Can you tune a Willys jeep better than the factory?
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- čas přidán 17. 06. 2018
- Modern fuels mean the factory timing marks arent correct for modern fuels, so how do you time the engine without using the timing marks on the flywheel?
Notice that because of valve overlap and the the design of the l134 engine the vacuum needle always flickers a bit in comparison to other engines, this is due to the engines design and not an issue with the engine! - Auta a dopravní prostředky
People forget how six volt systems need much bigger wires and cleaner connections.
I am glad to see someone covering these nearly lost skills. Thanks
I am glad to find this video. I was having a hell of a time figuring a way to read a strobe light down on the flywheel to time the damn thing. Thanks.
Judging by all the videos of old Willy's Jeeps on CZcams, yours is the most mint one I ever saw so far!
Great video! I had not ready much on the difference in fuel octane and now we need more advanced timing today. Awesome jeep too!
This is a great video! I have never even once thought about octane as an issue. I have the popping sound at factory idle on my 48 CJ AND my 52 Ford 8N tractor and I always thought my carb needed a little something...but the distributor timing makes perfect sense now that you mentioned the octane percentages.
a friend of mine helped me tune mine and we set it to the markings from the timing light, I never thought it ran right and just spun the distributor till I liked it. the fuel explanation makes so much sense.
I Will redo this video in the next year or so once my next jeep is complete, Apologies for the incredible speed and lack of clarity in this video!
+++Quick Correction+++ I say that if the Dwell is too low (points closed for too short a time) then you increase the gap, this is the wrong way round, if it is too low you actually decrease the gap and if it is too high you increase the gap, Sorry for the mistake quys!
Again, another great video explained in easy to understand steps. I read the books and get a tad confused but this is great. Plus a cat that's becoming famous. Thanks again.
No problem Dave, I hope it all makes sense. You need to have a grasp of what's going on and the 4 stroke cycle before viewing the video but with an idea of how to time it normally this should make sense!
Excellent video and also a very clean build. Something to be very proud of.
Thanks Scott, much appreciated. I am hoping my MB will improve on this one
In the 50's and 60's, we used to tune jeeps by driving. We'd advance the ignition till the engine 'knocked', then back off the dizzy just a bit, till the knock was gone. Didn't use a timing light or look at the flywheel markings. They always went just fine- even then, better than jeeps tuned to the 'ign' mark on the flywheel.
I tuned the 60/70 amc cars like that. I was a amc Jeep tech back then. Those twin vaccumne distributors the advanced and retarded were a pia. You had to time them on the road.
Very clear and accurate descriptions. Thanks very much.
Keep them videos coming, very educational
the first real (good) vid on how to tune your willys thanks !
No problem!
You're the kinda mate all Willys owners want! Cool vid, thanks
It is very easy to get a good look at the timing window, from right in front of it, while standing in front of the Jeep turning the crank. It would have been difficult when the Jeep was new, but today it is very easy. I place a camcorder directly in front of the peephole with the viewscreen tilted up, and fix a penlight to a spring clamp so that it shines into the hole. You can zoom in to make the image larger and really dial it right in on the mark with even grater precision than you could by laying under the Jeep so that you are face-to-face with the marks.. It works really well. Thanks for the video; my new dwell meter arrived today and I'm getting set to go set the advance.
Nicely done mate.
I really love the soft melifllous sound of Willys Hurricane Engine 🙏🙏
Really helpful video!Many thanks!
One of the best vidios I have seen, very informative and clear, great tips. Do you do a vid on the carter carb tune and adjustment in more detail.
Thanks, i'll look into the carb very shortly!
RPM method ....highest smooth rpm (watch vacum gage) and back down 100rpm .....it's definitely a "Feel" thing ...the more you do it , the easier it gets....Cool video
Am very sceptic about tuning ign timing with a vacuum gauge. Actually you have tuned your timing using the exhaust pipe noise (which is much better then the VG to my opinion), and then been looking where the VG needle is pointing to. You also used a timing light on your mark without counter mark, and concluded that it is a couple degrees of the factory setting which is nearly impossible to tell without counter mark. So you actually made up your own reference for the VG. Everyone that use a VG for tuning has made up his own reference. That is because there is no oficial reference! It is a good idea to duplicate the timing mark on the V-pulley where you can easilly see it with a timing light. But to do it acuratelly you need a fine line and a counter mark. I put the counter mark on the V-pulley protection plate. I have done a lot of fact checking with the VG, simultaniously using a timing light on 95 octane fuel with 10% bio fuel. It always boils down that the factory 5° setting is the best setting and for 6 volt jeeps that's where they start best as well. The manual is mentioning a vacuum check, not a vacuum gauge tuning. A vacuum check will show when everything is correct, but it won't show if something is slightly of. It is a rough estimate of what could be wrong in the field. To acuratelly trouble shootng one need a timing light to start with and few more tools like a leak tester and such. A vacuum gauge tuning is what some make out of it, hearesaying or saturday night tales in a bar. That said, I like your video's!!
Thanks for sharing the video, it's interesting!!
Very informative! Thanks!
No problem!
Hi there. Great videos - and I now suffer clean engine envy! I have a problem with my CJ3A's timing that I'm beginning to think might be due to the fibre timing gear. Have you got any plans to do a video opening up your timing cover and removing and refitting the timing gear? Cheers
Great video thank you. Both the carburetor and timing have are wrong. Should I start with the carb and then ignition timing and start again. My M38A1 is running terrible since a mechanic "tuned" it... thanks
We had a big problem with our project in that it wouldn't start when hot and was difficult to start when cold. Turns out it was firing so far before TDC that it was shooting the piston back down before it had a chance to cycle. Simple fix but took us ages to realise.
Had the same problem. I was thinking that my engine was partly seizing up or something else i did wrong during the complete rebuild, until one time i accidentally tryed to start hot without ignition, and i was surprised how cuickly the starter was turning around.
My grandfather and my father, both mechanics in WW2 and vietnam taught me that you should always put a star washer between the electrical contacts and bolts, it will dig in all around and bite into the block to make a good connection.
As far as dwell and timing, a old school meter is a must, and if you want to be absolutly anal about carb adjustment, propane enrichment is the only way to correctly tune an old war time engine. Plus, the old gas had benzine in it, you can still buy it, but youll have to add it to your fuel, it will help the burn be longer and smoother in the cylinder.
Great video! I have a 47 cj2a that I am starting and it was is really bad shape. I went to get plugs and wires for it at the parts store and the guy asked me if it's negative ground, I said I don't think so but want sure. Could see the wires that you had pointed to on the starter bit did notice a big heavy wire on it. Are/is your Jeep negative ground? Thanks for the help!
the context of your video is correct in terms of getting the most possible power out of your fuel, but power timing isn't always the best for drivability, mostly in terms of harder starting. 4-8 degrees is best for a compromise.
Thanks Albert, never had an issue starting though!
I don't doubt it, you have quite the well oiled machine! For those of us with vehicles at less than peak performance or under more adverse conditions... 5 degree stock timing might not be a bad recommendation.
Thanks for the info
Great video thank you. What fuel and octain rating do you use?
Sorry for dumb question.. where exactly do you plug vacuum gauge ? Can you share photo please ?
You should also include the idle mixture adjustment using the vacuum gauge. Good video though.
Installed electronic distributor in my gpw including compatible oil filled coil. Set timing, idle, mixture. Done away with points, condenser & retune. Available 6 & 12 volt system.
I like Willy jeep thanks so much information about
I would like to have seen the port your vacuum test tube went to. Other than that, I really enjoyed the video and info.👍
Thanks, just one of the ports on the intake manifold, I will redo this video on the future to make it clearer and more simple
Finally understand dwell, thanks !
No Problem, glad it was of some help!
Just a quick note too, I say that if the Dwell is too low (points closed for too short a time) then you increase the gap, this is the wrong way round, if it is too low you actually decrease the gap! Apologise!
I forgot to ask do Dwell meters come in 6 and 12 volt versions do you know. What did you use to time yours up with ? Thanks Dave
Hi Dave, it doesn't seem to make a difference if the dwell meter is 6 or 12v so no problem there. The ones i've got say they are good for point ignitions and electronic ignitions, they all seem to come from the 70's-80's. ebay seems to be the place to find one, handy bit of kit.
Any place else to pull a vacuum from besides the intake? I can't think of anything. My manifold is early and no ports to attach to but I feel like I'm forgetting something. I need to keep my eyes peeled for a dwell meter too. I used the mirror and timing light trick but you're right, adjusted it right out of the little window. Got it running smooth but she does heat up a bit and I think my timing is a bit off
Hi Rob, I'm not sure if this would work or not but perhaps temporarily removing the pcv valve and using the connection there is an option, I am unsure if this is a good idea or not but it's all i can think of! The dwell gauge is a great tool, no guessing about whether your distributor is set up correctly or not! They come up on eBay from time to time. Good luck!
Greendot 319
Ahhh yes the PCV, I knew I was forgetting something! Thanks.
I changed my distributor over to a point-LESS ,new solex carb(junk) and a electric fuel pump with a fuel pressure regulator, well long story short,now it won't start,I think it's a trimming issue. NICE clean WILLYS !!!🔧🔩🔧🇺🇸😀
That's the problem, these jeeps are best kept simple, they work well if you use the right parts and follow the manuals, no need to make them more complicated, just causes more issues trying to track down problems in the future! Good luck!
Find an old forklift mechanic, not only have they converted hundreds of points to electronic ignition , they also know what system works best with your original distributor and coil.
( PerTronix )
Do you put the vacuum in the top of the carburetor?
Agreed!
Modern fuel and ignition parts should add HP and drivability.
I've always adjusted the timing to maximum vacuum reading then idle mixture to maximum vacuum. Then set idle speed to spec and repeat. After 2-3 times you should be pretty well set. I've done 60s and 70s engines that way and would do a Willys engine the same if I still had the original engine for mine. If it doesn't work I'd return to the book settings, lol. Great video and a true idea most don't think of...
Greendot 319 some do some don't. I've done dozens of Chevy V8s but each is different.
David Weydert i
An excellent tutorial, you covered all the relevant points without the waffle that is in the book, even Moses gave it the seal of approval, just like the smell of EP90 ! The modern fuel is a big problem for most people now, with the real stuff getting harder to find, but I have seen people mix in a little paraffin in with aviation fuel to get to near pool petrol, although I have not seen any direct results from ethanol use, but I am sure we will see some problems in the future with our older engine systems, I get the impression that governments would rather us not have our toys!
I'm not sue if the ethanol really makes that much of a difference for the amount of driving we are doing, it would be interesting to use a lower octane fuel and see what a difference it makes to the engine, the lowest octane we can get though is 95 so not that much lower! I think the Americans get much lower octane fuel, maybe their jeeps are running better/more originally than ours in Europe! Mose smells worse than EP90!
@@Greendot319 We have Octane 80 fuel here in some special gas stations and its great for old engines. But when its not possible to use that one I use 92 octane but I let it sit for a while in the jerry cans for a month or so and it's loosing it juice and become more closer to low octane.
The main difference with the old fuel is lead that were used in it. You can find special fuel additives for the old cars. I guess liqui molly makes them in Eu but I am personally didn't use it.
@@Greendot319 American gasoline or petrol is of a lower quality than distillates from Saudi, Nigerin, Gulf states. And their engines are built around this fuel.
Great video... How did you come up the the number 42 for the dwell meter ? Thanks, Rob
Sorry,Ii mean 14
I imagine it was a mistake, dwell should be 42 as you say ;) cheers
Where did you connect the vacuum gauge? I looked in the book and it said just under the head but I’m unsure of where the location is.
Hi Chris,
If your intake manifold has threaded taps on it for vacuum wipers etc you can remove one of the blanks and fit the gauge pipe there, cheers
Glad to know my jeep is not the only that bites me.
Now to get my jeep back running again after it sat for a year.
seems perfect to me
Thats great! Now i only need a jeep 😩😩
I have been given a digital Dwell & Tach meter and just interested, where did you find the information about the Dwell being at 600 RPM = 42 degrees. Thanks Dave
Tech manual I think Dave
@@Greendot319 Thanks, I was just curious, anyhow it made it so easy following your video, and I’m getting the same readings as you when running. All be I have starting problems will only start with the handle or bump. Just confirmed battery is ok , so it’s as you say check all the connections ( good idea with the conducting grease) cheers Dave
Why I can't get fire out of points
Very good trouble shooting. That would be difficult to figure out.
That grease should come clear as well.
Minty jeep!!!!!!!!!! GPW that is!!!!!!!
What does crack the butterfly mean exactly
Means the butterfly valve is just slightly opened
How about coming to hampshire and sorting my engine im at my witts end with it
What's the problem Sean
You didn't mention anything about if your timing is out 180 degrees. What then ?
then its not firing the first cylinder.
Not adjusted any differently than any other engine on the market. Set the timing to base per manufacturer, fire it up, warm it up, tweak it until it's nice and happy. My '85 F150 wants about 3 degrees more timing than Ford says it should want.
O gato da bruxa!
Respected Sir, Regards with reverence,I want to draw your kind attention that, You have been keeping the title of the video "can we tune a Willys Jeep better than the factory?" Sir your video distinguished
check the tune of Jeep, but not do the tune of Jeep engine, if during tunning any mismatch is arise then required instruments should be needed in tool box for ratio proportional synchronisation in between several functions of engine , only after then we may have checked the tune by gauge reader
I now know why I feel such a strong bond with my Willy's, it's far too retarded. I sure hope when I fix it in the morning, it doesn't leave me!
Interesting, I think you did not properly a tune, with new equipment instead of stock parts, such as more powerful ignition system, but the original factory adjust to your engine.
The old military keeps ran on mogas . A mixture of gasoline and diesels
Hey GD319 - If you're interested in more Willys Jeeps help & info - check out www.SoutheastWillysJeepGetTogether.com on October 5 in Asheville, NC ... Buyers, sellers, exhibitors, lunch speaker, tech session - and swap meet ... Just a suggestion-hope to see ya ... Optimistically, Will(ys) Springer
Yes with a big big money to spend thousand of big dollars
Thanks for the info