E-BIKE LAW UPDATE 2024 // UK // SURRON
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- čas přidán 13. 04. 2024
- Change is coming!! The Uk Government have hinted that the e-bike law in the UK needs to change to keep up with the ever growing demand for electric bikes and e-vehicles. Two of the main changes revolve around the motor output and the use of a throttle. This is great news for people using e-bikes in the UK. However, will these changes come at a cost? for example, will we now have to register e-bikes as well as insure them and even complete a test in order to ride an e-bike.
I also discuss the popular question - "Where can I ride a Surron or Talaria e-bike legally? You might find that the answer is not what you expect!!
Dont forget to follow me on Instagram - SOUTHCOAST_SURRON - Auta a dopravní prostředky
I have a full motorcycle license and an e-bike but to be honest, if they start introducing more and more laws and requirements for e bikes with more power and a throttle you may as well just get a motorbike.
Especially if they start to require registration and tax etc
@@rxmeodsgn😂😂😂 shhhhh
Yeah I been looking at second hand surrons that are like 4 years old they seem too have lots of parts replaced already I wonder about the lifespan of these things
exactly, insurance ,registration will put people of getting an e bike imo
Registration and insurance should be required. Insurance should be compulsory for ALL road users. Push bikes and e-bikes are quite capable of causing significant damage to another vehicle or person safely how would you pay for that if it happened. Also, registration would put paid to much of the bad behaviour of cyclists who think they can’t be identified so can’t be held responsible for their behaviour ( jumping red lights, riding on pavement, general rudeness to other road users and total lack of consideration for other road users etc) Not all cyclists are like this I admit but there are enough to give you all a bad name.
I made a 2kW ebike 8 years ago which does up to 30 mph by adding a hub motor to a mountain bike and making a battery from 224 harvested laptop cells and have ridden thousands of miles on it.
Secret to not being stopped is to behave responsibly and keep pedaling as though you're working at it, even you're not actually doing any work.
Having a couple of panniers help too.
panniers is absolute gold 🤣🤣🤣
@@2009MazdaRX8 the law is there to try and stop the idiots but if you ride responsibly no one is going to question you. But if you are ever in an RTC you may be found liable even if it is not your fault because your vehicle is illegal. ie if a car knock you off and causes damage to your bike and cause injury to you and then you try and claim against the drivers insurance the likelihood is they wont pay out
The average politician went to Eton school, so anything with a wheel will baffle them.
😂😂
Anything more complicated than socks will baffle the fu---rs.
I've heard they are well versed in pigs though (the true "Swine" version)
Ok class warrior :D:D:D
@@synkuk Some people stand up for themselves, others thank their abusers.
I don't agree that 250 watts is pointless. It gives a very significant boost and definitely makes me use my bike more than I'd use one unpowered
Regardless if the 250W power is pointless or not I guess most of us agree that double the power its decent and safe enough. After all ,accidents happen even with the push bikes, even when we’re walking, that doesn’t mean we should ban vehicles specially now with so much technology they put in pretty much everything. European union leaders are ruining all the fun in life because they care so much about our safety. Its all about how to reap more money from our pockets and I think is obvious. Same damn thing they do with drones and other good things in our lives.
The only benefit to a 250w motor is that its helps maintain your speed when you're tired.
@@zahaidrahman2052 Not at all. Its a massive benefit
Throttles will be dangerous. Many people just won’t bother pedalling. There’s a certain connection and responsibility with the need to pedal.
@@MisterAshbrook I live in an area surrounded by steep hills. I have a responsibility to my neck, back and joints when I'm trying to make it home struggling up a steep incline with sweat dripping down my face and a bag full of shopping on my back snagging on my shoulders. Most average car drivers can't even be bothered to walk to the shop 5-10 mins down the road let alone climb these hills and there's those who physically are unable to peddle like my dad who lost half his leg in a car accident when he was young. Plus there are days when I wanna get out for my own mental health without it having to feel like a workout or the fact a lot of jobs are on the other side of the city and I don't fancy peddling like a maniac to get to work for an hour each way and yet people are whizzing around on e-scooters which you could argue are even more dangerous. I can't afford one anyway. I can barely afford to maintain my pushbike which is currently a bit of a death trap and while I personally enjoy riding a bike for exercise and leisure I can immediately see the benefits having one of these would have for my mental health since I don't own a car and can't afford to get one plus it would literally increase my chances of finding work and expanding the radius in which I could travel. Also these e-bikes hit like 15.5mph. I can do 20-30mph+ easily on a regular bike whizzing downhill but if I'm focusing all my attention on peddling getting out of breath with wind and rain blowing in my face then the e-bike rider is gonna be a lot safer and react a lot faster to any potential hazards coming their way not to mention they often have thicker tires with better tread/traction where as one wrong move with my thin presta tyres and I could end up sliding under the tires of an oncoming vehicle. I've always rode safe though. I respect both pedestrians and the laws of the road but I can't say the same for a large percentage of car drivers who think it's ok to cut me off by turning in front of me or tryng to overtake on the opposite side of the road when the reason I'm in the middle of the road is cos I'm about to turn right and if I didn't naturally ride on the defensive and assume everyone's an asshole I would've been dead many times over by now. If people got out on their bikes more often this would all be common sense not to mention free up the burden on the NHS since everyone should be getting a minimum of 150mins cardio every week in order to reduce their risk of things like stroke/heart disease. Also just to note I'm not a skinny ass lycra wearing ''cyclist'' I'm just a guy who happens to ride a bike from time to time or at least I did before I broke it and then both my mental/physical health took a signifficant downturn cos I was unble to get out and about as much. Besides IF I wanted to break the law I could just as easily go get my hands on a stolen overpowered e-bike/motorbike/ped/car where as all I want is a simple legal route that doesn't involve jumping through lots of hoops or costing a fortune. When I hear about all these stupid rules and regulations it just makes me wanna go out and break the law all the more even though I try my best to be a good law abiding citizen most of the time, or at least do no harm cause no foul. There will always be those who go out and break the law but guess what? They're already out there doing it and they will mow you down all the same lol
I've been using a 250 w commuter ebike for 7 years without any problems. Yes i have to pedal it but thats what it is an electric assist bicycle and it makes going up hills a whole lot easier.
Not been up steep enough hills, where 250w will really struggle, certainly won't reach 15mph. If they're going to have a speed limit in place then it doesn't need a motor limit (eg car engine size) so you could allow 500 or 1000w motors at 15mph, but seriously should be 20mph
@@hasan_z I used to live in Sheffield and believe me most hills there are 10% plus everywhere. Modifing my old commuter bike to a legal 250w pedal assist ebike transformed my daily journey to work. It showed an extra 440w input on the climbs just as long as I was putting some effort in. This changed me commute from a horrible sweaty breathless workout to an absolute breeze. 8 years later I am retired now and living somewhere much flatter but still using the same bike, the battery is dieing but it still has just enough juice to get me to the shops and back with ease. As long as you don't expect 250w ebike to behave like a 50cc motorcycle they are brilliant.
@@tommaguzzi1723 that's the loophole currently you can have 250w continuous power but a much higher peak power to kick in when needed
@@hasan_zpedal assist works for me. The peak power loop hole makes a 250w fine for riding 10% hills at 9 mph as long as I am prepared to pedal. Mine has a thumb throttle which is probably illegal since it powers the bike upto 15.5 mph ( on slight downhills) before it shuts off, but the bike could not climb a 10% hill unassisted at more than 4 mph even when the battery was new.
The problem is once E bikes become so powerful they can motor at 30mph plus unassisted they will be treated as such by the law and subjected to all the statutory requirements of a motorcycle including, mots, lights, insurance, compulsory motorcycle helmets, not able to use cycle paths and shared pavements. So the real loophole here is pedal assist making a 250w ebike still being classed as a bicycle by the dvla.
I surrendered my driving licence after having a seizure and they won’t give me it back now even though I’m 100% healthy . now there trying to take my bike 😂. I will build a para moter
🤣
Yes!
really ? i have a visual impairment condition and this leaves me unable to obtain my license, which means i cannot get my provisional for a cbt to ride the likes of a surron. i’ve ridden dh mountain bikes and have been into mtb as a sport in general from a young age and im used to controlling a bike in fast situations but also feel as though im safe, Im aware of my limits of my eye condition and generally that’s in low light , id like to be able to travel at the same speed as general town traffic (30mph, on a flat surface i can achieve this anyway, feels much safer travelling at the same speed as cars rather than sticking to one side and having tonnes of cars overtake ). I already have insurance on my mountainbike which is both in case of theft but also public liability and personal accident, it only costs £7 a month most bloody people should have it as it can help one day ! my issue is id absolutely love a surron but being unable to register one is what holds me back. i feel plenty competent to handle a bike like this having had prior experience on some mates ones along with mx bikes. feels very restrictive, e bikes are great and there will obviously be people that will abuse them but that can’t be said for everyone
Bro build an e-bike for yourself the sur Ron is expensive if u need new battery’s stuff like that but if you can afford it go ahead I would if I didn’t live up 4 flights of stairs hard enough to get the bike up haha .. the truth is I’ve surrendered my licence twice over the years I have epilepsy but it was controlled with the doctors prescription of lamotrigene and leveteracetam unsure of the spelling but both are toxic tablets for me personally .. that where causing me to have symptoms such as bi polar autism the lot severe adhd .. chucked the tablets no longer take fits or have any of the weird effects that happend after taking the tablets .. I no longer get glitchy moments that occur before having a seizure .. I’ve got it on the left temporal lobe i had take all kinds of different fits for about two years then it stopped .. I changed a lot of things like chucked alcohol and any sorta drugs I never took nothing mental heavy just the weekend party drugs all that stuff chucked the lot .. defo worked in my favour I choose to surrender the licence for the safety of others and my self and not worrying ma family but now I’m struggling to get back n forward to work without having to look over my shoulder constantly .. stupid laws .. 2kw e-bike will keep up with sur Ron if it’s just for cruising around your way more stealth on a diy bike bro take care
I live in a small town in the hills. I'm also 63 years old with severe heart failure. I ride my ebike everywhere, it's a matter of choosing the right bike for your environment and the 250w limit is fine, use your gears with forethought and pop up through the assist modes as necessary. I get up hills I could never hope to ride a normal bike up, even in my youth and without lifting my bum off the saddle.
Yes and I am 72 years old and load my Raleigh with 2 panniers of heavy shopping and encounter a steep hill on the way back . Bike is fine going up hill with pedal assist . Also my bike is 8 speed hub gear.
You’re old, every thing is fast compared to you
@@MuffinHunter69bro allow them
I live in the North East, I don’t know what the hills are like there but there’s no way at all I’m getting up the hill I live on with 250w
Hello to you, I also have heart failure and COPD and would love an eBike. Can you tell me what power and other numbers I should be looking out for, if anyone can help I'd be truly Grateful. Thanks then. Quentin
As someone who owns an e bike and who has spent many many years cycling prior to using an e bike, someone needs to explain to me why going over 15.5mph on an e bike is more dangerous than going over 15.5mph on a normal bicycle, because i have experienced no additional safety concerns between the two.
E bikes tend to be heavier than pure pedal bikes, so more danger to pedestrians, and strong brakes become more important.
@@scotlaughlin2487 pedestrians? I'm cycling on the road. If I'm concerned about hitting pedestrians then there's more immediate issues that are nothing to do with it being an e bike.
Pedestrians don't cross the road without looking where you ride? They do here. I think some see "not a car" don't notice my speed. I own five e-bikes, from low power 500w conversions to 1400w factory bikes. They weigh anywhere from 55 lbs to 140 lbs. Most of them could use more brakes to even match a typical road bike's stopping distance. If I hit a pedestrian, it's my fault in the eyes of the law, no matter how oblivious they were. If I hit them with the 140lb bike, they're going to be hurt worse than if hit by a roady on his 15lb carbon tour de france replica.
Impact energy goes up as a square of speed, so if you're going twice as fast, you do four times the damage to whatever you hit. If your e-bike is only twice as heavy as a typical leisure bike, and you're going twice as fast (a couple of mine will hit 30 mph easily ) that's eight times the impact energy. Yes, E bikes need to meet higher standards than pedal bikes. @@anythingpeteives
@@scotlaughlin2487 so should any bike ridden by a heavier person also be restricted to 15.5 mph. Or any normal heavy bike. A phat bike, for instance.
I've cycled for over 20 years and have never come even close to having an accident with a pedestrian crossing in front of me because I am aware of the potential hazards and of what my bicycle is capable of, stopping wise. If I couldn't avoid hitting a pedestrian even if I was doing say 20mph on an e bike then I shouldn't be cycling at all, in my view.
Btw, I'm not advocating for e bikes to be allowed to go at 30mph legally. But 15.5 is painfully slow and, if you cannot avoid pedestrians stepping out onto the road when travelling at that speed then there's an issue with your ability as a cyclist.
you can cycle as fast as you like but motor assist needs to cut out at 25km per hour and no throttle other wise you become a motor/ped and then there are different rules....speed pedelec, 45km, helmet and registration & insurance and no use of cycle paths
The rules on max power, throttles etc. could be tweaked slightly, but remember that unlike other powered vehicles, ebikes require no licence, tax or insurance. An exception is made for them as they're not supposed to be any faster than a fit person would be on a normal pedal bike. The power restriction is intended to make them safe to use without any training and to allow them to mix safely with pedal cycles. Remember that ebikes have the privilege of using cycle lanes and cycle racks just like a pedal bike. - Anyone who needs or wants more power can buy an electric motorbike, but these don't belong on cycle paths as their higher speed and extra weight make them unsafe to share space with pedal cycles and pedestrians.
eBikes should be limited to 20mph so you can keep up with the traffic in such restricted areas. There would then be no need for 'close pass' etc, because you're at the max anyway.
I can pedel my bike at about 20mph on the flat (I am a retiree!), but the assistance is useful for hills....
Yea great suggestion mate. I would agree. 👍
People on road bikes pedal far faster than that.
@@piratepedalerfl true. I can pedel as fast as 30, however the gearing on the Raleigh eBike is only 4:1 and you can’t get the gears to change it (I wanted a bigger chainring than 44). I can comfortably sustain 20 without compromising blood pressure.
My son has a full race/road bike and cab make 50 as it has higher ratio range.
@@herrtomas6729 then why limit it to only 20? I have a motor goat v3 on the way. Does over 40 with a rider my size. I bought this bike to save money going to work and maybe a little door dash or bike trails on the weekends. On my commute I have no choice but to ride in traffic because the road meets the ditch on both sides. In order to be safe I have to keep up. Sure I could have bought another motorcycle but that's defeating the entire purpose of getting an EV.
@@piratepedalerfl simply looking from the town/commuter viewpoint to safely cover everyone, starting from (I think it is) 14yr olds upwards from residential front door to school, work etc
You misunderstand the use-case for an e-bike. They are basically bikes made easier, they are not designed to be electric motorcycles. The throttle being allowed up to 4 mph is because it is only designed as a push assist, or to assist someone with a disability to get moving. Some e-bikes are heavy, especially cargo bikes, so this assists greatly.
ebiker, more often than not, the lazy cyclist
You can have your Surron on the road however it just appears to me that you do not want to register or insure it, I would love to get away with that argument on my motorcycle or car. If we remove the restriction for pedal assist then those bikes will also lose the ability to use the same areas that standard pedal cycles currently use as these areas will become overrun with what are effectively electric motorbikes. One of your arguments that these electric motorcycles are actually safer than pedal assist is you state & 11.55 that your bike is equipped with better brakes than a pedal cycle, that’s strange as yours appears to be equipped with Hope Tech 4 master cylinders which are designed for normal bicycles. Just give in, register your bike, do your CBT and ride it without complaining.
lol. I’m not complaining. I’m just talking about a topic. I agree that hope tech 4’s are for mountain bikes however you cant deny that they are a performance upgrade that would out perform most stock pedal assist e-bikes. Personally I feel a lot safer on the Surron compared to my EAPC. That’s just my opinion. Another point I wish I had made is regarding people converting their standard pushbikes to e-bikes by bolting on hub motors and strapping on batteries.
I agree TECH 4s and everything that Hope produce is well above the standard parts that are fitted to most bicycles, however the Surrons are effectively electric motorbikes and need to be treated that way. On the subject of home conversions by adding a hub motor and little else, I have seen several very poor examples and cannot believe that people would actually ride them even before a motor was fitted, I also believe that these are the source of many fires which does nothing but give electric vehicles of all types a very bad name.
You cannot ride a surron legally in the uk on the roads without insurance and tax
I don't believe that is a legal version of it it does not have wall the lights you need and the paperwork and he understands that
@@SirLordCustardthe10th there is a uk legal one with number plate lights and indicators
I think the laws on ebikes are spot on. If you don't have pedal assist then it's a motorbike. The likes of Surrons and Talarias ect, are in the realm of mopeds, they are faster in fact. You should need tax, insurance and a CBT to ride one on the road.
fed
Escooters are not classed as motorbikes, so I think it's fair to reinstate throttles up to 15mph on ebikes and still remain I. The bycycle category. They are much safer and allow people with limited mobility to get some exercise and rest when needed. Just my input as someone who has used one for 15 years
@@urbanpuma9136the kid that slammed into me on a government scooter cost Nottingham city council 2k in damages because he slammed into at full speed facing the wrong direction looking at a piece of ass 4 lanes away they are dangerous!
Getting hit by a fat person at 15mph on a slab weighing almost 15kg does a lot of damage and can easily breaks bones then add in no helmets or protection and they are a disaster waiting to happen..
@@printitpaintit.2436 I think rules on usage need to be implemented. Users should be aware of all road users and ride responsibly - this should be made law. In built up areas speed should be low. All vehicles are dangerous if used incorrectly and no way am I saying .escooters should be riding at full speed, same as ebikes and cyclists
I’d love to ride an e-bike to work but due to an injury I need full assist especially up hills, so it’s not an option, unfortunately the current law seems to be a one size fits all and discriminates against pepeole, with disabilities or heaver pepeole, no reason a 1000w Moyer can’t be used and regulated to deliver power and maintain the league speed limits, e-bikes could be a major answer to the climate crisis and congestion, pepole in power are clueless to be honest in my opinion.
I completely agree with you mate. Congestion would be a huge factor. Great point. Thanks for your comment bro.
If you got to insure one and MOT it and tax it you might as well buy a moped and go twice as fast. Next the government will expect us to insure a normal push bike. I can see all the kids with bikes going for that rubbish. It's all about the money. Government just penny pinching for their own pockets as usual
After a cyclist came off the pavement at high speed he ended up on my car bonnet, £420 damage to car and who had to pay yeah I DID, cyclists should at least have 3rd party insurance to be on a road.
Regular bicycles increasingly use dedicated road spaces, sometimes shared with pedestrians. If e-bikes can share this road space then it makes sense for others who interact with those dedicated spaces, be they cyclists, pedestrians or motor vehicles, to expect similar characteristics from all types of machine in that space. That’s why e-bikes have limited power and max speed. There are also electric mopeds, available which have much higher power, but are treated like other mopeds in terms of the road spaces they are allowed to use and the registration and driver training regimes.
I ride a pushbike mostly in London where there’s a lot of dedicated cycle infrastructure and would not appreciate having electric mopeds invade that space.
The distinction between bikes and motorbikes is also enshrined in law. Cycles can’t be sanctioned for breaking the motor vehicle speed limit, for example, unless, as you point out they do so ‘furiously’ (generally taken to mean dangerously)
So it’s not a money-making scheme by the government, it’s a necessary categorization of vehicle types and the line has to be drawn somewhere.
We have an ADO folding E bike with a 250 watt motor with a CE mark on it. I have been into the engineering section, changed it to hybrid drive and increased the max speed setting and fitted the throttle that came with the bike as an option. The bike now goes up to 15.5 mph as normal with the pedal assist but the throttle takes it up to about 22 mph without pedaling hard, in still conditions on the flat. I now find it perfectly capable enough for tootling about as a sensible e-bike. I can't see that 500 watts is needed. If I want to go faster I can get my Kawasaki 900 RS, or my Honda cbr 600 f out and go nearly 160 mph ( where permitted ) lol. Don't think any faster than that speed on an e-bike is appropriate and at that speed I wouldn't attract the wrong attention, particularly at 65 years old.
unfortunately there are a large number of idiots who spoil it for everyone, spoke to someone the other day who has built an old mountain ebike that will do 50+ mph according to him,this is on pushbike rim brakes! there should be a mot and insurance and plates.
I agree people should not be allowed to build their own ebike without registering it because the components have to be MUCH stronger! The motor and battery packs make the bike almost as heavy as a second rider so the frame, forks and rims have to be able to the extra weight and strain!
Even shocks have to be ebike certified with stronger valves because of the extra weight so the home build kits that allow you to 50mph are definitely dangerous..
Not to mention most kits use cheap nasty batteries made in china that will burn your house down if given the opportunity! 🙈
You make some good points. We have such terrible restrictions because some people are dicks and spoil it for everyone. I think that the police generally have better things to do than check e-bikes and so as long as you are riding in way that is not disrespectful to other people you should be okay.
Totally agree 👊
I used to be a competitive cyclist. Every year we has the Christmas hill sprint which was about 300m flat then a steep 600m section/ I used to hit over 40MPH on the flat section and could maintain that for 1/4 mile at 15yo. I averaged 22MPH on the long training runs which were 199 miles. So personally I believe a 15MPH speed limit is stupid. An E-bike that is in effect an E-moped should have the same performance IE capable of 30MPH.
Sounds like you haven't ridden a decent e-bike to be honest. With a Bosch Performance Line CX motor and the right gearing you can go up very steep hills with ease. I can do it on my Enviolo with moderate effort (sitting down, not sweating) but I test rode a bike with the Rohloff E-14 transmission and it went up the same hill in 3rd gear with ease. There is no need for more than 250W
Not everyopne can afford top spec.
Rohloff costs a grand alone
@@johndumarney1630£1600+
I agree 250 watts can do it with some effort from the rider. At a push I would be ok if they upped it to 350 watts as I think anything beyond this is too much to feel safe, particularly around pedestrians
You are quite right about the motor power, it is very silly. Its safer to have a higher power motor to get yourself out of a bad situation such as crawling up a hill on a narrow road with angry drivers behind overtaking at inapropriate opportunities.
The proposed increase to 500w is foolish - they may as well go to 750w because manufacturers are simply going to sell a restricted 750w motor to the UK market.
If the rider is going to have to have insurance is this going to mean the bike will have to have a number plate? Will the police do more spot checks to make sure people have insurance?? I can see the market for stealth ebikes increasing if so because nobody wants to be stopped and have to present documents.
Too many restriction and like you say we may as well get a motorbike, especially if you have to wear a helmet and have insurance and do a test - a 125 is far more fun and powerful than an ebike, and if they make a better noise too!
I totally agree with you mate. Hopefully this is just a step in the right direction and there is more to come.
Power of an e bike is not important if the speed is limited but more power on a limited bike means more able to climb hills which makes them safer and better not any more dangerous. In fact it makes take off better when keeping in traffic flow. I got involved in the govt e scooter consultation, their suggestions were ridiculous in my eyes, ignoring things that could be considered to make them a safe cheap transport mode, like decent size wheels that aren't too small for our crappy potholed roads and the simple option of a seat on a scooter making it more stable for any rider , even my old mum could enjoy that, and easily get it indoors , or up stairs etc. . Money always ends up the motivation. A cbt etc. will mean a licence, might as well buy a moped for far less money. Remember 16 yr olds had to ride limited mopeds with pedals? That didn't last did it? Mo FS1Es in shops now.
Yea I couldn’t agree more mate 👊
I can already unlock my 250w ADO Air to over 20 MPH. I would have loved a throttle on mine (EU model comes without) just for safer pull away and turning corners. The motor is weak for uphill though and I have to put in lot of effort for some of the steeper inclines. I can't see why the motor can't be up to 1000w with a speed limiter. It is needed for steep hills. Being able to maintain 15.5mph or higher uphill would be much safer too.
I saw this coming. The government always does things for their benefit. They initially restrict, then bring in " sweeteners" to bring others around to the greater restrictions they want to impose, i.e. tax, mot, insurance, registration and licence. If it requires registering, it isn't yours. If you require a licence, that is a contract relating to permission needed. Tax is just legal theft, so what you end up with is everything needed to use a ice bike or car, yet you are only using an e bike. If others can see through the deceptive practices and avoid them as much as possible, they will be better off. All of this is legislation. It is not law.
I think you’re missing the point the assist is to get someone who’s struggling to get up to speed 15.5 is like you said the normal speed for someone who is not struggling
I had to give up cycling due to health reasons. As I stay in a hilly area a 250w electric bike is pointless therefore when I go out to the shops I have to take the car. Only other option is I passed my driving test in 1977 therefore I could ride a 50cc moped on my licence without any test ?
Did my cbt and now i have insured my surron by the way i wouldnt recommend doing it at 16 im now paying 2500 a year to be insured
😮😮😮😮 no way!!!! That’s extortionate. It’s frustrating as the government is pushing for transport to become more green but then you are being completely shafted by insurance companies.
I took and passed the cycling proficiency test when I was a young teenager. Nothing wrong with having that for ebikes, or even all bikes, in view of the frequent abyssmal standard of bike riding. Insurance would be a good thing too. If you're not dangerous, it won't cost much, maybe even included with home insurance, but if you cause an accident, you need to pay for the damage or injuries. Some people think that because they don't have insurance, they're not responsible. I'd say registration would be a step too far. Next would be MOTs.
I have a car, motorbike and used to be a motorcycle riding instructor in the 1990s, I am all for proficiency testing, helmets and 3rd party insurance. I also think that the driving test in the Uk is far too easy. It should include night, motorway, and skid control training 40 mins around town is far from adequate testing to be able to drive around in 1.5 tonnes of metal.
so 40 minutes testing in a 1.5 ton car, is not enough time to pass or fail someone to drive a 1.5 ton car. That's what you just said Dave. Remembering all the lessons that they've had driving a 1.5 ton car.
I brought a e-bike to ease my body back into riding after accident. Yes they are slow and can't keep up with my pace. Having said that, at the moment, there are too many idiots on the roads. This includes all vehicles, so I would say faster electric bikes are not ready for the roads yet. Last thing, rather than put speed up, sort the bloody pot holes out first.
350 watts might be necessary on a heavy bike or a cargo bike but the Speed Limit definitely needs to REMAIN at 15mph in the UK - our cities are too crowded and streets too narrow for safety otherwise, and riding on pavements is becoming a grey area. Plus icrreasing the speed limit will just pave the way for more regulations, possibly registration of bikes and owners, tax and insurance - and even location tracking !
I agree. I think 250 should remain for ebikes and 350 for cargo bikes
What's the fastest and most powerful electric vehicle for road use licenced by means of a cbt? Will it need to be insured?
Revenue collection for their wars. Insurance, bikes always come off worse in accidents with larger vehicles.
Good to see the government is paying attention for once 👍
Definitely!! Hopefully this is just the start with better things to come!!!
They are not. They are asking the wrong questions to avoid building proper cycling infrastructure.
The issue with the laws changing on e-bikes is that it will be guaranteed that registration, a licence and insurance will be required, and you guessed it parking fines etc. will also come into play. Further, you will also be pulled for bald tyres and much more.
At which point you may as well get a moped and be done, e-mopeds are generally cheaper than decent e-bikes and are more secure when parking up etc due to in built immobilisers, alarms etc…
I’ve just bought a 250w bike to help me get out. Now having been a MTB downhill racer back in the day, I’m now disabled and can’t ride a non powered MTB anymore. My e-bike at 250w helps assist me climb some pretty steep hill in Shropshire, still pedalling but with no stress on my spine or knackered leg. The throttle gets me moving then cuts out which I really don’t mind as it’s all about exercise rather than speed. I have held a full motorbike license for 30 years and ridden some pretty powerful bikes so I understand people wanting a bit more power, but it isn’t necessary on a e-bike unless you want to be a hooligan, which tbh will fcuk it up for everyone else…if you want speed…pass your test, if you want exercise with a bit of help, then e-bikes are perfect ESPECIALLY for those of us who need that extra push up a hill.
Same here, herniated disc in my back and arthritis in joints. Just bought a 250w full suspension emtb so I can keep enjoying the MTB experience.
All good and nice to use .. I did not try an bike yet, but was an mopeds and bigger bikes from the age of 12 .. with or without license.. now have all the licenses and insurance I need .. what I know and believe is that younger teens do not have the understanding how much damage any motorbike burner or electric can do.. there have been accidents with scooters and ebukes from younger teens on footpaths with other pedestrians, so I do understand some regulations need to be in place. But you got a point low powered bikes are not making a difference of power and it is not there to make one, it is there to assist you and help you get there.. commuting to work or school etc.. getting there with less afford. I would say the bikes should be regulated the same way as motorbikes, it is a motor propelled bike it it is petrol or electric .. no difference, if you hit a car or a person with it and damage or health service would need to be covered yes you would need an insurance, any electric bike does have a way higher weight than a simple bicycle, the more weight and speed combined on impact the more damage.. not even talking about torque and controllability knowing how to and when, so this is going into a training same as motorbike licensing or cbt.. and if used on the street and it can go over the speed limit, to be able to trace the owner it be like a motorbike again ..meaning registration, numberplate etc..
One of the most informative posts I have seen in a long time and not packed out with pointless waffling.
Thank you 🙏
So you can a road legal surron & you need a cbt or moped license, insurance etc to ride it on the road.
Can they be retuned & reclassed to be a motor bike & then ridden with a full motorbike license, insurance etc ?
Like you can fit a bigger engine in a 50 or 125cc & have it reclassed as a motorbike.
Any ebike over 250w and 15mph is classed as a motor vehicle. You'd need MoT etc. too ride on road legally.
The biggest problem is kids riding around on these, full balaclavas, no helmet, no license, no insurance. They have no regard for the road laws. From what I have seen, they are just dangerous. It’s a shame as these are now replacing kids on a mountain bike.
I have a fat bike that goes 35mph but i can take it the same place that you do and the feild owners are chill about
I have the same experience with fat tyre e-bike. I find it’s the look of the Surron. It does look like a moto x bike and people just jump to conclusions. 99% of people I come across love it. You know the story of the other 1% lol
@@southcoastsurron yea there are just some people that abuse the Ron that's why they have a bad name
I have the same bike you are riding in this video at the start the pedal assist one - is this one legal to ride? Only used it twice tbf so wasn’t sure. Also how do I stop the metal mud guards rattling on the bike when riding it
If you are riding it on public roads in the same way as him, no that is not legal. Even if you weren't riding it in the same way (using the thumb throttle) and the motor is in excess of 250W max power output, again illegal if on public roads. Check the online listing for the retailer you purchased it from, it should say, as a disclaimer, that it is intended for use on private land. If you've been using yours on public roads you have been breaking the law and police can take it off you any time they want.
Hi, thanks for the reply - the max output is 192watts on the bike
@@andy211081 does it have it have a push button throttle and you have used that on public roads ?
Any E-Bike able to go over 20mph should require the same as a motorbike. CBT, Insurance, Helmet. Why? as more and more people on the road untested that don’t have a clue how to ride on the road. Plus Insurance protects other road users
They should be able to do 30mph just like a moped too
29 may in bow street london i was arrested for wanton and furious cycling the charge went no where i handed them a nice adjusted legal bill as well . If someone has a 250 watt motor can they put say a 500watt motor on without changing anything else
Hahaha! - The Fast and The Furious - 😂😂 Perhaps if your bike had more power you wouldn't need to pedal so furiously. 🤣🤣
If you have to register/plate/insure a higher power ebike would that make it illegal to take them on cycle paths/trails? if they are then classed as a road vehicle? can of worms?
Yes.
what trousers are u wearing?
The reality is that as long as you can buy these 'illegal' PEVs, people are going to get them in spite of any regulation or or law. More regulations just means less honest people using electric modes of transport, and the same idiots buying whatever they want and using it recklessly anyway
100%
I agree. This is one of the points I contemplated making in the video is should it be illegal to buy e-bikes with such big motors.
If, unlike the rest of us, you use any form of transport that enables you to travel faster than muscle power alone, you should take the stringent tests motorists have to. Otherwise chaos will ensue.
the cars on the road are chaos.
Greedy government yet again
Excellent video. Does this proposal approved now. I ammabout buy 250wh but will wait for 500wh bikes to come ..currently not much in the market
Only 4 pedestrians are killed by bicycles every year compared to 400 pedestrians killed annually by cars
More people die from talking selfies than shark attacks.
I think you'll find that there are more because the stats only refer to killed out right or die within a set time from point of impact. It does not include those who die a few days after.
@@funkycowie OK... perhaps, but I suspect that would make the car figure even higher than the bicycle one.
They have to catch you to enforce it lol. Good luck on my 72v Rawrr Mantis. 0-50 in 2.9secs 7500watt motor. Cops just look at it lol
What is the difference between an electric car and a fossil fuel car and make the same comparison between an e-bike, a 50cc moped and a normal motorbike.
The problem is that if a car driver is always deemed responsible in an accident with a bicycle where does that leave the driver when an ebike arrives at and crosses a pedestrian crossing from the pavement at 20 mph?
Both are classed as motor vehicles they just have different types of motors.
I have a 52v 2000w kit on my bike but i have a limiter which limits the bike to 250w will that still be illegal or legal even when i have the limiter on?
Not on the eyes of the law. You are riding with a motor way over the legal limit. That’s my argument, it would be great for the government to allow a limiter for public riding.
I would argue you have a motor 'rated at 250w but has a peak power of 2kw"
these cargo bikes make that claim too. A Bosch cargoline motor is 850w or sometimes even 1250w but they say it is 'rated at 250w' Look up the motor spec, it's clearly a cheat to make them road legal for the UK
@@utubeape the UK have a test of how peak wattage is measured over an 30 minutes sample and that is what discates the wattage rating
@@SirLordCustardthe10th so does that mean that you can buy a 2kw motor and as you pedal along a flat road you barely ever use its capacity it can qualify as a 250w?
I have a legal 1000w that comes limited to 250w (says 250w on the hub) it can be deresticted to 1000w for use on private property via the controller (have to change some settings) so it would depend on the nature of the limiter (a switch is a no) and perhaps, it might need to be factory built.... but I'm guessing here.
Great video, and wasn't fully aware of the trespassing piece. I think you're missing the point on pedal assist v Surron. A lot of eMTB's are being sold as part of a new life for mountain biking whether that be at bikeparks or in forest trails...neither a Surron can do. A pedal assist bike can also aid fitness, a Surron cannot.
Btw - i love the Surron, im not a hater and don't own an eMTB yet, but think you're overlooking an entire sport thats benefitting from e-assist and access to many who previously wouldn't touch a "tredder".
Good video 👍🏻
also owning an ebike for most people above 18yrs old are about saving money and having a viable cheap alternative to a car if the govoment start making people tax insure and pay for training just to use one then it no longer becomes cheap its obviosly cheaper than a car but ebike give people without licences and a lot of money for a car the freedom to get out and about which is good for mental health so like always the poorest get shafted
I totally agree with you mate. 👊
Yes, the laws are crazy, but you have to ask yourself this simple question; What are you using the Ebike for? If your answer is; to commute and not to have to pedal at all, well as long as you have no steep hills on your commute, 250W motor will just about do fine, if you dont want to go too fast. You wont need to pedal at all. What you have, is a non-taxable , no insurance, no MOT , no licence plate, no helmet required, ultra cheap mode of transport, job well done! If however , you are like me and has steep long hills where you live, but would like to cycle for fitness, but are like me, old 74, with dodgy knees, overweight and not so fit, you wont go near a push bike, as there is no point, you cant cycle up the hills. Thus adding an electric motor, batttery kit , even 250W allows me to go on a bike, and the motor makes the difference, providing that you are prepared to pedal! So for people that otherwise would not be cycling, due to age illness etc, Even a 250W motor makes a difference., and enables me to get the blood flowing . Thus first ask yourself , do you intend to pedal, or just use it as a free lightweight moped.
Personally I think there should be categories of e-bike similar to the USA. Category 1 should be cycle replacement e-bikes, 500w with use on cycle paths etc no helmet or insurance etc. Category 2, up to 1000w, same restrictions as e-bikes but 3rd party liability insurance requirement and possibly helmets required, then category 3 which could cover Surron type cycles up to the 25Km/Hr limit and possibly including registration plates or electronic tagging / black box technology, helmets and insurance. this then leads into category 4 and up which is covered under existing legislation for mopeds and small motorcycles.
I also can't understand why there has been little change in legislation in the motor vehicle world where you can legally drive an EV on the highway that is capable of busting Santa Pod records in acceleration from a traffic lights.
The 15.5 thing absolutely does my head in! Standard road limits range between 20mph and 60 mph(country lanes) so what's the issue with ebikes? As long as the suspension is adequate the bikes can handle the roads...more to the point if you cant keep up with the traffic it becomes really really dangerous (from personal experience) mainly because of bad drivers being road snobs as though they own the road and that your life is worth nothing. Ive had busses right up my arse knowing full well that if i come off im going under their wheels, ive had a bus driver almost cause a full head on collision with another bus because he wanted to overtake on a narow road. Ive had countless giant arse 4x4 owners come flying past me at 40+mph giving me less than half a metre in space when they should be giving me 6feet min. Eachbtime could have ended up with me dead , Simply being able to drive the thing at 20/30 mph would have kept me out of trouble
As I understand it electric bicycles above 250w are allowed but come under motorcycle licensing requirements. As a motorcyclist I think it makes sense for people using powered transport to meet certain training standards. I also drive a car and am a keen cyclist so am on all sides. I also think cyclists should obey the rules of the road, most do but many don’t. The changes in regulations seem to me to be reasonable. First time I have seen this channel. Great to see you out in the countryside. Would like to see your face.
As you say the issue of trespass is damage and nuisance and it is a civil issue so not normally a matter for the police. Personally I think it is always best to be considerate.
I'm a minimum wage worker, living in Newcastle area. I have a 16" folding 250w, 42n, 14 kgs ebike, that I rode from May 2023 till Feb 2024. Over 2300 kms on the odometer and can safely say that for a hilly terrain with pothole ridden cycle routes, 250w bikes are simply not enough. I rode that bike multiple times in London and even with good infrastructure, I still didn't think it was enough. Plus, the bike is limited to 15.5 mph and that law is just plain stupid.
I just got a Fiido M1 pro (500w), and can absolutely say that a 500w motor is ideal for this terrain.
Just like cars, motorbikes, vans, trucks, that are not restricted by BHP/torque on public roads and are restricted by speed limit, I wonder if these legislators have been challenged when it comes to ebikes and them imposing a stupid 250w restriction, when it's already known that most of the ebikes sold in the market are peaking much higher than that.
Pedal assist emtb are a game changer for getting up steep technical terrain compared to a std bike. So fine with what we have now on enduro off road emtb
Three days ago, the police stopped me in Newcastle. They confiscated my bicycle, which has a 250W motor and a maximum speed of 15 mph, just because it has a throttle. Now I'm trying to get it back. It's really difficult to get the 34-kilogram bicycle moving at traffic lights, and the throttle helps with that. I hope I can get my bicycle back.
Personally I'm not too worried about the power limit, but would like the assisted speed limit to be raised (say to 20 mph). Would make it much easier to keep up with traffic. Also, would make it easier to keep up with non-assisted bikes (at the moment I go faster uphill, and then they catch up on the downhill stretches).
Great point and I agree
~ Hi. Thanks for your knowledgeable opinion.
The faster you go, the less you see. Or, a ride at maximum attack is a highly, and narrowly, focused experience while a swift exhilarating ride is a controlled joy. Something like that?
I guess 🤷
I have a Chinese 2000 watt conversion kit fitted to my bike, but I'm always getting punctures ,as it's so heavy at the back.😢
Fit a solid tyre...
Put slime gel in the inner tube and take another inner tube and cut the inner diameter side and use it as protection for the first one. So basically you cover the inner tube with another one. You will never have puncture again except if is cut by shard of glass. It worked for me very well. And I had 14 kg of batteries on the rear and a 8kg hub motor and I weight 90kg
Not pointless if you have a mid drive motor.
4mph is average walking pace.
These are just in public consultation phase atm. So not law yet. Cycling groups are broadly against the suggested changes.
We need more protected cycling infrastructure, not more powerful e-bikes. Remember the existing laws are for pedal assist cycles. Not replacing cycling with motors more akin to motorbikes.
A 500w motor will mean e-bikes accelerating faster to 15.5mph and make e-bikes heavier and in turn the batteries - increasing fire risks. Increasing throttle should be no more than say 10mph IMO, not 15.5mph, if for disabled riders who can’t pedal. They already have class 3 mobility scooters.
If you want more powerful bikes then get a moped or speed pedelec to ride on the road with the appropriate legal paperwork.
in the USA they have 3 classes of E bikes, they can have 750w output, 20 mph peddle throttle. class 3 is peddle upto 28 mph, never had a problem. they are no were near mopeds or motorbikes. 750 watts is a puny 1 hp, i used ride motorbikes 90 times more powerfull. if they introduce registration, ect then kiss goodby to e bikes, or trying to get people out of cars.
If you ride round a farmers field without permission would you mind if we all ride through your garden without your permission?
Hi I've got engwe ep2 if i keep throttle off and keep it at 15.5 will if be ok m8 just its my first bike not sure on laws
Nope. get caught riding it on a public road it'll get crushed.
@@mobi1etone so it's no good for uk roads ?
@@waynefraser6808 'ATTENTION. Please be aware that this ebike model is only legal for use in private road. The throttle is unlocked when delivered and the motor is 750W.'
I have a legal rockrider e bike. Gets up clay filled rough forest terrain on a 20 degree incline fine with about 100w of power from my legs. You’re using the wrong bikes if you can’t get up a hill.
I like the law as is. I love my ebike and don’t see it pointless at all. It helps me train in the right easy zone despite hills and rough terrain, it gets me further and helps lug stuff around
Tell that to my Grandpa
With trespassing all it means that if u are not causing any damage then all they can do is ask u to leave there land .. that’s it nothing else , IF you refuse to leave when asked from the landowner then that’s a criminal offence. I am a landowner myself, basically if u see all these signs saying ‘ trespassers will be prosecuted’ etc etc ignore them , they can’t do squat 👍
The government have had a consultation on number plates for push bike back in 2021/22 can't remember which year
I think the 250W limit is good. If you want electric mopeds you must start paying insurance, think of stronger helmets, stronger brakes etc. . But a bicycle with pedal assist should remain a bicycle with pedal assist.
Sadly, as you mentioned, certain people will abuse these vehicles, and that will spoil it for everyone. In the rural area I live there are under age kids buzzing around on pit bikes on the road 2 up no helmet ,so I guess the government has to do something before someone is seriously injured or killed. Shame for the rest of us.
I’m sorry but I totally agree with high performance e bikes. I’ve got a motorbike license and have had for decades. I learnt how to ride a motorbike safely and those skills take time. For someone with no experience on riding a bike that can legally get on a bike that has similar performance to some small motorbikes is nothing short lunacy. They’ve typically got inferior handling capabilities, poorer braking making them even more dangerous. To see young kids on extremely fast illegal e-bikes scares me to death, not for them (they’re the least of my worries) but for people around them…
So, something like a cycling proficiency test, if only we used to do that at school.....
That's basically like what the CBT is anyway.
100% agree, it’s only ever been about money for them, tests etc will just put people off too
I have a 250w pedibal commuter bike and it has been to the DVSA for certification for throttle assist up to 15.5mph. Pedibal did all the leg work and the certificate arrived with the bike.
I have never ever ever seen anyone pulled over for having a +250 watt motor and throttle on a normal looking bike. Surron type bikes are literally mini scramblers and I totally agree that unless registered and insured, they should be nowhere near a public road/ paths.
I think 250w is very small for a “normal” e-bike , but 7000w is defo not required. 2000w seems to be more than enough.
All is on point, exc CBT allows driving 125 cc bikes
Governments, useless state employees, do just abuse stupidity with brainless rules, but things that really matter are overlook.
I got quoted $75 a year for liability insurance on my ebike that's not bad if you run Into somebody and the damage is covered.
Not in the uk
@@harrychambers7784 I got quoted £66 for insurance with Eversure. Liability, Injury and Legal.
For an off-road Sur-Ron?
@@southcoastsurron72v arial rider through progressive, considered motorcycle insurance
@@southcoastsurron Deleted my reply? i paid £66 for a 52v 1200w cruiser years insurance in UK.
I do agree with the law changes regarding helmets and insurance, especially if they're allowing more powerful ebikes. The insurance needs to be considered to cover liability for crashes, even for personal injuries. Otherwise the taxpayers cover hospital and/or damage costs to you or another person.
Current rules for e-bikes are just fine. 15mph on a shared cycle path is fast enough. You want a e-motorcycle or scooter then pay the insurance, license and get on the road. Whats the issue or fear? Its already bad enough when road scared mamils are flying down shared infrastructure with all the gear and no Idea. Speed on shared pedestrian infrastructure with no physical connection to how fast you are travelling is a terrible Idea.
Wanna bigger electric motor, put a licence plate on the bike get insurance and mot also obey the traffic signs and rules. 😉
I would have an e-bike in a heart beat, but I have a full driving licence and can’t afford to risk an IN10 and 3/6 points.
Having battled with the police over a motorcycle( I have had motorcycles all my life) on private property, they apply the law as any public accessible private property/place( not gated) is a public place and therefore requires everything needed to use the vehicle on a public road.
do we know when they're going to be looking at the laws or is it the usual guessing game with the government? also if they can geo restrict where dji drones can fly it wouldn't be much of a leap to geo lock ebikes
😂 I remember my champion cyclist father telling me how in the 1930s police stopped him as he went down Reigate Hill in Surrey. He thought they were going to do him for furious pedalling - on a fixed wheel cycle. No pedalling no movement. Fortunately they only said "You aren't in trouble. We only thought you would want to know you were cycling at 30 mph". Quite a feat on an old fixed wheeler at that time.
Im all for E-Bikes alternative transport which can be useful for alot people. I just want them to enforce certain rules especially within built up areas, follow road rules especially crossings and red lights. Being hit but one these things can be fatal youre going at full speed. Not from the direct impact, but the victim lands badly onto the pathments with head contact. They dont wear helmets.
You may say why isnt this enforced for Bicyles, I mean they should but electric assisted motors carries more force especally if your still accelerating vs a pedal.
I feel its sensible to require a type of license/certificate to purchase a bike to rule out anyone who could use it illegally
Interesting video, im 55 now but rode motorcycle since 16 , i also have gravel, mtb and road bikes, dont understand how the biggest demographic ( young lads) would possibly be able to afford to insure a Sur Ron or even a 500w ebike, you cannot also translate hp to speed, all the off road places here in Somerset are full of ebikes and i gave witnessed some insane riding on footpaths and bridal ways
You need min age, better classification of the vehicles and test equal to cbt at the least, also data loggers
Love all two wheel vehicles, but tech is moving faster than the law
Like I said the tech is there. The app I use can limit the bike as well l as providing a data log of each ride.
Too many good points to comment on...how ever it's worth mentioning not all e-bikes are equal as in terms of user interface I own an avaka bz20+. Pedal assist and throttle it gets interesting when you go through into the settings (not possible with all e-bikes) and you can turn down the intensity of pedal assist and how fast it will accelerate to 15.3 mph or 25kmh (don't start I know it's an odd number!) Mid drive motors are a different matter a 24v 350w mid drive set up will annihilate hill climbs and I've found it to be more reliable for hauling loads or even touring. (Forgot my partners logged into her youtube account 🤦♂)
Will there be a setting to stop these bicycles at red traffic lights!
i seen many cars go through reds, in fact i not seen a cyclist go direct through a red to the other side. and i been driving 35 years, so stop making it up.
@tonyrichardson2637
I'm not making it up about cyclists running red lights. It's epidemic in London and I've seen it with my own eyes. Yes motorists do run red lights but nowhere near the amount cyclists do. Yes, I appreciate there are many responsible cyclists around, I was one for many years but there is a certain group of cyclists that totally disregard the rules and can be a problem.
QUESTION..
Does "Registration..", mean the legal giving away of "Ownership.."
Example - ..am I the Owner or just the Registered Keeper?
You will own nothing and be happy..
Have to disagree.
I put a 250 watt Bafang mid drive motor on a 30 year old Marin mountain bike.
Works absolutely brilliant! Plenty of power up hills and good distance.
The power goes through the gears so works very efficient.
I have programmed it to go to 20 mph.
Thats all I need.
If I dont need to pedal then I would get a moped 😂
Cannot see the obsession with speed on bike!😂
Good report. Thanks
I use an ebike in the summer months only and live in a North Yorks seaside town . There are a few e-bike users here that are safe and respectful. Then there’s the holiday makers who I have seen let their kids ride them on crowded beaches without due consideration for the sheer amount of people. Someone is going to get hurt and ruin it for the rest of us. There is a whole world of difference between off roading and riding in big cities where sense and awareness of others is important but not always shown by the e-bike community, particularly in shopping areas. I can’t see the government allowing ebikers with bikes that can do 70mph without registration and insurance, theoretically if a e-bike can go faster than a street legal moped, it should be categorised the same and treated the same. ..almost time to de winterise my M.pro 😃👍
I'd quite like an ebike if it has the power and range to be practical. I'd get a lot of use when the weather's compliant and it'd save a fortune on busses and trains every time I wanted to say go 10+ miles away (it'd be quicker too in totality), in fact I'd make those journeys a lot more. I'd need a minimum 50 mile range without peddling and the ability to drag my hefty frame plus maybe carry 30KGs of cargo up hills. Expandable power capacity to extend the range later would also be nice. The government should be promoting these things and be creating more safe cycle routes to use them on, getting people out of inefficient big steel boxes and out in the fresh air on lightweight machines that don't need huge engines or half a tonne of lithium in the floor to make them move should be the goal. It's that or forever living with congested unpleasant urban areas not suited for Human needs.
Forget these. Just look into Lankeleisi MG740 Plus, it's 2000 Watt, 48 Volt, 20 Amp. Plus is an actual standard bike. Thank me later
acording to the department of transport i asked before getting one 2 years ago that you can have a throtle as long as it dosnt powere you over the 15.5 mph why and who gives the info out saying you cant have a throttle
DVLA states throttle can only assist upto 4mph on an EAPC
@@southcoastsurron I have a street legal Mi-Rider - yes the throttle button alone only gives about 4mph, but it helps boost the initial start. But also you can choose from 5 levels of assist, and I find it very convenient that I can generally pedal around on level 2 assist, but if I hit a hill or a headwind pressing the throttle dials it up to level 5 assist as long as you hold it.
I would prefer a 20mph maximum assist speed
That used to be the case upto 2015 but in 2016 they changed the law. I bought my bike in 2015 so have full throttle use (the law isn't retroactive so all bikes built before 2016 are allowed to keep the throttle), it's probably the only upside of having an old bike.
@@childofeternity then some one didnt tell the department of transport in 2021 when grant shap was minister as i asked them and got an email back on behalf of extra exetra teling me a throttle could be used as long as its ristricted to 15.5 mph so the dot and the vlv need to arange who makes the rules lol luckly i keep a copy on my phone just incase i ever get questiond on it
@@Paul-hl4cj You've definitely been given incorrect information so yeah, keep that copy just in case.
To register: is to give away what is lawfully yours.
License: to ask permission to do what is already a lawful act.
Person: a body corporate member by an implied contract.
All is wordplay to get you to comply.
Oh, and it's a required speed not a speed limit.
Know your lawful stance.