Is Cheating Always Wrong? | Middle Ground
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- čas přidán 15. 05. 2024
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0:00 intro
0:53 I would forgive my partner if they cheated on me
9:57 Emotional cheating is worse than physical cheating
16:34 I would date someone eho cheated on others in the past
25:30 There are much worse things that can break a relationship than cheating
25:41 it's okay to express attention to others while in a relationship
34:48 If you cheat on someone you are not in love with them
44:47 I would rather not know that I was cheated on
57:16 It's not always the cheater's fault when they cheat
1:04:02 final thoughts - Zábava
An unreleased prompt + an extended cut of Middle Ground: Cheaters vs Cheated On is up on our Patreon www.patreon.com/jubileemedia
Do libetarians vs liberals
Social democrats vs democratic socialism
Do Deaf people vs Blind people PLEASE ❤
@@shantelleschimpf1386a
I really wish you guys would skip the hugging thing at the end. All I can imagine everytime is me in that situation feeling the pressure that I need to hug someone at the end but not wanting to inside, yet feeling like if I say no its gonna create this awkward atmosphere for everyone.
@@LennyTheHopelessno seriously I’d be genuinely uncomfortable , esp if I had to hug that chelsea woman 😭💀
you know what’s worse than a cheater? a cheater who thinks they did nothing wrong.
Nobody in the video did that tho
@@argent5196 Delusional child
@@argent5196Damn bro you got to comment on everyone’s comment? you’re hella defensive lol
@@biscutvein uh what I replied to like two comments 💀 and that’s how a comment section works
@@biscutvein but.. nobody in the video did that tho, still
Imagine you start dating someone and see them in a video defending cheating💀
😂😅
😂😂
...thats why I will never go to California 😂 everyone is crazy
No one really defended cheating
😂😂😂
Chelsea is the type of woman that just got back from a gentrified yoga retreat in a foreign country and thinks she’s better than everyone else now.
Eat pray love-esk
HAHA
EXACTLY.
Superiority complex at its best. I can't stand when people act like that. 🙄
😭😭😭
“I’m a Christian I dont believe in having attraction outside of your marriage… I dont see other men” Literally cheated on your husband… 🙂 ok
she did say she changed so maybe she had a conversion after cheating...
You can think something is wrong and still do it lol. I think her point is she would be wrong to do that
Terrifying stuff... smh
she made no real argument. she just said im a christian the bible says and she still cheated.
Crazy
Cheating is always wrong. Period.
It’s not always so black and white.
Not for Chelsea 🙄
@@jackthomas6952yes it is
@@jackthomas6952for this it is
@@jackthomas6952because you can always break up
It’s refreshing to see Middle Ground tackle a topic that has nothing to do with politics
Same, though a few apolitical Middle Ground videos are on absurd topics, such as flat earth, aliens, and astrology.
What do you mean? Politics and cheating are pretty much combined nowadays 😂
Could i ask how? @@LolaKlein
@@len-1768 flat earthers v. scientists is one of the best episodes, purely for the insanity of it
True. Although that one annoying girl Raven was being self-righteous and trying to impose her Christian superiority on Chelsea who's also a Christian 💀
I wanna see more videos on non-political topics like the flat Earth one.
Raven is some top tier gaslighter 😭 how she managed to convince the guy it was his fault he was cheated on
She was the least integrated person on the panel. She just dove into Christianity and convinced herself of the straight-and-narrow path without actually deeply interrogating her motives.
She was annoying because she has such strong beliefs when it comes to cheating but she’s a cheater
Raven is just that type of person who doesn't take responsibility for her actions, so she takes them out on others
I think Sophie was the only Cheater that has come to terms with the fact that what she did was awful. The others did some mental gymnastics to be like, "but I'm better now" whereas she was like "i promised myself and my partner that if I started feeling that way again and wanted to cheat, I would tell him." I think that she was more honest than the others because she also was cheated on
Thank you for your kind words. I did a lot of work both in and out of therapy to find the root causes of my repeated cheating and to become a better version of myself. I haven't cheated on anyone in over 5 years. I can't take back the hurtful things I've done or said, but I can work every day to be a better person.
agreed all the others seemed like they were trying way too hard to defend themselves while she admitted fault and changed
Ain’t no way people are defending cheaters 😭
Idc cheating on men is based
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat 🤢
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat How? You’d be ruining a relationship.
fr
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweatwhat...
its funny how cheaters are trying so hard to convince themselves that cheating is okay
Fr, I laughed whenever one of them opened their mouth. It's ridiculous.
Cheating on men should be normalized i dgaf
Seriously LMFAOOOOOOO
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat ofc it's a swifty talking
Gross how it seems like it's becoming normalizing
Raven is acting like she didn’t cheat, and that she could never, and it’s just heartbreaking
Everyone in this thread is attacking Chelsea but it was really Raven who was the manipulative one. She dove head-long into Christianity, called herself "saved," and didn't integrate any of her shadow side. The red flags are never ending.
@@Orius25 i think the people there noticed did you see at the end how everyone were talking and hugging and no one talked to or gave her a hug lol she's kinda just standing there.
Blonde lady on the cheating side was so obnoxious. The pseudointellectualism was unreal
I didn't find her pseudo, she seemed to be the real deal who understood a lot of this on a very deep level, with a lot of integrity. Maybe she was a bit arrogant, but I found her POV way above entry level. Like... she has lived the reality of therapy and counselling others for a long time. As a therapist myself, it's very obvious.
No, I didn't agree with everything she said, but I didn't find her to be a pseuointellectual.
Those who rationalize cheating probably have the talent to become a politician.
😂😂😂
Yes their key talent being a lack of morals and empathy. Agreed.
🤣
Yyyyaaaaassssssssssss!!!!!!!!!
Real😂
Why is Chelsea talking to everyone like she's a therapist or life coach. It's awkward.
She is actually now a relationships therapist on CZcams and Instagram. Lol.
Life coaches without any educational credentials are just con artists.
@@Stellalovely1😮 deadass?
it’s still so weird because she isn’t THEIR life coaches she just is one
She is one. But she shouldn’t be 💀
I felt like the cheaters spoke the most and drove the conversation, especially Chelsea. I wish this was moderated better.
Agreed! Why did he keep giving Chelsea the floor?? She was clearly manipulating the conversation and overriding other people an problematic ways. I would have loved to hear more from the less talkative folks in the room
@@juiceycrutrue. Wanted to hear more from Leon and the others
Same 100% agree
Well everybody sort of already knows the generalized opinion of those that were cheated on. But no one really knows much behind the thoughts of those that were cheaters. So I feel like it was nice to hear more of their viewpoint... 🤷♂️
Yeah, they really are trying to justify their behavior. It’s even worse when you consider that some of their spouses have allowed it to happen, meaning that they’re enabling them.
I would rather listen to those who have been cheated on, than those who have cheated while defending themselves
I appreciated both sides a lot. Mainstream narratives often focus on the victim. We seldom get a nuanced conversation from the cheaters, and especially not between the cheaters and cheatees in one setting. It was a rare opportunity.
@@Orius25 I see your point but in this case, it’s the cheaters who are trying to justify their actions and tell you otherwise
Me too
This blond woman seems like someone who would go to therapy and then tell the therapist “well actually you should be telling me this”
Spot on 😅
Can't remember rolling my eyes so much in one episode.
Lmaoooo when she said telling your partner that you cheated isnt accountability I screamed 😂😂😂😂😂
@@amandamorgan8047🙄 she's a different kind of special.
@@chiefnama790 nope...just your typical k
Chelsea is literally a narcissist. The way she tries to dance around questions and validate her terrible behavior was insane.
This!! Total gaslighting narcissist! Doesn’t like being blamed. Typical.
I was thinking this too, she sees everything from the perspective of whats best for her and what benifits her. Theres no room in her head for thinking about someone elses feelings
I agree. She was scaring me. She seems emotionless.
@@anne-beritgunhildson598 Agreed, a relationship is about US not about YOU as an individual anymore. Marriage is supposed to be a union of two people. If someone can't think as a team and compromise for the sake of the relationship, then they shouldn't even be in one.
Glad I’m not the only one who peeped that
If your so worried about not telling someone that you cheated cuz of their mental health or the way it’ll effect them…. THEN WHY DID YOU CHEAT IN THE FIRST PLACE💀 what a self centered narcissist
Cheaters really don't be making any sense
Loved Leon, genuinely engaged with the prompts and seemed open to learn over just parroting his beliefs. He asked great questions and showed respect to everyone.
The fact that Chelsea is "counselling" women is worrying.
she seems so proud... crazy
It looks like she is a life coach. That is an unregulated title in America and obtaining training to be a life coach is up to the individual. You can be a life coach without any training. To be a counselor in the US, someone has to have a master’s (or a bachelors in some states) and have a license to offer counseling.
Edited for clarity.
VERY!
No it’s not she made perfect sense
@@argent5196You're pathetic and delusional
I feel completely sorry for the guy in that couple he’s being lowkey gaslit into believing he deserved to be cheated on
Agreed.
Raven seems insufferable
@@Fnanaanf for real 🤦🏻♀️ she uses the bible to justify everything and follows “every part of it” but where was that resolve when you cheated 😒
well..thats because society says its always the mans fault
That Raven girl was so annoying and her Christian superiority over everyone is mind-numbing. Apparently she cares about the bible until she gets to the 'thou shall not lie' or 'thou shall not commit adultery' parts when she cheats.
The highest form of love is consideration. Once you no longer consider your partners feelings, or how your actions will affect them, you are not in love with that person. Continuing to work on your love is an action, yes, but that action requires you to consider your partner and your self… if you cheat, once you cheat you are only considering yourself. You are ruining the opportunity to continue to cultivate love and maintain being in love. If you cheat, you are not in love with them… it really is that simple. Stand on it, like you stood on the act of cheating. That’s accountability too.
damn, very well said
WOW THIS IS IT
Nah, you can definitely love someone and cheat on them. What you’re suggesting is that people never hurt people they love. If you said they don’t respect people they cheat on I might be inclined to agree, disagree with love though.
True
55:16 “if you have a suicidal partner…”
you shouldn’t cheat on them in the first place . ESPECIALLY if they are suicidal.
While I agree. I have heard from friends that they can't bring up "breaking up" because then they will "off themselves"
So they cheat
@@Re69. that’s horrible
It’s Chelsea saying that she’d never forgive a cheater, then going on to say that she’s cheated multiple times💀
She also claims everything she did with the guy she cheated with was in the best interest for both of them. Delusional!!! She never states remorse or regret for hurting her partner at the time that she cheated on.
@@jazzycola narcissist behaviour
I'm convinced she just wanted to talk for every single prompt
She also said she would date a cheater so 😭😭
I just blank her out when she talks.
The smugness of the woman in the blazer is absolutely wild-to say you don’t owe you *husband* the decency of telling him the truth, after you’ve made a vow to love him through sickness and in health, to then go on and *cheat* on him and *betray* his trust because you are selfish is just absolutely crazy to me.
yes omg i’m so glad someone is talking about this !! i literally couldn’t believe what i was hearing
she made my blood BOIL
and she’s still with the person she cheated with
Then she went on to contradict herself like 5x.
It’s like she’s still trying to justify what she did
A flawless relationship can be shattered by a fleeting moment-a kiss, a fling-that may have occurred many years prior. You might not even recall the face of the person involved in that momentary lapse. Yet, for your partner, it can spell the definitive end.
In numerous instances, one partner discovers betrayal, a grave error committed in a moment of recklessness. By the time the truth surfaces, the partner once cherished has moved on, leaving the betrayed to embark on the arduous journey of healing anew.
This scenario isn't confined to the past. A couple in their 70s found that other cheated them in their 30s
they divorced
Therefore, after solemnly vowing to stand by your partner in sickness and in health, to then betray that trust out of sheer selfishness is utterly incomprehensible to me.
Simply because you possess the capability to do something doesn't mean you should. Theology should remain a thousand feet away from practical, real-world decision-making.
I can’t understand not wanting to not know you were cheated on when we live in a world where STIs exist.
The point of telling a partner about cheating is not to make yourself feel better but to finally be real with your partner. That’s the least that they deserve. How are they missing that fact??
People like Chelsea didn't say you shouldn't tell your partner. They said that telling your partner, in of itself, is not accountability. Accountability is when you take self-inventory and understand your own motivations, feelings, needs, and desires. That's why Chelsea recommended maybe telling a therapist first. Keep in mind that she is coming from the perspective of counselling women in domestic violence situations. In that case, telling your partner could be dangerous, so maybe telling another third party is better.
People in this thread are vilifying Chelsea like crazy but I think it's because she talks about a truthful reality that people don't want to hear.
Cheating is always wrong. Taking responsibility for getting cheated on is crazy. If you’re not happy in a relationship then JUST LEAVE. Simple as that
Nope, women who are trapped in relationships can cheat on their abusive partners.
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweathmm I can see why that is okay, but I feel like this could just make the woman get more abused and put her in a worse situation if the abuser were to find out
@@TaylorswiftarmpitsweatI feel like if you are in an abusive relationship, you cheating and getting caught will 100% make things a lot worse for your safety. I think your safety should be no.1 priority rather than cheating on your abuser, not because it isn't moral but because you are literally just putting yourself in danger.
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat
How can a woman be trapped in a relationship?
Are you talking about a kidnapped hostage?
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat If all you’re gonna do is post rage bait bullcrap then please stop posting. You’re adding nothing to this conversation.
Chris saying he cheated because he didn't have a father figure... Bruh that makes no sense 💀 i know plenty people without father figures who don't cheat, just making up excuses
It's only one piece of the puzzle that I'm trying to figure out. I don't blame my actions on any one part of my past. I take full accountability for my actions. I'll always be a work in progress. ✌🏻
It reminds of that meme where guys say "I cheated because my grandma died two years ago and I didn't have a dad and one time my mom put me on restriction and I had a dog that was hit by car" or something lol
Like what bro?!
People who come from single parent households are statistically much more likely to cheat. It's not an excuse, but it does explain what makes some people more prone to cheating than others. Understanding human psychology and behaviour is not the same as justifying it.
@@chrissiroisit’s almost like you didn’t delve deeper and give more clarification that made sense lol
@elisestevenson9120 him saying that he didn’t have a father was not his excuse for why he cheated. It was a prefacing statement into the real reason that was he was raised by and primarily surrounded by women and learned to crave their attention and what not. THAT was the reason he was a cheater.
@@MrStevo411 well, it wasn't like this was going to answer all of the questions. It was a very limited discussion and there are so many pieces that go into our dysfunctions. I'm on a quest to just be a better person and being a part of this conversation was interesting to say the least. ✌🏻
chelsea made me roll my eyes throughout this whole episode
The cheaters are literally doing gymnastics to avoid taking responsibility! Like throwing out worse case scenarios like suicidal partners & abusing relationships. Those are not the majority of cheating case so don’t use them in this argument
What made me laugh is that they are abusers themselves and dont even realise it
Middle Ground Idea: Parents whose child ended a relationship with them vs child who stopped having a relationship with their parent
Love this idea!
Incredible idea
yo me and my dad should be there, except he dont speak English, only Spanish
You should’ve phrased this better…Unless you’re from Alabama🌚
This would be so interesting !!
Chelsea is giving “yea i cheated and i’ll do it again.”
Ariana Grande vibes 😅
She for the streets…
LMAOOO😂@@osmanyousif7849
She probably blamed the partner when he found out
Buddy @20:50 she admits it. No conspiracy there. She has a side dude she is screwing even though she is married with 3 kids
Chelsea seems like the type of person to talk nonstop about divine timing and the universe protecting your peace while literally being the spawn of satan. EMBARRASSING!!
I didn't get those vibes from her whatsoever. She seemed wise.
Cheating is one of the most disgusting things you could do to someone.
There’s a lot worse things you can do, like thousands of worse things you can do. It’s not even close.
True
@@muhammadlee-You're wrong, it is that close
@@TheRider6199 It’s not even the worst thing you can do in a relationship and somehow you think it’s among the most disgusting things you can do? Seriously?
@@muhammadlee- I didn't say it was the worst thing you can do in a relationship, but IT IS one of the worst things you can do in a relationship, obviously you're one of the most people who don't get that.
Chelsea seems like the type of person who thinks she has figured it all out and therefore knows better than everyone else. It was so irritating to watch her treat others in such a patronizing way.
you can tell from the way both chelsea and raven were speaking and wording things that they view their subjective opinions on topic as fact and the superior way of thinking. 🙃
i thought i was the only one who noticed this since no one really mentioned it. She was treating the others in such an odd way, smiling/clapping whenever she "proved" a point (even though this isn't a debate competition), yet to get there she had to contradict herself many times to get there, even being called out on her hypocrisy.
@@shhhyourtooloud257I couldn’t stand her.
I was gonna say I felt the same about raven “I believe in the cross, and the Bible, the whole Bible, not just one portion of the Bible” like girl get over yourself😂
@@truself108she was doin that to be funny toward Chelsea haha.
As a therapist myself, I would investigate narcissism with Chelsea.
That's why they call the qualified one psychiatrist
@@martingarno9815 Confused by what you mean. How would my being a therapist stop me from diagnosing her with a mental health disorder? What medications would you prescribe somebody with a narcissistic personality disorder? A psychiatrist would be unnecessary in this instance.
I clocked her as one before she even spoke. Autism rizz at work once again lol. No but for real, she's insane. Look in her eyes and look at her body language and how she tries to police everyone around her, and her subtle little passive aggressive jab at the guy who mistakenly walked forward for the final(?) question. I would not trust her in a room with ANYONE.
@@HH-mr3iq
I think they meant there’s a reason Chelsea is a “life coach” instead of a qualified psychiatrist
hahahaha
To think the one being cheated on is ever to blame is unbelievable to me.
Cheating is one of the worst forms of betrayal. There is no if or why. It’s like saying you hate that person and exposing them to health risks.
Why isnt anyone talking about Chelsea. Her entire persona is mental gymnastics to validate selfishness
Literally. I don't see anyone talking about her
I came to the comments fully expecting it to be a bunch of comments about Chelsea but this is the first I’ve seen
I commented she was a huge gaslightler an hour ago lol but before mine? 0 comments lol
I was expecting lots of comments about Chelsea too. She seems very narcissistic and trying to avoid any type of blame on herself. The gaslighting from this woman is astounding.
Yes I’m so puzzled by her one of her bad takes is saying confessing you cheated is NOT accountability 🤔🤔
Chelsea seems very manipulative. I think she has brainwashed herself to live with what she did. The language twisting and the narratives pushed just didn’t seem genuine.
Narcissistic gaslighting.
58:06 she actually councils other women. I was thinking either her therapist filled her head with delusions or she is one herself. I can’t imagine how she’s twisted some people’s minds into thinking like she does. Why is it always the people who need the most therapy are actually the therapists?
@@raimeyewens7518 definitively, I think she inadvertently said it herself. Yes, a relationship needs fulfilled individuals but to say she’s the only one that matters was just so showing. Scary that these are the loudest voices and counseling others to make decisions in life.
@@JoseAFV1907she didn’t say she’s the only person that matters she says she has to be the most important person to herself. But I see why people would say that’s jarring because we are told that self sacrifice is the only way to make a relationship work.
@@jessthecreativeee a degree of self sacrifice IS the only way a relationship can work, period.
hot take: if your partner is abusive and you are unsafe to leave the relationship, it is no longer a relationship it's a hostage situation. your partner broke the relationship contract when they became violent and there is no such thing as "cheating" when you're being held against your will.
Nothing to discuss. Its immoral, disrespectful, careless of the person cheating. Its wrong, period.
And it's desrespectful to ignore your partner and that's why sometimes the cheating occurs.
An hour long video? What are the cheaters even gonna say? this is gonna be humiliating😭😭😭😭
Maybe the whole point of the video is to give some perspective instead of immediately assuming ill intentions of people so quicky.
@Nintendoshi ur tripping 😭 intentions dont matter when your hurting someone the "intention" doesn't make hurting someone, the betrayal of trust etc etc any better. It's wrong on base level u the problem if u can't see that
@@a.k2354i agree and i think cheating in itself is VERY intentional.
exactly
The title might be “Is it wrong” but they ask a lot of deeper questions around emotional cheating, love for a cheater, and forgiveness. It’s actually very humanizing to hear for those that have been cheated on. Maybe watch the video before leaving a comment
Blonde lady saying “we all play a part in cheating society included” euhm what do I have to do with you deciding to go mess with someone else ??? The cheaters were really trying to convince themselves that what they do/did is okay when it never is.
yup that was so random
Yes I couldn’t believe her saying that! How does society cause you to cheat?!! 😅 I couldn’t believe anyone was nodding along with anything that arrogant woman said!!!
Tell it!! 😭😭😭 Chelsea is ummm.....
i think it has less to do with society, more childhood, the community you were brought into, and the values you were born into/raised around. hurt people hurt people and thats probably why people cheat in the first place. still unjustifiable though dont get me wrong!
@@mahadewiiiiso arrogant! And completely delusional with half of the things she was saying
That girl with a grey hoodie needs a hug i have been through that i can see how she is literally hurting🥺
which girl with grey hoodie?
@@SamuelJ888raven, the one who cheated
“If you’re in an abusive relationship then just leave” is s o o o o wildly ignorant. And she was so confident saying it helpp 😭
So ppl should stay in an abusive relationship? The only solution in an abusive relationship is to leave. Is it hard absolutely doesn’t change the fact that it needs to be done. And cheating on your already mentally unstable partner isn’t helping them leave
@@Jenny-vm3yu never said it was simple. I agree that it can be very very hard. But what you’re is that it’s better for women to stay in an abusive relationship than to get help and try to leave, which I’m sorry I just don’t agree with. It sucks that we live in a world where people think it’s better to stay in an abusive relationship, because what it’s hard?
@@madisonhawkins4504 it's quite hard to leave an abusive relationship
@@xqr.r where did I say it was easy? Which comment? Just because something is hard doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be done. What’s the alternative, people should stay in abusive relationships because it’s hard to leave? No. People should leave. They should get help or at least try. So that they can live a happy life. And I’ll add that if others see someone in what seems like an abusive relationship they NEED to tell someone. Also if someone is in an abusive relationship and they’re close enough to a person to cheat on their partner with, that person is close enough to help them escape the abusive relationship.
Hearing Chelsea say “what if you have a partner that’s suicidal” trying to justify not disclosing cheating made me roll my eyes. Like quit coming up with hypotheticals and doing mental gymnastics and just be real with yourself. You did something bad to somebody and they deserve to know so that they can heal properly instead of looking for answers.
If people were that truthful about things, they wouldn't have cheated in the first place. You see things as black and white but partners have to take accountability for their spouse's feelings at some point. If you've been with someone for x amount of time you could guess how they'll react to the truth.
@@kamuilasia5813How can someone be responsible for somebody else’s feelings?
If a partner is suicidal, she should be feeling worse about actually doing the action in the first place. I have to wonder why she got married.
if you don't know, it doesn't affect you, if you do know, that is only gonna cause you suffering for a while
besides, if they were worried about their partner being suicidal, they shouldn’t have cheated in the first place
The cheaters said exactly what you think they'd say.
None of them said the obvious
figured
thanks i didn't want to watch the full video but the title was interesting enough to click😭😭
yeah literally. i was hoping there would be cheaters that evolved into better people and take responsibility for what they did, etc but nope
@@rosie2871 i was hoping some of the cheated on would take responsibility for the fact they didn't satisfy their partners and evolve to do better, but it never got bought up
Raven saying that attraction to others is not acceptable in a relationship is peak hypocrisy
Edit: and now she's calling chelsea a hypocrit LOL
I noticed how Chelsea especially and most of the cheaters used selfish rhetoric and kept saying ME it’s all about ME!
Everyone in the panel is talking about their personal experiences. What else should they be drawing upon if not "me"?
How is she not attracted to anyone, but she still cheated on her husband??? Make it make sense 😂😂
Because like most Christian’s she’s a self righteous liar.
and she tried to bring up religion.. like girl how u be so confident and so wrong at the same time
She did a bad thing and it’s her way of trying to correct the behavior so she doesn’t do it again especially since she is still with the same partner. I doubt he wants to hear her say that she finds other men attractive
Yeah that didn’t make any sense…like girl you cheated so obviously you found someone attractive enough to get to that point. Then the husband was the one who had go re-examine himself. Like ooooh kay.
Yeah, and i feel like she was skirting around the question too… like the question was do you find other men attractive and her answer was “I can’t, im married and Christian”
…ok. you “cant” according to your religion but DO you😂?? You cant cheat as a Christian either, but you did that, so???
A lot of people use the word “narcissist” too loosely. Chelsea is absolutely a textbook narcissist
100 percent. I mean even turning it around and blaming the other person for what she did.
I like her 😂damn her narcissism is working
@@starsigngirl9789you’d be manipulated very easily.
@@starsigngirl9789Rule of thumb, if someone says they’re a cheater they’re typically a liar and deceitful which comes along with a cunning way of speaking and are often seemingly very honest (manipulative).
And she totally has a savior complex with her counseling job
You scared to leave an abusive but not to cheat on the person abusing you 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
Chelsea is the type of person to hear she's the problem from everyone and thinks that everyone is the problem
Chelsea has this arrogant, “enlightened” energy that makes it seem like she thinks her way of thinking is THE way of thinking
So does Raven, I think that’s why they butted heads 😂
I’d say that’s more Raven
@@MarcoAce13 her too she’s that’s stereotypical holier than thou Christian
A lot of people think their way of thinking is the only way, just look at the comments sections. Everyone who disagrees with Chelsea's perspective is insulting and ridiculing her rather than just agreeing to disagreeing.
@@ElectronicCalifornia when people have an arrogant or hypocritical attitude it’s naturally repulsive to others. That’s what people are reacting to, and there’s nothing wrong with that. It (should) serve as a social learning tool for the person to become more empathetic in the future.
I feel bad for anyone in a relationship with Chelsea.
You can bet money that there was a counceller (just like Chelsea) involved, when Keith figures it out he's gona be pissed. Been there done that, his partner Raven is a sociopath. Letting Chelsea participate tainted the discussion.
Same with that Raven girl, she's insufferable with her Christian superiority and gaslighting Keith.
Sameeee
Why? She seems pretty smart
@@MarcoAce13she contradicts herself a lot bro. She said she cares about herself more than anyone else but she wouldn’t tell her partner because it might hurt them even tho ACCORDING TO HER (she said this) confessing your cheating relieves your guilt and shame.
Genuinely I’d never forgive a cheater, and I don’t expected to be forgiven if I cheated.
I tend to get revenge then I leave but I leave 100%. I hate that ppl expect to be forgiven the first time like we owe them a forgiveness. No we don't either.
Chelsea is a complete narcissist… I feel bad for her clients if she really is a therapist
i loved that british dude, he asked hard questions and had pretty solid opinions
He’s South African
@@niyajawn How do you know
He was eating Chelsea up
@@annetteoleary5691 I don't see the relation
@@stamzthehuman897 because he can tell? Maybe the person is South African? I'm British and I get how people can get confused between British and South African accents but ultimately, he does not sound British.
Raven and Keith being a couple was a PLOT TWIST! She talking about “I’m a Christian” and cheated in a marriage?!
And they have children smh 😢😢😢
I hate when ppl try to run to religion after doing something horrible. It’s so played.
So Christians are perfect??? What??? Lol
That part!!
@@ravethomas16 girl no, but almost all of us know someone who has made a big mistake and then they try to quickly get forgiven and not face consequences by pushing the hurt party into Christian forgiveness. It’s toxic.
Saying you’re Christian and believe in the entire bible, but missing the commandment to not commit adultery 🙃
Cheaters always refer to the ones they cheated on as someone they “loved”. You don’t know what love is bruh… fix yourself and your behavior
Chelsea is so incredibly smart. She has figured out how to convince herself that she's not a terrible person, was able to educate all the noncheaters about how wrong they are, AND has even made a living in counseling other people that are presumably going through similar situations. Absolutely brilliant.
textbook narcissist
Yup! And tries to reason to others how they're wrong for nor being self centered like her! She admitted she puts herself first in all aspects, which is disgusting behavior.
@@Akili369what’s wrong with putting yourself first?
@@gorillagripcoochie631 It’s the way she said it. Of course we should take care of ourselves first, BUT we absolutely have a responsibility to consider the feelings of the people in our lives before we act. Her whole point was I will always put myself first and do what I want to do, regardless of how anyone around me feels.
That’s because she loves the others 💀🤣🤣🤣
Not having a father at home is not an excuse for cheating.
Definitely not an excuse but can be a factor
@@onyinyesarah1226yup. Could be a factor. Even worse, if you have a present useless cheating father 💀
not an excuse but definitely leads to being a cheater due to the lack of a positive example of monagomay in the home.
true even though not having a healthy relationship to look up to can impact a child
@@onyinyesarah1226 “Hey, babe. My dad is a deadbeat so I decided to cheat on you. Whoopsies!”
I know I’m in an abusive relationship and its not safe for me to leave but while I’m away from my partner I’m going to cheat and include someone in the perceived danger. -Sophia, co-signed by deranged Chelsea
Cheating is one of the worst things you can do to your partner. As someone who was cheated on, it has caused problems in my current relationship because I have severe trust issues. The biggest problem is I don’t even trust myself or my judgement because I was so oblivious. I know it’s my own issue to work through but cheating causes psychological damage to a person. It is a selfish thing to do and I’m glad Chelsea admitted she was a very selfish person. Most cheaters are.
the moderator is giving chelsea way too much airtime lmao
She probably slept with him 😂
@babyb7001 you messy for that
@@babyb7001 My goodness. The door is open...GET OUT 😭
Because she made the most sense - correct or not.
@@aditi22012 hi Chelsea 👋
The fact that Chelsea thinks cheating was necessary and couldn't have just ended the marriage respectfully blows my mind.
Exact,why can't you first end a relationship the moment you feel you fell in love with someone else rather than cheating is beyond me
She s just a B
Narcissist. Gaslighting.
That's not what she said. Also she did leave her husband after confessing to him? What?
How is it mind-blowing? When she cheated, she came home and moved out, and then began the process of moving on.
Raven is trying to either get back with her husband or keep him after cheating. DON'T DO IT BRO. ITS A TRAP...
Unrepentance is real and dangerous. 💀 ☠
as soon as that girl raven said im a christian, I was like bye. you came out here publicly defending cheating
I love how she identifies as a serial cheater like it's an illness she has that she can't stop.
I feel like she has a sex addiction.
Tbf a lot of serial cheaters have underlying trauma that they're not fully dealing with. I think they should seek therapy so that they can find happiness in themselves.
LMAOO
The thing is some people cheat and yes it about something else than the cheating sadly I am with a husband who is on the spectrum and have a hard time understand his own feelings. Now, he ain't a cheater but I understand and saw a serial cheater does not understand why they did cheat because they don't understand their behaviors so naturally they repeat it. It goes hand and hand with many behaviors not only cheating.
Like she doesn’t have to be in a relationship. She can do her own thing.
Cheating is always wrong. No discussion needed.
At first I was upset with all the unnecessary discourse around this, and the struggle so many seem to be having to understand this, and now I'm just fascinated! Lol
The only time I can kinda understand is if someone is in an abusive relationship and could be in danger if they broke up with there partner and find somebody to help them get out.
@@12toro why would you need to cheat to do that? Its the only slightly understandable situation but you still don't need to cheat to do that.
@@intensevideogame If your partner is abusive and you need another relationship to get you out
@12toro imo, if you are in a relationship against your will. if you sleep with someone else, you arent cheating
Love the discussion and respect to everyone who participated but one thing that I noticed is that most of the people who have cheated have replaced the definition of " love" with "infatuation"
Exactly. One of them even said she was in love with two people at once. By definition, that’s impossible lol
Let's not forget that cheaters can put your physical health at risk. You absolutely need to tell someone you've cheated especially if the original commitment was monogamous...surprised the topic of venereal diseases didn't come up.
This! So many women contracted diseases from their cheating partners. I don't think they realize that they are putting their partners health at risk by not using protection.
Yes!!!!
This!!!!
Was waiting for the STI topic to be brought up the whole time... That's one of my main issues with cheating.
YES!!!!
I’ve been cheated on, it’s one of the worst feelings in the world. It is NEVER justified no matter what.
Especially when they blame you for it
Not unless you are a dv victim
@@AsapChalanor a sa victim. I personally was manipulated whilst under the influence even though i had said no sober multiple times and no drunk- when i was alot more drunk than they were. They manipulated me by saying were just friends its not cheating when i said no im in a relationship (which i had just rambled on abt how great he was and showing pics of him). They said he doesn’t have to know if he thinks it is cheating. And kissing isnt cheating. And then reiterated were just friends its not cheating and got moody with me until i gave in. I live with that guilt of the two kisses we had every day but I learnt not to put myself in that situation again no matter how much I trust my “friend”.
Most of us have lol
@@AsapChalanjust leave omg cheating is still not ok.. no excuses
I just absolutely love how open and respectful everyone was with each other speaking their truths. Thank you Jubilee for yet another thoughtful and interesting episode.
Cheating, no matter how one defends it, is ABSOLUTELY WRONG!
Anyone who says cheating is not wrong is either:
a) a moron
b) a cheater who is defending themselves
c) someone who was obsessed (in a romantic way) with a cheater
d) all of the above
pretty much
No one said it wasn’t wrong, but there are situations that are more nuanced than black and white.
What is a moron? I'm curious
Or, e) professional baseball players in the early 2000’s
@@SqueakyMcGee lol
Short answer is yes
Nope, cheating is justified against men.
Yep, cheating is wrong in any context of life
Exactly,short and simple 😅
Long answer is also yes
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat nice name😅.
Maybe I’ve just not watched middle ground for a while but this new setup with the mediator on screen and interacting between the participants is refreshing to see
Don't want to be mean, but I'm glad alot of people in the comments are getting the ick from Chelsea. Was worried people would agree with her as she has this authentic therapist tone which can lure people in.
And she probably has zero educational credentials (doesn’t have an MSW; Ph.D; M.D. (psychiatrist), etc. Anyone can claim to be a therapist or life coach.
Chelsea's answers scream that she doesn't think she really did anything wrong... she got a beautiful life out of cheating, basically. The thing is, she didn't have to cheat to get that life!! Just don't cheat. It's cowardly and low class. Own your ugliness (the kind on the inside) and teach others through acknowledging your mistakes.
she acts as if there is NOTHING wrong with what she did. i’m not qualified to diagnose anyone by any means but her justifications seem very narcissistic to me. the mental gymnastics she does is on another level. it seems like she learned nothing from her actions and it’s insane to see someone who clearly made a mistake not see it that way…
A beautiful life, how?
This is the thing...I understand falling out of love or falling in love with someone else but before you act on it...be a goddamn adult and go through the garbage and pain of a breakup. Who wouldn't rather be broken up with than cheated on? It's just chickensh*t to do that to someone you supposedly love.
Not only did she do mental gymnastics. I was under the impression she works as a therapist or life or coach or something based on her responses in this video, basically, she teaches these mental gymnastics to other people. Her interruptions were "this is wrongspeak, use language that makes what I did look less bad".
@@jaimemarrero3982she has a podcast and runs social media pages called, The Other Woman & The Wife. She has no therapy background.
Leon was my favorite to listen to. He always had thoughtful and logical questions, comments and responses.
His positions all seemed well thought out and reasonable
Underrated comment fr
Fr he's so real
He isn't trying to justify anything
Just being real
I just love how calm and chill and educated Leon is
I truly think you cannot love someone and cheat on them. But I think in the same way, you can’t intentionally cause harm to your partner and claim you love them, at least in that moment. When you love someone, you want to do you best by them. Consciously choosing to do something you KNOW will destroy them is not love. It’s selfishness and self-serving, which you should not be in a relationship with someone. Especially if you are claiming to love them. I’m surprised no one talked about this.
Chelsea will say you can't control how someone else feels, but will try to control how someone else feels by not telling them that you cheated. It is hypocritical.
Chelsea is lowkey just yapping like bro asked her at 36:27 if it was love or lust and she literally didn't answer she's literally doing mental gymnastics
His question of: "when you cheated, did you meet the standard of what love means to you?" was so strong and she, once again, didn't answer it 😅
The whole time she gave me the vibes that she's using all these words and psychology speak to seem more intellectual and mature, but beyond the surface she wasn't really saying anything of substance. Just trying to make herself look better, yet never taking accountability for her actions.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but her main takes were: she doesn't like playing the "blame game" when it comes to cheating (convenient when you're the one in the wrong), thinks it's wrong and selfish to come clean and tell someone you cheated on them (also convenient, as you get to get away thinking it's not as bad to have cheated because the other person can't be hurt if they don't find out), and thinks cheating isn't the cheater's fault on certain circunstances.
Listen itnwas crazy. I was like girl you said a lot to say nothing
@@declaracionespolemicas yep I thought her takes were completely wild and audacious, considering she was the cheater 😂
No she's not doing "mental gymnastics," she's self reflecting on how to apply those two terms to her situation because she acknowledges that there is gray area.
When you cheat on someone, you need to tell the person you cheated on to give them the choice to leave or to say. Every day you don't tell them you're allowing them to continue to waste their time with a cheater and that might not that be their choice.
Chelsea and Raven do not deserve to be trusted, and nobody deserves to be with them
I’ll never forget the “do all cheaters think the same?” Video where the CHEATERS were so offended and angry that their partners don’t trust them anymore like?!?! Hello WHO BROKE THAT TRUST?!
Are u for real?🥲🥲🥲🥲 cuz whaaaaaat!!!!!!!!?
Fr 😭😭😭
If you don't tell your partner you cheated, then you are lying to them.
No, not strictly. There's a certain lack of honesty, and you could say it's as bad as a lie, but you aren't lying to anybody. Yes, this is just pedantry.
@@fahrenheit2101Why are you sugar coating it, if youre not in an open relationship and your partner has the idea that theyre the only person on your mind. Not telling them you cheated is giving them a false reality and essentially lying to them. Its not that hard of a consept to understand, no need to twist and bend it to make it seem better
@@anne-beritgunhildson598 i didnt do that, do you know what pedantry is?
@@fahrenheit2101 Lying by omission is still lying.
@@AJ-lm5dl Yeah, hence pedantry. I personally don't think lying by omission is lying at all. It's dishonest omission. I'm not making a value judgement there of course. I mean omission is such a vague thing, because one is always doing it. You don't disclose everything to ANYONE, because "everything" is... a bit much. Lying is easy to categorise objectively, dishonest omission is oddly subjective.
Yooo... If you believe its "too dangerous" to leave an abusive relationship, wtf makes you believe its SAFE to cheat on them? You still gotta go home to them, so what do you think they're gonna DO TO YOU once they find out you cheated on them?
I fail to comprehend the hierarchy associated with different forms of cheating. Emotional and physical betrayals hold equal significance to me as they both involve deceit and betrayal. In my view, there is no distinction between the two. For me, love is a continuous choice and a spiritual bond of unity. This unity allows for individuality within the couple while maintaining a sense of oneness. When I am connected with my partner, he occupies a specific place within my spiritual and physical being. Love, to me, signifies a divine union.
Can't believe this even needs an hour long discussion, it's always yes.
The discussion was more than just the title of the video.
I feel like there is one, single exception: Abusive relationships.
No
@@_CetarialThere isn’t any. If anything you’re putting yourself in a huge position of danger if the abuser finds out. If you’re in a abusive relationship, you’re mind should be on survival and trying to get out of that relationship.
@@xsenpai5179YES
Cheating is cowardly at best, sadistic at worst
real
Imagine hurting someone you love deliberately and not taking accountability and instead blaming your partner.
Oh the topic of "I would rather not know I was cheated on" and suicidal ideation. I was far more emotionally devestated and had more feelings of being suicidal by discovering that my partner was cheating on my own and from them hiding it from me. If they came to me and had been honest from the beginning, I'd atleast know that they were thinking of me and my feelings for them. Not confessing is selfish and avoiding not only your own feelings of shame, but your partner's feelings for you and the relationship they feel that they have with you. You are denying that they matter. To convince yourself that it's okay to lie and hide things from your partner just because they may not take it well is disgusting and appalling behavior. If another person's feelings matter so little to you, don't be in a relationship. A loving relationship needs both partners to care about eachother's feelings and to be able to comfort eachother.