Was the RX 7800XT Cancelled? Where is the upgrade to the RX 6800 XT? What will compete with nVidia?
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- čas přidán 7. 06. 2024
- At AMDs event that announced the RX 7900 XTX and RX 7900 XT GPUs, they did not announce a RX 7800 XT. Was that GPU cancelled? What is the generational upgrade to the RX 6800 XT? Can AMD compete with nVidia without this GPU in the lineup? What will they use to compete with the RTX 4070 Ti?
Kitguru video referenced:
• AMD HIT Nvidia with RD...
#RX7900XT, #RX7800XT, #RX7900XTX - Věda a technologie
In the video I didn't address the use of N32 as a 7800xt. That is because that 200mm2 GCD will only allow 60CU. Moving from a 6800xt with 72CU to a 7800xt with 60CU would be a very, very poor generational upgrade.
I used to think the same some time ago but after analyzing how all navi21 22 and 31 scale across different cu nr I don't think that's the case .
Having 60CU in 3SE will scale better than in 6SE and depending on freq (i expect it to go ~2.80) 7800xt will go from 27% to 38% better than 6800xt and 5 - 10% better than 4070ti.
I understand that's not what we wished for, but that can give them the oportunity to keep price @649 or even @599.
And that falls in line with their last minute strategy.
7900xtx 50% stronger and cheaper than 6950xt.
7900xt 40% stronger and cheaper than 6900xt.
7800xt ~33% stronger and cheaper than 6800xt.
Speaking of "very poor generational upgrade" what concerns me the most are the rumors of 7700xt being an 8gb 32cu n33.
@@CM0G Watch it retail for $750
Only the consumers are Jebaited 2X this release. Corporates win.
obv
If there are tons of dumb people willing to spend way too much money on something, it’s a self Jebait. Essentially every company will charge as much as possible to make the most money. Especially when it comes to large companies.
@@adamhero459 I agree companies will charge more and more, but this time its gone out of hands. They are even putting apple to shame.
That's why it is better to be a customer
Cries in 2023
7800 xt should be on the Navi 32 die as was leaked a couple months ago. They are just delaying it in order to sell through the remaining inventory of 6000 series cards.
Navi 22 was the die they used to make RX 6700XT. Now Navi 32 is used to make 7800XT? There is something really fishy going on this generation. BOTH companies are just increasing the number of the GPU name so they can charge more money.
@@johnc8327 Why do you care about the GPU name? Price/performance should be the only thing people care about. Guarantee if the 4080 12Gb launched at $700 no one would have cared what they called it.
@@johnc8327 Both companies put the Flagship GPU's on their own die. GA102 was RTX 3080 up to RTX 3090 Ti. Navi 21 was Rx 6800 up to Rx 6950 XT.
This generation however, AD102 is RTX 4090 and RTX 4090 Ti. Also Navi 31 is Rx 7900 XT and Rx 7900 XTX.
Basically, AMD and Nvidia are putting the flag ships on the top die and pushing lower end cards down. Which is why I personally don't expect to see the RTX 4080 Ti on AD102.
@@johnc8327 It's different with chiplets. And it is depending on how much slower the 7800XT is compared to the 7900XT. I wouldn't say AMD is doing it too yet, untill we know how the rest of the lineup performs compared to the flagship.
@@johnc8327 AMD in previous generation of course wanted to use Navi 22 for 6800xt, but... it turned out that 6800 would have no chance to compete with 3080, so AMD was forced into using Navi 21.
Which means that (if 7800xt use Navi 32) either Navi 32 is way better than Navi 32 or AMD knew how big shit will be 4080
I think 2 things will happen
1) 3rd party manufacturers will only do basic coolers on the 7900xt making them be $900-950 whereas for the 7900xtx they will almost only put overbuilt coolers on them and thus charge more like $1100+ for all the models
2) the 7900xt will have a price drop for the msrp, likely $800.
False AIB partners will through 4090 coolers on both of them.
No matter what they end up doing I will be first in line to buy one.
@@ZackSNetwork ye they already are. Teh asus ones are teh same as 4090 cools.
Ah, I had the same thoughts about the 7900 XT after thinking over AMD's announcements.
The price was far too close to the 7900 XTX, which always felt like AMD were giving themselves a competitive buffer against Nvidia.
$899 is ridiculous on paper, but if Nvidia launch the 4070 Ti at $699 or drop the 4080 16GB to $900, AMD has room to maneuver. I also believe this is why they're choosing to launch a month after their initial announcement - they want to see how Nvidia adjusts their own lineup.
Chiplets give AMD pricing leg-room, while Nvidia's choice to redline their cards means they're almost stuck in a corner. Unless of course Jensen is willing to sacrifice his precious margins...
Pigs will fly before Nvidia drops 4080 to $900. Lets be realistic here.
7900XT and 7900XTX have very similar cost, so price is also similar
I seriously doubt that they'd cancel their level-8 enthusiast card. The only time that I've ever seen the absence of a level-8 card from ATi was Navi. Other than the RX 5000-series, the level-8 card has existeince since as late as the X1800 and possibly earlier. The presentation didn't have the 7500, 7500 or 7700 either but I don't think that they were cancelled either.
They haven't cancelled it, you're just getting what would have originally been the 7700XT now renamed as a 7800XT.
They haven't cancelled it, you're just getting what would have originally been the 7700XT now renamed as a 7800XT.
They haven't cancelled it, you're just getting what would have originally been the 7700XT now renamed as a 7800XT.
They haven't cancelled it, you're just getting what would have originally been the 7700XT now renamed as a 7800XT.
They've should've just called the 7900XT "7900" and the XTX Variant a "7900 XT"
Some concluded the 6800 non-xt was the best in the lineup. It actually has the most OC headroom from all of them. They didn't plan to sell much considering how much cut down it was. I'm sure their yield on TSMC 7nm meant they didn't have to cut many down that far.
As a 6800 non-xt user I say it have almost non OC headroom. They selected the least leakage chip to use. You can push it to 2500mhz @ 800mv, but you cannot go as high as 2800mhz like the XT can.
@@maou5025 Mine isn't stable that low, but mine is a reference. I have to run it at 900mv @ 2400mhz. Although at that its pulling like 160 watts which is pretty awesome.
That is very efficient! Reminds me of the R9 Nano. Whats the power draw difference from stock to 2500MHz @ 800mv?
@@ImaMac-PC it have very weird power draw. On one game it can only take like 130w, some can goes up to 200w. Completely random even at 99% load.
I've been saying this for a little bit, the 7900xtx should have been the xt and the 7900xt should have been the 7800xt. I think they don't want to sell many of them though. Also, I initially wanted the 6800, and I actually recently got one for $350. I don't think this will happen, but if they renamed/relaunched the 7900xt as the 7800xt for $750 I'd buy one at launch.
Another excellent video, keep up the good work!
Thanks again!
I think even a $799 launch price for the 7900XT would be disruptive. Then Navi 32 (7800XT) can still launch next year at the same $649 price point.
749$ disruptive!
799 would be disruptive, but a navi 32 7800xt isn't really an 80 class. It's basically the 7700xt, and would have the same problem. For $649, I'd expect it to beat the 6800xt by 30%+ and thats a tall order for less CU's.
lmao
I'm with you on this. Personally if the 7900 xt is $800 or less, I'll be very interested.
9:09 this is 100% true. I bought the ASRock 6800XT a few days after that announcement and saw it as the best bang for you buck GPU. Here I am playing it and I am beyond stupidly impressed with the jump up from my 2060.
Haven't watched the video yet but the 7900xt is the successor to the 6800xt obviously lol .they've just changed the name to justify the higher pricing just like nvidia did. At least the price isn't on the 4080s level lol
OK so I've watched the video now, it's nice to know not everyone is blind to the naming gaming lol. Had so many arguments with people thinking it's a replacement for the for 6900xt and the xtx is the replacement is for the 6950xt. Ignorance is bliss i guess .the xt makes no sense with pricing. Obviously they're trying to upsell to the xtx ...which has worked on me to be honest lol. The xt should of been $799 at the most. It makes no sense at $899., I feel like they upped the price nvidia cancelled their 4080 12gb lol
No 7900xt is 4k card. 6800xt is capable just for W1440p. 10% faster memory for AMD give 10% more FPS - so 100% memory bandwidth bottleneck. In some games at 1080p 6750xt is faster than 6800xt. 20gbps for 7800xt will give 25% more FPS and 10-15% more mhz ~40% faster than 6800xt (20% better IPC compensate 20% less CU/wgp). 7900xt is 30% faster than 6950xt or 60% than 6800xt. 40% faster successor at similar price($699 vs 649) is perfect ....
@@hristobotev9726 I don't understand why you're saying this ? Lol I'm saying the 7900xt is the replacement for the 6800xt . Not that it's competing with it lol of course it's faster than the older card it's replacing lol
@@PCgamingbenchmarktime 7800xt will be 6800xt replacement/successor. 7900xts are 6900/6950 successor. Same price (actually $100 less) 50% more performance
@@hristobotev9726 you're fooled by name dude lol . The 7900xt is even more cut down than the 6800xt was from the 6900xt lol don't. E do ignorant. They're using the 7900xt name so they could increase the price from $649. 6950xt doesn't have a successor yet, that will be sometime next year. We already know they have a more powerful card planned. Don't be so ignorant lol
7900xtx will compete with the 4080ti for $350 cheaper and the 7900xt will compete with the 4080.
you'd love to see a 749 price adjustment but i wont hold my breath...
Getting the 13 Dec off to make sure I get my xtx as soon as it launches in case it's another 2pm like 4090
I was thinking the exact same thing.
Can you imagine what would internet do if AMD named this two cards 7600xt and 7700? But I have to say that 6800 were made only in small numbers because there was low numbers of GPUs with only 60cu working.
When AMD was getting ready for this announcement Nvidia had two 4080s.. Nvidia canceled one, then AMD got caught trying to match with two 7900s.. I believe a day before the release, AMD is gonna lower the price of the 7900xt or maybe they wait for the 4070ti price to be revealed. The fact that AMD is confident they're gonna kick Nvidia ass means something is up.
In first quarter of 2023 will be announced 7800xt (and hopefully 7700xt), so probably something better than 4070ti price/performance will show up. We need to remember that 4070 ti (old 4080 12gb) is trash quality, even on Nvidia provided charts
What die would they use for the 7800xt. N32 has a max of only 60CU, less than the 72CU in the 6800xt.
@@ImaMac-PC 31.. They have the 7800xt 60CU but there's no card in the 70s so the 7800xt is probably there.. There's no card with 16GB so i think the info that's out there is wrong.
"Nobody bought the 6800" is a wrong statement. Sure, nobody bought it when it was selling for 1000 $ or more during the mining boom, but after prices came down, people started buying it. Especially since this summer, when it started selling for 500ish dollars. The 6800 is the sweetspot for 1440 gaming, offering visibly more performance than the 3070 and slightly more over the 3070 Ti.
Excellent analysis that I haven't seen elsewhere, so bravo for the independent thought. I am baffled by the clumsy XTX and XT nomenclature AMD has shown, and the small price difference between them. Your explanation is intriguing. Guess we'll see in a month or so! Thanks.
Thank you!
The boost clocks are only 100mhz apart for the 7900xt and xtx. 2500 and 2400 on AMDs own website. So the 2000mhz on the xt doesn't mean much.
i do agree that the 7900xt at 899$ doesn't priced well enough to incentive you get it over the XTX model unlike with the 6800xt vs the 6900xt, as a guy who own a 6800xt the only way i would consider upgrading is if the price on it will drop at least to 750$ , I really hope that AMD will surprise us all with a Jebaited 2X move and i do believe that by doing that AMD will be disruptive .
I understand that AMD runs business and tries to maximize profit but fair price for 7900 cards would be 849 and 699, taking current world situation in account. NVIDIA is out of their mind with current gen pricing but it was expected due to their trend since introduction of RTX gimmick.
I like your comment mostly. RTX basically means ray tracing model. Ray tracing really isn't a gimmick, Abe. It is the relatively newest and best way to produce as real as possible lighting effects in games. Regardless, it is stupid expensive and nobody should pay 1600 dollars for a card that ray traces natively at 44 fps. Without upscaling raytracing is impossible to play at a decent FPS on any hardware. I think AMD is going to crush Nvidia very soon in all categories. Maybe not this Gen. But the new chiplet design is a step in a direction that Nvidia hasn't even approached yet.
They have no incentive to lower the price on the 7900 XT until NV doesn't drop the price on the 4080 nor the 3090. Not to mention the XTX and the XT costs almost the same for AMD, they're basically the same cards with the same components (maybe a bit fewer VRM-components on the XT, and less mem) so what they really don't want is to people buy that card in high quantities.
This Radeon announcement was a clusterf@ck shitshow. The perf of 4090 surprised AMD and they went into panic mode with their namings.
If these cards battle against the 4080 then they should've been named as 7800 XT/XTX but then these prices would've been too high for AMD 7800 class cards.
If they name them as their performance slots into their own lineup then the XT should've been 7800 XT and $700. Not to mention everybody forget that now AMD has to compete with 530 mm2 silicon vs 379 mm2 silicon (AD103).
They have no idea what they're doing and their engineers failed.
Also everybody hated on NV when they announced two 4080s with completely different specs but now when AMD does the same it's all good... AMD is learning from NV, they don't want to disrupt, they want money.
Btw if they want to jebait they should announce it before Nov 16, just before the 4080 launches. Just so people think twice before buy.
Maybe you are right. Maybe they don't want to disrupt. Maybe AMD is learning from NV to just fall in line and collect money from their 20% marketshare. Maybe that's good enough for them.
you are a smart man Sir
I'll wait for benchmarks but most likely will buy the AMD XTX card.
great to point out, i did not catch this even though i called out nvidia as soon as they announced it, it is bad when amd does it also
N32 based which isn't ready yet. AMD is suffering from overstock as well and is rumored to have not really wanted to release the 7900 series this year, but had previously committed to. H1 2023, it'll exist
6800XT is such a decent card 4 a quite good price
Still a great card. i have a asRock 6900xt formula oc. It's pointless to upgrade right now from a 6700xt and up.
Yes Priced as is the XT is D.O.A. They are planning to launch the 7800XT on a Navi32 DIE Likely with much higher clocks. This way things just do not line up.
Unlikely but, The Greatest "Jebaiting" would be if they are sandbagging RDNA3 performance. Letting Nvidia launch 2 overpriced cards and beating both or
at least matching the 4090 with the XTX. I am sure they will outright win in 1440P and lower. I just hope there is enough supply and I can get my hands on an XTX.
Yeah I would love a 6800 xt gaming z for 550 right now but I'm going to have to wait for a 7700 xt
In mine case 6800 and 6800xt wasn't even available for a year minimal. Only 6900xt was available for some 1400-1500€. So I scratched idea buying new GPU. Last GPU i got was 380x for 280€. For me it was too big jump.
I'm still waiting ;-)
The $900 sure looked rounded up to me. Will have to see how it fares in 1440p, but feels more like all cards are going to have the same performance per dollar ratio, which means the absolute high end becomes ... the value option. 😨
you need 10 million subscribers, you make good videos. I'm waiting to see who will win this gpu war... thank you friend 🙂
Thank you!
Whoever wins, it's the customers that lose.
@@WesternHypernormalization why?
What if we get 7950xtx 34 gb vram????
Why 34? A lucky number?
@@samlebon9884 Cubacore and die system work on different on vram 34 vram is a large number seen on c compare to Nvidia rtx 4090 24 vram
i got a 6800 non TX because i wasted to stay under the 250w TDP range.. :) the XT was only $80 more
Sorry, I should have said have included lower TDP as a reason. It was implied in SFF build but some also just want lower heat output into a smaller office.
I literally made a post on R/AMD on launch day
Basically describing everything this video talks about in short and I got downvoted and nobody listened.
The "7900XT" (7800XT) isn't relevant untill AMD drops it's price and the 7800XT will probably only compete against the 3070Ti.
I agree 100% with every word.
It seems people just take the label and make a quick assessment. I would like to see more discussions of this as well since the 80-series is quickly becoming the new $1000 GPU. The 12GB 4080 was "unlaunched" since it was exposed for what it was with a different die. However, AMD is using the same die and they do not have a worthy generational upgrade to the 6800xt unless you spend $250 more than than last gen. If pricing on CPUs are good, why can't we get pricing on GPUs to be just as good?
the 6800 XT was such a steal
Yes!
That 7900xt should be a 6800xt and cheaper, they have done the same as NVIDIA with the 4080 12gb
I wonder if AMD will unlaunch the 7900XT the way Nvida did with the 4080 12GB. I have heard for months that the 7800XT wasnt expected until Q1 2023 so hopefully that is still the plan. If what your saying is true its curious why they wouldnt just go with the 7900 being the 7800 and targeting the 4070 with it. Even with the last current generation this was the case from a price perspective. The 6900 may have been aimed at the 3090 but it was priced closer to the 3080. AMD needs to just play the value game and not care about who has the better flagship and they will do well. If the 7800XT was this 84CU 20GB VRAM and priced $700-800 it would destroy the 4070.
? it's already launched. it can't be unlaunched. they can just quietly stop selling it and replace it was something else.
In the end, only the Price I really have to pay matters.
These are all Paper Prices and both Cards will smash through my Limit of 1000€ for a GPU.
And I am upset that I had to up the Limit to 1000€ in the first place.
For "899€", the 7900XT will fly right over that Limit by a few hundred Euros.
The 7900XT was overpriced by 50€$ for this Showcase. 849€$ would have looked much better, and as you said, even that would be too high.
If they drop the Price to 749€$, there is a chance that AIB, Taxes, and Retailers will offer the Card for 999€ or slightly lower.
Otherwise, I will have to reconsider a Purchase, and I won't be happy to pay something around 900€ Retail for the 7800/7800XT, and only get maybe ~20% more Performance than the 6950XT.
I agree. Many people have a limit of 1000 for a GPU. I guess we'll find out just how big that market is for exceeding that limit when these GPUs go on sale.
Absolutely agreed.
So 7900xt version of AMD can make same effect as Nvidia 4080...make people buy just most expensive one.
I cant ignore Rdna2 was early prices too optimistic, some of gpus at least, getting real raster advantage over Nvidia with drivers. But overall if you compare them to Nvidia Ampere... but Ampere is already sleeping at bad older prices... Neither Rdna2 is looking currently that great then. Yeah, it dropped in price since release. But its also alot dependent on narrower bus and cache, curious how it get older.
I'm worried that in this generation, only the halo flagship product gets more improvements that the mainstream products, just like Kit Guru says.
Yes, that's been a trend the last few years as the gains on the 70-series and under don't have the massive gains seen on the high end.
Great video and my thoughts exactly. 7900XT might have a chance at $799 even. But gen over gen the fair price would def be $750. Do you think that this might be another Jebaited move by AMD? At launch on the 13th a price drop? Would not be the first time. EDIT - Serves me right commenting half way through a video. You cover this later. LOL
I guess I'm not the only one thinking that could be a good move by AMD.
gen over gen, fair price would be $649, maybe $699.
6800xt is still best value card. But 6800 actually makes sense also, especially lower than 500usd.
As for the matter on video, pricing is just to justify overstock of 6000 series, same as Nvidia on their 3000. But at least to give AMD credit, they dropped prices on 6000 lineup.
And I do actually liked your analysis on this one as many of your videos. Are there any reason for AMD to release 7800xt? 6900xt is 650usd, 6800xt 550, 6800 starting drop below 500.
If 7900xtx is as fast as they said, and by a miracle people don't buy 4080, what Nvidia will do, they won't never lower the prices so fast, and they would f#$% the AIBs that are using expensive materials, and has a lot 3000 inventory.
I doubt Nvidia even cares, They are busy selling Hopper AI chips to China right now. I don't see Nvidia lowering prices for a while. They may lower prices a little bit right before the next gen comes out to clear out any existing stock. This generation is just getting started, AIBs and Nvidia have 2 years to try and sell these GPUs along with any excess Ampere stock.
As if Nvidia cares about AIBs...
I think they will announce/launch the 7800s and 7700s together. Maybe at ces well see something. But i think amd wants to move some more rdna2 stock before they anounce anything.
The navi32 is supposed to have 60cus. So same as the 6800. Given were seeing roughly 30% increase in performance per cu (according to amds numbers) we should see the 7800xt at 60cu clocking in around rx 6900xt/3090. Which coincidentally is about where the 4070ti(old 4080 12gb) will land.
I just want know if they are still planning that 120cu card from 2x navi32 that would be some crazy monster i want to see.
@@zperdek i wouldnt bet on it. Mcm for gaming likely isnt ready to pair compute dies. If it was i think amd would have lead with something like that.
nope, not gonna do it. Have and always will buy last year's flagship for half the price. The generational leap from last-gen flagship to newest-gen mid-tier is not worth the extra 400+$. Picked up the 6900xt for 579$ new. The gap between it and the 7900xt is not worth it in my eyes. and definitely not the 800+ green tax.
They should drop the prices for both, maybe 50 for the xtx
Why? It's already very attractive; compared to Nvidia.
Yes, the price of 7900XT is stupid - it's really just a renamed 7800XT. They need much more aggressive pricing for that performance tier and everything below it.
One thing most people seem to have forgotten about chiplets - they allow for 3D stacking to be viable, due to the way 3D stacking works there are too many difficulties with implementing that tech on monolithic chip designs, but chiplets solve most of those issues. AMD driver code has also confirmed there will be RDNA3 GPUs utilizing the 3D stacking design, but those have not been officially announced yet (Don't expect anything like dual GPUs stacked on each other, it will more likely be a Cache stacking design aka V-Cache).
This would be all nice if the 7900xtx wasn’t compared to a 6950xt in amds claims of a 54% uplift granted the difference between the 6900 and 6950 is small I have a feeling the 7900xt is actually gonna be the one that is bought more as it is very hard to justify a 100 dollar performance to cost increase if your only getting a 10% increase in performance maybe even a 15-20% increase is difficult to justify and judging from rdna 2 the performance difference is probably not gonna be much between the 7900xt and the 7900xtx.
There's too many theories flying around for me to believe in any one of them. All of them sound feasible yet are in conflict with each other. AdoredTV predicts AMD will have a higher tiered GPU than the 7900XTX next year to beat the 4090.
All theories on this topic will proven/disproven over time. Just make a mental note now and a year from now you'll know which ones to believe in.
I would guess they're being like Nvidia. They probably have excess 6800 XT stock they want to get rid off and holding off on announcing it. Which I think is just pathetic.
This gpu release for next gen so far hasn’t been too great, glad to see the 7900xt down to $799 or even $779 with that Asrock model, but I was expecting to upgrade my 5700xt. I quickly realized the 6800 or xt would be good, but then I started checking next gen and thought hmm, this is only 4 more CU than the 6950xt, this is weird. That was 2 months ago, now I’ve watched 6800xts and 6950xts dropping on price and being more available and the 7900xt is always available, I still haven’t bought anything because this all feels sooo manipulative with the pricing especially on the 7900xt but at 799 I may as well just spend the extra $200 against the 6800xt or $100 compared to the price of the 6950xt. I do take into consideration powerdraw as this was meant to be just a plug and play upgrade (750w gold Corsair psu) from the 5700xt now that they are super available. I know basically any of the gpus I mentioned will give me a huge boost in performance, with less a boost from the 6800xt, then 6950xt, then the more from the 7900. I just don’t want to buy it because I didn’t like that manipulative marketing. Anyway I still haven’t bought one but I may just buy lower end as I game in 1440p, but buying anytbing less than a 6800 isn’t much of an upgrade from the 5700xt this thing still performs, but I do need to get more vram lol. So I may just turn it into the start of a new build and switch to AM5 socket, meaning buy the 7900xt, upgrade PSU, then start playing. Then start getting next gen cpus, ram, mobo, ect. Then make the switch abs put the 7900xt into the new AM5 build. That being said then I’d put the 5700xt back into my old rig and essentially have an extra decent 1440p and totally fine 1080p gaming computer as a back up or to sell. However I’d really like that back up gaming cpu to have a 6000 series gpu and a 5000 series cpu lol. Sooo I’ll have to at least buy for just the upgrade new cpu, psu, and gpu lol. I’m saying all this for anyone that has been in the same position I am in right now. I really for the life of me can not pull the trigger, I am kind of speaking with my wallet but I also don’t know which way to go with it, and if I should look to buy something for long long term and have a really good backup gaming/streaming/editing rig. It’s like I am having fomo on the 6000 series and just want one, but buying the 6950xt and the 7900xt is just dumb as they are practically identical in a lot of benchmarks and specs, so spending less and getting the 6800 or Xt would make more sense. I guess I could do the 6800xt now or 6950xt, and skip the entire gen lol, but then I’m a gen behind like usual hahaha. I mean let’s be honest, the 7900xt is new, we will be able to buy new ones for a while from now, the 6800xt or 6950xt soon may not be around NEW. So I kind of want both lol 6800xt to just plug and play upgrade (no new PSU), the $580 isn’t much to me. The 6950xt will require the PSU upgrade blah. Now I know technically the TDP was 300w now 315w for the XT, abs system requirement min is 750w, but tbh I wouldn’t trust it lol, not with a 105w cpu as well. So as if just wrote dilemma, still haven’t pulled trigger, but to just take the hour ride to micro center cuz I know I’ll leave with something haha. Any advice for anyone still reading would be appreciated. Thanks in advance if so
I've been disappointed with first gen GPU chiplets. The pricing on the 7900xt is frustrating and it should not cost more than $750. Getting a deal on a 6800xt for around $500 would be my advice however, those deals have dried up since the Holidays. Not sure if your Microcenter has them Openbox from time to time, but that is another way to go.
If you just need more VRAM and are staying at 1440p, you may want to consider a 12GB 6700xt on a sale for $300-$350 to get you through to the next generation (late next year). And you won't need your power supply upgrade!
I think if they do price drop, it will be $799. b/c the price of the the 6900xt was to much for the performance gap over the 6800xt.
I like my moderately priced RX 6800 (non-XT). Maxed out GPU RAM from a non-Nvidia card, I don't have to sign in to manage my own hardware and I'm not buying a product produced by a corporation actively hostile towards me. Just because you don't understand a products value does not inherently mean other people don't value it.
The 6800 non-XT is a good card. Its replacement in the 7800 non-XT will not be a good upgrade.
7900xt is the real 7800xt lol
AMD saw the "4080" 12GB and knew they have Nvidia beat in the midrange and could get away with a price hike on everything but a 4090 competitor.
It depends, if its only 5-10% slower than the 7900xtx it's going to be a 800class gpu, if it's like Nvidia it's not.(like 4090=80 class, 4080 16GB= 70 class at best, 4080 12GB=60 class at best.
maybe 7900XT have wider overclock headroom than XTX ? Just maybe
Given its 2ghz using same die, it probably has.
It could, but just like the 6800 and 5700 before it, they will likely lock it down so that it doesn't approach the performance of the XTX.
In the Netherlands the 7900XTX is about €1250 and the 7900XT is €900, making the XT the better value one by a long shot. It is also cheaper than the 4070TI here.
it would most likely be a tad bit faster than the 6950xt like around 1.5 percent faster mabe a little bit more but not as fast as the 7900/xt
There both faster then the 4080 is why they are both 7900. 6xxx are still being produced along with all am4 cpu's so no reason yet for any other 7k cards.
Exactly. Many people think AMD have only 7000 series GPUs to sell; they have a load of 6000 series in their inventory.
@@samlebon9884 and still making more. You can even still buy am3 bulldozer cpus.
I think AMD should have named the 7900 XTX the 7800XT and the 7900 XT be the 7800 since Nvidia originally had two 4080's. But how things stand now the 7800XT and none XT will take on Nvidia's 4070 / 4070 ti.
600 should be the price cap on a top end GPU. They are just profit gauging.
Nothing wrong with profits
Did people forget nvidia had the 4080 12gb. That's what the 7900xt was going up against but nvidia cancel. So you're wrong when you say amd release 2 cards to go up against a single 4080, but it looks more on purpose since the video is to shit on the 899 price tag. I disagree with the prices anyway. Should be 699 and 849 if amd really care about market share.
XT numbers are out, it's just behind the 4080, i'd say that be the reason, bit of oc might take it on.... maybe, we can hope
I hope it overclocks since we see the 4080 OC is very good.
I don't think it's fair to judge the Navi 31 based on the 5nm silicon 300mm wafer alone. It's 300mm + 222mm of 6nm + interposers or whatever they are using to connect it all. The end product still likely costs as much as a 400-450mm 5nm die, had it all been one piece. On top of that 5nm is newer and more expensive now than 7nm was when the 6800xt launched. 7nm was on it's 2nd generation for AMD. 5nm is on its first generation with AMD. That whole assembly should cost at least as much a Navi21 die, still.
My guess is the 7900xt at $899 was meant to compete with the 4080 12gb at $899
Yeah AMD definitely has a huge opportunity to make a big impact, IF they would be even more aggressive, than they are showing at the moment, with price to performance! But it wouldn't surprise me if they miss up on that opportunity!
AMD does have a way of missing golden opportunities...
They'll give it a price cut when needed and crush price-performance of the competitor gpu . Just like 6000 series . But people will buy nvida no matter how much more it costs compared to the performance .
AMD has one shot at making a great first impression and that is at launch. Being a great buy at the end of the generation does not get noticed by the general population.
I fully agree with the analysis. I do however think that in order to be truly disruptive, AMD should take the classic 699 price point for the 7900XT. The price point traditionally held by some of the best GPUs in the past when it comes to bang for buck in the high end. Nvidia will soon be announcing their 4070Ti for that price (or a bit more) as a huge favour to gamers (despite a price increase from 3070Ti) and AMD can really ruin Nvidia's pricing by bringing the 7900XT at that price (or even undercut it with better performance for less money).
You are right, that is a classic price point...last held by the 1080ti
It's just RX 7800 XT in disguise. They shifted it one tier and added more letters XT and XTX instead of "nothing" and XT to make it look better and higher tier than it actually is and to easier justify price bump from RX 6800 -/XT
I think part of the reason AMD priced the 7900xt at 899 was because they want you to buy the 7900xtx at 100 dollars more. But until nvidia runs out of 3000 series stock, you will have a card that might come close to a 3090ti for 200 dollars less. So I see it as a win-win. You want the best? AMD makes a extra 100 bucks. You just want a 3090ti competitor when you can't get a 6950xt? $899 7900xt. Another thing that wasn't mentioned was the possibility of a higher power, higher clocked card. AMD has already stated that they can push navi 31 higher than the 7900xtx. Personally, I think we will see a 7950xtx before we see a 7800xt.
If they pull this off, AMD all the way even more
This video made my head hurt. The RX 7800 XT is not cancelled, it just hasn't been unveiled yet. Wait till January, 2023. Since the 7900XT/XTX line is not arriving until December 2022.
What will it compete against?
You should be the one hired by AMD to promote their products😆
I totally agreed to 7900XT should be 7800XT and priced at $749
For $100 cheaper than XTX..who would buy that 79(8)00XT..I wouldn't
Great video as always👍
Thank you!
You're forgetting consoles, I think. Amd is in both consoles, and new varieties like "pro" or slim or shaved down "series-es-es X". Their yields are being spread across a wider sector plus they're cheaper and so they're making mad bank in second place without as nasty press as Nvidia taking the brunt of ire. They're in it for the money, and that's what AMD are doing here. Nothing else matters but profit and efficiency.
In the UK 4090 average price £1,800. Looks like the average price 4080 will be £1,500 OR RX7900 XTX average of £1,200 same performance of a 4080.
Yeah, shouldve been 7800 XT for $699 or $649 with only 16gb vram.
There will be a 7800xt and 7700xt next year but want be as good
AMD Graphics are not in it to win desktop GPU marketshare. They basically are a development arm for Sony/Microsoft's game console graphics that happen to put out products in a regular basis to recoup some development costs.
When you look at it like that, AMD's declining graphics marketshare makes WAY more sense. They competed a decade ago because they had to. Once PS4/Xbox One hit was around the same time they really declined. Now with the consoles and contracts, they have no reason to compete.
U shall be proven delusionally wrong in due time
That price cut aint happening till the 4080ti and 4090ti 's are released AMD is going to milk that margin since 4090;s and 4080s are going to be sold out and aibs are going to go nuts on extreme pricing and slapping those expensive 4090 coolers unto anything they can get their hands on.
waiting 9900XT
Ryzen have core level chiplets, RDNA only have memory level chiplets, which is a big letdown.
Gpu cores cannot be seperated without a large performance hit. Cpus work very differently.
You should join their design team. They are desperate for smart people like you. Hurry up, don't waste your time.
@@samlebon9884 Some people's genius is frightening 🤓
Nah they shouldn't call it 7800XT because both are on the same die with slight cutdown. I'm sure if you overclock 7900XT it could reach stock 7900XTX performance just like HD7970/7950 or 290x/290 or 5700XT/5700.
Unlike 4080 16GB vs 4080 12GB where both are on different die and also you won't be able to make 4080 12GB reach 4080 16GB by overclocking, casually.
Here we are 3 months later. 7900 XT is now $799. $50 to go!
In a few more months, I think we'll see those deals and more. However, the damage has already been done to the reputation of the 7900 XT and I still think nobody will buy it. You only get one chance to make a good first impression. Good job AMD Marketing!
I have a 6900 XT and a 6800 XT and I'm thinking about selling them both and getting the 7900 XTX. I just don't know if I should wait for a 7950 XTX. The wife is telling me I got to wait 2 years after my upgrade. And I hate the way Nvidia does their business practices. they are way too expensive I just can't justify over 1,000 for one computer component.
sell the 6800XT to me :)
However, this summer the 6800xt was only $50 more. Why would you not spend the $50 to get the XT?
highly doubtful amd lowers price to $749. they're just nvidia lite at this point.
$749 would make sense without inflation. Inflation is wildly out of control. official stats are about +15% from 2020 to 2022, but real world price increases are about +25% in that time frame.
So really the 7900 XTX is not being sold at the same price, it's being sold at a 25% discount with inflation.
But I agree the 7900 XT is too high. $849 to $799 would sell XT's. $899 won't. It's a fair price at inflation, it's just not competitive with it's own flagship twin.
The premise of comparing the prices with previous gen in an "inflation free" manner is not completely sound though. It made sense back when we had 2 or 3% inflation.
Inflation does not hit all sectors equally. Housing and food is one thing. But what about silicon? Would you please explain to me how inflation has affected the price of CPUs?
@@ImaMac-PC That's an extremely detailed question, about an extremely specific thing, in an incredibly complex system. A bit like "would you explain to me how the advent of single celled organisms led to the evolution of the penguin".
But, 25% is a broad average over 2 years. Official stat is about 15% in that time frame (and that excludes volatile market items, in order to make the number look lower). Food itself is up considerably more than 25% in that time frame, but is being somewhat hidden by shrinkflation & slimmer margins.
Anyway, in simplest possible terms:
- more currency in circulation devalues "all" of the currency.
- the cost of energy is 'much' higher.
- the cost of housing and food is 'much' higher.
- the cost of labor is going to be moved by the price of housing + food.
- everything which is produced is made from labor + energy (where raw materials can also be reduced to the labor + energy needed to harvest/process them).
There's different classes of 'currency', some is more 'theoretical' than others. M1 money is money which is in peoples' pocket, or checking/savings accounts. Has risen over 4 fold in 2.5 years. M3 money, which includes a lot of complex IOU's and hypothetical arrangements and theoretical valuations, has grown by about 35% in the last 2.5 years.
Currently the real world cost of things is being suppressed by the fact that "the average joe" doesn't have much of it. Wages haven't climbed nearly as quickly, and 'median' household savings are actually down, and household debt is up. So while technically the 1% is wildly more wealthy than they were 2 years ago, you and I aren't. And that helps keep inflation at the store down the street, down.
And yes, these shifts are FAR more dramatic than in the past. Basically the inflation of the previous 10 years = the past 2 years.
But currency is only half the equation. Energy is hitting pricing in a big way. And everything which is made, uses energy. And some of that 'big money' does affect the street level inflation, because when coca cola wants to buy a factory from vess or something, they're dealing in those 1%-er inflated numbers, and they need to get their pound of flesh from the margins on what they make from that factory.
And I'm not even going to try to tackle shrinkflation, which makes some segments even worse.
If you go to the store and buy a stapler. It's about 25% more. Some things are more than that. Some things are less than that. But a typical stapler is about 25% more. That's an incredibly simplified end result. What do staplers have to do with housing or energy or food or currency in circulation at various M levels, or wages... ?
"Directly" nothing.
"Indirectly" everything.
Bear in mind that much of this reply is an absolute horrible mess. Fitting an answer to your question in this many words is like having a paragraph to explain quantum mechanics in a 3rd grade school textbook. And that's not a jab at your education level in economics, it's just an analogy of the complexity of the topic vs the space, and how badly it's damaging the reply.
Writing checks which the govt. doesn't have the revenue to cover, has real world consequences. Who paid for all the "stimulus" of the past couple years? Us, when we buy a stapler. Or in this case a graphics card.
But energy is having a somewhat larger effect than the currency situation I think. Both are abysmally bad though. Record setting really. And have been since well before Feb 2022. The only thing which makes the dollar _not_ look apocalyptic, is that so many other global currencies are doing just as bad.
@@ImaMac-PC Or how about a different approach. YOU pick a product. Not housing or food. You pick.
- What did it cost in 2020?
- What does it cost now?
If you cherry pick very carefully, you can probably find something which has gone down rather than up. But generally... you'll end up seeing what I mean.
Housing, food, and energy are excluded from calculated inflation, because they make it look much worse. And they want the stats to look less bad. The 'cooked' stats are that in the last 2.5 years, we're up about 15-16%. Real world more like 25%. Housing, energy and food are 'more' than that.
If AMD want's to disrupt the market, they should half their product prices.
edit: besides that the € price in europe, is always about 300 higher than in dollars. Somethings with pricings on multiple levels.
Disrupting the market is something AMD likes to say. They did it with Ryzen CPUs before. They just don't follow that up with GPUs.
7900XT is DoA, every one knows it, even AMD. This is a GPU that you throw under the bus to cement XTX as the good value. XT will do to $800 and lower.
N32 is most likely for the 7800/7700 XTX/XT series. To me, they lowered the price of the 7900xt and added an SKU above it or comparable to the 6950xt.
Either way, I don't see the big deal. They are going to make a 7800 GPU eventually. All that making a 7900xtx did was ensure they couldn't price the 800 GPU more than $799.
It is better than the 4080, almost doubling in price gen over gen. Then they called the 4060 the "4080 12GB" and priced it at $899. I honestly think they announced the 4080 12GB, so they could specifically "unluanch" it, making it so the $1199 price tag on the 4080 16GB was more or less ignored.
And the fact the 16GB is really a 4070 anyway.
Are you saying the 7800XT is "demoted" and no longer an 80-series class GPU?
What makes a base 800/80 series GPU? Until this gen it always the die below the top with the 80 ti being the top die. We can't extrapolate anything from RDNA2 as how the SKUs will be named, if anything RDNA2 and Ampere are outliers from tradition.
Nah they just waiting for 4080 to get announced and they will announced 7800xt
6800 was not available anywhere. Thats why it didnt sell. I waited mine for a year from order.
That one did disappear and then as mining continued, the 6800xt also became very scarce. Even the refresh in May with 6950/6750/6650 did not include a 6850 version.
@@ImaMac-PC yeah. And with 100€ more you could buy 6700xt compared to my 6800 😆
7800xt is branded as 7900xt & 7900xt is branded as 7900xtx 🤔
Let us thank Ngreedia for that 🤷
I tried really hard to buy an rx 6800 non-xt in january 2021 but there were none available. The only thing I could find within my budget, $700 or less, was a 3060 ti for $620 so I got that.
Of course its not cancelled. It's just not announced yet. Simple reason is that AMD needs to sell through their 6000 series lineup before launching the lower cards in the product stack, otherwise they'd be competing with themselves and cannibalising their own business.