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Full Power Tuning & Track Testing | 650HP SR20VET Swap | SR86 EP 6 [
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- čas přidán 15. 08. 2024
- What you DON'T want to see a day before you go racing...
0:00 - Ramp Run
0:13 - Full Power Tuning and Track Testing
0:43 - Boost Setup For Endurance Racing
1:58 - Boost Levels
2:28 - Traction Control Options
3:02 - Powerband
3:56 - The Tune
4:38 - Ramp Run 2
4:59 - Track Test
6:52 - Fine Tuning
7:00 - Closed Loop Boost Control Tip
8:03 - Oil Pressure Adjustment
9:07 - Oil Pressure Target
09:32 - In-Car Testing
11:09 - Temperature Issues
12:59 - Engine Bay Footage
13:30 - Big Problems
16:24 - What is Happening?
19:27 - Potential Damage
21:03 - Outro
With engine break-in and steady-state tuning sorted, Andre works his way up to full power ramp runs reaching 593.5HP at the hubs with a conservative tune in the MoTeC M150 controlled SR20VET swapped Toyota GT86 race car. Well, technically still a 'project car' at this point eh!
What do people mean by a conservative tune? As Andre covers he is running things a little richer than he needs to in order to help with cooling and also hasn't pushed things right to the edge when it comes to the ignition timing. This is just because there are a few races in this series and reliability is desired more than outright power, however, there are a few other potential issues that might get in the way of that goal any way it turns out.
Also touched on are some of the things revisited to fine-tune after a track/road session in order to account for the limitations of the dyno, as well as a tip on closed-loop boost control tuning.
The night before practice day we discover a cooling issue might be a little worse than anticipated with potential head and block damage already being done.
Want to learn how to tune EFI? Start here instantly, and for free: bit.ly/EngineT...
Website: www.hpacademy.com
Contact: support@hpacademy.com
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#highperformanceacademy #sr20swap #build #learntotune #enginebuilding101 #dontletthesmokeout #wiring101 #boostcontrol #sr20vet #pushtopass #enginebreakin #firststart #partytime
![More Power, More Problems? | 650HP SR20VE Swap | SR86 EP 8 [#BUILD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/PiAFAmUc3uY/mqdefault.jpg)
![More Power, More Problems? | 650HP SR20VE Swap | SR86 EP 8 [#BUILD]](/img/tr.png)
![Why didn't we just put a K20 in it? | 650HP SR20VE Swap | SR86 EP 11 [#BUILD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cvn2yecI_Bk/mqdefault.jpg)
It’s a tough hand to be dealt but I appreciate you showing us what it really feels like to respond to a disappointing situation and persevere. Best of luck guys.
Mad respect for showing us what goes on behind the scenes as well, even if you're not at your best, all of a sudden it makes your content more relatable because we all go through the same struggles building our racecars.
It is genuinely tough to watch your spirit be trampled like that Andre, with you as someone who is always very upbeat and positive about most things it was sad seeing you so defeated in that moment, hope you can bounce back and that the damage isn't going to set you back too far in your hopes for the season. Best of luck.
Thanks mate, sometimes these cars we build tend to kick us while we're down but it's all part of the 'fun' right? - Andre
@@hpa101 indeed they do, I think they call it... Character building, right?
Man I feel you guys.. this is behind the curtain of every great teams. I love how you guys share all the process transparently. I'm sure you will get this issue resolved soon!
Appreciate it! This car is certainly battling us at the moment but I'm sure we will get it all resolved - Andre
The joys of racing, been in this situation a few times and it sucks big time. But we keep battling away because we love motorsports, chin ups boys and keep moving forward.
First test was a success. Sequential helps get over the bridge in one piece 🤣
Yes, the sequential has fixed that little issue! 😂 - Andre
I learn something every time I watch any video from HP Academy. Y'all have helped get and keep my truck running on the road and track. Thanks so much!
The thing looks like a weapon ! Can’t wait to see it back up and running.
Always Very Informative... Well Done, Andre & HPA!
Once again this is some of the most educational content out there at the moment. Thank you for letting us learn with you.
Glad to see no down votes, that's probably the most honest behind the scenes I've seen in such a long time. Good luck boys. Wishing you all the very best.
"Camera in engine bay for sick shots!!"
"Oh crap what's this..."
15:37 "yeah....I'm not stoked"
Gold
Definitely more gutted than stoked.
One more thing, that dash display is awesome.
Great to be on the journey with you guys, fingers crossed you got it sorted today. Andres comments about removing the thermostat resulting in water flowing to fast were interesting because I have read some info to the contrary. That there is no such thing regarding water flowing too fast through a heat exchanger, it's all about a centrifugal water pump needing some back pressure to get into its operating region, otherwise it's just free-spinning in the water. Or something like that, would be interesting for you guys to dig into one day!
Definitely a rocket ship! VVL!
what a great episode! getting an insight into real world issues, fantastic. best of luck!
Love these, Andre sounds so tired, as someone who blew a motor 3 days before the biggest event of the year and pulled an all-nighter while working a regular job I know how it feels.
Shattering stuff. I really appreciate the honest and genuine content. Can’t wait to see next week.
So sorry to hear that news guys. Best wishes for a quick and relatively pain free recovery. Great video BTW, great production values, quality, content, thanks for sharing the downs as well as the ups.
Man thats devastating to find that out.I feel for you guys, i can only imagine how much crunch time you guys got invested in this.So i wish you the best of luck, let all be well.👍
Bad luck guys. Being on the receiving end of similar news after a really long build, I can feel your pain. Here’s hoping it’s a quick fix and not a total engine write off like it was in my case. Cheers for the content.
Ya Bastards, it's like a cliff hanger on yr fave soap 👌
Best video yet, showing its not all easy even for those who have the ability there are moments of strain. Next video is a must
Wondering all the way from Ireland how it performed?
My 2cents is pulling the thermostat causes you to loose the "pressure head" (of coolant) in the head block that packs coolant tight around the hot spots.....so steam pockets can develop causing localised overheating coolant pressure spikes etc.
That's a fair kick in the nuts for the whole team. Chin up lads. To be fair though it was a BIG ask to essentially have rebuilt an entire car to suit the new doner heart AND have it all shook out before round 1. If I were lucky enough to be in your shoes and had a semi pro team ready to race, id be setting my expectations to be competitive for the last few races of this season at best and then go full tilt into next season...
Good luck lads and keep up the good work and vids! Cheers.
Its a sucky situation but its a releif to see even the pros such as yourselves can still have issues. I have just been through the same situation myself. It was infact your advice that lead me into diagnosing the issue. Good luck with the repair and cant wait to see it back in action . Keep up the awesome content!
Oh man looking at your face on 16.24 really shows how serious the problem is. It sucks hard, but still got to push on.
Awesome series of videos. 👍
Glad you like them! Hopefully more videos with better results soon. :)
Oh mannnnn that's some shit news! Thank god you had that footage and caught it early 🤯 I feel your pain
After this we were in so deep we hit the track anyway after covering all we could of the basics with the time we had. The results were predictable haha - Taz.
@@hpa101 Literally just watching that video now, you had my hopes up in the beginning 😂😥😪
Sorry to see guys but Im glad you still shared this with us. I use to work on a team and this is definitely part of the game sometimes. Keep your heads up and crank it out in the AM.
Thanks mate, it is certainly fighting us a little at the moment - Andre
Devastating stuff, but we've all been there sadly. Loving the story and know you guys will ultimately sort it, being the professionals you are.
Its sort of comforting to know even the Pros who have been dong this for years still sometimes have issues. Makes me feel less bad about any teething issues I have.
Hope theres no serious damage and you can find a way to stop the head lifting and finally have a good competitive drive.
Yeah it's all part of the game. Normally there would be a few extra sensors on the car to help pinpoint things like this a bit quicker too but with the rush to get things done a few things had to be pushed to the side.
While annoying, and expensive, the downers always help make the good times feel that much more satisfying - Taz.
Wow, you boys are legends. Grind it out and get the win.
10:45 glad to see you using 1st gear on the track!!!
A certified ripper! I had to chuckle at the comment "In the meat of the powerband between around 7000 and 9000 RPM". Talk about a high strung endurance racer! Keep the faith and I hope it holds together for your first round with it!
I dig this interim build, and love following the progress - so this isn’t a “should have done this” - but it makes me more amazed how many boosted, basically stock, F20C’s run so long without problems (comparing to SR20VETs which I seem to see a lot with problems).
This is why most Road Racers will drill 1/8 inch hole in their thermostat.... I guarantee you the cooling problems are the cause of the blown head gasket/ warped head. And I really doubt that they're going to make that event. I really hope you guys get to make it to the next event... i suggest buy a couple thermostat's... drill holes in them. Make sure that you have three or four different temps. that way you guys can dial and how it runs. who cares if it takes a little while to warm up and it wants to cool down that's kind of what you want in a road racing car. Best of luck
i admire the honesty in this vlog
Install a pressure sensor in the cooling system and setup a driver warning or boost limiting strategy in the ecu.
We have a coolant pressure sensor installed which unfortunately had an issue during our testing. We have it up and running now and yes, it's great data to have, however once the head has lifted your day is done. The real key is to not get into that situation in the first place - Andre
That track looks like a beauty! Would be fun to drive
That looks mental fast. Great job
Guys this is definitely a tough one. I really appreciate you taking us on this journey with you all, for both the highs and the lows. I hate sappy lines like it only goes up from here, so I’ll spare you all that one and just say, Keep going. Well done to everyone for keeping it together.
Thanks Tyler. I have to say it's hard making videos about the lows, but it's nice to have you all on our journey. - Ben
I have faith, you guys can do it! Fingers crossed for you! I love this built, really want to see the potential!
Thats a bummer when the car ran so nicely , happened to me last year, and over a year later i finally got it together again, i hope you are faster than me :)
Aswome content! Love it
I've been there for sure but have found out on the first lap out on track. Better to know before!
I feel for all the team. big time
That track is beautiful ...
@@alexpatterson5973 pretty sure its the track just outside Queenstown. Highlands motorsport park. That whole area is very picturesque.
@@alexpatterson5973 its worth a visit even as a tourist. Went skiing in Queenstown a few yrs back and visited the track. They have a pretty great museum of cars.
Yep It's Highlands Motorsport Park. 100% worth a visit, I recommend the Track Taxi or the Radical Drive, museum at very least. :)
That SRLYF. Unlucky guys!
What a great video. Can't wait to see the next episode of 486
Even during the lows Im excited to see this thing run and gun. It awesome seeing the success and failures (although I hope I don't have some of these issues with my VE).
Keep pushing lads, it will be awesome when its done. (And who needed a V8 anyway)
Thanks Zappy, we are hoping that giving some insight into our experiences help someone else out. Lots of the time you only hear something if everything is going well. - Ben
Looks rapid, looking good guys
Looking good💪
Appreciate it
Ugh that’s gutting news. Still, good to discover it before the practice session. Appreciate the behind the scenes reality of the situation discussions, felt like we were in the room with you guys. In a sea of unicorns and rainbows the harsh taste of reality coming at you fast is refreshing from an audience standpoint. Sucks the coolant pressure sensor wasn’t working but it seems pretty conclusive for the footage.
How would you proceed with this? Torque the head and go do a quick couple of pulls with the coolant pressure sensor operational? If you weren’t on a time crunch would you just pull the head straight away?
Great video guys .. terrible thing to happen the SR but it goes to show even the best in the business can have failures, we’ll done for the transparency.. best of luck 💪🏻
chin up lads and give it hell. 👌
Looks about ready to clap some cheeks on that circuit. Hell yeah.
Stick to it guys! Enjoying the content
Thanks mate.
Great effort and content 💫
Thank you 🙌
Sr20 rules 👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽
Just a thought! I've had an engine builder tell me to run water only in the cooling system until the coating on the head gasket has had a chance to 'bond' with the block and head. Apparently the chemicals in coolant can interfere with the bonding process causing gasket failure.
Damn she looks quick!!!
Yes, it's a rocket ship compared to the V8 and we haven't leaned on it yet - Andre
I know the feeling, head lift ...massive job
My friends and I got a head gasket done on a 4G63 in 2 hours in the pits once, but the whole team had to come together like a well oiled machine.
I wish you guys the best and try not to stess it youll get it figured out
Im sorry it went this way but as you guys know that’s cars and that’s MotorSport. Andre your comment of “that’s the hopes and dreams of someone with a lifted head “made me laugh hard!
That vet sweet note 😍😍😍
That has got to be the very definition of "Murphys law" 😑 Hope it works out in the end 👍
Man that thing looked quick! shame about the head but fingers crossed its just a re-torque, new gasket and less aggressive boost map
This was all pretty much at minimum boost unfortunately :( Stay tuned for next week and you'll get to see how it all plays out at the race track - Andre
Looks quick 👍 great build
Thanks 👍
Bugger, that sux guys
I think engine is too efficient and needs some blowby. Maybe adding another sensor for crankcase pressure and logging it would be an answer. Water temp. and/or oil temp. to blowby pressure will bring you a safe sitting head? Electric thermosthats can bring you an pwm adjustable water temps. Hey, I just remembered it's running dry sump, but maybe an analog pressure sensor's peaks can tell something in pressure by spark data log?
Another idea, put heat ressistant strain gauges in every spark plug hole(or near between head studs), calibrate at working temps. and use it as a boost and/or timing limiting factor 🧮👋🏼
Blowby is pretty much an unavoidable aspect of any internal combustion engine. We are dry sumped so this helps reduce positive crankcase pressure but regardless, blowby isn't really related to head sealing but rather is a factor related to cylinder pressure and ring seal. We also monitor crank case pressure but this is more for some insight into engine health - Andre
that sr sounds good!
Lets hope its just the headgasket, amazing build btw
It looked so fast too, sorry guys, excited to see you get it all figured out👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽
Thanks mate, it's definitely going to be a fast little car when we have it all dialled in - Andre
Had a quick scan through the comments and haven't seen this one asked yet. Given you were chasing overheating problems prior to water blasting the engine bay, how did you conclude that the issue was excessive cylinder pressure lifting the head vs inadequate cooling leading to the headgasket failing?
He was saying that issue was fixed when they drilled the tstat it wasn't overheating anymore. I'm guessing they damaged the head gasket seal during the period when it was initially overheating to 120C (VERY HIGH!!)
Man that sucks! I assume you guys are running 1/2" head studs? If so 24psi shouldn't be a problem. I've never retorqued head studs after a heat cycle but again I've never pushed boost too high but its definitley something I will be doing on my next build to be safe.
I have a P11 head here with no cams for my SR22 build, what spec are your Kelfords? Also you mention its a stock head? Is that in terms of porting or is all hardware stock?
Keep plugging guys love following this build! Also I'm the guy you Skype interviewed in Sydney in regards to the Motorsport Engineer role :)
Sorry to hear of the troubles. From what I have read online I understand at these sort of power levels it’s worth upgrading to a larger head stud. Not sure if you have done this already.
at these power levels its worth upgrading to a 4G63 :)
eclipsetrekker haha the cheek of it!!
I wonder if the mazworx extended head studs will help this problem
Is this a New type of watercooled turbocharger? XD i am kidding.
In my opinión the gear stik is a little to hight but only a bit, but this dependes on the driver
With any big project there are teething issues,i hope you have it ready for race day
spoilers already... xd
Good luck to the crew. There is always hope.
How did the 1UZ blow up? I have a boosted 1U and it's held for a few years now.
The 1UZ dropped a valve at 8700 rpm. Safe to say there wasn't a lot of good stuff left after that :) - Andre
@@hpa101 Ooooohhh! Yea..... Dude you said 8700rpm. Didn't think they would spin that high. Wish these engines had more aftermarket love.
One day I'll get around to buying an 86 and swapping an engine in. I'd do the engine I think Toyota should have used from the start, the 8AR 2.0 turbo from the Lexus IS/GS/RC. I think one of the Japanese race teams is getting 650hp out of it.
Replace head gasket, check head for deck flatness, torque the head to slightly higher tension than used previously,...
Then Run at much lower boost...
After the upcoming event, rebuild the block with coolant ring machined around the deck in this video @10:15
czcams.com/video/07HHr6u1t-I/video.html
Also i think the earlier run with stuck thermostat with coolant temp reaching 120degree C pretty much accelerating this issue (or could be the source)
Loving this series! Also: what do you think could cause the head to lift like that?
High cylinder pressures or excessive boost is a common cause, sometimes the gasket itself, if the seal isn't optimum can give way under too much pressure. In drag racing where they run upwards of 50psi boost its common to see steel 0-rings (fire rings) coupled with custom gaskets and sometimes larger head studs to help alleviate these kinds of issues. Its an expensive rout though and requires a specialist to be done correctly.
Put a dye in the water ran in the radiator so all the evidence doesn't evaporate/disappear next time lol
If the head really did get lifted clearly time to get thicker studs
Any plans to fit a coolant pressure sensor after this little episode? Shame to see it happen so close to race weekend
Andre has commented on that here somewhere, there is one, it just had an issue during testing. Murphys Law - Taz.
Damn sorry guys.... Thing is a monster tho... Can't wait to see it in action again
This is racing
We wish it wasn't but sadly it is! - Andre
Do you think you will be upgrading to mazworx 1/2" studs? Is there a typical retorque sequence after getting the car up to temp for the first time?
Was this engine utilizing 1/2 inch head studs? I hope not lol.
Can you give a bit more clarification around the power matters not torque and seeing how you run the car totally naked on the dyno with the intake right infront of the fan, would that not alter the tune once the body panels are on the car and the intake is brought back in the engine bay be it with a open air path?
You need to confirm the tune on the track/street, it's the last step of dyno tuning. Doesn't really matter what panels you have on or off, you can never replicate the real world on a dyno like this.
I'm sorry but I don't understand your power vs torque question - Taz.
What size head studs ? mazworx do 1/2inch kit
2020 strikes again. First Speed Academy and now HP. If something happens to Rob Dahms car, this whole stupid year will be a wash in terms of CZcams car shows.
Yeah man, was heart wrenching to watch that Speed Academy video the other week. The struggles make the wins that much better, but there's a limit. We'll get there with this build and always knew it is a push to do this much work with a small team in a short timeframe without any setbacks, but you gotta try 😎 - Taz.
Who put the go pro in? Luke? So its Luke's fault!
100% 😉
Suprised you don't have a coolant pressure sensor fitted.
That said we've all been there. Proof that things don't always go to plan and that unlike an F1 team, there's no night shift and spare $15k motor sitting in the shop
We did, but it wasn't working correctly during testing. Tis one of the reasons why you test things. Hindsight tells us we should have fixed that before running things, however, hindsight is also absolutely useless 😅- Taz.
Could have been worse, could have missed the issue and ended up with a much bigger problem. The highs and lows of racing. Non racers really don't understand.
question here, how do you prevent things like this happen again in the future? and does it show up in logs? hopefully it's not bad, keep on fighting
Wouldn't an expansion tank reduce the likelyhood of head lift occurring? This set up would entail removing the radiator cap and having the water from the radiator overflow into and expansion tank which would have a line from the bottom of the tank going to a suction to the water pump in the cooling system
The head lifting doesn't have anything to do with the cooling system as Andre said in the video, the water spraying out is a result not the cause. The head has lifted off the block due to the combustion pressure being greater than either the studs can handle.
@@jarrodflood1353 Thanks
Why not use a beams 3sge?