DO PEOPLE ONLY BUY CANYON BIKES FOR THEIR CHEAP PRICE??
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- čas přidán 16. 11. 2023
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Wrong question. Should be: if Specialized/Trek offered similarly equipped bikes for the same price as Canyon, would people still buy Canyon? I think THAT is the real question. I’m pretty sure most people see Specialized/Trek/Cervelo etc charge waaaay too much….to the point of overcharging and borderline gouging the consumer.
Good question, I'd get the Sworks 😆
And that might be part of the reason why some people don’t trust bike shops or shop owners because they will tell you you “need” one of the bigger brand bikes, when they know good and well that you don’t! No shop owner will honestly say “look if you want a great deal on a bike with all the same components, that will do the same exact thing, then go with a Canyon!” I’d rather a shop owner tell me that and them they could make all the money they want off of me on tires and bottles and maintenance and components! I’d be a loyal customer for life if they weren’t just mouth pieces for the bigger brands!
💯💯💯💯💯💯💯
Agreed. Although I’ve owned the Trek Madone and have the Aeroad-I’m taking the Aeroad all day.
The only thing I will agree with you, on this mostly unsubstantiated, nonsensical rant is this: if all bike brands went direct to consumer, you, the retailer, would go out of business. And no one wants that.
Matthieu Van der Poel won the worlds on a Canyon. Ditto for Chloe Dygart. Multiple world tour teams ride them, something BMC, Giant, Trek, Factor, Cervelo, Pinarello and Colnago can’t claim.
Peter Sagan did for Specilalized what Van der Poel has done for Canyon. Your comparison is asinine. If you take equally specced bikes, regardless of manufacturer, Canyon is the much better buy, and by a lot. Of course price matters. Of course there may be more complaints that you hear because there are NO Canyon bike shops! Specialized lather, rinses, repeats their models, invoking a “speed sniffer”, and slaps a 14k price tag on it. Then I see a world tour sprinter holding it in two pieces after a crash. And I should pay 14k for that? To support the retailer? When I would then have to purchase a whole new bike, or at least a frame, and is I buy the SWorks frame, I’m paying 6k for that, when I can buy the top end Canyon complete bike Aeroad for 9???
Cmon man, I get that you hate their business model, but discrediting them for it is bitterness in translation.
I personally think that company like specialize or trek selling their frames at 6k is way overpriced considering their cost of manufacturing is probably less than 1k. Canyon is one of the few companies that make an honest living by not ripping their customer off. Kudos to them and we should have more companies like this.
Canyon by far is the best bang for the buck. I'm not a pro rider and getting a Canyon Grail gravel Ebike for only $5K and changing out the tires would outperform any manual TT bike out there. Cheating? Only if you are officially racing. If you are just riding, there is no competition and no cheating. Canyon Grail is my pick over any TT bike.
Canyon sells bikes that “should be” $8k to $9k, he says. Spoken like a true middleman.
Word!!
You don’t like Canyon because Canyon has cut the middleman, you! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 !
I understand your point about IF Canyon went to comparable pricing. But Canyon has shown that the Big Bike Brands are WAY overpriced.
I've owned 2 Canyon's, thus far, and they're both amazing machines that I would highly recommend - The D2C business model seems to provide the most value to the end customers by way of price and overall quality.
Why not buy a Lightcarbon or Winspace bike?
My Canyon is $3200 cheaper than a Trek with similar specs. $3200 buys a lot of LBS labor if I need any service not covered by Canyon. No brainer.
Apart from the frame and the suspension (on mtbs) most parts are also relatively cheap to replace, so even if something breaks, replacing it costs you about 150-300 dollar/euro if you decide that you don't want to wait a few weeks because their service might not be the quickest. For an ebike it might be different because of the motor/battery that you will not get on the aftermarket easily, but for a normal bike i see no problem and i will also buy a gravel bike from canyon soon
Agreed
The sad part is a lot of brands are trying a semi-direct to consumer move and we arent seeing their prices come down.
They can't because if they lower the margins they will screw their dealernetwork
I have had 3 canyons and have had no issues with them. Build quality is fine. Pricing is obviously competitive. You don’t sell them so you are bound to not like their business model.
I've been extremely tempted to buy a Canyon. I have a few people I ride with and they love their Canyons. They've had no problems.
That's a weird conclusion, Grant sings plenty of praises about bike brands he doesn't sell.
He has tons of brands he doesn’t sell on his channel…so this argument makes no sense
He reviewed a Canyon recently and liked it if I’m remembering correctly.😊
This argument makes ZERO sense! Of course people by Canyon because of the price and the only reason people buy the more expensive brands is because of the name. Neither are any better or worse than the other when it comes to almost all riders.
This exact model is followed by Tesla, I think they’re doing ok last time I checked. There’s no need to have a middle man sell you something if you’re knowledgeable in what you want directly from the manufacturer. His job depends on this old sale model continuing so I’m not surprised by this video.
I totally agree with you also, why don’t other brands copy canyon then, everyone will be happy with lower bike prices 👊🏾👌🏾
Not surprised at all. He must be trolling for views.
The only reason I don’t get canyon is the warranty
@@duttyveganbecause their entire structure is built on a dealer/distributer model. They are not setup from the ground up for DTC. They are trying to adapt their model but will never be able to fully compete on price.
My gravel bike is a Canyon Grail - and I love it and it is unique on group rides. To your point, the price is unbeatable ( specially when you take into consideration the components ) - The only challenge I have is service - bike shops are not very enthusiastic when I bring it into their shop. BUT I love my Canyon !!!!
If they are charging you to work on the Canyon, why should it matter? They should be enthused they are getting your business at all. Given the breadth of DIY info out there and inexpensive tools, there's practically no reason to have a shop service a bike. I chose to take my Canyon Lux Trail to my local shop and pay for service that I could do in order to support them. Even though they are a Trek Store, they have never frowned upon me bringing my Canyon in. They gladly take my money and provide great service.
If the bike shop premium was like $500, canyon buyers, at least myself, would probably be more interested in buying from a bike shop. But when the bike shop premium is $2k+, it’s hardly surprising when people don’t buy the bike shop bikes.
All other brick and mortar retailers have figured out how to compete with DTC. The bike manufacturers and shops need to figure it out.
Some of these competitors are so overpriced you could almost buy the canyon, buy the frameset you want, and build up the frameset using parts from the canyon and still come in less than the cost of the complete bike from the other manufacturer.
Everything is relative. For example: why do so many buy Chinese (such as the elves) instead of more expensive variants? Well, the performance is similar. The same with weight, and so, the Canyon is popular as it is a tested and nice frame with decent wheels for a great price.
I just bought the new Grail and compared to alternatives such as the Aspero 5, Crux, Diverge,…it is an unbeatable deal around 3000$ cheaper than anything with very good components level. Pretty innovative too with inside storage, more options for groupsets also (no 2 by for the Crux for example). I used to buy all my bikes from Specialized but am incensed at their current pricing: 8200$ for a Crux Pro compared to 5000$ for a Grail CF SLX Di2 which has a better wheelset. Specialized, Trek and all need to discount all their high end bikes by 20-25% to become attractive again
Guy is a moron. I was a specialized rep for years. They are literally junk. Cervelo. Same. I've been servicing pure bicycles aka canyon for years. This guy made a comment about the endurace having wheel clearance.... Lol😂
You can set up a Crux 2x. It just has to be wireless
In my opinion it is really the performance. This year my dad bought a wilier filante SLR with Dura Ace nad the Wilier SLR 42 KC Wheels and some Selle Italia saddle with titanium rails for 12.000€. I bought a Aeraod CFR Di2 later this year in sale for 8699€ with the upgradet seatpost. This bikes comes with DT Swiss Wheels, eqipped even with better hubs than the SWORKS Tarmac complete bike has, it comes with some of the best Selle Italia Saddles with carbon rails, it comes with a ROTOR Powermeter. And in addition to this it has one of the best frames in aerodynamics, tested by the german tour-magazin. They compare every bike in wind tunnel, the stiffness is mesured by engineers etc. In the end there is no bike, lighter with the same aerodynamic than the Canyon aerod. Only the simplon Pride 2 and the Storck Aerfast are a bit more aero, but weight 300g more. The Cervelo S5 is worse in windtunnel and on weight. The Scott Foil and the Giant Propel are on the same level like the Aeroad in the Aero-Segment in my eyes, but more expensive.The onliest bike, that makes a better overall package for me and for the tour magazine is the SWORKS Tarmac SL8. But here comes the price again. And even some components are nicer on the way cheaper bike.
It is less that Canyon is so much cheaper than all the big brands…it’s that the big brands are not putting out a product that is worth the price they are charging. No chance an SL8 is worth $15k. You can buy a S-Works SL8 frame, Ultimate CFR complete bike and swap the groupset over for less than a complete SL8. It’s a joke. Big brands are marching themselves out the door. The market will go this way and the other brands are starting to do the same. It won’t be long before the local bike shops are cut out/reduced to repair/maintenance.
The only way to honestly answer this question is with financial transparency, which will be almost impossible to gather. It would help if you had the cost of manufacturing from Canyon, trek, specialized, etc, and then the price the retailer makes from it and the suggested price. Also, the cost at which these companies are getting the components. Once you have that, you then have to see and compare side by side these frames with complete tear downs. Until then, it will all be speculation. But people go for three things: performance reputation (tour/wins), weight/ aerodynamics, and the price. Canyon bikes are winning stages, have decent aerodynamics/ weight, and, for the price, give excellent components. This is coming from someone who's on SL7 sworks with top-tier components. I've never ridden a canyon, but I can also think like a consumer.
The DTC model for gear was put into play by 4FRNT skis. If you have good quality gear it's a no brainer. If you build shit then it is nit sustainable. +1 for the consumer.
You're saying they allegedly take Chinese frames, but then 1 min later you say they are pushing the boundaries on engineering.
Can't be both...
I think they are just analyzing the market and following their own style.
Specialized has the do-it-all bike, Canyon sticks to the full out Aero bike + climbing bike.
I prefer the do-it-all bike, because I want to have 1 single bike, so I got a Spesh
But I do like the looks of the Aerobike as well
When I was shopping for my frameset I actually considered the Aerobike, but then saw a really good deal on the SL7, so I went for that one
The new Canyon Ultimate is their do it all bike. It’s brilliant!
I’m that old guy you were talking about - riding continuously since the 80”s. It was time to upgrade from my 2016 Giant TCR 0 (all DA 15.5lbs). I went to my professional bike fitter (UC Davis Sports Medicine) and got fit with the dimensions before shopping for a new bike. No surprise - the stack and reach on endurance bikes were a better match than the Giant TCR. So I searched all the potential endurance bikes - Cerevlo Calendonia, Giant Defy (pre SL ), Specialized Roubaix, Trek Domane, etc. and what I found was all of the top end spec models were 2lb to 3lb heavier than the TCR… Yes, I am not as flexible as I was 20 years ago , I wanted something close to my TCR but a bit more relaxed and a bit more comfortable, but still light and responsive . After a long search, I found the Canyon Endurace SLX 9 (pre-toptube storage) it met the stack and reach requirements, and weighed about the same as my TCR , including more comfort from wider tires and flex seat post. The new Giant Defy SL wasn’t out yet, it would also worked - even if it would have been available there is no way I could justify spending $5,000 more for the Defy SL. Over the years I have ridden high end bikes from Merlin, Cervelo, Giant etc. After riding it, the Canyon rates up with any of them. For me it wasn’t as much about price as it was that Canyon offered the bike that fit the criteria I was looking for. ❤❤
My Aeroad 2020 is fast as f and looks glorious. Never will have an issue buying a Canyon. All the other brands are waaaay overpriced. I think Canyon are too but the other' are smoking something else!
Bought a 2023 Canyon Aeroad CFR with Shimano DuraAce Di2 12 Speed and DT Swiss ARC1100 top of Line Wheels all for $8,000 and I really LOVE my CFR. I’ve been riding every Top of Line Pinarello’s since 2006 up to a F10 and that’s when the price point went way way up with the F12 and then the F. I really love the Looks of the Pinarello F but at between $15-17,000 it was a No Brainer really. That’s almost double the price of the Canyon! Money justification reared its Ugly head. Had the Canyon not been priced that competitively then that would be a different story! Price MATTERS DEFINITELY and Bicycle Prices are gone MAD and thankfully Canyon has their thinking Caps on to save the very people that keep the Cycling World alive……. Just IMHO……..
sorry sour grapes Grant but wtf. canyon bikes are independently tested to be near the top in their categories. talking shit about canyon LOL go to tour mag and see the reviews. do they have qa issues yeah. so does trek with crappy bb90 and iso speed . specialized with steerer issue.
If the innovation, design and reliability is good enough for the world champion is good enough for me. Their business model is excellent for many people.
Bought mine when I was living in Japan. I’m 6’1” and none of the LBS’s had anything in stock in my frame size. Decided to give them a shot since they would send straight to my door. Had my bike shipped from Germany to Japan in 3 days. 10/10, would buy (and probably will buy) again.
💯💯💯Canyon offers VERY GOOD VALUE FOR MONEY! 💯💯💯 They are not OVERPRICED, unlike all the BIG BRANDS! 💯💯💯 Love Canyon design & aesthetics 👍👍👍
Also helps that MVDP won big races on this.
I bought my aeroad 23 for 2 reasons 1. imo the best looking aerobike 2. I ordered it and it was delivered 3 days later… in my opinion you asking the wrong quenstion… maybe the trek sl9 is the better bike but you need to compare the same pricepoint so is a sl6 with 105 and cheap wheels a better bike than the cf slx with ultegra and dt swiss. I also do everything on my bike by myself… so no Need of a bikeshop for me…
5 years, >30tkm w/o any issues with a canyon - even pressfit was fine. I like the attitude releasing new stuff like the "hover bar". Just sad they only sell as listed w/o any customization available to get the right fit.
When I first saw a Canyon bike in the pro pelotón, I knew I wanted one. That was back when Katusa was riding them about ten years ago or so.
Then Cycling Maven got one and I was soooo jealous. They're just beautiful bikes.
Now that I'm in a position to get my next bike, I knew I wanted a few things:
Electronic SRAM shifting
Power meter
Fully integrated / clean front end
For it to be a Canyon road bike.
My New Canyon Ultimate arrived Tuesday and my first ride in it was Wednesday. I love it so far.
Ditto. Team Katusha sold me on the Aeroads a very long time ago. The epic Red bikes plus the GCN's Is bike was my envy for a long time.
which ultimate did you end up getting?
I have a Canyon bike and had an issue with the crank, the support was good and fast and they even gave me an upgraded crank. This was in Europe, don't know about the service in the US. But on the topic of all the marketing going to funding the elite athletes and MVDP can win on anything, why would someone even bother spending more money on another legacy bike frame when even the top cyclists can win the stages on the "cheap" canyon frames. Is it just that the other frames looks better in your opinion, that they are worth spending more money on? ( I like the look of Canyon bikes) I think in the bike industry the bike prices are really high these days and only the top models really get promoted, so more people want the top models but the only moderately priced ones are Canyon bikes.
This sounds like the debate over Amazon 15 years ago. Why would someone want to buy on-line when they can go to the local electronics store and talk to real people and get the help they need. How did that work out. For the vast majority of bike buyers, the capability of the bike they buy far exceeds their ability. Regarding looks, Canyon road bikes tend to be extremely conservative, generic, vanilla. Some of that I suspect is to keep the design simple and less expensive to manufacture. Performance wise, there is little difference and totally unnoticeable by the average consumer between what your getting for $6,000 in a Canyon road bike vs $10,000 on a Specialized, Trek, etc. Average Joe or Jane does doesn't feel 8 watts of aero savings or 10% stiffer frame when they at max put out 300 watts going up hill. All the big bike brands have nearly identical engineering capabilities, design software, wind tunnel access, real world testing etc. and know very well how their bikes perform relative to the competition. At the end of the day, people buy Canyon for price and maybe just like car dealerships and direct to consumer EV cars they prefer the on-line shopping experience. Eliminating the middle man and understanding that there is a big market for selling high spec bikes with simpler frame designs is clearly a good business model for Canyon.
GC thanks for your channel, I’ve only been in the road bike sport for a few years and my first bike was a canyon endurance from the outlet store and my second bike was a Canyon Ultimate CF SL rim brake and I’ve been very happy and pleased with both purchases. With my budget canyons pricing enabled me to get into and enjoy the sport of road cycling.
I think if we are being honest, ALL bikes are way overpriced these days, including Canyon. They just aren't taking the Mickey quite as much as the big guys feel comfortable doing. In terms of on the road performance, I am sure most enthusiasts would simply not notice any difference, so why pay more?
The lower pricing of Canyon is just icing on the cake. I mean their bikes are out of this world good; the Aeroad is one of the fastest road bikes ever built. And incredibly comfortable! I'd buy Canyon even at a slight premium over other bikes.
In all honesty you’re asking the wrong questions. It’s not a question of PRICE, it’s one of VALUE. For anyone to think a bike of a certain spec “should be” $8000-15000 is simply ignoring the problem of bicycle pricing today, because I can buy a pretty high spec motorcycle for that money. Even Canyon’s bike prices are high from a perspective of manufacturing cost vs retail price.
A Canyon Endurace CF frame isn’t any worse than a Trek Domane SL. They’re both manufactured in China and have similar QC levels and issues. The SL 5 is $3600, and the comparable Canyon is $2299. There’s virtually nothing separating the two in terms of quality. The Canyon isn’t a lower quality frame for less money. It’s a comparable quality for less money. And with the extra money, a consumer can throw on carbon wheels and a power meter and have a significantly better bike than the Trek or Specialized alternative.
To answer your question, I'm buying a Canyon Ultimate even though similar Specialized models are 30-40% off here (South Korea) and thus slightly cheaper than the Canyons right now.
I don't own a Canyon but I don't get the hate from a bike shop. I will happily pay your mechanic their hourly rate for service regardless of the logo on my bike.
Just bought an aeroad after a madone and domane. Build quality is amazing. Spec is excellent. Price is exceptional. It rides flats with no effort and climb’s amazingly well. Your issue with canyon is based on capitalistic bias. You can’t turn around and make 2 grand for assembling a bike. Bikes in shops are overpriced. I’ve had issues with all my treks. All covered under warranty. Mainly seatposts etc. You keep talking about Chinese bikes like there’s something wrong with them. Check out the video of the guy who chops frames in half and details the production process of the carbon. I’ll take the expert opinion over your ignorant rambling any day.
Can not follow. Canyon has a huge R&D budget at the same size as Specialized and they really push for innovation. Also all warranty cases I know of were handled very decently.
So I can not follow the point of that video.
Would be interested to hear your thoughts on the Time Alpe D'huez or the Look 795 Blade RS in terms of performance and quality against other brands.
Specialized are SO OVERPRICED. They are ripping off consumers. Canyon is the people's brand.
Imho it comes down to this: If you have a good qualified local shop what really looks after you then sure, buy there. But most people probably don't have that. During Covid I tried to get some things done on my old bike in shops in my town and they didn't really wanted to or could not help. So over the 3 years I build my own little workshop in my basement, learned lots of new skills for maintenance and so on.
Of course my new bike was a Canyon. I can service it myself now and why should I throw money at people that where not willing to help my during the Covid times?
Canyon seems to be hitting the sweet spot in regards to the product, marketing and biz model. It's good to have competition.
Aren’t treks and specialized made in Asia too?
Wind tunnel numbers on a Canyon vs a Specialized don’t matter to 99.9999% of people. To some people paying $3,000 more to cover them in a low probability event like a frame failure, letting them bring a defective frame to a shop, is worth it for them. To others there’s no reason to pay $3k for that benefit. Plus, I’ve seen a bunch of videos where Grant complains about how Specialzied doesn’t let you customize your cockpit at all on a $12,000 bike.
I’d love to hear someone speak to the benefits of buying from a shop and what tangible things that extra 25% cost gets you. Rather than saying that DTC is bad because the bikes are unreliable based on anecdotes, let’s hear what you’re actually getting for those extra thousands and compare that to the cost you’d charge a DTC customer for the same service in your shop.
This. 25-30% margin to a shop is mismatched to the value perceived by the consumer. Buying from a shop is a better experience, but not 25-30% better when talking about $5-10k bikes.
@@hobmarg some brands have more than 50% margin.
@@Flexy1234 50% margin at the shop/distro level? I'd love to know what margin the big players have on frames, like what is the gross margin on an SL8 Tarmac SWorks frame, it has to be like 400% at Specialized's scale right? No way they are paying more than $1k per unit on those.
@@hobmarg average cost is around 500-700$ per frame , fuckers are so greedy 🤣
In June, was looking for an aero road bike to replace a Litespeed road bike from 2001. Looked at what the Pros ride in the tour and that was my short list. I did look at Winspace bc of Hambini, but wanted something that was proven either in a wind tunnel or race. I couldn’t justify new car money on a pro level bike from Cannondale or Cervelo (I ride a lot, but not a pro or pro power) but for a few grand less, I could get a Dura Ace spec bike from Canyon. Bought the Canyon. Zero problems in first 5000 miles, including riding across the US in Aug/Sept. wouldn’t change a thing on it.
Offcourse i choose canyon because it offers a good quality product for a competitive price. I would never buy a specialized for a few thousand more the frames aren't better. And i work daily with those bikes
Canyon cooler and more desirable in many people’s opinion than big boring mass produced Giant, Specialized, Cannondale, Trek etc. Canyon customer service has been excellent in my opinion. And local bike shops are hugely variable in quality, approachability and I’ve had more issues with LBSs doing a poor job compared to Canyon. Let’s face it all the brands are more or less the same mass produced in similar locations to similar quality. People aren’t suing canyon every 5 mins because their frame or fork exploded on a decent. Everyone has quality issues recalls etc. Buy canyon and have a few thousand pounds dollars or euros for servicing parts replacement upgrades or save it for your next bike.
I have three Canyon bikes 2 SLX and recently 2023 Aeroroad, awesome bikes! no issues that can't be easily fixed ... i.e. seat post creaking. and yes decision made after weeks of comparison and the price was the deal maker.
Following is from a mechanical engineer's perspective who has been cycling for decades.
It isn't the cost proposition. Its the value proposition. What is value by definition? Value as taught in school and even a boundary condition of design because engineers can design better products with a bigger budget..
Value = Cost/Benefit. Value is a ratio. How much does it cost? divided by how much bang for buck you get.
The misconception I believe promoted on this channel and others like it is...there is much difference between higher end carbon bicycles. There isn't. That somewhat solves the 'benefit' part of Cost/benefit equation. David Arthur recently tested a $14K flagship Trek Madone aero bike against a $6K round tube Giant TCR in a wind tunnel with the same riding position and wheelset. There was virtually nothing between them in terms of drag nos.
Marketing or lies. Pick your favorite word.
Back in 2016, a Scot Foil which was a very early iteration of an aero bike which had one of the harshest rides of any race bike on the planet 'ever' won the fabled cobbles race, the Paris Roubaix. So much for needing an endurance geometry bike to withstand the rigors of getting beat to death for 100 miles under the most grueling of riding conditions most of us will never experience.
Roadbikes now are highly evolved, I have ridden and raced with pros and ex-pros. One of the stongest riders I ever rode with rode an old aluminum round tube DeRosa with mechanical 105 and box section wheels. He could drop anybody I know on that thing.
So bikes now are close in performance and at the end of the day the 'rider' is what matters for speed on the bike and therefore 'money' walks and talks as to what a rider buys because you can't buy game or much game at least.
The Cannon business model 'speaks for itself'. It works for many people. For a guy like me who never walks in a bike shop because I build all my bikes from scratch, I don't need a bike shop. I mostly ride old Specialized bikes before Specialized lost its mind. I agree with Durianrider about the rip off of the bike industry and why I believe they will flounder in more difficult economic times in particular. Same with the car industry btw because greed and respective business models are not dissimilar. Probably 85% who ride a road bike do need a bike shop...especially with electric shifting and hydraulic brake hose routed through the head tube. Part of the reason so much of the public is hustled by the bike industry is because they are technically clueless. People live in a society where they turn in an Iphone for a new one. Fewer things are repaired now. They have never built a bike from scratch or god knows pulled an engine out of a car or changed the transmission on a motorcycle. They know nothing and are easier to sucker.
That's all.
Quality components that fit matter to me. More than looks or supposed aero benefits and that’s why I go for Canyon.
I got an Aeroad cf slx. Bought it as it got good reviews from both magazines and youtubers. I have put about 40 000 km on it and I think it is doing okey. I get better suport from Canyon than from Specialized.
I've had a Canyon Ultimate since fall of 2019. I'm 6'5, mine is an XL fits me like a glove. I love it. I'd buy another one in a heartbeat! Just my 2C.
The new Grail is likely going to be my next bike, not because of price, but because it is the only bike which has the geometry (and features) which I am looking for: longer wheelbase and reach, lower BB, in frame storage (so no seat bag out in the wind), lightweight (even in the SLX model). And yes, the price is not insane, like the one other frame I was considering (Enve MOG). Sound like you have some sour grapes GC! You say Canyon is a "cheap chinese frame", really??? Compared too what? How is it "cheap"? You actually site no specifics here-on the one hand you suggest that Specialized is a much higher quality frame, but again, no specifics, how is it higher quality? Specialized frames are mass produced in Asia, just like Canyon... I have not owned a Specialized bike, but I do have a set of Roval (specialized) Terra CL carbon gravel wheels. I love the wheels, but the quality of the carbon work was lacking: the factory rim tape job would not hold air and the reason was pretty simple: the rim bed finish was so rough the rim tape could not stick down to be reliably air tight. I had to spend a lot of my own time to fix this, carefully (I have worked with composites and do not recommend inexperienced folks do this) sanding the rim bed surface smooth enough such that the rim tape could get a reliable seal. Since I fixed the rims myself, the wheels have been great: but certainly the poor surface finish of the rim bed of these rims did make me think Specilized does not have some super high quality carbon work going on! Now, are Asian produced carbon frames of lower quality than some, perhaps yes, like maybe Time, and the Canadian made We Are One rims I use on my MTB appear to be of a very high quality-better than anything I have seen from Asia. But 90% or more carbon bike frames are of Asian origin, including Specialized, Cervelo, Trek, Giant, etc... Unless you can site some specifics, it sure seems like you are blowing smoke in canyon's direction here.
Been on Specialized for a long time (Chisel, Epic, Tarmac and now a Crux) and also own an Canyon Aeroad for almost 30-40% of the price point of a new Tarmac or a Dogma or Astro Vam. Am I happy with the Canyon right now?Yes I had to spend some big bucks on cockpit change but would be the same thing for the other brands as well. I think other brands need to start realising that the Covid level inflated prices need to come down (both from the starting range as well as the premium high end ones). We are going to see the same trend with the automotive industry.
I think Canyon is doing a fantastic job and as a consumer I am happy with that.
When I saw the aeroad for the first time on GCN 6 or 7 years ago I thought it was the coolest looking bike ever. Now that so many aero bikes look the same I can see the price being the big differentiator more many consumers.
Let me ask you the reverse question: why/how is a Specialzed/Trek/Scott etc a better frame than a Canyon? If it’s just down to shop support, which I 100% agree has value, is shop support really worth 25-30% margin on a $5-13k purchase? Tough to argue that on a road bike where it shouldn’t be in the shop very much. Mountain bikes is a different argument due to how much maintenance there can be.
I have a Trek Madone and a Canyon Aeroad. The Madone now hangs on the wall. I did. have one issue with the Canyon. The rear light charging cable would not charge the light. Called Canyon and they sent out a new, complete light and charging cable.
Retailers dont like Canyon - nothing New / Specialized is a king of marketing but nothing really New since years too / i have a sworks sl6 and a canyon Grail and both bikes are fantastic
Competitive price is a great feature. Don’t hate! I can’t wait to see the bicycle bubble burst. I say this as someone who bought a brand new S Works in 2021.
I am that older guy. I been riding a Canyon Endurace CF SL di2 Aero for five years putting 38k km on it. Last May I got Aethos S-Works..Love both bikes. Canyon Endurace is more comfortable and Aethos is 1 kg lighter. Not to be a cliche but the Canyon was €4100 and Aethos €14000. I prefer the headset bearings and BSA Treaded bottom Bracket in the Aethos from a maintenance perspective. Customer service is great in my Specialized LBS. My couple of interactions with Canyons customer service has been bad but my LBS has sorted any issue out without significant cost or fuss. So what’s the real differences, well three things.. Comfort, weight and €10000. Two of them are subtle to imperceptible.
I bought my Grizl only over the price and components,… the same diverge f.a ( components) you pay 3 tsd. € more 3299 to 6300 think you pay a lot for name like trek or Specialized … or other brand Cervelo ,… open enve …. … development is the key … the service and the price. For employees in stores of non canyon brands will need a pay check … and that’s why in my opinion , take a specialized bike is at least 2000/3000 in the same specs more expensive … and that is what the lower price is the service… do not go with a canyon to a normal bike shop for a repair … they will in the most normal way not accept a Canyon bike… here in Germany the are now more service points and I think they will be
more worldwide …in the luckiest. fall in your neighbourhood 😂 best greeting from Hamburg
The Aeroad is a rocketship 🚀
"decent looking frame"? Damm, i find it gorgeous...
I own a Canyon lux trail CF , and previously an Exceed and Neuron AL. Canyon has to have good looking frames with good components or they wouldn't sell because you never get an opportunity to look and feel the bike in person, but the frame quality , especially on CF models feels very much like it was built to a budget. If you compare Canyon CF frames to Specialized even FACT 9 there is no comparison. The Specialized frames feel like a finished product whereas the Canyon frames don't feel optimised or refined, just really stiff and they also like you say look good. If Specialized for example was the same price Canyon wouldn't be in the game at all. By the way I've never had bad service from Canyon, I'm dealing with Germany direct. They have always been polite and efficient.
Tour Mag tests, data proves u are wrong. Canyon frames are pretty stiff but also very compliant. Dozens of different frames tested in the last 10 years.
Don't need tests as i own an Epic and Lux trail. There is a difference trust me!@@Gianniz27
This is a flawed comment/argument, each manufacturer have their own customer target, just like BMW vs Toyota, if BMW were to lower their prices to Toyotas, obviously Toyota will definitely go out of business as soon as tomorrow. But BMW won’t do that because they would go out of business themselves too. Horses for courses, dude!
Canyon directly compete with Specialized. Toyota do not compete directly with BMW. I don't see your logic here.@@cestmoi6029
Design is clean, price is good, colours are nice, they kit up bike with known brands not some in house stuff, at least in EU there is excellent support, they have price point for every budget and more. If you look Specialized sl8 is starting at more than 6k and Ultimate starts at 2.6k. If you want to buy at same price you need to get SL6 (who else sales 2 generation old bike?). People who buy high end bikes for 14k are older people who were watching old races when this brands were dominating. New generations will watch Canyon riders and on top of that the bikes are wallet friendly so they can ride them too. This so called top tier brands have the worst marketing. Old school system based on local shops.
The quality is as good as a specialized/trek/cervelo
every brand sometimes has a problem even specialized with their sl7 steerer tube recall
You make it sound like selling DTC and providing consumers with real value is some sort of evil marketing trick! Canyons are great, I'm on my second Ultimate and the experience from customer service has been brilliant. I crashed a frame during a lockdown and had a new one shipped Germany to NZ within a week. Also, re. your comment they're generic - Canyon has one on the most distinctive and consistent design languages of any brand. Local bike store very happy to build up my frame and service my bike.
Also, the QC rocks. They were the first manufacturer to invest in CT scanning critical components - they do it twice, at manufacture AND at assembly/depatch for forks and cockpits. Another big tick from me...
thats very nice, there are plenty of cases where people have enjoyable cases, but also I hear more cases oif people having bad times with them that is the reason for the video
Question is who is really manufacturing the tour pros bikes? Just like the old steel bikes, do you wonder if there’s a custom shop building the tour pros bikes to look exactly like the mass production bikes at a much different quality level to hold up during things like the Tour de France.
I would agree with your logic, but Canyon bikes review very well and win a lot. You talked me into buying one 👍
I own an Enve Melee road bike. I also own a Canyon Grail gravel bike. Honestly they both perform well. Now aren’t most major brands built at the Giant factory in Asia? IMOP find the best bike that fits you for the money.
$2700 for my Canyon Endurace with 105 di2. My brand is normally Cannondale and they had a Supersix Evo at $4500 and another at $4250. Also a Synapse for $4500. I just cant justify almost an extra 2 grand. I think that Synapse is on sale now for $3370. Too late. I looked at Giant also, my local shops are dealers. $3000 with mechanical 105. If Canyon can offer such prices, no reason why bigger companies shouldn't be able to or at least come close.
It's such a foreign point of view to me. Just placed an order for a €1600 van rysel ncr tiagra. Most of my friends have actually cheap road bikes for around €1000. Whining about "cheap 5-7k" doesn't make sense to me. I just have to congratulate all you people that are that much richer than I am.
I actually considered a 3k canyon ultimate cf, but the proprietary steering tube diameter was too off putting to me. Being locked in into canyons mail order service every time i want to adjust my fit.
I think you are misunderstanding why people keep bringing up canyon and the price. They bring up the price because they're essentially trying ti say why are they able to bring down the price of a bike and the big companies can't. I still feel like if canyon was a big box store that charged the same prices they would still sell. And I'm pretty sure that's mainly up to their marketing team. Specialized pushes the marketing of their achievements but canyon markets with athletes and projects.
Come on GC. Canyon exposed how other brands are ripping customers. It’s widely known fact that bike shop margin is 35% manufacturers margin is another 30-35%. I understand you have a shop but they have been exposed.
They are not that cheap, to be honest 🥺
I doubt you will even see my comment but ive worked with multiple brands in Australia as a mechanic, i think canyons are just as good as their competitors.
Ive built a few canyons for customers and they always seem really good quality, and way cheaper than what my shop could sell a bike of that level for.
90% of riders wouldnt even know or feel the difference in a good quality vs poor quality frame, but what they can notice is how good the gears and brakes work.
So why would they want to pay more for a bike that has shitter components ?
If someone rides around with a loose headset and dosent even realize, are they going to notice the areo gains of a 10k bike? NO
For 90% of riders, A good groupset and brakes (and wheels) if going to make your ride wayyyy better compared to a tarmac with stock wheels and 105
As far as after sales service, iv had one experience when a flux came into our shop to be built and when i unboxed it, there was a solid impact in the front triangle. Canyon sent our shop a new front try angle and paid us to fit it. Was a very easy process
I feel a lot bike riders have no idea how to take care of their bike, let alone maintain it, and they would be the ones complaining about canyon and other brands.
If i owned a shop i might think different but shops hate on canyon because they cant make money off them…. I bet most would sell them if they could
As a mechanic and someone who has ridden for over 15 years, i think they are pretty solid
I see your comment and also I have worked on a lot of them since this video with people seemingly to bring to me to build weather for fun after the video or just for service. But since this. I have also figured these bikes are a little better than what I thought. They work good
It does suck that canyon is sort of anti LBS, but they sell their bikes for what these bikes should be closer to costing. Nobody can convince me that an sl8 is that much better than an aeroad or an ultimate.
Also can’t knock canyon for selling bikes with marketing like MVDP, when half the reason people obsess over Specialized is the s-works logo. Ask Chris miller what he thought a out his aeroad
Canyon have some nice features not found elsewhere, like the VCLS 2.0 CF seatpost or accesoires that fit like a glove, like fenders, for some models. Their ebikes have been available, too, in a time where there's been shortages. (I bought all, though returned the ebike for a Look.) Some models are interesting since they seem to be a better market fit, like the Roadlite:ON.
I think this seatpost is originally made by Ergon, their model is named CF Allroad Pro Carbon, but the one from Canyon comes for a very interesting price at the moment, 140 euro here in Germany, not sure about other markets
@@e_mtbErgon and Canyon are founded and owned by two brothers
Are you able to do a review on the new 2024 LOOK 795 blade rs with corima mcc dx/Evo wheelset🙏🏽? It’s so hard to find any decent reviews on it😵💫
I own two Canyon bikes. Gravel and endurance road. The ride quality of the frame feels unrefined. It's decent but not velvety smooth like my BMC Team machine. But the price makes up for it.
I bought a 2023 Canyon Endurace with Di2 groupset. Wanted to love it so bad, but didn’t. Switched to a 2020 Roubaix and it feels more like what I expected the Endurace to feel like. Feels lighter, faster, bettering cornering. Roubaix is also more comfortable stock but stuck with proprietary seatpost and future shock stem. So that’s both a plus and minus. Still much happier with the Roubaix over the Endurace.
the roubaix is a very uner rated endurance bike, a lot of people stay away from it because of the future shock but that bike is so nice to ride and very smooth
Thanks for the perspective. I love my TCR but have my complaints. I feel some people prefer fancy components over a premium frameset, IMO
Are they really that bad? I went to Koblenz where Canyon‘s home base is for a couple of times. The folks are very enthusiastic. Their bikes aren‘t that bad. It feels like their prices are still tough to beat but the gap between the old pack and them is no longer that big what is good for LBS‘s and the market at all.
If you have the chance to get the bike you desire at a reasonable price, always buy it locally. But if not, why not Canyon?
I'd be willing to buy consumer direct. However, I'll typically ride a size small, which usually comes with a 100mm stem. I need a 120mm, and I would prefer 38cm bars. And I can't change the stem length when ordering, so it could be something like $1k to change an integrated cockpit after purchase, plus I now have a stock size cockpit hanging around.
Also, I've had two people with Canyons have their seatposts slip during group rides this year.
I would rather purchase from a dealer and know I have support and pay more than get a mail order bike and hope for the best. I question the stability of the adjustable handlebars. Thanks for being there for the customers and making great videos.
i owned canyon aeroad CF SLX 2021 been satisfied with the performace, the stiffness when you applied power just went off and the stability at high speed, cornering is smooth and stable, off saddle sprint is balance also....proof that the aeroad frame is no fluke, also just purchase the ultimate CF SLX with new sram force and comes with the zipp firecrest 303 for my all round and climbing bike for $6000 that is a steal....
I bought a Canyon ultimate and took it for 2 rides and loved it but the stem was too short. Well with the proprietary integrated cockpit I was SOL. Canyon had no replacement bars in stock and didn’t know when they would have more. Bike sent back. I want an Ultimate but I need a longer stem…so I am locked out.
Once you have ridden for awhile and you build your fitness you understand that it's not all about the bike.You don't need to go out and buy a top tier bike to be fast.Most cyclist come to the conclusion that a 3 or 4 thousand dollar bike can be just as fast as a 14000 bike.So yes if I can buy a cheaper bike with good components and save 7 or 8 thousand dollars then that's what I will do.We are not pros so we are not concerned about what they do on a bike.And yes those China made bikes are on the rise because of value.
Almost everything at the Tour is from China
I totally agree about the fitness and a good fit mire important than swag
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yeah fastest guy on my group ride is using an 80s steel race bike.
If I’m to be perfectly honest, this sounds like a real sour grapes rant. Very similar to the reaction of auto dealers against Tesla who also sell direct to consumer. I don’t see why any self respecting top pro team would pick Canyon simply because of “marketing”. They have no shortage of Tour level victories relative to other brands. They’re also consistently placed at or near the best in bike comparison reviews (go watch CZcams). I think you’re upset because you don’t have their business. That does NOT mean that their bikes have mediocre design or low quality as you’re insinuating.
I understand where you are coming from, maybe my take is pretty biased like I said I am a dealer so they are my main competition but also with cheaper prices and more money to pocket because they do not have retail stores they can dump more money into paid marketing videos to get there bikes out there
you say it looks like any other china build bike and you are not wrong, if you look up canyon ultimate and og-evkin 25 disc you will see that it is the exact same bike! I also own both(one for me and one for the wife) and can confirm without a doubt they both left the same factory.
over 10tkm on both with 0 issus so cant really complain about it, canyon and giant are the only big brand with okay ish prices and the rest of the big names are just out of touch with reality.
thats the dyson model...everyone loves their dyson because they spent 800 bucks on a vacuum that works just like my 50 dollar.
To your point. If the bike similar to Canyon for 9K retails 12-13K. Does the LBS really need to make 3-4K per bike? Maybe local bike shops should become Local Bike Service where there is pure margin and bikes should be sold Direct to consumer? just a thought.
MAPDEC cycling Chanel just dis a video about this! He I embracing change, the bike bands like Giant have started to sell directly on sale cheaper than he got supplied on his floor, it's not up to customers to support anyone it up to business to offer value
Ah c'mon, don't you know how difficult a job it is to sell bikes? It requires unique skills and so many years of education and training. They should charge a mark up of 20k at least.
@@TikeMyson69nice😅😅😅😅
@@TikeMyson69 That’s an extremely unfair and false take on things. It costs a hell to run a shop (rent for a convieniently located shop, labour, interior design , marketing and the complete inventory of goods). You may not fancy to browse in a real shop with real merchandise and pay the surplus for that service, all well and good, I do neither out of several reasons (small choice of brands for bikes and parts and clothes, no real test drives of bikes anyway, sales staff are mostly clueless, too expensive). But providing that service is expensive, and it is without doubt impossible to match online shop prices with a brick-and-mortar shop.
Bought my Aeroad due to wind tunnel numbers and lack of availability of Systemsix. Have 3k miles on mine since spring, quality has been great. Faster on flats and downhills than any of my buddies… actually pretty surprising. Arguably the fastest bike on the market. Also it rides great and is comfortable too. No other bike in this category has fully integrated bars and 60mm premium wheels. My guess is the pricing beats dealer price by a lot of all other bikes in the category.
This is one of the points he is making. You paid $$$$ and your perception is that your new bicycle is amazing. Of course it is better than your older bike. But I have not seen wind tunnel testing comparison of different brands. Then how do you know yours is the fastest? As a matter of fact David Arthur did a wind tunnel comparison test of Trek, canyon and Giants. New Canyon ultimate was slower than old giant TCR.
@@Questioneverything72 who is talking about the ultimate. Just because you haven’t seen the data doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. Test results are well documented, check Tour magazine. And no my numbers are not based on feel vs my old bike. I gap my buddies and I put out fewer watts. Coasting downhill side by side in a tuck I accelerate away from them, same body weight and I am taller. The David Arthur wind tunnel video was debunked due to different body position. Educate yourself. My point is that even if you spend $8k or $9k on a Trek, Giant, Spesh, Scott, BMC you are not getting nearly as good components. You have to spend more than that to get similar level of wheels and cockpit.
@@melmyers4164 yes price point as I mentioned in my own comment is unbeatable. As far as your road experience, I hear you but it is unreliable. A little wind or different temperature that day changes the whole equation…Regarding wind tunnel numbers , you just have to take their words, and as far as I know all brands compare their own new frame with their older version and claim new bicycle is some few seconds faster... If you know of any side by side testing of two different brand name bicycles I would appreciate if you provide the link.
@@Questioneverything72google tour magazine its's a german magazine han has done tests on most of the popular bikes. It's in german so you will have use google transelate
I have two canyon bikes and have returned three because of the wrong size / damage to the frame. I also bought a ton of accessories from them and had no issues with customer support. You are based in North America so maybe it is different over there.
Also, if you work at a bike shop you probably get a selective group of people who have had issues with canyon bikes (or other direct to consumer brands), which is why the decided to just get a bike from you - an expert who can advice them in person.
It’s a very interesting video, thanks for sharing.
yea I can see how my videos come off as bias because I am there main competition and like you said I get people who bring me there problems, so this I understand but what you said might be true as well, I have heard that NA canyon is slower to respond then peoples experience over in EU
I have a Canyon Endurace CF 8. It needed some fine tuning after I got it but otherwise it did pretty well so far. I recently also got a Specialized Aethos Expert from a local dealer because I wanted to get an upgrade and so far I've had nothing but trouble with it. Or rather I had one week of trouble with it in October and it's been in for repairs ever since. Kind of makes me wonder what exactly I paid a 1500€ premium over a similarly speced Endurance CF SLX for.
that sounds horrible, I mean the aethos as well is such a simple bike too, I dont think there are too many issues to go wrong with that bike
@@GCPerformance18 The initial issues were, as far as I can tell, incompetence on the dealer's side. They took over a week to build it, apparently because they couldn't figure out how to get the Di2 cabling right, and when I finally got it the saddle and hoods were mounted askew, brake rotors were rubbing, the Di2 battery wasn't charged and, as it turned out, the front axle wasn't tightened. I fixed the previous issues myself but I only noticed the loose axle when it slipped out after 80km of riding causing damage to the wheel and fork. Afaik it was then sent back to Specialized for repair. That was over seven weeks ago, no idea what they've been doing with it all this time. I would have thought replacing a fork and a wheel would take a few days max. I should probably also mention that the dealer from which I bought it is an officially licensed Specialized dealer and supposedly one of the more reputable bike shops in my city...
Canyon DOES have a customer service issue. They do not follow through with promises in my experience, personally. However, Grant - Trek is selling the Checkpoint for about the same price as that high end Grail you showed.
In our shop, I have seen Canyons nearly rattled apart frame wise. They seem to be cheaply built. They do give great specs and they hype for sure.
After owning several Canyons, I went with Trek for my new road bike.
Just paid for the wheelset and groupset, while the frame is free🤣
Joker. 😂
While I was shopping in 2019 for a $2k bike it appeared to me that Canyon was the only company using ALL Shimano components instead of house brands for chain/cassette/BB ….. and at the time this was important to me….don’t think it matters as much now.
Also it had 105 which I couldn’t find in the BS brands.
similarly priced are ORBEA’s , just curious how do they stack up against CANYON performance wise? obviously canyon has done alot more in terms of marketing. just asking for an opinion. thanks.