The IBM Model M Buyer's Guide
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- čas přidán 5. 10. 2014
- My review and buyer's guide to the greatest keyboard ever made. I'm sure I missed a bunch of stuff and I'm sure everybody will grill me in the comments so check back in the near future for part 2!
INFORMATION ABOUT MODEL M KEYBOARDS
deskthority.net/wiki/IBM_Enhan...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_M...
www.clickykeyboards.com/index....
geekhack.org/
wiki.geekhack.org/index.php?ti...
WHERE TO BUY:
ebay.com
New production PS/2 to SDL cable: www.ebay.com/itm/270929351364
Active PS/2 to USB Adapter: www.amazon.com/Ziotek-PS2-Keyb...
7/32" Nut Driver: www.ebay.com/itm/321119841757
Another 7/32" Nut Driver:www.ebay.com/itm/390599966693 - Věda a technologie
if anyone ends up getting a model M because of this video, I highly recommend actually purchasing the nut driver as well. previous owners don't always clean them and they can become pretty dirty from regular use.
No offence, but I hate noisy keyboards.
Clark Clements
enjoy your INFERIOR TYPING EXPERIENCE
danooct1 Clark Clements *presses key* CLICK
dan m8
How is it inferior? It is just loud and annoying. I want to hear the game that I am playing, not the sound of me pushing keys on a keyboard.
*removes key cap with Mosin Nagant bayonet*
I got one for a dollar recently at a indoor yard sale.
Id just like to tell everyone that the AT connector (5 pin din) used in the IBM model F and M boards are still totally usable on today's computers, not "just for parts" like the guy said. A simple adapter is all thats needed to convert AT to PS/2
No, an adapter doesn't work, an active converter is needed. They are using completely different scan code sets. So, an adapter never works for that.
@@ibrahimaysu8247 I think he was talking about adapting it to PS/2. Converting PS/2 to USB requires still a converter.
It goes like that: [AT Connector > PS/2] = Adapter | [PS/2 > USB] = Converter.
Also converting one with a terminal plug or an older xt plug (without leds) to usb is also possible, it just requires a special converter.
@@ibrahimaysu8247this is an old post AT and PS/2 are the same protocol. You only need an adapter
Actually, you can use Terminal Model Ms on modern computers, I'm typing on one right now. You need what's called a Soarer's converter.
Thanks for making this great guide, I plan on buying one of these keyboards in the near future and now I know what to look for.
Don't be afraid of the AT connectors. One can either swap the cable for a PS2 (identical SDK connector on the keyboard itself), or adapt the AT connector (available at Amazon). It's the same keyboard. Although he mentioned something about the lights not locking, that's not been my experience. I did a lot of swapping cables, though; since I used old, old tech through the 90s. It's possible that I had a PS2 kb with an AT cable on it. In any case, the swap isn't like the PS2-USB adaptor. It's just wired through, and the signals it carries are the same either way.
I own a 1390120 model M. It doesn't bother me that it lacks the lock lights, it is the smoothest and best performing keyboard I've ever used outside of a beam spring. I'm planning to get it overhauled in the coming weeks with bolt mods and just getting the entire thing freshened up.
Look at that SLICK BLACK keyboard. Looks like the PS Triple. BALLIN'.
Thank you very much for making this video! You are great man! I have a 1995 Model M by lexmark, numlock/SL/CL LEDs were not lighting up, and I modded it to jump the membrane connector to the LED little board with real cables, and now it works 100%, very pleased. Looking to acquire a space saver to save space on the desk, since I'm also a fan of the TKL layout.
Thank you for going into detail on this tutorial!
Thank you for this! Great content, a lot of things I didn't know about the Model M!
This is a great video! Currently hunting my birthday Model M Jan 23 1990!
I'm using a Model M 122 key terminal Keyboard with Windows. You just have to solder four wires to a teensy board and load soarers firmware. I have more keys than I know what to do with.
i use the model f variant its loud capacitive full nkro and delightfull
The one shown at 12:49 is not a terminal keyboard; it is an XT keyboard. The IBM PC-XT did not have BIOS support for keyboard lock lights, so that's why the keyboard doesn't include them. But like most Model Ms, it is XT/AT autoswitching, so with a 5-pin to PS/2 adapter, or a replacement PS/2 cable, it will work fine with any modern computer, if you don't mind the lack of the lock lights.
It was actually a terminal keyboard, as it had field keys that were present on the other terminal keyboard, but are not on the XT keyboard, as well as 24 function keys
Thorough and informative review,thank you.
Great video. I considered one of these years ago and I might look into it again now.
Wow. Didn't even know you had another channel Rogue until I happen to look up IBM Model M usb. Subbed.
My friend and I have a few older Dell keyboard with Alps switches (pretty much the closest thing to a Model M), and the keyboard has a huge space at the top where there isn't anything going on. My friend had the idea to put an active USB converter inside the keyboard, then cut a hole in the back for a female USB port. That way, the keyboard has a removable cable and it's USB. Just for laughs, we put a 32 GB flash drive inside the keyboard so that it has internal storage.
As i can conclude from your new channel picture, you are a fucking great designer!
Thanks for the vid!
Now I really want a Model M!
Pretty much the only thing that it doesn't have compared to my current keyboard is the Windows key and extra audio and music controls on top of the keyboard.
I've had the model m for a few years, and its freaking awesome!
There are now adapters that let you use the terminal model Ms with normal PCs (Look up soarer's converter), so there isn't inherently as much of a reason to stray away from one now if you can still find one cheap.
Thanks for making this video. Really helped me make an informed purchase. I would have bought a non ps/2 with dome switches if it wasn't for you
I just bought a 1991 Model M on eBay and I am so excited to get it.
Thanks for this. Been fishing eBay and there are bunch of version. My old one vanished years ago.
I am typing on my second Model M keyboard. I wish to thank you for sharing your valuable information and advise about how to select one. I am a senior who is challenged by poor dexterity, but find the Model M the most comfortable keyboard for writing long articles. The model M has to be the best keyboard ever developed.....
I remember I used to use DIN to PS/2 adapter cable for my old PC and it worked. Also I remember we had IBM model M for our family computer when I was small, shame we gave it away...
I just got one and it's magical to type on.
nice, using a mosin bayonet to remove keycap from premises very good job and good review.
"This one is _sllick bllack_"
-rogueamp
Just like my hair, and the PS-Tripple.
Great video with some great information! I've recently rediscovered mechanical keyboards, and have already bought a couple. I might get a Model M just as a backup, though... Although I'll probably go with Unicomp, just to have something a bit newer (including USB out of the box and a Win key).
How do you feel about Unicomp? They are supposedly the exact same quality as Model M, and they even offer some of those trackball models. I myself will probably just get a standard setup. (At the moment, I'm using the Happy Hacker Pro 2 on my iMac).
Can the non detachable cable ever be replaced on my 71G4644 as the flat areas insulation is brittle & coming apart. Terrific video, learned a lot by watching. Thanks,
Got the terminal one for free... did a small conversion with a teensy 2.0 and works great... also a lot more keys for macros... and you get use to the 4 arrow keys with the extra rule key really quickly
I'm looking at getting a Unicomp keyboard at some point in time! :O) Interesting and informative video!!! :O) Kindest regards from England.
i love the 122 Terminal Keyboard. a Teensy2.0 and some soldering you can make a Soarer Converter for Terminal Model M. You can do a lot of things with all the extra Keys. typing one one actually right now.
I was going to post a comment, but I'll talk a little more about that later.
I actually have 3 of these keyboards. 1 of which is un-opened
Chris Donham selling for cheap?
Hahahaha no I like them
Chris Donham owell XD
Dooooope
I used to have a model m2, it died after my dog got ahold of it somehow.... but I just purchased one of those unicomp model m 122 clones from 2003! it looks pretty good in the pictures, Im looking forward to trying it out!
how are the older m13s? I found an one lying around my attached garage i never knew we had. unlike the one in the video mine was made late 94 and in the USA. I ask because the one i found is pretty whooped and i want to know if its worth repairing.
rogueamp uploaded this 3 days ago. 3 days ago was when my own model m review video had view spikes. Coincidence?
In all honesty if these views were caused by you uploading this video then I'd like to say a huge thanks!
My model M is a 94' by Lexmark. Such an excellent keyboard!
Thanks! I was looking at this keyboard everywhere on online shopping sites. :3 I have many various kinds of keybaords (I have Cherry MX Blues, Browns, Blacks) but I wanted something that is more special and not as easily to find everywhere. I always wanted to see something like a buyers guide for this keyboard. :D
Cherry MX blue etc are the brands of switches...not the keyboard itself.
Zestypanda lol? Isn't it obvious? I didn't really want to list out all of the brands and models of each brands. I know what I am buying. ;)
Do you think there is any usb adapters for the model m?n I dont have a desktop pc anymore and my laptop only has usb!
I actually had one of these in the 90s when I was 8 years old or so, it was my dad's, we had it on our 486. Then we sold the whole thing for next to nothing around 2000, and got a new PC with a rubber dome keyboard, which was just entering the market and everyone thought they were so cool and modern, b/c they were silent, keys could be super shallow, they were thinner, and had more modern-looking designs, had extra keys, etc. And we used to say remember those old clicky heavy keyboards how silly were they, like old typewriters. Times sure do change. My Model M was in a really good shape too. I never thought I'd actually dream of having one 2 decades later and it didn't even cross my mind it could be worth like $150. I think we sold the whole computer for less. Rubber dome is now considered cheap garbage, and I love my Steelseries 6GV2 mechanical keyboard, but I think the Model M is just the best keyboard ever made, so I am saving for a "new" one.
I grabbed one of these at goodwill for pretty much free (10 cents) only problem is it has an RJ45 connection, is it possible to use on windows 7 If I buy a RJ45 to usb adapter?
If you consider this the best keyboard of all time, what would you say is it that makes it superior to the model F AT keyboard?
Great advice. Thanks.
Ive got an ibm origional keybard (missing a few keycaps and a broken spacebar) but i LOVE it use it with my ibm 5170
There is no "converting" between AT and PS/2. They are the same protocol. Adapters are cheap and work great since the connectors are electrically identical. Not sure what you're on about with it being a hassle.
The RJ45 connector ones I think can be used on modern computers using a Soarers converter (costs around £40)
I'm surprised that you did not make any mention of the Unicomp Model Ms. What's your opinion on those keyboards?
no not exactly i am typing this with a unicomp and the case is thinner and the caps are way more cheap feeling but the switches are about the same "about"
Chazdin McCluew the backplate is also plastic so it’s not nearly as nice to type on
@@garlicbread5320 Not true. the backplate is also metal. The case material on all model M's is made of plastic.
HudsonGTV you know I’ve got no clue as to why I said that cause that doesn’t even make sense lol
Hey, loved the video. IBM Model M 1391401 user here. Anyway, couple questions: First, what do you think is the best place to look for replacement keycaps for the model M? What about custom ones that are more colorful/showy? Also, what is the purpose of the speaker grille? Lastly, apart from being able to hotswap, what are the advantages of converting to USB vs. just using PS/2, which is working just fine for me so far?
Unicomp sells printed/unprinted/multi-color Model M keys. The speaker grille was used (I'm assuming) to play a boot-up noise when the machine started. PCs later came with their own speaker so it made the one on the keyboard pointless. There really isn't an advantage/disadvantage in converting from PS/2 to USB, unless you actually think NKRO matters (which it doesn't).
I have a space saver keyboard, sits in a pull out keyboard drawer, with a trackball on the side. It's handy because if you're a lefty, you can simply move the trackball over to the left of the keyboard. As long as you don't use the dedicated number keys section a lot. Oh yeah, I got it for $10 at a flea market!
I still use a Model M (1391401 18OCT98) today at my desk at work. Ive owned this keyboard for about 25 years now. I used to work selling used computers back in the 90's when you could not give these away along with the IBM PS/2 computers they came with.. I remember sending hundreds to the recycling center. With Y2K a year or two away any system that was a few years old and not considered "Y2K OK" was junked. After Y2K no one wanted to buy used systems since most just got new ones so everything we had in the warehouse was sent to the recycling center.
With how much they sell on Ebay now I wish I had saved a few hundred of them..
I got lucky and bought one of my model M keyboards new in the box from a thrift store for $5.
It's a model with a PS/2 connector and was made in Scotland.
You can also get SDL to USB cables to connect these to modern hardware.
I've got the same Keyboard, the Part Number is the same but it does not have a fru number and the id number is different.
Mine is also OLDER it's dated 9-21-90.
I got it at a flea market for 5 bucks it was in a box full of a bunch more of the same keyboards.
I also have the same exact PS/2 to USB Adapter because it did not fully work with my Asus Motherboard in the PS/2 port I could not get into set up of my BIOS but once my operating systems loaded the keyboard worked, strange.
I think some of the plastic rivets broke off in mine because I hear something rattling inside it but it still works and all the keys still click. It has fallen off my keyboard tray a few times and made a loud thump / bang sound like a brick falling.
Terminal Models are absolutely usable with a Soarer's adapter. It's a bit of work, but so is everything.
hey i just bought my self a 1395985 model by lexmark uk but i cant find it anywhere on that list.
I got the 1391401 made 22, March 1988. I love it.
Hi rogueamp2, great video! Just wanted to let you know black M13s do exist that were made in the US by Lexmark. The part no is 13H6705 and mfg date is 20-dec-94.
I would love to try a buckling spring keyboard, but getting a WASD CODE with Greens is higher on my list right now. I'm using MX Blues right now.
I just got my new Unicomp 103 key model m today in the mail, and oh god it is worth your ninety dollars. Its not a true old fashioned IBM Model M, but it sure as hell does get the job done and actually DOES NOT leave you with finger fatigue after typing on it for extended periods of time. In short, buckling spring switches are king, and if you want to buy new, Unicomp has top notch customer service.
What about Unicomp Model-M keyboards? They are the current manufacturer and still make them as far as I know. They cost around 90 bucks and they make versions with a USB connector. Are these just cheaper versions like the Lexmark ones or just as good as the real deal?
They use buckling spring keys but they are cheaper than the PS/2 era model Ms in almost every way. They use cheap plastic, there's no steel plate, the cable is hard wired, the key caps in some cases are non removable and they have been known to be unreliable. But they do have the Windows key, and you can order them with the Macintosh layout.
Do you know where i can buy an extra key? I dont have the F5 key, i have the thing that sticks in i just dont have the cap. And also, if i buy a PS/2 to USB adapter will it work on windows 7?
+Barrel Roll Try Unicomp who are the orignal kbd manufacturing plant (AFAIK), and sell full New Model M type keyboards & key and keycap spares (I can't verify they work on the old Model Ms but hey!) www .pckeyboard. com
i have an m13, i haven't noticed much letter wear tho. I can confirm there is a difference between the maxiswitch and the original model m
Also their are M13 versions in the normal M tan coloring. Same keys as the normal M.
6:56 yeah so you gotta get used to pressing Control-Escape to call up the start menu
10:33 I think ***** said something about AIX/UNIX
AT keyboards are completely compatible with PS2. I used to cut the AT end off and splice the wires into a PS2 connector. Although I would recommend just buying an adapter. A teenager will do something like this to save the $3 on an adapter. I suspect that this would be true with the RJ45 wires as well, but I haven't ever actually tried it on one of those.
Lexmark really was just IBM's accessory division. It was all the same people and same factories (or factory) that always made Model M's. No doubt they did change some stuff over the years, as all companies do. But just thought it was worth clarifying that if you get a Lexmark-made Model M, it's no less a real Model M than one "made by IBM". Only the sticker on the back is different. I actually bought a 1996 Lexmark-made Model M new about 16 years ago, and it still looks and works like the day I bought it. They're still pretty indestructible. I haven't needed to do any mods.
i own an IBM 1391401 92' i can't find one like it simply because my IBM has a "ADP Financial Partner" is that bad?
Just bought a 92' Model M for about $80. It's the PS/2 adapter version and it looks perfect. Cannot wait to clean it up and I am thinking about doing the bolt mod only if I have to. Also, has anyone ever heard that the PS/2 plugs in the Model M are a bit overpowered when plugged into modern motherboards (like they could short the motherboard)? I heard that from another video on them beforehand, and it kind of makes sense since you need an active adapter to plug it into a USB port (and work). Can anyone shed some light on this before I fry my motherboard next week?
I have a very VERY early model M UK keyboard that's been in my life for over 25 years! it still works perfectly and I use it to write. it's got a 5 pin DIN connector, but with a 5-pin to PS2 connector it works perfectly with my ASrock motherboard. So I would disagree to steer clear of the 5-pin keyboards. It's also got an extra key between the Z and left shift key that was easily remapped to be a windows key - It was originally a UK keyboard but the beauty of these are that you just buy individual keycaps to change your locale.
I have a 42H1292, made in the UK by IBM. I wonder why the wiki table only has the 42H1292U variant.
You can actually convert the terminal model m by either buying or making a soarers converter. I use mine every day.
Your link for replacement cables no longer work. I ended up paying $9 a peice for some vintage ones :-/ The cheapest I could find, as everything after that skyrocketed in price upward. The passive PS/2 to USb converters I bought did not work, so I'll be looking for a cheaper active converter than that Sanoxy...
I'm trying to find one of these keyboards to buy recently. Used to use them for data entry at a warehouse I worked at, best keyboard I ever used, I prefer it over the Corsair k70. If only I could find a M 1391401 for less than $160
What do you guys think about the Unicomp keyboards?
winfr34k I've seen some pretty good reviews of them on GeekHack and in general all around the net, most people do say they feel a bit cheap when compared to the original Model M however that is to be expected really, they changed their plastic formula a couple of years back. Some people also say they got rid of the steel backplate, thus making the keyboard lighter, however, some also say that this is false and that the reason the keyboard is lighter is because the metal used on the backplate is a lower quality steel... Personally I wouldn't be willing to take one apart, I actually emailed Unicomp Support about this (I am considering to buy an Ultra Classic White USB one pretty soon) and they have not replied yet, I've seen someone say they favor old-fashioned communication (Letters and phone calls) over emails... May just give them a call tomorrow.
very informative video, tnx
I switched from my G710+ to an IBM (Model) M2, simply because the typing experience was superior, for me they were better than the Cherry MX-switches. I do still use both it and my 6Gv2 along with my workshop computer(s) and they are fine, but for my main computer the M2 keeps it spot.
There's this Acer 6511-va Keyboard for sale, not sure if it's mechanical so if anyone can tell me if it is, I will pick it up if so
My IBM model m had a steel case and weighed a ton. But a friend with a nerve condition begged it from me as she kept breaking keyboards. I am using a dell at102w instead which is great.
Where can I find one in the UK? Shipping costs from 'merica are way too much.
There are plenty on eBay - they made them in Greenock, no need to get an American one!
What were the ibm keyboards with the steel chassis?
You are referring to the Model F which was the predecessor to the Model M. Many hail the Model F as the true mother of all keyboards. Even though the Model F had superior build quality, the Model M is the model that set the keyboard layout standard.
I
Rougeamp2, what do you think of mechanical keyboards like razor ones?
I like it......
Compared to a dell membrane, its a pretty solid keyboard.
But compared to a model m, well... nope!
Are there any converters for a rj45 cable such as a ps2 or USB for the IBM Model M?
Check ebay. There are ready made cable converters using ATMega32u4 boards for around $40 US...or you can roll your own.
Look up a Soarer's converter. It converts from rj45 to USB and lets you reprogram any of the keys on the keyboard at the hardware level, no software needed.
I myself have a Unicomp 103 key buckling spring keyboard. Quite honestly, I love it, but I cannot compare it to a genuine Model M as I have never used an IBM version before. I'm sure however, that genuine Model M's are just as good, if not better. On a side note though, Unicomps customer service is of outstanding quality.
The buckling spring is very similar to MX Blue switches, but the model m squashes the MX Blues...
You did notice that the Lexmark keyboard seller did declare "non-clicky" in the listing title?
It's not very difficult to convert the terminal (RJ 45 connector) model M keyboards to be usable with modern computers. You can google "Soarer's Converter" which allows you to convert that terminal connector to USB. Or you can even make your own with a cheap logic board from China + some soldering equipment. Great option if you really want a Model M but don't want to pay over 100USD.
The metric system is superior. Pretty much every one else in the world uses it.
+samzx81 im canadian (uses metric system) but the metric system is just confusing to me. the imperial system (america burma and liberia) makes sense to me
@@Kn270 lol WHAT???????
@Mark B Ah yes, orange man bad. Actually if you were not so ignorant, you would know that the US did not invent the imperial system, and is not the only country to use it. Canada also uses it along with a few other countries. Which ever system you use doesn't determine your intelligence or political affiliation as you mentioned. Maybe some people like having an intermediate measurement between centimeters and meters since there is a massive jump, hence, making inches useful. Maybe it doesn't fucking matter which measurement system you use.
And before you call me too stupid to use the metric system, I use both systems depending on what I am measuring. For example, I use Celsius for measuring temps of electronics, and Fahrenheit for measuring the temp of the current day. Americans use millimeters, centimeters, alongside with inches and feet. We use grams as well.
wrong imperial is way better than metric
@@animegamingdude not for doing calculations.
SDL to USB? Soarer's converter?
Do you still have that keyboard
Also you can get a usb cable for the model m but there like $40 on ebay tho
it would be really fun if you made a contest and the winner's prize would be model m!
all the plastic for the case is pbc and the caps are pbt (i may be saying the case plastic wrong but its something like that lol) abs is low quality and yellows
Why it's so hard to find any information about the 1390141( 1986 ) i wonder if it's even model M :( it's with Ö Ä Å keys
I feel like I need to make this clear. Out of all the outdated keyboard interfaces, dealing with AT is absolutely the easiest. The PS/2 keyboard interface is electrically the same as the 5-pin DIN connector on AT keyboards, and thus AT keyboards can be made to work with PS/2 with a simple, incredibly cheap wiring adapter. Be careful, though- XT keyboards also use 5-pin DIN connectors, but XT is NOT electronically the same as AT and PS/2. XT keyboards need a converter, opposed to a simple wiring adapter. Right now, the cheapest is a Soarer's Converter, sold by Orihalcon on Ebay for 40 bones.
Thanks rogueamp, I spent $180 on a keyboard because of you.
the only mechanical keyboard that i have is a dell at101w with alps skcm black tactile switches, i haven't ever typed on a model m.