HOI4 Navy Guide - How Naval Armor vs Piercing REALLY works
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2024
- #hoi4 #heartsofironiv
In this guide I will show you how naval / navy armor vs piercing really works. This is probably the most important naval mechanics to understand when it comes to naval battles, and that is because of two things: damage reduction and critical hits.
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/ hyggegaming
0:00 Intro
0:20 Damage reduction
2:00 The Channel
2:38 Critical Hits
4:27 Ways to increase armor and piercing
8:22 Summary and Conclusions - Hry
No one on CZcams comes close to how your channel perfectly educates us on HOI4
This comment made my day. Thanks a lot mate ❤️
Nice video Badger. One of the things I like about these guides is they explain the mechanics, not just "NEW META! DESTROY THE ENEMY!!!" Clickbate. I for one, with now almost 3k hours, am still trying to understand the "why" of what is happening. Keep up the great work
Thanks a lot mate! It means a lot to hear :)
Excellent guide, very helpful
Thanks a lot!!
Problem with armor is the cost is a huge % increase in cost, associated with loss of speed.
The speed itself is a type of defense. So you are loosing defense to gain a little bit of defense at a huge cost.
Battleships in general are not worth. If you are thinking about cruiser, then their armor naturally tend to be low and easily pierced.
I partly agree! In SP it might not be worth it, however, in MP BBs, BCs, SHBB, CV all have their roles to fill, depending on what the enemy is doing :) I for one really like slow heavy BBs if my opponent is going for BCs. But if my opponent goes for CVs, then I go for BCs
Yes speed and ship visibility (lower is better) will lower the chance of a ship hitting hit . This is rolled against the chance to hit by the gun type. Light guns hit light ships well, and pretty regularly will hit large hulls (capitals). The bigger a ship becomes the most important armor becomes for it simply because light attack guns have a fairly good chance of hitting them. Light guns though have crummy piercing, so one armor plate will really mitigate a lot of light attack damage to large hulls. For smaller ships armor is less important.
Sometimes its better to choose a lower Armor and keep up your Speed.
I think its about 8 Armor points and 2% Speed difference between Battleship Armor 1 and 2. Those 2% will decide if your Strike Force Fleet will catch the spotted Enemy fleet or not.
Its important to build them tanky but it wont matter how tanky they are if they never catch a fleet.
@@DthScythe01You have to value between Speed and Armor and visibility for some Fleets.
Patrol: Visibility, Spotting,Light Attack, TP, Low/Med Engage
Raiding fleet (Convoys): Visibility, Med Engage (Most times subs)
Strike Force: Speed, Pen, Hard Attack, Positioning ,always engage.
Finally someone who understand this and is able to explain
Thanks a lot :)
I stopped using armor past armor2... I go for speed now.. fast battle cruisers with fast escort carriers supported by light cruisers and destroyers in single player has been VERY good for me.
I really like BCs as well :) I’ll make a guide on speed and visibility soon I think :)
Going to post some math because this sparked some conversation in the comments. These are the base hit chances of light attack guns and heavy attack guns vs different hull types.
Light Attack Guns
Destroyers
Year Chance to hit
1922 29.14%
1936 27.30%
1940 25.66%
1944 25.66%
Cruisers
1922 62.60%
1936 46.39%
1940 41.90%
1944 39.94%
Heavy Hulls
1922 172.07%
1936 101.63%
1940 94.99%
1944 88.62%
Heavy Attack Guns
Year Chance to hit
Destroyers
1922 9.22%
1936 8.64%
1940 8.12%
1944 8.12%
Cruisers
1922 19.81%
1936 14.68%
1940 13.26%
1944 12.64%
Heavy Hulls
1922 54.44%
1936 32.16%
1940 30.06%
1944 28.04%
I did this math by just looking at ship profiles and ship base speeds for all hull types. Also looked at the hit profile of each gun type (light and heavy).
Basic take away. Light attack is for killing light ships. They have a much better chance to hit light ships but also have a very very good chance to hit heavy ships (sometimes 100%). That is why heavy ships NEED armor. They cannot mitigate light attack damage with speed/visibility. They are just too big. One plate on a battleship will tank a light attack damage to be very small.
Heavy guns suck at hitting light ships. Light ships don't need armor that much. This also shows why damage control research upgrades are really good.
Torpedo hit chance is even lower than heavy guns.
Better hulls are harder to hit, but not because their visibility changes (it doesn't), but simply because their base speed is higher.
I pulled the formulas from the wiki and just did the math in a spreadsheet.
hoi4.paradoxwikis.com/Naval_battle
I’d like to propose that screen hulls need armor against light attack. It makes a huge difference in damage taken and for crits
@@hyggegaming Well putting a small armor plate on light attach cruisers absolutely makes sense. Are you proposing adding armor to destroyers? That would be nice, but it would have to be a small plate, like maybe 2-3 points of armor.
Language advice: to oversee = to watch over/ to lead sth., f.ex. mine overseer. The word you should have used in this context is “to overlook“ which means not to see a flaw, f.ex. the Japanese overlooked that the US could have broken their code before the Battle of Midway. Best wishes and until 21:00 :D
Aaah, hahaha. You’re absolutely right mate 😅😂
BTW amazing info. Now I understand why the insanely high armor stats in the World Ablaze mod are worth every penny of build cost. They go way above 100 btw.
based
is there any sandbox mode for trying to learn the game without dying immediatly
I recommend playing Italy, because they start I a war they kind of cannot lose :)
@@hyggegaming thanks so much,I haven’t got the game yet,I’m waiting until the summer sale
speed= dodge
armor= dmg reduction
piercing= critical dmg
Do you think having less armor but keep capitals at 30knots worth it?
Depending on what you are facing and what modifiers you can stack. As Germany fx where you have visibility advisors, it might be smart to focus all in on speed and low visibility. Play on your strength. However, if you know you are facing carriers, I would go for speed either way, I.e BCs
Nope you want armor on larger ships. Larger ships have high visibility and are much easier to hit with light guns.
@@DthScythe01 as far as i know, light guns will hit screens first, and only after that, it will target capitals. Screens also have low piercing value by default. You want torpedos if you intend to hit capitals with screens.
@@borali26 Yes light attack will hit screens first but the chance to hit larger targets is very high. Light guns will shred large ships that are not armored. Thats why you put armor plates on them. Granted if you are in that situation you are screwed anyhow. Torpedoes do a lot of damage but still have very poor hit chance, even against unscreened ships.
@@DthScythe01Ofc CV, BB and BC got higher visibility hiding isn't their Job. Those Ships are made for engaging and killing the enemy Fleet after your Patrol Fleet spotted them, which will never happen if your Ships aren't there in the right time. The Strike Force fleet is useless then.
hi there, i found this info, what do you think?
surface detection can improve positioning (related defines are NNavy.RELATIVE_SURFACE_DETECTION_TO_POSITIONING_FACTOR and NNavy.MAX_POSITIONING_BONUS_FROM_SURFACE_DETECTION)
When a task force joins a battle there is a preference for ships with high detection (sub + surface) to enter the battle first. Not sure on that one but should be easy to test.
Also:
Surface Detection:
Surface detection refers to a ship’s ability to spot enemy vessels on the surface of the water.
It influences how effectively your fleet can detect and engage enemy ships during naval battles.
The higher the surface detection value, the better your ships can identify and target opponents.
Its seems that having catapults on capital ships increase its hit chance. This explains why many models comes with catapults.
What do you think?
Very interesting. Surface detection is an average stat on all ships in a task group, so either way, it might not be smart to have them on capitals, if they are intended as a strike force. What I assume, but not sure of, is that you don’t need surface detection on your doom stack/strike force for this bonus on positioning, if the enemy is already spotted by a smaller fleet. But this can be tested :) thanks!
@@hyggegaming well if this is correct this should increase hit chance of screens only. 🙄This game is unnecessary confused