I was stationed in Germany in '73-'74 in a howitzer battery. Our survey section had one along with a M 151 A-2 Jeep. The fuel shut-off broke and you had to get out, open the hood, and pull back on the cable to shut down the fuel pump. Finally I rigged a coat hanger through one of the engine louvers and could reach back from the front seat to shut it down. It had no spare. You had an assembly that mounted between the cab and the trailer which held the two parts in place so you could remove the middle tire to mount as your repair. You could also remove the trailer and operate it as a four wheel vehicle. True to the video, hearing protection was mandatory. Most of them experienced cracked windshields. They mounted the defroster vent in backwards and it blew hot air directly on the frozen glass cracking it. There was a simple fix. The vent was mounted backwards from the factory. You removed it and reinstalled it correctly and there were no more problems.
As an experienced Goat herder (1985 - 1989), I ... ...have too many stories for a comment section. I do, however, have one correction and and a few comments to add about this marvelous beast. Correction: When talking about the drive/transfer case levers, you intimated that power was sent to the front axle in two wheel drive. Actually, two wheel drive sends power to the center tires, with six wheel drive then adding the front and rear wheels. Comments: When steering (and not power steering, by the way), the rear wheels turn at 50% of the front wheels. While the Goat will not jackknife on itself, reversing the vehicle with a single axle trailer (a towed Vulcan, for example) attached can and will cause said trailer to jackknife in a proverbial heartbeat. At speeds in excess of (roughly) 20mph, the Goat will flip over faster than an old postal jeep in a sharp turn. The articulation joint folds up like an accordion, the inside center tire rises up, and, for the hapless driver, the horizon becomes a vertical line instead of a horizontal one quite quickly. Regarding parking on a slope with the tanks half empty: the two fuel tanks are cross-connected, but the fuel pickup for the engine is only in the left (?) tank. Parking with the right tank down results in all of the fuel leaving the left tank, leaving the fuel pickup high and dry. I should go.
would very much like to hear your stories. I am fascinated by any "out of the box" engineering and small details about the operation of maintenance of said contraptions.
I was looking at the diagram of the transfer box thinking is he SURE the power in 2WD mode goes to the front...? And I did think that the rear wheel didn't look as turned as the front, but I passed it off as just perspective, so nice to know i was right.
I too loved the Goat. Driver from 1974 - 1976. Took it from Ft Lewis to Coronado NAB (flown in a C130). The Navy dug a huge pit to show how to free a high-centered vehicle...but it wouldnt high-center. Took in in, up and over the pit in 6-wheel low with no problem. Had me go over the top of the pile from the side where it peaked, and because of the articulation of the center wheels, it wouldnt get stuck either. They didnt mention in the video that the center wheels, if lifted off the ground, will almost meet in the middle.
Same here. Loved that thing. I was a AR medic in Ft. Huachuca, AZ 84-86 until I went RA. Pretty loud but could tackle any mountain. The rear A/C never worked though.
@@pauld9555 What unit? I was serving time as AT Platoon Leader in 3-60 Infantry (Second Brigade) until a slot opened in 2-77 Armor when we did ALFAT at Coronado and flew down from McChord to North Island in C-130's. After we finished with Coronado, we spent a month with the Gyrenes at Pendleton. Second Brigade had 2-77 Armor, 2 (Mech)-60 Infantry and 3-60 Infantry. So how did we keep up with tanks and APC's? Simple. We were joined at the hip with 9th Combat Aviation as the Divisional Air Assault Battalion. Even got allocations to send people to Air Assault School at Ft Campbell.
My dad, SGT John Sandahl, was a mechanic in the Regular Army during the Vietnam era, (he did not get sent to Vietnam) and afterwards served 21 years in the National Guard as a wheeled vehicle mechanic. He worked on this machine and he hated it. He cited its being underpowered and extremely mechanically complicated for the reasons.
That rekindled some memories. Among other things I've been an ambulance driver in the 82nd, late '70s-early '80s. I can say I've exited the same aircraft as my vehicle. Hearing protection, what? You'll have to speak up. I'm not remembering the hearing protection thing, but clearly a good idea. Did I mention they beat the hell out of walking? Goat riders on the storm!
I joined the 82nd in 83. yea we had to have hearing protection via regulations to be in the drivers compartment. were you by chance with the 307th? I started there till I transferred to 1/508. as a medic, my worst memory of these vehicles was the number of times that troops rolled them. usually on that slippery as wet shit red clay at Bragg and too much speed. the survival rate of crew and passengers if that thing rolled was next to zero. if you didn't get thrown you got crushed.
Bragg, 79'-80 Medic, 3/4 ADA( Vulcan/Redeyes ) I liked the Goat. All six turning, in low the thing would go up anything. At 60 MPH the tires started to produce a bit alarming vehicle bobbing frequency. Never had to do work on it.
I spent a few years towing Vulcans in one of these. I know I am the minority when I say these were fun. The required a lot of work to keep running, especially the breaks which were waterproof and had to be bled and adjusted through a drain plug in the hub. One thing I was very surprised you didn't get into was the truss kit, a replacement for having a spare tire. This was a brace you use to connect the front and back eliminating the articulation joint and you would then swap the flat tire with one of the middle ones. I know you are reading from the manual, but they could hit 60 on the freeway. We drove three abreast through Tacoma on I-5 towing our Vulcans, racing to see who could get back to Ft Lewis first.
My unit in Korea had several M561 assigned to it in the late 80's. The thing I remember most about it was the Motor Sargent throwing tools at it when he had to work on them. That plus the several time he would shout at it after receiving a cut on his hand and arms, that "Gama Goats bite."
As a new 2LT I had four of these things. They would go anywhere, but were indeed loud as hell (aural protection was mandated). I never saw one stuck on the ground ..... did see a couple stuck up in trees (I was in the 82nd Airborne). Saw one take off across the motor pool without a driver -- fuel cut off valve was left in and someone bumped it with another vehicle (Diesels start on compression as well as glow plugs). We could never keep the stupid "stop" button in the back working--every vehicle required a Safety Dead-Line sign off from the commander. They were hard as hell to do even basic maintenance on. Oh, what a blessing the HMMWV was!
It was the only vehicle that you didn't have to drive to hate it. The only good point it had was it gave you a 15 min warning when Top was bring chow. In my company, if you screwed up you became the driver until someone else screwed up.
Well, your 1SG was a dick. My guy always made sure to feed his troops. It was a goal I aspired by. Even though I was a lowly E7. But hey, we can bring food, too. And I do, do hate that POS. I lost 3 friends, and I don't GAS
2 stroke Detroit diesel engine. The engines that make it sound like you're going 100mph+ to anyone that can't see you..... Even though you're only going 20mph at 1/2 throttle
"attracts attention at shows", because everyone at the show can hear it no matter where they are or what else is going on. I remember seeing (and hearing) these things around Schofield barracks when I was in high school. We didn't have hearing protection on while passing lines of them on Kam Highway.
And, is one of the most reliable, power dense engine designs in history. If it wasn't for the Nazis at the EPA, they'd still be using them for on-road vehicles to this day.
MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA! My 1954 GMC PD4104 is powered by an inline DD671. I absolutely love it. Yeah, it's a Greyhound bus, but one that can take off from a standing start with no throttle input and climb a 19% grade. An absolutely beastly motor. And I drove an M113A2 in the Army. It was also DD powered. It used a 6v53, I believe. I loved driving that too.
The Blizzard of 1975 in OMAHA NEBRASKA was 28" + of Heavy snow. I was stuck in my Ford 6000 Louievill with 6 tons of its own. AND It's own Detroit. in. On the corner of 50 and L street, 3 am in the morning and the M561 AMBULANCE was the on;y thing moving. It was Pushing SNOW 1/2 Way up on the front windshield and White smoke coming out the rear heater. Very Impressive!
I was a light wheel mechanic in the Army in the 80's; my squad leader used to tell us epic tales about these things and how horrible they were both to drive and to work on. Never saw one in person because they were long gone by then, but now that I've seen one...... yeah, this thing is a beast in more ways than one. Mainly the noise level, with no firewall or any kind of soundproofing between it and the crew compartments. How did this thing ever get approved for field use??? Great video, as always!
The US Army has a tippity-top-secret Division which has total control over everything. We called it the Department of Dirty Tricks. Geoff Who notes he once got an assignment he wanted, and they sent him to a unit with lousy moral.
I was in the 6/56th ADA in Germany 1983- 85 and we had our radar systems mounted on the rear. We never really had any problems with ours as long as you stayed out of the water. The would go just about anywhere and were kinda fun to drive, of course we did not have to work on them.
I was with 565th Ord in Germany. We supported the SHORAD unit at Ramstein (2/60th) and they had these things too with their FAAR radar systems mounted on them. They were pretty incredible as far as being able to go anywhere and not get stuck. From the mechanics in our heavy wheel shop, the biggest mechanical issue with them was the center differential and axle assembly was kind of fragile.
Ahh, the Goat. All the manuverability of an aircraft carrier, all the stealth of a flaming clown, and it floats as well as any other chunk of masonry. Well known for being a source of 3-53 engines and wheels for those looking to get a bit more oomph from their M37.
The Army was still using these during my first enlistment in the mid-late 80's. I was in an M110 8-inch SP unit and our commo section had one and there were a few more scattered across the battalion.
Sounds like my enlistment in Germany, HQ 1st BN 76 FA 8 inch artillery. I was in in the Radio section, 31V. We had a Chevy Blazer and a Gamma Goat. Our NCO drove the Chevy and stuck me with this POS.
I can just imagine being a patient in the back of an ambulance version of that thing: “Where are you hit?” “WHAT?” “WHAT?” “WHAT?” Patient gets to aid station, had wound and now is also deaf.
let's not forget the awful ride. if a seriously wounded soldier was in the back of those things the ride could kill him. forget it if you are trying to keep his spine intact.
@@jic1 I drove the ambulance version that had the heater but it never actually had a heater because every time I got one installed it would get stolen :/
@@abntemplar82 Jeeps weren't any better for stretcher rides. Especially if the medics slept on the stretchers, you'd just sink until you hit the braces. So glad when we finally got HMMVW's.
I had a goat for a couple of years in the Army. It was a decent vehicle and very good off road. The engine was loud and underpowered. I can't imagine getting in and out of one today, but when I was 19 it was only a minor inconvenience.
Cool another Goat operator. I liked mine, ours was used to transport our 81mm Mortar and crew down in the Panama Canal Zone 77-79. It never let me down, went through some tough marshy, jungle vegetation too. Take care fellow goater.
I drove one in in Germany back in the early 80's. Put me firmly in the hate camp. My engine was so boned out that it could never keep up with the convoy on the Autobahn. They would either leave me behind or tow me with a maintenance truck.
I believe we are starting a polytheism we can provide the Chieftain with another name and he can work beside Gun Jesus. Maybe Military Vehicle Ares? Something god of war related? I'm sure the internet will come up with something.
It was missing the M16 mount on the passenger door. That sticks in my mind because we had a gamma roll over and the m16 mounted on the passeger door injured the passenger. Ever see the front site on a m16? Imagine that getting driven through your thigh. Yeah...ouch!
I'll share an interesting story about the Gamma Goat.. While doing a TDY with my state's NatGuard supporting fire fighters, we drove Goats around with various supplies for the fire fighting crews. One day, we were told that one of our fellow goat drivers had been in an accident with a logging truck.. So we drove out to the scene where we found a fully loaded logging semi truck flipped over on its right side, and the damaged goat on the other side of the road. Apparently, our guys were entering the roadway and couldn't see the logging truck barreling (as they often do) down the road, and the Semi struck them on the passenger side front wheel at a likely 55mph.. The impact spun the Goat around 360 degrees and put a nice dent in the front crew compartment and broke the right front wheel mounting.. Both crew members were shaken, but unharmed. It was sent back to Boise to be repaired, which probably didn't require much effort. The Semi? I'm sure it was a total loss.. No word was available on the truck driver's condition, but I'm fairly certain he survived as well.. Moral of the story.. A Gamma Goat vs Logging Semi.. Gamma wins.. game set and match... ;) Personal note.. They were kind of fun to drive, but the ear-splitting noise of that engine would leave you vibrating for hours, despite wearing full hearing protection (head muffs).
An interesting concept that should never have gotten past the field trials stage. Did the same job as commercially built CUCVs that were far easier to operate and about 1/4 the cost.
We used these a lot in the army. They were loud as hell and slow and the engine always revved so high that it sounded like it was about to explooooode...BUT, it would go just about anywhere.
Until you tried to pass a convoy around a blind curve and found a big honking german truck going the other way...Good thing I stayed in my tank that day. Didn't like the GOER, either. Didn't lose anyone in one of those but I could haul six pallets in my deuce, could only ever fit 5 in a GOER.
It made it's film debut in Stripes. It didn't have power steering, which made it a cast iron bitch to drive. The throttle would get stuck, so the other person would have to climb on the back, open the hood and free it. To quote Moriarty, from Kelly's Heroes, "It's a piece of junk".
2 stroke detroits are incredibly efficient...........at converting fuel to noise! Side note, that's an aluminum block / iron head engine I believe, and a standard gm 4 speed truck transmission.
Andrew W MacFadyen, if you look at the Nebraska tests from the tractors powered by Detroit (GM) diesels, they provided very good fuel economy, much better than the early (pre 1960's) 4 cycle diesels. This is without the benefit of a turbocharger. They also don't have problems with head sealing and electrolysis that most of their contemporaries had. They can be serviced and overhauled in the most primitive and unsanitary conditions. They also are relatively easy starters, even in adverse conditions.
Winfield Johnson um... cause they're made of aluminum? I believe only used in this application, but I may be in error. They also made aluminum block 6v53's
That's interesting. I'm a retired bus mechanic. In my early years of turning wrenches, I became fairly familiar with DD's, including some straight 6's with no turbo's, or blowers. I've never seen one with an aluminum block. I don't have any familiarity with military applications,but was under the impression that a DD was a DD, including marine applications....Well, if you're correct in this, I've learned something today....
My Aunt and Uncle were both MSgts in the Army when this vehicle was adopted and it was their go-to service horror story about the Army procurement system in-place at the time. Apparently, none of the service personnel who tested the vehicle found anything good about it, but the top-brass (and their civilian bosses) had been sufficiently "compensated" by the manufacturer to push it through to a contract.
Tim and Max, not even particularly overpriced as compared to other fighters. A new-build F-18E costs just as much. And isn't as good. The "Trillion Dollar" sound bite is stupid, it includes all the costs to operate and maintain THE ENTIRE F-35 FLEET FOR FIFTY YEARS.
Max, Tim and Mish, whislt its fun to argue the merits of the F-35 programme, is anyone suggesting that the Military-Industrial-Complex hasn't corrupted American Government to its core? Sitting here in Ireland on the other side of the Atlantic, I can still hear the spinning sounds of all the revolving doors in the Pentagon and Congress. If I was an American tax payer it would all be very frustrating.
Stephen - Is it wise or practical to disarm? Clearly, no. Therefore, having the best possible equipment is the least we can do for the guys and gals that may be called into using it to defend the country. You, sitting there in Ireland have the luxury of being defended by other countries. As they say in the southern US, "you ain't got no dog in this hunt".
Roll overs. Never mind the noise and all their other virtues, this thing LOVED to roll over and play dead. Well, without a roll-cage, the driver didn't have to play very hard. There is supposed to be a steering governor; a device that prevents the driver from turning too sharply at high speed. Well, it did not work. Driving down a road at 40 or so, a quick twitch of the wheel to avoid a turtle could flip you on your back; front and rear wheels counter-steer! This is great on muddy ground at 7 MPH, not so nice on hard-pan at 40... Seen three roll-overs, two fatalities and all under 50 MPH. I loved training at Fort Hood in the 1970's...
I was an army wheeled vehicle mechanic 63B from 72-75 and during AIT we had one. Part of my schooling was vehicle recovery. They had a 30 foot trench and my instructor told me to drive right at the trench, perpendicular, and don’t slow down. Scary but that gamagoat didn’t skip a beat. Down one side and straight up the other. I’m guessing it was about 60 degrees, on both walls. It was a blast!
I was assigned two Gama Goats during my service in Germany starting in 1975. The first one was just a cargo hauler. Shortly after, I was made Chief Switchboard operator on our Field Mobile Telephone Switch Board. This was designed in a aluminum box that fit perfectly into the front part of the goat, in front of the point of articulation. This switchboard made the goat a little unwieldy and top heavy. The goat was still a go ANYWHERE off road vehicle. These Gama Goats were very very capable of going anywhere a jeep went. That is saying a lot. I think they had three cylinder two stroke engines. These little diesels made a lot of noise, but still acceptable. It had a two range 4 speed transmission. These things were rudimentary. I would equate running one of these with running a farm tractor from the same time period. I liked mine. It never broke down, which was amazing. You know how the military is, their tiered echelon maintenance system was perfect and followed to the letter. I don't know what use they would have in the civilian world, but maybe a rancher might have use for one. They would hold a advantage over your typical side by side ATV because of what it could haul. I changed the oil on mine one time. These things had a water tight hull. First I had to remove a 6 inch circular metal plugs that threaded into the hull. Then, there was about a foot between the hull and the drain plug on the oil pan. I finally got it. I got oil all over my fatigues and I asked the NCO if I could wash my fatigue shirt in gas. He said it was ok. He just be careful. So, I got a small metal wastepaper basket, put my oil soaked shirt in it, and poured MOGAS on top of it. Then I rinsed it in water real good and just turned it in with my regular laundry. It came out good.
I was a mechanic working on Goats (83-87), and I hated them. Just a few reasons beyond the ear splitting noise of the engine: 1. The master cylinder was right over the brake pedal (logical place) but we used silicon brake fluid (slicker than teflon) that spilled on the clutch and brake. Made it tough to operate or climb out of the vehicle... 2. No spare tire! Instead there was a center axle lift kit and struts to lock the carrier to the cab. If you had a flat, the drill was to use the struts to lock the carrier and cab together so they no longer moved around the articulation joint. Then jack the center axle (and wheel) off the ground and use the lift kit to hold the axle suspended above the ground. Remove the good center wheel, roll it to the flat wheel, jack up the flat and swap wheels. Move the flat to the center axle and drive away. Simple, right? 3. Many, many, many U-joints that all required lubrication. I remember counting them and losing track of the number at about 64 or so. With so many U-joints, it wasn't unusual to miss a lot of them when lubing the vehicle so the Gamma Goat would break them and throw prop shafts, just because it was a Goat. 4. The bilge area under the engine would fill up with oil and rain water if the bottom plugs were left in the carrier. It was dark under the engine and hard to tell if the hull was full of water... until the wrench you dropped made that splashing sound and disappeared. On the other hand, that bilge pump would shoot a stream of water about 15 feet. Great fun if you timed it right and hit the switch as someone walked by...
Former Goat Driver in Central America 82', 83; 84'. Despite the noise, there wasn't any jungle or terrain it wouldn't handle while in my hands and we SWAM them. That was sketchy. Loved this vehicle (with a pair of noise pro on ). Fun to drive off road. Thanks for the walk down memory lane. AIRBORNE All The Way
That thing looks like some brilliant engineers got 1/2 through the design & engineering phase and then the amateurs took over to cobble together the final product. Some really clever designs and layout but with a flawed execution by someone that's never turned a wrench. Like if John Browning gave me the 1st drawing of the 1911 and told me the theory of the system and then said "it's all yours, make the production model.... I've gotta go."
No, it looks like some brilliant engineers got 100% through the design & engineering phase, and then it went straight into full production and service without any serious field trials. It would have actually *benefited* from some "amateurs" having a say in the final product.
Speaking of Browning, one might argue that his early versions of High Power (namely M1922 Grand Rendement) would be much better of being given to someone else to start production rather than evolving like it did into Saive's final design.
Great video!!! Brought back memories. Was in US Army from 1981-2001 and road around in these things a few times. Yep - if riding in the cab, definitely had to wear hearing protection for the sound of that engine was deafening. Also had to use arm/hand signals just to communicate with each other. Riding in the back - do not ever remember that STOP button ever working. Usually had to throw something at the driver in order to get his/her attention. Think this vehicle was finally fazed out of the inventory sometime around the very late 1980s or very early 1990s when enough HMMWVs to replace them all - I was in a Combat Engineer Battalion, so we had our stuff a bit longer than infantry, armor, etc.. You mentioned the old CUCVs - yep, drove those things as well.
I had the joy of driving one of these monstrosities while I was in the army 81-89. I was the only one in my battery they would trust to drive the stupid thing. I personally saw three of them tipped over in ditches. It required some skill to get from point A to point B in one piece, backing up was an adventure. Even after I reached E 6 as I was the only one licensed to drive it I would have to crawl up into the driver compartment with no roof or doors and freeze to death for as long as it required, then rush back to my FDC in time to run some fire missions. Those were the good old days
Don't know how I missed this until just today. We had only a couple of Goats in our motor pool in Germany in the early 70s. The only time I ever saw them go out was on field maneuvers - around once each year. I now have and drive one of the few operational ones in private hands - a 1970 ex-USMC model. It's a shockingly capable vehicle off-road - but must be religiously maintained. I have owned it for over 20 years but have only swimmed it one time, down a boat ramp and across a calm lake. The main reason I won't do it again is that mine is equipped with a winch - which weighs around 500 pounds. To swim it I have to snug up an empty 55 gallon drum with the winch to help float the nose of the tractor up.
I would never swim one, if it were mine. The slightest ding or dent in your tailgate, and your watertight integrity is gone forever.... there's no way to make it right. As a former mechanic, I would love one, living here in the boonies of the Philippines, it was made for this part of the world. It would have to do a lot of fording, but nothing serious. How hard is it to find parts, for you?
@@markcollins2666 The tailgate is an issue - not because of leaks - but because it's the only major body part made of steel instead of aluminum. I'm on my second tailgate, kept rust-free only through my constant attention. Some difficult parts I have gathered as they are available and stored over the years. I have maybe 3-4 new soft tops, etc. Others are easy - some of the Detroit 353 internals and gaskets, etc are available from any DD dealer; and some are common to other vehicles. The wiper blades for instance are the same Trico models used on a lot of early busses. I modified the water-vulnerable steering box with a zerk fitting to accept Mystik JT-6 grease instead of gear oil - and on and on.
Seems the Canadair vehicle(also known as the Dynatrac) may have been better the better vehicle if developed. The British Warthogs would be a similar type of vehicle. It may sound silly for Canadair getting involved but you have to know it was owned by General Dynamics at the time which also owned Convair too surprisingly. At the time the "not made here" was a big part of US purchases and only Canadian STOL aircraft managed to by pass that rule, during the Vietnam period, where if it was not made in the US, it was not accepted. The Dynavert is another good example, which was ahead of it's time but was not accepted because it was "not made here"
I served from 76 to 97 as a DAT (Dump Ass Tanker)... All the "Line Dogs" I knew hated both the M561Gama Goat & the M520 Goer Cargo Truck! To add "insult to injury..." Nothing worst than a injured Soldier being "evaced" in an M792 Gama Goat Ambulance! He's already in "pain" just beat him to near death in the back of one of these! TANKS for the Memories! :)
Brings back memories. Had the pleasure of riding around in one for about a year while the XO of an HHC for an Armor Brigade in USAREUR. Loud as hell but could go just about anywhere. And yeah, I’m sure it is part of the reason for the ringing in my ears to this day. Hearing protection really didn’t help.
USMC '74-'78 ... Got fortunate to be driving LVT P-7 Amtrac ... However once out I became a volunteer firefighter ... We had 3 of these with 200 gallon water tank in the trailer set up to spray foam ... Great to run on the beach and fighting dune grass fires ... I LOVED IT ...
I received my first military drivers license in this vehicle. I was in S-3 at Ft. Polk, Louisiana and we used it as a radio rig. I drove it through swamps and it does float. It's very loud with the 3 cylinder Detroit and you needed earplugs! I would love to have one to go get firewood in! Miss my Goat!
My Goat used to kick out of 4th gear when I exceeded 55 mph. I loved driving on and off road with it all over Hawaii. I wish I had one now. Great video.
The steering wheel used to be larger. Made it easier to steer, but rubbed your shirt clean thru. You should try to fire drill with the soft top on. My driver, had one, refused to get out except to go potty. My MTOE listed my 1SG as the driver. Was not going to order him out. He was a good sport. Did follow the requirement that it was his out past range road. Otherwise, I kept him in a jeep much as I could with a driver. TOW mounted jeep company, plenty of Mutts and trailers around.
I had Gamma Goats in my AZ Army National Guard Unit (8 In. Howitzer (SP) Battalion HQ) way back in 1979-1982. They were loud AF, and we loved them... they could go anywhere in the desert (we never took them swimming). Of course, I never had to maintain them (besides our motor stables). God this brings back memories...
My dad was an artillery Capt in the NJ National Guard, and used to talk about towing his guns with the Gamma Goat. This was LONG before the internet, so I never actually saw one before.
You can get a Goat stuck. This was accomplished by a Marine in 29 Palms CA. As the story goes this individual decided to take a "shortcut" and realized the wash they were crossing was deeper and not as wide as they thought a little too late. They ended up wedging the Goat in the bottom of the wash with all 6 tires digging and spinning. Apparently it took an M 88 recovery vehicle lifting the Goat out of there in order to free it.
I drove one of these in the Army , One of the nicest features the GAMMA GOAT had a super compound 6 wheel drive LOW GEAR , this baby could crawl up any hill over Rocks anything!
This looks a lot like some of the experimental vehicles that the British were playing about with in the 1930's and which were discarded. It's hard to believe that anyone would regard this as practical.
I believe the Brits had a forward control Land Rover with a powered trailer at the same time. Because of the VW van, forward control was popular around that time.
Bringing back nightmares and stories. Probably would have been OK if the Army could have figured out if you were required to Lube the u-joints or not. Seemed that the policy changed every month. My last memory was being evacuated from Sicily drop zone in a medivac Gamma Goat and having it break down half way to the hospital. Also felt every bump on my broken hip.
I was assigned one of these during my time with the 1/17 AirCav, 82nd ABN(75 -'78). I can not thing of anytime this it let me or this mission down. I miss that old goat!
Had the unfortunate opportunity to drive that particular vehicle for our FDC for a brief time. Hated that vehicle. Was glad to see it go. When I was in the 7th Infantry Division, we would do live fire at Camp Robert's California. On this particular day, we did some direct fire with our M119 howitzers, and low and behold, on the impact area, to my joy were a herd of Gama Goats! What a great time it was blasting the crap out of them! A 105mm HE round is more than adequate! Good times.
I was in the 2nd Bn, 2nd Infantry, CSC company 4.2 mortars 84-85. If there was a 4.2 mortar conversion kit, I never saw it. We just threw everything into the back, the camo nets were on top of the equipment, and us on top of the camo nets, trying to get some sleep as we moved to our next firing position. We loved the goats, they would go anywhere, but swimming them was not a good idea. Lots of fond memories sucking down diesel fumes and Yakima dust. I can still hear the high pitch whine of that engine.
I've always kinda wanted one. From a collector's standpoint, it's a neat little vehicle. It's relatively small, as military vehicles go, it's wheeled, tracked vehicles aren't road legal where I live, and, those little Detroits are easy to work on, and, find parts for.
Maintenance nightmare. During my days as a combat support company maintenance officer in a tank battalion and then later a cav squadron maintenance officer, my guys usually found a way to keep these things deadlined. LOL
I remember driving one of these things around back in '85. The thing I remember most is that it needed another gear in between 2nd and 3rd. It sure was a lot of fin to drive, that thing would go just about anywhere!
Back in 1983-85 we had two gamma goats at 1st. Batt. 3rd Marines. They were out portable coc for radio command and control of our line company's. They were loud, required maintenance, but would take you just about anywhere you needed to go! One driver in motor t, filled the trailer full of water and floated in it! It was the summer at kbay, Oahu. It was hot, and he had did some maintenance on it! When command said they are doing away with them, the floater cried with disbelief, he even wanted to buy it!
The driver positioning pro and con sounds like the same of a high-rise penthouse suite. A wonderful view of the surrounding area. Also a wonderful view of the mushroom clouds after MAD has been enforced. Both are wonderful views......
Dear Chieftain Last time I was home in England, I visited the Muckleburg Collection in Norfolk (I think the largest private military museum in Britain) and they had one of these running and you could have a fast and exciting ride over a rough bit of hilly ground near the North Sea. By the way it is an excellent museum and you can even arrange to drive a tank (I drove an Abbot SPG!)
A sound I remember well. The Army was still using these as late as 1984. Specifically, 4-40 Ar Bn at Ft. Carson with the 4th ID (Mech) as ambulances and command vehicles. (Command vehicles had wooden sheds built on the carrier to house radios and officers) They were replaced by M113 variants.
My comms platoon in 1/8 FA (Automatic Eighth) had M561 for each wire team which worked great as they really could go anywhere. The M561s for the RATT (Radio Teletypes) rigs where another story. RATT rigs had large shelters on the trailer to hold the equipment and operators. Still could go anywhere as long as it did not tilt to one side or the other. Very top heavy.
Here in Mexico we have some hand me down Gamas. I've been on these on the September 16th Parade when I was in the Mexican Navy Marines. Thanks for the memories Chieftain.
I was stationed in Ft Ord CA in 1982 7th ID. My company went down to Camp Robert's CA to train weekend warriors. One night after training some of us were allowed to go the EM Club. We took a quarter ton a duece and a half and a goat. At the end of the night we started back to the bivouac area. I jumped in the jeep because a Samoan corporal that was two sheets to the wind insisted on driving the goat. The jeep was in the lead. We were hauling ass down a dirt trail when we couldn't see the goats lights behind us anymore. We turned around and headed back and found the goat laying on its side and drunk soldiers littered on the trail. Luckily no one was seriously injured. We had those goats on their 3 wheels plenty of times but this was the first time we flipped one.
Someone once related to me the story of how, prior to a base inspection, the order came down to dig a ditch with a D-9 Caterpillar bulldozer, drive one of the base's Gama Goats into the ditch, then cover it over with the dirt from the ditch. I forget the exact reasoning.
I remember having to take a 2 week class just to learn how to drive, and fix the goat. You forgot to talk about the brace & truss kit. Goats did not have a spare tire. If you got a flat you would install the brace on one of the middle wheels then use that wheel to replace the flat. You would use the truss to lock the cab to the cargo end.
There was one at a Marine Corp reserve unit in Houston back in the late 80's. All of the Nam era guys told us young ones all of the legends. One day they got with the Army reserve center next door and the mechanics got it back running again. Nothing better to do, I guess.😊
Obviously I'm catching up on older videos. I was given a Goat to haul demo and pyrotechnics across the Imjim River in Korea, late 70s, to set charges and smoke pots to simulate arty. The Goat and driver were from another unit and both unfamiliar to me. Loaded up and set off across the river in an incoming tide. We had to swim for about 50 yards and the vehicle felt sluggish when we finally got the wheels on the bottom. When we finally got to the first demo site I climbed out and saw that the cargo bed was quarter full of water. Turns out that the tail gate seals were crap and the driver didn't know anything about drain plugs. When we were done with the mission, I took the log book and scrawled across the dispatch, DO NOT SWIM.
7th Infantry Division, Fort Ord, California. 1984, I was assigned a GOAT to haul my 107mm mortar squad. I was previously mechanized in Germany and so, I hated this thing. However, 6 months after arriving at Ord.....Uncle Sugar started converting us into "Light Fighters". We turned in ALL our vehicles. Our nearest training area was Fort Hunter Ligget, 90 miles away. It took three days to walk to training and another three days walk back. I really missed my GOAT, then.
Two things I recall about them was that there were about 130 grease fittings on it and maybe a third of them were reachable. The other was that a GG driver needed to have a second knee joint installed on his right leg that worked in reverse so that he could get in and out of the driver's seat.
Loved the Gama Goat.... Also, loved our mechanics who did all the repair work on the things. Though everyone was happier getting some old beat down M548 replacements. Since anything from the M113 line was super easy to work on, especially the covered wagon cargo version.
Another problem with sitting on the front axle is getting bounced all over the landscape. In a military vehicle with no consideration for crew comfort, a 5 point harness might be a good idea.
my dad was heavy machine operator/mechanic in Vietnam early 70's and absoulutely hated these. Guys had the idea, 'if I break it, I dont have to use it'.
Back in the early 1980’s a buddies dad bought a gamma goat for his farm. The vehicle was a blast when it ran properly, it was a nightmare to work on, hydraulic systems, fuel systems and electrical systems that seemed to break down because it was Tuesday at 4pm. But it would climb all but the steepest inclines, and was near impossible to get stuck. The family used it for farm work for about two years before selling it to a military veteran and collector of military equipment.
I was in a ARNG Duster unit and had one in our motor pool in '86-'87 and I never saw it driven and I think it had to transported to be turned in because it didn't run. The running commentary was it had a hourly 7-1 maintenance to operational ratio much like an aircraft.
Had one at our ASP in Benning in 94. No one was allowed to drive it except the one person who had a license. It was our 1Sgt. I heard many stories from Vietnam guys in my unit who used to use them all of the time.
A friend has one, he broke a linkage in the front, took years to get new/used one.. I can say it is fun to drive around in, his didn't have muffler and is so loud you need ear plugs..
Was expecting to see Ian in the background towing that Bofors
YES I was thinking the same.
I wanted to see it mounted in the bed
Yep
Ian’s are everywhere soon we will take over the world. Fear the Ian’s
Same.
I was stationed in Germany in '73-'74 in a howitzer battery. Our survey section had one along with a M 151 A-2 Jeep. The fuel shut-off broke and you had to get out, open the hood, and pull back on the cable to shut down the fuel pump. Finally I rigged a coat hanger through one of the engine louvers and could reach back from the front seat to shut it down.
It had no spare. You had an assembly that mounted between the cab and the trailer which held the two parts in place so you could remove the middle tire to mount as your repair. You could also remove the trailer and operate it as a four wheel vehicle. True to the video, hearing protection was mandatory. Most of them experienced cracked windshields. They mounted the defroster vent in backwards and it blew hot air directly on the frozen glass cracking it. There was a simple fix. The vent was mounted backwards from the factory. You removed it and reinstalled it correctly and there were no more problems.
As an experienced Goat herder (1985 - 1989), I ... ...have too many stories for a comment section. I do, however, have one correction and and a few comments to add about this marvelous beast.
Correction: When talking about the drive/transfer case levers, you intimated that power was sent to the front axle in two wheel drive. Actually, two wheel drive sends power to the center tires, with six wheel drive then adding the front and rear wheels.
Comments:
When steering (and not power steering, by the way), the rear wheels turn at 50% of the front wheels. While the Goat will not jackknife on itself, reversing the vehicle with a single axle trailer (a towed Vulcan, for example) attached can and will cause said trailer to jackknife in a proverbial heartbeat.
At speeds in excess of (roughly) 20mph, the Goat will flip over faster than an old postal jeep in a sharp turn. The articulation joint folds up like an accordion, the inside center tire rises up, and, for the hapless driver, the horizon becomes a vertical line instead of a horizontal one quite quickly.
Regarding parking on a slope with the tanks half empty: the two fuel tanks are cross-connected, but the fuel pickup for the engine is only in the left (?) tank. Parking with the right tank down results in all of the fuel leaving the left tank, leaving the fuel pickup high and dry.
I should go.
would very much like to hear your stories. I am fascinated by any "out of the box" engineering and small details about the operation of maintenance of said contraptions.
Nah you should stay and tell us more stories!
Martin Wessling tell us more! So much more interesting than the usual comments
I was looking at the diagram of the transfer box thinking is he SURE the power in 2WD mode goes to the front...?
And I did think that the rear wheel didn't look as turned as the front, but I passed it off as just perspective, so nice to know i was right.
That vehicle sounds more of a mess than the Chieftain explained it. Thanks for the info! No wonder why it was not very well received.
I don't care what the haters say. I really liked the Goat.
(But, then again, I was light Infantry. ANYTHING beats walking.)
I too loved the Goat. Driver from 1974 - 1976. Took it from Ft Lewis to Coronado NAB (flown in a C130). The Navy dug a huge pit to show how to free a high-centered vehicle...but it wouldnt high-center. Took in in, up and over the pit in 6-wheel low with no problem. Had me go over the top of the pile from the side where it peaked, and because of the articulation of the center wheels, it wouldnt get stuck either. They didnt mention in the video that the center wheels, if lifted off the ground, will almost meet in the middle.
Same here. Loved that thing. I was a AR medic in Ft. Huachuca, AZ 84-86 until I went RA. Pretty loud but could tackle any mountain. The rear A/C never worked though.
@@luisgomez5049 AC?
What Army vehicle ever had working AC for more than a couple of weeks a year?
LoLoLoL
OO-Rah!
@@pauld9555 What unit? I was serving time as AT Platoon Leader in 3-60 Infantry (Second Brigade) until a slot opened in 2-77 Armor when we did ALFAT at Coronado and flew down from McChord to North Island in C-130's. After we finished with Coronado, we spent a month with the Gyrenes at Pendleton. Second Brigade had 2-77 Armor, 2 (Mech)-60 Infantry and 3-60 Infantry. So how did we keep up with tanks and APC's? Simple. We were joined at the hip with 9th Combat Aviation as the Divisional Air Assault Battalion. Even got allocations to send people to Air Assault School at Ft Campbell.
My dad, SGT John Sandahl, was a mechanic in the Regular Army during the Vietnam era, (he did not get sent to Vietnam) and afterwards served 21 years in the National Guard as a wheeled vehicle mechanic. He worked on this machine and he hated it. He cited its being underpowered and extremely mechanically complicated for the reasons.
That rekindled some memories. Among other things I've been an ambulance driver in the 82nd, late '70s-early '80s. I can say I've exited the same aircraft as my vehicle. Hearing protection, what? You'll have to speak up. I'm not remembering the hearing protection thing, but clearly a good idea. Did I mention they beat the hell out of walking? Goat riders on the storm!
I joined the 82nd in 83. yea we had to have hearing protection via regulations to be in the drivers compartment. were you by chance with the 307th? I started there till I transferred to 1/508.
as a medic, my worst memory of these vehicles was the number of times that troops rolled them. usually on that slippery as wet shit red clay at Bragg and too much speed. the survival rate of crew and passengers if that thing rolled was next to zero. if you didn't get thrown you got crushed.
Charlie Co. 782 Maint. Bn says Hi
HSC 307th Med. I remember the 1/508 motor pool just outside the back gate the Med motor pool. Or was it the 2/508...?
Bragg, 79'-80 Medic, 3/4 ADA( Vulcan/Redeyes ) I liked the Goat. All six turning, in low the thing would go up anything. At 60 MPH the tires started to produce a bit alarming vehicle bobbing frequency.
Never had to do work on it.
I was down the street (Ardennes) in 18th abn corps arty driving one of those goats full of radio equipment. Where have the years gone?
I spent a few years towing Vulcans in one of these. I know I am the minority when I say these were fun. The required a lot of work to keep running, especially the breaks which were waterproof and had to be bled and adjusted through a drain plug in the hub. One thing I was very surprised you didn't get into was the truss kit, a replacement for having a spare tire. This was a brace you use to connect the front and back eliminating the articulation joint and you would then swap the flat tire with one of the middle ones. I know you are reading from the manual, but they could hit 60 on the freeway. We drove three abreast through Tacoma on I-5 towing our Vulcans, racing to see who could get back to Ft Lewis first.
As I remember there were half a dozen of them screaming down the freeway... LOL I was going the other way on I-5
And if you had a good mech at the motor pool they could tune a Goat to hit 65mph!!
Hahahahahaha that's awesome!
Loser bought the beer?
That's Wild!
My unit in Korea had several M561 assigned to it in the late 80's. The thing I remember most about it was the Motor Sargent throwing tools at it when he had to work on them. That plus the several time he would shout at it after receiving a cut on his hand and arms, that "Gama Goats bite."
As a new 2LT I had four of these things. They would go anywhere, but were indeed loud as hell (aural protection was mandated). I never saw one stuck on the ground ..... did see a couple stuck up in trees (I was in the 82nd Airborne). Saw one take off across the motor pool without a driver -- fuel cut off valve was left in and someone bumped it with another vehicle (Diesels start on compression as well as glow plugs). We could never keep the stupid "stop" button in the back working--every vehicle required a Safety Dead-Line sign off from the commander. They were hard as hell to do even basic maintenance on. Oh, what a blessing the HMMWV was!
Sorry LT. The only 3 guys I lost on active duty, I lost in these peaces of shit.
"Gun it! They're gaining on us!"
"No. I would rather die than gun this engine"
You got that right.
I’m a hater. That bitch was louder than any other vehicle in my battalion, including m109s.
It was the only vehicle that you didn't have to drive to hate it. The only good point it had was it gave you a 15 min warning when Top was bring chow. In my company, if you screwed up you became the driver until someone else screwed up.
Well, your 1SG was a dick. My guy always made sure to feed his troops. It was a goal I aspired by. Even though I was a lowly E7. But hey, we can bring food, too. And I do, do hate that POS. I lost 3 friends, and I don't GAS
Cool story bro
2 stroke Detroit diesel engine.
The engines that make it sound like you're going 100mph+ to anyone that can't see you..... Even though you're only going 20mph at 1/2 throttle
"attracts attention at shows", because everyone at the show can hear it no matter where they are or what else is going on. I remember seeing (and hearing) these things around Schofield barracks when I was in high school. We didn't have hearing protection on while passing lines of them on Kam Highway.
And, is one of the most reliable, power dense engine designs in history. If it wasn't for the Nazis at the EPA, they'd still be using them for on-road vehicles to this day.
We had some of these when I was on active duty ('71-75). At one point I recall an order was put out that the drivers had to wear hearing protection.
I imagine a Cummins 4bt would be better although nowadays someone would put a 6.0 LS twin turbo in it with 900 Horses....lol
MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA! My 1954 GMC PD4104 is powered by an inline DD671. I absolutely love it. Yeah, it's a Greyhound bus, but one that can take off from a standing start with no throttle input and climb a 19% grade. An absolutely beastly motor.
And I drove an M113A2 in the Army. It was also DD powered. It used a 6v53, I believe. I loved driving that too.
The Blizzard of 1975 in OMAHA NEBRASKA was 28" + of Heavy snow. I was stuck in my Ford 6000 Louievill with 6 tons of its own. AND It's own Detroit. in. On the corner of 50 and L street, 3 am in the morning and the M561 AMBULANCE was the on;y thing moving. It was Pushing SNOW 1/2 Way up on the front windshield and White smoke coming out the rear heater. Very Impressive!
Awesome 👍
I was a light wheel mechanic in the Army in the 80's; my squad leader used to tell us epic tales about these things and how horrible they were both to drive and to work on. Never saw one in person because they were long gone by then, but now that I've seen one...... yeah, this thing is a beast in more ways than one. Mainly the noise level, with no firewall or any kind of soundproofing between it and the crew compartments. How did this thing ever get approved for field use???
Great video, as always!
The US Army has a tippity-top-secret Division which has total control over everything. We called it the Department of Dirty Tricks. Geoff Who notes he once got an assignment he wanted, and they sent him to a unit with lousy moral.
I was in the 6/56th ADA in Germany 1983- 85 and we had our radar systems mounted on the rear. We never really had any problems with ours as long as you stayed out of the water. The would go just about anywhere and were kinda fun to drive, of course we did not have to work on them.
I was with 565th Ord in Germany. We supported the SHORAD unit at Ramstein (2/60th) and they had these things too with their FAAR radar systems mounted on them. They were pretty incredible as far as being able to go anywhere and not get stuck. From the mechanics in our heavy wheel shop, the biggest mechanical issue with them was the center differential and axle assembly was kind of fragile.
Money exchanged hands.
Because of US corruption and incompetence
Ahh, the Goat. All the manuverability of an aircraft carrier, all the stealth of a flaming clown, and it floats as well as any other chunk of masonry.
Well known for being a source of 3-53 engines and wheels for those looking to get a bit more oomph from their M37.
Well ya know on paper....it looked great. But so did the M16.
In 1995 I got to watch one get blown up at Graferwoehr in a simulated mine strike. It was glorious.
That was the best hope a goat could aspire too.
*LOL....*
Hope to hell it was my old bbde 4 502 43 would pay for video of it
Did that damned engine arch into the grungy skies of Graf? I wash I had been there!
The Army was still using these during my first enlistment in the mid-late 80's. I was in an M110 8-inch SP unit and our commo section had one and there were a few more scattered across the battalion.
Sounds like my enlistment in Germany, HQ 1st BN 76 FA 8 inch artillery. I was in in the Radio section, 31V. We had a Chevy Blazer and a Gamma Goat. Our NCO drove the Chevy and stuck me with this POS.
Oh Bugger, the truck is on fire!
Oh bugger, the truck is SINKING! Geoff Who fixed it for you.
Oh, no worry, that's the purpose of life vest.
Oh bugger, the truck is sinking and all the life vests are on fire!
OH, no worry. Crews already escaped.
Oh Bugger, my goat is on fire!
I can just imagine being a patient in the back of an ambulance version of that thing:
“Where are you hit?”
“WHAT?”
“WHAT?”
“WHAT?”
Patient gets to aid station, had wound and now is also deaf.
let's not forget the awful ride. if a seriously wounded soldier was in the back of those things the ride could kill him. forget it if you are trying to keep his spine intact.
I bet you that the insulated top he mentioned for the ambulance version wasn't just to protect from the weather, but also to muffle the engine noise.
jic1, if it was it did a shitty job of it.
@@jic1 I drove the ambulance version that had the heater but it never actually had a heater because every time I got one installed it would get stolen :/
@@abntemplar82 Jeeps weren't any better for stretcher rides. Especially if the medics slept on the stretchers, you'd just sink until you hit the braces. So glad when we finally got HMMVW's.
I had a goat for a couple of years in the Army. It was a decent vehicle and very good off road. The engine was loud and underpowered. I can't imagine getting in and out of one today, but when I was 19 it was only a minor inconvenience.
Cool another Goat operator. I liked mine, ours was used to transport our 81mm Mortar and crew down in the Panama Canal Zone 77-79. It never let me down, went through some tough marshy, jungle vegetation too. Take care fellow goater.
I drove one in in Germany back in the early 80's. Put me firmly in the hate camp. My engine was so boned out that it could never keep up with the convoy on the Autobahn. They would either leave me behind or tow me with a maintenance truck.
The vehicle looks cute, then you started explaining the details ...
I understand the troops more and more.
Tank Jesus is now Military Vehicle Jesus
Needs longer hair....
Wouldn't make military uniform requirements. Geoff Who notes his hair style hasn't changed since he was three...
I believe we are starting a polytheism we can provide the Chieftain with another name and he can work beside Gun Jesus. Maybe Military Vehicle Ares? Something god of war related? I'm sure the internet will come up with something.
The internet always finds a way...
so....
It was missing the M16 mount on the passenger door. That sticks in my mind because we had a gamma roll over and the m16 mounted on the passeger door injured the passenger. Ever see the front site on a m16? Imagine that getting driven through your thigh. Yeah...ouch!
:0..
the 3 prong? yep. ouch!
I'll share an interesting story about the Gamma Goat.. While doing a TDY with my state's NatGuard supporting fire fighters, we drove Goats around with various supplies for the fire fighting crews.
One day, we were told that one of our fellow goat drivers had been in an accident with a logging truck.. So we drove out to the scene where we found a fully loaded logging semi truck flipped over on its right side, and the damaged goat on the other side of the road.
Apparently, our guys were entering the roadway and couldn't see the logging truck barreling (as they often do) down the road, and the Semi struck them on the passenger side front wheel at a likely 55mph..
The impact spun the Goat around 360 degrees and put a nice dent in the front crew compartment and broke the right front wheel mounting.. Both crew members were shaken, but unharmed.
It was sent back to Boise to be repaired, which probably didn't require much effort.
The Semi? I'm sure it was a total loss.. No word was available on the truck driver's condition, but I'm fairly certain he survived as well..
Moral of the story.. A Gamma Goat vs Logging Semi.. Gamma wins.. game set and match... ;)
Personal note.. They were kind of fun to drive, but the ear-splitting noise of that engine would leave you vibrating for hours, despite wearing full hearing protection (head muffs).
An interesting concept that should never have gotten past the field trials stage. Did the same job as commercially built CUCVs that were far easier to operate and about 1/4 the cost.
We used these a lot in the army. They were loud as hell and slow and the engine always revved so high that it sounded like it was about to explooooode...BUT, it would go just about anywhere.
Until you tried to pass a convoy around a blind curve and found a big honking german truck going the other way...Good thing I stayed in my tank that day.
Didn't like the GOER, either. Didn't lose anyone in one of those but I could haul six pallets in my deuce, could only ever fit 5 in a GOER.
Engine didn't really rev high, it just sounded that way because it is a two-stroke. It sounds like it is doing 4,000prm when it is only doing 2,000.
It made it's film debut in Stripes.
It didn't have power steering, which made it a cast iron bitch to drive. The throttle would get stuck, so the other person would have to climb on the back, open the hood and free it.
To quote Moriarty, from Kelly's Heroes, "It's a piece of junk".
There you go again with them negative waves! I'm going to steal the phrase "cast iron bitch". Just thought I'd be polite and tell you.
(5) _"There you go, more negative waves!"_ *-- KELLY'S HEROES [1970]*
😁😁😁
2 stroke detroits are incredibly efficient...........at converting fuel to noise!
Side note, that's an aluminum block / iron head engine I believe, and a standard gm 4 speed truck transmission.
The Rootes (Commer) TS3 2 stroke (worth a google) was also very noisy but it sounded great and was fuel efficient..
Andrew W MacFadyen, if you look at the Nebraska tests from the tractors powered by Detroit (GM) diesels, they provided very good fuel economy, much better than the early (pre 1960's) 4 cycle diesels. This is without the benefit of a turbocharger. They also don't have problems with head sealing and electrolysis that most of their contemporaries had.
They can be serviced and overhauled in the most primitive and unsanitary conditions. They also are relatively easy starters, even in adverse conditions.
Where did you get the idea the Detroit Diesel was an aluminum block?
Winfield Johnson um... cause they're made of aluminum? I believe only used in this application, but I may be in error. They also made aluminum block 6v53's
That's interesting. I'm a retired bus mechanic. In my early years of turning wrenches, I became fairly familiar with DD's, including some straight 6's with no turbo's, or blowers. I've never seen one with an aluminum block. I don't have any familiarity with military applications,but was under the impression that a DD was a DD, including marine applications....Well, if you're correct in this, I've learned something today....
My Aunt and Uncle were both MSgts in the Army when this vehicle was adopted and it was their go-to service horror story about the Army procurement system in-place at the time. Apparently, none of the service personnel who tested the vehicle found anything good about it, but the top-brass (and their civilian bosses) had been sufficiently "compensated" by the manufacturer to push it through to a contract.
Ah yes, the beginnings of the military industrial complex that now runs our government. Which is why we have trillion dollar failures like the F-35.
@@timothyhouse1622 the F-35 is not a failure, it's just over priced.
Tim and Max, not even particularly overpriced as compared to other fighters. A new-build F-18E costs just as much. And isn't as good. The "Trillion Dollar" sound bite is stupid, it includes all the costs to operate and maintain THE ENTIRE F-35 FLEET FOR FIFTY YEARS.
Max, Tim and Mish, whislt its fun to argue the merits of the F-35 programme, is anyone suggesting that the Military-Industrial-Complex hasn't corrupted American Government to its core? Sitting here in Ireland on the other side of the Atlantic, I can still hear the spinning sounds of all the revolving doors in the Pentagon and Congress.
If I was an American tax payer it would all be very frustrating.
Stephen - Is it wise or practical to disarm? Clearly, no. Therefore, having the best possible equipment is the least we can do for the guys and gals that may be called into using it to defend the country. You, sitting there in Ireland have the luxury of being defended by other countries. As they say in the southern US, "you ain't got no dog in this hunt".
Roll overs.
Never mind the noise and all their other virtues, this thing LOVED to roll over and play dead.
Well, without a roll-cage, the driver didn't have to play very hard.
There is supposed to be a steering governor; a device that prevents the driver from turning too sharply at high speed.
Well, it did not work.
Driving down a road at 40 or so, a quick twitch of the wheel to avoid a turtle could flip you on your back; front and rear wheels counter-steer!
This is great on muddy ground at 7 MPH, not so nice on hard-pan at 40...
Seen three roll-overs, two fatalities and all under 50 MPH. I loved training at Fort Hood in the 1970's...
I was an army wheeled vehicle mechanic 63B from 72-75 and during AIT we had one. Part of my schooling was vehicle recovery. They had a 30 foot trench and my instructor told me to drive right at the trench, perpendicular, and don’t slow down. Scary but that gamagoat didn’t skip a beat. Down one side and straight up the other. I’m guessing it was about 60 degrees, on both walls. It was a blast!
I want one to commute to work every day.... I live on a terraced street and go to work at 5am.
I was assigned two Gama Goats during my service in Germany starting in 1975. The first one was just a cargo hauler. Shortly after, I was made Chief Switchboard operator on our Field Mobile Telephone Switch Board. This was designed in a aluminum box that fit perfectly into the front part of the goat, in front of the point of articulation. This switchboard made the goat a little unwieldy and top heavy. The goat was still a go ANYWHERE off road vehicle. These Gama Goats were very very capable of going anywhere a jeep went. That is saying a lot. I think they had three cylinder two stroke engines. These little diesels made a lot of noise, but still acceptable. It had a two range 4 speed transmission. These things were rudimentary. I would equate running one of these with running a farm tractor from the same time period. I liked mine. It never broke down, which was amazing. You know how the military is, their tiered echelon maintenance system was perfect and followed to the letter. I don't know what use they would have in the civilian world, but maybe a rancher might have use for one. They would hold a advantage over your typical side by side ATV because of what it could haul. I changed the oil on mine one time. These things had a water tight hull. First I had to remove a 6 inch circular metal plugs that threaded into the hull. Then, there was about a foot between the hull and the drain plug on the oil pan. I finally got it. I got oil all over my fatigues and I asked the NCO if I could wash my fatigue shirt in gas. He said it was ok. He just be careful. So, I got a small metal wastepaper basket, put my oil soaked shirt in it, and poured MOGAS on top of it. Then I rinsed it in water real good and just turned it in with my regular laundry. It came out good.
We blew one of those up with an anti-tank mine. To show the soldiers how powerful they were.
I like that you had to show how powerful an *anti-tank* mine is. Can’t just take its name, purpose and form factor for it, people need a demonstration
@@lovelybraintoaster164 It was damn impressive I can say that pieces of the goat went 500 meters in the air.
I was in the Army for 4 years 81-85, all I can remember about these is that they were extremely loud and they never seemed to leave the motor pool.
I was a mechanic working on Goats (83-87), and I hated them. Just a few reasons beyond the ear splitting noise of the engine:
1. The master cylinder was right over the brake pedal (logical place) but we used silicon brake fluid (slicker than teflon) that spilled on the clutch and brake. Made it tough to operate or climb out of the vehicle...
2. No spare tire! Instead there was a center axle lift kit and struts to lock the carrier to the cab. If you had a flat, the drill was to use the struts to lock the carrier and cab together so they no longer moved around the articulation joint. Then jack the center axle (and wheel) off the ground and use the lift kit to hold the axle suspended above the ground. Remove the good center wheel, roll it to the flat wheel, jack up the flat and swap wheels. Move the flat to the center axle and drive away. Simple, right?
3. Many, many, many U-joints that all required lubrication. I remember counting them and losing track of the number at about 64 or so. With so many U-joints, it wasn't unusual to miss a lot of them when lubing the vehicle so the Gamma Goat would break them and throw prop shafts, just because it was a Goat.
4. The bilge area under the engine would fill up with oil and rain water if the bottom plugs were left in the carrier. It was dark under the engine and hard to tell if the hull was full of water... until the wrench you dropped made that splashing sound and disappeared.
On the other hand, that bilge pump would shoot a stream of water about 15 feet. Great fun if you timed it right and hit the switch as someone walked by...
Thank you for sharing! :D
Former Goat Driver in Central America 82', 83; 84'. Despite the noise, there wasn't any jungle or terrain it wouldn't handle while in my hands and we SWAM them. That was sketchy. Loved this vehicle (with a pair of noise pro on ). Fun to drive off road. Thanks for the walk down memory lane. AIRBORNE All The Way
That thing looks like some brilliant engineers got 1/2 through the design & engineering phase and then the amateurs took over to cobble together the final product.
Some really clever designs and layout but with a flawed execution by someone that's never turned a wrench.
Like if John Browning gave me the 1st drawing of the 1911 and told me the theory of the system and then said "it's all yours, make the production model.... I've gotta go."
you'll find that to be a big problem with engineers who have never been out in the field, and spent their time poking at calculators.
No, it looks like some brilliant engineers got 100% through the design & engineering phase, and then it went straight into full production and service without any serious field trials. It would have actually *benefited* from some "amateurs" having a say in the final product.
Speaking of Browning, one might argue that his early versions of High Power (namely M1922 Grand Rendement) would be much better of being given to someone else to start production rather than evolving like it did into Saive's final design.
More like profiteers
Great video!!! Brought back memories. Was in US Army from 1981-2001 and road around in these things a few times. Yep - if riding in the cab, definitely had to wear hearing protection for the sound of that engine was deafening. Also had to use arm/hand signals just to communicate with each other. Riding in the back - do not ever remember that STOP button ever working. Usually had to throw something at the driver in order to get his/her attention. Think this vehicle was finally fazed out of the inventory sometime around the very late 1980s or very early 1990s when enough HMMWVs to replace them all - I was in a Combat Engineer Battalion, so we had our stuff a bit longer than infantry, armor, etc.. You mentioned the old CUCVs - yep, drove those things as well.
I had the joy of driving one of these monstrosities while I was in the army 81-89. I was the only one in my battery they would trust to drive the stupid thing. I personally saw three of them tipped over in ditches. It required some skill to get from point A to point B in one piece, backing up was an adventure. Even after I reached E 6 as I was the only one licensed to drive it I would have to crawl up into the driver compartment with no roof or doors and freeze to death for as long as it required, then rush back to my FDC in time to run some fire missions. Those were the good old days
Don't know how I missed this until just today. We had only a couple of Goats in our motor pool in Germany in the early 70s. The only time I ever saw them go out was on field maneuvers - around once each year.
I now have and drive one of the few operational ones in private hands - a 1970 ex-USMC model. It's a shockingly capable vehicle off-road - but must be religiously maintained. I have owned it for over 20 years but have only swimmed it one time, down a boat ramp and across a calm lake. The main reason I won't do it again is that mine is equipped with a winch - which weighs around 500 pounds. To swim it I have to snug up an empty 55 gallon drum with the winch to help float the nose of the tractor up.
I would never swim one, if it were mine. The slightest ding or dent in your tailgate, and your watertight integrity is gone forever.... there's no way to make it right. As a former mechanic, I would love one, living here in the boonies of the Philippines, it was made for this part of the world. It would have to do a lot of fording, but nothing serious. How hard is it to find parts, for you?
@@markcollins2666 The tailgate is an issue - not because of leaks - but because it's the only major body part made of steel instead of aluminum. I'm on my second tailgate, kept rust-free only through my constant attention. Some difficult parts I have gathered as they are available and stored over the years. I have maybe 3-4 new soft tops, etc. Others are easy - some of the Detroit 353 internals and gaskets, etc are available from any DD dealer; and some are common to other vehicles. The wiper blades for instance are the same Trico models used on a lot of early busses. I modified the water-vulnerable steering box with a zerk fitting to accept Mystik JT-6 grease instead of gear oil - and on and on.
Seems the Canadair vehicle(also known as the Dynatrac) may have been better the better vehicle if developed. The British Warthogs would be a similar type of vehicle. It may sound silly for Canadair getting involved but you have to know it was owned by General Dynamics at the time which also owned Convair too surprisingly. At the time the "not made here" was a big part of US purchases and only Canadian STOL aircraft managed to by pass that rule, during the Vietnam period, where if it was not made in the US, it was not accepted. The Dynavert is another good example, which was ahead of it's time but was not accepted because it was "not made here"
Loving the stream of content lately, keep it up!
I served from 76 to 97 as a DAT (Dump Ass Tanker)... All the "Line Dogs" I knew hated both the M561Gama Goat & the M520 Goer Cargo Truck! To add "insult to injury..." Nothing worst than a injured Soldier being "evaced" in an M792 Gama Goat Ambulance! He's already in "pain" just beat him to near death in the back of one of these! TANKS for the Memories! :)
Brings back memories. Had the pleasure of riding around in one for about a year while the XO of an HHC for an Armor Brigade in USAREUR. Loud as hell but could go just about anywhere. And yeah, I’m sure it is part of the reason for the ringing in my ears to this day. Hearing protection really didn’t help.
USMC '74-'78 ... Got fortunate to be driving LVT P-7 Amtrac ... However once out I became a volunteer firefighter ... We had 3 of these with 200 gallon water tank in the trailer set up to spray foam ... Great to run on the beach and fighting dune grass fires ... I LOVED IT ...
I received my first military drivers license in this vehicle. I was in S-3 at Ft. Polk, Louisiana and we used it as a radio rig. I drove it through swamps and it does float. It's very loud with the 3 cylinder Detroit and you needed earplugs! I would love to have one to go get firewood in! Miss my Goat!
A lot of the drivers around here might like it. But they would have to paint it shiny black and put on a resonator in place of the muffler.
My Goat used to kick out of 4th gear when I exceeded 55 mph. I loved driving on and off road with it all over Hawaii. I wish I had one now. Great video.
The steering wheel used to be larger. Made it easier to steer, but rubbed your shirt clean thru. You should try to fire drill with the soft top on. My driver, had one, refused to get out except to go potty. My MTOE listed my 1SG as the driver. Was not going to order him out. He was a good sport. Did follow the requirement that it was his out past range road. Otherwise, I kept him in a jeep much as I could with a driver. TOW mounted jeep company, plenty of Mutts and trailers around.
I had Gamma Goats in my AZ Army National Guard Unit (8 In. Howitzer (SP) Battalion HQ) way back in 1979-1982. They were loud AF, and we loved them... they could go anywhere in the desert (we never took them swimming). Of course, I never had to maintain them (besides our motor stables). God this brings back memories...
Neat vehicle...but it sounds like the manufacturer almost tried to make it as complicated as possible. And JEEZ...THE NOISE!!!
My dad was an artillery Capt in the NJ National Guard, and used to talk about towing his guns with the Gamma Goat. This was LONG before the internet, so I never actually saw one before.
We used them in HHB 2/59 ADA ,in the early 80’s to carry the FAAR(Forward area alerting radars) in the rear carrier ...
You can get a Goat stuck. This was accomplished by a Marine in 29 Palms CA. As the story goes this individual decided to take a "shortcut" and realized the wash they were crossing was deeper and not as wide as they thought a little too late. They ended up wedging the Goat in the bottom of the wash with all 6 tires digging and spinning. Apparently it took an M 88 recovery vehicle lifting the Goat out of there in order to free it.
I have never seen that truck in my life... Thank u 4 showing it!
I’ve always wanted one of these things. Incredible off road capability, extremely complex, lots of maintenance required, it’s perfect for me
I drove one of these in the Army ,
One of the nicest features the GAMMA GOAT had a super compound 6 wheel drive LOW GEAR , this baby could crawl up any hill over Rocks anything!
This looks a lot like some of the experimental vehicles that the British were playing about with in the 1930's and which were discarded. It's hard to believe that anyone would regard this as practical.
I believe the Brits had a forward control Land Rover with a powered trailer at the same time. Because of the VW van, forward control was popular around that time.
Bringing back nightmares and stories. Probably would have been OK if the Army could have figured out if you were required to Lube the u-joints or not. Seemed that the policy changed every month. My last memory was being evacuated from Sicily drop zone in a medivac Gamma Goat and having it break down half way to the hospital. Also felt every bump on my broken hip.
I was assigned one of these during my time with the 1/17 AirCav, 82nd ABN(75 -'78). I can not thing of anytime this it let me or this mission down. I miss that old goat!
Had the unfortunate opportunity to drive that particular vehicle for our FDC for a brief time. Hated that vehicle. Was glad to see it go.
When I was in the 7th Infantry Division, we would do live fire at Camp Robert's California. On this particular day, we did some direct fire with our M119 howitzers, and low and behold, on the impact area, to my joy were a herd of Gama Goats! What a great time it was blasting the crap out of them! A 105mm HE round is more than adequate! Good times.
I was in the 2nd Bn, 2nd Infantry, CSC company 4.2 mortars 84-85. If there was a 4.2 mortar conversion kit, I never saw it. We just threw everything into the back, the camo nets were on top of the equipment, and us on top of the camo nets, trying to get some sleep as we moved to our next firing position. We loved the goats, they would go anywhere, but swimming them was not a good idea. Lots of fond memories sucking down diesel fumes and Yakima dust. I can still hear the high pitch whine of that engine.
I've always kinda wanted one. From a collector's standpoint, it's a neat little vehicle. It's relatively small, as military vehicles go, it's wheeled, tracked vehicles aren't road legal where I live, and, those little Detroits are easy to work on, and, find parts for.
And here I thought my time in the artillery had a negative impact on my hearing...
Drove one back in 1983 for about 6 months. Loud as hell. Loved driving it.
Maintenance nightmare. During my days as a combat support company maintenance officer in a tank battalion and then later a cav squadron maintenance officer, my guys usually found a way to keep these things deadlined. LOL
I showed up at my first duty station in a 67’ Volkswagen Van. I was instantly made a Goat driver… 😂
I remember driving one of these things around back in '85. The thing I remember most is that it needed another gear in between 2nd and 3rd. It sure was a lot of fin to drive, that thing would go just about anywhere!
Back in 1983-85 we had two gamma goats at 1st. Batt. 3rd Marines. They were out portable coc for radio command and control of our line company's. They were loud, required maintenance, but would take you just about anywhere you needed to go! One driver in motor t, filled the trailer full of water and floated in it! It was the summer at kbay, Oahu. It was hot, and he had did some maintenance on it! When command said they are doing away with them, the floater cried with disbelief, he even wanted to buy it!
The driver positioning pro and con sounds like the same of a high-rise penthouse suite. A wonderful view of the surrounding area. Also a wonderful view of the mushroom clouds after MAD has been enforced. Both are wonderful views......
In the movie "Stripes" it was an armored personnel carrier for Warsaw Pact
Dear Chieftain
Last time I was home in England, I visited the Muckleburg Collection in Norfolk (I think the largest private military museum in Britain) and they had one of these running and you could have a fast and exciting ride over a rough bit of hilly ground near the North Sea. By the way it is an excellent museum and you can even arrange to drive a tank (I drove an Abbot SPG!)
A sound I remember well. The Army was still using these as late as 1984. Specifically, 4-40 Ar Bn at Ft. Carson with the 4th ID (Mech) as ambulances and command vehicles. (Command vehicles had wooden sheds built on the carrier to house radios and officers) They were replaced by M113 variants.
My comms platoon in 1/8 FA (Automatic Eighth) had M561 for each wire team which worked great as they really could go anywhere. The M561s for the RATT (Radio Teletypes) rigs where another story. RATT rigs had large shelters on the trailer to hold the equipment and operators. Still could go anywhere as long as it did not tilt to one side or the other. Very top heavy.
Here in Mexico we have some hand me down Gamas. I've been on these on the September 16th Parade when I was in the Mexican Navy Marines. Thanks for the memories Chieftain.
I was stationed in Ft Ord CA in 1982 7th ID. My company went down to Camp Robert's CA to train weekend warriors. One night after training some of us were allowed to go the EM Club. We took a quarter ton a duece and a half and a goat. At the end of the night we started back to the bivouac area. I jumped in the jeep because a Samoan corporal that was two sheets to the wind insisted on driving the goat. The jeep was in the lead. We were hauling ass down a dirt trail when we couldn't see the goats lights behind us anymore. We turned around and headed back and found the goat laying on its side and drunk soldiers littered on the trail. Luckily no one was seriously injured. We had those goats on their 3 wheels plenty of times but this was the first time we flipped one.
Someone once related to me the story of how, prior to a base inspection, the order came down to dig a ditch with a D-9 Caterpillar bulldozer, drive one of the base's Gama Goats into the ditch, then cover it over with the dirt from the ditch. I forget the exact reasoning.
I remember having to take a 2 week class just to learn how to drive, and fix the goat. You forgot to talk about the brace & truss kit. Goats did not have a spare tire. If you got a flat you would install the brace on one of the middle wheels then use that wheel to replace the flat. You would use the truss to lock the cab to the cargo end.
There was one at a Marine Corp reserve unit in Houston back in the late 80's. All of the Nam era guys told us young ones all of the legends. One day they got with the Army reserve center next door and the mechanics got it back running again. Nothing better to do, I guess.😊
14:20 Oh my god, the Gama Goat is on fire!
Obviously I'm catching up on older videos. I was given a Goat to haul demo and pyrotechnics across the Imjim River in Korea, late 70s, to set charges and smoke pots to simulate arty. The Goat and driver were from another unit and both unfamiliar to me. Loaded up and set off across the river in an incoming tide. We had to swim for about 50 yards and the vehicle felt sluggish when we finally got the wheels on the bottom. When we finally got to the first demo site I climbed out and saw that the cargo bed was quarter full of water. Turns out that the tail gate seals were crap and the driver didn't know anything about drain plugs. When we were done with the mission, I took the log book and scrawled across the dispatch, DO NOT SWIM.
At least it got there..
7th Infantry Division, Fort Ord, California. 1984, I was assigned a GOAT to haul my 107mm mortar squad. I was previously mechanized in Germany and so, I hated this thing. However, 6 months after arriving at Ord.....Uncle Sugar started converting us into "Light Fighters". We turned in ALL our vehicles. Our nearest training area was Fort Hunter Ligget, 90 miles away. It took three days to walk to training and another three days walk back. I really missed my GOAT, then.
Something I've never seen or heard of. Awesome thanks C.hieftain
I remember these. You either loved them or hated them. There was no middle ground.
Two things I recall about them was that there were about 130 grease fittings on it and maybe a third of them were reachable. The other was that a GG driver needed to have a second knee joint installed on his right leg that worked in reverse so that he could get in and out of the driver's seat.
Loved the Gama Goat.... Also, loved our mechanics who did all the repair work on the things. Though everyone was happier getting some old beat down M548 replacements. Since anything from the M113 line was super easy to work on, especially the covered wagon cargo version.
Another problem with sitting on the front axle is getting bounced all over the landscape. In a military vehicle with no consideration for crew comfort, a 5 point harness might be a good idea.
my dad was heavy machine operator/mechanic in Vietnam early 70's and absoulutely hated these.
Guys had the idea, 'if I break it, I dont have to use it'.
One of my favorite military vehicles.
I've acquired one in the ambience version what a wealth of information thank you for posting!
🥃cheers🍻
Back in the early 1980’s a buddies dad bought a gamma goat for his farm.
The vehicle was a blast when it ran properly, it was a nightmare to work on, hydraulic systems, fuel systems and electrical systems that seemed to break down because it was Tuesday at 4pm.
But it would climb all but the steepest inclines, and was near impossible to get stuck.
The family used it for farm work for about two years before selling it to a military veteran and collector of military equipment.
Just imagine driving for 30 or 40 miles in that thing, by the time you arrived your ears were still ringing even with hearing protection.
2 stroke Detroits are quite loud in all configurations but also distinctive. There is no mistaking one for anything else.
I was in a ARNG Duster unit and had one in our motor pool in '86-'87 and I never saw it driven and I think it had to transported to be turned in because it didn't run. The running commentary was it had a hourly 7-1 maintenance to operational ratio much like an aircraft.
our FAAR radar was mounted on one of these, many years using one.
Had one at our ASP in Benning in 94. No one was allowed to drive it except the one person who had a license. It was our 1Sgt. I heard many stories from Vietnam guys in my unit who used to use them all of the time.
A friend has one, he broke a linkage in the front, took years to get new/used one.. I can say it is fun to drive around in, his didn't have muffler and is so loud you need ear plugs..
My dad was a Vietnam era 11C mortar man. He had so many horror stories of these things being hard to drive and unstable at any speed.