223 Rem - 75gr Hornady BTHP with AR-Comp
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- I'm testing the 75gr Hornady BTHP with Cannelure using AR-Comp. We've got a known-good charge, so I want to test seating depth in this video.
I also make a custom seating stem for my Lee seating die and run into some strange concentricity issues.
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What do you do when your watching Ultimate Reloader and JRB posts a video? You pause and start JRB!
Don't forget to go back!
No doubt. This is hands down the most watchable reloading channel on the internet.
@@JohnnysReloadingBench👍😺😸😹😻👍
Great video as always! I always look forward to seeing a new video post.
Yep, these are the best two reloading channels, period. They’re both brilliant.
The longer I've been reloading, the more I've settled into the Parratto Principle, often known as 80/20. 20% of the work will get you 80% of the way there. To get to 100% will take 80% more effort. It's not that things like weight sorting brass and bullets, weighing powder to the .001 grain, neck turning and getting to 0.000 runout don't matter--they do--it's a matter of degrees. For me personally, having a 223 AR load that shoots 1" or less is fine because I know I can accurately engage targets out to 600 yards. In my life, I get more benefit training and shooting at targets with a good load than chasing another .3-.5" in group size. But that's me, in Fall 2021. I still love the chase, and if supplies ever become available again, I may go back to it. The thing is, we each get to choose how far to go down the rabbit hole. Keep up the great work!
Parratto is spelled Pareto, the principal is named after Vilfredo Pareto who showed that 80% of the land in Italy was owned by 20% of the population.
Interesting. I think you are right @Mike Sessler. The question always comes down to “what is your goal?” Sometimes that last 20% is worth the 80% effort, and sometimes it is not… 👍
I agree, there are variables everywhere in reloading, and our variables can / do change from test to test. There are always more questions......
I LOVE IT!!
😁 😂 😛
Mike - absolutely 💯 spot on.
I agree. Often the effects of variations in elements like runout are swamped or over overshadowed by other uncontrolled effects. If you have a poor construction of the intersection of the gas port into the rifling in the barrel, it may scrub a little of the gilding off of every bullet that goes by. This could have an effect greater than 0.001 or 0.003 variations in run-out
Damn I was rooting for that .25 moa thumbs up.
I was on the edge of my seat.
I was sure he had it!
Where he makes his mistake is in thinking about it, blows it everytime. He needs to not think about it and just shoot.
Hey Johnny, I'm a not the most experienced handloader, but I do have a mechanical engineering degree and about 8 years of reloading under my belt. I believe runout and concentricity aren't important for 1 very simple reason. The bore of the rifle is smaller than bullet. Unless the cartridge is just horribly deformed, the bullet is always going to true itself up to the bore once the rifling engages. Plus, there's no way the bullet stays perfectly true during its jump to the lands anyways. As pressure builds, the brass lets go of the bullet and its free to wiggle due to uneven thrust caused by the powder burn. This wiggle is almost certainly greater than the actual runout you could measure before firing. But once the bullet gets to the throat, the rifling acts like a guide and the bullet's bearing surfaces are forced back into parallel with the bore. Thus it's a self solving problem.
Sorry but no it won’t
@@3er328 Very convincing counter argument.
Nope. If the bullet is jammed into the lands sideways, it deforms sideways and goes downs the bore non concentric.
People don't understand ejector plunger pushes it off center.
@@3er328
Ok. Support your position. Tell us why it won't.
Teaching, magic, suspense, drama, and mystery all in one video! JRB is really expanding his horizons.
In my culture, he is known as a guru.
I stopped worrying about runout when I finally determined that I wasn't a good enough shooter to take advantage of .001 to .002 of runout vs .003 to .004. I found that good solid reloading practices in general made more difference than obsessing over one to two thousandths of runout.
Well, don't be so quick to blame the shooter.. there are a lot of rifles that are not all that interesting. (only accurate ones are interesting!) Fired thru a bench rest rifle with minimum chamber and neck, it will probably be something you could see. Thru a semi auto, I doubt you will though...
That's me. I reload primarily to save a little money (not much these days) and to tailor my ammo to my firearms. That has definitely increased my accuracy, however I can only shoot so good, so I've stopped short at stuff like runout, weighing brass, and even annealing. For me it just takes the fun out of it and becomes a technical dumpster fire.
I'm a simple geek...LOL
But I enjoy watching Sean struggle with all this😂😂
@@elwhastrummer I agree on your premise that there are certain aspects of reloading like weighing brass, or maybe turning necks that may only decrease your group by 1/16" or .0625". To me I don't spend the time doing those either. I wouldn't spend the time on those even if I knew before hand it was going to take my gun from a .4" to a .2". The time involved just isn't worth the reward to me as a regular guy not shooting matches. But I would disagree on annealing. Annealing does two things. One it makes all your brass easier to resize and get the same amount of shoulder bump which has a direct effect on pressure from one case to another. Two, it helps with consistent neck tension during the resizing process. While I don't weigh brass, I do check for brass run out. I heard a great shooter say, a bullet that starts out flying straight will tend to continue to fly straight. But a bullet that starts our flying crooked will never fly straight.
Fellow RCBS Case-Master owner here!
I'll lend a helping hand with two answers, one by citing documentation, and one with anecdotal findings.
1) In the Case-Master documentation, it mentions that anything greater that 0.005" bullet run-out is when you should check your seating process and what might be causing an issue, and that anything less than 0.003" is "fine for varmint ammo."
2) I have found that even with seating stems with fantastic fits, regardless of brand (Lee, Forster, whatever), that I can get all the way up to 0.006" thousands run-out. This is no problem, especially at shorter ranges. It's when you get close to, and beyond, 0.010" that you'll start to notice oddities.
When and how much to measure? If you're having any issues - and, again, this is referring to my own experience - you'll find it within the first 5-10 rounds of a batch measured.
Take that with a fistful of salt, though, because if you think you're an idiot, oh man, you haven't met me yet.
A guy that reads the instructions is almost wizard-like in his apparent knowledge! LOL! Good info!
I know you fellas are joking about being an idiot, just trying to have a sense of humor. However I refuse to be called stupid, dummy, idiot, retarded ect.. and don't dare call myself or anyone else that I have respect for this names. My go to is 1. I'm a goober or that was a goober move. And sometimes 2. Code 77. = Operater Error. I find DIY folks are very smart and if I listen I learn alot from others. 👍
I feel like I learn something every time I watch a JRB video! Great job!
Amen!
If you go down the run out rabbit hole, you'll end up using bench rest techniques for brass prep, weighing and sorting each case and each bullet, neck turning and more...and in an auto-loading rifle with a factory chamber it's pretty much a waste of time. Don't worry about minor run out, your rifle sure doesn't seem to.
That said, bench rest brass prep techniques do help squeeze the last little bit of accuracy from a rifle, but it's up to you to decide if all that fussing around is worth your time.
I agree 100%.
Yup, I don't think the deer will care if you rifle shoots a .85 group or a 1.54 group from an auto-loader.
You are right that the BR crowd have the special chambers, bbls, etc. to exploit the advantage of max ammo prep; however, there is another factor regarding this that Johnny is constantly running up against.
He frequently has trouble interpreting what variable is causing certain effects. The only way to really figure these things out is to reduce/eliminate all the other variables. Using as good a barrel as WOA makes, he’s eliminated a huge variable. Johnny definitely knows how to assemble a good upper. I think he should build a cheap 80% blem lower and just mount it in a vice with no finish (it’ll get scratched to hell by the vice anyway). Then trim, chamfer, flash-hole deburr, neck-turn a lot of about 300 cases, so he can weight-sort down to 50-100 which are *identical*. Weigh out 1000 primers to find 100+ which are identical. Johnny’s already using a chargemaster to weight *identical* powder charges. Use Wilson hand seater to reduce concentricity issues from seating.
Will accuracy be magically better? Not necessarily, but tracking down which variable is having what effect would be easier, because it would truly be powder, bullet, and seating depth issues, and none of the “possible” variables, because they’ve been eliminated.
Of course, it all depends on what Johnny is wanting to accomplish too. He can certainly build rifles, shoot, and load well! Maybe that’s good enough, and really he’s just entertaining us (which he also does amazingly well - Love the channel.)
There are tons of variables. Like seating depth nodes. He just ran through a ton of seating depths and hit highs and lows with seating depth nodes.
An auto loader can be a pain in the butt. They’re only going to be “so” accurate. Locking a cheap build with a great barrel up in a vice creates an entirely new problem. Free recoil or not? This is all one big rabbit hole but I love it lol
It looks by the video that your die is slightly off to one side. Could be optical illusion though
Thank you for putting this out. Almost finished with a new WOA 20" barrel upper, your 223 series has given some insights for starting points.
When I started reloading, the first few hundred 308 loads were as match sorted, trued and prepped as I could make them. After that I quit the match case prep and bullet weight sorting. I noticed very minimal change in accuracy but a big increase in rounds loaded per hour.
Johnny I have been watching your 223 Rem series with great interest. I've been reloading 308 Win for awhile, but now I'm into 223 Rem. Based on your videos I purchased a 18 inch White Oak barrel as well and gave up my PSA 16inch Liberty barrel just as you did. Now I just got from the range using several different powders (H335, IMR 4198, IMR 4895 and IMR 4064). I do not have the many different powders as you. With that said, 25.0 gr of H335 under a Hornady 55gr bullet performed absolutely the best. In fact I shot a 4 bullet group of .281 inches at 100 yards. Only the last bullet messed me up! That always seems to happen. But the group total was 1.128 inches. Thank you so much for ALL of your effort with these videos!! They taught me a lot....
Don’t stop making these videos you inspire me to keep thinking forward thanks jrb
At last something good to watch
Great series of videos. There’s a saying in High Power: “You can’t reload your way to the podium”. In benchrest or F-class, sure. Chase that reloading bench rabbit as far down that hole as you can. But as soon as you have to pick that rifle up and hold it in your hands to shoot, 90% of that minutiae flies right out of the window. With a White Oak / CLE / RR National Match upper you can get to a .5 MOA load with consistent powder charge and seating depth. That’s a magazine length load and full length resize and a thrown charge. No amount of improvement on that matters when shooting unsupported.
Thanks for all the time and effort you put into making these videos. I'm sure you have your moments where this feels too much like work. But I for one really appreciate your efforts and thoroughly enjoy each and every video. THANK YOU!!
Your video quality is superb! I could count the serrations of the cannelure, the threads in the cloth on the table, the sand grain impressions in the casting of the press, etc. And, the color fidelity was also excellent, as well as the very sharp focusing and depth of field! Whatever you did to make those improvements was sure noticeable and appreciated.
Amen to that...it makes the video a real pleasure to watch.
Thanks for all the hard work! I have been subbed for years and learn more every video! I have had success with using RL16 with this projectile.
I love this channel because he does all the hard work and gives us a good baseline to start with. It's much appreciated.
This is research worthy reloading method. Thanks for providing data. I'm impressed that a non bolt-gun can shoot this good.
Runout the start of a very accurate car alignment. This is so fantastic. I'm glad you did this.
I've been reloading since last March. Mostly .223. I find the 75 grain Hornady bthp is an excellent round for target shooting and my favorite. I've made note of your data. Thanks and keep this up!
Yes! Love this content! Top reloading channel, bar none.
Yes, seating depth matter! Your seating window is about 0.006-0.009” so if shooting 0.010” you may have completely missed it. Load up between target 3 or 4 and verify results..
This is what I have been begging you to do.. it works, it has been very repeatable for me.
Crappy combo find best powder node by 10 round charge weight to find flat spot and then this test.. so you find a low as/es charge then this seating depth ladder..
Or just pick on that shot like poop but had good numbers em do a seating depth test.
Each combo can have a different tune. Change primers and you may have to start over. Change powder and you will..
Run out is not as big an issue as people think. The bullet if shot through a tight freebore is aligned into the rifling. This is the most critical spot in the rifle. The free space around the case in the chamber allows this misaligned bullet to align with the bore.
I'm not always as dumb as I make myself seem.
To test all of the stuff we've talked about on Twitch over the last year, I needed a series of videos where it would seem natural and people would be interested.
This is the 3rd video and so far we've got tons of interest and engagement, a gigantic set of baseline data on a bullet that's shooting really well, and several interesting side quests to keep things interesting.
These things just take time, man. That was the problem with live streaming so much...you guys had a window into my daily insanity of planning videos. "What I want to do" and "how I get there with the audience" are very different challenges and I have A LOT of problems lining them up sometimes.
This series is a huge win. The view numbers are good and I've got lots of different stuff I want to test. Should be a fun and natural way to introduce some new concepts and load development methods, then spread what works out into my other videos.
Thanks, man!
@@JohnnysReloadingBench this series is awesome! And yes a second powder that did crappy would be a fun follow up! Just make sure to get a charge with decent as/es before seating depth test. Take care and looking forward to the next one!
@@JohnnysReloadingBench when you do the 200.20x in 300WM can you try RL165?
Looking forward to seeing how this series progresses. Keep up the good work @jrb
@@ewetho definitely like see more on the 300wm in the 22-250 fun video. And how about more 357 mag video have done any long time
This is all stuff I have been interested in: 75gr Hornady bullets, Concentricity, OAL, Seating stems. It's like JRB made this Vidya just for me
So much to explore with just this projectile etc, great questions we will all have fun chasing the answers for.
These kinds of videos are extremely interesting to me... It's fascinating to me to see people who are very knowledgeable on a subject and how they think their way through it. I'm somewhat new to reloading even though I've been watching reloading videos for years and I don't shoot competition or anything but the all things gun enthusiast in me really enjoys learning about stuff. It gives me a different way to look at problems I'm either having or ones that might pop up once I get more advanced. Great video as always keepem coming brother!!!
Awesome video!! What I like the best is that at the conclusion of the video you have a very usable 1/2 MOA load.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
DO the same with your Mk262 clone series.
We need a conclusion to that beauty.
I REALLY like the graphics at the top - Computer app display. Easy to see & follow along.
I've been wanting to start reloading for the past 2+ years or so, but have had waited for primers to become more available. These videos are incredibly interesting, and I can't wait to be able to try some of my own loading ideas.
Save your brass, do your research on loads and equipment, and set aside some money every payday so when your ready you can buy what you need. Start with non bottle necked pistol calibers. Getting bottle necked rifle brass sized and trimmed properly can be a royal pain. Pistol is a lot easier.
I asked Eric Cortina the exact same questions about concentricity you are talking about in this video. I never saw much of a difference chasing concentricity.
That's good to know because it's a pain sorting and straightening them to see if it makes any difference.
Had me on the edge of my seat. *heartbeat speeds up… checks if CZcams froze… crap*
Same!
I use these in my 24" heavy barreled AR15 bench gun with 1-8 twist with great results. I added a harmonic damper and was surprised at the accuracy increase a rubber ring made. Cheers!
Love this vid and all the questions it raises. Super excited to see the crappy group version. I hate when I have to get totally OCD to get a load I can be happy with. Over the years I have found a few that fly better than I shoot no matter how bad a day I was having at the press.
Reading through some of the other comments, maybe you should measure the runout on a few loaded cartridges, fill a magazine, fire one, then manually eject the next and measure the runout induced from the action. Do that a few times and see if special attention is even worth thinking about on the reloading bench.
I'm reviewing my reloading. And rewatching yor videos. I've followed you a few years. And consider you the most lab intensive loader.
And no one research powder like you.
Thanks for all your effort.
Super good video, don't worry about going into a rabbit hole, as we ALL learn from what you are doing even if it doesn't result in a definite answer at the end. Very interesting stuff Johnny, keep it up!
Outstanding video Johnny!!!
I guess I got lucky when I started reloading. 21.4grns of H335 under a Hornady 62grn BTHP @ 2.255 +/- 0.002 makes less than 1" groups @ 100 yrds out of my Savage Winter Warrior bolt action. My entry lvl MSR even likes it. The MSR gives about 1.5" @ 100yrds. I'm still working on getting a crono.
Thank you for teaching me about reloading.
Hi Jonny,
Love your content! Relative to bullet seating stem dies I want to share with you my experience using the LEE 4 die set deluxe for 9mm Luger.
I was new to handgun ammunition hand loading. I experienced one cartridge that would not pass my Dillion gauge. I also experienced a ring on the bullet from the seating bullet seating stem. I then used 600 grit sand paper, using a bullet as a polishing mandrel. It worked great. I no longer saw the bullet tip ring, from seating, and eliminated brass bulge in the neck portion of the brass case!
Bottom line, hand loaders need to know that they may be receiving inferior dies, bullet seating stem bullet contour, in my case. The rough surface finish of the bullet seating stem caused bullet deformation and did not allow self centering into the brass case.
Load 25 rounds with the same charge and length. Measure and separate into groups by concentricity, 5 worst, then next 5 worst, etc. That should tell you if the small amount you have makes a difference. I think that this video showed that jump is important.
Thank you for doing this! Super interesting and super cool info! Some of us don't have the tools to do all this work, thanks a ton!!
I made some ladder loads with varget and the 75 grainer. My savage bolt really liked them. I thought that rifle was the bees knees with the 68s. Smallest group with the 75 was .58 inch and the largest was a tick over 1 inch. Thank you for all the great info and ideas.
I believe I read an article from a top bench rest shooter that stated that he didn't start seeing groups opening up until about 0.006 TIR. Your measurement will vary greatly depending on where your indicator rests on the bullet as the run out starts at the neck of the case. I personally reject any round with more than 3 thou for competition just to be safe. One thing you can do is mark each case at the "top" of the run out and make sure they're being inserted into the chamber the same orientation.
This just seemed like a great example of a seating depth test and it worked quite well. I've been using the Satterlee method to find the node, and seating depth to tune for the last couple of years. It plain works when done correctly and paired with good reloading practices.
What is The Logical reason that accuracy and velocity change with seating depth?
@@Mike-xi4zt by micro adjusting the seating depth in increments of .003" you are able to time when the bullet is exiting the barrel and tune the harmonics of the barrel to the load, or so the theory goes
@@newerest1 If it is barrel harmonic vibration, then using a adjustable barrel tuner/brake would be a be a better way to adjust to the best frequency of vibration. Like tuning the dial on a radio to find the resonant frequency of the circuit. The theories I have heard say that to much jump to the rifling causes inaccuracy because it causes runout of the bullet. I think that letting the bullet exit the soft brass case mouth to be supported by the steel barrel as it is swaged into the rifling would yield better results. Plus it would lower the peak pressure and permit higher velocities. Use the throat to align the bullet not the brass neck that has runout built into it to allow the round to chamber and extract.
This is not confusing or suprising to me at all. A friend of mine did tests with runout, found that at least at 100 yards, any runout up to about 10 thou was absolutely undetectible in groupings. Maybe it has some measurable impact at 1000+ yards but the time invested in correcting rounds vs returns isn't worth it.
I feel like the runout is easily corrected by ditching the expander ball in the fl die by pulling it out and using a mandrel expander to open the neck back up. .002 neck tension is generally where the magic happens
This is also what I have found. Even at long distance.
@@cademarti1365 what is the logic to why an expander ball ruins concentricity but a mandrel does not?
@@Bill-v650 ball pulls upward and not centered. Also has potential to pull shoulder out as well. Mandrel is floating and expands going in case mouth
Once you’re at 1000 yards you won’t be able to parse out a difference between the wind and anything caused by runout.
I like these bullets a lot. They’ve always worked pretty good for me. I like the 77gn too.
Yep you can spend a whole day reloading one round lol it’s amazing all the gadgets you can get but man you are good
Can't wait for you 7.62x39 series to resume!
... great video as always! I was shouting "pull the trigger" on the last 2.251 group. If I'm shooting a good group I try to keep the rhythm and it usually works. I always seat my 69grn SMK'S to 2.250 and they are accurate. I've been using the Lee Collet seating die from the start but I do a double press, full press and rotate 120° and full press, it's just what the instructions suggest... good shooting!
Great work Sir!!! Thank you for your effort.
Man, you do a great job. You are really getting good at these videos.
Excellent video. The minutia of Statistical Process Control. Reloading is as much of an art, as it is a science.
I have noticed the same effect, shorter OAL gives better concentricity. I suspect it has to do with neck-projectile interface. After chasing my tail, I just determined what OAL my rifle seemed to group best with and went with that length. My standard grouping with a load the rifle likes is .7 MOA. That was good enough for me… Always enjoy checking out your work.
I try to get my concentricity of the case mouths as low as possible from the beginning. This helps to eliminate that possibility, and I can concentrate on powders, charge weights, OAL, bullet jump, etc.
I turn my necks, then anneal the brass. Then I know that the brass will be as good as possible.
Nice groups, Johnny 👍🇺🇸
Hornady use to make a 6mm in 75 grain hollowpoint. It was a phenomenal shooter. I wish they still did
I thought your 2.236 would a tight group. But your 2.250 was super you dropped that last shot but damn near bullet in bullet. Love watching you learn a lot😊
I love this series! I’ve had issues with my Forster stem, I fixed it by going to Redding micrometer seater. Same basic design but thicker walls, doesn’t crack, and the vld stem fits long match bullets wonderfully.
As always thank you for your content, as I rewatched mk vids made me think to try leverevolution with 75s
Sizing the necks with a mandrel is probably the easiest way to cure run out problems in brass. The Sinclair mandrills are actually pretty cheap. I am getting less than .001 using the mandrel in the first station of my Dillon on my range ammo. After I saw how well it works, I started using it on all of my rifle brass
Good stuff as always. JRB
Excellent bullet with IMR 8208 with 75 BTHP
Much better than the tipped versions !
Although I prefer the 77gr Sierra MK for paper and self defense and the 62gr TSX for hunting in my AR
One of your most interesting videos to date. Thanks so much. Looking forward to seeing you try the Harrell's tuner.
I find the comments just as interesting as the spectacular video. Much to be learned here. Thumbs up to Cade Marti. I started this months ago and couldn't agree with you more. Machined my own mandrel and use a neck sizing die to hold it. Did not let the case enter the sizing portion of the die.
That was one heck of an interesting video. I like going down the rabbit hole, makes you think
Fricken genius on the seating stem. never even thought of that. You could buy 4 or 5 and I.D. for each bullet type.
Thanks. great video !
I chuck up a bullet in a screw gun and use lapping compounds to lap the seating stem to the bullet of choice. I buy extra seating stems and lap them for different bullets as needed.
God I missed your rambling long videos!
It wasn’t the 5-thousandsth of run-out that destroyed your group. It was the “5 minute” pause you took from the fourth to fifth shot where you told yourself “don’t screw it up” that caused the screw-up. 😊 Otherwise, interesting video and info. Keep up the good work. 👍
Good stuff. I had a rifle that would barely hold 1.25 in at 100. Did 0.003 testing. Got it down to 0.069. Never tested run out. I believe seating depth is much more important a factor than run out.
JRB thank you, great stuff but...sorry to add another variable...when you use the new Lake City cases the shoulder will come from the factory bumped back as much as .004" below SAAMI .223 chamber minimum dimensions. No big deal in terms of safety and it's done that way to fit all chambers. BUT, although it's counterintuitive, the more the shoulder is pushed back, the more the projectile will be pushed forward towards the lands. SO now your seated bullets ogive is actually .004 to however many more thousands closer towards the lands than bullets seated in your minimally bumped back fire formed brass. Take two pieces of brass with equal bump seat two projectiles to the same depth, now take one(no powder) and bump it back. 001-.002. If you measure the CBTO of both, you will see the bumped back one grew the amount you bumped back the datum line!.
I use a 204 R sizing die. Yes a Sizing die to seat my 223 bullets. The204 makes contact on the bullet close to where the rifling of you gun would. I get very consistent seating depths and bullet run out ! Don't take my word ! Try it !
Again, another excellent video that saves people money, those Hornady bullets shoot well enough to give winning scores in across the course NRA National Match. You are the Man dude. The main thing you brought to the table to consume, (Seating bullets to the rifle throat) to adjust your bullet jump. Great video, -Dave
Great video! This series keeps getting more interesting.
Devcon, epoxy, JB Weld, etc can chip after a while, but they do last for many many seatings and are cheap to replace. 👍
Great stuff, I think your right about needing a little more attention in case prep. I would love to see what effect you get from trimming, neck turning** and chamfering case mouth of your next batch. Also please retest 2.251! Thanks for the excellent content!
Fantastic video, thank you for explaining the velocity difference between the top half and bottom half of the screen. I'm going to load up some Hornady 75 gr bthp with cannelures on top of some accurate 2520, if I can get results even half as good as yours I will be happy
Although I have no intention oh reloading I find these videos so fascinating. So much info if you reload or plan to
Love these .223 videos! I had picked up some of these last year and hadn't messed with them. Thanks.
Great job pal. Really enjoyed this. Please keep it up. I appreciate your expertise!
For me, at comp works good today but maybe not tomorrow, but I do like it!
Thanks Johnny!
Great stuff. What an emotional rollercoaster.
My favourite bullet (minus the cannelure because they are unobtanium here) for 5.56. I measure them and find one that is to spec length and then set my die to seat them to 2.25” over a max charge of Varget (compressed) and use the seat, turn 90, seat trick I learned from you years ago. Shoots like a laser.
Great video. Thank you.
Had the "ring" issue with some "mystery" 75gr HP. I used a Dremel & Polish paste w/a wood "q-tip" on the seating pin...did pretty good at cleaning it up.
It would be interesting to see if powder burn rates effect accuracy. Choose a few powders, like 10 apart on the burn rate chart, and load the to the same(ish) velocity. That could also give some data on case fill vs. SD, also burn rate and powder volumes
22:48 saying negative things like "don't screw it up" is the best way to ensure you'll screw it up ;)
Johnny, I ran into this same issue with some .224” bullets I use for carnitas loads. After contacting RCBS, they requested I send 6 bullets of the type I wished to have the bullet seat stem made to fit. RCBS charged me $20 + shipping and handling per bullet seat stem and sent my bullets with the new bullet seat stems. I did wait for approx 6 weeks for the seater stems but what the heck? I was extremely happy to have a stem that fit my bullets.
Cantinas loads? That was supposed to be varmit loads. But I’m laughing now.
For determining where the stem is contacting the bullet, or for similar uses you could use dykem layout dye, or maybe sharpie marker.
Good video
I was so excited for this, couldn't wait, still fascinated. I wanted more kinetic energy over distance, and accuracy and had found Varget poor with my lighter bullets, so used my stock with these 75s and OMG. Turned out so durn good. Others ok. never had any inconsistency except with H335 which I rather expected. So Superformance and Varget were amazing with the 75 and my rifles. Interesting stuff. BTW I loaded to like 2.25"
Try 25 gr LVR @ about 2.250. LVR is a great 223 powder. Didn't chrony yet, don't really care, it's scootin along.
Yeeeeeeeeeesssss... *THANK YOU*
That seating depth test was awesome... yeah I wouldn’t go down the run out slippery slope. It’s an AR-15- can’t ask for anything better than 1/2 MOA (for the most part).
Most people (me included) would have a target like that with 90% of the groups being sub MOA, with 70% of them between .5 and .8 MOA, and called it a day... Jobs done! Now it is time to go celebrate with a beer and a burger!
I love your obsession with trying to shrink those groups as much as you can, and I admire your gumption.
Thank you for sharing you research.
I'm not a big fan of the cannelure because whatever the reason it's there, it creates a deformity in the bullet. How consistent is the cannelure made? On lower quality bullets, I can't imagine it's not all over the place. There is match grade and base level bullets for a reason. These bullets Johnny was using, where do they fall on the scale of bottom plinking bullets to the highest grade bullets made? If runout was an issue because of the cannelure, then use bullets without the cannelure. Easily remove the issue. BUT, is that the issue? Or is more bullet in the case mouth what really stabilizes the runout regardless of the cannelure or not? I wish I had the time, money and equipment to do what Johnny is doing. Thank you Johnny, you are a king in this never ending world of reloading.
Great bullet 75gr BTHP for the 5.56
Good video! Answered a few questions but created a few more.
Great video....thanks
AR Comp is my fav powder for either 6.5 Grendel or 223 rem. Sad to say that it will not be available in the US for a spell. I was told that Alliant was not exporting anymore, due to their needs at home. Working on my AK 18" heavy barrel 5.56 1/7 shooting the 75 gr Hornady hpbt with either IMR 4895 or TAC. My AR Comp will be held for my Lapua 123 senar's Grendel shooting. Thank you for all the work you put in!!!!
Don’t use 2.254”; use 2.251”. That COAL is trying to shoot benchrest level accuracy (only the single bullet with worst runout was outside the group). That’s definitely the optimal COAL length for this bullet in your WOA bbl. Concentricity *does* matter; however, not as much as jump to lands in this combo of bullet, bbl., and powder charge. I also think bbl. harmonics are at play here. The 2.251” COAL, with this bullet, and this powder charge, with that barrel and suppressor is hitting the harmonic sweet spot as well. I don’t think anyone fully understands all the forces happening with barrel whip and harmonics yet. I’m going back to re-watch your videos on it and ruminate some more. Just put a pseudo-tuner on my Bergara B14R to test with.
run out is NOT suppose to matter, the throat is suppose to align the bullet to the bore as it enters. How ever... I'm sure it has some degree, but your seating depth is more important. I am sure you are aware but some of your viewers may not be, that a 5.556 chamber has more throat than a 223. The 556 is built that way to accept many faulted or different lengths of bullets and correct it. I have always had good results with backing off the lands .020 thousands less than what Hornady calls for. I think that keeps chamber pressures low and allows the bullet a chance to get moving before it hits the lands. I was holding my breath at the one shot group waiting for you to pull the trigger. I was rooting for ya. :)
Check the runout after you load them then check it again after it has been chambered and before firing it. The violent feeding process will likely change the runout. If so, in the end, it won't matter what the concentricity is because the rifle will change it. Different story in a push feed.