Do I need a Harmonic Balancer Crank Damper? - Jay's Tech Tips #31 - Real Street Performance
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- čas přidán 28. 07. 2015
- A harmonic balancer is a widely overlooked, valuable asset to your engine’s longevity. Jay dives into the significance of having the right harmonic balancer for your engine’s performance application in this week’s Jay’s Tech Tips: Harmonic Balancers.
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![What You SHOULD Know About Harmonic Damper Pulleys | Harmonic Balancers 101 [TECH TALK]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/J1BGsgIZ_Ek/mqdefault.jpg)
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Hey I want you guys and girls to know this channel is high quality , the mic quality , the music mastering with your voice is on point , thanks for being so humble and sharing this building tips and tricks !!
Thanks for your feedback and thanks for watching. We appreciate your support 🏁
That's very nice of you to say 🎉.
Thanks Jay! As usual only the best informative info on part's we see everyday but not really understanding the importance of them until explained in detail! Realstreet's the Real deal.
Jay's Tech Tips back at it again! Super informative and great source of information! You are doing the work that many wont take the time to explain, appreciate it @jay
This one video made me subscribe, and I've literally never seen any others. Informative, concise, and it doesn't go traveling off into unrelated territory to beef up the runtime. Great video, I will definitely be back for more.
Thx for your tech tips. Theyre very useful and contains topics which normaly nobody thinks about. After watching this video, a few months earlier, i purchased an ATI for my rb26.
best channel on CZcams 👍🏻thanks
Just installed mine and I must say what a difference it made. Little to no cabin vibrations now.
Great vids that I always keep coming back to.
I wish Evan or Jay was on the west coast for sure. These are two tuners that I would love to have at my disposal to tune with.
My builder literally made me buy one and ditch the 'lightweight' crank pulley on my Subie. Heck, it could have been a culprit for all I know. Thanks Jay for another good video to show people real life scenarios and actual facts. This is certainly one part that gets overlooked on many modded cars. keep up the good work on the videos guys!
You never want lighter weight on a crank Pulley
Lol my builder done the opposite and my oil pump exploded
Agreed. I never knew this about the balancer.
I'm in the middle of my 2jz build and I was using a cheap "flashy" aluminum pully set. I had no idea how important having an actual damper/balancer is. Thank you!
Kurtis Koepke
change that asap
Literally same here vro luckily i have no ordered yet🙌🏽
Thanks man, I finally found some no bullshit information on balancers for my build.. Cheers
Favorite car channel period. Great info from legends in the industry. I’d love to see some N54 content, it’s a very affordable platform for your average joe, that can also make good power
Without the vibration damper, the engine experiences torsional vibration - the front of the crankshaft moves back and forth with respect to the flywheel. This can cause a very rough running engine at certain speeds and the back and forth rotational motion of the crank will eventually overload the rod bearings toward the front of the engine ultimately leading to failure.
Also, crankshaft balancing will help with this.
Damn! I never knew about this car part and this video was incredibly informative! Thank you!!!
Omg thank u sooooo much bro…especially going into details 💯💯
Honda F and H series from Accord and Prelude where 2.2l-2.3l had extra balance shafts in the block that ran along with the crank driven by a timing gear.
Music is on point, I learned something on that note lol
thanks for your time! great video
Glad you enjoyed it. Thank you for commenting.
Thanks from England.
Thank you....good info.
Good info, thanks man
Thanks for sharing
Probably one of the the smartest in the business
Even a new fresh oem style one is a good idea if your on a budget until you can get a good one, if needed for your hp level
Thx for the video
Good Demonstration
I have a Honda crx which came from the factory with no dampening at all just a steel pulley I "upgraded" to an aluminum one and had the machine shop balance it. After watching this it makes me want to put on a heavier stock dampener. Since the alum one weights less than a pound
FiendForLows never use lightweight crank pulleys it leads to bearing failure
Exactly what I am going through right now. Bought a 1987 E350 ford. Motorhome and its just fucked everything. Belts burned snapped off, blew transmission line and snapped another belt clean off. Thank God I noticed the rubber dampened sticking out and mentioned it or they wouldn't have fixed it or noticed. 🤦♀️
good video Jay
How about underdrive pullys and the rumors that engine accessories will suffer? Can they still dampen out engine vibrations as well as factory? thanks
Hi Jay 🙋🏽♂️
Just i would like to know your experienced idea about 2jz wobbly timing belt between intake cam shaft pulley and crank pulley while engine revving around 3,000 rpm...
Thanks for experienced ideas 💡
Regards
I would love to work at Real St. and meet Jay
I'm thinking the ATI pulley might be a bit too tight for mine.
1.3820 inches crank snout OD vs 1.3745 ID ATI hub.
What about a video on how to ensure TDC on a 2jz when the engine is sealed ( i.e. Head and oil pan on )
Subscribed.
If its bad, does it throw the belt off a bit to shred it on 1 side?
i had my chevy 383 stroker internally balanced. i am running the 400 balancer on it now. but im about to change it to a 6'' street balancer. is it going to throw off my internal balance ? and cant i just change out the short timing marker for the longer one to keep the correct timing setting ?
How about having the rotating assembly of the engine balanced? I am a fan of that for helping to reduce engine vibration.
Mr. Adventure haha yea tear it down to bare block might as well rebuild the whole entire engine while your at it.
I change to Work Engineer lightweight pulley on my K car, which they claim to have pro balance technology. I am not sure how safe is it, still monitoring after a year plus.
Hi, I just installed an ATI Super Damper with 2% overdrive and lightweight hardware on my MINI R53 and I’m hearing like a wiring sound, almost like if there’s a strong airflow going through the pulley, is this normal or could have possibly installed it incorrectly like maybe too close the the wall and it’s scraping? Thanks!
Please don't tell me I need this on my 156K 1999 Ls1 Camaro I get a bad vibration at a low RPM if when in Park, Neutral, or driving at a low RPM like under 2KRPM. Been doing it since 140K miles. Will I ruin the bottom end of the engine or driveshaft? I try to run it at a higher RPM and it goes away.
Hi, iv been looking at your real street dampener and fluid dmaper. The only reason I look at fluid damper is its self tuning. The Ebay real street model does not say the Durometer specs. Also videos say you need to tune the ATI. Is their a safe window for a 2jz-na with bolt on's that Rarely sprays nitrous, that i can buy and bolt on without tuning? Thank you.
I'm doing a diesel engine swap. It's an older Cummins A series inline six. Made before the famous B and BT series. This engine is the outside size of a 300 CI Ford inline six or a GM , JEEP inline six. I'm having to fabricate everything about this swap including Flywheel and Bell housing. I gotta get with Cummins and see if they can recommend a balancer for the front because it only now has a direct drive V pulley. I have a couple inches between the flywheel and the back of the block. Would it be a good idea to mount a harmonic balancer on the flywheel itself to help the whole engine be smooth? This engine has a cast iron crankshaft which I thought was odd. I sure don't wanna break the crankshaft as I've seen done before when using cast iron crankshafts. I'm wishing to use Teflon around the flywheel bolts to take out part of the jarring when the clutch is engaged. Would this be possible to take the shock out of engagement of the clutch?
I'm running perrin lightweight crank because it really does free up hp and i dont mind rebuilding after 150k to have reliability but thats my opinion
Lightweight pulleys seem to be good idea when you have lightened flywheel and removed a/c and power steering pumps.
But for lightly tuned street engine they may cause more problems than benefits.
Thanks buddy,I’m into vw air cooled and the harmonic balancer does not exist from factory so would it pay to put one on thanks 😊
What is your background music? I want to use it for my podcast
There is an alternative to Fluidampner or ATI, dayco powerbond.
I can't find a balancer for my mazdaspeed 6 the balancer is toothed for the crank position sensor maybe that's why they are rare
Bone-Harmonic thug balancers in harmony:)
Lol😂
literally laughed out loud when i read this.. brilliant! :)
Not looking for a ton of hp or looking to be at high revs all the times so a lil lightweight forged aluminum crank should last a bit ?
I bought a fluidampr instead of an ati super damper both are Well worth iT
I have fluid as well, i've got my fingers crossed. I might pull it off after 30,000 and see what state it's in. Though my timing marks were incorrect on mine. What about yours?
@@Skirk84 mines were fine, check your TCT & chain.
@@PatrickMeloModesto I just built the engine. Base Timing is set correctly, but the marks were just off.
Team Spintop weird man. Does the car run fine otherwise ?
@@PatrickMeloModesto yep its good, makes good power, doesnt ping, spools super quick. Just the timing marks. You set it to tdc and its out by 10 so highlight the new mark for tdc, degree the cams, set the base timing, check it with the gun and its exactly what you set it to in the ecu. Just out by 10 originally
Can a bad SFI harmonic balancer that's gone bad ....keep eatting the front seal out of my 302/347?? I keep having to replace them ...and when pulled out they look like a dog chewed them up ...also it's a Supercharged build ??? please help ....
I have a lightweight flywheel in my Honda B series build. No power steering, no AC. Should I use a good aluminum crank pulley?
I have an under drive pulley kit on my K series.. Does the ATI pulley replace that or run off a separate pulley.. Thanks
Jose Melendez Jose, the ATI balancer replaces the pulley you have now and will drive your belt once installed.
thanks.
Let’s say my car doesn’t have an ati damper application, would a simple $100 aftermarket/replacement harmonic balancer react the same way as the oem?
My evo 8 got balance shaft deleted now I getting buzzes at certain RPM would this pulley help?
Thanks
what about light weight aftermarket harmonic balancer on a built 200 HP na civic d16 engine
Hi, I have a question, so I am looking into getting a lighweight crank pulley for my car but as you've said it can't absorb the vibrations at high rpms. But my car only produces 90hp stock from the factory and the rpm redline starts at 6.5k rpms. And Im mostly just daily driving at decent speeds at around 3.5k-4k rpms. So is there alot of vibrations in those kind of rpms in the first place?
Do you need to boil if you use the installation tool?
Been running solid well-balanced aluminum crank pulleys on several different tuner engines over the years and haven't had any of the failures stated.
Checking in 3 years later and yes I still have light aluminum crank pulleys on 9K RPM 600whp 4AGE, 375whp VG30DETT and 300whp J37A1 with no failures or problems.
@@DJToneRI I like you. That's the way to comment. You came back after 3 years and reply to all of us. I hope everybody has that in mind.
@iris baez 🤣 no problem! Just one man's experience but at least that's worth something!
@@DJToneRI Nice man. Good to know. Know anyone running one on a FBO and tuned K20? I should be good since my engine is internally balanced.
This comment 👌 👏
I made the mistake of buying and eBay lightened underdrive pulley/dampener for my DSM it completely change the low RPM and start off characteristics of my engine it was like having a lightened flywheel I had to go ATI to get my daily drivability back.
Did you also use a lightweight flywheel? I like the zippy response of a low inertia bottom end, but yes I agree it decreases driveability
Should have added something about underdrive/ overdrive pullies. Alot of people run them that don't even have dampening
Quick question! On my B18C I want to run the alternator only * no power steering or a/c *, but I want it to still charge my alternator for accessories like headlights. I have heard the *RACE* Damper will not charge well on a bseries. Is there any way to use the Race version on the street or buy a super damper without the extra a/c and p/s pulleys?
Yea
Elastomer vs Fluid?
Will a lightweight flywheel needs a different tuned harmonic balancer?
Hi I had 2x crank shafts broke of behind nr
4 big bearing can that be the reason for not use a damper
This is an old video so hopefully you can answer my question, but is a fluid damper needed if you're running a stock engine with an aftermarket light weight flywheel since it's a recipricating part of the engine? Reason is I recently installed an ACT light weight flywheel on my s2000 ap1.
And this is a old answer : yeah
hey guys ,so a bad harmonic damber can affect the power and rpm of my car ? i have a sportage 1996 gasoline with harmonic damper just cracked :(....
Dp you suggest the Dorman replacement for the jz motors?
Im glad you popped up everyone else talks to much
how'd you get the instrumental for this track? would really appreciate it.
Can anyone tell me which brands and/or sizes will fit my 87 mazda 323??? Please???
Where can I get one like that for my car.
I accidentally turned the bolt on the harmonic balancer off of spec trying to replace belt any how I noticed vibration at speed how do I reset it back to spec?
If you get these random vibrations during idle, could it be harmonic balancer? Changed to solid mounts 3 yrs ago and have this vibration during idle. Almost seems like care is about to stall out sometimes.
+JOe Shmoe Are you certain the engine is not misfiring? Solid mounts will definitely transmit more vibration into the chassis but won't cause the engine to stall/shake a lot at low speed. Without being there to see your car it's hard to say if your vibration is "normal" for solid mounts but the stalling condition is not related to the balancer.
thanks
Hello which brand is better under drive pulley. One by summit or jet performance. I have a 2014 Chevy Silverado 1500 5.3 z71 LT. Suggestions plz
Hello can you my question please
What about honda engines? are they just pulleys or "harmonic" balancers?
Can i get one for my chev 350 to add power?
I didn’t have a damper on my b series turbo and u guest it 😢
I'm planning on having the ATI super damper installed on my 07 Z06 with an 10% under drive. The OEM just doesn't last very long. I'd rather pay 3 or 4 times the price over OEM than to have to deal with it again sooner.
C6Z06 if you take the rack bolt out on e one side and the motor mount on the other and jack the engine a tiny bit to one side you can sneak the crank pulley bolt out no problem
What about light weight under drive pulleys???
i kinda want a ATI damper for my na 2jz 🙄
buy one...?
What brand are good harmonic balancer s?
for the 2jz setup, which one is better, the fluidampr 840801 or the ATI super damper
I'd also like to know as i'm running the fluid, but have always known ATI is the business.
I went with the fluidampr because it utilizes the factory sized serpentine belt i.e. the pulley is the same diameter as the OEM pulley. I hear ATI requires a different belt size.
Should there be any slack between the crankshaft gear washer and the timing belt? Reason I ask is the ring/washer rides against the belt and was unsure if the ring/washer is suppose to spin freely between the gear and belt after the damper is torqued down. Thanks.
Hello, There will not be any play between the balancer hub/timing belt guide AKA washer and timing belt gear. They're all sandwiched together and both the inner hub of the balancer along with the hub's sandwich fit against the washer/crank gear help transmit vibration into the damper. Also the keyways on the crankshaft locate during install however it's a combination of the keyway AND the torque of the crank bolt sandwiching it all together that keeps things from turning during use. Thanks
Thank you! I have the ATI damper that needs to push back a few centimeters more. I will have to get creative as it was a very tight fit to begin with.
That's an easy one to overcome! Put some antiseeze on the snout of the crank and boil the hub of the balancer with oil once you've confirmed there's no burs in either part. With the hub hot it will slide on nicely with the bolt. Thanks and let me know if this helps.
So I read some replies and still don't know. Not sure of the difference on balancers and dampeners. Still go in the same spot right? Front of the engine? My engine (350 Chevy) vibrates a lot at higher rpms. I was told it could be the flywheel or clutch plate...then yesterday a transmission guy says it's rare and he's never seen that before. Says its gotta be the balancer.....???
Beetlejuice117Kc dont quote me hut i believe they are the same thing called dofferent things by dofferent people
Ross gold balancer or ATI and why?
Question for you if you don't mind.. I have an Audi a4 Quattro 2.0t. It's engine is stock, but even after replacing the engine mounts and the transmission mounts, I'm still getting some vibration when I put the car in gear. I'm not moving, jus in gear with my break on. Do you think that could be my hermonic balancer? The car drives great and ONLY vibrates when I have my foot on the break and put it in gear..
Better check your engine and tranny mounts first.
I have exactly the same problem with a 2005 V6 Mustang. The engine and tranny mounts were both checked, with only the engine mounts actually having to be replaced. Engine ran really smooth for about a week before the vibrations crept back in. With research and my mechanics advice, it was discovered that it is probably the harmonic balancer that has weakened over time. I plan on getting it swapped out and hopefully it fixes the issue
@@mattc5650 so did you replace balancer? Did it help?
can the balancer rubber ring slip and cause the timing marks to slip
yes, the inner and outer ring can become "uncoupled" if the rubber ring between them fails. If this happens, the crank pulley damper is ruined and needs to be replaced.
An aftermarket balancer is definitely a must for any engine build
If I installed a good broad band harmonic balancer at the same time I install a single mass flywheel, how far will that go toward cancelling out the classic gear rattle issue? Probably not 100%, but any experience with that? (On mk7 GTI w/ 6spd MT, if that matters...)
You follow through with getting one? I just ordered my fluidampr for my mk7 gti
@@brianwilhelm9464 Check out the video I made to compare sound before and after. I did get the balancer. It was installed at the same time as the new clutch/ flywheel (South Bend) and downpipe (APR). I never heard the car with the single mass flywheel, but without the fluid damper, so I don't know if it changes the sound. But sound has not been an issue at all for me!
@@fredygump5578 awesome I’ll check it out. I’m either gettting my SB stage 3 clutch this year or in the spring. For now I’ll see how the fluidampr does smoothing my power mods out and mounts
so it's a bad idea to swap out and install an aluminum crank pulley?
If it's a lightweight single piece pulley you want to stay away from it. There are some Dampers on the market that are aluminum however I don't keep up with their outcomes. I just stick to ATI as I've not had bad experiences with them. Thanks
Thanks does that mean we need to balance the crank and balancer together to find the correct harmonics
Is there any way to "build" your own pulley? There's a company called that makes a prebuilt ATI pulley for my motor, but it's $800.
No, they are tuned specifically to negate the harmonics produced by that particular engine through a tuned section of the rev range. Building your own would be worse than not running one at all.
It's a misconception it's automatically a balancer. If your engine is internally balanced it's a harmonic damper. If your engine is external balance it's a combination balancer damper.
After setting timing on a 2002 PT Cruiser does the harmonic balancer need to be on to crank it
No, but you will have no accessories.
Why does this come up in my recommended one week after my OEM balancer's rubber disintegrated in the middle of a cruise...
🤯👍
what are your thoughts on fluid damper or is ati better
I have the fluidampr, Theyre both great, just your choice
Patrick Melo Modesto thx 👍👍
No problem man i have it for My
S2k , doesnt matter what engine you have or if The stock one can take 1000hp. These dampers are worth it overtime
Patrick Melo Modesto would you suggest these even for stock engines? In he middle of a timing belt job for my b6 a4 Audi and looks like my oem crank pulley looks old n worn
Is there any aftermarket option for H22a7 engine?
@potato_melon here is the link to the ones we use on the H22A1 and H22A4 engines we got here in the United States. If they are interchangeable with the H22A7, then any of these will work. But we never got the CH1 Accord Type-R here so I can't confirm from personal experience www.realstreetperformance.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=__empty__#q=&idx=production_default_products_availability_sort_asc&p=0&dFR%5Bmagento_enginecode%5D%5B0%5D=H22A1&dFR%5Bmagento_enginecode%5D%5B1%5D=H22A4&dFR%5Bmagento_parts_subcategory%5D%5B0%5D=Crank%20Pulleys&hFR%5Bcategories.level0%5D%5B0%5D=Shop%20By%20Category&nR%5Bvisibility_search%5D%5B%3D%5D%5B0%5D=1&clearmvge=1