How to set up Force Feedback on rFactor 2 Clipping Strength Tips
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- čas přidán 11. 01. 2024
- Simracing is our passion! This sim racing video is about Force Feedback and Force Feedback configuration on rFactor 2.
We will explain what is Clipping, how can it prevented and how should you set up your rFactor 2 Force Feedback for best Force Feedback experience.
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#tutorial - Hry
I have been wondering for too many gaming hours, why the steering felt like it was clipping and lacking detail. Thank you so much for the tutorial!
you are welcome mate! thats why we are here :)
Ah this is what we need, proper tips. Been messing around with this for a while so definitely looking forward to it.
You aer welcome! It will be pretty basic though. maybe take a look at my general simucube settings, they may help you a bit further.
oooooo!!! looking forward to it!
Hope you will enjoy it :)
Thank you for sharing your knowledge, i learned so much from you👍
You are welcome mate! Thats why we are here - hope you will enjoy the video
Nice job, Michi. Thanks for the clear and logical explanations. This will help a lot of people.
You are welcome mate! Thanks for the feedback. I hope it helps everyone a bit setting things up :)
Hey Michi, once again, a great initiative! :)
However, I must emit a friendly WARNING here. For those of you guys who would begin on rF2 with a Fanatec DD2 base, I MUST advise you not to start like Michi if you are using the full DD2 capacity of 25Nm. Because it will be DANGEROUS!
EDIT: after several hours keeping digging this f*** settings, I must concur with Michi regarding the weird behavior of FFB Output graphs in i2Pro, as however I had set my DD2 base, the FFB Output graphs shows clipping, as long as the FFB strength inside rF2 is not lowered way below 80%. So, the bit below that I wrote before that, is not totally accurate anymore... I keep it because the warnings are still important I think, but keep in mind what Michi says regarding the rF2 ingame setting.
------------ old bit below ---------------------
I followed your tutorial (so with DD2 wheel base and a Formula V2 wheel), and I quickly remembered why the FFB strength parameter SHOULD NOT be set on 100%... :) At least, not to begin with, and not without other parameters in close check.
Now, it allowed me to dig deeper into its different settings and, once mixed with your insights and my testing drives, I could set the DD2 FFB strength from 24 (my former average setting) to 60.
BUT! a couple of other ones are important. So, let me try to give you an overview of my findings (with an Alpine A110 GT4 car):
1. The first difficulty with rF2, to my mind, is to find a good equilibrium between the general feeling you get in the wheel when you drive on a smooth tarmac, and the forces you receive when you roll on (quick) bumps, on curbs, on grass, etc... In order to understand that relationship, it's much better to start with the following settings on the DD2 base (granted that on rF2's side, both settings are left on 100%, so the car multiplier and rf2's FFB strength) : FFB 50%, FFS PEAK, NDP 50%, NFR & NIN OFF, INT 6, FEI 100, FOR 40%, SPR & DPR OFF
2. I don't recommend using the car multiplier because you need to change it systematically with every livery-instance of even the same car, it's not user-friendly at all (besides, it should at least have been moved or copied in the car settings once on the track...). Using the rF2 FFB strength parameter is a bit of a shame since you tell rF2 to send you only a percentage of its relevant values. Don't forget also, that the sensitivity of your steering (in the calibration page) will somehow influence the dynamic response of the tyres: the higher your steering sensitivity is, then the sooner the feeling of weight in the wheel will increase. (and so I must precise that my steering sensitivity is set on 200%, that's how I like it)
3. So, working with the DD2 base settings is the best way to start with, in particular because you can set it while you're driving on the track and it's by far the most efficient way. Now, you got only 5 sets of settings that you can store in the DD2 base, and if you're driving with very different kinds of cars, it might be boring to have to remember how you had fine-tuned such or such car that you don't have a stored set for... And that's where you need FANALAB! (it allows you to keep a database of settings for most games and for each given game, you can keep car-specific sets of settings and if you have Fanalab running on a separate screen for ex. you can change your current settings with a double-click on the car-specific one you want to drive with and it does it in real-time to set the DD2 base (or any other compliant Fanatec base).
4. SO, giving all this above, I would recommend to start with a "rf2 basic settings" like I gave in point 1., then you do some testing drives on a nice track (Spa is a good one) with one of your favorite cars in order to fine-tune the 3 following parameters:
- FFB: it handles the overall strength of EVERY forces that have to be applied [think of a Master Volume on a guitar amp], which includes (for ex.) the dynamic response of the CPM tyres I was talking about (BUT, this kind of forces doesn't have a specific parameter on the DD2 base, contrary to the other two below), but also the strength of the jolts you get when colliding or rolling on curbs, the difficulty you'll have to turn your wheel, etc...
- FEI: it handles the intensity of the specific forces to be applied to your driving wheel on bumps, curbs, grass, collisions, etc... this one represents "what is the maximum value to reach" (for ex.: the game will tell the wheel to turn left for 30°; at 100% it will turn 30°, at 10% it would turn only 3° [it's just to explain, the exact deviation could be less than that in actual facts]
- FOR: it handles the strength of the specific forces to be applied to your driving wheel on bumps, curbs, grass, collisions, etc... this one represents the actual strength with which the wheel will move accordingly to what the game tells it it should do. And THIS IS the VERY dangerous one if you let FFB at 100% and in-game ones at 100% too (though those should be kept at 100% at all times).
So, during your testing drives, use the wheel menu to fine-tune those 3 parameters in order to get:
- good equilibrium between on-tarmac feeling and off-tarmac feeling (curbs, grass, rumble strips, etc...) For ex., the rumble strip on the right of the track on kemmel straight on Spa, you should feel the vibration, but it shouldn't push you back inward.
- richness of information on the tarmac itself, bumps & irregularities of the track, etc...
- no erratic oscillations of the wheel (with my settings above, if I remove my hands off the wheel on kemmel, the wheel is slightly vibrating (you will still get the urge to move them back on it before turn 5, but yeah... no furious jolts in every direction - at once! - and it feels quite and sufficiently heavy like that).
A last point : Once you get comfy with those 3 parameters above, you can see to lower the NDP one (Natural Damper) between 10 and 30 (there's a warning for values below 15 so I don't recommend going below 10, but it can be interesting to play a bit with this one once you have a good understanding of what it does in actual facts). Somehow, it dampens the "natural personality" of the car's model (how the car behaves under stress, that kind of things...).
FINAL WARNING: With rf2 set like I said, and a FFB parameter set above 60%, it would be IMPERATIVE to get your hands OFF the wheel in case of inevitable incoming CRASH. ;)
KIDS: DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME ALONE...!! :)
okay that's it, I'm replying to myself, probably a sign I should go to bed pretty soon...
I finally found a setting that works for the A110 GT4 with the DD2 base FFB strength parameter set on 100%...! Halleluiah! :)
so, it gives:
- rF2: car multipl. 100% / FFB strength: 30% (the value above which it begins to clip, whatever the DD2 settings)
- DD2: FFB 100%, NDP 38%, FEI 50%, FOR 30%
in fact the Natural Damper notably softens the wheel's jolts when rolling over curbs, so I guess it should be tested for each different car with values between 25 and 50. In any case, Fanalab is the way to go if you want to avoid using the car multiplier of rf2.
Very deep inisght into the topic from you! thank you for that.
Whilst I agree with your warnings to the people (yes simracing is dangerouns and driving with a DD Wheel can be indeed dangerous for wrists) I do not fully agree with the FFB graphs and the fact that the wheelbase shall not be set to 100% from the beginning.
Hence I made sure to mention that the FFB shall be turned down in the car specific FFB multiplier (yes which is user unfriendly every time you change the car -- but stays the same all the time if no updates) or the FFB strength in rF2 settings (which works the same way as the car specific FFB multiplier but on a global aspect - so its applied to all cars. (not car specific ;) )
I found it easier adjusting it in fanalab too so I have a profile for every car and it changes it for me every time I get in
Thanks for the video.
Would be great to have something showing how to work and configure the Motect software and get the data from rFtactor2 and F1 23 :)
Hey mate - for F1 23 I have not even tried it yet. Maybe I should, maybe I would read something from that.
Personally, I think setting Motec up is most of the time very personal as in what you need - what would you need?
@@MichiHoyer from me at this time exactly for what you showed. Check the clipping and if messing around with the settings minimizing that would even make the felling for me better
I hear you@@Balrog7 yeah I cannot promise that I can fulfill these specific requests in the future every time. But I wil give it a try to have more reasonable and relevant videos out for that :)
@@MichiHoyer fantasticmate. I know you will try you best 😁
Also love the videos where we see your line of thought on improving your setup. Something like that using the telemetry as you do is also good content that I think we would like.
@@Balrog7I am aware that many people are looking for such things. At the same time I need to be careful though as in what information I can give away for everyone hehe. Many of these MoTeC logs contain intelectual IP of me and other teammates.
yeah, yeah, yeah... that's it I'm abdicating... :) at this stage I think there's no way to get one single setting for FFB strength and car multiplier in rF2, that would work with every car, even with the use of Fanalab. It helps, sure, but depending on the car... i'm afraid we have to give a little tweak to these 2 parameters. maybe if we could dial the effects intensity and effects strength on the DD2 wheel base/Fanalab, it could help a bit more but am not even sure it would be enough... so ok, case closed, we are doomed to be forever members of the rf2 tweaking club :)
Yeah its a bit on/off at times. Sadly we have to live with the compromizes im afraid.
Thank you very much ! Do you have a recommendation on a track that would be good to feel all the effects? Some sort of "ffb test track"? Btw. Häufigkeit -> frequency
Oh another question. Can you save a ffb profile inside rf2 for a specific car (I think I saw that in your settings)?
Thanks!
to question 1) I think Nürburgring is pretty good as it got couple of flatt curbs and couple of big rattling ones, bumps and elevation changes
2) you can safe many profiles, I am not 100 % sure but I think each profile saves the settings (button mappings & Ffb settings)
Hello Michi thanks for the video! I have a question: Do you know how to reduce the vibration in the FFB when going in straight line with flat spot tyres without increasing the Smoothing value?
Increasing Smoothing value only helps a bit - you would need to put a filter into your FFB hardware setting
and that filter needs right frequency & attitude which can be checked with Motec both
Great to see this explained for people who buy a 20nm wheel and then incorrectly run it at %60 strength at the wheel software ...basically asking for clipping to occur!! I have a Simsteering 2 26nm wheel with same settings as yourself but I only run up to %20 damping and maybe %10 friction. FFB multiplier ingame varies from 20-40 depending on the car.
Thanks for your feedback! Yeah this sounds reasonable. What makes you using the 20% dampening and 10 % friction if I may ask - just want to hear the reasoning :)
FFB multiplier is absolutely reasonable yes.
Hey Michi. I use between 15 to 20 percent Damping and some friction. You always need to use some damping as the rotation speed of a DD wheel is so fast. What are your damping settings? Niels Heusinkveld has some good youtube videos on how to tune your DD wheel! He was the Physics Guru for Automobilista 1 or AMS1@@MichiHoyer
His company is where your HE sprint pedals come from!! I have the older Pro pedals and his Simrig GT. I have had my DD Leo Bodnar wheel since 2015 soo about 9 years now.
In all honesty. I do not use any dampening whatsoever. But I make sure with the settings described in the video, that the strong forces of the DD wheel are not "killing" me@@Blacktop503
You're fast enough but I think you will be faster and do it easier with some damping. It will take some time to get used to but you will wonder how you raced without it when you get used to it and then try and go back to no damping.
Hi Michi,
Simucube settings are a bit confusing as per displayed to me.
Are you using any damping/friction/inertia effect from the wheelbase settings or do you rely fully on rF2 FFB input (and ingame settings) ?
Hey there. I think I have everything off and fully rely on rF2 ffb. If anything settings of up to 2-5 % but certainly not more.
@@MichiHoyer thanks a lot !
And wish you an happy racing year in 2024😉
@@agahnim90Thank you mate! likewise
Will we be able to have in-game clipping meter and in-car FFB strength adjustments at some point? Getting in and out of the car is just too much hassle for me and other sims do better here, although I always enjoyed rF2 and how it delivers forces.
I could imagine some simhub dashes are available for that. The game itself probalby wont deliver that information sadly.
Does rfactor remember the settings car specific every time you change vehicles or do you need to change them everytime
It remembers the settings for car specific - UNLESS - the car gets an update.
If you change liveries of the same car, you need to reset your car specific FFB multi too. It only remains the same if you pick the very same car (version, livery, upgrade-configuration)
How do you setup the FFB worksheet in i2?
You create a time distance graph and add "FFB Output" channel to it.
Do you always run zero smoothing or just certain cars/tracks? I find the feedback far too busy with zero & some of the kerbs are really severe (eg Imola)
Yeah, I keep always running zero, as the smoothing not only flattens the input and shock waves of the effects to the FFB but obviously makes the feedback "blurry" if you know what I mean.
@@MichiHoyer Wow! OK. That's pretty hardcore. I'll try & work back to zero & give it another go. I generally run 3,4,5 or rarely 6.
@@teabagmcpick889You will feel a difference for sure the more you come to 0. Personally, I just wish to have the most unfiltered FFB possible, only that way i can get the maximum feedback out of it.
Would love a tutorial on how you set up motec, I can't figure out how to view the FFB data quite how its displayed here.
You add a time distance graph,
Then you click right - properties
Add channels
Ffb output.
Make sure you use the i2Pro Motec :)
I grow away the moza r5 and buy the r12 I go crazy when I play asetto it is so nice en when you go to rf2 it’s only vibrating 😫
What do you mean? the FFB on rF2 is worse than on ACC?
@@MichiHoyer the r5 has not enough power for the game settings or i am doing something wrong 😑
How do you get FFB as a tab in the menu like Michi has in this video please? I know it's one of the channels, but how does it get added in so it could be brought up as a standalone?
You mean for the MoTeC software? or what do you refer to?
@@MichiHoyer Yes, the Motec program. At 4:00 of your video, you can see the FFB tab inserted between the Traction Control and Pit Lane tabs. I figured out how to add a new worksheet tab, but where did you find the actual FFB channel to add it in? Thanks.
@@thracian2072 I think its a Histogramm that then usese the FFB Channel to get these curves. I would need to look it up again.