Boeing 787 AUTOLAND | Aircraft and Avionics Update 2 BETA | MSFS | Real Airline Pilot
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- čas přidán 21. 05. 2023
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The real one, based on the videos I saw on CZcams, also lands at about 100-200fpm. I think that the avionics did a good job here since the plane flared as it is supposed to but the flight model of both 747 and 787 in MSFS makes the AOA catch the wings attitude with too much of a delay, meaning the plane basically ignores your flare in terms of V/S. Very noticeable on a manual landing as well.
I thought i was going crazy, good to know it wasnt just me
The progress of these beta versions is simply outstanding. Hats off to Asobo and the team. Yes, they don’t always get it right, but we must remember that this is a *game* first and a simulator second (breaks my heart to say this but it’s true)! They listen and take yours and others’ feedback seriously. Thank you for these great videos 🎉
A small thing I'd like to correct here: Asobo is not involved into this - they created the base model and systems but besides the model nothing remains untouched. The ones doing the great job now is Matt and his team called "Working Title" which is a Microsoft division.
Also, I really have to disagree with your "game" point of view - every simulator out there without specific (and certified) hardware which is running on a desktop client is basically a game, even XP. However the core sim is indeed a simulator - It simulates the environment, aerodynamic forces and airflow dynamically based on data processed in "real time". Other titles I'd call a(n arcade game) do not bother about that stuff (e.g. Ace Combat) - these use purely vectors to spin the 3D model around and weather has 0 effect on anything.
When it comes to the depth of simulation keep in mind the default aircraft (even when reworked) do not use the full capabilities of the sim - they are just there to provide a solid base for even entry level simmers, not for professionals which always was a thing on Microsofts Flight Simulators as well as on XP at least until XP12 (which of the default aircraft were actually study level? One and a half out of all? (C172 and the half 737-800 WITHOUT Zibo Mod).
MSFS as well as XP are meant to be a platform everybody can enjoy and expand for their needs (using PMDG, Fenix or the Zibo Mod), but these as well as P3D and DCS are not (arcade) games imho in which you can just hop in and mess around ;)
@@deltak5457 @Yo! Half agree here, you can do everything real world, i.e. live weather and traffic. That said, you cannot become a RW (IRL) certified pilot through the sim. It is a pretend world at the end of the day. It is set up as a pay-to-play platform (in-app purchases), and is expected to make money before a succeeding instatement will be considered, much like a film franchise. Actual training sims costs hundreds of thousands, if not millions of dollars, you cannot modify them, and they are not available to the public. Therefore, I have to agree with @Yo! It is indeed a game first.
This is coming from someone who is spending serious amounts of cash on sim controls, components, with a nearly $3K rig which I built specifically for MSFS2020. Latest addition is the ThrustMaster TPR Pedals, and I will continue to spend the $$$ to be as fully immersed as my pocket book will allow. Moreover, I just signed up to go through the SW Virtual Airline cert program via VATSIM.
That said, I do firmly believe that this is a game first. I don't personally treat it like a game, I take it seriously, but that is the truth of it.
@@lowrivera that's basically what I say - every simulator running on a desktop out there would be needed to be called a game if the expensive certified training hardware build around is missing.
Anyway "simulation" in non training terms is a subdivision of "videogames" describing a game which is intended to give a feeling of the real behaviour of something (driving/flying/trading/managing), so for me it indeed is a simulator :)
@@deltak5457 I agree, as a product, this is a simulator first, even Microsoft/Asobo confirmed more than once that is their goal. Sure, people can use it as a game, but that's clearly not what the main focus is. If you can or cannot use it as a "training sim" or get certified is irrelevant. It's still a simulator.
"Asobo is not involved into this"... I wouldn't put it this way, don't forget Microsoft/Asobo are the ones approving and financing these updates to give to the community for free and determining which direction the sim goes. They could do it themselves or hire someone like Working Title. The fact they assigned it to WT, does not mean they are "not involved". But yeah, technically, WT are the ones responsible for delivering the AAUs.
I questioned that early on. About the listening part.. but they really do work on issues and try to fix them.
My two flights were both autolands with the 787 to Hawaii and back to ksfo as I am ten years over the max retirement age and was tired. It worked very nice.
This is very impressive considering its a "default" aircraft, I caved in and installed the beta to test it out !
Let me know what you think of it!
@737NG Driver I did a 10h45 minute flight from Auckland to Tokyo Narita and performed an auto land in Narita as the weather was dreadful it managed the it all pretty well.
Noticed a few issues like with VNAV (too steep descent at times perhaps)
But I am not a 787 pilot and just hold a PPL and an RPAS (commercial drone pilot operations) so by no means an expert my only real life aircraft experience being C152 and C172.
@@SoldierXXL how do you install the beta version?
I’m absolutely LOVING this aircraft! Such a smooth taxi and transition to cruise! Could be my summer sleeper aircraft lol
The autoland feature is one of the most impressive features of modern airplanes! I caved in and upgraded to the premium deluxe version of MSFS (although it was quite expensive and should have just bought this version first) just to get the B787 and it's now my favourite plane on the sim (previously, I loved the A320 NEO.)
Looks very good, thanks for sharing . FYI the HW A330-900 now has VNAV, just completed a 4 hour flight it worked perfect. Perhaps you can do a video on it to let everyone know.
The PMDG 737 has spoiled me. Can't wait for these default aircraft upgrades to go live.
Handy for when I’m too slow getting back after making cup of tea 😂
😂😂😂
What I noticed the most about that landing was that the nose seemed to come down very quickly after the mains. I think it would have made it quite "positive" for the guys in the cockpit as well!
Default MSFS aircraft are getting astonishingly good. They are not capable of simulating non-normal procedures, but for 99% of flight simers who just like to fly from A to B without studying each aircraft's systems in too much depth, the variety and quality is just amazing.
Two maintenance logbook entries: Autoland check ok, and all passenger oxygen masks need to be stowed. ;)
Jokes aside, this looks fantastic. I can’t wait to add this to my hanger, especially being a proven (by Emanuel) comfortable long haul machine.
Another stamp of approval for me, proving that this feels more like an airplane than a random airplane addon, is by you being totally immersed: “Gear down flaps 15. *oh wait it’s not a 737* flaps 20”.
As always thanks for a great video man.
haha, thanks Etai! I'm sure you'll LOVE them!
The nose of the aircraft is at about 4 degrees on touchdown. The automatics do a nice pronounced flare before touchdown. The fact that the vertical speed on touchdown is higher than it should be is presumably due to the lack of lift from the wing / fault of the flight model, not the automatics.
Excellent video. How do you get the outside views for landing?
When you are certifying the autoland you are also certifying the landing gear assembly. Or it could be Boeing’s way of waking up your passengers 😁
Thanks
The PMDG 73s have the best autoland in the game right now I think, but I'm satisfied with the current state in the AAU2 aircraft. I'm sure it'll get better. I honestly depends on it more than I should, especially with the larger aircraft. With the PMDGs I'm instantly high on the approach once I disco the AP and I'm not sure how I can prevent that.
I have yet to try the autoland on pmdg as I love flying it! Maybe next time? 😂😂😂
Emmanuel, great video, but in real life the runway you landed on (runway 02C/20C) is currently closed due to construction works. Next time you fly, the landing runway is 02L/20R (as of May 23, 2023). The WT team have done a great job with this aircraft, can't wait to see it come to the full release.
They don't have a CAT II or III ILS on that runway however. Thus I went for 20C, which at least has a CAT II.
If you would have told me 20 years ago I could get an aircraft with vnav, lnav and autoland capability with the base game (okay deluxe), I'd have laughed at you.
We live in amazing times!
Wish they would fix the rear wheels so they dont partially float in the air
Great video. Would it be possible to show us the steps you take to “set-up” an auto land?
For all I know, you just don't disengage the A/P when you're already in APP mode, it should arm and execute the autoland by itself
Hello so there’s is no frequency to as I’m as the aircraft is doing it by its own ??? Do I have to engage second autopilot??
Nice! I do NOT know the systems here, just wondering; A few seconds after touchdown the general caution light came on. Then, also the general warning light. Bug, or “feature” from something actually happening (or didn’t, but should have) ?
Huge thanks (and greetings from 🇳🇴) for all the insights through so many videos! 👍
The caution is autothrottle disconnect, the warning is autopilot disconnect. Completely normal.
@@user-gf8qs1dg3w Thought so, thanks. 👍
Seems like more of an abrupt air-to-ground transition in the core sim than a problem with the AP itself, the last few seconds of descent looked very slow and gradual when viewed from the outside.
This might be a dumb question. Does autoland trigger automatically whenever you approach a CAT runway with ILS, or do you have to set something up beforehand?
WT took a short root here - normally you have at least to check if you are tuned to the correct ILS frequency (assuming irl the 787s, like the Airbus aircraft tune to the frequency and course themselves using a database).
When established you'd have to activate approach mode (APP) and also arm all autopilots (A/P) available (on the 747-8 it would be 3, on the 787s it's 2).
On this version shown in the video you directly arm both autopilots with one click on one A/P button which is the shortcut mentioned ;)
On older Boeing aircraft you would additionally have to tune NAV1 and NAV2 to the ILS frequency and dial in the runway course using the runway course selectors of the MCP.
@@deltak5457 Thank you. It seems then autoland is triggered automatically, with the AP button toggling all autopilots, unless it's a bug to be fixed. The rest of the requirements are basically done anyway when using ILS approach.
@@gabor-toth from what I read it's intentionally designed this way for ease of use.
All now updated aircraft are also intended to be modified by the community to change stuff like this at least on PC.
@@gabor-toth I haven't tried the 787 yet. But If I set up just a quick custom flight on the world map with the 747. Where you just select the arrival runway and it spawns you in on the approach. As soon as the flight loads. I have to hit active pause real quick. Then go down to the FMC and hit the DEP/ARR button. Select the correct runway, hit EXEC. And then that loads the proper frequencies for the ILS. After that you just hit APP and it autolands just fine. You still have to select the speed manually if you do it this way or it'll come in hot. And remember to set the autobrakes.
Sure this isn't the "realistic" way of doing it. But if you just want to try out a quick and dirty autoland real quick. It works. I started using 28R at ORD to practice since it's a really long runway. And so far the 747 is following the ILS perfectly. LAND3 comes up, the speedbrakes arm automatically and deploy when the aircraft touches down. The flare is reasonable. And with the autobrakes set. It'll track centerline and do the entire rollout basically to a stop on the runway without any inputs on my flight controls. I'm planning on trying out some more in depth stuff soon. But as I said if you want a quick and dirty autoland just to see how it works. This method has worked for me every time.
Does the autopilot have autority on the nose wheel steering(follow the runway's centerline) and the rudder(de-crab in crosswind)?
Does both those things
787 doesnt do decrab like an Airbus does. The aircraft goes into a slip at about 400’ and continues to touchdown in the slipping attitude. It doesnt do the rudder in to straighten etc you get on other aircraft.
Hello, I installed the beta but when I takeoff and land one of the gear suspension does not condense normally, do you have any similar issues?
When to turn on the approach mode?
I have a question, how are you able to download the beta? Where are you able to download it from? I'm new to all this stuff so I'm not certain where I am able to download these avionics.
Just curious why do we line up with the runway center line using the center of the half cockpit rather than using the center of the whole cockpit…I always felt the center of the cockpit is the center of the airplane which is where the nose gear placed at.
Because of parallax from our own eyes. It's acually not that far off, because of the sheer length of the centerline in front of you relative to the distance between your actual seat and the true center of the aircraft, even when you're aiming for the middle of your own seat, it's still relatively centered and only offset for a few centimeters which is negligible. Besides, it's not actually the middle of your half cockpit side. You can see from the video that even though the centerline is in the middle of the pilot half of the cockpit, the ILS indicator was showing that the aircraft is a little bit rolling on the right side of the line.
Not sure about the reference point in the 787. But for me, the true reference point in the A320 is this little screw bolted on the panel on the pilot side instead of the center. As long as the centerline disappears under the cockpit while touching that screw, the wheels are exactly on the middle of the centerline. If you sit in the first officer seat, the reference is also the same, there's another screw at the panel on that side as well separately from the one on the captain's side.
Due to the parallax, when the wheels are exactly on the centerline, the captain will see the line to cross over the screw bolted on their side of the cockpit, while the F/O also see the line to cross over the screw bolted on their side of the cockpit.
@@NeoKingArthur oh thank you！everything make sense now
why is no one talking about the fact, that the gears behaved very odd and missed some key animation on touchdown?
As it's still the beta, let's hope it get's fixed.
Ok so howd you do the replay of the approach to show different angles? I thought this wasnt an option in msfs yet?
You have to enable it somewhere in the options, it’s on beta at the moment
Hi, I don't understand why when the plane flares then it floats on the runway and lands too long. Any suggestions?
You’re supposed to fly the plane right onto the ground, not flare until it eventually settles. You’d only do that in GA aircraft.
Is it just me or does anyone else have difficulty flaring the 787? I found that below 50 feet, before initiating the flare, the plane always has a tendency to pitch down even under the same thrust setting. It's really difficult to maintain the descend rate unless extra force is applied to the control column. Is there something wrong with the aerodynamics of the plane?
This is actually a behavior of the real plane as well. Because the fly-by-wire is speed stable, the system injects a nose-down moment starting at 50 feet RA in order to promote a flaring motion in the yoke from the pilot.
@@mattnischan582 Wow I never heard that before. Thank you so much for your detailed explanation!
The ils course and frequency is input automaticaly?
Cannot speak for the 787 but as it's this way on the 747-8 I think the answer is "yes".
Hello, after getting the MSFS update the checklist on the 787 doesn't work for me. Is there some kind of add-on I need to buy to get the updated 787?
Check for updates in content manager - on initial install of the beta build, the 787 update also needs to be installed (I think as it's premium deluxe etc. as that was not necessary for 747)
I made that mistake on first installing beta and wondered why half the functionality (inc checklists) was non functional...
@@danlance I have premium deluxe but I'll check for updates again
It's available for xbox?
As much as I appreciate mods making planes more realistic in the sim, I would rather land the plane myself.
I'm with you 99 percent of the time. Those solid, fogged in days where visibility is nil? I'm thankful for it. I've used it on the fenix, but never pmdg
My aau2 update doesn’t work on my 787 😭
Did you join the beta?
Make sure you don't have the Heavy Division mod installed.