Why are Ajax and Tottenham Hotspur historically "Jewish" clubs?
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2024
- The football teams of Amsterdam, the capital of the Netherlands, and one of the North London clubs, Tottenham Hotspur (Spurs) are both known for their use of Jewish imagery such as the Star of David, Jewish songs, and several nicknames relating to Jews. In this video, I try to find out why this is the case.
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The club didn't go after fans for saying Yids. It was the police and the courts that did. They banned the fans and it got over turn on appeal. The club always stood by fans regarding this situation.
I think one or two MPs, even PM David Cameron had to give us the benefit of their wisdom on the subject.
I think the club asked the fans not to chant Yids any longer.
@@jurgencuypers8350 It wasn't the club. It was the FA and the CPS. The fans refused and the club stood by them.
The club began a fan consultation over the use of the term "Yid" in 2019. This was interrupted due to Covid but eventually they reached a wishy-washy conclusion as follows:
As a Club, we always strive to create a welcoming environment that embraces all our fans so that every one of our supporters can feel included in the matchday experience.
It is clear the use of this term does not always make this possible, regardless of context and intention, and that there is a growing desire and acknowledgment from supporters that the Y-word should be used less or stopped being used altogether.
We recognise how these members of our fanbase feel and we also believe it is time to move on from associating this term with our Club.
The adoption of the Y-word by our supporters from the late 1970's was a positive response to the lack of action taken by others around this issue. An increasing number of our fans now wish to see positive change again with the reduction of its use, something we welcome and shall look to support.
We acknowledge that any reassessment of the use of this term needs to be a collaborative effort between the Club and its fans. We shall be working to further outline the historical context of the term, to explain the offence it can cause and to embrace the times in which we now live to show why it can be considered inappropriate regardless of context.
I received the letter from the club, it was in reference to a complaint from a legal body, the Black Solicitors Network. So it was organised external activism and THFC responded.
Please Sir, I beg of you, make more football history videos, these are great!
Better not let the historical Bayern Munich fans see this
I think you mean 1860 Munich. Bayern was the "Judenklub" of Munich, due to their president and coach before 1933 being Jewish.
And most of the players @@jbc17c
Bayern is/ was a Jewish clubs in the 30’s and 40’s
In the late 30's Bayern was still referred by ordinary Germans as "the Jew club"!
Wrong. Bayern had a jewish president that was forced to resign by the nazis. And the emblem change was also forced... Very superficial take on a complicated and sad history
Who remembers the 2018CL semi final Ajax vs Spurs
moustache man would've exploded out of joy
That was 2019
As an Ajax fan, I only know that there was no semi final between Ajax and Spurs in 18-19. Just as there is no war in Ba Sing Se...
Lmao. The Jew derby
I was at our first leg at Tottenham Hotspur Stadium the turnaround in Amsterdam WOW
Bayern Munich are also traditionally seen as a Jewish Club.
😶
The National Socialists (and others) referred to Bayern as the Judenklub I think primarily because the club was run by Jewish president Kurt Landauer from 1913 until 1951. He was briefly sent to a concentration camp but amazingly released after a few months after money changed hands. Landauer was instrumental in restarting the Bundesliga after the war.
Mainly because of Kurt Landauer and the fact that 1860 were supported and sponsored by the Nazis.
So is Mainz, right?
@@Drtoe2ner you may say play after war. Bundesliga did not exist until the 63/64 season
I’m an Australian Jew who went to a spurs game with a non Jewish friend at white hart lane in the 90s .I was so surprised at the crown yelling out Yido Yido but as a Jew I loved it .I think they had Rony Rosental playing then .Now I love them more as they have a great Aussie coach .
As a football fan, I did not expect History with Herbert to make this type of video
I’m dying, imagine being a neutral Jewish dude who just went to a football match not knowing much and looking over at the ultra section of Spurs or Ajax and they like:
czcams.com/video/j5Lo6X-PFDY/video.htmlsi=IaCLKBj1eza5hYuw
I died after seeing the video lmao...
the Ajax have songs about the jews as if they are supermens, if I would be a jew I would be proud of it
@@JR-mh8vn you could say *ubermenschen*
Amazing comment😂😂😂😂
"spurs ultras"
As a Jewish football fan, I have good feelings towards these clubs. I understand that some Jewish people wouldn't want to be mascotted as American teams such as the 'Cleveland Indians' or 'Washington Redskins' have done, but I feel that by informing the traditions of these two major clubs, great parts of Jewish culture become more accessible to non-jews everywhere. While they may not be the most accurate representations of Judaism, these club traditions seem to create love and connection with their Jewish communities and should be kept into the next century.
i'm sorry but the use of israeli flags that some of the jewish community of football fans that bring to the ground is never on, just wrong knowing what we know with the palestine situation.
@@ogome2927 Is it fuck, Am Yisrael chai. the Jewish community overwhelmingly supports Israel, you cannot separate the two just so you can stratify Jews in to good and bad.
@@ogome2927 is it also not ok for spurs fans to bring south korean flags to games? Manor Soloman, while he has been injured for much of the season, is one of our players and an Isreali international. in the stadium u will see at least one flag for each of the nationalities in our team, while I would normally agree to try and keep politics out of football that has become increasingly duificult with the general politicization of society, and Isreali flags have been in the stands for at least a decade consistently, they arent being flown in support of the cirrent situation but as reprisentative for Jews in general, just as the isreali flag is often paired with Hebrew on apps and menus.
@@ogome2927So do you also condemn Feyenoord supporters for using Nigeria flags? pretty sure that Nigeria is killing Christians, oh wait... that conflict isn't about Jews, so its not important for you.
Let people do what they want, Ajax supporters always had a strong connection with Jews and Israel, they are also friends with a club from Israel (Maccabi Tel Aviv). Nothing wrong with waving a Israeli flag.
@@Dutchology exactly
Great video. The history of Everton is similarly interesting. They're generally viewed (at least locally) as an `Irish Catholic Club'. But their connection is really more to the Methodist Church (especially culturally, as there's a Liverpool & Everton fan group called `Fans supporting Foodbanks', which raises funds for those in need at every Everton home game). For those who don't know, the Labour Movement has its roots in the Methodist Church
I'm a 30 year Ajax fan. I don't feel the need to say I'm Jewish or not. I'm actually Catholic. I don't tolerate anti semitism or racism as a fan. Most law abiding Ajax fans are the same. Amsterdam as a city historically has been a large Jewish city. With that said the city in is entirely should be celebrated. We also have large Muslim and Suriname populations... That should be celebrated too. But to be clear in the recent light. There's a difference between being antisemitic and anti Israeli (IDF).
Loser
Fantastic little story keep it coming
Dutch Jew here:
Currently it's not just Ajax fans that identify themselves as 'joden', but also the Jewish community strongly identifies with Ajax.
[Which is funny in my family as my grandfather who grew up in Rotterdam, but lived most of his life in Amstelveen. So he was a single Feyenoord supporter amongst all the Ajax fans.]
But to the crux of the issue, if it's antisemitic, I don't think so. Although it often leads to antisemitic chants by the supporter of the opposite team. And regardless it's kind of useless to ban chants, it doesn't really work.
The only solution is nuanced historical education and discussions, like this video.😊
ngl but the dutch jewish fans who fly the israeli flag over imho are not real fans, you can't just fly the flag of a nation which has committed so many atrocities against the palestinian ppl doesn't sit right with me.
I like your grandfather (I’m
A Feyenoord supporter)
@@ogome2927 agreed
@ogome2927
Did those "atrocities" randomly happen or were they the inevitable consequence of multiple genocide attempts committed by the arabs?
7 arab countries attacked a tiny group of poorly armed holocaust survivors, and when the arabs lost and the consequences of war happened, the arabs called it an "atrocity". Nowadays known as "nakba".
It's really curious how the atrocities committed by the arabs and the consequences are always blamed on the jews. Were the nazi inspired pogroms known as Farhud, which happened in Iraq before israel was created, still to blame on the jews and on the not yet born state of Israel?
And when the Arab League then attacks the survivors of those persecutions, who escaped to Israel, since they dared to defend themselves, they are now the target of these slanderous accusations of "atrocities".
Another example would be Israel, yes other groups inhabit the country alongside jewish people. But is it antisemitic to call israel a jewish state?
Always wondered, thanks!
People on here are claiming they didn't know that Spurs had Jewish roots - what on earth did they thnk the hissing noises were all about when the team played at grounds like those of West Ham, Chelsea and Arsenal were all about? I've been following the club or a long time now and thhat sound's always been there at away matches.
Dude, theres allot of implication for what a hissing sound could mean
You actually think people would hear hissing noises...and immediately go "why are we immitating the noise gass showers make? Ooooh theyre jews!?"
People perceive that but that doesn't mean it's true.
@@sie4431Oh come on now. When you make that noise towards a Jewish person, there's only one reason why.
The biggest connection is a player John Kirwan ( an Irish international) who played for Spurs and indeed scored the winning goal in the 1901 FA cup final, he later became one of the founding members and indeed their head coach of Ajax
I read once that pre-war half of Ajax's fans were middle-class Jews, always got the impression that originally it was a Jewish club. I stand corrected.
Not quite. The club did not have specific a Jewish supporters base, but the neighbourhood Watergraafsmeer, where Ajax stadium De Meer was located, had a lot Jewish inhabitants. Fans of visiting clubs would walk towards the stadium through the 'jewish' neighbourhood. That is how the connection came..
Same pretty much for Spurs and having owners over the years with names like Levy, Lewis, Sugar, Scholar, Silver only reinforced the impression.
Utrecht hooligans from the Bunnik-Side started calling Ajax supporters jews. This is when the F-Side took it over as a nickname.
The Hava Naquila song became famous in Amsterdam after happy hardcore group "party animals" ( an Amsterdam based gabbers group) made it a hit with a gabber remix, thats when the fans also started singing it.
Funny is tho, Ajax hooligans used to have good contacts with Arsenal. Even helping them out in Copenhagen against Galatasary when shit hit the fang.... we don't have a lot with Spurs in all honesty.
Gabber, Dennis Bergkamp... a people of culture
I'm not sure if Bunnikside(FC Utrecht) or Vak S(Feyenoord) started calling Ajax a Jewish club. What did happen is that Bunnikside hung anti-Semitic banners on the fences somewhere in 1981 when they had to play against Ajax.
The original hafa nagila song was sung by the Ajax supporters (F-side) from the stands around 1983 long before the party animals even existed.
Just before the CL semi-final match Spurs-Ajax, the older Ajax hooligans had a friendly conversation with the Spurs hooligans until suddenly out of nowhere a group of younger Ajax hooligans challenged and attacked the Spurs supporters. Then the atmosphere changed big time.
@@theallrounder1578 Never heard of it being sung that far back, but I could be wrong in that case. I did hear about Spurs being attacked, I also know they cleaned house after they did tho, Ajax could not take them on.
@@AFCAUltra The songs of the F-side in the 80s were creative and trendsetting. Unfortunately, that has not been the case for more than 27 years. All stands/sides in the Netherlands sing the same melodies, annoying and not creative at all.
I don't know if the current Y*** army is that much stronger than Ajax (the old generation together with the current one), the difference between the two will not be that big compared to 40/45 years ago, but maybe i am wrong.
The times that the English hooligans(age 54+) from various clubs were unbeatable seems to be over.
Hello Hilbert. I come from Bradford and the neighboring city, Leeds had a Jewish community, probably known best from Marks and Spencer being started there. Bradford had other immigrants and is known for curry. This led to the story that fans would taunt each other with "I'd rather be a something than a something else".
Bradford used to have a very large jewish community. There's still a synagogue there I think
@@justelliot4870 Bradford is a fairly big city at over half a million people, so I would expect no less. It also had an area called Little Germany, which had many Jews among that community according to a Google search.
Leeds is bigger at over three quarters of a million people, despite being the younger city. It was also a train stop between Hull and Liverpool for refugees from pogroms on their way to ships to US. Some of them saw the chance to stay and make a living, in a rapidly expanding area, giving it the larger Jewish community.
Manny Cousins, Lesley Silver, we’re both great Leeds United chairman and Jewish 💙🤍💛
yh i'm not from bradford but the community that majority of the immigrants from bradford come from are mirpuris who comes azad kashmir located near pakistan, that's acc interesting tho never knew there was beef with that one i assume that beef must escalted rn with a lot of us mirpuris being palestinian supporters and with some of us in that community sadly being quite anti semitic and targeting jews
@@ogome2927 It was not between the actual communities. It was football fans shouting names at each other, allegedly.
And why is SC Heerenveen more Frisian than Cambuur?
Because they stole the identity and thats why cambuur is anti frysk
Well, big city vs smaller city(In Heereveens case a town). The big city will always have less feeling with the regional identity.
Because leeuwarden, being the capitol, is slightly more cosmopolitan then the rest of friesland
Because leeuwarden, being the capitol, is slightly more cosmopolitan then the rest of friesland
Pretty obvious when your colours are literally the Frisian flag, including the red 'pompebleden' (waterlilly leafs). Aside from that, in the capital Leeuwarden not proper Frisian is spoken , but the more watered down 'stadsfries' ('city frisian') .
Interesting piece of football history, I didn't know about.
Ironically, I'm a kiwi and EPL team is Arsenal because Bergkamp, but my Champions league team is Ajax(or Barcelona) because Cruijff and total football, and my Eredivisie team is Twente because that's where my opa was from. Weird, I know, but I don't have to be as tribal all the way over here.
Inb4 Spuds come along to say "because Arsenal are shit in the Champions league".
I'm non-Jewish, but I'll always look at Ajax as our Dutch brothers. 🤝🏼
your older more successful brothers :-P
like fishing
@@imascrew6218 Wouldn't be hard
@@imascrew6218It's not Tottenham's fault their owner is allergic to silverware
im not jewish but i am an early modern historian, and your brief history of judaism in england is spot on! many pages like this get the jewish arrival wrong, dating it to the 19th c as opposed to the mid 17th c. Great to see proper history, in brief, on youtube. Great video re Tottenham / Ajax too !
When we started chanting, "we are Yids, we are Yids", back in the 70's it was take ownership of the insult and to turn it into a badge of honour, Ive been hissed at, called a dirty hook nosed yid, listened to other fans sing songs linked to nazism, I actually think Arsenal have a large Jewish following and had Jewish directors before Tottenham, but they attracted the more wealthy and different sects, Leeds and Villa also had large percentages some years ago, but Leeds fans were infiltrated by the NF and they dropped off
Reminds me of gay people reclaiming the British cigarette and Qu-een slurs.
As a Jew, i find it quite cool those clubs want to identify with us. "Yid" is not even a real slur, in Yiddish it's just the word for a Jew, even if it is used as a slur it's quite easy to reclaim. Don't let political correctness ruin having some fun.
It's an interesting point about 'yid' and slurs, if we shorten the name of some races/nationalities it's seen as a slur (Pakistani as a prime example) yet for others there's not an issue (for example 'Scots' for Scottish people).
I guess it comes down to whether the word has been used as an instrument of oppression (like 'paki' was/is in the UK).
@user-lx1lu8qr7e yeah it's complex, it's all about context. If you read literature from before the 19th century, even the word "Jew" is used as a slur, to call someone greedy. I guess "yid" Is somewhat in the middle between "paki" and "scot". The way this works is quite fascinating, really. You can see it especially with afro Americans who use the n-word among themselves, yet will punch in the face any white man who uses it.
@@user-lx1lu8qr7eit’s an interesting point but I think Pakistan is the only real outlier, the reason it can be seen as derogatory is because it’s used by people who aren’t Pakistani to describe people who are, I can’t think of another offensive example with any other country apart from maybe Japan but even then it’s rarely used in an offensive way. The English language has a habit of shortening alot of words and when you are being derogatory to another nationality, your likely to show less respect by not using the full word
@@ToTheMaxGaming1 Yeah in the U.K Pakistan is definitely the outlier but other regions have similar. 'Spic' is a pretty offensive term for hispanic people in the U.S, also 'heeb' is used in a derogatory fashion against hebrews, obviously these terms aren't widely used in the U.K but using them just as an example.
@@user-lx1lu8qr7e you’re right they’re both bad, they’re just never used in the uk (or at least I’ve never seen them used) as our Jewish and Hispanic population is very small in comparison to the US
I lived in Tottenham itself during the early 1980s. I attended at least one Spurs match with a schoolfriend who was a hereditary Arsenal supporter, and was spooked out by even visiting White Hart Lane. It was Spurs v. Notts County, Fashanu and Hoddle on the field.
I didn't even know it was supposed to be a Jewish club.
Yes, I think the history was 'resurrected', sometime in the 90s. Let's face it, Spurs were a massive club in the 70s and 80s. No one mentioned anything about their Jewish identity until Baddiel and Skinner in the 90s.
@@roginkthey really weren’t that huge in the 70s and 80s
3 UEFA cup finals winning 2. 3 FA cup finals winning 2. 3 league cup finals winning 2. During the 70s and 80s shows we were a big enough team.
@@chuckyx934 That really doesn’t make you ‘massive’
@@jodaco3869 Agreed. The Swedish club IFK Gothenburg won the UEFA Cup twice in the 80s, which obviously was a great feat, but no one would ever call them a "massive" club during that period. The same goes for Spurs, they've never been massive and never will be.
as an american jew i had no natural team to back, i picked leicester because i started watching that season. but spurs have always been my second team. ajax is def my first team that isn’t in the epl. and i find the nicknames ‘yid’ and ‘superjew’ quite flattering honestly. i’ve been called a yid before but it’s nice to see it being said proudly in defense of jews
Excellent video
Ajax is clearly not Jewish: I've never seen someone burn so much money in one summer!
From a young age in North London have always supported Tottenham , not Jewish , but have no problems being identified as part of the 'Yid Army' when at the games. With little time for racists and those who equate it to Israels conflicts. Embrace and accept the heritage, and learn from the mistakes of Nationalist bigots and Liberal extremists using political controls to alter truth, and fix it to their own p.o.v.
Is Hilbert dutch? The pronunciation is excellent (to my untrained ear)
Ja
Yes
Did he split a bill recently?
As a Jew I love this, dealing with antisemitic language and complicated racial dynamics is a core part of the Jewish experience
talmud
All you need to do is stop being offended and you'll be free from that "experience" if you want to.
Back here in the Netherlands they are being searched up and harrased in real time.@@martinseptimryden7272
109
@@martinseptimryden7272 that's not a great argument.
Football and the history surrounding it make for the best stories
Perhaps many people forgot, but in the 1920s&30s, since there were significant Jewish communities in almost every major European city, each such city had at least 1 "Jewish" club & 1 "non-Jewish" club, lhe latter usually with strong AntiSemitic attitude
In Rome: FC Roma (Jewish) vs Lazio (non-Jewish)
Budapest: MTK (J) vs Perencvaros
Vienna: Austria Wien (J) vs Rapid
Munich: Bayern (J) vs 1860
and of course, Tottenham vs Arsenal, Chelsea, West Ham etc.
All that ended after the mass murder of Jews during the Holocaust and the dissappearence of whole communities, but much of those traditions still exist today
BTW, PSG was regarded as the "Jewish" team of Paris up until the 1990s lol
Damn thats interesting, atleast its clear who to cheer for, go superjews.
Arsenal and Chelsea have lots of Jewish fans tho
I wonder where eintracht Frankfurt landed. My dad was from there and a rabid eintracht fan. But he was Jewish and had to get the hell out of there.
Oh geez I wonder what happened to those numbers of Jewish people who lived in Europe back in the 20s and 30s, what a mystery /s
interesting history, never heard of this
There was a subset of North London Jewish fans that were Leyton Orient fans rather than Spurs.
Very much still is. An official Jewish supporters group called MeshuggenOs was launched a few months ago.
I'm on the committee of the Orient LGBTQ+ supporters group, and of the 8 committee members three are Jewish.
Why not start a Leyton Orient Jewish LGBTQ plus committee. @@luxford60
@@luxford60 I thought it was still true of the O's, but I didn't want to jinx it, if you know what I mean. BTW, I'm not LGBTQ+ myself (ok, maybe have a touch of D!), but I wonder who are the most accepting of LGBTQ+ fans?
My uncle is Jewish & a Leyton Orient supporter.
Royal Antwerp FC fans in Belgium also are referred to as "the Jews" sometimes, mostly by the fans supporting K Beerschot VA who refer to themselves as the rats.
As far as I'm aware some Antwerpen lads were very close with Feyenoord's firm back in the day and so always objected to the Joden label. I believe the relationship between the two groups has really soured in the last 10-15 years though.
I don't believe there were Jews in Roman Britain. The first recording of Jews settling in Britain were those who came over with William the Conqueror in 1066. There may have been Jewish merchants who may have visited Roman Britain from time-to-time but I think that's your lot.
Yeah I’ve read there’s no trace of any Jews or Synagogues in England/Britain before 1066.
Then William the conqueror invited French speaking Jews to England because they were ‘good for business’.
You mean Jewish people are more legitimatly English that the so called Anglo-Saxons racists are obsessed with? (You know the rulers of England that gave way to their own dark ages?) Oh god that's a good laugh I needed that.
Great video. Leyton Orient also have big Jewish support. My uncle is a season ticket holder.
And Slavia Prague is also heavily jewish
Im an Englishman first. Im also foremost, a Jew. Enjoyed this video.
This guy replied to me on a Saint Maximin vid before
Much love for Ajax and Eddy Hamel! Rest In Peace.
An American Jew from New York who played for the Ajax first team and wound up being the club's only victim in the Holocaust, perishing in Auschwitz.
Funnily enough Melbourne has two sports teams historically called Ajax (Green Gully SC and AJAX FC), but Green Gully are Maltese (and dropped the Ajax when soccer dropped ethnic names in the 1990s), and AJAX are Jewish
I live across the road from green gully and didn't know they were called Ajax back in the day. My wife is maltese, her family used to be involved with st george fc. Thank you for sharing the info.
There was for years a Jewish club in Melbourne. Hakoah,
Disbanded for lack of support,
Twente suporters, are mostly revert to as Boeren (Farmers) which the also took as there nickname, I wonder how many footballers there are in the eredivisie or the premier legue
Love their beer there!
I got a chuckle when in the US the movement to remove American Indian imagery from pro sports teams there would be comments like "can you imagine the outrage if a team named itself "the New York Jews", as if something like this never happened.
As a spurs fan I have used "yid" in chants in the past, never in a negative way obviously, but it's not something I am comfortable doing anymore. Having said that, although anecdotal evidence I know a handful of jewish spurs fans and all of them aren't just fine with the word being used, but actually really like that aspect of the clubs history, makes them feel included, like they're every bit as part of the club as any other supporter. Obviously my 3 jewish mates isn't exactly a wide ranging focus group, but it does make me wonder how much of the pushback against using the word comes from people who aren't jewish or involved in the club themselves, being offended on the behalf of others.
I'm been spurs fan all of my life and I'm English and I support Tottenham Hotspur who where formed by 2 Englishman 1 from a cricket club and from a English priest from a English church in allhallows in Kent so they where formed and borned a English club as for London the Jewish people live in Stamford hill golders green and when the Jewish people came to the UK they first set up in the eastend of London
Correct.
There is another Jewish club in Hungary!
MTK Budapest.
Formed in 1888 and still Jewish
Ooh, I did not know this! I'm a Jewish American football fan and I think I just found a new team to play as in Football Manager lol
Based MTK
@@neres5795 What does that mean?
@@ThePetekA it's like legit
@@ThePetekA Terminally online people, like myself, sometimes refer to good or cooler things as "based", althought I would not advise using it that much, since us rather childish.
Bayern has Jewish Links too.
Thats why Schalke and BvB are the best
@@Mergor_X Definitively not.
Dortmund is the No.2 and Schalke is in the 2. Bundesliga
But that is not the Reason why your Statement is utter Crap.
Pretty interesting history.
Wow, David Cameron getting it 100% right.
Bayern Munich as well, they were once banned from the Bundesliga because of that.
Banned because of being jewish?
I love Christian Teams and Jewish Teams so much.🥰😍🤗
Xitians you meant madrid and Barcelona right which English club is xitians
Indeed I am a Spurs supporter who is descended from one of the oldest Jewish families allowed to settle by Oliver Cromwell. My earliest known ancestor is Solomon, a Goldsmith in the City of London in 1680. Please fact check me, but I believe one of the major reasons Jews were Spurs supporters was convenience. After escaping the Russian pogroms many settled in the East End around Spitalfields. After attending the Synagogue on Saturdays they could get to White Hart Lanes, station & ground from Liverpool Street in time for the 3 pm kick off.West Ham & Arsenal did not have the train infrastructure. The Central Line & Piccadilly tube stations were not to be built for 20-30 years.
I would throw Chelsea into this aswell
under Roman the majority of their board was jewish
with the most jewish players and manager under a European club in this century
You should look into the History of Bayern Munich as well. It has a history of Jewish leadership and passive civil resistance against the Nazi Regime, often being labeled as the "Judenklub" by the Nazis. People often just point and laugh at their WW2 Era Club logo and make the obvious "Don't ask what X was doing between 1933-45" jokes about it, but it often overshadows Bayerns distinctly anti-Nazi history.
7:26 Chelsea a North London club ??? Don't think so mate !!! One football thing that Arsenal and Spurs fans would agree on. Otherwise an interesting piece, probably a subject a lot of football channels wouldn't have covered
North London as in the right side of the Thames LOL.
Maybe I am ignorant of the suffering of diaspora Jews and therefore thier sensitivity to words but I think this is harmless fun and banter in football..Btw just before the Corona I was in Netherlands and Western Europe in after the Army,and in Jewish area in Amsterdam I remember my friends told us Ajax called themselves "SuperJews" and sang Hava Nagila,that was hilarious lol and I petition for that name aswell,we should 100% adopted it to Hapoel BeerSheva.
At Spurs away matches hissing noises are quite common, is that good old 'banter'?
@@LeslieDiablerets Ok I am not talking about that,but I think there is always gonna be morons you should answer them back not ban it.
@@yakov95000 like the calling us hook nose?
A London based non-league club with a strong Jewish identity is Wingate & Finchley. The star of David being part of their crest.
I hear omsturdom is lovely this time of year
Despite being in different leagues they did play out a master class!
I support Tottenham and have always believed that as time has gone on, Jewish related chants have gone onto mean more about the club than Judaism. The word has a different meaning to a lot of Tottenham supporters now.
I’m pretty sure I’ve seen Glasgow Rangers fans waving Israeli flags…
That's because Celtic (and Irish nationalists in general) support palestine
Yeah, most that do that won't be doing it because any sort of longstanding connection between the various communities that follow Rangers and Judaism.
It'll literally be because there's a section of the Celtic support that's pro-Palestine
I think I have a memory of reading that Third Lanark were the Jewish club in Scotland, but I might be misremembering that
Rangers, not 'Glasgow Rangers'.
@@blah......4970 Isn't there still a protestant-catholic rivalry between Rangers and Celtic? Dutch protestants traditionally tend to a strong connection with the Old Testament's chosen people. Catholics have a tainted history with jews.
It would have very much surprised me if it had been the other way around.
I had no idea
Can’t wait for the comments
Makes sense that Tottenham is so financially successful with absolutely nothing to show for it. They are adverse to hard work. England needs another Edward I
They wont let it happen
WV-HEDW are the Jewish football club in Amsterdam. Ajax are just a Dutch club with a connection due the city’s history. They embraced the title ‘Jews’ after insults from rival club supporters because of the city’s history as a Mokum safe haven and traveling fans had to pass the ‘joodsehoek’ to get to the stadium. The founders of the club were not Jewish and the club was not founded in a Jewish neighborhood but rather in Amsterdam-Noord before moving to Watergraafsmeer and eventually De Bijlmer in Zuidoost.
As a spurs fan the issue is quite complex for us as using the term yid can lead to more antisemitic chants, making our usage useless. However I remember us playing against teams who would sing racist chants and hearing us chant back yids to silence them was amazing
The antisemitic thing really took off during the late 70's at Tottenham during the days of the National Front, the worst offenders were Chelsea, West Ham and Leeds. Spurs supporters took on the Y-word defence as an act of defiance, and perhaps a nod to the nearby suburb of Stamford Hill which has a large population of Orthodox Jews.
On Merseyside I know 3 local Jews who like a bit of football and they all support Everton. Never thought to ask if the toffees are the local Jewish club. Must get round to it sometime
There a lot of match going fan are Jewish way more than 5% because the Tottenham fans who aren’t Jewish moved more to the outside of London but still around 20% if are match going fans are Jewish
Bullshit!
The same goes to the Club Atlético Atlanta from Buenos Aires, located in the neighbourhood Villa Crespo, which has a strong jewish presence. Atlanta´s rival, Chacarita, has chants about Atlanta with antisemitic connotations
Why were they expelled?
Guess
@@Mergor_X considering every place that expelled them experienced a golden age afterwards says something.
🎶 they tried to stop us & look what it did...🎶
thing I love most is being a yid!
Celtic is the Palestinian team of Europe
Irish club in the Scottish League
Tottenham and Ajax are the Jews, but I don't know how real it really is
Gentile Spurs fan here. I saw a webcast from a jewish Spurs fan who said the club, from a fairly recent survey, had received a 2/3 positive response from jewish Spurs fans on the use of the word yiddo.
Even PSV Eindhoven can be considered to have Jewish roots, although surprisingly few fans know this (and probably wouldn't be to pleased if they did being one of Ajax fiercest rivals). The Philips family (the P in PSV) are of Jewish origin and Lion Philips was one of Karl Marx's biggest sponsors.
Great video!
Never heard Hava Nagila or similar sung at Tottenham. No idea where that "fact" has come from...
Hava Nagila is included in the theme of MTK Budapest.
Another Jewish club no one mentions’
They sung Ronny Oh Ronny Ronny Oh Ronny Ronny Oh Ronny Rosenthal YID Ronny oh Ronny Ronny to the hava nagila
@@ThePetekAshut the hell up with your stupid insignificant club no one cares about
it used to be a downloadable ringtone from the spurs website years ago when that was a big thing. they eventually got rid of it
Why is your dutch accent good?
I'm wondering whether the context of using the term 'yids' - approved or non-approved - has a parallel with the African-Caribbean community, where they can use the n word, but not others?
Yid just means a jew in yiddish
The comment section will take to this like piranas to fresh chicken.
As an American Jew I am a fan of both clubs and I think it’s great that their fans embrace and view Jews positively. We don’t have a lot of friends in this world and it is great that these fans support their clubs and support Jews. What is particularly troublesome is how some of the rival fans demonstrate their vile antisemitism in their chants and attacking other fans, I am looking at you Feyenoord. 🇮🇱✊🏻✡️💪🏻⚽️
Ironically, Feyenoord (Ajax's arch rival, whose fans don't shy away from using antisemitic language) has more and deeper Jewish roots than Ajax.
Dombi😊
Fascinating how old the tradition of, making taunting chants, part of the clubs identity is
I life in Hamburg, were the fans of Fc st.pauli are used to called Zecken (ticks)
Started as mocking therm, to label the club as broke and the fans as low income class
Now fully embraced, by the clubs leftwing supporter base
Religion and politics, should not be a major part of the game
But if they are part of a clubs history/identity, it's at least good to know the background story of it 👍
What do we think of tottenham?
Great club.
Hssssssssssssssss
I’ve supported Spurs since 1958 in those days Jewish supporters were really integrated with non Jewish supporters. It wasn’t really until the 1990’s - 2000’s that the term ‘yids’ as a chant was being used regularly. It seems a term of endearment rather than insulting. What is absolutely disgraceful is the chanting by away fans especially Chelsea ( who were Jewish owned - Amabramovich) of hissing noises.
I grew up always up
seeing both Ajax & Spurs as predominately
Jewish club in much the same way Rangers
Glentoran , Linfield , and Crusaders are predominantly Protestant clubs as are
Hearts & many others clubs in Nothern Ireland
& Celtic, Hibernian, Dundee United , Cliftonville are predominantly
Roman Catholic clubs.
I really like Ajax very much, so they are my favourites mainland
European club they have been as far back as 1995
I just love Dutch
Voetbal I am very passionate about it.
As a Scottish Chelsea fan since 1996, I dont like
Spurs very much at all, but the same can besead about the other London clubs it's not about
Spurs being Jewish or not, that is just something to antagonise Spurs fans about jokingly.
I terms of Israelis & Palestinians let them get on with it we the British should take nothing what so ever do do with it.
It is not our conflict
to get involved with
The U.K. is not predominately & I say predominantly Jewish country, so we should stay out of things that do not concern the vast majority of our population religiously or politically we have bigger problems to deal with much closer to home in my personal view.
Politics , religion & football should never mix
but living in the West of Scotland, I can tell you they always will in Europe anyway.
concentrate on your own jews - chelshit fans all they do is MOUTH OFF !
Is English your second language?
Do one about Madrid being Jewish next
Wonder what the 1940 Bayern team was 🤔🤔🤔
they had a jewish owner iirc
@@CtrlonbushThey became champions of Germany with a Jewish coach, so the Nazi's punished them by forcing them to have a swastika in their logo.
@@Ctrlonbush owner ? President, or may be board members, you mean. German clubs don't have 'ownership'.
Until the 1960 Bayern was a just a minor club. But the club was known to be 'Judenfreundlich' , even in the 1930s. And the club has been very active against discrimination and racism afterwards as well, for what I heard. (I had to swallow that 'F1ck Bayern' was actually a decent club ! . This was before 2010 when they started to play attacking football .. )
There has been a study about football in the Nazi era : 'Fussball unterm Hakenkreuz' (Nils Havermann, 2006, 'Football under the Swastika '). For big clubs, like Schalke 04, it was difficult to stay away from the pressure and involvement of the Nazi Party. Explicitly 'Brown' clubs were clubs like Werder Bremen, 1860 Munich and Vfb Stuttgart.
Werder participated before 1933 in a political loaded football match in then french controlled Saarland. 1860 and Stuttgart profited heavily from their connection getting better facilities, which contributed to several trophies in the period.
Borussia Dortmund, a smaller club in the day, was as a miners club more or less left oriented, with anti-nazi sentiments. Though there came more nsdap influence , members of the club had printed critical leaflets against Nazi policies from the offices of the club.. And towards the end of the war some cadre members have been executed by the Gestapo .
Hamburger SV took away a statue of one of their historic heroes, who appeared to be a fanatic nazi , with blood on his hands in the war. After the war they tried to bring down right wing support groups, which became only successfull when they moved to the new Volksparkstadion in 1953 . And after the 2006 book did some serious soul searching to come to terms with the past.
@@Ctrlonbush German clubs don't have owners . But they may have had jewish board members .
For me it comes down to a mixture of intention and the perspectives of real Jews.
When rival fans turn 'who doesn't jump is no Jew' into 'who doesn't jump is a Jew'. Here you don't think about an actual Jew. Here it is the synonym for an Ajax fan. So there is no harm meant. But if Jews feel offended by this. You should respect their feelings and not sing it. There are plenty of other ways to banter.
Yo mafkees als je alles met engels accent zeg, Zeg dan ook AMSTERDAM in het engels! Echt vervelend om zo een video te kijken
Is there a list or something similar to see which football clubs have a Jewish background? From Germany, for example, I know that Eintracht Frankfurt has a Jewish background
MTK Budapest is a Jewish club’😊
My dad was from Frankfurt and a huge eintracht fan. Also Jewish.
You said Amsterdam perfectly are you Dutch?
I don't think you can call Tottenham the Jewish club now as it have a huge worldwide fan base now it was a part of their history more or less
I dont think spurs have any links with jews not for a hundred years or more
Star of Remphan not David