Mark Fisher - DOCH Lectures #1
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- čas přidán 29. 08. 2024
- Mark Fisher alias K-Punk has over the last decade established himself as an academic equivalent to Colonel Kurtz (Apocalypse Now) bringing together deep insides of popular music with psychoanalysis, political analysis and speculative fiction creating, what Sukhdev Sandhu names, an extraordinary body of rogue scholarship, a theory-rush with few parallels.
In two three hour sessions, Mark Fisher dug deep into the realism of ubiquitous capitalism - “today it is easier to imagine the end of the world rather than an end to capitalism” (Jameson/Zizek) - beyond the corner of grey zombies and into the thematic of his forthcoming book dealing with depression, hauntology and lost futures."
Fisher is the author of ‘Capitalist Realism’, the editor of ‘The Resistible Demise of Michael Jackson’ (both Zer0, 2009), and writes regularly for Sight and Sound, Film Quarterly, The Wire and Frieze, as well as maintaining a well-known blog at k-punk.abstractdynamics.org. He teaches at the University of East London, Goldsmiths, University of London, and the City Literary Institute.
The seminar was part of the DOCH course Speculative Realism and was open to the public.
An original thinker. His whole intensity /awkwardness reflects how he's at the forefront of modern philosophy where there's no safe-zone of working within a tribe be it classical or marx. He's nearer to being a performer or DJ than academic.
Thanks for the reply. Id forgotten id said that. Im not an academic. I deliver pizzas and listen to alot of music. Probably youtube recommended this. Im reflecting how he laments how people are so isolated since the millenium. I was going to raves n festivals late80s early 90s. Then the 94 unlawful assembly laws: they knew rave was a real danger of the millenium becoming a revolution. They moved it into clubs but tamed it. And the party that should have happened, didnt. The new millenium is about isolation, rising autism, the disappointment of the celebration that didnt happen. Though of course its an arbitary mathematical date with no organic significance, except human expectation. 2008 is significant: debt had spiralled in the last 150 years and we're all being organised to be more productive pay more taxes to service the debt , ideally go to work go back home and stay indoors so they create lockdown. In the old days if you were criminal or vulnerable you were kept in service to the crown but the multinationals have usurped power and everyone is now in service to them more precisely the big bank families and their big customers. And it all happens cos collectively as individuals we let it happen to us. People must do taichi, kungfu whatever it takes. I met some folk whod joined islam in the 70s and then come back to uk. I learned islam from them and my friends are mostly n. Africans turks. Traditionally islam is built round the mosque the bazaar the silk route . As was europe. Thats how we try to live, similar to but more wholsome than the new age travellers/squatters i hung out back in the day. And in islam charging interest on a loan is illegal.
I was sorry to hear this guy is now dead. Hes right: the millenium years are totally sterile and a death to the human spirit. Nothing new has happened, technology had destroyed itself by being too perfect, everything is 90s rehashed. Thanks for spurring me to inspiration
no, you're used to academia being a certain thing. playing tracks does not make him a DJ or performer. his point is these forms of culture matter and feed into the academia of now if only the academia could recognise it. DIY collectivity matters and surpasses the shape of historically venerated academia.
@@teamcrumb Yes, exactly.
There is a depth of sadness, and humanity (altho at this stage, I'm not sure they aren't the same thing), pouring from this guy that is almost overwhelming, and that I honestly never, ever see from ppl. The Recession was a pivotal moment in my life and despair and political understanding as well; how I could have failed to become familiar with this guy before he ended his life is as mysterious as it is upsetting. But all of these treasures he left, and now I can uncover them; feels like an indescribable gift.
I echo this hugely. And he has some of the most poignant quotes that will stick with me for life (he also produced some great DnB)
Beautifully put.
I can't believe this man is gone
Part of what I love about this lecture is that this lecture itself is old. When this series happened it was in 2011. form a person in 2020 the examples he uses further illustrates the massive push and seeming advancement of technology to distract from lack of culture. Case and point, his example of the shift from CDs to MP3's... in 2020 an Mp3 with wired headphones is about the equivalent of a Walkman...
seeing mark drop a burial track on some college kids is the best thing i've ever seen
Takes 'based' to a whole new level
i do wonder if he'd discovered autechre or similar. bands who make music that is wholly their own genre at this point.
This is an amazing collection of lectures, of inestimable value to anyone interested in the thought of the tragically departed Fisher himself but more widely with an interest in bringing an authentic mass movement into being set on freeing us of the zombie grip of Capitalist Realism & engineer enough of a break with its stifling hegemonic grasp upon our culture and consciousness to allow once again the possibility of revolutionary change so essential in our historical moment. Thanks so much for the upload.
You again? Heheheh.
@@KilgoreTroutAsf See you on the barricades bruv.
Oh, is that what you call it?
@@MaxArturo 😑
Your ideas will reverb not only in all of our heads but also in our hearts forever. The eerienes surrounding your thoughts and existence really moved us like no other theorist or lecturer ever did, but It's hard to listen to you sometimes. Above all because these same ideas were part of the reason you decided to go, and hearing them is at the same time comforting and maddening.
I know you shared a Spinoza's inspired definition of freedom, something like: freedom is never achieved but only partially gained when searching for the causes that determine you/us. So in a way I guess that; on the one hand I thank you immensely for that piece of freedom, and on the other hand, I am totally and unrightfully mad at you for making me mourne the things you will never be able to explore with such rare delicacy. Although like you once suggested, let's not underestimate the power of the spectres, I hope wherever you are you can somehow feel how yours will haunt us forever.
Your comment is equally as haunting. Thank you for sharing.
I would have loved for Mark to have a chance to read and speak on The Age of Surveillance Capitalism
Same! Shoshana Zuboff's 'The Age of Surveillance Capitalism' is an absolute must read.
I don't agree with everything he says. Some I do, some I don't. His points and conclusions are interesting. Mr @beenasfarastodecidetouseve6733 I think you yourself have yourself a goal. The greatest thing about philosophy is that you don't need a degree. You have to see your society. If you are here already on youtube I'd say you;re already on your journey.
I know your comment is two years old but if you want to discuss certain topics I'm open for it.
He likes Burial and UK Post-Dub Jungle Eh ! Nice ... The most important UK electronica artist who Never played a concert nor rave.
Audio Pervert yet, he understood raves at a deeper level than most of those presenting them for years!
@@martinreid2352 Well he WAS the rave generation
Big up to the one like Mark ❤️🖤
I wonder what Mark Fisher would think about the post pandemic situation. RIP
Don’t think he’d be a big fan... like all of us lost souls watching
That Berardi passage at 8:15 really hit home for me.
thank you for uploading these. So interesting to listen to and the questions or comments during the lecture I also found very interesting and thought provoking
We get it Mark Fisher... you love the musical genre of Jungle...lol
The ghost of Nick Land.
And the Ideas behind it.
@@antoniovasquez9946 nope
25:10 Burial is like dance music to listen to alone
i wish fisher was around today to hear things like hyperpop
amen
I imagine he’d have a lot to say about vaporwave
@@anarchoautism You might know about it but there is this book called Babbling Corpse, which deals with vaporwave in a similar way as Mark would have.
Yeah, them raiding our cultures aesthetics, and dumbing down our music is hyper innovative
It's probably one of the reasons he decided to check out. RIP
Michael Brooks brought me here.
Morgoth brought me here.
RIP MIchael Brooks, David Graeber and Mark Fisher. All gone to soon.
Thanks for the upload
Such a shame we lost him, he would've had so much to say about so many things that have happened and are happening. Rest in peace, he's probably having a much better time than we all are in this hellhole.
He is Snape's nice brother. Equally sad and weird, just nice to people and eloquent.
It’s a spiritual crisis - drugs distractions and tools to numb. We are powerful beings when we learn just be and stop chasing.
likening Fisher to Colonel Kurtz is just bizarre. Kurtz went mad with power and went AWOL and encouraged indigenous folk to treat him like a deity. Kurtz was the heart of darkness. Fisher was desperately trying to swim in aspects of human culture that resisted neo liberalism and attempts to remain progressive
Dunno, maybe give him (if he were alive) power and see him go mad.
Getting trading-app ads before this was as distopian as it gets
There have always been musical and stylistic revivals of fashions which took off 17 or 23 years before. Not every wave is revived. Only those which have been forgotten such that the kids who drive fashions, or succumb to them, find it new and entirely unlike what is presently dominant. The 2-Tone Ska revival came 23 years after the first wave of Ska in the UK. The 1960s Blues revolution in the UK began by recycling US Electric and Delta Blues of the deep south from the 1940s. Likewise with the 1950s Jazz explosion in the UK, and the Folk revival which culminated with Bob Dylan, was based on the folk recordings of cultural archivists which had taken place decades before. Waves which never went away, like punk and especially pop punk and hardcore punk, don't need reviving because people are continously playing them and discovering them. What is different is the loss of the generational conflict about musics which marked the arrival of rock 'n' roll and punk. This is partly to do with the way that fashions have become increasingly commodified so that more and more people are involved in their production and circulation, so that parents understand that what used to be rubbish for teenagers is good and important and may form their own livelihood, and partly because of the way in which musical technology has settled into a final pattern. Distortion and the Marshall amp were developed in the 1960s and early 1970s. Those sounds are no longer new, nor do they need replacing. Similarly with microphones, recording technology and electic guitars and basses. The technology is no longer generating spectacles with attendant offense to parents. Instead the established technologies are going through continuous incremental refinement, as with guitar effects pedals and pedal-boards. Globalisation has also globalised culture, with most "exotic" musics and instrumentation now incorporated into the pallette of options available throughout the industry to artists everywhere. There may still be unexpected cross-overs and fertilizations to come, but nothing is any longer really exotic or avant garde. It has all been heard before. Since that is the case, it makes perfect sense for artists and consumers to pick their favourite sounds and stick with them, only innovating around the edges, in musicianship and curation, and add variations on the old themes, as with the ever expanding variety of subgenres of heavy metal.
So that part of Mark Fisher's argument is not so impressive to me. The diminishing of the sense of generational eras in pop music, the blending of present and past and the normalisation of retro is not necessarily another product of capitalist realism. Arts, sciences and theologies have their own internal logics which unfold more or less irrespective of the class context and the dominant mode of production. Having said that it can be said that the dynamism of musicianship in the 1960s and 1970s was a by-product of the welfare state and a working class generation who had unprecedented and subsequently destroyed affluence, free time, economic and scial security and freedom from stress and oppression. Privately-educated middle class kids, bringing the values of the professional-managerial class to music-making, produce well crafted but ultimately hollow, pretenscious and meaningless stuff that is neither good fun nor expressing revolutionary rage.
calling our cultures retro is bizarre
I remember first seeing what looked like well dressed people talking to themselves whilst walking in the street, around '05? in London. The effect of the internet on humanity, especially since Covid has been horrible.
I remember seeing them well before that in London
@@ttllymxico Good for you. 🌹
So I do think that there was a sound of the 2000s and it’s directly tied to the Iraq war - let the bodies hit the floor and break stuff both exemplify that era to me. I think that this death cult nihilism/hedonism that both of these songs exude speaks volumes about the mindset of those times.
the era was a lso basic as heck
Our modern world: if Herman Hesse's Castalia from "The Glass bead game" had been reimagined by Kurt Vonnegut.
5:20 for the Burial bit lol mannnn RIP kpunk
Brilliant on the wider cultural condition but disagree that music has lost its position outside the commodity form. Innovation is exciting but transitory, the demand for ever more of it having something of a consumerist logic. The mark of good music is not novelty but durability. Music can be innovative in its time but date quickly. It’s no accident that we call the best music ‘timeless’. Music of that quality is its own object: you can’t commodify it in any true sense because it exists purely in the sound. Innovation, on the other hand, is tied up with cultural and political assumptions and temporal specificity: this abstract valuation may be cultural rather than economic but is similarly utilitarian in its relation to the art.
you have misunderstood what he was saying. Fisher stated most popular music was becoming nothing but commodity, he certainly wasn't saying music ceased to be a commodity. he stated many avenues of popular music were a commodity free of new genres and progression, once jungle had made its offering. his point is popular music culture moved through the decades via popular DIY collectivity and that these genres once represented the time period that created them. he's talking about Neo liberal markets taking over all things to the point popular culture no longer organises itself around DIY collectivity, but rather homogenised culture. he was saying new popular music's trajectory was incapable of creating a new genre, and instead could only borrow from one or all aspects of popular music from other decades.
@@teamcrumb @teamcrumb You appear to have misunderstood my argument. I'm arguing *against* the notion that art (especially music) does not have, or no longer has, the capacity to exist outside the commodity form. Listen again from 46:00.
@@4nalogue what like steezyasfvck and their imitation of everything other's cultures
19:10 that’s interesting considering the recent surge in vinyl sales
nostalgia is a powerful emotion.
it's just because Gen Z is infatuated with old aesthetics and wants to relive them rather than cultivate their own future, the surge in vinyl sales just speaks of the hauntological age we are all in
A couple of minutes in......can you put it on a bumper sticker?
10:45 huh? wait. huh.
This sure wasn't 2001?
now that I think it can't be 2001 because he's playing burial from 2006. so i guess it was 2011
I can offer one solution regarding music. Learn a musical instrument--non electronic. I have returned to classical guitar after 30 years and am thunderstruck by the beauty of the music of S.L.Weiss (1685-1750) that comes out of a page of simple sheet music. Go into it yourself and make it yours.
there is so much anxiety in this man
No fucking wonder.
He was shy that's all. Buonanima
@@noluntas Shy? He was clinically depressed about everything he was questioning!🎈
He offed himself
Since this lecture, Sweden has become the 4ape capital of Europe because of immigration.
It's so sad that a brilliant mind had to eventually commit suicide...
bad boy tune this one rip mark
I bloody love how awkward he is in this video
Such a contrast to the grimly polished grifters that infect everything these days
I got sea sick
try again
guys i think he likes burial
His work is invaluable and brilliant but he is so hard to listen to.
@tostones worth the effort though. I just kept repeating it & every listen brought new insight, recognition and depth of understanding of his elegant and profound mind's wide-ranging and illuminating wanderings.
Get a grip
Beautiful comment. I've heard this lecture at least five times.
If it’s so hard to listen to; and I would go even further it’s very difficult to listen to and impossible to understand, then how can we possibly know that it’s “..invaluable and brilliant.”?
no idea what you're all on -- I find him to be a tremendously human speaker. I suppose that entails some sputtering, rough pivots &c., but better that than the robotic form most academic papers get read in.
If only Mark Fisher heard Death Grips
He already heard them in the 80's
@@yoooohooooo interestung
🤓
Run out of stones to turn over? Try the character structure of the common man and epidemic orgastic impotence. Only after every ridiculous topic is explored will we be forced to acknowledge the abysmal state of sexuality and therein find the answers to the question of capitalism.
you sound like d. h. ruddy lawrence
You sound like you are a quack
Any books/lectures you recommend on this topic?
@@georgeniko41 I would suggest the Function of the Orgasm and Character Analysis by Wilhelm Reich.
@@Matt-xw1xx sweet i'll take a look. I was expecting something more contemporary given the proliferation of online pornography, increased digitisation of social interaction etc but will still look into this. Cheers :)
that creepy "common purpose" linguistic style
2008 was the largest failure ever? lol, Fisher is so myopic. He's just another ideologue.
don't you know what happened in 2008?
oh no he isn't etc
@@therealartistproper apparently it didn't happen to *them*
he should've watched more stupid cartoons
Died as a coward
you alive as a Bully
💥 💥 💥 💥 💥
Love what he's saying, but damn is his pacing making me agitated