Former Missionary Kids Discuss the Dark Side of Mission Communities.
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- čas přidán 11. 11. 2022
- #atheist #exevangelical
Thank you to Bosra and Victoria for sharing their stories!
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No teacher should ever talk about a student to other students. That is teaching 101.
Agreed 100%!
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
Oof I had some horrifically abusive teachers who led daily ridicule against me because my parents didn't attend church.
Yeah but, he's denouncing one student to another for jesus.
That's why I say places like that which put the religious beliefs of the authority figures ahead of education, even ahead of the well being of the students, are not really schools. They are indoctrination centers and it fits that scenario that they use the "students" to keep each other in line.
Thank you so much for having us! 💜
Thanks for coming on!
Thank you for sharing your story! It was extremely enlightening.
@@philzeo where is God olin your life? That what I do not get. As I do not get why only white youth westerns are so proud to be godless and souless alone people? How come? As always white westerns always are the worst of human kind, and now even Goddenier, into a this new cult called Atheism that does not offer anything to us l, and even to yourself, but lonlyness! No hope for this generation of godless alone people, let's hope the next one is better. No respect for you Goddeniers at all
I worked for a missionary organization many years ago when I was a young man. I had degrees from both Christian and secular universities and was young, but not a kid either. They treated me with suspicion because I was single. The school where I taught treated me like a troubled teen. Everything I did was watched. They didn't like it that I already spoke the local language and would hang out with people in the village. I remember grilling burgers for a family in a one-room home. They were so happy to have "American" food that they bought a six pack of beer. We had a great afternoon drinking beer and visiting. I would have been fired for that had anyone found out. My mental and physical health broke after two years of trying to make the "Christians" happy while still trying to be a regular guy to everyone else. This video brought back a lot of bad memories, but I'm glad I watched it.
We're glad you shared your experience and made it out of that environment
“Oh no, they’re getting the impression that American isn’t a theocracy” why do missionaries sound like literal cartoon villains.
Thank you for letting us share our stories!
Thank you for coming on!
Years later, it’s so easy for me to see just how toxic that class and teacher was. Lots of old wounds there. Thanks for making this video, Taylor
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
Oh, man. This is so much like my experience at an MK school. It was so hard to find teachers to staff the school, and they basically just stuck anyone in the classroom, whether they were good with kids, or not. There was this attitude that we should just be grateful to have teachers at all. If you or your parents complained, you became a problem for the school. I hear that the school I went to recently had a pretty severe abuse situation that sounds similar to what you all described, and they finally made some changes and implemented child safeguarding practices, but these same things had been going on for so long, and no one ever cared.
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
I know this couldn’t have been easy but I believe it’s value is incalculable, thank~you.
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
Thank you all for talking about this openly. These are the sorts of traumatic conditions it takes a lifetime to unpack, but it really helps to process it with friends who understand. I'm sure this conversation will resonate deeply with a lot of people who watch it, and I hope this helps them to make sense of their own experiences along with you.
Thank you all so much for opening up and talking about this!! Those adults’ behavior was so alarmingly and unforgivably abusive and violent. I’m going to do my part to elevate this issue out of the shadows, I’m never letting these little micro aggressive slivers of violence off the hook, this culture of silence and complicity is undeniably causing permanent and deadly harm.
The amount of 30 year old “bachelors” on the mission field that would flirt with or look at creepily 12 and 13 yr old girls..
I really think there should be a support group for people that worked in the mission field as kids, either as student missionaries or MKs. It would be helpful for me, for sure.
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
@@Mar-dk3mp What?
@@CharlieEarthRoast It's a bot telling every single commenter that they are soulless and that God Loves You(tm).
So I love these. I grew up Jewish, not super religious, but I had a Bat Mitzvah and went to Synagogue weekly. Now I’m kind of culturally Jewish but not religious.
These videos are so interesting to me, and I hope you continue them!
You guys made a comment I wanted to ask about… the girls had boyfriends so they must be breaking all the rules. I’m guessing no one cared that the boys had girlfriends? Typical double standard stuff? Did they get called out in the same way? Or it was okay for them, “bad” for you?
One of the biggest problems in christianity is the result of equating all aspects of sexuality outside heterosexual marriage to evil and the same level of evil (and blaming women for men's attraction to them) so if someone has a healthy, reciprocated sexual attraction to someone of an appropriate age, that's equated to... what missionaries were doing to little boys. They don't see it as "This action causes such and such harm so it's wrong." They see it as "The bible says these two things are wrong so they're the same."
Thank you for sharing your experiences, I know there are still people facing the same kinds of situations you were put into and I hope this helps them see that they are not alone and there is nothing wrong with them.
Omg, imagine saying that to someone who was assaulted and impregnated. What a sick thing to say. Just let people live. I’m so proud of all of you.
That story about them hearing a rumor about a student being involved with a boy reminded me of something that happened at the Christian school my parents sent me to for elementary school (it was K-12 school, but I only went there for K-5). A 13 year old girl got expelled because she got pregnant (and refused to quietly have an abortion and pretend it never happened - tho TBF, I don't know if that was her choice or her parents). The boy who knocked her up also went to the same school and faced no punishment.
I remember that sticking out to me as especially unfair. Especially as I was told over and over again that abortion was wrong no matter what. Shortly after that we moved to a different state, but that particular situation has always stuck in my mind, you know?
Thank you all for sharing your stories. We live in the south, and there's virtually no sex ed here either. I'm hoping to change that. Your stories helped confirm how desperately it's needed.
Been looking forward to this. I appreciate everyone sharing their stories.
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
I am so appalled by these experiences. I remember a workmate told me experiences she had growing up at Catholic school, and how she was physically abused by the teachers. The more I learn about the abuses of the churches, the more I stay away. I will always believe in God and Jesus Christ, but I do not believe in the way He is portrayed by the religious institutions. I am so sorry for all of you and what you had to experience. Btw, when I was 18 I became a Jehovahs Witness and finally left after 23 years of it. I still suffer from their abuses too.
Ahh I saw you asking for stories from listeners and I got so excited for this coming up! Heck ya
Undiagnosed ADHD (not that it was even recognised back then) made me a “problem child”. This resulted in me being a prime target for bullies, and being completely unequipped for boarding school life (I started at age 4). I swung between tantrums to being completely shut down. I remember one evening where students and teachers could put on little “plays” (kind of a talent night thing?) where the teachers put on a play that blatantly mocked me and my behaviour. To everyone there. They used my name.
One of my most vivid memories was me sitting on my bed, screaming “somebody kill me please” at the top of my lungs for half an hour. No one even came to check on me, I was completely ignored. I tried to strangle myself with a scarf. I didn’t have enough exposure to things to know how else to unalive myself otherwise I could guarantee I would not be here today.
I also had no outlet with my parents. We were forced to write home to our parents weekly, but being a “problem child”, my letters would be read by staff first and I would be told to start over. I remember once handing in a letter with “dear mum and dad, how are you? I am fine.” As the only text, because the only other things I could think of to write was how I was being treated and how I wanted to go home. That was also rejected, so I used to make things up, just to fill the page. I’m sure the teachers knew it was full of shit, but i wasn’t calling out their behaviour so I got away with that.
I'm so sorry for your experiences. As a mother, it breaks my heart to read this.
@@missrobin2088 I do question my mum’s awareness of the treatment. I don’t know if my sisters really knew any better to tell them either. They probably also viewed me as a bit of a “problem little sister”. My mum has passed so I can’t ask her, and my dad was fairly “hands off” when it came to parenting.
Appreciate you having conversations like this!
So sorry for everything the three of you went through. Obviously more oversight was needed along with a student advocate.
What an informing conversation to listen in on!
Thank you for posting, I need a distraction after being on the phone with insurance for an hour
1 min in and just had to pause to say - I absolutely love your lighting!
I would definitely be interested in more MK related content.
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
Thank you for sharing. All of this stuff is very painfully familiar. Half of my family were missionaries and I went to an evangelical fundamentalist school. It was an awful shaming experience.
All of you are amazing
I just find this channel to be very refreshing. I love hearing respectful, productive conservations about the structure of this religion/branch from an atheist. Sure I follow other atheists, but it just hits different watching an atheist who used to be PART of the church instead of just GROWING UP in the church--like you actually used to be Christian. I find this path way more relatable as I come from a strict, religious household and sure I might still be Christian (my faith is slowly slipping away though) but I just find this to be way more relatable because it's like we've seen the behind the scenes of what these "holy" people are like and why they say some of the things that they are saying that others who simply just grew up in the church might not understand 100% or see why it was a big deal to deny a certain thing. Anyway, I'm just glad to have broken out of certain chains but I'm still dealing with the spiritual trauma
Matt Dillahunty is a prime example of someone who was IN the church. So is Seth Andrew's from the thinking atheist podcast, which I didn't even let myself listen to until this year based on the title alone.
There's also plenty of reformed clergy on this platform if you know where to look lol
Thank you all for sharing your experiences and stories. ❤ Important conversation to have!
Thank you! ❤️
Im pretty sure that these people, these teachers just need enemies. "The other side". Something to point to. It is very likely they don't actually do this, because there's really was something different or even wrong with you. Which makes this even more fucked up and inhuman.
Have you watched Hannah Alonzo? She's another anti-MLM channel and she has a series called MLM Horror Stories, and I was curious if it'd be a productive idea to have something similar here for missionary kids to be able to share these experiences, since they seem to have been so swept under the rug?
I'm so sorry you all had to go through that. I was saddled with catholic schooling for grade school and high school in a small midwestern town so some of that I can track and other parts seem beyond the pale. Might amuse you to know missionaries were talked about as people who were out doing good in the world while we were just here existing. I remember similar bits with teachers and staff thinking they could casually slap a label on some students and then treat them as if this label they didn't choose for themselves is a core part of who they are.
My state wouldn't allow abstinence only sex ed but the school found a way to pervert the mandate. 6th grade sex ed was fine, it covered the biology of it and t lest mentioned birth control. The high school version added consent to the mix but not in a good way. To young women the message was that all young males are driven by their hormones to be sexual predators. So if you dress the wrong way or go to a party it's the same as giving consent to whatever happens. To young men the message was that even if you get consent from a woman, you're probably pressuring her into it and you can't even trust that yes means yes. That you can literally rape someone you care about because you and your uncontrollable hormones have pressured her into it even if you aren't aware of doing so and even if she expresses her consent. Together they effectively redefine consent to be all about male hormones. It was bonkers.
Of course once you're married, anything goes.
As an adult I learned how consent really works and that everyone is responsible for how they handle their own sex drive and attractions. I decided that if I was attracted to someone, I wanted that to be a positive experience for them. I wanted them to feel respected, not objectified. And I decided the church was a lousy, irresponsible partner in my sex life who wanted all the power but none of the responsibility. Catholic schools taught me that religions are mostly about PR and power grabs for the church. They also taught me the importance of being a good person when so many people around you aren't. So ironically they taught me to be a good humanist.
Getting bullied by other kids at school is bad enough, but when it's an adult teacher, that makes it so much worse. I was bullied so much in school, that I never made it past 8th grade. The abuse I experienced growing up at school and at home I still struggle with even now and I'm over 50. I had to learn how to be ok, but I still struggle with it every day. It never leaves you and you have to live with it for the rest of your life. It's not something you can just get over, but if you have support, it can help. My problem is that I don't have any real support, so I have to deal with it on my own.
You can be abused in any kind of school. My dad, who 76 years old, still remembers his Math teacher from the primary school who used to hit and insult the students. One of my dad's friend said that he had wanted to commit suicide because of the mistreatment.
Regular schools have changed a lot. Teachers these days are very limited in how they are allowed to discipline kids for exactly this reason.
I’d love to see a video about Bosra explaining more of her experiences growing up as a Papuan girl living under the ongoing Christian colonization. How did her Christian education impact how she relates to her own culture and language?
There are a few factors within that. One being Christianity but also Papua (western half of New Guinea) being occupied by Indonesia.
This is very similar to the way that the missions community operated where I was in Central Africa. It is very disturbing looking back on it, and I have a shitton of trauma from everything.
Religious trauma comes in so many forms and flavors. I am glad that you all have a supportive community in each other and other survivors of this man's abuses: religious, educational, and cultural.
Sending you all BIG LOVE. Be well.
#NoGodsNoMasters
32:35 I wish you expanded on that.
Most interesting. I grew up in the northeast and moved to California. I have known very few evangelicals during my life. You mention that teachers were not held accountable for their misdeeds. It seems to me that dodging accountability is a big part of Christianity--if you have faith you dodge accountability for your sins because they are all forgiven. Is that not the case?
I was a missionary kid to russia. we left when the war started. going to russia was definitely traumatizing, but i'm pretty lucky that my parents have become a lot more liberal as they've spent time overseas. i've been able to comfortably come out as an atheist to them. i would say im overall grateful for the expeirence of living of russia, but probably wouldn't do it to my kids. of course it depends on the place, parents, and the kid themselves. the most traumatizing part was definitely leaving cause of the war though. i will never live in america which probably wouldnt be the case if i didnt move to russia. idk there a lot of positives from it in my life, but thats just my expierence, and i dont really morally agree with having kids and being a missionary.
I would certainly like to hear more of Bosra's story, but I think I can predict how it would go. Abandon everything that makes you special because jesus.
The most abusive element of any sect or cult of christianity is the missionary kids. Having also grown up a missionary kid in a very abusive cult environment, I empathise with what you experienced. SA is such a prevalent, problematic and widespread thing. The worst part is though that the assault is rarely recognised as what it is. Often it is just seen as a disciplinary thing, especially in cult situations. Spare the rod, spoil the child is the blanket under which predators get away with predatory acts and often because of the power and knowledge disparity.
These are people we are taught we can trust and the truth is, we simply couldn't but the role they achieved for themselves, meant that even our parents overlooked it or maybe they knew what it was and didn't care enough to protect us. Cult parents are pretty much the fucking worst examples of humanity. I knew children who had been SA'd by multiple adults but the power disparity meant they would keep quiet. I doubt any of them have talked about to this day.
8:25 And it sounds like it was a forced, fake apology.
It definitely was!
This is just a problem in tight knit church communities, period. At least it is where I am from.
Does this person still have a job interacting with children?
Sounds like they do as they stated they never got closure
Very much still doing some missionary/mentoring work. 🫣
@@lMagicalMerlin what the actual f!@# does "closure" mean? Have you read Miller's book "Thou shalt not be aware. Society's betrayal of the child". ? Closure sounds like the worst kind of weasel word invented by perpetrators and the therapy industry. People do NOT get over this kind of abuse. It's part of who they are. Closure? Don't make me ill
Why is it always the Bible teacher? I'm not a missionary kid, but I went to a boarding school stateside and our Bible teacher was a missionary and had just come back to the States, and this was his first year teaching at the school I went to. He had (not quite bouncy balls but not quite tennis balls) two blue balls that he would keep in his desk and throw them at students if he caught you sleeping. like if your head was down on your hands on your desk he would throw balls at you. Also he wanted us to call him bwana.. which means 'sir' in Swahili... So like... Idk what's up with that...
The next bible teacher we got(yeah.. none of them lasted) was actually on furlough from the school one of my best friends went to in Africa (she was an MK) and he was the creepiest he had two kids that were highschool age and I remember it was really hard for them to escape hearing about all the weird stuff he did. He had creepy overly friendly vibes always wanted to be in on the gossip tried to like.. adopt the good students and parent them. (I wasn't one of his favorites but no one had anything nice to say about him)
That school in Africa wasn't Rift Valley Academy was it?
@@brendanoloughlin395 Maxwell SDA if memory serves
An like instructional video into like how many times the word “like” can like be used like in like every sentence.
I couldn’t like keep watching.
Verbalized pauses are normal and generally indicate unscripted, genuine communication.
When you're raised in evangelicalism and taught obedience culture where adults protect other adults, particularly as a girl taught to defer to men, and your whole world revolves around acceptance by that small, isolated community this is so much worse than a teacher being obnoxious in say, a public school setting to a student who does have the support of the state and their parents to hold the person accountable.
When you consider rape culture and how girls considered "sluts" had to fear ostracisation and losing protection from your community, all of this becomes a massive power imbalance beyond the perceived teacher-student imbalance. For those who didn't grow up with this evangelical upbringing particularly in such a small, isolated, controlled community where obedience culture and not questioning is literally the top priority above everything else, and is upheld by the community which is self-policing and WAY too aware of each other's business, where "accountability" (lack of privacy/prying into others' business/keeping people in line through gossip and the constant fear of excommunication as the consequence) is considered a virtue, it's very important to be aware of this context.
Wow. The craziest part to me is how missionaries go around being super racist and think they're being perfectly okay. Actually think they're right for doing so. It's "the right" thing to do. All the stupid wilful ignorance blows my mind. All to protect hierarchy.
Missionaries have helped communities all around the world in various ways. You seem to have great insights as a former missionary kid. I can tell that you’ve been through a lot when you were younger. Seems like times have changed over time and not all missionaries end up being somewhat successful.
Colonialism isn't help.
@@Chandler27 exactly.
Missionaries bring help only if the indigenous peoples are willing to strip themselves of their native beliefs to get it. Its essentially forced conversion, even though the force in question isn't violence but instead access to food, water, and other humanitarian aid. In most cases the people don't even want the missionaries there and never asked for them, but were instead forced to deal with these assholes pushing their religion. Nothing helpful about it
EDIT: Spelling. Stupid autocorrect, lol
It always seemed odd to me to donate to charity, but only on the condition someone engages in your religion.
The primary focus of 'missions' is always spreading one's religious beliefs not helping people.
If the word, "like" didn't exist............
Verbalized pauses are normal when one is communicating difficult ideas or memories.
how is anyone a 'former missionary kid'? You either are or you aren't
I think this thing to be godless and souless thing which is primarly from a western people soon will end, also hecause the idea to be a godless and souless person and be nothing omce death is a thing that even many atheists like it. But Maybe God bless you anyway.
Bruh idek what you're trying to say here