Nissan Leaf 62 kWh charging at 72 kW and 200 A
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- čas přidán 14. 07. 2020
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Thank you for being fair to the poor maligned Leaf. Other CZcamsrs "proved" the Leaf+ could only charge @50kW but you not only showed otherwise but calculated Amps needed for full charging speed because you know how batteries and chargers work.
There are factual errors in the video...
Delta 150 kW Ultra-Fast Charger (Used by Koble, Grønn Kontakt and BKK) supports CHAdeMO version 1.2. CHAdeMO version 1.2 supports charging current of 400A at 500V, or 200kW.
It's CHAdeMO 1.0 and 1.1 that have a 125A max. CHAdeMO 2.0 supports 400A at 1000V. From the beginning the CHAdeMO plug was designed to carry 400A.
The reason for Delta chargers is limiting to 125A is the cable. With a cable of the same size with temperature sensors inside, you are able to charge faster than 125A for a while. Normally the passively cooled cable will be cold long enough to get past the CC part of the charging cycle.
CHAdeMO died with version 3.0, its not physical backwards compatible with 1.0 - 2.0. And the newest Nissan comes with CCS.
We had a chance for a charging standard that we could cross the world with. But now we have 3 incompatible standards. CCS1 is separated from CCS2 by a large ocean, but not CHAdeMO and CCS2.
CHAdeMO versions.
1.0: 2009 (62.5kW)
1.2 : March 2017 (200kW)
2.0: June 2018 (400kW)
3.0: April 2020 (600kW)
I think this Leaf is a car for almost anyone. Not many of us do drive more than 500 or 600km a day. I really like it.
It costs barely 4,000$ less than a model 3 SR+ here in Canada. So the problem isn't the car it's the price. All these EV's going into bigger battery for more range are now getting too expensive and the quality isn't there for competing against Tesla.
@@onedankind8168 I just got a fully loaded SL Plus for $20,000 USD less than the cheapest Model 3. LEAF at these prices is the value king.
@@pioneer7777777 that’s obviously not msrp. How did you get that deal?
Also I’m using Canadian $$.
@@onedankind8168 It was a dealer loaner car, so had some miles on the odometer but never titled, so eligible for tax credits still. There were about a dozen at one dealer in my area. I believe there are discounts all around the world at this point though.
@@pioneer7777777 no offence. But stacking all the discounts and credits to show how much cheaper something is, sort of missed the point. Not even to mention getting a used price on an ev that has MASSIVE used depreciation.
2020 SL leaf is over 52k and a 2020 model 3 is over 54k before discounts here in Canada.
And that’s my point.
Hey I would love any EV a leaf anything. Just saying the value just is not there when these other vehicles try to compete on range with Tesla.
Insurance is the only winning factor right now for non- Tesla’s. but when Tesla’s insurance plans come out is imagine Tesla wins there too.
The Leaf is Back !
I thought since last year that the leaf could only do about 47 kW charging speed. 71 kW is pretty good, I'm a little surprised.
Thx Bjørn. Much better than i expected!
its good to at last to get positive comment about the leaf I think it's a really good car! Good quality finish
Comfortable and reliable.
Löddeköpinge also got the thick cables now. I topped out at 73kW today. ⚡️💪
they are popping out in Germany too. About 16 Charging Parks with 4-6 x 200A CHAdeMO (and CCS of course) being built right now. But that does not correspond to "CHAdeMO is dead". :-) I am really pleased by this!
Thanks for your tests Bjørn! My first EV is ordered and I have chosen the e208! In France we have a limited 12'000€ incentive if you dump an old car for an EV, so the overall monthly cost of the e208 is less than if I would have bought an old 7000€ gasoline 208 with already 100'000km. Awesome deal
€5500 in Spain if you dump an old fossil car 😔. 12.000 is amazing!
10650EUR in Romania (including 1350EUR for an old car)
I love your videos dude, keep up the good work
I don't normally comment but this was a fascinating and very informative video Bjorn. Well done. It does indeed show that the Leaf is not ready for the scrap heap yet.
Always
Be
Charging
Always
Be
Comparing
Always
Be
Competing
Always be Commenting
VW :
Always
Be
Cheating
Always Be Cleaning.
Always Be Comparing charging speeds
The camera quality in this video is great, good depth of field
"SuperFat" love it. the gap in temperature was surprising. I expected to be much higher temp but it wasnt.
Very good information, and a good video (For the nerds of EV's) .
*The Leaf had a flatter curve than the e-Soul.*
I see, you are a man of culture.
Welcome to my channel. Don't forget to subscribe.
Good shiiiit, thanks for video
pretty impressive for the Leaf. Bjorn was 10 mins slower on the new Ioniq than the Leaf even loading with 50kw max, so on mi-long range Trips it really can keep up or even be faster than some of the CCS rivals...
Their approach on the 62kwh-Leaf is often missunderstood. Its not made for 1000km challenges or even longer trips. That battery is safe for degradation until around 50°C. With rapidgating, it safes the battery after around 41-42°C. That means on the one hand, you have slower charging after the 2nd or 3rd charging stop (after 600 or almost 850-900 km). On the other hand, you safe the watercooling inspections every 3 years for about 400 Euros and have one less system to malfunction.
So in reality, the Leaf is a very good deal for the most.
BUT: Still i think nowadays to convince more people into EVs, active cooling is the way to go. People are afraid of range and want a car that supports that theoretical ultra long trip day trip perfectly.
In markets where Leaf costs almost as much as Model 3, that (and using soon-to-be-dead Chademo) makes Leaf significantly inferior.
@@jjanovsky1983 I just got a new 2019 LEAF Plus for $20,000 less than the cheapest Model 3. LEAF is much more affordable at the low end, and it is the car for the masses. It must not be overlooked. Also, there are loads of new Chademo chargers being built in my area, so it is definitely not dead. I am so grateful to have an extra $20k in my bank account that I can happily live with any occasional drawbacks of the LEAF.
@@pioneer7777777 Congrats! Here in EU Leaf cost about as much as Model 3 and Chademo is dying.
@@jjanovsky1983 change the record
Thank God the Ariya is going to be CCS, liquid cooled and capable of 130kW+ charging.
@@jhchooo Until you have charged to much, and they have to limit the speed to protect the battery.
You know that charging above the safe level gives immediately and permanent damage.
By Tesla reducing the speed after x hours of charging shows that they are destroying the battery to proclame 240kW, and later give you the real safe charge speed.
@@MichaelEricMenk In theory correct, but the new battery with Model 3/Y don't show any slow down, for any millage or DC%.. Only old S and X are affected, they have older battery technology.
Hi Bjorn, in some of your tests you compare range but have done tests at different temperatures you mention that this will have an effect. I have done some quick calcs just using the formula for air resistance that includes density of the air. This density changes with temperature and so I did a couple of calculations.
At 25C vs 0C the force required is 91.62% and so this will have a noticeable effect, the effect of humidity surprised me the resistance is less if the humidity is higher as water as a gas has a lower density than air.
Regards Simon
Good work, another thorough video!
How long does the leaf take to shed that heat?
Still think they should have atleast done some fan forced cooling, battery is only the single most expensive part of the vehicle.
There's one of those bastards in nittedal too, fortum. Weird charger, also has 225kw ccs, but I don't even get close to that with my model 3
forget the numbers, what this crucially means is that in the time i would take you to go get a coffee and a snack and eat/drink it, you would be at or damn near 90% and ready to hit the road again
We need a race between the new ioniq and the new Zoe 🙏
You should really make these videos in Spain or Portugal where you get up to 40º celsius outside...
Leave that to the spanish or portugese CZcamsrs
But is the battery worming up very quickly during charging up to 65C anyways? So then shouldn’t be big difference then? I’m just guessing.
@@MariuszCars The battery tends to be at same degrees or more than outside and after charging, it make practically impossible to lower its temperature. Been looking for any youtuber who's tried portable cooling systems (with ice and all) into the battery as I've seen in forums that it works... just not with the car's own ac.
@@JohnDoe-vx3z should I start a youtuber career? :p I haven't found any videos on this yet... let me try searching in Spanish or Portuguese and I'll let you know :D
So it is actually faster. I’m wondering if Model S 2019 75d will charge faster or heat kills efficiency and I will pay for time on charger without using electricity?
the soul had higher kwh charging rate most of the time. why was it slower than leaf, prior to getting to 74%?
Can u try charging to upto 50-60 % in the 200amp charger or how ever max charger you can find. And charge the rest with default slower charger. Just wanted to know about the difference in battery temperatures and charging time difference(if any) along with cost savings maybe ? Idk the rates and all. Just wondering if u can save some bucks in that way
Between Rapidgate and the scarcity of high powered ChaDeMo chargers, I know who my money would be on in a Soul/Leaf race.
With the Ariya, Nissan as the last EV vendor (apart from non-EV Misubishi Outlander PHEV) is finally switching to CCS in Europe. About time!
Evidently eSoul has more available energy (and more range) than Leaf. All the way down to 73% eSoul is charging in higher speed, but Leaf had 5% higher state of charge at that time? This is the main reason why Leaf finished first.
Correct.. e-soul has 64kwh usefull battery, and real battery capacity is up to 70kwh. The leaf has 62kwh of total energy, so usefull probably 57-58kwh.
@@marcsimmonds5483 on both GOM's yes, but they can be very influenced by the time of year video was taken, driving style of previous trips, and weather that day or day before. Says absolutely nothing. The souls speed was higher almost at all time, so more kwh wenti in there for sure, it is just that the leafs battery is a bit smaller, so by percentage it can be ahead.
I have a leaf the local chargers here charge at 4kwph.. takes me 15.5 hours to charge my leaf
Race e-Soul vs Leaf e+ 1000km Trondheim. Mankind needs to know. Is TMS really an issue? I drove 1000km Kona last June and TMS, I prefer many small charging stops, charged 7 times, and TMS was only in effect for a few minutes in the longer 40 min stops. I don't know. That was Portugal, cold day June (25) sllightly warmer than Norway. Hot days of course TMS matters, but...
Good job, and More of that Audi fisting.
What is the point of the 75kw charging speed?
If you drove the Leaf before charging the battery will be hot already and then you won't be able to really use it and afterwards the battery will be hot for 24h so that's good for a one stop strategy if you didn't drive too fast beforehand.
Chademo is limited to 60kW at HPCs in Switzerland. Not sure why, but that would correspond to 150A.
The 62,5 kW are only 125A. It's just calculated from the max. Voltage (= 500V) and max. Current (= 125A).
Hallo bjorn, Im a big fan of your CZcams channel, I like your way of testing ev, I’m planning to Go to north cape with my Nissan leaf 30kwh starting from Florence Italy, I try to see If I can Charge in danmark sweden and norway but my apps dont work On Those chargers, which service provider should I register to travel through those country? Thank you
Yes and my battery has 32% degradation!
I've had a 2023 LEAF 40kwh for 4 months now and I've tried everything even draining that battery till the percentage showed --- and the charge time screen just showes --- (the 3 dashes) instead of a est charge time to whatever percentage. Is there something wrong with it? Do I need to take it in for a warranty repair? Can I fix it myself? Also a funny thing I've noticed that at an electrify America station it always says 78 minutes to 80% soc even when starting the charge session at 60%. Sometimes the EA station will say my soc at the start of the charging session was -1%. Can someone help I can't find anything online and my local dealership is more clueless than a deer in headlights when it comes to EV system service
What happens when your chademo charting the lead and you also plug in a active j1772 or the other way around?
Nothing. It used to be that if you start on Chademo and connecting j1772, then it will switch automatically to j1772 once Chademo is done. Now - I don't know
I have this car, but can I hell find a 100Kw charger in the north east of England.
Hi Bjørn, would you recomend buying the Leaf vs e-Niro or Kona? Or you would wait for other new cars that will arrive during 2020? (F.e id3 or Mazda Mx-30 )
E-niro 64kwh
Peter Traveller Hi!
Yes, that’s my favorite as well but price diff is big... and then the question is, is it worth the price difference?
@@AndresRodriguez83 Thats currently exactly the point. Leaf is arround 10.000€ cheaper than e-Niro oder e-Soul in the 64 configuration.
So Leaf could still be quite interessting if you do not do many over 400/500km trips a year.
@@AndresRodriguez83 i got one, no Problems so far, Trips until 750km... As Björn said, for this car in real life Rapidgate is not a common problem. 99.9% of your trips don't go that far anyway. It's a very great car when it comes to price / value. Underrated for most people who are afraid of things that will not really happen to them in real life, anyway
Bjorn did hear any news about an upcoming new Leaf ? Nisssan, They are very quiet on that subject.
Do you mean Ariya?
@@bjornnyland A dont known. What the news with that model. is the Leaf as a futur or not ?
I guess Nissan applied the Osborne effect this morning when the Ariya was presented. CCS and liquid cooling!
What happens in a 1000km challenge when the Leaf rapidgates and the Zoe does not?
Nissan Ariya talk please
hahaha bastard variant! TB choice of language is what brings me back everytime!
Bjørn, Nissan will have in Ariya CCS plug and liquid cooling instead of Leef's battery cooking 😂
Yeah!!
Ayyy Notification Squad!
This is all moot for the 62kwh Leaf since the new Ariya supports CCS.
It's actually funny that my 2017 i3 94 Ah or 33 Kwh can charge at higher power above 60%.......
we have 100kwh in usa evgo chadmo
*100 kW
But does it mean that the CHAdeMO plug can deliver 285 A? If the plug is limited to 200 A like in this video then the max power is still 72 kW.
Now let's see the same test at minus 10 degrees outside
It would be not much different.
@@bjornnyland It should, eSoul has a battery heater. Old LEAF used the heater only below some -20 degrees to keep the battery from freezing.
Not after driving 300 km. Then the Leaf battery is nice and warm regardless of how cold it is outside. Just watch many of my rapidgate videos in this channel.
I checked out your older LEAF plus video where you started at 5 degree battery temperature and you are right. So the only problem would be if you were to start a trip with a very cold and almost empty battery.
Yo. I'm the father of all F ups, or will be someday.
+47 degrees must degrade the battery so fast.... and I know the Leaf can get even hotter.
John Faulconer tesla heat their packs when supercharging up to 55-60 Celsius. The thing is tesla cool the battery pack when finish charging
Seems life a Leaf charges faster than an older Model S.. #fuckchargegate
That's the disadvantage of OTA updates. At any given time, they CAN make your car worse. I have a Model 3, and hope chargegate never hits Model 3 users... I wan't to use this car for roadtrips in the future..
You can't compare a 7 year old Model S with a 1 year old Leaf...
czcams.com/video/ZwMA4K9tMEY/video.html
czcams.com/video/s9wIYbTx-xY/video.html
@@bjornnyland you are 100% right. But the majority of older Tesla owners are pissed off. They used to charge from 10-80 in 40 minutes, when they were released. Now, it takes 1 hour and 10 minutes. Just because of a sw update. It's tragic.
No doubt that Tesla batteries degrade minimally, but i don't get why they reduce charging speed for older models.
Nissan Leaf: Great charging ..... until it rapidgates. Bang for the buck car.... until the battery degrades due to lack of cooling & burns a hole in your pocket.