Should you use Macs with unsupported macOS and No Security Updates?
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- čas přidán 23. 08. 2024
- Should you use Macs with unsupported versions of macOS with no new security updates? In this video we answer that question as well as things that you can do to keep your MacBook or Mac computer safe when using unsupported versions of macOS on older Apple Mac computers. Learn what is the best practices for keeping your older Macs and unsupported versions of macOS free of viruses or malware. We cover all the things you can do with older Macs to keep you and your data safe in this video.
Link to check what version of macOS is supported on your Mac - eshop.macsales...
Link for Apple's latest security updates - support.apple....
Link for Open Core - dortania.githu...
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my 2012 15" Macbook Pro is unreal still. runs Sonoma. I run multiple virtual machines on them. took out the old mechanical HD and put in an SSD and upraded the RAM. Amazing machine still
Same
My 2008 unibody MacBook Pro is running fine too. Relying on Chrome. Gave it an SSD and RAM upgrade a decade ago and while it’s not powerful by modern standards and covers basic needs and I’m determined to keep it running just because ….
@@shred3005 Its amazing how usable these old macs are. I bought 15 on ebay and 13 of them came not working. Taught myself the same and its easy. new SSD and RAM but having to fix firmware and using open core legacy and I was shocked at how well they work for their age. Some in great condition id get for 30$ or 40$. The 2012 unibody 15" Mac might be the best one. I have three. Dual boot Linux on them and they run great. Those amazing old Apple keyboards
@@shred3005 I cant do Chrome. Safari Brave and TOR for me. Sometimes firefox but bro. I dont pay for youtube at all. I watch all my youtube FREE of ads using the Brave Browser. I havent seen a youtube ad in years. Just watch youtube via Brave. on your phone or whatever
@@shred3005 I gave my 2008 BlackBook an SSD and 4GB RAM (max is 6GB but then you lose dual channel which is really important for an iGPU) and it runs VERY well. Perfect for me, managing my iPods.
You get around studios and people doing production work you'll find a lot running old versions of OSX. Apple with music software has a terrible history of compatibility issues, so once you worked out a set of software running stable on a version of OSX it's risky to move to newer versions when your income depends on a stable Mac.
When working my last gig before retiring doing post editing not only were some of the work Macs running old versions of OSX I was on my personal system at home. I would say if running old OSX systems keep them off the internet only connect when absolutely necessary.
I remember watching the mini-doc on Phil Collins making his last solo album and there's a section where the doc shows him working at his house. He seems to still be using an old version of Cubase on Panther...in 2010-ish.
Snow Leopard is a year old at that point.
This! 👍 When one component of the stable system is updated, something else breaks, and then everything has to be updated to restore the status quo. And that might involve a considerable extra budget. In the end, something still doesn't work, though. 😅
Thanks for posting. Yes, I know a ton of people are using older Macs and MacOS. Maybe more then are using the newer versions.
Brought 5 2012-2014 Mac Minis last weekend so I can play around with OCL without the concern of messing up my main Mac. Just the learning experience is valuable since OCL is such a great program. And since there would be no user data on these Macs would be little security concerns.
Yes, it's good to learn on a system that is not your main one.
True for most thing old macs are more than enough even 4K editing photoshop anything audio even the g4 and g5 from the early 2000 can handle that with an updated ssd and upgrade to 16gb or more.
Mac pros the classics can actually still use fast pcie ssds add usbc or thunderbolt or 10g Ethernet latest WiFi massive space for ssd and hard drives to amd RX 6800 or so making them actually more powerful than many m1 m2 m3 machines especially the 8 go models that must share memory with the cpu gpu is and video out.
And with hacks run the latest almost Mac OS X Linux or windows natively.
Not to mention 64db slow ram can often be better than 8 or 16 go fast ram.
Yes, I have done a tone of videos on the older Intel Macs and most can still perform great depending on how you use them, ram, and ssds inside. Thanks for posting.
Excellent advice Craig. Regardless of the computer you use, the first and most important step to security is ourselves. Don't click on any unrequested links, especially in emails.
Open Core does have a bit of a learning curve, but is the best way to continue using our older Macs. Unfortunately, some 3 party apps (Turbo Tax for one) will not install on Big Sur and older because of the lack of security updates. Other apps will soon follow.
I'm currently using my 2015 27" iMac as my main computer running oclp Sonoma. The cost of replacing that 27" 5k display is just too much these days.
Thanks for watching Steve. Yes Open Core is great but I just know some older people or non techies won't attempt that so I figured I would make a video like this. Thanks again.
I install Sonoma using OCLP on a 2013 15” MBP. It runs well and I don’t have any issues. I also did the same on a mid 2012 MacBook Pro 13”. The 2012 MBP runs a little hotter using OCLP.
Nice, yes they still work pretty good with OCLP. I have it on a few machines also.
Great video with informed, intelligent analysis! I love how you advocate for older Macs. I now want to buy an old machine and tinker with OpenCore again, even though I have an M1 Air. Thanks again!
Thanks for the post appreciate it for sure.
I still use mavericks for music production. It works great.
Nice. Get your money's worth as the computers are expensive.
I have a 2012 13" MacBook Pro I use as my experimental Mac I will use when I test new MacOS versions via OCLP. It's not my daily driver, but it's fun to test with.
Yeah, using the older systems make a good fun project for sure.
my 17" 2011 Macbook Pros run perfectly. I used DosDudes GPU eliminator code to shut down the AMD GPU. Works perfectly still
Nice and thanks for the tip
@@craigneidel Anytime bro. It is all pretty easy and works perfectly. Used it all for years. Open core is great. I was terrified for a while to even try it. Now its like breathing. Its so easy. Just had to get over my fear and laziness. Takes some work at first but doesnt everything? I have 14 old Macs with my apple silicon Macs and many I bought on Ebay not working just to learn. They all work perfectly and run Ventura or sonoma. Some run baremetal Linux and run it well. Now I have this for the rest of my life. With Open core theres no reason my 2011 17" Macs cant last another 5 plus years. I text Android phones from them (if you have an iphonme too)
If someone is tech savvy, sure this video is right on the money. If you are like my 84 year old sister, nothing you just said will resonate with her. Automatic security update are a must for her.
Yes, but if she clicks on an attachment or if she downloads a bad file normally the automatic security won't save you either. Phishing also like emails coming asking to check banking statements. Those are how they get people not using the automated security any longer.
@@craigneidelIn that case, get a product like Intego that has a built in firewall and they keep it updated. BTW.., auto security updates are a must for me as well, and I work in the industry. I’m belt and suspenders paranoid.. I have a commercial grade perimeter router with IDS signatures that are constantly updated.
Yes, setup the level of security that you need and are comfortable with.
Simply, you have two choices. (1)Use the old macOS and never connect to the Internet or (2)Install Linux.
Not sure about that but Linux does work good for sure.
I dumped Mojave OS and installed Linux Mint and it's way better on my old iMac
Linux Mint is a nice OS for sure.
Youre so right. I was scared and nervous but I just said "Fuck It im gonna learn open core" Took maybe an hour. Now i have a bunch of old unibody Macs that are amazing. Yeah I have an M1 Max and an M1 Air but just learn Open Core.
Hey Craig, great video. I want to add to the comments for the knowledgable that switching to, or dual booting Linux may also be good option for older macs. That's what I'm doing with my late 2015, 27" iMac. I bought the Mac when it was the current iMac before the 2017 came out, and Monterey is the last supported OS, that will be ended this fall. Since I don't need the latest version of macOS for the Apple specific features I use, Linux works well for me as an alternative, and it also guarantees 32-bit support for the older games I like to play as well as giving me a current OS. I would also recommend Linux over Open core for the following reasons (if the person doesn't need specific macOS features, or software) There are limitations of patched systems because they can't update drivers a lot of times, so they have to make old ones work. With Linux the OS is open, and it's designed to be changed and customized unlike macOS, so anyone with experience can probably fix issues in Linux easier than that could with a patched macOS with open core. I agree with you on the common sense though, because that's a big focus on the security alerts and warnings are for the people who don't know anything, or use good computing practices. I've found this topic to be a one size doesn't fit all in many cases.
Thanks for the tip of using Linux and I agree with that for sure.
11:00 I would definitely recommend an adblocker extension. This will massively reduce attack surface into a machine.
Maybe but some of those can have issues or cause issues if you select the wrong one.
Great video Craig! Thanks for sharing. I was wondering what is your favorite 3rd party app for digitizing DVDs on MacOS Monterrey? App Store doesn’t have many options.
Thanks for watching. I really don't digitize DVDs any longer so I don't have good insight into that. If I find anything I'll let you know.
not once did he mention not to be logging on to external WiFi hotshots with older machines use cellular or Home instead but the rest of his advice is sound and generally good enouch to apply lso to other computers as well.
Yes, and maybe use a VPN etc. also.
My MBP mid 2012 is working like new with Linux Mint.
Yes, loading Linux is a great option but then it's not MacOS but still fine.
I currently still use a 2011 IMac......I use an Avira antivirus security App & run it off an external SSD.......mostly use google browser & have never had a problem......
Nice 2011 is getting up there in years.
@@craigneidel yeah I know.....gonna get me a mac studio desktop & mac studio display real soon....
Nice.
One perk of Apple Silicon is once you updated to 14.5 I think it was, you get a patch that does security updates even if you can’t update macOS any longer (so they say).
That’s great for me cause I have kept my last 3 laptops 7-10 years each. I’ve been having some software issues but not entirely sure that’s Apples fault.
With all that said though, I don’t think I’d use any computer that doesn’t have OEM security updates. Just to risky.. someone changes my passwords or gets a bank account and you’re screwed. I don’t have extra money for that big a hit. Ends up being cheaper to own a system that’s current w security updates.
Thanks for posting all that info and for watching the videos. I appreciate that for sure. I do agree the safe route is keep things updated but I just know most are not doing that.
Open Core is now crazy easy to install and use
Yep
I run Sonoma on my MacBook Pro Late 2011 with OpenCore Legacy Patcher. Works fine and was easy to install, but obviously it isn't fast since the hardware is old.
Yes, a 2011 won't be as fast but it's a miracle that it still works. Thanks for watching.
This is a great video!
Yes, you should update to the latest update you can but theoretically as long as you're not stupid and follow the advice in this video, you will be fine (people will hate me for saying that).
I am very guilty of running older software. For example, my iPhone 13 Pro which I daily is still running iOS 15.7 from 2022. People tell me I need to update but it still works fine and I have not had any issues. Now apps are starting to not be supported but most apps I need work. Now if I were a celebrity and people were after me then I would definitely update. But I'm just a nobody so I'm not too worried.
My home file and time machine server which is only accessible inside my network runs OS X Yosemite on a 2010 Mac mini. Now obviously if I was going to make it accessible online I might update it to High Sierra but I'm not too concerned.
As for my secondary 2014 macbook air, I run the sonoma patcher. However, the patcher isn't completely secure as you have to run with system integrity protection disabled (the only issue I've seen this causing is certain apps like those annoying proctoring apps schools make you install require it and don't work). However, as long as you're not stupid you are totally fine.
So overall, it's about following some simple guidelines and not being stupid. As long as you're not a celebrity people are after and are not being stupid, you are honestly fine running old software.
However, you should stay up to date if you can.
Thanks for the nice words and the detailed post. I do appreciate that. I agree that it comes down to being smart but we all make mistakes once or twice so we also need some luck. Funny, but true. Thanks again.
I've enjoyed OCLP for number of years; my 2011 Mac Mini used Monterey for a while. It was kinda nice, but I went to Linux a few years ago.
Not only do I now get all the security updates from Linux, the machine feels quite a bit more snappy and spry than with OCLP. I also run Linux on my 2015 MBP. Can't say I even miss MacOS anymore.
Linux is a good option for older Macs too. But then it's not really a Mac any longer.
@@craigneidel 🤣🤣Everybody calls my Macs "e-waste resurrected from the dead." All hail the Apple zombie apocalyptic overlords.🤣🤣🤣
Funny, thanks again for watching.
Yes thats the main reason to do it.
Just purchase things on your other computer tablet or phone.
Get your moneys worth out of apps you already bought no need to keep buying new versions.
Plus tons of free 32 bit software availble that cannot run in m1 and newer.
Hackers are mainly going after supported macs not the unsupported ones.
Thanks for the post.
food for though is i bought a late 2013 15" 16 GB Ram with 512 GB Ssd $132.00, one problem was the person installed a Partition drive, wiped the driver, installed open core legacy MacBook works great for another 5 years and look for something more up to date
Yes, they can work good even today as long as you are not editing 4K videos and more extensive work like that.
@@craigneidel I have not learned how to do that yet I also upgraded my Late 2013 iMac 27", will have to learn how to do video using iMove system
iMovie is the easiest to learn but Capcut for Mac is so much more powerful now.
Just bought a used macbook pro 2015 13inch 2.7ghz one and just found out that its unsupported, that to my knowledge still was the best used and upgradeable model, unfortunately i wasnt quite right, so now im in the dilemma of leaving the OS on it as is, or going down the path of configuring SonomaOS.
In short, is it worth while setting up an unsupported macbook with a supported MacOS when considering its for longterm?
I think so if you can do it. You can use something like Open Core to load on a newer OS and it should help with security. If not then you need to be a bit more careful but I know many are still using unsupported macs for sure and they still have security on them just not the brand new security updates. But, it's more up to you since I can't make that call.
@@craigneidel i see, ive still got my macbook pro from 2011 15inch running very well and recently it stopped working thanks to no longer being supported and as unsupported macbooks go for dirt cheap, Id rather find an alternative way of using it functionally and worry free as can be.
I'd like others opinion on if it truly Is sustsinanble in the long run.
So to answer u, I am forced to use this unofficial method of upgrading OS as the macbook from 2011 refuses to let me browse, download apps and constantly notifies me about incompatibility.
What would u have done in this scenario?
I would give it a try and just back up data.
I know that is not the way Apple fans are looking for: the perfect solution for my 2012 Macbook Air was linux. I installed Pop OS by System 76 in 2016 and never looked back. Its still a beautiful machine, with upgraded ssd and battery. Apple Intel hardware is normally very well supported by linux as the linux devs use Apple hardware often (the great Linus did).
Linux does work great on these machines if you want to do that. That is for sure.
My problem with Open Core is that it is extremely annoying to uninstall if you want to sell the computer. The problem for me was, as with Hackintosh, that imessage didn't work correctly. It no longer felt like a Mac but more like Frankenstein. Personally, I wouldn't use OpenCore any more and would rather spend a little more on an M1 Mac, for example. Another problem for me was that my widescreen monitor no longer supported the correct resolution, even with the appropriate tools.
It's pretty good right now if you have not checked it out in a while. It's just another option out there.
Craig, what are your thoughts on CleanMyMac software used on older macs?
I tend to not use them but to be honest I may review a few in the future.
What about a 2004 eMac running Leopard? ^ My gaming rig...
Well there are limits.. ...
I used to instal a light small latest version of Linux on the aging Wind PC and solved many problems! Is it possible to install such Linuxes on the aging Macbook too ??
For sure. Linux will run on the Intel Macs.
@@craigneidel Thanks ! my Macbook 2019 has intel 7 cpu
Indeed you can. I installed Zorin OS (my Linux distro of choice) in my 2011 MBP and it runs like a charm. No driver compatibility issues, at all
Buying a used Mac from third-party sellers, meaning not from a well-known Mac reseller company, is risky. You don’t know what the previous owner might have put on the machine so I wouldn’t connect it to your network. Fully erase the drive(s) first and then install the latest supported MacOS using MacOS recovery mode. Most older Macs can still download an installer from Apple’s archives. Finally, install OCLP and gradually upgrade the OS to newer versions.
It can be risky and that is why you need to do your research on who you are buying from. But I agree with your tips. But, at the end of the day buying any tech from China for example is risky also since anything you plug into a computer (including flash drives) could have something on there. I know some of the cheap PCs (New) had this a few times so it's the wild west out there.
@@craigneidel I agree completely about any tech from China being risky.
It can be for sure.
All My old Macs LL THE WAY TO 2011 run Sonoma via Open Core legacy all free
Yep that's the best way
I have a 2015 MBP running Ventura. When I lose security updates I’ll sell it. I don’t care about running an old OS, but I do care about security. I can use OCLP but I know some damn update will break it. My main driver is a Studio Ultra so I’m Ok limiting my MBP.
Yes, everybody is different and do what you feel is best for sure.
An extreme method is never connect Ye Olden Mac to the Internet, nor WiFi.
You'd be using 'sneaker net,' external drives. Only works for stand alone applications. Say video editing, art projects, 3D printing, using it as a typewriter, etc.
And old Macs are useful for running old software that can't run on newer Macs or MacOSs.
Maybe but without the Internet then it really limits the use of them. But I hear you on safety there. That would be safe.
I plan to get an M1 MacBook when the new MacBooks drop and people unload their older MacBooks.
Yeah they are getting cheaper and cheaper and are great systems for sure.
Hopefully the M1 will still have a few years of support left.
For sure they will
Tim Crook . " Our customers enjoy a curated platform ." Planned obsolescence , ever get that feeling we are being had ?
I know what I'm buying before I buy it and have full control of what I buy. So not really.
@@craigneidel 👍
What's with lack of security updates? The ADVANTAGE of using a newer unsupported OS is that I still HAVE security updates. If I were still using Mojave, I would have no security updates.
Did you watch video
@@craigneidel I owe you an apology, now that I've viewed the entire video.
I have 2010 Mac Pro desktop, running Ventura with OpenCore Patcher. At first, installing OpenCore Patcher can be a little scary; however, someone like Jesse of Jesse's Flying (czcams.com/video/SZN3a9tFrDU/video.html) is really good at guiding you through the process. If you can, install OpenCore Patcher and a newer OS on a separate hard drive; therefore, if something gets screwed up all you'll lose is a little bit of time.
Installing one of the newer systems, such as Ventura or Sonoma, insures that you have the most recent security updates. There's a couple other advantages to using an operating system such as Ventura or Sonoma: Even on my ancient computer, they run faster and smoother. In general, my computer is more of a pleasure to use in almost anything I do. Also, any Photoshop user needs to have Ventura or Sonoma if you want to take advantage of the new AI features.
Something to watch out for in the OpenCore installation process: At the very end of the install, it will ask if you want to install "Post-Install Patches," and it will ask you if you want your boot files copied to your hard drive. Click YES for each. This sounds complicated, but it isn't. You just have to be on the lookout for these options toward the end of that install.
I'm running Ventura rather than Sonoma, because Sonoma is a little slower. You probably wouldn't notice this, unless your a Photoshop user.
No need to apologize for anything and thanks again for the info and for the post. Appreciate it for sure.
@@craigneidel I just wanna spread the good news. It's like having a brand new computer, now that I'm running Ventura. No issues, whatsoever.
Take care,
Trevor
Thanks for watching and for the info.
Install and run Linux?
For sure. Works great too.
ChromeOS Flex install is a last resort way to continue safely using an old Mac.
Yeah there are others option like that and Linux but then it's not a Mac.
@@craigneidel at least it's usable. It could be a Mac, a Big Mac, a Whopper, I don't care I just want this device to be usable and safe.
Use what you feel is best for you for sure.
I used the dosdude firmware hack to get my Mac Pro 3,1 to a 5,1; installed metal compat GPU and upgraded CPU. Got as far as 10.14 on a 15 year old Mac. But enough is enough. Even the 3rd party browsers that are still patched won't install. I'm done. Mac Studio on its way.
Yes when it's time it's time
Its a bit sad that apple fases out older macs by ending the suport on older macs, they do often work greit for a normal user. Its just an economical thing for apple. Also think about the environment.
They get about 7 or more years of support like most others and Open Core can work with systems older then that.
Open Core now is basically click and just read the prompts. It used to be a bitch. Crazy easy now
Yes easy for most but still most won't do it for some reason
@@craigneidel But dude. In all honesty with me. Yeah it was intimidating Open Core but really. It was me being lazy even thhough I love fucking around and learning on my computer. Im a mess as you can see but learned a shit tone from great videos like yours and other folks. Appreciate it. Windows can eat a fat di....... My windows laptops are strictly for Linux
I install Ubuntu on my old Macs
Yes that works great for sure.
I disagree with you on this! I have a 2014 IMac and it’s still running great and no security issues Hasn’t been updated in years but still no issues
Well of course and I'm not sure you watched the entire video then. Just because you are using a older OS doesn't mean you will be hacked automatically. The video is how you can keep yourself safe. Watch the entire thing.
When the day comes that I can no longer upgrade any of my old intel Mac I'll turn it into a Linux box
I hear a bunch of people saying they will do that too.
Opencore isn't that hard to use, all you need is a usb, a shitload of time and of course the ability to read text.
Yes, for sure. I have used it many times.
@@craigneidel I'm just saying, I mean if you're making a video about old macs, and you know about opencore you could have explained it. But whatever, still a great video mate.
$6000 + 2019-2023 mac pros will soon be unsupported.
Yep, but most of the people that bought those are larger companies who like to waste money.
@@craigneidel lol true its a tax rightoff and ofcourse,
some pros particularly musicians who needed expansion pcie slots ie protools sound cards and sound cards by the daVinci RME which they already invested thousands in, unlimited memory for large sample sound libraries, and onboard storage expansion like 4 3.5 ssd or hard drives and pcie raid ssds fir large track countd, and ability to add many ports and run Native OSX, native windows and native linux, and yes it can actually under windows with a hack run the latest amd and Nvidia GPU cards for specific workflows like blender.
Unfortunately the 28 core was its limit, as intel introduced a new xeon and motherboard requirements right after it.
But to be honest for audio and most workflows that's more than.enough with hyperthreading which geek bench does not measure and even for video editing with a good GPU. And audio.
Of course two of the media engine chips will beat it in most video editing workloads on apple silicon.
There are some serious deals in them.know if it fits your needs.
Yes, they are great tax write-offs for sure but still a waste since some of them were around 45K. Thanks for posting the info and for watching the channel.
@@craigneidel no prob
I say NO! wipe the drive and install a supported OS! Linux.
Do what works best for you.
NO WAY.
So you don't like Macs. That's fine.
@@craigneidel No, I retired my iMac as I didn’t want all those passwords for banking etc, possibly being compromised by a frigged loader system, and bought a monitor and 16” MacBook Pro.
The “NO WAY” I was responding to your question, should you use a open core installed Mac, I was referring to a system installed with unknown unofficial possibility compromised software, not criticising Macs.
Got it, and thanks for watching the channel.
Install Linux.
Yep 100th person that said that
It works, but insecure, and slowwwwwwww.
Not the Macs I used. Some work great even from 2013 with SSDs.
@@craigneidelNot when using Photoshop.
If it has an SSD I normally will use an older version of Photoshop and they work pretty good for me.