This honestly the most polarizing question in Naruto. discord: www.patreon.com/user?u=73709846 outro song: • HOME - Above All [Synt... #naruto #tobirama #kisame
Tandem paper bombs can only work if you are an edo tensei because it literally involved sacrificing ur body to create reverse summon paper bombs. Tobirama would never pull that in character in a real fightz
Anyone who grew up in the warring states era has a huge battle experience advantage over those who didn’t, Tobirama was fighting wars against uchiha when he was a literal child and not to mention he’s quite possibly more intelligent than shikamaru and has the power to capitalize on that iq, Kisame said jiraiya would embarrass him in a fight and jiraiya’s feats pale in comparison to Tobirama
The truth is we haven't seen much of Tobirama's abilities in a battle. We Saw more of Kisame's abilities vs Guy, naruto, Killer Bee, Kakashi, and the tailed beasts. However I think Tobirama wins because judging from his performance and character when he got summoned in the battle with the 10 tails he seemed to be more in charge than Minato and Hiruzen. He is a genius when it comes to figuring out weaknesses. He managed to dodge an attack from Sage Madara with the Rinnegan while Tobirama was in his weakened reanimated form and when Sasuke tried to attack Madara from behind he almost got killed despite Tobirama's distraction.
So you so he wins from speed and being a genius? Did you literally not watch the video my guy? It's like comparing final form frieza to 20x kaioken goku in namek arc. You might have the advantage esrly on but eventually you'll lose.
He was summoned as a REANIMATED version of himself, which has more chakra stability than the living Tobirama. It’s VERY hard to say that a living Tobirama would defeat Kisame, when we’ve seen more of Kisame’s abilities. I’m VERY split between these two.
5:05 No, Kisame can not tank those paper bombs. They were strong enough to completely destroy sage Hashirama's biggest deity gate, which were strong enough to hold down the 10 tails and tank a bijuu bomb from it. Unless your implying that Kisame has 10 tails levels of durability. 6:57 Even if Kisame "anticipates" Tobirama's teleportation, what proof do you have that he'd be fast enough to react to it? You can't use Madara as an example to explain why Kisame would be capable of doing that, since that Madara has far better speed feats than anything Kisame ever displayed.
It destroyed a wood clone of Hashirama only. That's nowhere near the original Madara was poking them with the ribcage Susanoo and they were gone Tobirama himself stated that Minato is better at teleporting than himself Killer B reacted twice to Minato and Kisame reacted from point blank attacks from B.
@@andreizamfir3232 I'm not sure what you were trying to get at with the Hashirama wood clone and Susanoo ribcage point, so it'd be nice if you could clarify. B reacting to Minato was impressive, but he was suppressing himself in that encounter with Bee. A weakened Edo Tobirama was fast enough to blitz and react to Juubito multiple times, who has speed similar to KCM 2 Minato. This weakened Tobirama had relative speed to another character's who speed is relative to an even faster Minato than you mentioned.
@@bofi1280 simple. Tobirama's paper bombs are nowhere near Sage mode Hashirama 's power nor a Juubi' blast. This only means that KCM is more of a power multiplier than speed. Plus it was alive Minato not so that B reacted to. The only times Juubito got blitez I remember was when he had almost no control over his body and second time he didn't knew he was that vulnerable to Sage mode. Nobody blitez him afterwards.
@@andreizamfir3232 His paper bombs are on that level tho. That same deity gate held down the 10 tails and survived a 10 tails bijuu bomb without being destroyed. Tobirama's paper bombs blew it to bits, therefore his paper bombs are 10 tails bijuu bomb level +. How do you know that KCM is "more of a power multiplier than speed?" We can clearly see that it boosts all stats, like most transformations in Naruto. We see Sage mode Naruto(granted it was a clone) being able to keep up with the 3rd raikage in speed, to being able to blitz an even faster character in 4th raikage Ay. This is a clear indication that KCM gives it's user a speed boost alongside other things. Also, Tobirama was blitzing Perfect jinchuriki Juubito, re-watch the show.
@@bofi1280 Hashirama's power was split between his clones. That's how I remember. It wasn't when Juubi charged that Biju Bomb. An attack like that would have one shotted Izuna, Madara and the Kinkaku squad that killed him. Why didn't he use it then? Those were the only times Juubito got "blitzed". The context matters. How do I know? Because it allows you to form a huge Kurama body and to fire biju bombs Edo Tobirama said base Edo Minato is better than him at teleporting. But even base pre war arc Naruto easily kept up with Ms Sasuke who could reacted with inferno style to v2 Raikage. No KCM required. Even Gaara reacted to V2 Raikage.
Ok my friend I think you are comparing kisame to alive rinnegan with sage mode madara who should be way faster than kisame the fact that this madara dodged tobirama doesn't mean kisame can Correct me if I am wrong, the problem is that tobirama is way faster than kisame that's a fact dude tobirama was taging tentails obito multiple times and this is edo tobirama his clone alone was reacting faster than minato. Yeah so alive tobirama should be faster and stronger than edo tobirama and 1v1 tobirama should beat kisame if he is serious if he was fighting in the war in weaker form he should brat kisame quickly and if you are comparing kisame to another character's feat you should first how strong and fast they are Kisame has no hope of deafiting tobirama and tobirama cold teleport samehada away to another place and fight him 1v1 tobirama is just faster and smarter than kisame he could chop of his head with flying raijin Thanks anyway for making this video I am a new subscribe and please don't downplay tobirama
madara dodge tobirama because of hashirama sage mode, which can sense chakra. and hashirama and madara said tht tobirama instinct and speed dull a bit in edo form. tobirama has edo tensai jutsu too
Bro tobirama is not defeating kisame we will take prime tobirama OK And prime tobirama had already got shit on by ginkaku and kinkaku And than you are talking about kisame can't dodge tobiramas FTG OK let me tell you tobirama died to ginkaku and kinkaku which definitely means that he was not able to blitz them with his FTG means Tobirama = ginkaku and kinkaku We will high ball tobirama because I put him equal to ginkaku and kinkaku let's move on . ginkaku and kinkaku was not able to blitz darui or inoshikacho trio means they are rival to gin and kin bro Means Tobirama = darui =< gin kin And now 4 ( A ) > darui bcz he is the fastest shinobi after minato and now jonin minato > tobirama right which means his FTG his better than tobirama right and kid killer bee was able to react minatos FTG remember and that was kid killer bee means he is not faster than minato I m talking about reaction speed means Tobirama = darui =< gin and kin < 4 raikage < killer bee = jonin minato And that was kid killer bee and than kisame was able to blitz ( blitz ) killer bee and killer bee was not able react at kisames attacks which means Tobirama ~ darui < gin and kin < raikage ~< kid killer bee ~ jonin minato < adult killer bee < kisame so definitely kisame is able to react at tobirama FTG Wait let me tell you the comparison Speed = reaction = kisame and blitzing = tobirama Strength = kisame Chakra = kisame Jutsu = kisame ( no doubt ) Taijutsu = kisame ( tobirama has no feats Genjutsu = none Battle IQ = tobirama Winner = Tobirama =2 Kisame =5 So there is no way tobirama can defeat kisame absolutely not you have only one feat to tell FTG and I also have cleared you that kisame is definitely able to avoid blitzing so please accept this brother
@@DarkTemple31 u know wht ur problem is, u ccompare character like bullshit, always compare character with there ability not with other people. kisame would never match tobirama speed, write it down. every jutsu kisame use , tobirama would dodge it in a sleep. tht the power of FTG.
@@Shubham-hr5uw wait bruh first of all you can compare characters with other characters because they never fought with each other Now with their ablilties OK so you are saying that tobirama is lot faster than kisame agreed and you are also saying that edo tensai we are not including edo tensei in first place but even if we did than still kisame is stronger bcz tobirama himself accepted that his edo tensei is weaker than orochimarus part 1 edo tensei so hmm kisame takes this round now you are saying that he can blitz kisame nope he can't like I said in my previous comment that kisame has no difficulty dodging his FTG because minatos FTG got reacted by kid killer bee and minato is by far faster than tobirama and kisame has faster reaction speed than even duly killer bee so I told you FTG won't work and now no jutsu is useful because kisame can absorb than and tobirama can't dodge kisames attack bcz kisame has by far better water style jutsu than tobirama just imagine a 30% clone can bring a water lake than 100% kisame has like way way better water style than tobirama if tobirama places kunais to dodge kisames attacks than kisame will bring water lake or create a water bubble and boom its an easy victory I m not gonna hate tobirama just bcz he looses to kisame I m a big fan of him he created MSC Jutsu and I like him but its an honest truth that tobirama has nothing against kisame and I m not talking about kisames abilities bcz if I did than its an unmatched 1v1 and every jutsu of tobirama is not gonna work bcz kisame will absorb it so kisame > tobirama i m not saying that tobirama is weak or something but its an honest truth that 4 akatsuki members are stronger than tobirama 1 obito 2 itachi 3 pain 4 kisame
@@norman5985 I suppose that is possible. I do think that Kisame is definitely kage level but even if he could beat Tobirama, Tobirama would be smart enough to know when he is outclassed and teleport away making it a stalemate. He is fast enough to also ambush Kisame while he is on a stroll. But yeah if Tobirama and Kisame were forced to fight to the death within an enclosed arena Kisame wins
@@lanastevens7399 Yeah I think he loses but to be clear I don't necessarily think he dies if that makes sense. I don't see any evidence that indicates Kisame has some kind of space time barrier to stop a flying thunder god retreat
Tobirama is definitely loosing under these circumstances, but what if tobirama could tag and teleport samehada like minato could, Because if tobirama figure out after landing attack on kisame that samehada heals kisame, if tobirama can get rid of samehada, then tobirama should gain an advantage in the fight.
U guys are stupid y do u watch naruto tobirama is a fucking senju he have a lottttt of charka too u guys only focus on hasirama even the fifth hokage have alot of charka have u idiots ever see those ppl complaining about charka
@stoopidsilly the juubi bomb was touching ( connecting) with killer bee when minato teleported it, the TSO is juubito's but that didn't stop tobirama from removing it and that's much more potent than samehada, so yes Tobirama can teleport samehada .
Thank you for making me realize that their is a good youtubers that can make naruto verse battles good that swagkagy is just making fun out of it in bad way that makes you want to close the video when he start talking
@@electro13k54 bro you really gonna say that? First, it's a forbidden justu, second you really think he just caring a scroll of his many dead enemies at his disposal? Dont be doing shit like that bro.
K but instead of doing a flying rajin to the stomach, cant he just do it to the neck. And he can use edo tensei, its part of his arsenal, dont know why u wouldn't include it. I know he never used lightning but if his opponent is a water style user, it would only make sense that he uses lightning style. He also has his "thunder of god sword" which would be useful against kisame
@@docrivers8211 I mean it was used when Obito was attacking Kabuto, so u can say that it saved Kabuto and also against Orochimaru vs Hiruzen. And Tobirama's was not perfected but much better than Orochimaru's. It could regenerate and also plant paper bombs for them to explode to their targets. And I imagine that Tobirama is not just going to stand there, he is going to use them for a diversion and wait for the right moment to flying rajin Kisame
@@electro13k54 he doesn’t like to use edo tensei in the first place, and his edo tensei is most likely much weaker than kabutos, and if I’m correct most people were highly nerfed even in kabutos so I can only imagine how weak his is
you can't draw conclusions. Tobirama has many jutsu and several abilities that are still unknown. Tobirama created 1000 jutsu that much is still unknown. Tobirama only has a few scenes in the anime and manga. Kishimoto must reveal all his abilities, so that we will be able to draw conclusions.
Tobirama wins, it's not even really a debate...that's not knocking Kissame...it's just the truth, especially if he's using all of the jutsu he has at his desposal and doesn't he technically have all 5 chakra natures? I just don't see how this is such a big debate.
Just some guy we haven’t seen tobirama use other elements, so it would be illogical to include those factors in this battle, as it is not relevant. For example everyone can actually learn the 8gates, it just takes years of training. Are we then going to say that in a fight against Sakura and Itachi, that Sakura will win by busting out the 8gates? No
The problem with bringing dead ninja back to life to help you fight someone just proves you lost to that person 1v1 and that darkness jutsu belongs to Hashirama so Tobirama looses either way, but for you people disrespecting Tobirama you'll need to grow up its always about the match up in a fight and strength isn't the key to winning a fight all the times.
What about edo tensei? Yes if tobirama summoned them they would be weak ofc but he could still use them to strategize. Either way I can still see Kisame winning, but I also think tobirama could cut Kisames head because of his speed. I don’t think Kisame would have the time to react to Flying raijin . Either way a good video 💯
Lol there’s SOOOOO many problems here 1) First off all did you REALLY just compare SM Madara to Kisame in terms of speed? That’s completely ridiculous!!!! You can’t just say that Kisame could dodge Tobirama’s attacks just because Madara could. You have to provide speed feats that scale Kisame to Tobirama’s level We’ve seen Kisame getting blitzed by characters like KCM Naruto and 7th Gate Guy Meanwhile Tobirama while weakened by Edo Tensei was so fast that his SHADOW CLONE was capable of saving KCM Minato ( who is WAAAAY faster than KCM Naruto or 7th Gate guy) from Juubito’s exploding Truth Seeking Orb. Not to mention that he was also shown blitzing Juubito multiple times during during the war arc In short you have MASSIVELY underestimated Tobirama’s speed 2) Even if Kisame covers the battlefield in water I doubt it will impede Tobirama’s movement/ teleportation If you go watch Tobirama’s fight with Hiruzen he was shown swimming underwater with ease and even attempts to drown Hiruzen. So he is still very agile underwater And considering FTG marks never disappear Tobirama can escape Kisame’s giant water dome ( or any other water techniques) by teleport away from the battlefield and returning 3) Tobirama’s Paper Bomb technique is a lot stronger than you give it credit for It was capable of destroying one of Hashirama’s Diety gates which were durable enough to tank being hit by Naruto’s Sage Art: Massive Rasenshurikan and strong enough to pin down the 10 tails So it would not be unreasonable to say that the Tandem Paper Bombs scale to or even above the Hirudora 4) You didn’t mention that Tobirama can use Edo Tensei which allows him to summon zombies that regenerate and can be used in combination with the Tandem Paper bombs to create immortal suicide bombers .......and Kisame doesn’t have a reliable counter to this because he doesn’t have any sealing jutsu ( which is necessary to defeat an Edo) If I were you I would consider redoing this video. You got a lot of stuff wrong here my guy
Tobirama’s reanimation would be way weaker than kabutos or orochimarus you can’t even use this as an argument cuz we don’t even know who he can summon plus he probably wouldn’t have much control over them since ororchimaru used the tags and he didn’t. Correct me if I’m wrong haven’t watched Naruto in a solid while
@@deathreaper4166 wrong, if your going to state things as a fact, make sure they are actually facts. The 2 "low level" biju had nine tails 2 biju mode, and had the sage of 6 paths ninja tools with them. Then they had 20 S rank ninjas that can be anyone from the akatsuki level, who are considered Gods. And to further prove how you are lacking in infornation, Tobirama was scuffed after coming back from a mission, scuffed if you dont know means tired, fatigued. And Tobiramas aim was to keep the attentiin on him 24/7 so his team could escape. His death was not an anti-feat if you understand the calibre he was up against smh
Anime Catalyst wrong I stated exactly what they were, low level Bijuu at best. The sage of the sixth paths weapons are unquantifiable in power and we have no evidence of which weapon they used and if they were impactful at all, for example some of the sealing weapons used by the sage of the sixth paths wouldn’t even apply here at all because Tobirama doesn’t have a catch phrase, they might not even know his full name. And yes they did have 9 rials bijuu mode but it was only level 1 cloak and the max tails they could sprout is 4, they also both only have 10% of the nine tails combined between them so they are basically way weaker versions of 4 tails Naruto that fought Orochimaru and tenchi bridge. As for the “20 S class ninja” again we have to assume how powerful they were, we can’t just say they were akatsuki level especially since most S class ninja are just mid-high jonins in other villages. If these other “20 S class Ninja” were that powerful dont u think they would have a name outside of the “Kinkaku force” ? They were all ninja who were lackeys of the gold and silver brothers who aren’t that strong at all and maybe if Tobirama would have lost to them once you could argue it was an outlier but he literally lost twice to them, once at the peace summit and the second time with a squad ambush. This is one of the worst anti feats in the series and the fact that the second hokage and one of the strongest Senju couldn’t beat a bunch of low bijuu level ninja shows how garbage he is in comparison to other high tier Naruto characters. Kishimoto wrote himself into a hole In order to give a back story to the gold and silver brothers, and unfortunately it came at the cost of anyone ever taking Tobirama seriously again.
Death Reaper ok so you basically just said what I said. We don’t know what weapons or how strong the 20 s class ninja were. They would’ve been Akatsuki level or Young Kakashi level. You also don’t know how many of them he killed or if he killed any at all. Please just stfu cause like I said we don’t know enough about Tobirama
Death Reaper and it was named the kinkaku force because they created it 😂 that’s like saying Naruto is the most powerful charecter because the show is named after him
I think the fact that Tobirama could react to **Reincarnated, Amped, Sage Mode, Rinnegan Madara** means Kisame is getting put down lol Tobirama just uses FTG a few times and cuts Kisame's head and/or limbs off. Kisame can't heal everything forever. Tobirama isn't going to spam high-chakra attacks like Bee did, so there's little to nothing for Samehada to absorb. Tobirama isn't going to be at a huge disadvantage underwater, both because he's a master of water release, and because of FTG as you mentioned. You make it sound as if there's just nothing Tobirama can do because Kisame was able to heal that one attack. Except there's also nothing Kisame can do because Tobirama can dodge or FTG away from everything Kisame does + his massive speed advantage.
considering all we saw kisame doing in a fight against bee and all tobirama managed to do in war arc, tobirama gets bodied, he lacks fire power to hurt kisame, ffs kisame just laughed off bees lariat which is far more powerful than anything tobirama has in his arsenal.
I severly doubt Bee hits harder than tobirama. Tobirama with a flex scared EMS sasuke, Oro, Suigetsu(who was scared of him, while he wasn't afraid of taking on the *full fucking 8 tails*), Jugo, as well as Minato and Hiruzen. He was able to cut through the divine tree, which was able to purge the shinobi alliance and is litterally said to be the tree form of the 10 tails(which was powerful enough to tank an attack from KCM2 naruto amped by amaterasu. And was able to overwhelm Minato.) and could restrict and kill several amped shinobi stronger than kakashi, who in the war outdoes fully transformed bee and kcm naruto. The divine tree was also going to kill KCM2 naruto had Hiruzen not saved him. Even in his severly nerfed Edo tensei state in part I, he was able to overpower Hiruzen who was the strongest of the 5 kage, including Onoki and Ay. So yeah, Tobirama deffenitly hits harder than bee
Blitz Kisame, tandem paper bomb, teleport home for some ramen. Im sorry but tandem paper bomb is far more dangerous than Hirudora. The explosions dont stop once they start until the user cancel it. Its not a one off burst attack. Its massive damage over time. The only way Kisame could survive that is if the explosions were too weak to hurt him but he isnt explosion proof. He is durable and one bomb isnt going to finish him, but there would be nothing left except grilled shark by the 57th explosion.
I'm two years late so I'm probably talking to the wall, BUT, Tobirama also has kage bushin and edo tensei. And while edo tensei is forbidden I have a hard time seeing him lay down his life rather than use it. Both these jutsu create diversions for a severing wave, FTG, or other attack. I understand that you're hamstrung when discussing the 2nd because there is so much he can allegedly do but we have only seen a couple things, but it think taking away his other chakra natures and assuming he has a certain level of physical strength despite him being Senju and that he would only use water despite being a tactical fighter is just like using an entirely different character at that point. So like, I get where you're coming from, but it still isn't a fair comparison. Also I think people overstate Kisame's healing abilities (and attack potency in general) based on the Killer Bee fight. Kisame is 100% a fighter who's max potential is really dependent on the chakra he can absorb. He began the v. 8 tails fight by absorbing a like tail-cloaks worth of chakra and swelling Samehada to a size larger than we had ever seen beforehand. Of course, then, he is able to have a really good recovery and large scale attacks. You can refer back to the v team 9 fight, but even then, it's not totally convincing that water and earth style Jutsu take as much chakra to impact a large area. Yamato casually creates a cliff and a waterfall. Kakashi creates the giant water vortex despite having his chakra depleted. He definitely has the chakra for large scale attacks, but I think people will overrate him based on these attacks when realistically he has a lot of gaps for tactical fighters to take advantage of. In my opinion
@@stealtha1234 I think it was only said kinkaku was there and not specified if his brother was, and they only use the nine tails Chakra when one of them is severely wounded. And ur acting like their cloak is comparable to kcm when it’s like only 4 tails. And the third raikage took out 10000 jonin and I think 10k jonin r harder than 20 s rank ninja. S rank is like konohamaru in Boruto lvl
@@docrivers8211 it’s not only 4 tails kid , it’s 6 tails . S-rank is not konohamaru level , konohamaru level is A to B-rank ok and Tobirama was on a mission so he wasn’t at full power
@@ActuallyAlask there is no such thing as power level in naruto tobirama has nothing to kill kisame hirudora destroyed madara's full body susanoo where everyone else could not break his ribcage well kisame was way below his max power tobirama can't kill him if he blitzes him kisame regenerates using tobirama's chakra kisame already has several times more chakra than tobirama fused kisame gets stronger time by time tobirama gets weaker and weaker kisame stomps 10/10 times kisame fused is stronger than 7th gates guy who would destroy minato or tobirama
@@jackson9034 "tobirama has nothing to kill kisame" He cuts Kisame's head off with Severing Wave. "hirudora destroyed madara's full body susanoo where everyone else could not break his ribcage" uhhh read that chapter again, there is absolutely zero evidence Hirudora destroyed Madara's Susanoo. Guy merely knocked it back. He also could have just gotten stronger between the Kisame fight and the War since he uses the gates more frequently in the War. There's also a difference in concussive force vs cutting power. Kisame was scared of a pencil charged with some lightning chakra going right through his head, and this was full power Kisame. "kisame regenerates using tobirama's chakra" Why is Kisame able to react to absorb Tobirama's chakra? Even if Kisame does absorb Tobirama's chakra, Tobirama was capable of using Water Style Ninjutsu to cut through several god tree roots. These roots absorbed so much chakra in such a short time that Naruto went from bijuu sage mode to passing out in base. And tobirama is still capable of cutting through a bunch of them with a single stream of water. Tobirama would just completely overpower Kisame to the point where chakra absorption wouldnt even matter. Also if Tobirama jumps in close quarters Kisame is fucked because Tobirama isnt giving Kisame any chakra to munch on. "kisame already has several times more chakra than tobirama" proof? "fused kisame gets stronger time by time tobirama gets weaker and weaker" Tobirama outspeeds pretty badly and overpowers Kisame before the fusion can really happen or do anything.
Suigetsu's reactions to the two can be used as evidence, he was composed when it came to Kisame, and while Kisame wasn't at full power a single raised finger from nerfed edo-Tobirama caused Suigetsu to hide behind Orochimaru. There's also the fact that Tobirama dodged alive, sage-mode, 1 Rinnegan Madara. Madara is faster than KCM1 Naruto who Kisame could barely see moving let alone react. Tobirama would just be too fast for the hidden mist swordsman.
Tobirama scaring Suigetsu would actually be in Kisame's favor, Samehada's whole thing is that it is better against High-Chakra Ninja since it has more to eat thus more to pump into Kisame to power him up. Now it is possible that Tobirama is faster...in the air. If Kisame uses his whole Lake thing I don't think Tobirama is as fast in the water, and there's no way he can teleport into the water and attack like it's nothing, the shock alone from dry to wet would stop that plan.
If you watched that scene again, it's obvious Hashirama was the one who scared Suigetsu, not Tobirama. True but when Naruto blitzed him, Kisame was not in a combat form, but one for spy. In Water Kisame could move faster than V2 Killer Bee who should be comparable to KCM1 Naruto since they fought side by side
@@andreizamfir3232 but a stronger Naruto was barely able to see what Tobirama was doingI’m by the way I just re-watched it Hashirama powered up after Tobirama scared them.
Swags vid be like Bro OMG kisame fought bee trolling Tobirama for 10 mins straight Me - is it over Yo Seth you want in on it A video not even comparing just hating on tobirama
It's crazy how everybody thinks kisame stomps tobi rama 😂😂😂 dude with edo tensei and flying raijin.......I don't see how this is ever happening Let's say he can react to flying raijin which we all know he can't something not even Obito kamui lost to What will he do against an hashirama edo or madara edo tensei just to metion a few....lol Oh and I guess samehada absorbs the bringer of darkness genjustu too Oh my bad I guess the samehada will just swallow them all up 😂😂😂
@@FolkBoyify he said he does flying raijin better was the best water justsu user of his time and killed madaras brother who had a mangakeyo how could minato shit on him
@@jackson9034 I understand, but i totally disagree. Edo weakened tobirama can keep up with kcm minato, kcm 2 naruto, ems sauske. In part one tobirama can even move on par with hashirama. Plus he can tag and mark kisame.
@@HaydenDao616 because he didn’t do shit? What he do He isn’t useful in battle He lost to fodder characters Do you really think madara/Hashirama/Itachi/Obito/Pain/Minato would have lost to those fodder characters tobirama lost against
Tobiramas tandem paper bomb managed to destroy one of hashiramas deity gate which even the ten tails tailed beast bomb couldn't destroy
That never happened in the anime, correct me if that happened in the manga
WyArYUGei N1 it happened in the manga
Tandem paper bombs can only work if you are an edo tensei because it literally involved sacrificing ur body to create reverse summon paper bombs. Tobirama would never pull that in character in a real fightz
Well he could still use it by putting it on a kunai or using edo tensei to resurrect some random ninja
@Prepare your ass because pablo yes it did, use ur brain first
The difference is, Kisame produced the wave from inside of his body, Tobirama made the vortex out of thin air from around his body
people really underestimate tobiramas abilities
Tobirama is overrated af
Kisame wins
Underrated
Anyone who grew up in the warring states era has a huge battle experience advantage over those who didn’t, Tobirama was fighting wars against uchiha when he was a literal child and not to mention he’s quite possibly more intelligent than shikamaru and has the power to capitalize on that iq, Kisame said jiraiya would embarrass him in a fight and jiraiya’s feats pale in comparison to Tobirama
If you think Kisame has an edge over the smartest senju to ever live then you need to rewatch the show
The truth is we haven't seen much of Tobirama's abilities in a battle. We Saw more of Kisame's abilities vs Guy, naruto, Killer Bee, Kakashi, and the tailed beasts. However I think Tobirama wins because judging from his performance and character when he got summoned in the battle with the 10 tails he seemed to be more in charge than Minato and Hiruzen. He is a genius when it comes to figuring out weaknesses. He managed to dodge an attack from Sage Madara with the Rinnegan while Tobirama was in his weakened reanimated form and when Sasuke tried to attack Madara from behind he almost got killed despite Tobirama's distraction.
So you so he wins from speed and being a genius? Did you literally not watch the video my guy? It's like comparing final form frieza to 20x kaioken goku in namek arc. You might have the advantage esrly on but eventually you'll lose.
@@Friendly_G He dodged a sage mode rinniagan Madara while be nerfed and if he can’t use chakra on him he can just cut off his head.
@@Friendly_G stop with the bullshit you can’t defend this
@@asura3229 yeah.
He was summoned as a REANIMATED version of himself, which has more chakra stability than the living Tobirama.
It’s VERY hard to say that a living Tobirama would defeat Kisame, when we’ve seen more of Kisame’s abilities. I’m VERY split between these two.
Kisame wouldn’t even able to hit tobirama let alone win...
That what i was thinking topirama is too fast to git hit by kisami and kisami is too tanky to be killed by tobirama
@@thefuturefighter8215 well if he uses it on kisime he gets way stronger like way so he can’t really use it
Spittin
Kisame would murder your boy
@@MrLadysman333 😂
5:05 No, Kisame can not tank those paper bombs. They were strong enough to completely destroy sage Hashirama's biggest deity gate, which were strong enough to hold down the 10 tails and tank a bijuu bomb from it. Unless your implying that Kisame has 10 tails levels of durability.
6:57 Even if Kisame "anticipates" Tobirama's teleportation, what proof do you have that he'd be fast enough to react to it? You can't use Madara as an example to explain why Kisame would be capable of doing that, since that Madara has far better speed feats than anything Kisame ever displayed.
It destroyed a wood clone of Hashirama only. That's nowhere near the original Madara was poking them with the ribcage Susanoo and they were gone
Tobirama himself stated that Minato is better at teleporting than himself Killer B reacted twice to Minato and Kisame reacted from point blank attacks from B.
@@andreizamfir3232 I'm not sure what you were trying to get at with the Hashirama wood clone and Susanoo ribcage point, so it'd be nice if you could clarify.
B reacting to Minato was impressive, but he was suppressing himself in that encounter with Bee. A weakened Edo Tobirama was fast enough to blitz and react to Juubito multiple times, who has speed similar to KCM 2 Minato. This weakened Tobirama had relative speed to another character's who speed is relative to an even faster Minato than you mentioned.
@@bofi1280 simple. Tobirama's paper bombs are nowhere near Sage mode Hashirama 's power nor a Juubi' blast.
This only means that KCM is more of a power multiplier than speed. Plus it was alive Minato not so that B reacted to.
The only times Juubito got blitez I remember was when he had almost no control over his body and second time he didn't knew he was that vulnerable to Sage mode. Nobody blitez him afterwards.
@@andreizamfir3232 His paper bombs are on that level tho. That same deity gate held down the 10 tails and survived a 10 tails bijuu bomb without being destroyed. Tobirama's paper bombs blew it to bits, therefore his paper bombs are 10 tails bijuu bomb level +.
How do you know that KCM is "more of a power multiplier than speed?" We can clearly see that it boosts all stats, like most transformations in Naruto. We see Sage mode Naruto(granted it was a clone) being able to keep up with the 3rd raikage in speed, to being able to blitz an even faster character in 4th raikage Ay. This is a clear indication that KCM gives it's user a speed boost alongside other things. Also, Tobirama was blitzing Perfect jinchuriki Juubito, re-watch the show.
@@bofi1280 Hashirama's power was split between his clones. That's how I remember. It wasn't when Juubi charged that Biju Bomb.
An attack like that would have one shotted Izuna, Madara and the Kinkaku squad that killed him. Why didn't he use it then?
Those were the only times Juubito got "blitzed". The context matters.
How do I know? Because it allows you to form a huge Kurama body and to fire biju bombs
Edo Tobirama said base Edo Minato is better than him at teleporting.
But even base pre war arc Naruto easily kept up with Ms Sasuke who could reacted with inferno style to v2 Raikage. No KCM required. Even Gaara reacted to V2 Raikage.
Ok my friend I think you are comparing kisame to alive rinnegan with sage mode madara who should be way faster than kisame the fact that this madara dodged tobirama doesn't mean kisame can
Correct me if I am wrong, the problem is that tobirama is way faster than kisame that's a fact dude tobirama was taging tentails obito multiple times and this is edo tobirama his clone alone was reacting faster than minato. Yeah so alive tobirama should be faster and stronger than edo tobirama and 1v1 tobirama should beat kisame if he is serious if he was fighting in the war in weaker form he should brat kisame quickly and if you are comparing kisame to another character's feat you should first how strong and fast they are
Kisame has no hope of deafiting tobirama and tobirama cold teleport samehada away to another place and fight him 1v1 tobirama is just faster and smarter than kisame he could chop of his head with flying raijin
Thanks anyway for making this video
I am a new subscribe and please don't downplay tobirama
madara dodge tobirama because of hashirama sage mode, which can sense chakra. and hashirama and madara said tht tobirama instinct and speed dull a bit in edo form. tobirama has edo tensai jutsu too
Bro tobirama is not defeating kisame we will take prime tobirama OK
And prime tobirama had already got shit on by ginkaku and kinkaku
And than you are talking about kisame can't dodge tobiramas FTG OK let me tell you tobirama died to ginkaku and kinkaku which definitely means that he was not able to blitz them with his FTG means
Tobirama = ginkaku and kinkaku
We will high ball tobirama because I put him equal to ginkaku and kinkaku let's move on . ginkaku and kinkaku was not able to blitz darui or inoshikacho trio means they are rival to gin and kin bro
Means
Tobirama = darui =< gin kin
And now 4 ( A ) > darui bcz he is the fastest shinobi after minato and now jonin minato > tobirama right which means his FTG his better than tobirama right and kid killer bee was able to react minatos FTG remember and that was kid killer bee means he is not faster than minato I m talking about reaction speed means
Tobirama = darui =< gin and kin < 4 raikage < killer bee = jonin minato
And that was kid killer bee and than kisame was able to blitz ( blitz ) killer bee and killer bee was not able react at kisames attacks which means
Tobirama ~ darui < gin and kin < raikage ~< kid killer bee ~ jonin minato < adult killer bee < kisame
so definitely kisame is able to react at tobirama FTG
Wait let me tell you the comparison
Speed = reaction = kisame and blitzing = tobirama
Strength = kisame
Chakra = kisame
Jutsu = kisame ( no doubt )
Taijutsu = kisame ( tobirama has no feats
Genjutsu = none
Battle IQ = tobirama
Winner =
Tobirama =2 Kisame =5
So there is no way tobirama can defeat kisame absolutely not you have only one feat to tell FTG and I also have cleared you that kisame is definitely able to avoid blitzing so please accept this brother
@@DarkTemple31 u know wht ur problem is, u ccompare character like bullshit, always compare character with there ability not with other people. kisame would never match tobirama speed, write it down. every jutsu kisame use , tobirama would dodge it in a sleep. tht the power of FTG.
@@DarkTemple31 in this battle we havnt included edo tensai, if we include it kisame has no chance.
@@Shubham-hr5uw wait bruh first of all you can compare characters with other characters because they never fought with each other
Now with their ablilties OK so you are saying that tobirama is lot faster than kisame agreed and you are also saying that edo tensai we are not including edo tensei in first place but even if we did than still kisame is stronger bcz tobirama himself accepted that his edo tensei is weaker than orochimarus part 1 edo tensei so hmm kisame takes this round now you are saying that he can blitz kisame nope he can't like I said in my previous comment that kisame has no difficulty dodging his FTG because minatos FTG got reacted by kid killer bee and minato is by far faster than tobirama and kisame has faster reaction speed than even duly killer bee so I told you FTG won't work and now no jutsu is useful because kisame can absorb than and tobirama can't dodge kisames attack bcz kisame has by far better water style jutsu than tobirama just imagine a 30% clone can bring a water lake than 100% kisame has like way way better water style than tobirama if tobirama places kunais to dodge kisames attacks than kisame will bring water lake or create a water bubble and boom its an easy victory I m not gonna hate tobirama just bcz he looses to kisame I m a big fan of him he created MSC Jutsu and I like him but its an honest truth that tobirama has nothing against kisame and I m not talking about kisames abilities bcz if I did than its an unmatched 1v1 and every jutsu of tobirama is not gonna work bcz kisame will absorb it so kisame > tobirama i m not saying that tobirama is weak or something but its an honest truth that 4 akatsuki members are stronger than tobirama 1 obito 2 itachi 3 pain 4 kisame
Can Tobirama just teleport samehada away? Maybe he could use darkness jutsu to prevent Kisame from swinging accurately
@@norman5985 Does the sword always absorb chakra constantly? If yes then I guess you have a good point. I guess it depends if Kisame notices the seal.
@@norman5985 I suppose that is possible. I do think that Kisame is definitely kage level but even if he could beat Tobirama, Tobirama would be smart enough to know when he is outclassed and teleport away making it a stalemate. He is fast enough to also ambush Kisame while he is on a stroll. But yeah if Tobirama and Kisame were forced to fight to the death within an enclosed arena Kisame wins
@@emersonlee5146 atleast you acknowledge tobirama loses
@@lanastevens7399 Yeah I think he loses but to be clear I don't necessarily think he dies if that makes sense. I don't see any evidence that indicates Kisame has some kind of space time barrier to stop a flying thunder god retreat
Yep
Reasonable a shame we didn't get more action out of tobirama
Yeah I actually like Tobirama a lot more than kisame. This battle is kind of like a Swiss Army knife vs a machete. A machete always wins.
Tobirama is definitely loosing under these circumstances, but what if tobirama could tag and teleport samehada like minato could, Because if tobirama figure out after landing attack on kisame that samehada heals kisame, if tobirama can get rid of samehada, then tobirama should gain an advantage in the fight.
U guys are stupid y do u watch naruto tobirama is a fucking senju he have a lottttt of charka too u guys only focus on hasirama even the fifth hokage have alot of charka have u idiots ever see those ppl complaining about charka
@stoopidsilly the juubi bomb was touching ( connecting) with killer bee when minato teleported it, the TSO is juubito's but that didn't stop tobirama from removing it and that's much more potent than samehada, so yes Tobirama can teleport samehada .
@stoopidsilly he used sop tools
This video deserves way more likes
Yep tobirama is so overrated kisame wins eventually
Thank you for making me realize that their is a good youtubers that can make naruto verse battles good that swagkagy is just making fun out of it in bad way that makes you want to close the video when he start talking
It seems everyone forgot he created the forbidden jutsu resurrection the dead....
that is so irrelevant in a 1v1 I honestly don't know why you guys keep bringing that up. he wouldn't even use it
@@lanastevens7399 Its in his arsenal. why wouldn't he use it
@@electro13k54 like he said NO PREP TIME. My guy
@@Friendly_G Edo tensei is not really prep time. He probably already has dead bodies at his disposal
@@electro13k54 bro you really gonna say that? First, it's a forbidden justu, second you really think he just caring a scroll of his many dead enemies at his disposal? Dont be doing shit like that bro.
Much better than swags vid
they just weren't being serious
I win
@@New_Horizons even if he was, its still a fact. Yours is way better
@@saul_goodman3932 oh damn
K but instead of doing a flying rajin to the stomach, cant he just do it to the neck. And he can use edo tensei, its part of his arsenal, dont know why u wouldn't include it. I know he never used lightning but if his opponent is a water style user, it would only make sense that he uses lightning style. He also has his "thunder of god sword" which would be useful against kisame
It’s almost impossible to use edo tensei in battle, and his edo tensei is like part one orochimarus, it’s trash
@@docrivers8211 I mean it was used when Obito was attacking Kabuto, so u can say that it saved Kabuto and also against Orochimaru vs Hiruzen. And Tobirama's was not perfected but much better than Orochimaru's. It could regenerate and also plant paper bombs for them to explode to their targets. And I imagine that Tobirama is not just going to stand there, he is going to use them for a diversion and wait for the right moment to flying rajin Kisame
@@electro13k54 he doesn’t like to use edo tensei in the first place, and his edo tensei is most likely much weaker than kabutos, and if I’m correct most people were highly nerfed even in kabutos so I can only imagine how weak his is
you can't draw conclusions.
Tobirama has many jutsu and several abilities that are still unknown. Tobirama created 1000 jutsu that much is still unknown. Tobirama only has a few scenes in the anime and manga. Kishimoto must reveal all his abilities, so that we will be able to draw conclusions.
Tobirama has gone toe to toe with the kinkakku force a group of 20 elite shinobis, talking kisame would be walk in a park for him
My god you're dumb.
Tobirama beat chunin level fodders overrated fodder tobirama kisame claps 10/10 times
Tobirama wins, it's not even really a debate...that's not knocking Kissame...it's just the truth, especially if he's using all of the jutsu he has at his desposal and doesn't he technically have all 5 chakra natures? I just don't see how this is such a big debate.
Are his attacks strong enough to kill him
@@SyedAli-gl7jq
Mhm
@@ActuallyAlask no they are not
@@SyedAli-gl7jq
Stronger than a pencil with some lightning chakra so yes
@@ActuallyAlask tf
Wait so just because we’ve never seen Tobirama use another nature element that means he can’t in this fight?
Bullshit. Fake news.
Just some guy yes, it makes sense smh
32 Spinner How?
Just some guy we haven’t seen tobirama use other elements, so it would be illogical to include those factors in this battle, as it is not relevant. For example everyone can actually learn the 8gates, it just takes years of training. Are we then going to say that in a fight against Sakura and Itachi, that Sakura will win by busting out the 8gates? No
I styll believe that Tobirama wins however
32 Spinner Go watch Swagkage’s video on chakra natures. He clearly states that Tobirama can use all 5 basic chakra natures.
You’re wrong.
The way tobirama had his sword as he cut izuna imploes he wasnt meaning to kill him, he also got non vital spot so he would 100% decapitate kisame
The problem with bringing dead ninja back to life to help you fight someone just proves you lost to that person 1v1 and that darkness jutsu belongs to Hashirama so Tobirama looses either way, but for you people disrespecting Tobirama you'll need to grow up its always about the match up in a fight and strength isn't the key to winning a fight all the times.
What about edo tensei? Yes if tobirama summoned them they would be weak ofc but he could still use them to strategize. Either way I can still see Kisame winning, but I also think tobirama could cut Kisames head because of his speed. I don’t think Kisame would have the time to react to Flying raijin . Either way a good video 💯
Lol there’s SOOOOO many problems here
1) First off all did you REALLY just compare SM Madara to Kisame in terms of speed? That’s completely ridiculous!!!! You can’t just say that Kisame could dodge Tobirama’s attacks just because Madara could. You have to provide speed feats that scale Kisame to Tobirama’s level
We’ve seen Kisame getting blitzed by characters like KCM Naruto and 7th Gate Guy
Meanwhile Tobirama while weakened by Edo Tensei was so fast that his SHADOW CLONE was capable of saving KCM Minato ( who is WAAAAY faster than KCM Naruto or 7th Gate guy) from Juubito’s exploding Truth Seeking Orb. Not to mention that he was also shown blitzing Juubito multiple times during during the war arc
In short you have MASSIVELY underestimated Tobirama’s speed
2) Even if Kisame covers the battlefield in water I doubt it will impede Tobirama’s movement/ teleportation
If you go watch Tobirama’s fight with Hiruzen he was shown swimming underwater with ease and even attempts to drown Hiruzen. So he is still very agile underwater
And considering FTG marks never disappear Tobirama can escape Kisame’s giant water dome ( or any other water techniques) by teleport away from the battlefield and returning
3) Tobirama’s Paper Bomb technique is a lot stronger than you give it credit for
It was capable of destroying one of Hashirama’s Diety gates which were durable enough to tank being hit by Naruto’s Sage Art: Massive Rasenshurikan and strong enough to pin down the 10 tails
So it would not be unreasonable to say that the Tandem Paper Bombs scale to or even above the Hirudora
4) You didn’t mention that Tobirama can use Edo Tensei which allows him to summon zombies that regenerate and can be used in combination with the Tandem Paper bombs to create immortal suicide bombers .......and Kisame doesn’t have a reliable counter to this because he doesn’t have any sealing jutsu ( which is necessary to defeat an Edo)
If I were you I would consider redoing this video. You got a lot of stuff wrong here my guy
Tobirama’s reanimation would be way weaker than kabutos or orochimarus you can’t even use this as an argument cuz we don’t even know who he can summon plus he probably wouldn’t have much control over them since ororchimaru used the tags and he didn’t. Correct me if I’m wrong haven’t watched Naruto in a solid while
Honestly we don’t know enough about Tobirama to say if he loses, stomps, or if its even a good fight
Mohamed Mohamed we know he got stomped twice by two low level bijuu and 20 mid-high jonin fighters. That’s all the information anyone needs.
@@deathreaper4166 wrong, if your going to state things as a fact, make sure they are actually facts. The 2 "low level" biju had nine tails 2 biju mode, and had the sage of 6 paths ninja tools with them. Then they had 20 S rank ninjas that can be anyone from the akatsuki level, who are considered Gods. And to further prove how you are lacking in infornation, Tobirama was scuffed after coming back from a mission, scuffed if you dont know means tired, fatigued. And Tobiramas aim was to keep the attentiin on him 24/7 so his team could escape. His death was not an anti-feat if you understand the calibre he was up against smh
Anime Catalyst wrong I stated exactly what they were, low level Bijuu at best. The sage of the sixth paths weapons are unquantifiable in power and we have no evidence of which weapon they used and if they were impactful at all, for example some of the sealing weapons used by the sage of the sixth paths wouldn’t even apply here at all because Tobirama doesn’t have a catch phrase, they might not even know his full name. And yes they did have 9 rials bijuu mode but it was only level 1 cloak and the max tails they could sprout is 4, they also both only have 10% of the nine tails combined between them so they are basically way weaker versions of 4 tails Naruto that fought Orochimaru and tenchi bridge. As for the “20 S class ninja” again we have to assume how powerful they were, we can’t just say they were akatsuki level especially since most S class ninja are just mid-high jonins in other villages. If these other “20 S class Ninja” were that powerful dont u think they would have a name outside of the “Kinkaku force” ? They were all ninja who were lackeys of the gold and silver brothers who aren’t that strong at all and maybe if Tobirama would have lost to them once you could argue it was an outlier but he literally lost twice to them, once at the peace summit and the second time with a squad ambush. This is one of the worst anti feats in the series and the fact that the second hokage and one of the strongest Senju couldn’t beat a bunch of low bijuu level ninja shows how garbage he is in comparison to other high tier Naruto characters. Kishimoto wrote himself into a hole In order to give a back story to the gold and silver brothers, and unfortunately it came at the cost of anyone ever taking Tobirama seriously again.
Death Reaper ok so you basically just said what I said. We don’t know what weapons or how strong the 20 s class ninja were. They would’ve been Akatsuki level or Young Kakashi level. You also don’t know how many of them he killed or if he killed any at all. Please just stfu cause like I said we don’t know enough about Tobirama
Death Reaper and it was named the kinkaku force because they created it 😂 that’s like saying Naruto is the most powerful charecter because the show is named after him
I think the fact that Tobirama could react to **Reincarnated, Amped, Sage Mode, Rinnegan Madara** means Kisame is getting put down lol
Tobirama just uses FTG a few times and cuts Kisame's head and/or limbs off. Kisame can't heal everything forever.
Tobirama isn't going to spam high-chakra attacks like Bee did, so there's little to nothing for Samehada to absorb.
Tobirama isn't going to be at a huge disadvantage underwater, both because he's a master of water release, and because of FTG as you mentioned.
You make it sound as if there's just nothing Tobirama can do because Kisame was able to heal that one attack.
Except there's also nothing Kisame can do because Tobirama can dodge or FTG away from everything Kisame does + his massive speed advantage.
Tobirama can’t hit Kisame. And Kisame would kill Tobirama in one shot
@@princescille4569 No
@@princescille4569 He could just simply cut off his head in one shot the only reason why he did not was he wanted the possibility of peace
@@asura3229 no he can’t
@@princescille4569 why can’t he
considering all we saw kisame doing in a fight against bee and all tobirama managed to do in war arc, tobirama gets bodied, he lacks fire power to hurt kisame, ffs kisame just laughed off bees lariat which is far more powerful than anything tobirama has in his arsenal.
Tobirama actually cut the God Tree, Kisame would get cut tf in half by Tobirama's Water Style Severing Wave.
I severly doubt Bee hits harder than tobirama. Tobirama with a flex scared EMS sasuke, Oro, Suigetsu(who was scared of him, while he wasn't afraid of taking on the *full fucking 8 tails*), Jugo, as well as Minato and Hiruzen. He was able to cut through the divine tree, which was able to purge the shinobi alliance and is litterally said to be the tree form of the 10 tails(which was powerful enough to tank an attack from KCM2 naruto amped by amaterasu. And was able to overwhelm Minato.) and could restrict and kill several amped shinobi stronger than kakashi, who in the war outdoes fully transformed bee and kcm naruto. The divine tree was also going to kill KCM2 naruto had Hiruzen not saved him. Even in his severly nerfed Edo tensei state in part I, he was able to overpower Hiruzen who was the strongest of the 5 kage, including Onoki and Ay. So yeah, Tobirama deffenitly hits harder than bee
@@Dwood777 thank you, tobirama rapes lmao
All Kisame knows is water style. Tobirama invented most of the Jutsu everyone uses in this series. Kisame is getting bodied
@@Dwood777 Bro what does sasuke being scared by tobirama's vast amount of chakra do? Bro remember this is NO PREP TIME fight. Just the video my guy
Blitz Kisame, tandem paper bomb, teleport home for some ramen. Im sorry but tandem paper bomb is far more dangerous than Hirudora. The explosions dont stop once they start until the user cancel it. Its not a one off burst attack. Its massive damage over time. The only way Kisame could survive that is if the explosions were too weak to hurt him but he isnt explosion proof. He is durable and one bomb isnt going to finish him, but there would be nothing left except grilled shark by the 57th explosion.
New Horizon works for Uchiha
I'm two years late so I'm probably talking to the wall, BUT, Tobirama also has kage bushin and edo tensei. And while edo tensei is forbidden I have a hard time seeing him lay down his life rather than use it. Both these jutsu create diversions for a severing wave, FTG, or other attack. I understand that you're hamstrung when discussing the 2nd because there is so much he can allegedly do but we have only seen a couple things, but it think taking away his other chakra natures and assuming he has a certain level of physical strength despite him being Senju and that he would only use water despite being a tactical fighter is just like using an entirely different character at that point. So like, I get where you're coming from, but it still isn't a fair comparison.
Also I think people overstate Kisame's healing abilities (and attack potency in general) based on the Killer Bee fight. Kisame is 100% a fighter who's max potential is really dependent on the chakra he can absorb. He began the v. 8 tails fight by absorbing a like tail-cloaks worth of chakra and swelling Samehada to a size larger than we had ever seen beforehand. Of course, then, he is able to have a really good recovery and large scale attacks. You can refer back to the v team 9 fight, but even then, it's not totally convincing that water and earth style Jutsu take as much chakra to impact a large area. Yamato casually creates a cliff and a waterfall. Kakashi creates the giant water vortex despite having his chakra depleted. He definitely has the chakra for large scale attacks, but I think people will overrate him based on these attacks when realistically he has a lot of gaps for tactical fighters to take advantage of. In my opinion
its simple kisame its tailed beast level since his nickname is the tailest tailed beast and tobirama died to fuader characters
Nigga the Characters he died to Had the second strongest tailed beast chakra 💀💀, And 20-s class shinobi sooo what’s your point ?
@@stealtha1234 I think it was only said kinkaku was there and not specified if his brother was, and they only use the nine tails Chakra when one of them is severely wounded. And ur acting like their cloak is comparable to kcm when it’s like only 4 tails. And the third raikage took out 10000 jonin and I think 10k jonin r harder than 20 s rank ninja. S rank is like konohamaru in Boruto lvl
@@docrivers8211 it’s not only 4 tails kid , it’s 6 tails . S-rank is not konohamaru level , konohamaru level is A to B-rank ok and Tobirama was on a mission so he wasn’t at full power
@Kevin Mandujano Yes obito is strong , but I’m telling you Tobirama wasn’t at full power
Just stop.
Lol ppl gotta realized that only hasirama was build different in the senju clan everyone else is normal ppl with high chakra reserves
I think it could go either way
No, Tobirama literally one shots him. Not even exaggerating.
@@ActuallyAlask tobirama is the most overrated character in naruto kisame wins 10/10 times
@@jackson9034
what scaling does Kisame have over Tobirama lol
@@ActuallyAlask there is no such thing as power level in naruto tobirama has nothing to kill kisame hirudora destroyed madara's full body susanoo where everyone else could not break his ribcage well kisame was way below his max power tobirama can't kill him if he blitzes him kisame regenerates using tobirama's chakra kisame already has several times more chakra than tobirama fused kisame gets stronger time by time tobirama gets weaker and weaker kisame stomps 10/10 times kisame fused is stronger than 7th gates guy who would destroy minato or tobirama
@@jackson9034
"tobirama has nothing to kill kisame"
He cuts Kisame's head off with Severing Wave.
"hirudora destroyed madara's full body susanoo where everyone else could not break his ribcage"
uhhh read that chapter again, there is absolutely zero evidence Hirudora destroyed Madara's Susanoo. Guy merely knocked it back. He also could have just gotten stronger between the Kisame fight and the War since he uses the gates more frequently in the War. There's also a difference in concussive force vs cutting power. Kisame was scared of a pencil charged with some lightning chakra going right through his head, and this was full power Kisame.
"kisame regenerates using tobirama's chakra"
Why is Kisame able to react to absorb Tobirama's chakra? Even if Kisame does absorb Tobirama's chakra, Tobirama was capable of using Water Style Ninjutsu to cut through several god tree roots. These roots absorbed so much chakra in such a short time that Naruto went from bijuu sage mode to passing out in base. And tobirama is still capable of cutting through a bunch of them with a single stream of water. Tobirama would just completely overpower Kisame to the point where chakra absorption wouldnt even matter. Also if Tobirama jumps in close quarters Kisame is fucked because Tobirama isnt giving Kisame any chakra to munch on.
"kisame already has several times more chakra than tobirama"
proof?
"fused kisame gets stronger time by time tobirama gets weaker and weaker"
Tobirama outspeeds pretty badly and overpowers Kisame before the fusion can really happen or do anything.
Suigetsu's reactions to the two can be used as evidence, he was composed when it came to Kisame, and while Kisame wasn't at full power a single raised finger from nerfed edo-Tobirama caused Suigetsu to hide behind Orochimaru.
There's also the fact that Tobirama dodged alive, sage-mode, 1 Rinnegan Madara. Madara is faster than KCM1 Naruto who Kisame could barely see moving let alone react. Tobirama would just be too fast for the hidden mist swordsman.
Tobirama scaring Suigetsu would actually be in Kisame's favor, Samehada's whole thing is that it is better against High-Chakra Ninja since it has more to eat thus more to pump into Kisame to power him up.
Now it is possible that Tobirama is faster...in the air. If Kisame uses his whole Lake thing I don't think Tobirama is as fast in the water, and there's no way he can teleport into the water and attack like it's nothing, the shock alone from dry to wet would stop that plan.
But not Kisame
If you watched that scene again, it's obvious Hashirama was the one who scared Suigetsu, not Tobirama.
True but when Naruto blitzed him, Kisame was not in a combat form, but one for spy. In Water Kisame could move faster than V2 Killer Bee who should be comparable to KCM1 Naruto since they fought side by side
@@andreizamfir3232 but a stronger Naruto was barely able to see what Tobirama was doingI’m by the way I just re-watched it Hashirama powered up after Tobirama scared them.
@@andreizamfir3232 even in the water he could use a flying rijin and leave
Fused kisame is very underatted
Swags vid be like
Bro OMG kisame fought bee
trolling Tobirama for 10 mins straight
Me - is it over
Yo Seth you want in on it
A video not even comparing just hating on tobirama
Yea
Tobirama is stronger he is 3 strongest hokage after hashirama and hiruzen
minato stronger then him lmao
@@lanastevens7399 for what kid😂😂 why you kids underestimate the second and third hokage oops im sorry minato fanboy
hiruzen? idiot Naruto Hashirama Minato Kcm Tobirama he is the 4
@@bisha9756 get over yourself, minato is stronger than tobirama.
@@lanastevens7399 hahahahah minatotard dont underestimate lord second kid i know you are minato fanboy
It's crazy how everybody thinks kisame stomps tobi rama 😂😂😂 dude with edo tensei and flying raijin.......I don't see how this is ever happening
Let's say he can react to flying raijin which we all know he can't something not even Obito kamui lost to
What will he do against an hashirama edo or madara edo tensei just to metion a few....lol
Oh and I guess samehada absorbs the bringer of darkness genjustu too
Oh my bad I guess the samehada will just swallow them all up
😂😂😂
So minato(alive) beats kisame but tobirama doesn’t ? Huh
Minato shits on Tobirama tf?
@@cuppatea1127 no he dosent lmaol
@@cuppatea1127 no
@@lordbunnie5228Yes, he does. Tobirama said himself that Minato surpassed him.
@@FolkBoyify he said he does flying raijin better was the best water justsu user of his time and killed madaras brother who had a mangakeyo how could minato shit on him
wake up to reality ... Tobirama wins ..
Kisame wins 10/10 times tobirama overrated fodder
@@jackson9034 🤡
@@jackson9034 I understand, but i totally disagree. Edo weakened tobirama can keep up with kcm minato, kcm 2 naruto, ems sauske. In part one tobirama can even move on par with hashirama. Plus he can tag and mark kisame.
Tobirama would win mid to high difficulty
Mid-high tbh he low-diffs
@Kevin Mandujano wanna debate it?
@Kevin Mandujano okay my discord is kingslayer720#0780
@@phoenixsaint9461 kisame stomps
Kisame stomps 10/10 times
You misspelled Tobirama.
@@ActuallyAlask kisame
He win
Edo tensei strengthens the reanimation
Tobirama flexing would restrain kisame 🤷🏾♂️
Kisame stomps
Tobirama is fodder and so overrated
Stfu and use logic,not cuz u like kisame u think he wins
@@AA-vx4yb I like em both, I actually think tobirama is severely underrated, but kisame still has a edge over him
How is he overrated?
100% tobirama is fodder
@@HaydenDao616 because he didn’t do shit?
What he do
He isn’t useful in battle
He lost to fodder characters
Do you really think madara/Hashirama/Itachi/Obito/Pain/Minato would have lost to those fodder characters tobirama lost against
Kisame won tobirama fusion kisame is broken and tobirama die,tobirama is not more powerful like kisame for me