CHEAP, JUNKYARD, BOOSTED SWAP MOTORS. L67 3800 V6 VS 4.8L LS! WHO MAKES MORE STOCK & WITH MODS?
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- čas přidán 23. 07. 2024
- JUNKYARD BOOST BATTLE. HOW DOES A SUPERCHARGED 3800 V6 COMPARE TO A 4.8L LS V8? EVEN WITH THE BENEFIT OF BOOST, CAN THE LITTLE V6 COMPETE WITH THE BIGGER V8? CHECK OUT THIS COMPARISON BETWEEN A JUNKYARD L67 SUPERCHARGED 3800 V6 AND AN EQUALLY CRUSTY 4.8L LS TRUCK MOTOR. HOW MUCH POWER DO THEY EACH MAKE IN STOCK TRIM? WHAT ABOUT AFTER SOME MINOR UPGRADES, LIKE A PULLEY FOR THE BLOWER OR A CAM FOR THE 4.8L? WHAT HAPPENS WEHN WE ADD A CAM TO THE V6 AND EVEN WILDER CAM TIMING TO THE LS? NOW LET'S ADD A TURBO TO BOTH!
- Auta a dopravní prostředky
We NEED more turbo 3800 tests! I think a 3800 with a turbo alone will hold a candle to a 4.8l! We need to find out though!
Id like a Super & Turbo 262cid 4.3L.
Amazing the Gen 1-Gen 5 SBC, Buick Series 1-3 3.8, and the 262 4.3 are all 90° Engines
Richard, years ago I used to street race and track race a 1995 Riviera, 3800 supercharged with about a 125 shot of dry nitrous and a BIG fuel pump/regulator and it went NUTS! I would REALLY like to see you test NITROUS on SOME 3800.. PLEASE! The cooling effect of the Nitrous on top of the Supercharger makes SUBSTANTIAL torque gains! Thanks for all the hard work! (worked it down to 13.80s in the 1/4 mile from 16.40s!)
Series 1 buick 3.8
I have just recently hit 13s with my 2 door GTP on minor bolt ons. Really an impressive platform no doubt! I have had faster cars but whenever I'm in the ole GTP everyone wants to play and race, they all think its a massive underdog lol, and it surprises ALOT of people. Really makes driving this car fun. I hope to one day hit 10s with an all out build 🙏 and still daily this pig. It's awesome the aftermarket is still alive and improving these 3.8 bricks.
@@BagpipekilR I'm glad and hoping the market stays alive for a 2000 SSEi as well.
I am currently putting a l67 and a turbo in my 87 buick t type
Sounds like an awesome build 👍 are you documenting it anywhere?
I’ll never get tired of looking at dyno graphs
3800 is such a badass platform. So much potential, the 3800 can make some unreal power when built right, and they sound so good with a big cam, I would dare say better lope than a V8 imo. The Aussies have pushed over 1000hp to the tire consistently with these little V6 motors. And they pull HARD!
You could put the 2.8 bellhousing on the 3.8 then find a clutch then put it in a s10 with a t5
Waiting for the N/A 3800 with added turbo video.
Just wanted to say a big thank you Richard. There isn't a great deal of in depth l67 content available that tests multiple combos like you have. In Australia is is a bit of a niche platform to work with as they didn't produce a massive amount of these motors. I like that they are a bit of a different thing and the way they deliver power makes for a really enjoyable mild street motor. Thanks again for your other guys series. I'm about to sort out my L67 very soon and get some more power. You have helped out in a big way in helping to understand what these things want and respond to. 👌✌👍
I smoked a brand new 370Z with a '99 Buick Regal GS up to 100... Loved that little 4 door sleeper!
I really like this format with the graphics and dyno graphs. Good work
Personally I like the idea of the 3800 with a dedicated turbo!
Still waiting for the Truck Norris in the 4.8. Love your vidoes
Cant wait for that ported heads and turboed 3800 Richard!
Hello Richard,nice job
The bigger motor definitely has more power potential. The LS is an excellent and proven V8. However, there's something to be said about the 3800's durability. I've been hitting my L32 with 500-700whp for 10 years and it still runs mint. I've been next to (in front of) several s/c and turbo LS combo's and more than a few of them have spilled their guts all over the road. Not saying the 3800 is better, just saying it is a damn tough engine.
700 whp?
@@richardholdener1727 the weakest 3800 (l26) has been over 700 wheel. Current record is over 1200 wheel over in Australia
As much as I love my V8's I really enjoy my little 4.4L V6 that's in my Typhoon. I can't wait to get the new bigger turbo on it & turn up the boost.
4.3*
@@Duke9089 well it started as a 4.3L but is now a 4.4L as it displaces 266 cubic inches.
Barring a situation where the 4.8 just wouldn't fit well (transverse mid-engine setup for example cough:fiero:cough) I'd be hard pressed to pick the 3800 over the V8 in any application. 3800 is a solid engine, but LS is better.
Look at Series 2 and 3 Buick 3.8Ls. Consider the 4.3L 262 LU3
Huh, i have a whole subframe in backyard from a 1997 LSS olds 3800 supercharged guess i should do something with it.
Cant wait to see the 4.8 with a m90 and like 4:1 drive ratio lol
I have 3 too many projects right now. I have an M90 I've been slowly remodeling to work with a Carb. It's been done before, and quite successfully. The rear Bearings I've chosen have a 2 lip seal, and the manufacturer claims they can withstand Nitromethane, Ethanol and "Etc."
The 3800 s/c would be alot better if the throttle body wouldn't be pointed at the firewall in a rwd application
The 3800 and the 4300 were a Chevy 350 CID V-8 with 2 cylinders cut out and the 3.8L had a odd firing order.
If you look at what Gale Banks has done with compound super-turbocharging, he's found that turbos feeding the supercharger is a bad arrangement for highest efficiency and power (but good for packaging under the hood). The supercharger needs to feed the turbos.
I think he did that on a diesel-this is not that
@@richardholdener1727 You have more knowledge than me, so I defer to you. If you have time, watch this Banks video "1,200hp The Wrong Way", see if my opinion carries any water
czcams.com/video/i6cR5Jx2UsM/video.html
you should do or should have done the LS4 vs. the L67
I see a TT LS V6 coming down the pipe in the very near future. . .
I wonder what a chevy vortec 2700,2900,3500 or 3700 would make, their great inline 4&5 cylinder engines. We know the vortec 4200 is capable what about the cheaper smaller versions. Also those 2.0 ecotec engines the LNF, LDK gen2 variants or the LTG,LSY gen 3 variants. All cheap and abundant drivetrains with potential, probably more then a 3800 v6. You should do a 3800 v6 vs a inline 5 & inline 4 vortec vs a 2.0l ecotec.
Any vehicle 3300lbs or less would be a rocketship with the modified 3.8sc. I never went that far with a gtp, I ran series2 motor, stock m90/ 3.2pulley and they run quite well considering heavy fwd auto car. It would destroy the tires if you wanted too lol
Stroke the 3800 to 4100.
The 3800 comes from the same engine family that includes the BOP 215 aluminum V8 and the Rover 3.5, 3.9, 4.0, 4.2, 4.6 alloy V8. And the Buick 300, 340, 350 V8s. That Eaton blower should be very adaptable to the V8s.
They make a stroker kit that brings it to 4.2 liters but it's pretty expensive and doesn't do much for strength. Unless you got forged internals. Which the 3800 internals are already pretty damn stout. People have had it up to 30+ psi on stock internals with a tvs1900. blower.
I'd think for a truck I'd look for the more ft-lbs deal
Truck cam
All depends on what your intentions are with it.
That 3800 is a little torque monster
Holdener I hope you read this. And test \ prove it. Can you PLEASE do a video, on turbo boost & spool vs exhaust leaks. Showing how much or little, exhaust leaks can hurt you. How it may create lag or boost loss. Like little leaks up to bigger leaks. I just think it would be a great learning video. P.S. love you vids man !
I have been talking about that for years-after using oxygen sensor holes in my y pipe to help improve a situation with too small of a waste gate-I need to just do it-and leaks in the cold side
@@richardholdener1727 I'm going to have to look up that vid. I'm super curious on the results
I’ve always wondered what a twin screw would do for the 3800 compared to the stock Eaton M90.
I DID THAT-THAT VIDEO IS UP-I MADE AN ADAPTER TO RUN A KENNE BELL
Does wonders
My problem is what manual transmission can handle that sort of power for the 3800? Someone please let me know!
Does a 3800 really bolt to a 4l60E?? I guess there was a fwd W body with a 5.3 in it which is the opposite so... yes?
It's funny Richard mentions putting one in an S10. I've toyed with that idea so many times over the years. I wonder about reliability with the 3800 at that power level
Extremely reliable
But the 4.8L was RWD application and the Buick 231 CID 3800 was a FWD engine must be took into consideration as well
Richard... You clever man.. For a swap into a smaller vehicle, say an S 10, I can see the V-6 Supercharged may be a better choice. If one wants insane power, an NA 6.0 LS would be the simple choice, but the compact V-6 sounds like an excellent alternative to a 4.8 V-8. For the Ford guys, Ford 3.5 Ego Boosts a plentiful at the wreckers. The 3.5 Ford is already turbo, of course, and a variant of this little monster won Lemans in 2016
Finally Ford won Le Mans again, Corvette took it like 8 times.
i got a 96 buick with 56k miles on it, so wish it was the supercharged one lol .
Had to keep the LS guys happy lol
3800 compound needs to rev higher, and def needs intercooling and/or water-meth....the compound loses a lot of its advantages to heat, that's why the boost can be high but little or no gains
I have a 97 RS camaro with a 3.8 that had a rod knock when I bought it to put the rear end in my 3rd gen ls swap camaro. I have kind of wanted to put the gtp supercharger on the camaro instead of just putting a ls in it
Skip the blower, it’s not very easy on the f-body’s and a turbo will make way more power
@@TurboTPI yeah that's one reason I haven't done that yet lol
It's a lot of fun if you do go the m90 route. Mine was a ton of fun when it was running. Both turbo and blower have their own challenges, but the turbo is easier to get big power out of it than the m90
Boosted Bird. I have my 3rd gen camaro with a 5.3 and tko600 for the power part. I just have the 97 sitting around with a bad engine and figured of doing something different so big power isn't something it needs
@@levisouder5777 m90 builds are generally good for about 350+ whp, with insane torque. But there are people who have pushed it to 450+ and the record on an m90 being 500+. I like my blower whine, so that's why I'm sticking with the blower, even tho a turbo is much easier to make power with lol
Guys I remember working on the 3800, 3100, 3400 in the '90s. I've swapped 4.8 LR4's and LQ4 6.0's into a couple 4x4 crawlers and a hot s#!+ race car. An NV3500 works behind any gen3 LS in terms of fitment like what comes from the factory. Does the 3800 V6 have the same fitment in terms of being rear wheel drive? SM465, M20 bolt up fitment? The 3800 ain't no joke with boost but will it bolt up with a T56? CD009? Tremec TKX/TKO600? I never gave it that much thought way back then while being underneath them on a lift, on flat rate but I sure knew and paid attention to suspension and steering geometry with every car I came across. What's up with the old 3800? Can it bolt up to a rwd transmission like an SBC or even a gen3 LS? School me guys. A 1996 corsica ain't a bad daily when your 7.3 tow rig is on big single shots.
3800 version all have GM metric corporate bell housing. The S-10 did have 5 speed corporate housing that may hold up but the early 2000’s camero 3800 were all NA but had 4L60e which you could put behind 3800SC just be sure to grab the oil pan, exhaust manifolds, and oil pump housing from camero. Also the LS4 has the corporate belling housing fwd just a FYI.
If you use the stock computer you will have to segment swap with hp tuners.
There is an adapter for both t56 and sbc (th350/400)
Thanks guys!
Cam swap + 3.0 Pulley swap - 4# boost reduction... Did cam reduce 6#? or no gain from pulley?
CAM DROPPED 4 PSI BOOST-THEN PULLEY ADDED SOME BACK-THAT VIDEO IS UP ALSO
Take the supercharger off put a fbody intake on it with the turbo it’ll make more power
Time to get rid of the supercharger on the 3800 thats choking it and turn it into a fire breathing monster with a big turbo on it :)
What about the Ford supercharged 3.8 by? Why the GM bias? lol
Did you have to change from stock injectors for the 3800?
yes-the injectors need to be big enough to feed the power level
@@richardholdener1727 thought so. I assumed to the 60lbs. Thanks for the cool videos. I wish you were close enough to join our 24 hrs of lemons team. Lol
When it comes to comparing the supercharged 3800 to the na 4.8 LS, I prefer the 5th gen 4.3 V6. Do some LV3 stuff. Cam and turbo. It'll blow any supercharged 3800 into the weeds and be lighter. The 4.3 replaced the Gen4 4.8 with the same power, and even more if run on E85. Smaller and much lighter package than the iron block 4.8.
I've been considering doing a 4.3 Lv3/lv1 to replace my m90'd Firebird. Only problem I see is there is little to know aftermarket support.
Between a stroker + aluminum heads + m112 supercharger + e85/ic combo 3800 or a fbo Lv3 with an m112 blower and e85/ic combo.
About the same price comparing the two set ups, but with less aftermarket on the 4.3 I'm hesitant to trying it
di/vvt motors are problematic to run on the dyno
Not enough support, its like trying to upgrade heads on a LU3, L35. The 4.8L is older, and can handle moar boost.
4.8L LR4 crank in a 5.3L LH6 block,GT45 and E85. Light and lots of power.
@@boostedbird4799 A stroker split-pin crank would definitely be expensive. But it doesn't seem like a Brian Tooley VVT cam with lobe positioning for the V6 would be such a big stretch. Then porting the heads would be common with the L83 5.3L. They use the same ports and valves. Keep the stock intake manifold. Turn the exhaust manifolds around and plumb to a front-mounted turbo. DI injectors from a ZR1 Corvette would easily handle the fuel requirement.
Were not live
Personally I blame squirrels
Which one is best for fuel mileage?
I’d guess the 3800. My dads old 1997 park avenue ultra used to average 31-32mpg on the highway. Not bad for a big sedan with a supercharged V6
L67 3800 V6, Australian Commodores fitted with that motor got 36-40 highway MPG.
The key to the fuel mileage on the 3800 SC is the air bypass valve in the lower intake manifold that allows intake air to go around the supercharger, thus reducing the pressure and the load of the supercharger. When vacuum drops with throttle angle, the air door in the intake closes, allowing boost pressure to develop.
40 mpg?
@@richardholdener1727 After learning how the auto company's determine mpg, 40mpg is easy unfortunately. Average speed is in the 40's for these tests with limited acceleration.
We all know the 3800 could have put the 4.8 to shame !
😲, not bad for such an old & bad breathing engine (GM 90° 3.8L V6).
I would probably do turbo with an N/A intake, ported/matched everything on both intake and exhaust sides, add cam, springs and call it day.
That factory splayed crank probably was screaming murder thru the whole ordeal. 😁👍
Have that... Works great! 👍
What do these guys thinks going to happen, Putting boost to a v8 over a v6, The way I look at it , Why can't the v8 beat the v6 stock with out, any boost, All he did was equalize the game. So this Proves a v6 can be made to make just as much hp as a v8, I Think Thats all some,.