lid
Then there are other factors at play with either the geometry or capacity
I really question the existence of this video. Heat doesn't only escape from the top. Dual-walled cups feel cooler to the touch because they've reduced the surface area where heat can be radiated. Air trapped between layers serves as an insulator.
The dual wall doesn't need a vacuum to insulate.
I never said it only escapes from the top, just the vast majority. The insulating properties and advantage to the external surface temperature were mentioned right away in this video