Hammer A3 41 - My Planer / Thicknesser is broken!
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- čas přidán 14. 05. 2024
- Yep, you read right, my Planer Thicknesser has just broken.
Is this really what to expect from such an expensive machine??
A3 41 first impressions
• The Hammer A3 41 Plane...
A3 41 after 4 months
• Hammer A3 41 4 Month R...
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After receiving Invoice from Felder I realised I've misheard the tech on the phone, he apparently said £107, I wrongly thought he said £170 so my apologies for the mis information, but I must say I'm delighted that it just got a lot cheaper.
My A3-31 had the same issue within 2 months of delivery. It was still under warranty then but resulted in over a week of down time. I was told by the tech that came to repair it that the green start button must be pressed until the machine reached operating speed. Approximately 1-2 seconds. A quick touch of the button on startup results in the startup capacitor not being used and cooks the run capacitor. Haven’t had any issue since the repair.
This failure is caused by not holding the start button down until the machine reaches full speed. My A3 is about ten years old and I have never held the button down and only learned of the problem about a year ago but luckily have had no issues at all. There should be an alert sticker next to the switch on all single phase machines but three phase machines don't have the issue.
I was wondering about this very thing. I see many tutorials by people and they always seem to first a low the machine to get up to speed. Before they use it. There should be a delays start on it with a green light that lights up when the machine is at full speed.
Todays still a good day, you still have your good looks, lol.
That's the spirit 397, always looks on the bright side (of the capacitor)
My A341 looks to be about the same age as your machine. Haven't had any issues yet 🤞🤞🤞. I emphasize with your circumstances and appreciate you sharing your experience. Hopefully you're back up and running soon, and this issue is just a singular annoying bump in the road
Thank you and yes I hope so as well. 👍
You are so right, Graham. Felder/Hammer should be a highly reliable AND expensive brand. This kind of component should not be any problem, and cheap to replace (an electrician could probably even wire in 2 replacement off the shelf capacitors). Hammer is not demonstrating good customer support if they wouldn't just get you the part for free, even outside the warranty period.
At the same time, obviously 170 pounds is worthwhile to save a 4,000 pound machine, especially as a business essential.
Hi RY, absolutely, it just feels like maximising an opportunity to make more profit.
Things happen
Equipment brakes sometimes
If you can source the parts cheaper than you should do that. But I have not had any issues for three years and knowing he may not have any other issues for three or four more years doesn’t sound too terrible.
Sounds like you're having a good run. That's good to know.
I am about to upgrade a cnc router and sell the one I have now. I was thinking about buying a Hammer 12" jointer/planer but might be considering a different brand now.
This is indeed a pain. I am sorry this is happening to you. I also bought a hammer price of equipment, but rather the saw. Regarding the capacitor, I was told to press the on button till it's fully spun up. But I find 3 years is still s short lifespan. Best of luck and keep up posted.
By button, I meant the on button
Also, the fact the cap says "made in China" really grinds my gears
As soon as I found out I was not the only one having issues with Hammer A341 machine I sent it back to Felder and got AD741, I couldn't be happier now. I love the thing. It is day and night difference, but the price is also that difference 😂
Thanks Andrea, good to know. 👍👍
I think you should just source your own compacitor. Since it’s not covered.
As an American looking at purchasing one of these, I think I've concluded based off videos like this, and widespread issues on alignment issues, difficulty aligning, etc... that I'm better off getting a dedicated jointer (planer), and planer (thicknesser). Realistically probably a 12" and 20" respectively.
If I had the space I would be doing exactly that.
So you spent $4000 pounds that would be Roughly $6500.00 American not a small price! For that kind of money I would expect it to be Industrial Quality and something capable of running all day everyday! I really don't blame you for being up set because I am sure that in a small one man shop it isn't running for more than a few hours here or there! Makes me skeptical about the quality of Hammer equipment for sure!
Sad to hear this.
Parts replacement is a huge market with a huge profit margin. So expect everything to break and expect to pay a premium for it to be fixed.
Look up light bulbs and the agreement between manufacturers to set a time limit to the light bulbs longevity.
Sorry that has happened. Making me rethink my potential purchase.
I've heard a lot say its so worth going up to the Felder Range.
@GTWoodshop the felder range is a big step up, the hammer range is really good for the price you pay but they are a entry level
Hi Graham, sad to see/hear you’re having issues with the planer. Really shouldn’t be happening after such a short time. Plus that’s a ridiculous price for a capacitor. Disappointing to hear.
Graham (Ireland)
they should be covered, and i think these capasitors are pretty standered i suspect
I would of thought so Jim.
First of all I have to say that I watch every episode of yours, sometimes educational sometimes just fun, keep going with this especially the way you present it! The problem is that you are not an individual but a company. For commercial use, you have a maximum of 1 year warranty in the EU. The capacitor should last much longer, actually for the lifetime of the machine. I would still buy the capacitor somewhere else and cancel the others. Or they have to send it to you at cost price, the price you have to pay now is certainly 3 to 4 times too high.
Thanks Stefan. Yes I certainly felt like I was being stung, not a pleasant experience at all.
Good luck with that Felder customer service is the worst. I will never buy from them again.
Sometimes you just have bad luck. I would not go as far as to say that the Hammer products are bad. And just because a part has made in China on it means nothing. I have had stuff with made in Germany, USA etc break on me. However, what is not okay is for them to overcharge on spare parts or to not have parts like these in stock in the UK.
Hi Graham, I’m sorry to hear your situation! Clearly, Felder/Hammer’s services are lacking and it is something you wouldn’t expect from a premium brand. If I were Hammer, I would be very ashamed of a failing capacitor and would have send the component without any charge. I’m not a qualified elektricien but what I know about those capacitors is that they are there to keep the electrical current -more- in synch with the voltage and is there to keep the utility company happy. For all I know the machine will operate without it but due to regulations they need to be in there. Capacitors are specified by the -max- voltage they should be able to handle and the capacity expressed in (micro)Farad. They are very simple components and if you had browsed on the net, like you did, you could probably pick up one of those for less than the amount you pay. I shows to me that Hammer took capacitors very near to the specs needed, while if they would have overspec’ed it, this problem shouldn’t have happened while it have cost them an Euro or so more on the base cost of that machine. Ridiculous!
Point is, Graham, the amount of wood you take off your workpieces has nothing to do with the failure of this component. If you blew up the motor, yeah, that would caused by the stress you put the machine in, but the capacitor is just poorly dimensioned.
What bothers me more is the customer service that you have to call. It is the sign of the time to push away all personal contacts at first and ‘guide’ customers through complicated menu’s or social media channels where there is no room for some human interpretation of an issue.
Just to add to this, Graham, I’m not a profession woodworker like you. Yet I’ve done my bit in rebuilding our house and it was you amongst 2 or 3 others that brought Hammer to my attention. I’ve got the K3 Basic and the N3800 bandsaw. I still can call the sales person here in The Netherlands to fill me in on some issues I had. I would still recommend the brand, prior to this story.
I sincerely hope the part is delivered and it will keep the machine happily running for many years to come and that this issue is long forgotten in the end.
Cheers, __Frank
Hi Frank, thank you for the reply and level of detail. It is just such a shame that this sort of thing happens as you say. I have no knowledge of capacitors as mentioned but it just feels lacking to me. Thank again. I'll post an update when I have one. 👍👍
Felder is not a premium brand ! Only DIY people think that it is. Big production companies rarely buy Felder.
Hi Graham, with no warranty, why not source an English/European component and say to Hammer you no longer need the part they ordered? Also it was partly your honest review of the Hammer originally that caused me to go for the SCM mini max 41c
I would absolutely do that if at all possible. £170 is a crazy price for a starter capacitor for a what? 3hp motor? US$70 would be the most you should pay for a start capacitor, and a fraction of that for a run capacitor.
@@TrevorDennis100 It's more like 3kW (S6-rating) output motor in the single phase version.
Yea I needed parts for my saw 10 weeks I waited every time I called them they said the parts had to come from overseas and it would take a while. and their parts department made me pick out the parts I wanted from the breakdown they would not guarantee that I picked the right part from their drawing.
Wow!
For the price, you would expect greater longevity out of these machines.
Exactly.
4 Days?! The company contracted to maintain my solar system took 2-3 months to fix my inverter.
I was once charged $200 (US) to replace what turned out to be a $15 capacitor on my homes AC unit.
Welcome to the new world.
Yea, not so good!
Its so annoying when a machine doesn't function, i've got a hammer bench saw, planer, bandsaw and the small Cnc machine. All of the machines are great up to now and get a fair bit of abuse, after care from Felder UK is pretty spot on, next to the Felder machines you really can see the Hammer price point, they are much cheaper, but there aren't many brands to choose from at this level, I wouldn't touch the Axminster stuff, good luck you'll be up and running soon ✌
Thanks Andy.
My experience is horrible with Felder all round. Poor quality of machine and terrible quality control and even worse service.
@@rayvisser6402 I'm certainly hearing that when they let the ball drop, it drops hard!
Hammer is ordinary, felder is good, format 4 is great
Shouldn't be happening buddy. I would definitely follow this up with the manufacturer.
I understand your frustration. Felder should have replaced these for you at no cost. Those are components that should not have failed. This might make a difference to me on whether I buy a Hammer A3/31 or 41. I really enjoy your channel. Best of luck to you with the j/p.
Thank you Jay.
I wouldn't buy Felder again I have spent money on a Felder CF 741 S Professional combination Machine with all the trimmings and a Felder FB710 Spent around £30K and they didn't set it up properly, wouldn't come back, Supplied incorrect parts to what I ordered and wont honour the order. The planer side of the machine started to fall apart. The sliding table is not level, just too much to mention.
@@rayvisser6402 Oh no, that sounds like a horror story.
Capacitors break but If I had the money, I would still buy a Hammer planer. Fantastic bit of kit. The capacitor should be covered under the manufacturers warranty. If not, quote the Sale of Goods Act at them. You're covered for 6 years under 'satisfactory quality'. They may back down.
That's good to know, thanks David.
Hi Graham. Incredibly frustrating. I know when my A3-41 had a problem they had to send three different engineers to sort it! One did say that the capacitors do burn out if you don’t keep the green ‘on’ switch depressed until the block is fully up to speed.
I have a number of Felder/hammer machines. Fortunately they have all performed faultlessly to date. However my one major gripe with Felder UK is that they carry no stock of spare parts/consumables. Everything you order has to come from Austria hence the time delay in delivery. I would advise against ordering any large item for home delivery as the transport costs are frankly extortionate
Completely agree, £350 to deliver the Saw!!!
That is super not normal. You should check your installation for voltage transients and check the actual voltage you get from your plug. Is it a three phases ?
No, just single.
Mine came with a bad shipped now I have a spare set
The company can’t control capatcuters manufactures they all made in china
Just because its a simple compenent doesn't mean they don't fail...all componets will eventually fail...especially electronic. Are you going to compalin if your tire on $60,000 Mercedes goes after the 1 year warranty? It does the same thing, stops you from using your car. Things happen. However over 100 quid for a start up or running cap...you gotta be kidding me. I had a startup cap go on my furnace...it was available locally at $5...HVAC guy wanted $80. I can see $20 for his labor (5 min) and carrying it on his van, but not 160 x the cost...and I'm sure they get it cheaper than I can. No cancel the order...an buy a both as backup.
Seems the price should be more “at cost” rather than overpriced. Only thing that’s good is that it is replaceable.
I am concerned about the 1 year statement. Sales of goods act (as ammended) fit for purpose! In the case of some goods, this has caused a warranty to be extended to 7 years. For example, motor vehicle body work. If sold in the UK, the EU rules only ever applied as secondary. The date of purchase may be of some consideration. This leaves me cold when purchasing any tool from the EU direct.
What a pain in the backside. If was you I'd rant at them about the cost as the ones they'll send will be standard Chinese ones that you can buy for a tenth of the price. I've had capacitors go on machines over years no rhythm or reason as to why. These start ones do get a hard life and normally are the ones that give in as they are under a massive load when you start the machine.
Hopefully they will turn up quickly and you'll be fine. But the disruption is always the big thing.
Completely agree Paul.
I have never been a fan of combo machines, i had a bad experience with a grizzly combo machine, should have gone the route with an oliver machine
Capacitors like these are common failure points as they're extra cost for the single phase machines... They usually take the cheapest part they can get away with, that's the sad truth about it. You're probably better off buying your own replacement capacitor from a well known brand.
Also another reason to get the proper three phase version of the machine...
I have an issue with my C3 31 Thicknesser which is the slightly smaller one than yours attached to a combi machine. I have tried every set uppiece of advice I can find been old by Hammer and still can't get a piece of wood through it.
Hi Deano, whats the issue?
hi Buddy @@GTWoodshop I try to feed a piece of stock into the thicknesser and it wont go in unless I shove it really hard. I have checked the roller springs are working and they are, I have been through the set up in the manual but still to no avail. It has happened before but somehow fixed itself. I am going to have to get Hammer to send an engineer as I have exhausted my skills and I can assure you, they aint cheap. Thanks for asking and if you have any ideas, they would be greatly appreciated.
Hi Deano, lets cover off the basics first. Feed rollers are enaged? Not trying to take too much off in one pass? Table / bed is locked in position?
Hi Buddy@@GTWoodshop Yes to all of the above. Won't feed into the thicknesser even for half a millimeter unless I giveit a real shove
Hi Deano, ok. So the first thing the piece hits as it enters is the feed roller, have they been adjusted up as its sounds as if they are wound down to far?
my experience with trying to get even a simple idea of cost to fix a humming but no rotation of ant saw/planer/spindle they passed on service tech and electrical tech numbers to contact said they dont know???"absolute was! of time
My 2010 A3-31 with a byrd cutter head has been trouble free so far. Knocking on the side of my head for luck. I'd probably still buy another one if I had to replace it because I cant think of a better option quality to price point wise.
Thats reassuring, thanks Mark.
If you buy a machine like this at less than half the price of the mainstream manufacturers like SCM in Italy, you have to expect lower quality. As for the four day lead time, Felder aim at the DIY and lower part of the market rather than high production. It would probably have been next day from SCM as their high production customers will not accept that level of service.
What is a better choice at this price point?
The Felder range springs to mind.
@@GTWoodshop still value engineered though. If you want a decent industrial 400 mm planer thicknesser, you need to budget in excess of £10 k nett. It is just a fact of life.
Well this is not comforting, as I just took delivery of my A3-31 today. While motor capacitors can and do fail, I don't think you're wrong to be upset that yours failed in under three years of light to moderate use. The price they charged you is absolutely outrageous. About the only thing I wonder is, do you hold down the start button until the motor is at full speed each time? If so, then all the more reason you should be upset. These things cost them next to nothing, considering the volume they buy them in. A new one sent off would have gone a long way toward good will.
Lesson learned for next time, I suppose, is to look at local electrical suppliers to source a new one faster and cheaper. Sorry you had to deal with this Graham, I know how frustrating it is.
Thanks Moeszy, thats the feeling I got after 5 mins of surfing, I feel 'taken for a ride'
thats an absolute horrendous cost.. honestly a capacitor at that price. As you have probably seen you can buy them for 10 of pounds not hundreds!!
Yea, gutted.
a lot of these companies seem to be racing to meet the level of Shop Fox … a real shame …
I think you are correct about the build quality of items in the world. I'm so tired of buying a $2000 refrigerator and then they ask me if I want to buy the 5 year warranty??? Why is that not included??
I believe that once we move manufacturing away from china we will be better off. We will pay a little more but other countries have better ethics and don't produce trash. Hammer should not be sourcing parts like this from China, but in their defense, every manufacturer has their plant there. So sorry for your troubles. I've been looking at Hammer for years and drooling. p.s. love your channel. you have a good format.
Thanks buddy,
That's absolutely wrong that such an expensive machine from a supposedly high end manufacturer has gone up in smoke like that. And the price they charged for those parts is scandalous!
Absolutely unacceptable.
It does unfortunately seem to be the way of the world right now though. All the majority of these companies seem interested in is a quick sale nowadays. They should be holding themselves to account for issues like this, especially when their customers workflow is affected so severely.
Bring back proper manufacturing processes, using high quality components. Tools and machines used to be built to last, just like the joinery elements we build using them!
I with you on that.
quite an ordinary fault.... Very common for motor caps to fault. A local electrical wholesaler would have them on the shelf cheap as chips.. pop down buy one fit it. 5 min fix all sorted. It doesn't matter how expensive the machine a run or start cap is a consumable part. I know its very upsetting when you are in the middle of a job and have spent a lot of money on a piece of kit. But it really isn't a reflection on the quality of the machine. For example we run an air compressor in our shop and as part of our regular maintenance we keep spare capacitors and belts on hand and change them just as regular maintenance. Same for other motor driven equipment we have. Sometimes if fortunate a cap might last multiple years other times not... They work hard and degrade under normal use on any motor driven equipment. The next one might last 5 -10 years.. you really don't know. The wiring is not complex they aren't polarised as in you don't have to worry about "+ - " connections they have 2 wires one in/ one out, as long as they go back to the same two points in the circuit from the new one and its same rating ,you are good to go.
Thats good to know, thank you. 👍
I agree. A lot of electrical/electronic components are made in China nowadays and it is common for a capacitor to fail. Those caps can be had for $10 or so (not sure of price in England, but can’t be more that 10-12 quid). Felder doesn’t make those caps and they have to source them like every other manufacturer. I do think it’d be nice for them to have covered the replacement cost, but they are at the mercy of the component manufacturers. £107 is ridiculous though.
Unfortunately the problem is that you bought a Felder machine, I do appreciate that you want a high end type of machine at a budget price your best option for this type of machine is the Minimax range from SCM far better than the Hammer brand.
I run a Minimax S41 Digital spec thicknesser in my joinery workshop and runs day in day out and doesn't miss a beat whether its hardwoods or softwoods, I did also run a Minimax F41 Surfacer up until last year and again didn't miss a beat but I swapped it out for an SCM F410 Nova last year as I wanted a planer with a longer bed and needed to spend some money !
to be fair id put money on every manufacturer putting chinese capacitors in their machines, occasionally electronic components fail, could have happened to any brand machine.170 quid seems steep though, maybe query the cost . just be glad you arent in ireland, i was quoted over 5000 euro for an A3 31 , the equivalent of 4500 pounds...
We usually get charged extra down here in Cornwall but your's sounds worse. 😢
It's a real shame, but Felder's support and customer service has really be slipping. Very noticeably.
Agree
What are you all paying for disposable tips on your spiral cutter heads?
I'm sure you know this, and you did allude to it in the video, but I've found that most electrical components within Felder machines are generic and pretty easily, and much more cheaply available from other suppliers who will deliver them for cheaper, or often for free. I've made the mistake of ordering electrical parts from Felder only to wait 2 weeks to receive the exact same component I could have bought for a fraction of the cost with next day delivery. Felder are total con-artists when it comes to maintaining and repairing machines. My whole workshop is pretty high-end Felder machines but when I replace them it'll definitely be with another manufacturer - When it's my business that I rely on to make a living from, I cannot afford to be messed about by salesmen who just like to swindle money from you.
Its such a shame, I appreciate having to make a profit but................
You probably still have a chance under the consumer rights act. But it will be hassle, and you need it fast. The company should replace the parts as not fit for purpose as it’s sold as a quality machine. Terrible service.
That is a ridiculous price for a capacitor, particularly if it has Made In China on it.